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little wren
18-02-13, 08:57
Hi
Just wondering if others have had CBT for agoraphobia and whether it was successful (even partially) and would they recommend this therapy or even another therapy. Also what is actually involved in the sessions and if anyone has gone private for it?

Thanks

flossie
18-02-13, 09:52
Hi. CBT is the preferred treatment for agoraphobia. Everybody is entitled to at least one course through the NHS. Ask your GP if he thinks it would be suitable for you at this time and that you would like to be referred to the mental health team. There is usually a waiting list, it differs how long depending on the area you live in. The sooner you get your name on the list the better. In the meantime, there is an organisation called No Panic. They offer CBT courses over the telephone. There is a £12 annual membership and for this you can have access to as many courses as you feel would help you. I am on the list for my 2nd group course and hope to start in the next couple of months. No Panic offer a one to one course or a group course.
I have put a link for more info on the agoraphobia thread in the phobias section.http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?t=130181&page=2

little wren
18-02-13, 10:51
Hi flossie :), the thing is I had cbt for ocd about seven years ago when I was severely ill and I don't think I made the most of it. However, something must have sunk in as the ocd has improved from then. I really just wanted to know if others had benefited from having cbt for agoraphobia - any personal experiences of it. I have read a few threads of people who have had cbt but apart from kittikat nothing for agoraphobia. At the moment I just seem to be throwing myself into going outside but without feeling I have effective coping skills. I have never had any other kind of therapy apart from this one short course of cbt seven years ago. x

Pinktel
22-02-13, 10:28
Totally you should check out cbt4panic website, helping me for my agoraphobia of 20 odd years! Around £60 for all workbooks, online videos where Robin Hall analyses and explains all the workbooks step by step with you, you get everything sent on a DVD anyway and you can download everything onto your computer anyway.
The first 30 days you don't even get the money taken from your account, and you can cancel at any time, then I even think after the money has been taken you have another 30 days to cancel and be refunded under the distance selling act. I don't even think they then ask for the material back.
I haven't cancelled as it is helping in such a clear way as. In a way nothing else I have ever tried has.
I have paid more than that for a one off hour with a psychotherapist trained in CBT.
I have battled health anxiety, panic disorder, depression, agoraphobia, social anxiety, you name it...
I am not cured but I am better than when I started the therapy.
Robin is there with extremely helpful and informative emails whenever there is a problem.
You have to print out the work sheets, fill in the analysis sheets, I have gone through a lot of paper :D but that is the key to success (although even just reading and listening to the workbooks will go a long way to help).
The great thing is that YOU are in charge of the process, so no pressure from a psychologist trying to push you to spend the day in a shopping centre etc to see results.
You have to take small steps with successful outcomes as the best route.
Techniques taught will give you coping strategies to help you when the panic rears its head.
Why not check it out?

little wren
22-02-13, 11:01
Thanks pinktel - your message was so uplifting. Yes I am having a look at cbt4panic I emailed Robin Hall the other day and he was kind enough to point me in the right direction...I am still looking at the downloads at the moment. It is so reassuring that it is working for you (thanks for sharing). I really know what you mean about feeling pressured by others to meet deadlines in recovery - I suppose the NHS has to do it that way. I think feeling in control of your recovery is really important too. Good luck :)

AuntieMoosie
23-02-13, 02:46
I, too, would highly recommend CBT4PANIC :)

Having had agoraphobia since 2004 and being 100% housebound, I'm now able to go out and put what I've learned into practice :) I've still a way to go, but all the time I'm making progress I'm happy :) :hugs:

little wren
23-02-13, 07:59
Thanks auntiemoosie x

Serenitie
23-02-13, 08:11
I entered the trial of CBT4Panic as a result of a recommendation from NMP and I was sorely disappointed.

I cannot criticise the methodology whatsoever. As a mental health practitioner trained in CBT, task focused therapy, person centred therapy and crisis management, Robin's product is sound and well presented.

However, at the time of embarking in this programme, I was totally without income and in crisis resulting from numerous issues in my life. I was not able to pay. Upon cancelling, I expressed my thanks for a quality product, but at this time, I could not continue as a paid member. Robin's response was patronising and said it was a shame for me to walk away from the one to one support for such value for money. I responded to Robin by saying when you have no money for food or mortgage, paying for CBT is not an option. He responded by conceding that financial matters and generating an income were a priority for him currently.

This told me that as skilled as this man is in CBT, which I do not deny, his people skills were displaced by his need to make money from CBT4Panic.

I am a qualified social worker, skilled in many fields, willing to offer my expertise for free on NMP even though I'm struggling financially. Look through my threads. I seek support infrequently but provide support as often as I am able.

I post on here to help others out of goodwill and the hope that I can help others with the benefit of my knowledge, skills, personal & professional experience.

Be wary of those charging for their support. Some - not all - will be reluctant to hurry your progress or discharge you from their care as this causes a drop in their income. I speak as a professional who has heard this directly from other colleagues and so called 'professionals' who I have recoiled from in disgust.

Please make informed choices :hugs:

Pinktel
23-02-13, 09:57
Serenetie did you have to return all course material once you cancelled?

Jamesflames
24-02-13, 09:05
Hey Little Wren. I am currently in the middle of CBT with the NHS. It's no miracle cure but has generally helped. I think the most interesting effect is that I have started viewing trips outside my 'safety zone' as interesting opportunities to observe agoraphobia, rather than fearful experiences to be avoided.
Time will tell what the end result will be, but I am feeling pretty positive about it.

little wren
24-02-13, 10:31
Jamesflames ... Thanks for sharing. It's interesting what you say about it changing how you view areas outside your safety zone. It is so easy to fall into the habit of thinking about 'safety zones' in the same way (the only safe place) and anything outside it in the same way (it is always scary). I can see how gaining a different perspective would be helpful. Good luck x

robinhall
24-02-13, 14:03
Hi Serenite

I'm very sorry I have caused you to feel so bad. You may not have noticed my post in the Announcements forum that I intend to give CBT4PANIC free from now on in a few weeks time.

I did apologize to you when you told me you felt I was patronising you and made clear that it was not my intention to do so but clearly that didn't help so all I can say is that I am sorry again and I hope you are finding the help you need in all directions.

