'Sticky' thoughts - for those who have recovered

[Ruthie88]

Hi guys

Just out of curiousity - how many of you suffered from 'sticky' thoughts? These are common for sufferers with panic disorder.

They can be described as a thought that occurs to you within those dark moments and they frighten you to death.

For example, when I had panic disorder, I was at a BBQ and standing near a knife. A thought jumped into my head - I could hurt someone with that - and that thought caused me so much distress that I actually went home! Its like I thought I would lose control and do it or something!

I now know a thought is just a thought without intention, motivation and desire. I also know this to be quite a common thing. Phobias can develop out of this! I actually developed a phobia of knives.

I am interested in the common links between sufferers of panic disorder. I am studying Psychology at University and although I cannot really use any of the information I obtain here for my studies, the general knowledge will be invaluable to me.

Oh, and by the way, current research leans towards anxiety disorders resulting from maladaptive learning. If anybody tells you it is 'genetic' or you have bad genes (including your GP - who is medically trained..) ask them for the evidence. DO NOT BELIEVE EVERYTHING YOU HEAR. Since I started studying Psyc I cannot believe the misinformation that is our there. There is no thing as a gene for panic disorder...

Thanks
Ruth

[hunny]

Maladaptive learning?
Excuse my ignorance,but could you explain please?
Hunny

[Ruthie88]

Maladaptive means 'not appropriate useful or aiding in adjustment.' In other words the way a panic sufferer has learnt to interpret his or her anxiety symptoms is maladaptive. Other people experience the same symptoms and do not panic about them. Panic sufferers need to relearn how to interpret these symptoms.

Ruth

[mum2four]

Seeing a knife and thinking you might hurt some one with it is also called a spike.

I have had spike's all my life but it only been recent that i found a site that help me understand what was happening with me. I seriously thought i was going insane. I feel better finaly understanding what has been happening to me. I'm still worried about talking to my dr about the spike's. I now on a med called Luvox (Falvoxamine Meleate) and for the most part the spike's have stopped. I can rember that i had thr spike's but no new one's or repeated one's have really effected me. When the spikes wer at the worst I would start getting erg's to hurt my self (bang my head, cut my self, rock, tap).

I still very scared of the spike's depsite knowing that I wouldn't do it. When I was yonger the spike's did cause me to be come agressive toward's anyone who refuse to let me run away and hide from what eva was scareing me. I attack at least 3 teacher cause thay grabed me and refuse to let me go after i scream everything at them to leave me alone. i warned all of them what I would do if thay didn't let me go. When thay still wouldn't let me i did exactly what i said I would do. I remember bitting one teacher for squezzing my wrist and dragging me from the school oval for refuseing to remove my self from the field where thay were playing softball wher had been hit by a ball for refuseing to play the game. I just sat down with my legs crossed and my head down and went in to my own world.

I swung my arm and hit another teacher and swore at her for trying to drag me to office by my arm. After she finaly gave up trying she i ran to school fence and hid behind a building and stayed there for hour's till i felt safe enought to came back and then i sat out side my class room cause I refuse to go to office. When I finaly went I was stubborn and refuse to be co-operative. I got punished and when thay tryed to make me do the punishment i refuse so thay draged me and then thay put me in the headlock and anther teacher picked my leg's up and me on ther verander where i was supose to stand all recess but as soon as saw my exit i ran and hid in the school yard. I dont remember any other vilance towards teacher after than but i was very stubborn and refuse to do my work because of how i felt in side. It was far easier to play the part of the horible child than to try to deal with what i was feeling on the inside.

3 years ago I realised I was still keeping people at arm lenght when thing seem to be going well I would go out of my way to find something wrong. I tryed real hard to stop doing thes but I dont know how to be any other way. While I'm doing well with my kids and partner(who put up with for a long time) but i find it very hard still have friend's.

I have had spike's while doing dishes when looking at window's while in the car. The car was a big one I use to only eva sit in the back pasanger seat as kid and if someone refuse to let me have that seat i would get angry and scream and if it was my sis or bro i would hurt them. in public i would have shut down's most of the time go shy and slowly become worse and more inside my self the more scared I got untill i felt like my sence's were on screaming at me. Then i made my excape and if I could not excape I would hurt them just enough to back off and let me past.

I can remember my friend wanted to smash my head in for staring at her locker( still dont understand that one). She was hurting me throwing me agaist the locker's and pushing me ect. I did very little back to her cause I didn't want to give in to the spike's in my head which were flashing like a picture show about what I could do to her. I was so focued on getting away and out that I would only hurt her back if i thought i could make my excape.

It has not been uncommon for me too thing of every posible senario that could happen speacily with my greated fear's like police and hurt people dieing. I the car after having accedent I was prety jumpy i was realy starting to bug my partner. I still have a fue bad time's in car li

[Ruthie88]

I'm really happy for you the medication is working for you.

I actually understand some of the behaviour you are talking about. I used to work with a youth services group and a lot of the kids exhibited that kind of behaviour. There was alot of self harming, running to escape and head banging. I am not sure if it was due to spikes, every child is different, but I think they were all attempts to escape or relieve whatever was going in their head.

Sticky thoughts occur within panic sufferers usually because of the belief they are not in control of their bodies. I made the assumption that because I couldn't control the panic I wasn't in control of my body (very common). And when the thought occurred to me - and it occurred because I believed I wasn't in control of anything - it was totally overwhelming. There was nothing more horrifying to me in the world than the thought of hurting somebody else, and with the belief I wasn't in control of my body, you can see how horrible it was!

The thing is, no we cannot control our emotions. But we are always in full control of our bodies. It is common assumption for sufferers to believe this isn't the case because of how intense they are feeling at the time. I think it is also linked to the 'insane' belief that a lot of sufferers develop at the start of panic disorder - the belief they are going insane.

I have a close friend who is a Psychologist specialising in the treatment of anxiety disorders - I am lucky because I had him around. He treats people six out of seven days a week. I can tell you, any symptom of panic disorder you have experienced, another has experienced it as well. And there is always an explanation. And complete recovery is possible for everybody.

Clare Weekes actually talks about sticky thoughts in her book as well.

I put this post up for those who suffer from this horrifying aspect of panic disorder just so they don't feel alone. Remember this: the simple fact that you are petrified of these thoughts means you will never act on them. Fear is not intention, motivation or desire. If you had intention, motivation or desire to hurt somebody then it is time to worry!!