View Full Version : What is their Agenda?
neowallace
09-05-12, 19:25
I will make no apologies for sounding suspicious but what is the real agenda with the NHS just now with diazepam. All they will do is create a large black market for it. They are refusing people it but not offering any better solutions. These other helpful things like CBT etc...are good but not always practical and you have to wait ages for them and it ends up only lasting for 6 weeks. I have been sober 6 years and feel I would rather be on Diazepam the rest of my life than end up drinking again. But as usual we have no real freedom of choice....rant over....
nomorepanic
09-05-12, 19:35
It causes long term health problems though as it is very addicitve so they do not want to end up treating people with those further issues.
Personally, I have never had any problems with my GP prescribing diazepam....I must be one of the lucky ones!! But it is such a shame, it can be really beneficial in treating anxiety and alcohol withdrawal and as you say....better than the booze....and I think we are all aware of it's addictive properties, but used sensibly......a lifesaver for some. Kitti :)
neowallace
09-05-12, 20:16
Thanks for the replies have to agree with Kittikat I know quite an number of people who have been using long term Diazepam in moderation. What long term health issues are we taking about?
Kindest Regards
Just find a GP/ shrink who prescribes diazepam and move on really. You can't force a GP to prescribe them.... Alcohol and cigarettes are addictive blah blah.
I dont think its a case of 'if I can't get diazepam I WILL have to drink instead' - deciding to drink to deal with anxiety is a personal choice, and obviously not a very healthy one.
There are plenty of people who manage their anxiety with other meds and counselling, and don't have to turn to drink, or very addictive drugs, which is basically what the NICE guidelines are suggesting, although it isnt perfect as the waiting lists for counselling are long in lots of areas.
It does remind me that someone I know ( who has experience of both ) said coming off valium was much worse than coming off heroin ! so it can show you how addictive the drug can be
neowallace
10-05-12, 07:27
I am afraid my view is not going to change. One boot does not fit all. I respect your experience and views but it does not apply to everyone.
@Dan1234.....Glad you have been lucky enough to find a GP/Shrink to prescribe...phew, that really makes me feel better.
Usually it is the older shrinks who agree to it.. The conditions to me getting diazepam are that I have a course of CBT.
Dan
neowallace
10-05-12, 09:13
Hi Dan
Apologies for sarcasm feeling frustrated just now with my symptoms. It makes sense probably an older shrink would understand life better and also that you are doing CBT as well. I have been prescribed Pregablin for anxiety. Might get a result with that. All the best with the CBT.
Steven
Well Pregabalin has certainly helped me --- Am on 600mg/d.
neowallace
10-05-12, 09:39
Good news , I've heard good reports about it as well. :)
Good news , I've heard good reports about it as well. :)
fingers crossed for you. It is pretty quick acting too. :)
neowallace
10-05-12, 11:24
Thanks Dan, much appreciated mate....:)
I am having so much bother with trying to keep my valium prescription going. Valium got me over housebound agoraphobia when everything else (therapy, counselling, various antidepressants, beta blockers) had failed, and I like to be able to use it occasionally. I am SO SICK of being told I am "dependent" or "going to get addicted" when I have been using it for several years without trouble. I used to use it a few times a week to overcome phobias, and now I use it how often? Well, twice this month so far. LIKE HELL I'M ADDICTED.
Just yesterday I had to fight tooth and nail with a pharmacist and his bitchy sidekick, a sour-faced chemist who was sucking on a wasp and looking down on me for being in the position where I need to use Valium. Thankfully I made an out of hours phonecall to my surgery where I thankfully got a rare, helpful doctor who could see that I rarely use the stuff and was happy to give me a one-off prescription so that I could enjoy my saturday and socialise with family and friends.
Sigh. Sorry about the ranty nature of my post! But I am getting tired of the benzo hysteria when some people really do have no other option than to take them on an occasional basis. As for the brain damage theory, I don't deny it exists because I have noticed that Valium affects my memory, but of we're talking along those lines then someone needs to have a think about what SSRIs do to people, because when I took SSRIs I was behaving very differently, quite aggressive, and it took almost a year after coming off them to finally feel like myself again.