Robin

little wren
25-02-13, 10:08
Just an aside - I have a raging toothache (desperate need of a filling) as other agoraphobics are aware it is not as easy as just phoning up the dentist and going (actually I am not even registered anywhere it has been over 20 years since I went to the dentist). At present I have fallen backwards and cannot even get out of my street. Has anyone got any ideas of how I should go about this? I am thinking maybe Robins programme may help but how long until you feel it working? x

Pinktel
25-02-13, 11:54
Firstly I would register with the nearest dentist!! Not sure how you do this now as have been with mine for years but you must be able to get on somebody's list somewhere close by.
I would then have a really frank conversation with them about your current limits and see what they themselves suggest. Until you know your options you don't know what is required of you or what you need to be working towards.
Certainly I would think the CBT will help but it's perhaps a tall order to throw yourself into that so quickly if you are currently struggling. If nothing else the programme is based on constant repetition of a behaviour to retrain the brain so the more you do something successfully with no fear of panic the better it gets. Why not email Robin to ask advice also?

little wren
26-02-13, 09:38
Thanks Pinktel - you make perfect sense...I need to know what is required of me... can bear pain at moment...but get ball rolling x

star2sparkle
26-02-13, 15:56
Hi LittleWren

Have you found a dentist? I hope so. I have dental phobia along with agoraphobia and had terrible teeth but I found a lovely dentist who helped me to face my fears and if I could marry him I would! I have to travel to see him and so 'battle' the agoraphobia with the dental phobia but it is amazing what you can do sometimes. My teeth are so much better as a rewarding result.
I agree with Serenite in that there are so many anxiety 'helpers' out there such as Charles Linden who are making vast quantities of money from other people's suffering. I actually did buy Charles Linden's stuff and found the Tai Chi helpful and visualisation techniques (not much else to be honest!) so consider that as a way of relaxing. Have a peek on the net.
Robin Hall's books are great. I am sure he would send you 'Overcoming Panic Attacks and Agoraphobia' using CBT if you ask him. It is so good! The cartoons make me chuckle all the time. I don't quite comprehend why he was charging before and not now but I can say that his books can be lifesavers. All I would propose is that you seek face to face expert help rather than just going it alone, especially if you have suffered for many years. Graded exposure therapy is excellent for agoraphobia but often you need extra support for this, not just self help. I will always say that one size doesn't fit all because otherwise we'd all be cured by now; there are, after all, many people who are extremely brave that aren't cured using CBT (I know it is about acceptance and not bravery so much but still have to say it!) It can be about a combination of therapies that suit you.
I am still trying...never give up and just find what is best for you :bighug1:

little wren
27-02-13, 09:06
sparkle2sparkle I am so scared of 'flooding' - doing too much without knowing what the hell I am doing. When things like toothache hit you (something you can't think away) it makes me realise just how ill prepared Ive let myself become by letting my going out fall by the wayside.

Robin sent me the free literature a few days ago. I think the value of it is not going to be immediate for me (i.e. the tooth) but as a long-term strategy I think it makes perfect sense. As for the tooth - I kid myself 'it doesn't hurt that much' etc but I am going to ask MHN early next week where anxious clients go (we all have to deal with the everyday whether we have anxiety disorders or not) as who I see is going to have a major effect on how I deal with it. Perhaps this hurting is a good thing because I can no longer ignore that I need to ask them for help. x

---------- Post added at 08:06 ---------- Previous post was at 08:02 ----------

Just an aside I couldn't get onto your blogspot - it came up error.

Ive seen a few of diaries/blogs on this site and the writer appears to benefit just by the actual writing of their experience (whether anyone reads it or not). I am considering my own (jumping on the bandwagon) as I don't want to hog other peoples. I also find it is easier to follow a few people when they have a diary/blog. x

star2sparkle
27-02-13, 09:59
Hi Little Wren

It is strange about the blog link. As you say it doesn't work but if you copy it and then paste it into your browser, it does. odd! Yes, do write your own blog, I'd love to see it. How are you getting on today?

Alabasterlyn
27-02-13, 10:20
I've had CBT for my agoraphobia 3 times and on none of those occasions have I felt I really benefited.

The last 2 times I was just given the 6wk sessions and both times they were stopped as the therapist wasn't able to take me out in their car. Now I know some people might think that I should have just gone walking up and down the road with the therapist but I was told on both occasions that during therapy it was important to make a list of places that I actually wanted to go to otherwise it would be pointless. As I find walking up and down the road I live in incredibly tedious rather than anxiety provoking we agreed to drop the sessions. I still find it hard to believe that the NHS can't arrange for therapists to be insured to take our patients as being able to travel is surely such a huge hurdle for so many of us.

My first experience with CBT though was for a longer period which was supposed to be a year and for that I saw a qualified Psychologist through the local hospital. I had to go to her office every week for the sessions, which was very hard but I made sure I kept every appointment.

For 8mths we just sat and talked in her office when I was itching to actually go out and do some exposure therapy. When we did start to go out I realised quite quickly that it wasn't going to work as I didn't agree with the way she did things. Our first outing was walking around a local field on a hot August afternoon when the temperature was 96f! I was anxious when we started off, felt even worse when we were walking around the field and more crucially felt even worse once I got home. I've always understood that it's important to stay out until the anxiety lessens yet this therapist obviously didn't see it that way.

For our next session she wanted to meet me in the middle of a 140 store shopping mall :scared15: I was not allowed to take anyone with me, just to be dropped off in the middle of town, somewhere I was totally unable to get to even with my partner. When I asked if I could at least let my partner wait for me in the car park she wouldn't even go along with that and decided to stop our sessions on the grounds of my "lack of trust". I'd be the first person to say that yes I do have trust issues, but I don't see that as a valid reason to stop therapy.

Pinktel
27-02-13, 10:36
Wow Alabasterlyn - that is RUBBISH CBT!! But I am not surprised as my experience of NHS CBT is equally sad, although I am sure there are good therapists out there, they are just not in MY neck of the woods!

What a shame you are put off CBT from these poor therapists. Please try the (now free) CBT4Panic which is endorsed through this site it is slowly but surely changing my life. 20 plus years of agoraphobia, panic disorder, health anxiety, hyperventilation, GAD, the list is embarrassing!!

I won't advise you to walk up and down your road if you find it tedious. But what happens when you walk beyond your road? Where is the cut off point to feeling anxious as opposed to bored? Find that point and that's where you begin. If you are in charge of your own CBT programme you certainly CAN take your partner to a shopping mall to begin with, you do it at your own pace in your own way. If your partner is around to drive you, try and plan that into your week in different ways.

little wren
28-02-13, 08:53
Hi Little Wren

It is strange about the blog link. As you say it doesn't work but if you copy it and then paste it into your browser, it does. odd! Yes, do write your own blog, I'd love to see it. How are you getting on today?


