Feeling hopeless :(

[Catherine84]

Hi everyone,

I posted on this forum a few days ago regarding panic attacks focused around my breathing. I think the anxiety had been building for months, and had just reached a peak, where I felt like I was going to have a breakdown. I thought I would ask for advice here again as everyone seemed so supportive last time and really helped me get through some very bad days.

As some of you know, I saw the doctor about a week ago, who put me on diazepam 5mg three times a day to control the anxiety attacks I was having. I had been staying with my parents for a few days while my partner worked, as I couldn't face the thought of being on my own all day while I was having such negative thoughts. Therefore, the prescription I was given was from a temporary doctor, and not my permanent one. I was advised that they could only give me enough tablets for a few days, and if I wanted to get another prescription, I would have to make the 2 hour round trip to my normal doctor, who would be able to issue me a longer term prescription. So I saw my usual doctor again on Friday, and explained the situation to him. He very reluctantly agreed to give me 7 more tablets (I am aware of the addictive nature and do really want to get off them - I just feel like I am struggling so much at the moment, and I have always been very stubborn about taking medication in the past unless I really need it), and said that I should skip the odd day to gradually come off them. This seemed strange to me, coming completely off them for a whole day, as I was told by the temporary doctor to very gradually reduce my dosage (a little less each day instead) to avoid withdrawal effects, and I worry on the day I skip it I will not be able to cope (it is all the conflicting advice I am getting that is confusing me :( ). I feel bad for saying this, but I felt he made me feel like I was wasting his time, said 'what do you want me to do', and explained the CBT waiting list is very long and gave me a helpline to phone (I have already phoned such helplines for advice when I was at the stage before I accepted I needed to go on medication, but there were still days where I was crying my eyes out and unable to cope). I also asked him if there is any other anti-anxiety medication of a less addictive nature, that does not stay in your system for weeks, and could be taken on an 'when needed' basis (with the intention that I would not take it unless absolutely necessary, but would give me a safety blanket if I needed it, and maybe allow me to think about getting back to a slightly more functional life and returning to work, without the fear of having a panic attack in front of everyone), but he said diazepam was the only option, and I could go on an antidepressant such as sertraline instead. Whilst I am happy to go on anti-anxiety medication until I am able to tackle the problems by myself (I am trying to look at some very good advice some people gave on the other thread on coping techniques, which I am going to persevere with as much as I can:)), I feel like if I didn't have the anxiety, I wouldn't be as depressed! I am reluctant to mess with my brain chemistry after some bad reactions to antidepressants in the past, and I read a thread about antidepressants making some people's panic attacks worse, which has also added to my reluctance to take them :(

I saw a therapist privately last week out of desperation, but it is very expensive, and I would rather not go down that route long-term.

Sorry to waffle, but I was wondering if anyone had any advice or experiences with diazepam use to control anxiety and reducing its dosage gradually? Since I have only been taking it for a week, are the withdrawals likely to be bad? Things seem to be made worse by the fact that I already seem to be developing a tolerance to its effects, even after the short time I have been on it. Also, does anyone use any other medication to control their anxiety? I may try and see a different doctor (I vary rarely manage to see the same doctor at my normal surgery anyway, as getting an appointment can be very difficult), and discuss my options with them while I wait for the CBT appointment.

It is difficult when you are desperate to beat something, and sometimes you just have to accept it is there (it has been reassuring to know I am not alone, although I wish none of us had to go through anxiety at all!). But I am beginning to be worried sick about getting back to work and losing my job if I do not go back soon, as this is not the first time I have been signed off (it has only been a week and a half this time, and my boss has been understanding in the past, but I worry that they will lose their patience with me. I also feel guilty for being off, as our team has been downsizing and I hate to think of other people having to pick up my fairly heavy workload when they all are ridiculously stretched themselves).

Any advice anyone is able to give would be really appreciated, and thank you again for your support in the past. :hugs:

Apologies again for the long post and thank you for reading :),
Catherine xx

[maddierose98]

I have posted on your last thread aswell. I am going through the same thing, and I also never take medication unless I positively need it. So now this is my third day on Lovan (fluoxetine) because I've reached a point where I can't cope by myself. Before my Lovan prescription a doctor gave me 3 Ativan (diazepam) which I refused to take. I recommend coming off the diazepam because its strictly short term and switching to a long term antidepressant. I am also undergoing CBT but for a different reason. Hang in there :)

[Catherine84]