I am having so much bother with trying to keep my valium prescription going. Valium got me over housebound agoraphobia when everything else (therapy, counselling, various antidepressants, beta blockers) had failed, and I like to be able to use it occasionally. I am SO SICK of being told I am "dependent" or "going to get addicted" when I have been using it for several years without trouble. I used to use it a few times a week to overcome phobias, and now I use it how often? Well, twice this month so far. LIKE HELL I'M ADDICTED.
Just yesterday I had to fight tooth and nail with a pharmacist and his bitchy sidekick, a sour-faced chemist who was sucking on a wasp and looking down on me for being in the position where I need to use Valium. Thankfully I made an out of hours phonecall to my surgery where I thankfully got a rare, helpful doctor who could see that I rarely use the stuff and was happy to give me a one-off prescription so that I could enjoy my saturday and socialise with family and friends.
Sigh. Sorry about the ranty nature of my post! But I am getting tired of the benzo hysteria when some people really do have no other option than to take them on an occasional basis. As for the brain damage theory, I don't deny it exists because I have noticed that Valium affects my memory, but of we're talking along those lines then someone needs to have a think about what SSRIs do to people, because when I took SSRIs I was behaving very differently, quite aggressive, and it took almost a year after coming off them to finally feel like myself again.
Well said grotbags....great post :yesyes: Kitti x
I am on 15mg a day - never had a pharmacist comment about this. If they did - they would be told where to go.
My GP just does as my shrink says thankfully.
Dan
I am on 15mg a day - never had a pharmacist comment about this. If they did - they would be told where to go.
Likewise....my GP prescribes me 168 2mg tablets every month, I do get a funny look from the pharmacist, and rather strangely they only ever dispense half of the prescription as they 'haven't got enough in stock' so I have yo go back for the rest a few days later :shrug: hmmm.
Likewise....my GP prescribes me 168 2mg tablets every month, I do get a funny look from the pharmacist, and rather strangely they only ever dispense half of the prescription as they 'haven't got enough in stock' so I have yo go back for the rest a few days later :shrug: hmmm.
Really? That works out at 6 boxes. I saw the diazepam draw at tescos they must have had at least 15 of the 2 and 5mg boxes.
Yes, very strange eh Dan? I actually go to the Tesco pharmacy for my prescription too!! Can't really understand that....
Weird indeed - I think they try and keep some in stock, in case others need it, and just order more in for the next day. Although diazepam is such a common drug they should have enough.
Do you prefer taking 2mg tablets over 5mg? Just interested really.
Dan
neowallace
25-06-12, 19:43
Hi Guys
@Grotbags ...sorry to hear you are getting hassle trying to get a medicine that helps you typical of people who don't experience anxiety who don't understand. I know probably this should not be posted but I get my diazepam from my friend. I take about 2/3 mg daily. I am planning on stopping simply because of the anxiety of maybe not being able to get them off my friend. I to find them helpful and have proved I can take them without needing to get a higher dose due to tolerance. Have been taking them without prescription for about 3 months now. I am starting tomorrow cold turkey without them...should be okay as not on a high dose and I am also taking pregabalin 300mg which I think helps. Unless you are able to get a G.P who is a bit more worldly then you end up with Politically Correct G.P's who just go by the book. If my anxiety gets that bad again then I will do what I need to and the G.P's and Shrinks can go and well........ :lac:
Anyway all the best to everyone out there........:)
Weird indeed - I think they try and keep some in stock, in case others need it, and just order more in for the next day. Although diazepam is such a common drug they should have enough.
Do you prefer taking 2mg tablets over 5mg? Just interested really.
Dan
Hi Dan, the reason I get 2mg tablets is because I have hardly ever taken more than 4mg in one dose, my usual prescription is 12mg daily (4mg three times a day) with the option to take extra if I had a really bad day. However, since starting my CBT programme, I have managed to reduce to 8mg daily and I am fairly stable on that dose atm :yesyes: This was my own choice and although my doctor is very pleased with me for taking the initiative, I am under no pressure from him at all to taper off.