Hi star2sparkle

Thanks for asking... I am ok this morning (I am up at the crack of dawn as we have a pup - well he's five months old now but still a big baby lol). I am under a bit of stress at the moment as hubby was very ill two nights ago (long-term condition) and an ambulance was called early hours to take him to hospital. He may be out tomorrow. Last night I felt the anxiety creep up - then I remembered what little songbird had written on her diary about how she gives no importance to intrusive thoughts and just knowing someone else was experiencing and handling anxiety helped so much.

I think the pregabalin is actually helping with the toothache - or the nerves are dying :huh:- either way I have made my decisions on what to do concerning it.

Yay - your link works now :yesyes:! I read your article about 'Wrinkles, worrying and whining...' It was funny and so true. I am someone who looks younger than my years and everyone is surprised when I tell them my actual age - I think it is just genetics. I hate all the influences out there that women over 40 are made to feel unnattractive. I was watching Lowri Turner on Wright Stuff yesterday and she is 48 and pregnant with twins and I just thought yes someone who is doing what she wants. A late forties pregnant presenter lol - Growing old disgracefully - love it.

How are you feeling today? I was also wondering which area of psychology are your interests in?

little wren x

impulse81
28-02-13, 09:01
I am also on the waiting list for c.b.t,my problems are agoraphobia and s.a,I'm being brave today I have an appointment with my alcohol support worker and my partner is in work,I have got to get there by myself,I'm not feeling to anxious as yet but Its only early and I'm trying to think positive!

little wren
28-02-13, 09:25
For our next session she wanted to meet me in the middle of a 140 store shopping mall :scared15: I was not allowed to take anyone with me, just to be dropped off in the middle of town, somewhere I was totally unable to get to even with my partner. When I asked if I could at least let my partner wait for me in the car park she wouldn't even go along with that and decided to stop our sessions on the grounds of my "lack of trust". I'd be the first person to say that yes I do have trust issues, but I don't see that as a valid reason to stop therapy.


Hi Lyn thanks for sharing. You know when I first read your post I thought she cannot be writing about practices in Britain...Obviously you were. I think it is atrocious and think it is more akin to 'flooding' - just shoving somebody in at the deep end and saying well sink or swim then! Trusting the anxiety will come down and indeed the person will swim. I cannot imagine why she would use something 'outdated' when CBT usually asks for small gradual exposures. It is no wonder it has put you off!

---------- Post added at 08:25 ---------- Previous post was at 08:11 ----------


I am also on the waiting list for c.b.t,my problems are agoraphobia and s.a,I'm being brave today I have an appointment with my alcohol support worker and my partner is in work,I have got to get there by myself,I'm not feeling to anxious as yet but Its only early and I'm trying to think positive!

Hi Impulse - well done for thinking positive :)- I think most people suffering from agoraphobia will be relating to what you say. By not engaging with the 'what ifs' you are doing brill. As I write this I think 'sounds so easy to say' but I know how hard it can be sometimes. Good luck.

Alabasterlyn
28-02-13, 10:48
Wow Alabasterlyn - that is RUBBISH CBT!! But I am not surprised as my experience of NHS CBT is equally sad, although I am sure there are good therapists out there, they are just not in MY neck of the woods!

What a shame you are put off CBT from these poor therapists. Please try the (now free) CBT4Panic which is endorsed through this site it is slowly but surely changing my life. 20 plus years of agoraphobia, panic disorder, health anxiety, hyperventilation, GAD, the list is embarrassing!!

I won't advise you to walk up and down your road if you find it tedious. But what happens when you walk beyond your road? Where is the cut off point to feeling anxious as opposed to bored? Find that point and that's where you begin. If you are in charge of your own CBT programme you certainly CAN take your partner to a shopping mall to begin with, you do it at your own pace in your own way. If your partner is around to drive you, try and plan that into your week in different ways.

Thanks for the link for CBT4Panic, I will have a look into that. I probably will sound like a lazy mare but I've got to the point where I don't want to walk any further than I currently do. We have 2 dogs and walk them about 2 miles a day, but I can only go with my partner and I am much better walking them when it's dark. I'm dreading when the clocks go forward as I will have to push myself even harder. Up until just over a year ago I never really did much walking outside of the house and had a treadmill in the spare bedroom. OH then had some knee problems and was finding walking the 1 dog we had at the time difficult so I started going with him and have been going ever since. It's been incredibly difficult battling to manage the distance and although I don't feel particularly anxious I've had a few times when I've come over all dizzy out of the blue and struggled to get back home :scared15:


Hi Lyn thanks for sharing. You know when I first read your post I thought she cannot be writing about practices in Britain...Obviously you were. I think it is atrocious and think it is more akin to 'flooding' - just shoving somebody in at the deep end and saying well sink or swim then! Trusting the anxiety will come down and indeed the person will swim. I cannot imagine why she would use something 'outdated' when CBT usually asks for small gradual exposures. It is no wonder it has put you off![COLOR="blue"]



It certainly does sound like flooding indeed and I know years ago flooding was very popular. I can still remember once many years ago being asked if I would like to take part in this kind of treatment. It meant travelling about 40mins by car to the hospital and then going by tube into London with a group of fellow agoraphobics and going into a Dept Store in Oxford Street for a few hours. I can't believe that anyone in their right mind would ever think this kind of treatment could ever be effective and I often wonder what happened to the patients who did try it :ohmy:

little wren
05-03-13, 15:32
Feeling bit down - I have not been allowed CBT for agoraphobia. I had CBT seven years ago for OCD which was only partially successful. I feel I could really benefit from CBT as I've moved on since then. I have been offered a support worker to accompany me outside once a month and come with me to the dentist as a one-off.

Feel like giving up. Where do I go from here? I will ask the psychiatrist on my next appointment. It is my last hope. I have looked at NICE guidelines and it says that if one session does not work can be given another session or a different therapy.

Just taking the prozac and pregabalin (have chest pains but I think it is from the bad news). I feel so demoralized.

Pinktel
05-03-13, 16:21
Little wren do not give up, I will not let you :mad::D

All I can say from my experience of NHS CBT is it is not a patch on the programme at CBT4Panic. I have never yet come across such a comprehensive package.