Hello maddierose,

Thank you for your reply. Have just seen your other post as well (mine came out of the blue also, after several years of respite in my case). I am really sorry you are going through the same thing and hope that the medication works for you and you begin to feel better soon. I can completely relate to the not wanting to take medication unless I really have to, and I am really wishing I hadn't started on the diazepam now. I got desperate as I was being sick and not eating because the anxiety was so bad, and finally caved in after a lot of persuasion from various people. If you have the time, I strongly recommend the links that Lotus (who replied on the other thread) posted on 'Sensorimotor OCD' - in the short time I had with the therapist visit, he mentioned a lot of the same coping strategies. I am still struggling with the thought of coping without medication, but the links gave some very good advice :)

I hope you also manage to overcome this - it is by far the worst anxiety symptom I have experienced and I completely understand what you are going through. I am here for support if you need it! :hugs:

Best wishes,
Catherine x

[BobbyDog]

I have also posted on your other threads. I would seriously consider taking antidepressant medication to help you through this bad patch. Discuss your options with your GP again. Hopefully AD's will help you relax and not focus on your breathing so much. I tried diazepam for a couple of days and it did nothing to alleviate my symptoms, it made my anxiety worse.
Nopanic. org offer group telephone counselling and also one to one, I am in group recovery at the moment and finding it really helpful. On the waiting list for one to one. They are fab!

[Catherine84]

Hi BobbyDog and thank you :)

The telephone counselling is a really good idea. I will definitely look into that :)

Is the antidepressant medication a very long term thing, or can you come off it without too many nasty effects? I have tried Paroxetine and it made me really ill (this was a few years back), but have not tried anything else. Maybe it is time to accept that I need something else to cope besides what I am taking.

Thank you again for your advice and hope you are ok at the moment. Take care :)

Catherine x

[dally]

Hi Catherine
I hope you managed to get some sleep. I have had pa for over 20years. Mine started with the breathing problems. I was convinced I had asthma, chest infections etc, when all the medical tests came back clear, I finally had to admit it was 'Just' panic. It is so scary when we feel we cannot breathe. I do know what you are going through.! the doc gave me antidepressants, which I had horrendous side effects too,(almost worse than the breathing problem) . Then gave me Valium. I was scared to take them, so really suffered for years!!! Then would quarter a 2mg Valium!!!!!. At one point a pshychiatrist laughed and told me I would be as well just drinking a glass of water, for all the good that would do me. So when I was VERY desperate, I gradually experimented increasing the dosage, depending on the severity of the pa and have worked out that I need about 4mg to calm me down.
You a absolutely right Valium is a very addictive drug, and that is my main worry, because apart from that there is no side effects. It's calming effects last for 4-5hrs, but the chemicals stay in your body for up 4 days per dose!
However, usually dependence does not occur for 3-4 weeks of continued daily use. And even then, with proper support from your gp, you should have a GRADUAL withdrawal. If you have only been taking them for a week, IMO you should not be addicted, or need withdrawal programme.
recently the dic gave me propanalol, which does help, it takes the edge of your anxiety. And reduces your physical symptoms. However, it is not used if you have asthma. And for me, was not the drug of choice cos it does not help with thoughts etc, only physical symptoms.
I also take Bach remedies, which for me don't work, but I take them when I'm desperate anyway!!! I have heard good reports of Kalms.. And also something I never did, but have promised myself to do. Practise breathing excercised EVERY DAY. It is the daily practice that makes it become automatic control over your breathing.. Keep in mind, no one has every died with a panic attack, you will be fine. I know. Good luck and let me know how you get on. Xxx

[BobbyDog]

Hi BobbyDog and thank you :)

The telephone counselling is a really good idea. I will definitely look into that :)

Is the antidepressant medication a very long term thing, or can you come off it without too many nasty effects? I have tried Paroxetine and it made me really ill (this was a few years back), but have not tried anything else. Maybe it is time to accept that I need something else to cope besides what I am taking.

Thank you again for your advice and hope you are ok at the moment. Take care :)

Catherine x

Hey Catherine,

There are a lot of medications out there to treat anxiety and you are not alone in rejecting SSRI's. I tried Citalopram for a second time and could not tolerate the start up side effects. I was given Mirtazapine instead which really helped me at the time, the only side effect was drowsiness during the day and that wears off. It is great for sleep problems/insomnia. I made a 90% recover whilst taking Mirtazapine. Unfortunately I had a relapse. Now I also take Pregabalin and things are starting to look up again. But medication is a personal thing, your doctor may be able to lead you in the right direction if you are considering taking Antidepressants. I was going to say have a look at medication info on NMP, but negative experiences can be really off putting.

sarah.x

[JulieJay92]

Kalms and rescue remedy were my rock in the early days, both herbal, still rely on kalms but no longer use rescue remedy but both very effective and i didnt suffer any side effects at all

[lotus]

Dear Catherine

Please don't freak out. I know you're going through a very tough time, I've been there. You will survive this, this won't hurt you physically or mentally. It's just really uncomfortable. You won't die or go crazy, I promise. Don't be scared to take the Diazepam if it helps - you're taking a small dose. As long as you don't take it for more than a few weeks or months, you are in no danger of becoming addicted to it. You don't need to take it on a regular basis at certain times during the day, you can only take it when the anxiety is at its peak to take the edge off. It's just to calm you down, but it's not really "medication" per se /it won't restore your brain chemistry to normal, it will just tone down the anxiety/. Read carefully through the articles I gave you and try the coping strategies mentioned there. These articles are written by professionals, they know what they're talking about.