Hi Guys
@Grotbags ...sorry to hear you are getting hassle trying to get a medicine that helps you typical of people who don't experience anxiety who don't understand. I know probably this should not be posted but I get my diazepam from my friend. I take about 2/3 mg daily. I am planning on stopping simply because of the anxiety of maybe not being able to get them off my friend. I to find them helpful and have proved I can take them without needing to get a higher dose due to tolerance. Have been taking them without prescription for about 3 months now. I am starting tomorrow cold turkey without them...should be okay as not on a high dose and I am also taking pregabalin 300mg which I think helps. Unless you are able to get a G.P who is a bit more worldly then you end up with Politically Correct G.P's who just go by the book. If my anxiety gets that bad again then I will do what I need to and the G.P's and Shrinks can go and well........ :lac:
Anyway all the best to everyone out there........:)
This is a very valid point. As my shrink says - if you need it - you need it. He prescribes me diazepam without question. Just a shame so many other psychiatrists are against it.
I have taken Diazapam for several years but only very occasionally if I had an attack of social anxiety that would ruin an important occasion out.
During this time my Diazapam was acquired by un-official routes as I could not get a script for them.
I have also taken them for health anxiety issues, generally when starting an SSRI and finally got a prescription this last time round.
I find 2mg still gives an effect even though I have taken a moderate amount over the years, 5mg makes me calmer still and the most I have taken in one sitting is 10mg and I felt very content! I still take 2mg to start though and find it's usually enough to allow me to get through a period of extra anxiety.
I am unsure how one would get addicted to these drugs? Does a person get addicted to feeling 'nice' like in how we should already be feeling if we didn't have to contend with whatever anxiety we are suffering? If so I can understand why people might want to continue taking them? I certainly have never felt compelled to take them when I haven't needed them for anxiety.
For me taking Diazapam when needed has allowed me to enjoy life whereas I would at times have either hid myself away or attended some event and been a quivering, frightened wreck!
Prescribing Diazapam when starting Citalopram or another SSRI should be a non-issue and we should not have to beg or get to such a state we become desperate?
Doctors dish out pills by the bucket load for all sorts of ills and what for, yes to hopefully make us feel better but because what we suffer from is 'in our minds' they can hesitate in prescribing a very effective drug. Would they do the same to someone screaming out in pain and deny them drugs that would work well on the off chance they may become addicted?
I put Diazapam in the same class of drug as pain meds. Both mask the problems and allow people to function. The underlying condition should be treated in other ways (if possible) but sometimes with either drugs taking them chronically is sometimes the only option. It's a case of risk versus benefit and personally the benefits wins hands down.
Steve.
In my view, I would say Diazepam is almost a victim of its own success, and a victim of newer drugs.
What I mean is, that it is VERY effective at what it does - i.e calming people in distress for whatever reason. And that makes it become something people reach for understandably, and for some, that might mean they become dependant on it. Again, understandable given the horrific nature of anxiety as we know.
Because modern SSRI's are being given out for anxiety now, and they are effective, but maybe not as quickly as Diazepam, they are the preferred med of doctors and the NHS.
I'm of the personal opinion that Diazepam is very effective, and a life saver for some, and doesn't deserve the rep it has, but unfortunately, that is here to stay. If prescribed well, it is still a great med, and quite frankly, what is the real difference between taking Diazepam every day, and taking an SSRI every day? I'm not sure, but I guess because Diazepam is so fast acting it has become a recreational drug for some, so maybe that is part for the reason for its rationing? Again, possibly a victim of its own success?
Thats my thoughts.
neowallace
26-06-12, 19:27
Hi Guys
Totally agree with Purplesky....:)
---------- Post added at 19:27 ---------- Previous post was at 19:24 ----------
Hi Guys
There is not really a specific place to post about this so I will try it here. Does anyone use Zoplicone? And have they used it during the day for anxiety relieving effects. I mean maybe taking a quarter or half one as they have anxiety relieving properties. Just curious as I have started doing this....
Steven....:)
I've said this before on another thread.