You sound like an intelligent person to me from your posts, it is not beyond you to take charge of your own recovery.

I have yet to come across a support worker with an understanding of CBT and neuroses such as Robin Hall displays. Read your way through his workbooks, watch the accompanying videos where he talks you through each work book (that is VERY helpful).

Get filling in sheets, get planning, get going, you CAN do this.

Mental health services are being slashed up and down the country, it is by no means right, but you will spend a long time fighting for very little help. Much better to spend and invest your energies in working through this yourself, it is a tried and tested methodology being offered to you through this programme and it will help you if you let it...

Any advice on it please ask me also, I am not Robin Hall but I am currently working my way through it all, I have been where you are. :hugs:

bernie1977
05-03-13, 16:29
So sorry that you are not getting the treatment you need Little Wren. I was in the same boat at one point and I wrote to the head of the mental health team and to NHS Complaints manager in my area. It worked for me and one week I get a visit from a CPN and the next a support worker to do exposure therapy with.

Not saying it will work but you could try and complain to see if it gets you the help you need.

little wren
06-03-13, 08:20
Thanks Pinktel you are a little gem picking people up when they fall flat on their faces :)

Yes I cannot beat the system (I'm not longer young enough to believe it is fair). I think you are so right about investing my energies into taking control of my own recovery. I have nothing to lose following Robins lit. I cannot give up hope. If there's any support you need too just ask.

---------- Post added at 07:20 ---------- Previous post was at 07:15 ----------

Thanks bernie - I don't think I would get anywhere appealing the decision. I did actually ask my cpn 'who do I write to as I strongly disagree with the decision made about my health care?'. I was told basically it would do no good. I can see why vulnerable people benefit from advocates to help them have a voice. I guess I need to look more towards myself for my own recovery now. Ive read your post on other thread - and really pleased you are taking steps forward x

flossie
06-03-13, 09:47
Hi little wren. Don't forget that CBT support is available via No Panic.

little wren
06-03-13, 10:08
flossie - do you know if robins lit and the no panic programme are compatible - I can't remember if you'd done both. x

flossie
06-03-13, 11:03
I haven't seen Robins CBT lit. little wren but I am interested. I can't afford it myself.
I would imagine both cover the same information. It just depends on which suits you as an individual and whether or not you work better with having someone to talk things through on the end of a phone but I don't see why they cannot work hand in hand to be honest.
You pays your money and makes your choice in this instance I think.

Pinktel
06-03-13, 13:47
flossie it is now FREE!!! if you pm Robin Hall i believe he is working now to offer it free of charge to those who cannot afford it... you have nothing to lose :)

little wren
07-03-13, 10:50
flossie - I pm'd Robin and asked if the two programmes were compatible and he says yes they should be. I did email no panic and ask about their recovery programme but nothing back from them. I think telephone support would be helpful as sometimes things do need clarifying whilst I'm working through Robins literature.


To everyone who reads this thread - There seems a few on the agoraphobia thread who are using cbt as a means to conquer agoraphobia - does anyone want to have a small group of support on here - on what they tried today and how they coped with it using the cbt techniques etc. Just an idea as it could be helpful to air thoughts and hear constructive responses etc. I know the one thing is practice - I know there are good days and bad days and I know sometimes we need feedback that we have understood the literature. Just to say I don't mind if this thread is used like that. Otherwise I am going to just continue writing down my own experiences of cbt here and any feedback is warmly received.

Pinktel
07-03-13, 11:31
i think that's a really good idea little wren

flossie
07-03-13, 11:35
I reckon sticking to this thread is perfect for swapping thoughts on CBT and any other therapies other members are trying little wren, otherwise it would get spread over too many threads. If it doesn't work then we can think again in a while. It's up to you though if you would prefer to start your own thread. I am looking forward to hearing your thoughts and how you are getting on. I need a kick to get me moving and your enthusiasm is encouraging me to start working harder at recovery.
We all have different ideas and techniques that help us and reading something that we may not have heard of before, whether CBT or not, could just be a light bulb moment for someone.
I had a lovely email from Robin and will be taking a look at his work later today. I haven't time at the moment - this agoraphobic is going out!:D

little wren
07-03-13, 14:10
Excellent - anyone doing cbt (or have other ideas) for agoraphobia can benefit from the support here. I am genuinely interested in hearing how others are getting on and what techniques they are using. It would just be nice to have a little space where we could support each other as cbt is a hard slog sometimes...and the fear can make you just think why bother.

Hey - I think I know how Bernie felt in one of her posts. I went out (with other half) to chemist and around the block with our dog. I then took the dog around the other half of the cul-de-sac BY MYSELF (gulp). The advice given here was great - he didn't sit (except when told to) and yes he takes his time having a good sniff but watching him enjoy it so much kind of rubbed off on me - I felt elated. After the adrenaline has pumped up it makes me very tired (in a good way). The anticipatory anxiety was awful (I thought I would just do as much or as little as I wanted, no pressure if I couldn't get to chemist it had been a long time since I'd last been) but I ended up doing more. I know this was a 'good' outing and there is no expectation that this will extend to next outing. The small goal I have set myself is to walk dog in morning to an area near my house (it's a carpark but there is a nice grassy area to the side). I will go as far as I can each time until I get there.
The advice I took with me today was 'relax the stomach' and breathing will become normal and float with the anxiety should it come. x

little wren
08-03-13, 09:20
Pinktel - Replying to your other post: I am genuinely surprised by your statement '...I could probably do with a few more panics involving it to really clarify my thoughts on it further...'. That shows real determination and understanding of anxiety disorders. I have not looked at the videos yet. I am doing that today x

---------- Post added at 08:20 ---------- Previous post was at 08:11 ----------

Hubby went to work early so I didn't take dog out (at the moment I am only doing it when he is at home - my first step). Tooth still hurting so not bothered - the pregab. will ease the pain but the sooner I understand and can use cbt skills the better. I have time as I am still waiting for an str to help - no way am I going on my own (know it sounds chickeny but I feel I need accompanying as I not only find going out difficult I find being in buildings I don't know difficult let alone being confined to a chair powerless).

Alabasterlyn
08-03-13, 10:53
I would love to give CBT another go on my own terms rather than with a therapist so look forward to hearing more about this free CBT as like many other agoraphobics I don't work so don't have any earnings to pay for any therapy.

Pinktel
08-03-13, 12:40
Little wren I think the videos will really clarify things for you. Reading the workbooks is great but the reinforcing videos for each workbook are what drummed it all into my little brain that bit further! Look forward to hearing what you think of them all!

