View Full Version : Thoughts on genetics/chemical imbalances?
I've mentioned this briefly in another of my posts but really wanted to hear what other sufferers thought about this as I keep getting conflicting information.
I've been reading up on articles etc and just wonder whether anxiety (anxiety inparticular for me but of course other mental health problems) can be genetic/in our DNA/caused by a chemical imbalances passed on through families?
I recently spoke to my therapist about this and she quickly dimissed it, infact seemed a little insulted I'd asked (but that could be me being sensitive!) She said anxiety is a learnt behaviour and does not run in families.
That's fine, however she then went on to refer to criminals saying that their anxiety part of the brain (amygdala) is 'switched off' which is why they commit crimes because they don't feel fear. If that's the case, surely the opposite would mean a highly switched on brain leading to abnormal anxiety levels???
I definitely think anxiety can be learnt in many people if not all of us that have anxiety (like when you experience a traumatic event, learnt through childhood, experiences and so on) but I don't think it's the only thing that causes it, I think there must be other contibuting factors. I say this because I have a strong family history of mental health problems which I've just traced back to my great grandad who had anxiety and OCD, my nan who has been in hospital all her life because of depression and been diagnosed as a manic depressive (which is probably bipolar nowadays?).
Then there is also two sets of twins on my mums side of the family (I don't know their relation to my mum and I've never met them) but they all have social anxiety and there's also another girl in the family I think maybe my mum's cousin's daughter who had emetophobia. Finally, my mum has anxiety (controlled by medication) and my dad, well, he has some problems too. Which leads to me! I believe I have social anxiety, which has resulted in panic, phobias and health anxiety (which I've practically recovered from)
Sorry for the boring long-winded dive into my family history there but I'm just trying to explain where my thinking is coming from. I'll definitely take all this to my doctor and see what she thinks, but I'm interested to know what anyone here reading this thinks?
OK have just asked my daughter who is a Neuroscientist.
She says a lot of pschyotherapists are not very open to the scientific side of things as it reduces their view of what can be achieved therapeutically. In Neuropsychology, she believes the strongest models are Bio-psycho-social models, which basically state that vulnerabilities can come from varying sources, including biological, psychological and sociological. If negative thinking patterns run in families, that CAN affect behaviours, but there is a lot of evidence that certain genotypes are more vulnerable to the problems you describe.
In Epigenetics, there is a lot of research into how our environment can affect how our genes (inheritance) are expressed - eg someone might not get depression if their life didn't trigger it, even though they are genetically predisposed... but someone else might find things more stressful simply because of their genetic make-up.
She tells me there is a 'short 'S' allele' of the serotonin transporter gene, which is particularly linked to mental health vulnerability. So of course things can run in families - but different families will respond differently too so that all has to be considered. She says it isn't overly helpful to tell someone to think themselves better if they have inherited a gene which makes that more difficult for them than for others.
So there you go! :shades:
I'm not sure but have read that it can run in families but they, the researchers/scientists, aren't sure if it's due to genes, nurture or environment.
Personally there is no one in my family that I know has had an emotional/mental health issue. I think mine is due to a combination of being a sensitive child (genetic), parents with poor understanding (nurture) and being brought up in a 'tough' emotional environment.
I think some of us are predisposed to anxiety due to our genetics and early years but I've given up trying to work out the whys and hows, it just is. I am anxious and suffer with panic attacks and depression as a result, it's something I need to live with but don't need to find out the cause or right any wrong doings, I am content to just let the past go.
Do you think proving a genetic link will help you come to terms with your anxiety Jayjoe?
What a good question...
I think it helps in as far as you can tell yourself it isn't you making bad choices (which can be implied sometimes). I think the Nature/Nurture sides are so mixed up as to be inextricable. There is obviously a huge vein of MH issues running through my family but the (non) Nurture could explain it.
I guess some people may well be 'set' to respond to life differently. For some, that could be helpful to know. For others, it could be a reason not to fight battles which actually, they could perhaps win..?
GirlAfraid23
30-06-13, 18:33
It definitely runs in families.
Most anxiety conditions run through the family line.
Specific issues that are seen to be inherited:
OCD
Panic Attacks
Schizophrenia
Autism
Depression
Bi-Polar.
These all share geneic roots and can be passed on through the family line.
eight days a week
30-06-13, 18:53
In my humble opinion it's definitely genetic in many cases.
Also learned behaviours from your parent(s).
Both are beatable I absolutely believe :)
shakey1961
30-06-13, 19:41
JayJoe - you are so on the right lines thinking that anxiety is genetic. Your therapist is talking cr*p.
Mine is such a long story, but I'll try to keep it short.
Started with panic and anxiety at 16yo, suffered it for 35 years, (I'm now 51). I always thought "something was doing this to me" and it wasn't all in my head.
