Honey for anxiety/depression

[zygfried]

extremely interesting post everyone. Thanks! I just wonder if anyone has tried the organic coconut oil mentioned by eight days a week? I've read something about that being helpful too, but it might have been for another ailment. I'm plagued by minor colds and bugs, I think, because of anxiety/depression, so I might just try the honey to see if that helps.

[Jimgym]

Personally, I can't see honey being of any use for anxiety. Honey is a good antibacterial, fact but there seems to be a number of scientific arguments on here that don't make sense for example, enzymes in honey are unlikely to have any major effect on the human body.

I thought that as anxiety sufferers we were meant to avoid high GI foods such as honey? After all, honey is pure sugar.

I'd attribute honey's 'anti-anxiety effect' to a rapid increase in blood sugar which although quelling anxiety for a while, will inevitably lead to a sugar crash with anxiety symptoms.

Be wary of Manuka Honey - it appears that its salespeople want to public to believe that it's a cure all medicine. Just look at all the advertisements for Colloidal silver on the internet and you'll see the similarities...

May I also stress that honey is only a useful antibacterial on surface wounds and has little effect on anything internal.

[Tish]

Oh Jimgym! I wish I'd read your post a little earlier, I've just been out and treated myself to some Manuka honey! I thought I'd buy some while the 1p offer is on at Holland and Barrett. I'm getting over a nasty sickness and dirrhoea bug this week and thought honey's antibacterial quality might balance my tummy.. Oh well.. x

[eight days a week]

Personally, I can't see honey being of any use for anxiety. Honey is a good antibacterial, fact but there seems to be a number of scientific arguments on here that don't make sense for example, enzymes in honey are unlikely to have any major effect on the human body.

It may be interesting for you to look up enzymes, even on Wikipedia, as they play a lot of essential roles in the body, especially in digestion.

Personally I think the main point is that there are vitamins (especially B vitamins which can be good for anxiety, and which stress destroys) and minerals in honey in natural food form, not synthetic supplements like tablets.

It contains amino acids, ten of which (I think) are essential for your body, and need to be taken in your diet. If you're not getting enough of these from your food and drink, honey will help your body work better/as it should. Again, google 'essential amino acids' for the science (and particularly their importance in things like anxiety and depression). But just as a physical example, athletes take them to improve their fitness, body performance and injury recovery.

I thought that as anxiety sufferers we were meant to avoid high GI foods such as honey? After all, honey is pure sugar.

I'd attribute honey's 'anti-anxiety effect' to a rapid increase in blood sugar which although quelling anxiety for a while, will inevitably lead to a sugar crash with anxiety symptoms.

You have a good point there about the sugar 'rush', and we've discussed it in the thread. But I can honestly say I've never noticed a 'crash' later in the day after taking honey. I'll look out for it from now on though and report with what I've noticed.

For me 10mls a day is the same as two sugars in tea. That may be too much for some people I guess. I have very little sugar in my diet so it doesn't worry me. <edit> Now my stomach problems have mostly been cured by Manuka honey (see later in this post) I don't take it daily anymore, but Jim's post has made me think, and although honey has a lower GI than sugar, I think I'd benefit from maybe a teaspoon a day rather than two teaspoons every other day - a little bit more often.

Be wary of Manuka Honey - it appears that its salespeople want to public to believe that it's a cure all medicine. Just look at all the advertisements for Colloidal silver on the internet and you'll see the similarities...

Yes by all means be wary, at the same time this is a very extreme way of putting it. The NHS have accepted some benefits of Manuka honey (completely unlike colloidal silver) - with careful research, why shouldn't we? My pharmacist recommends it for a few things.

May I also stress that honey is only a useful antibacterial on surface wounds and has little effect on anything internal.

Please give some sources for this argument, as, with respect, it appears to be absolute nonsense to me. I've done lots of research of honey and never read anything like this. My pharmacist swears by it for, for example, reducing hayfever symptoms in hundreds of his patients. How is that not internal?

Honey is a food, are you trying to say that all the vitamins, minerals and other good things in food don't work 'internally'? Then why bother eating? We could just drink energy drinks all day, much simpler! And apart from all the valuable vitamins, minerals and amino acids I've already mentioned, why would an antiseptic or anti-bacterial stop working on your insides?!

I myself started taking it partly in the hope it may soothe my gastritis (which often lead to me retching and throwing up for half an hour every morning). Guess what? Beyond my wildest dreams, it's almost completely cured the retching and throwing up! I'll bet if I had another stomach camera my gastritis would look miles better.

The only other option for me would have been to continue to take Lansoprazole twice daily, which didn't help that much, and Buccatem, a chemical that stops you retching by messing with your brain chemicals.