What are your main panic symptoms? What I also found invaluable is the de sensitizing section on symptoms where each day you practise bringing on similar feeings to your body. For example, getting your heart rate up by running up the stairs to mimic a racing heart. Just to get you more used to that sensation in a controlled way. Again, reinforcing that your body has coped with it thousands of times before and is perfectly capable of managing those symptoms.

And stop yourself thinking about being confined to a chair powerless. That is anticipatory anxiety revving you up right there. You are not powerless. You can tap the dentist on the arm at any point so they stop and you can sit up, get out the chair, walk around. Hell you could even leave if you really wanted to, you'd get home one way or another.

Dentists alongside doctors and psychologists will experience people having panic attacks infront of them every working day. They won't give a hoot. If you need to have a panic then just go right ahead and have one. And afterwards, when nothing has happened to you, you will still be alive and the sun will still come up tomorrow and everyone will go about their day exactly the same. You may even have learned something to help you, you can take a symptom that you were experiencing and work your way through it to begin to undermine it's authority by exposing it as a fraud. :mad::D

---------- Post added at 11:40 ---------- Previous post was at 11:40 ----------

lyn why not pm Robin Hall?

flossie
08-03-13, 14:12
I would love to give CBT another go on my own terms rather than with a therapist so look forward to hearing more about this free CBT as like many other agoraphobics I don't work so don't have any earnings to pay for any therapy.

Hi Lyn. Taking control of my own recovery is exactly what I am doing. I have done a group CBT telephone course with No Panic and have my name down for another. I am hoping to hear from them soon about starting in the next few weeks. http://www.nopanic.org.uk/resources.html click the Click Here link in the middle of the page for details.

Alabasterlyn
08-03-13, 14:23
Hi Lyn. Taking control of my own recovery is exactly what I am doing. I have done a group CBT telephone course with No Panic and have my name down for another. I am hoping to hear from them soon about starting in the next few weeks. http://www.nopanic.org.uk/resources.html click the Click Here link in the middle of the page for details.

I used to be a member of No Panic for years. I think I joined back in 1994 when I had a major setback and I did their 12wk course and then trained to be a volunteer myself and would spend most weekends taking calls on the helpline. I don't think back then they did any CBT telephone courses though.

little wren
14-03-13, 08:35
Today went out with the dog early morning. I prefer not seeing too many people - just the early commuters on the way to work. I forgot how beautiful the early mornings are - when the sun is just coming up. I will keep on doing this initial route until I feel more confident. Again the anticipatory anxiety was awful but it has to be done - the alternative is...well...as every agoraphobic knows.

I need to read a bit of my cbt everyday to help with confidence - doing things half heartily is not the answer for me. I come on this site every morning now and it is a good thing to study the cbt at this time so I get it drummed in every day.

Hope everyone is doing well...or even just doing...:)

---------- Post added at 07:35 ---------- Previous post was at 07:32 ----------

Lyn - what a great contribution in helping others...hopefully when I'm managing this I will be able to do something similar too. Have you applied for the 12 week course (I am still humming and haahing about it)?

little wren
15-03-13, 10:14
I woke late today and did not take pup out (I do not want to bump into the people going to work - i don't really bother getting dressed well and I don't want people to see me). Eventually I will take him out even when people are about but for my first step i would prefer it to not be that rush time when people are going to work/school etc.

Intellectually I understand about adrenaline affects on the body, but it is taking time for me to really understand that there is no choice but to accept them.

Robins dvd workbook 1 - such a difference seeing and hearing someone speak the words - brings the literature to life - makes it more real.

little wren
16-03-13, 08:32
Will I ever be able to sit back from the anxiety and observe it like a scientist - gathering my information? No pass or fail just information gathering?

Watching dvd workbook 2. Some of the information on the other thread is so helpful to me I need to collate it here so I don't lose the information.

---------- Post added at 07:25 ---------- Previous post was at 07:22 ----------


Originally Posted by little wren
Hi guys

How do you guys deal with anticipatory anxiety?

I worry that because it went so well yesterday i won't be able to do it today - I've set the bar too high on my first attempt if that makes sense. I write my worries down - but then what - do I just do it regardless of how I am feeling at the time. The thing is I know I am a 'scientist' and if I go and come back ok then I have disproved the worries, but if I am overly anxious does that mean they have been supported?


Is anyone worried they may become conditioned into panicking at certain things?

little wrenxxxxxxxxxxxx


I think one of the hardest thing with recovery from agoraphobia is this constant "testing" ourselves rather than "practicing". Every Saturday morning my OH and I go to our local Tesco Extra and it really is huge. I know I should be using it to practice but in the back of my mind I also see that I am testing myself. Some days I can get right to the far corner of the store with no anxiety and now that's the bar I have set, even if I try hard to not to. So on a day when I can only get 3/4 of the way round the store I am really hard on myself afterwards.

Lyn
__________________


pearl
I test myself constantly, if I panic in a shop, I will beat myself up, hate myself even, go home and cry but then a few hours later I will tackle a smaller shop to test how I react. I feel like life is one big long test right now. Because I see it as testing I of course feel anxious before leaving the house, on the way in my car and then when I go into the shop my heart is racing so of course the anxiety symptoms kick in.

#202
15-03-13, 11:16

robinhall
Junior Member

Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 173

Re: 2013 Agoraphobia Thread
This is the reason CBT uses the term 'behavioural experiments'

when we 'test' ourselves we think in terms of success or failure - all or nothing - good or bad and so on

but when we 'experiment' we are just gathering information that we hope will help us move forward and most people accept that 'experimentation' will involve some negative results

as Thomas Edison said "Results? Why, man, I have gotten lots of results! If I find 10,000 ways something won't work, I haven't failed. I am not discouraged, because every wrong attempt discarded is often a step forward...."