Over the years I've panicked in almost every place, and I also found that I would become dizzy/drunk like, my head feeling funny, which I eventually found out was hypoglycaemia (low blood sugar).
Fast forward those 35 years and I was making a lovely sponge cake. I had 3 large slices over 2 days tasted great. Following day I was stuck in the bathroom with bad diahorrea. So I go and see my GP and I suggested it might be the eggs (sorry, I know it's a too much information time, but "IT" smelt eggy). GP said that was unlikely but to try cutting out the wheat.
I cut wheat out and after a few days I felt calmer, heart slower, breathing slower and less/no hypos. After much research into symptoms and links between one disease and other it became clear I have Coeliac Disease.
Sadly my parents are no longer with me, but it is plainly obvious that I inherited this from my father!
There is a direct link between hypos and coeliac. None of my family have any past history of diabetes, but 2 of my dads brothers were alcoholics and his other brother had epilepsy (which does have a link).
I hardly panic now, but I get the odd twinge now and again, I think it's because my nerves are conditioned to it, and I have to "un-learn" all my anxiety triggers as they don't matter now, but I can't remember the last time I was truly anxious - I'm so much better.
If you want to know more please send me a private message.
Regards
Sparkle1984
30-06-13, 20:03
There have been several heated debates on this forum in the past about whether anxiety is caused by a chemical imbalance or whether it's a learned behaviour. I personally think both theories have merit - for some people, anxiety is genetic (ie caused by a chemical imbalance) and for others it is a learned behaviour. Then for some other people, it may be a combination of the 2 factors. I think these 2 different theories explain why some people can recover from anxiety with CBT alone, while others need medication. I'm aware that anxiety and depression often can run in families, which gives weight to the genetic theory.
For me, I think my anxiety is partly caused by a chemical imbalance (serotonin deficiency), but I'm not anxious all the time - mine comes in episodes which can last for a few months, then I go back to normal again until the next episode starts. These episodes seem to be mostly triggered when I go through a stressful phase in my life, for example being made redundant from a job, or other major life changes, although occasionally they can come out of the blue with no clear explanation. So in my case, I think it's partly a chemical imbalance and partly due to environmental factors. I'm assuming that the chemical imbalance must always be there, but I usually only enter an anxious/depressive episode when there are other stresses in my life.
I've had these episodes on and off ever since I was about 8 or 9 years old. Thankfully when I was a child they weren't too severe, and I felt like I could handle them on my own. I was too scared to tell anyone in case they thought I was crazy or they laughed at me(I felt like I was the only person in the world with these sorts of thoughts). I was also worried that my mother wouldn't know what to do. It's only in recent years that these episodes have started getting more severe, more long-lasting and often accompanied by depressive symptoms. So when I had a major episode last summer, it was so bad I felt like I had to tell my close family members and also go to the doctor for help.
When I'm on medication (which I started for the first time last year) and it's fully kicked in, I hardly get any symptoms at all, which is what makes me think my body probably doesn't produce enough serotonin naturally. I briefly came off medication earlier this year, because my doctor and I thought I had recovered, but 4 weeks later my anxiety symptoms came back again. I tried to carry on with my CBT/self help techniques, but they no longer seemed to be working as the anxiety and intrusive thoughts felt too powerful. I began to feel very hopeless and apathetic about everything, so that's why I asked to restart the medication. Thankfully in the last week or so my anxiety and intrusive thoughts have died down significantly, and I feel a lot happier in myself and more motivated again.
I don't think chemicals force you to think certain thoughts...a lot of anxiety is choice...avoidance, safety behaviours, over-reacting etc. And I think the family line thing is a lot to do with learned behaviour from my parents.
But I think you can be predisposed, my grandmother had a nervous breakdown in the 30s. Predisposed does not mean "resigned to" though, it's just a possiblilty factor.
Nothing should stop someone from trying to get better. Drugs are never the complete answer.
Rennie1989
30-06-13, 23:13
Nobody actually knows why some people suffer from anxiety (or any other mental illness) and why others don't. Genetics has been thought to play a part but scientists aren't sure if it's a learned behaviour from the parents or if the susceptibility of developing the illness is passed down. It is still a debate whether anxiety and depression is a 'chemical imbalance' is the brain because no part of the brain or chemical has been found responsible, some believe that anti-depressants are just a 'placebo affect' and only help people because they believe it helps them.
I really couldn't give you my two-cents on what I think. I've done research myself and nothing seems definitive to me. I hope funding can be given into this research because what ever causes us anxiety and depression is found then treatment (or at least the development of) would follow shortly afterwards.
OK have just asked my daughter who is a Neuroscientist.