I think the problem is "Street Diazepam" which is mixed with all sorts of shit including ketamine and is being abused by drug addicts.
Unfortunately as a consequence of this, the people who really need it for anxiety aren't getting it from their GP's.
My psychiatrist (older) and my previous one (older) is a big advocate for treating anxiety with diazepam. I take 15mg daily alongside an SSRI and have also had psychology treatment.
I reduced this myself to 11mg and then had another depressive episode which landed me back in hospital. My psychiatrist and I think my "maintenance dose" is 12mg which I plan to to gradually reduce back to.
The GP's are being governed by NICE guidelines at the moment.
Haz.
Great posts by southey, purplesky and haz.......well said :yesyes:
What a shame that Diazepam has become 'demonised' As I have said before, used sensibly and with the support of the doctor and/or therapist a very effective, gentle and well tolerated drug.
I hate to think where I'd be now without mine, which has helped me so much in my fight with debilitating anxiety and panic (which lead to agoraphobia) I am slowly coming out of the 'black hole' and on my way up at last and diazepam has played a major part in my continuing recovery :)
I agree with Kittikat who always gives such sound advice. I am on diazepam and it is helping me so much. I got freaked out by reading anti benzo stuff and kept trying to reduce my dose. I have been on it for 13 weeks varying between 2mg and 6mg per day. I went down to 3.5 mg for a couple of weeks but it was too soon and my GP has put me back on 6mg. I will taper when I am ready but in the meantime I am happy to continue.:). Diazepam is tried and tested, we know the benefits and the pitfalls, it's not on the world health organisations list of essential drugs for nothing!:yesyes: Sal x
Some pertinent posts well made, you people. :)
My own antipathy toward 'Benzo Hysteria' is long-standing and deep-seated.
Keep up the debate, it's worth watching/contributing. :shades:
neowallace
28-06-12, 14:43
Hi Guys
I have been refused diazapem from all doctors at my surgery and also the NHS Shrink who is linked up to the surgery. I am currently on Pregabalin which I think may help a bit but still would like the freedom of choice and Diazepam help me. I have been getting roughly 2mg a day for a around 3 months no prescription from a friend. I cannot keep relying on a friend for it. I have now been 3 days without it and feel not bad but certainly missing it. Has anyone had success getting it prescribed by any other means. I don't mean black market but maybe changing surgery's or making a complaint. Has anybody any thoughts or is it a case of G.P'S no better and you are not getting it. Any feedback would be appreciated. Please no lectures on the dangers of diazepam.
Warm regards
Steven.......:)
Because of NICE guidelines most GPs wont prescibe it,bit drastic to change GPS when theres no guarantee the new ones will prescribe it either.
Dunno the answer tho
Joy
I think that is extremely reckless of a GP.
The guidelines exist for good reason, it should only be specialists who break them with good reason. If a shrink says you need 100 fair enough, but a GP wow.
10mg a day - was he trying to finish you off.
The unlicensed dose is 1-2mg daily.
---------- Post added at 10:33 ---------- Previous post was at 10:29 ----------
Hi Guys
I have been refused diazapem from all doctors at my surgery and also the NHS Shrink who is linked up to the surgery. I am currently on Pregabalin which I think may help a bit but still would like the freedom of choice and Diazepam help me. I have been getting roughly 2mg a day for a around 3 months no prescription from a friend. I cannot keep relying on a friend for it. I have now been 3 days without it and feel not bad but certainly missing it. Has anyone had success getting it prescribed by any other means. I don't mean black market but maybe changing surgery's or making a complaint. Has anybody any thoughts or is it a case of G.P'S no better and you are not getting it. Any feedback would be appreciated. Please no lectures on the dangers of diazepam.
Warm regards
Steven.......:)
To be honest I just bought it off the black market and saw a private shrink who prescribes diazepam.
Dan
neowallace
29-06-12, 15:52
Hi guys thanks for all the feedback. I know everyone has different views and experiences with Diazepam. I am going to give it a bit of time without and see how I feel. My alternative Pregabalin has been increased so it might help. Good luck to everyone that has posted..
:)
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