Treat beating yourself up in the same way you are trying to deal with the panic

As soon as you realise you are doing it - remember it isn't helpful
Then accept that you are doing it - that's ok - it's not your fault
dont beat yourself up for beating yourself up ;-)
observe the thought process - let it happen but step back from it slightly
remember this is a common thing that people with anxiety do
write the thoughts down and then restructure them based on what you are learning about anxiety
Then read over the workbooks and particularly book 3 which explains how to conduct graduated exposure that won't involve 'testing' yourself.
__________________
Robin Hall is a Cognitive Therapist and co author of the professional CBT4PANIC programme recommended here on nomorepanic. Read this thread for more information.. http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?t=91696

---------- Post added at 07:32 ---------- Previous post was at 07:25 ----------

Re: 2013 Agoraphobia Thread
Hi little wren. My postings come from my own personal experience more than a CBT approach. I was housebound for 20 years and started to go out 6 years ago when we got our new puppy. I took part in a CBT group course with No Panic last summer and have just started Robins CBT4panic.
Many of my comments may not necessarily fit in with the CBT therapy but I am just relating how I manage my fear of the anxiety and panic. I am by no means 'cured.' In fact, most of you do much more than I do. I still have the same fears but I am gradually learning that I can do the things that I thought I couldn't and that I can trust myself to manage and cope with the anxiety.

Accept that the anticipated anxiety is part of the condition. We have programmed ourselves for this to be a part of the routine for preparing to go out. It is just another part of the cycle that needs to broken down. As you keep practising accepting the anxiety and giving it less and less importance the anticipated anxiety will naturally lessen. You will no longer fear going out so there will be nothing to worry about. Be patient, the worst thing you can do is constantly check if todays anxiety is better or worse than yesterdays. This way you keep focusing on how you are feeling which in itself will make you anxious. Each day is different for everyone regardless of whether they have anxiety issues or not. Some days are brilliant others difficult. If you have a day when nothing seems to go well for you do not become despondent, it doesn't mean that you are losing all the progress you have gained. It is just a bad day, everyone has them. In much the same way that we over react to the anxiety and blow it out of proportion we also do the same when we have a rotten day and convince ourselves that we can't go to a particular place again.

Don't worry if you can't do what you did yesterday. Worrying about it is putting pressure on yourself and makes sure that you are guaranteed to become anxious to the point where you cannot even face going anywhere near. Relax into it. Take pleasure in what yesterday brought you and think 'I really would like to do that again. I don't know if I can do all of it but I can go back and do as much as I can manage for today. I can manage a small amount of anxiety but I won't push myself to the point of a full panic attack as I know from past experience that this would cause me to lose confidence in ever going back again. I know that I can choose to quietly walk away when I feel I have had enough. If I don't go as far as before that is OK, just going again and doing a little bit still makes me a winner because I am practising and learning to work through the anxiety.' Smile while you are thinking it. Smile when you think about going out. Start to turn the fear into thoughts of having an adventure. You are going out anyway so you can be out, anxious and miserable or out, anxious and happy because you are working toward better things.

Stop expecting to be able to do it all every day. You will become too tired to think straight and that is when the anxiety will kick in hard and make life difficult for you. Make sure you give yourself permission to take a break from worrying about going out. Staying home for a day or two will not mean that you won't be able to go out again. Every now and again I get really tired and decide to give myself a weeks holiday. It isn't long before I get bored and end up going out more than I would normally have. It is like I have given myself the OK not to get uptight about not going out. I am more relaxed so am not putting the pressure on myself. As we struggle with anxiety going out is such hard work and tiring it sometimes becomes a bit of a chore that we need to take a rest from. It is OK not to go out every day.
Going out, no matter for how long or how far, makes it a good day.

sorry it's a bit jumbled, I type as if I was speaking to you.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Re: 2013 Agoraphobia Thread
Little wren - I'm not sure that I am "dealing" with anticipatory anxiety as such in that all I really do is acknowledge it for what it is, catch myself when I am dwelling on things and winding myself up, and try to rationalise what I am feeling and remind myself what effect it will have on me. I am awful for painting extremely vivid pictures in my mind's eye of exactly how bad things may turn out! I am very imaginative!

I ordered the CBT4panic in january but bear in mind I have had 20 years plus of self help books, NHS run CBT attempts, private CBT and reading all I could to help myself.

Not sure why the CBT didn't work for me up until this point but something clicked with me about this particular course. I thought I knew everything there was to know about the mechanism of fight or flight. And in a way I did! I don't think CBT4panic has told me much information I didn't already know (well perhaps a few things) but it was the WAY in which it was presented and explained that struck a chord this time. I don't think I had fully understood the mechanisms involved before - plus I was refusing to accept the fact that I was actually scared of the symptoms. I kept saying - i KNOW it is just panic I am fearing, I dont really feel I am going to die. But having examined a proper panic I realised that in the actual moment of a panic I really did feel I was about to die/go mad. This gave me something to begin working on.

I also didn't want to believe that the best way forward was by having more panics! I had spent 20 years doing everything I possibly could to STOP myself having them.... why should I let go and experience them?? they were so damn horrible - all I would prove to myself by having them was that yes, they were still horrible.

But I was missing the point.

I need to get through and be spat out the other side of the panic still in the situation I would normally leave. That was the only way for my brain to really learn. pinktel



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally Posted by Pearl35

I just hope I can get strength and be able to go into shops and not panic. I am reading the work books with the CBT 4 panic course and they say to let the panic happen, and not panic at the symptoms just accept them. I know they can't hurt me, I said yesterday to myself it was just adrenaline but the violent shaking wouldn't stop, nor would my heart calm down, so how can I ever relax when that happens, if it happens again that is my concern that this course won't help me because that violent shaking does terrify me even though I know it is just a panic symptom, it feel so awful and I fear I may collapse, it is so horrible feeling like that.[/I][/COLOR]
Hi
You are doing well even considering going towards the fear - we all know how scary that is.

Can I try to clarify that 'acceptance' and 'letting the panic happen' are part of what you PRACTICE doing when panic strikes - because resisting and fighting the symptoms leads to an increase in adrenaline and more symptoms.

But remember this takes time and you may not see any changes right away.

Understandably most people think this practice should make the panic stop - but in the early stages the fear of the sensations is still very strong and usually overrides anythinh we think or do.

Like any discipline - it takes time to see results. If you had a fear of swimming or water you may still for a long time feel very frightened every time you got into the water - but if you kept practicing every day you can imagine that over time your fear would become less.

and this is why very gradual exposure is best. If you just jumped in at the deep end every time your fear may stay the same but if you built it up gradually - paddling, going up to your waist, sitting down, using arm bands and so on you would grow more and more confident that you weren't actually going to drown and that swimming was a real possibility.