[Catherine84]

Hi everyone,

Really been struggling again the last few days. I thought I was on the mend, but now I realise it was only because I had been heavily medicated. I am becoming anxious with every breath again, trying to remember what my therapist told me about being at ease with your bodily sensations, but it is consuming me more than ever and I feel like I just took 1 step forward and 3 steps back. I am getting to the stage again where I am losing interest in everything and would rather depart this planet than put up with this for another 50 years. The therapist mentions the 'chinese finger trap' analogy, where if you try and pull away from your fears, they just get worse, and you have to lean in to them (to release your fingers from the trap), but when I am this wound up, I just cannot cope however much I tell myself these things.

My boss rang at the end of last week to see how I was (after Occupational Health had called) and I told them how much better I was feeling and probably wouldn't need the maximum 4 weeks the doctor's note had given me (yes, bad idea I know with hindsight), but I was feeling a lot more positive after a week of Diazepam (I came off it last Thurs). Then at the weekend, I was up and down like a yo-yo, and just seemed to have got a lot worse this last week. It probably sounds trivial in comparison to some other problems, but our cat who has been in the family 11 years is dying and I have watched her decline these last couple of weeks (it's upsetting as we got her as a kitten when I was still a teenager, and I hate the thought of the poor creature having to suffer, although the vet says she is not in pain, just lethargic due to anaemia and kidney failure). I also think if I can't cope with this, how on earth will I cope if (heaven forbid) anything happened to one of my parents or my partner, or one of my close friends?

To be honest, I have had a lot of other problems as well which may have contributed to my stress reaching breaking point and causing the breathing obsession. On their own, they are all manageable (to different degrees), but together they are the recipe for a breakdown. There is some alcoholism in the family, my parents (in particular my mother) don't really approve of my partner (or my best friend for that matter), my mum asks my dad repeatedly 'what will happen if you predecease me and I cannot cope with the bills/internet/gas etc', and how he doesn't do enough for himself, and I have had a few rough patches with my relationship (when my partner dropped out of teacher training college and there was no money coming in from his side, so he ended up losing all his savings and was saying how he may have to move 400 miles back home, or I would have to support him as well as paying my own side of the rent), which caused a few arguments, even though I was supportive of his decision to call it a day with the teaching. I have had enough thoughts about whether my own career is right for me after all (after 5 years of making up and testing disinfectant samples, I have found it has become rather monotonous and soul-destroying), and also like I have been launched into the deep end as they are not replacing the people who leave and I am the main person in charge of coming up for the formula for the latest project. I didn't do that badly in my degree, but I feel like it was only after a lot of hard work, and I found it a struggle, so I frequently feel out of my depth. I just don't know what else I would enjoy or what my talents are (if indeed I have any).

I have a box of Citalopram sitting on the worktop (10mg) which I would like to give a go as I am desperate, and I know it is probably the right thing to follow the doctor's advice, but I am coming up to that time of the month (it could well be the PMT contributing as well I suppose), and I know it makes you really on edge for a while as your body adjusts to it, so I have decided to wait until next week. The thought of having even more panic attacks and suicidal thoughts is not something I want to entertain at the moment.

I have tried Kalms, Rescue Remedy, everything. . .nothing seems to work. I do believe coming off the Diazepam may have contributed to this - I would love to be able to take it as and when I need it, but it is so hard to get a prescription and it is only for a few days usually (I was cross when I had to pay £7.50 for just 7 tablets, when the last doctor gave me a normal box!). I just feel like I am trapped in a prison by being alive and wish I could escape.

Sorry for the depressing message, I am just beyond myself with anxiety and have been crying a lot the past few days.
Catherine x

[Ineedlookingafter]

Hi Catherine,

I totally understand where you are right now. I feel like giving up too everyday but we just need to keep going and try and remain focussed on getting better.

You are not alone and lots of people have come through tough times- you can too and so can I.

Hold on to your partner and your parents and friends, let them support you and you can get through this.