As far as I'm concerned Manuka has been a miracle for me internally

[Jimgym]

It may be interesting for you to look up enzymes, even on Wikipedia, as they play a lot of essential roles in the body, especially in digestion.

Personally I think the main point is that there are vitamins (especially B vitamins which can be good for anxiety, and which stress destroys) and minerals in honey in natural food form, not synthetic supplements like tablets.

It contains amino acids, ten of which (I think) are essential for your body, and need to be taken in your diet. If you're not getting enough of these from your food and drink, honey will help your body work better/as it should. Again, google 'essential amino acids' for the science (and particularly their importance in things like anxiety and depression). But just as a physical example, athletes take them to improve their fitness, body performance and injury recovery.

I am a qualified microbiologist, having had a university education which also covered a lot of biochemistry (amino acids, enzymes etc). I also have a particular interest in wound healing and know of several studies which have used honey (esp maunka) as a topical agent to kill bacteria in surface wounds.

Whilst honey may contain essential amino acids I think it's all about doses here. Sure it can help you achieve your total amino acid intake but then so again can a piece of meat or other protein - with honey being mainly carbohydrate I don't think that it would be a value for money source of essential amino acids. Essential amino acids aren't as rare as adverts like to make you think.

Please give some sources for this argument, as, with respect, it appears to be absolute nonsense to me. I've done lots of research of honey and never read anything like this. My pharmacist swears by it for, for example, reducing hayfever symptoms in hundreds of his patients. How is that not internal?

Honey is a food, are you trying to say that all the vitamins, minerals and other good things in food don't work 'internally'? Then why bother eating? We could just drink energy drinks all day, much simpler! And apart from all the valuable vitamins, minerals and amino acids I've already mentioned, why would an antiseptic or anti-bacterial stop working on your insides?!

Honey works as an antibacterial because it provides an osomotic gradient. That is that the high sugar content of honey vs the low sugar content of a surface wound actively works to dehydrate the bacteria. This killing effect is also helped along by antibacterial proteins and hydrogen peroxide in the honey. When taken into the body, the honey would be diluted with other bodily fluids making the osmototic potential less. Besides, the honey would have to attack the billions of bacteria in the human stomach....many more than on the skin/a wound.

Hayfever isn't caused by bacteria (My initial argument was bacterial based). I can imagine honey having some effect against hayfever in the way that it may contain pollen and be able to desensitize the body to pollen.

I myself started taking it partly in the hope it may soothe my gastritis (which often lead to me retching and throwing up for half an hour every morning). Guess what? Beyond my wildest dreams, it's almost completely cured the retching and throwing up! I'll bet if I had another stomach camera my gastritis would look miles better.

Is your gastritis caused by bacteria or inflamation caused by retching? I would suspect its the latter and the honey has a calming effect in a similar way to cough syrup helping a sore throat.

I wasn't trying to start an argument here. I hope I've explained myself clearly.

[Tish]

Thanks for your informative posts guys. I've got the honey now and will give it a try, T x

[eight days a week]

I wasn't trying to start an argument here. I hope I've explained myself clearly.

I appreciate that, and you have to a large extent Jim. Many thanks for posting back, it is really appreciated. We are just sufferers who are looking for things to help us, and (as far as I'm concerned after all my own research) the more natural the better.

I still take issue/have lots to discuss regarding some of the things you've said on here, but wonder if this is a thread to go through them on? I'm not trying to 'duck' any discussion at all (in fact there's nothing I'd welcome more, and would be very glad to talk directly to someone with more of a scientific background then I have).

It's just that most threads here tend to simplify things. Perhaps because people who visit often want some basic guidelines or ideas to try which might help them (a teaspoon of Manuka honey in a cup of tea instead of sugar being a perfect example), I think also often because their lives are complicated enough without deep scientific debates. This is why, despite my own reading, I've tried to keep my own posts on the thread as simple as possible. I'd very much like to engage with you though, and suggest we open a new thread if there's going to be a lot of discussion beyond people reporting how they got on with it.

In the meantime I'll bring up a few points, and I guess we can see how it goes from there?

Whilst honey may contain essential amino acids I think it's all about doses here. Sure it can help you achieve your total amino acid intake but then so again can a piece of meat or other protein - with honey being mainly carbohydrate I don't think that it would be a value for money source of essential amino acids. Essential amino acids aren't as rare as adverts like to make you think.

There are all sorts of points raised for me here. The main one I think is that for people like me who have increasingly poor diets because of anxiety and depression it's far easier to have a teaspoon or two of honey per day than an extra piece of meat or other protein (and that's even without touching on the quality of meat or other foodstuffs that many/most people eat). Being able to drink it makes it far more available to us.