So - try to see practice as 'inching' forwards. Remind yourself that the practice isn't about stopping the panic (which is a subtle form of resistance anyway and can make you more anxious) it's about ATTEMPTING to chip away at the absolute belief that something catastrophic is happening

and afterwards even if you FELT that you made no progress write up your panic diary. You said "the violent shaking wouldn't stop, nor would my heart calm down" but the reality is that the shaking DID stop and your heart DID calm down - even if you may have had to escape whatever situation you were in the symptoms DO die down - so that can give you more evidence that it doesn't last forever. Eventually you can discover this in the midst of trigger situations - but very gradually.

You can also go over your thoughts "I fear I may collapse" - "my concern that this course won't help me" - "how can I ever relax when that happens" and any more you can remember and restructure them as best you can to more helpful thoughts

ie I fear I may collapse but I didn't and I haven't..
I have only been studying the course for a few days so I can keep reading and see what happens
Even though I feel I can never relax when that happens the sensations do eventually die down and now that I have a new understanding and some new coping skills if I keep practicing then I may get better at coping with the feelings
etc

Keep reading over the books
Remember that you are 'practicing' new ways to respond to fight of flight symptoms - this will take time - this practice isn't about stopping the panic - it's about gradually CHANGING how you react with thoughts and behaviour so that you can break into the cycle of fear.
It's not about FORCING yourself to 'accept' or 'let it happen' - that can make you anxious - like when we 'try' to go to sleep we feel more awake.
it's about gently trying the new skills and even accepting that it's really NOT easy to accept :-)
Give yourself a pat on the back - you have been through a lot - you are extremely brave in having to face this every day
Take your time

and can I say that this thread has been filled with some really great advice from everyone.

Robin
__________________
Robin Hall is a Cognitive Therapist and co author of the professional CBT4PANIC programme recommended here on nomorepanic. Read this thread for more information.. http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?t=91696

little wren
16-03-13, 18:56
Took pup out - I enjoyed it! Forget whether I will enjoy it next time - I enjoyed it this time.

Pinktel
17-03-13, 09:14
Nice one :D bet pup enjoyed it very much too! It's a real confidence boost when it goes well, very empowering when we find ourselves just enjoying something without the constant mind chatter rushing around in our heads! When I find myself in those lovely moments I think how wonderful for others who haven't anxiety disorder, they spend most do their time just focused on what they are doing.... How lovely and simple :D

little wren
17-03-13, 10:10
17/03/13
Took pup out along usual route. Felt apprehensive before going - I think I have low blood pressure and felt weak legs. Just went anyway - as flossie says as far as you can. Managed the whole route. The anxiety went down - had no expectations of completing the route or not or how I'd feel. Keep doing it - no expectations either way. I want to just not care either way.


Pinktel - thanks - I know there is an expression of 'being in the zone' when focus is on the activity and nothing else - we forget because anxiety takes our attention.

Bonnibelle
17-03-13, 11:43
Well done, these walks will build up your confidence, and keep you getting out there, not hiding away completely.

What breed is your pup? I've 2 dogs, a border terrier girl and Shihtzu, also a girl. X

17/03/13
Took pup out along usual route. Felt apprehensive before going - I think I have low blood pressure and felt weak legs. Just went anyway - as flossie says as far as you can. Managed the whole route. The anxiety went down - had no expectations of completing the route or not or how I'd feel. Keep doing it - no expectations either way. I want to just not care either way.


Pinktel - thanks - I know there is an expression of 'being in the zone' when focus is on the activity and nothing else - we forget because anxiety takes our attention.

Lilharry
17-03-13, 11:49
I think it's really important to focus on the positives and not beat yourself up if it doesn't work out. Sounds like you are doing really well!

Alabasterlyn
17-03-13, 12:55
Well done, these walks will build up your confidence, and keep you getting out there, not hiding away completely.

What breed is your pup? I've 2 dogs, a border terrier girl and Shihtzu, also a girl. X

I've got a shih tzu too, they are lovely little things aren't they. Also have a chocolate labrador.

flossie
17-03-13, 15:42
Took pup out - I enjoyed it! Forget whether I will enjoy it next time - I enjoyed it this time.

:yesyes: Well done little wren. I am proud of you.
That is how I approached it. The time and distance wasn't important. Just going out was the important thing. No pressure to go anywhere in particular, being out and above all, appreciating it was what mattered in the beginning. I considered it building a foundation from which I could learn about myself and grow stronger. Becoming familiar and comfortable within an area closer to home at first will help you deal with the fight or flight feelings. You will know that you can be home in a very short time if you choose. This gives you the confidence to stick with it and to learn that these feelings are harmless and that you can cope. Moving further from home will come automatically as you realise that you will be fine.


Would you believe that I have a Border Terrier and that before him I had 2 Shih-Tzus.:)

little wren
18-03-13, 09:26
Aww thanks guys :)

My boy is a big goofy lab. - Lyn there is a big size difference in your dogs do you walk them separately? Our boy should have been a cute, catlike, clean and elegant papillon lol:noangel: but now he's here I cannot imagine a day without him :)

Andreas71
18-03-13, 09:42
Jamesflames I really recognise your experience... I changed from thinking about trips outside my safety zone as being graduated exposure to being "little experiments", a chance to observe and learn. It made a big difference and made the task a lot less terrifying!

little wren
20-03-13, 13:51
Andreas that is what a group of us are practicing on 'agoraphobia 2013' thread - the help there is really good and supportive too - come have a look :) as for those little experiments well here are mine....

20/03/13
Went further with pup - down to next lamppost on the main street. Had to clear up poop (not nice when you have ocd but did it). Still apprehensive before I go out. I keep thinking if fight/flight comes then float with it - let it happen. Ironically fight/flight did not come and I just forgot about it. Downloaded audio to ipod - really get to understand this at the deepest level. Keep doing the same boring route every morning so I am out walking at least once a day. Put everything I think about anxiety away for two weeks and follow religiously the cbt4panic programme - just read, just do it. :woof

little wren
02-04-13, 10:09
Question: For those following CBT after reading workbooks 1 and 2 (Robins) and a bit of Claire Weekes I have a question - am I right in thinking that it is impossible to feel both anxiety and anger at the same time?

Arousal of the nervous system is due to emotions based in fear, adrenaline is pumped resulting in physical fight/flight readiness (or freeze). Are they mutually exclusive - in evolutionary terms does the body have to 'nail its colours to the mast' so to speak - make a choice anger to fight or anxiety to flee (a half hearted attempt is not evolutionary useful is it)? Any ideas?