Take care. x

[Pinktel]

Hi Catherine
I also posted on your breathing thread, sorry to hear you are having such a rubbish time at the moment.
Diazepam is never going to be the solution , you can suppress your central nervous system for a time but as soon as the effects wear off you will be right where you started.
Have you tried the CBT?
Meds alone are not the best answer for you they HAVE to work in conjunction with the CBT if you want any longstanding relief, your therapist is giving you good advice, fighting these feelings will make you more agitated.
Peruse these boards, read people's stories, CBT is working for so many. Yes, it is harder than taking a tablet, but you are dealing with the essence of the issue. I have serious doubts that so many millions of us actually have seratonin deficiencies and yet we so readily agree to tinker with the neurotransmitters in our brain without considering the effects of altering our brain chemicals.
Short term I see no problem with meds helping an anxious person (a person with moderate to severe depression is another matter) through a bad patch, but you should really crack on with the therapy as a long term solution.
When do you next see your therapist?

[Catherine84]

Thank you for your kind words and apologies for double posting in the same thread.

I am seeing my therapist next on Tuesday, so I will explain things to him then. As a matter of fact, I have just found out today that the CBT referral has finally gone through and I am going to phone them back tomorrow for a telephone assessment.

Thank you both again for your support and I hope you are OK as well ineedlookingafter :) - it is too easy to feel like giving up, but I know deep down we have to carry on (it can just feel such an uphill struggle at times). I hope that you too manage to beat this :hugs:

Catherine xx

[lotus]

Dear Catherine

It might not be a good time to start with the exposure exercises, as you are not feeling very stable at the moment, but at least try some CBT exercises. Get a basic CBT book, such as CBT for Dummies, and read the parts about anxiety. Actually, read any part that feels right at the moment. I know it's hard, but you have to hold on till you see that the techniques work. When you see that they do work for the first time, it will give you tremendous relief and piece of mind.

This is the pdf version of the book, you can take a look while you wait for the therapist appointment:
http://www.monkeymax.com/phocadownload/health/Cognitive%20Behavioural%20Therapy%20for%20Dummies. pdf

[coldwater]

I feel the same. It makes everything worse.

When you are well it means nothing. When you are not it means everything.

My drs will not prescribe me any benzo so i drink instead. I am tired of drs. They do not understand about quality of life. I feel like my ego has died. I feel like trying to get better is making me worse because i cant get better. It is not even hell anymore. I would love to not wake up tomorrow. so pathetic feeling sorry for myself and depressed all the time. Everything i love in life makes me panic. i just cant put into words what this is. I feel like everything is a joke. Drs just want your money/finish the day. I cant even think it makes me panic lol. I don't believe anything anyone says anymore. They said it gets better. It gets worse everyday.

[BobbyDog]

A great book that my Psychologist used when I was having CBT with her may be of help to you, it is: The Anxiety and Phobia Workbook by Edmund J Bourne PHD.

I have gone back to it many times when my anxiety levels have been really high and needed to refresh the knowledge I had previously learned(and forgotten) in CBT.

[Catherine84]

Hi coldwater,

I have sent you a PM. Hang in there, I know exactly how it feels to be how you describe and I too have had a drink the last few days. We should not let this horrific illness get the better of us :hugs:

Take care of yourself,
Catherine

---------- Post added at 18:17 ---------- Previous post was at 18:15 ----------

Thank you also everyone for the links. I will look at them now I have calmed down a little. Your support really means a lot to me, so thank you x

[missfishlash]

I feel for you coldwater
Doctors have never helped me get better, Ive had many bouts of depression and anxiety, havent even bothered to go doctors cos Ive never found one who really cares...just throw drugs at you to go away anyhow
Ive paid for hypnotherapy this time and feel miles better, cost me a bit but I have no faith in docs anymore so it was worth it and worked for me, who knows for how long
I drink everyday :(

[coldwater]

Yeah it's like well what's the point anymore in even trying. Depression over taking you. The fact when I think about sleeping and everyday being stuck in my head having panic attacks. Can't be bothered anymore even to drink to numb it all out.

[ruthless]

Hi Catherine

I have been reading your posts with interest, and I know exactly how you feel, and have been there many times myself

You will get through this I know, and you have lots of support on here.

I have started to read through some of the anxiety books on amazon, and am currently waiting for Claire Weekes- Self Help For Your Nerves. Some of the books are very helpful, and they distract me and help me sleep at night.

Hope your CBT telephone assessment went ok

[Catherine84]

Thank you for your kind words Ruthless :)

I had my telephone assessment and they are referring me for either a CBT class or one-to-one counselling on the telephone (though it may take a while to come through).

I am coming up to the 1 week mark with my antidepressants, and I am starting to suffer the side effects slightly less at least.

I hope you are ok, and I am glad the books are helping. I have just started reading 'How to do Everything and be Happy' by Peter Jones.