Hayfever isn't caused by bacteria (My initial argument was bacterial based). I can imagine honey having some effect against hayfever in the way that it may contain pollen and be able to desensitize the body to pollen.

Yes, that's how it works I believe. Even my pharmacist was able to explain it to me (I mean that only as a reflection on him, not yourself) - this is a man, who despite the highest qualifications required by a pharmacist, understands far less about the prescription medicines I take and their mechanisms of action and potential interactions than I do (imho of course)!!

When taken into the body, the honey would be diluted with other bodily fluids making the osmototic potential less. Besides, the honey would have to attack the billions of bacteria in the human stomach....many more than on the skin/a wound....Is your gastritis caused by bacteria or inflamation caused by retching? I would suspect its the latter and the honey has a calming effect in a similar way to cough syrup helping a sore throat.

My gastritis, I believe, was caused by stress and poor diet and nutrition, which then led to the retching and throwing up some six to eight months later, and remained for three years, until 'cured' in less than six weeks taking 10ml daily Manuka in warm water (sipping very slowly). Now it is gone, as is my IBS (which I had for seven years). I am now (after 'cure') taking 10ml of Manuka in warm water 2/4 days a week, but I very much take on board your point about folk with anxiety having too much sugar at one, and so from now on I will try to have a teaspoon in warm water more or less daily.

I don't believe it's calming for my stomach, I believe it's all but 'cured' me (I could write for pages how bad my retching and sickness were for years but people still wouldn't really understand, you had to live through it - and yet with no other changes to my lifestyle now it's gone). I'd be willing to undergo another endoscopy to prove it, if someone would pay for insurance against the risks.

[Tish]

I don't take scientific theories too seriously, I just go along with someone who can say 'This is what worked for me' and try it for myself. I tried a teaspoonful of honey first thing yesterday morning on an empty stomach which was totally the wrong thing to do for someone who already suffers with low blood sugar. I've been more sensible today and stirred a little into my porridge and I'll try it in warm water next, sipping at it slowly. I'll be very happy if I find it helps ME with my IBS. Thanks for your input guys x

[eight days a week]

Jim, thanks again for your posts. I've understood now your point about it not being anti-bacterial in your view (I didn't when I replied before) and thus why you asked me if my gastritis was due to bacteria.

Anyway, the reason I say it's cured my IBS and the retching and sickness, rather than just being a soothing agent as you suggest, is because now I can only have honey once or twice a week and still those horrible things have almost completely gone, and before I tried Manuka, like I said, I had both for many years.

The relief has no correlation to when I actually take the honey - it doesn't soothe me at the time, particularly. It seems like a long-term thing (as long as I have Manuka occasionally). I'd be interested in hearing your thoughts on that.

I don't take scientific theories too seriously, I just go along with someone who can say 'This is what worked for me' and try it for myself. I tried a teaspoonful of honey first thing yesterday morning on an empty stomach which was totally the wrong thing to do for someone who already suffers with low blood sugar. I've been more sensible today and stirred a little into my porridge and I'll try it in warm water next, sipping at it slowly. I'll be very happy if I find it helps ME with my IBS. Thanks for your input guys x

Thanks a lot for posting Tish, and sorry it all went wrong your first time with your blood sugar problems. Hope it goes better for you when you take just a little bit more often, and please post back how you get on, good or bad, the more people post on here about their experiences the better for all of us

(P.S. After what Jim said I've been thinking about the sugar content more, and have also read in lots of places to sip it really really slowly. It's hard though because it's so tasty! And don't forget to try not to let the water be over 40 degrees. I boil a kettle and then mix it about 30% hot water and 70% cold tap water)

[Babooshka]

Personally, I can't see honey being of any use for anxiety. Honey is a good antibacterial, fact but there seems to be a number of scientific arguments on here that don't make sense for example, enzymes in honey are unlikely to have any major effect on the human body.

I thought that as anxiety sufferers we were meant to avoid high GI foods such as honey? After all, honey is pure sugar.

I'd attribute honey's 'anti-anxiety effect' to a rapid increase in blood sugar which although quelling anxiety for a while, will inevitably lead to a sugar crash with anxiety symptoms.

Be wary of Manuka Honey - it appears that its salespeople want to public to believe that it's a cure all medicine. Just look at all the advertisements for Colloidal silver on the internet and you'll see the similarities...

May I also stress that honey is only a useful antibacterial on surface wounds and has little effect on anything internal.

....I disagree - i had a chronic sore throat, started taking manuka honey, twice a day and it was gone in two days, felt better immediately after the first dose.

Am going to start taking it again to see how it affects my GAD

Paula