Tufty
02-04-13, 10:26
I think you're right Little Wren - it's one or the other. I've used anger many times to fight the feelings of anxiety but this in turn creates more anxiety and as anger does not come naturally to me I find it difficult to sustain. Anger does work in the short term though. The only long term solution is acceptance but it is harder to accept than to fight or flee, I'm still working on it :).

Alabasterlyn
02-04-13, 11:49
Aww thanks guys :)

My boy is a big goofy lab. - Lyn there is a big size difference in your dogs do you walk them separately? Our boy should have been a cute, catlike, clean and elegant papillon lol:noangel: but now he's here I cannot imagine a day without him :)

We actually walk them together as Mishka our labrador is nearly 14yrs old so she is quite slow whereas Daisy our shih tzu is not a year old till this weekend, so she is still all bouncy, skippy, jumpy and full of energy. Mind you we had Daisy speyed last week so we've had to slow down a bit :ohmy:

When I am depressed I find Daisy to be very therapeutic as it's a nice distraction grooming her and as long as I have my OH to go out with it's also nice to get out walking them in the fresh air too.

bernie1977
02-04-13, 12:29
I'm back again with the same problem. My support worker is due to visit at one and I've got myself into a bad state. I've felt anxious all morning and now I've reached the crescendo. I'm hyperventilating, I feel sick, my stomach is doing cartwheels and my hearts jumping.

The problem is I get like this when it comes to having any social contact. I've shut myself away for that long and cut everyone off, except my partner with whom I live. I shut myself away and developed agoraphobia due to panic disorder and I think through doing that I've got social anxiety. One big mess.

I've left a message for the support worker to ring me, he's due in 30 minutes. I know I need his help but I just can't face seeing him face to face.

All sense of reasoning and rationality has left my mind please help

Tufty
02-04-13, 13:23
Oh it's abit late but the fact that you're not online at the moment I take as a good one. I hope you've managed to meet up with your support worker. You have good insight into your problems Bernie and are doing something about overcoming them so well done. You will recover from this, we all will.
Love Sam

bernie1977
02-04-13, 15:31
Thanks Tufty.

I did it!! I let him in and we ended up chatting for 90 minutes. I feel fantastic for doing it. He says I've done things wrong in my recovery before and moved on too quickly, so I'm starting at the beginning again. For the next 10 days I'm to open my front door and walk to the top of my road. He will visit again and see how I've got on and we won't move on again until all discomfort has gone.

little wren
03-04-13, 10:55
Tufty - thanks for the reply. I am not an angry person either - too passive sometimes. Yeh, you're right the fight/flight response cannot be sustained over a long time. I was just wondering though as CBT mentions the evolutionary benefits of adrenaline. Anger has a place - perhaps by not recognizing when you should be feeling angry it gives rise to anxiety. Who knows...Acceptance is the key definitely.


Lyn - I hope I get to feel happy walking my dog soon - I wish the clocks had gone backwards and not forwards - so I had more time in the early mornings before people are around (it starts getting very busy where I live around 8 am). If no-one is around I don't have to worry about make-up and ironed clothes - I can just go.

Bernie - glad you got it all sorted. I think you meant to post on Agoraphobia 2013 which is the main one where most people read. I'm glad you got a reply on this one though. I think you are doing really well - remember how scared you were when you had your first meeting...and now to chat for an hour and a half with him....that is so good :) I am struggling at the moment walking the dog around my cul-de-sac - the snow put me back and then the clocks changing. For 10 days whilst you walk up your road - I will be starting back on walking the dog - I will be thinking of you, let me know how you are getting on....it helps so much hearing of other peoples cbt journeys x

Alabasterlyn
06-04-13, 11:14
I am feeling quite down today after my assessment yesterday for CBT.

I was told when I spoke with the triage person who phoned me a couple of weeks ago that as long as I went to the surgery for an assessment that the CBT therapist would come to my home due to my agoraphobia.

The appt for yesterday had been on my mind ever since I got the letter and I was a mess all morning. The traffic getting to the surgery was nose to tail all the way there and back and in total it took 2hrs. The heat in the surgery was overwhelming and I could feel myself getting very anxious.

At the end of an hour of pouring my heart out the therapist said she would be happy to give me 6/8 sessions but I would have to go to the surgery for them. I have to say I was gutted as there is no way I can get there without my OH taking me and he was only able to take me yesterday because he took a day off work, something he can't keep on doing.

What made things even worse is that the therapist then said that if I had been "totally housebound" then perhaps they would have relaxed the rules a bit, but as I had made the effort and got to the surgery then I was "recovered enough" to keep on going there.

I have complained to the local Mental Health Team but it was like water off a ducks back :weep:

little wren
06-04-13, 11:37
Lyn - really sorry to hear that - how on earth can they justify not allowing you home visits (when they will 'bend' the rules for some people)? I hope you manage some compromise with them - maybe they would do a few sessions over the phone to start with? Why is it so damn hard to get any proper help from the NHS?????

Alabasterlyn
06-04-13, 12:30
Lyn - really sorry to hear that - how on earth can they justify not allowing you home visits (when they will 'bend' the rules for some people)? I hope you manage some compromise with them - maybe they would do a few sessions over the phone to start with? Why is it so damn hard to get any proper help from the NHS?????

I get the feeling it's all about NHS cutbacks and I think mental health has always been at the bottom of their list when it comes to priorities and anxiety disorders most likely come way below other disorders like schizophrenia where they feel someone may be a danger to the public.

It does make me very angry when I read in the papers about people coming to the UK from overseas purely to get free NHS treatment that costs thousands of pounds which they aren't even entitled to and those of us who have been born and brought up here and contributed to the system with our taxes are penalised.

little wren
08-04-13, 09:43
May follow flossie and register with no panic for their phone CBT alongside Robins programme as I find it hard to go out after Ive been stuck in for awhile...it was the excuse of snow that did it...then the clocks going forward so I kept missing my early walk with pup... but I will take him out with OH later - have to force myself to go - get back into the routine of going. I know for it to work for me I have to practice DAILY whether I feel brave enough or not.

little wren
13-04-13, 09:59
13.04.13
Ok have been really thinking about the CBT approach. Each day try and adopt it into a lifestyle change - a real change in the way I am thinking. Frustrating as the going out is difficult - the apprehension. Practice, Practice, Practice. Been also reading Claire Weekes as a lot of people have recommended. Been practicing CBT for OCD too and it is working - the float past, the let it be, the step back and observe instead of becoming enmeshed within it.