Has anyone had much success with going with the panic rather than fighting it?

[Anxious_gal]

I'm slowly grasping the idea of not fighting the panic.
I've read about it in Claire Weeks book and the CBT4panic books.

I'm learning to relax, observe the panic and remind my self not to fear it and try to replace all the negitive thoughts and images with positive ones.

Obviously fighting the panic , avoidance , etc. . Is not helping lol
So I'm hoping just accepting the panic is the way to go.

[robinhall]

Hi Mishel

That's great that you are starting to get the idea of not fighting the panic

If you don't mind I can add a few suggestions

First of all it can help to change the language you use - so that you stay clear about your new way of approaching anxiety

What you are not 'fighting' or 'resisting' is the fight or flight sensations that arise

If we keep calling it 'panic' we see it as a separate entity that 'attacks' us - whereas the reality is that frightening but ultimately harmless symptoms (that are the result of our fight or flight response) have been activated (sometimes for no particular reason) and we have mistaken these symptoms for something more serious so then we go into 'panic'. And when we panic we send fear signals through the body which again activates the fight or flight response and so we get caught in a cycle of fear.


Through your new practice you are not necessarily going into 'panic' - you are seeing the symptoms for what they are and attempting to let them be until they die down.

so the truth is you are now grasping the idea of not fighting the 'fight or flight sensations'. And if you say it to yourself in this more accurate language you will progress more rapidly because you will be remembering the fact that it IS 'just' fight or flight as opposed to you being in some terrifying state labelled 'panic'.

The word 'panic' is so vague it doesn't help us remember exactly what is happening

I realise this may seem like a very minor detail but I have seen it make a big difference to people.

Another thing is that it is helpful to observe if by 'accepting' the sensations you are still hoping deep down that this will 'get rid of them'

Obviously we all want that but panic is like a conundrum - when you have no fear of 'panic attacks' (in the sense that you really understand that as frightening as they feel you are actually in no danger) then they will stop happening

and in order to reach that point you need to
1. Understand why panic attacks arise and what maintains them
2. Learn skills (such as acceptance and restructuring your thoughts) that will help you deal with the symptoms
3. Practice graduated exposure to the sensations (or places that trigger the sensations) until you learn that you are in no actual danger

So - a part of recovery involves ALLOWING the sensations to exist - as they are

but because they are frightening we understandably want them to NOT exist - and sometimes we use our new skills (such as acceptance) as another subtle form of 'resistance' (we are hoping that our acceptance will make all the horrible feelings 'go away')

I know this sounds frustrating - but it is very understandable and normal. The key is to just observe if it is happening and then try to adjust your 'acceptance' so that you are trying also to ALLOW the sensations to exist in fullness - and you even try to accept letting them get as bad as they want to get (because you know now that they are just fight or flight and you are in no danger) - THIS is true acceptance and it is this level of acceptance that you are hoping to reach

All this information above will work best with those who have straightforward panic disorder (and you have been checked by your doctor) - if you have health anxiety then you will need a different set of skills

Anyway - I hope this hasn't been confusing :wacko: - those of you who have the CBT4PANIC course know that I have laid this out very clearly and simply in the books and videos

Cheers
Robin

[BobbyDog]

This acceptance is really difficult!!!!!
I continually put myself in situations that I fear, like in social situations, I always panic and it is hard to "accept" the feelings of fight or flight when the physical sensations caused by the adrenalin rush are there, I can't think about anything else.
I will never give up though, it can be done.

[Anxious_gal]

Robbin thanks so much for taking the time to reply.

I will trying replacing the phrases panic and anxiety with flight or fight response.
Yes it true that by accepting the panic I am hoping it will take the panic away which does seem rather counterproductive.
I know when mediating you need to observe your thoughts without analyzing them, just let them come in and out of your mind. So I guess I'll try to take the same approach for when I'm anxious.

Bobby I find when I'm in situations that make me panicky, That focusing you attention outside of yourself can help.
When you panic you zoom in on all your feelings and symptoms, but if you try to focus outwards it can help.
Look around, people watch, take an interest in things outside of your mind.

When I panic I try to stay a few minutes longer than I want to, I also try to slow down.
It can help sometimes to go outside and then go back in once you're feeling a bit calmer.

Also telling yourself that you can leave when ever you want can be helpful as well as saying I choose to be here or I want to be here.
With anxiety some times you don't realize you're only leaving the situation because you feel scared and not because you don't want to be there.

[Tish]

This really does work!
I'm agoraphobic but I do go out with my husband, I haven't been out without him in over 4 years. About a year ago, Iwould ask him if he'd stand outside whilst i went into a shop alone. This would fill me with fear and panic but i just tried to ignore the feelings. Over time they lessenand now i can go into a shop, no problem.
We would go to car boot sales and i would panic if he left my side so, using baby steps again, I would ask hubby to just be in the next aisle so I could find him if the panic overwhelmed me. This also worked and now I can wander around freely without him.
I've still got massive hurdles to overcome. I'm still scared if I'm confined like in a bus or restaurant and I still can't go anywhere without hubby but I'm proof that if you follow the CBT programme you can make progress, even if it is slow.

[waunder]

Love these replies. I also have come a long way using these techniques, nothing is easy but it works and worth all efforts.:yesyes:

[Jamesflames]

I was watching an Australian film about agoraphobia the other day and one of the doctors on it was saying that it helps to separate the physical sensations from your feelings. I have been trying this by imagining that all my panicky sensations are over to my left and that my feelings are over to my right. This way they are not "wired together" and even if I have tight muscles, dry mouth, pounding heart, etc these sensations are not connected to how I feel generally. I have found that by doing this I can be physically having a lot of symptoms of panic but not feel too worried by them and can almost ignore them.

I know these sort of visualizations can be quite personal things, but I would be interested to know if this sort of thinking is helpful to anyone else. :)

[jimsmrs]

I was distacting myself at one point then I read somewhere, not to fight it but to confront or challenge it. I then started to invite the panic and the anxiety in, but found it's basically a coward, I then pictured it, gave it a face and a body, sounds weird I know but it worked for me.

[deejay94]

I've tried to confront it but have failed so far, not very pleasant.

[Jules147]

Acceptance as Robin outlines is more effective with 7/11 breathing along the way. Focus your attention on what is outside your body also helps.

[BobbyDog]

Thank you Robin for CBT information, I will try and take on board what you have said.
When I think a panic attack is coming on, I will say "Ah, it's the fight or flight", "OK I will ride with these feelings".

Sarah:D