She says a lot of pschyotherapists are not very open to the scientific side of things as it reduces their view of what can be achieved therapeutically. In Neuropsychology, she believes the strongest models are Bio-psycho-social models, which basically state that vulnerabilities can come from varying sources, including biological, psychological and sociological. If negative thinking patterns run in families, that CAN affect behaviours, but there is a lot of evidence that certain genotypes are more vulnerable to the problems you describe.
In Epigenetics, there is a lot of research into how our environment can affect how our genes (inheritance) are expressed - eg someone might not get depression if their life didn't trigger it, even though they are genetically predisposed... but someone else might find things more stressful simply because of their genetic make-up.
She tells me there is a 'short 'S' allele' of the serotonin transporter gene, which is particularly linked to mental health vulnerability. So of course things can run in families - but different families will respond differently too so that all has to be considered. She says it isn't overly helpful to tell someone to think themselves better if they have inherited a gene which makes that more difficult for them than for others.
So there you go! :shades:
Damn right :yesyes: your daughter is spot on im not a neuroscientist but biomedical scientist and it is all about a mixture of factors. External and internal.
I know I'm naturally very very strong and without sounding dramatic , Ive had a very very difficult life continuously for over a decade. I've constantly tried to stay afloat BUT as you dauoghter said about the gene thing, maybe I am predisposed to the S allele and therfore my psychology has been disturbed by too much eternal stimulus. It's a good job then, if this is right, that I'm naturally strong in personality because otherwise I would have not managed to get to my 30's and achieved what I have. I would have possible suffered years ago.
I don't know even as someone with a degree and an academic how some psychologists can be so narrow minded and dismissive of scientific developments! It's funny because psychologists do categorise themselves as scientists though:lac: when they want!
No I definatly believe what your daughter is saying :winks:
Pennyjoann
01-07-13, 10:20
I believe it can be either or both. I personally have no underlying problems from my childhood that make me anxious or depressed, I've explored this when I ended up in hospital with a psychiatric nurse. I've always been quite an anxious person, I think the anxiety causes me to get depressed and have panic attacks. I know my biological dad has similar personality traits to me and similar mental health issues, so I believe I'm like this because of him. I don't cope well with stressful situations like other people may be able to cope fine, my anxiety/depression is often triggered by stressful situations but sometimes I get like that for no good reason.
Hi Col, I will tell her you approve! :winks: To me it is obvious really. I'm the youngest of four, you can see MH issues running through our family for generations when you look. I've just (at almost 53) been prescribed Fluoxetine, my first time ever on a medication, but when I think back I have been highly anxious for the whole ofmy life (including exaggerated startle reflexes as a baby and debilitating childhoodphobias which I eventually fought by myself).
For whatever reason, it appears my innate resilience is higher than that of my siblings - however, this hasn't prevented me from eventually needing a bit of help to rebalance things in my brain.
I find it all fascinating. I am really interested to see how it feels to live without anxiety, because I have just accepted it and 'got on with it' for so long, it never ooccurred to me to seek help. So in a way, my workplace bullies may have done me a favour!
Hi speranza, funny because when I look at my maternal side I can see a link too.
My grandma and mum both had a phase of depression , then my mum due to a very very nasty separation with my dad, ended up sectioned! It was awful! My mums ok now but has her moments at certain times of the year & also my auntie for all of my life, I've known of her having anxiety and depression & taking beta blockers for it?
There's definatly a connection genetically. :hugs:
GirlAfraid23
01-07-13, 15:45
I've looked into my family history and there was a relative back in the 1800s who was declared *insane* and set to an asylum.
My dad is definitely bi-polar and a little OCD. My mum is a little Heath obsessive too.
Both me and my brother have OCD and anxiety tendencies.
Thanks everyone for your responses, it really has been so helpful to read what you all think! I definitely think there must be a genetic link somewhere, after all, we do inherit personality traits from our parents so I don't see why we can't inherit anxious genes too. I agree that there are many factors that lead to mental health issues, as I have family members who I can see slight anxiety in but the path of their lives has lead them to avoid getting full blown anxiety disorders, so I guess that shows there must be other contributing factors? I personally have had such a good upbringing, even though my mum has anxiety she has been on sucessful meds since I was a baby so I definitely didn't learn anxiety from her. I loved school and love learning, had a great group of friends who all followed to the same high school but then once I hit my teens everything changed. I think for me it's genetics but maybe triggered by other things, I don't think I'll ever know fully what triggered it though but that's not important!
OK have just asked my daughter who is a Neuroscientist.
She says a lot of pschyotherapists are not very open to the scientific side of things as it reduces their view of what can be achieved therapeutically. In Neuropsychology, she believes the strongest models are Bio-psycho-social models, which basically state that vulnerabilities can come from varying sources, including biological, psychological and sociological. If negative thinking patterns run in families, that CAN affect behaviours, but there is a lot of evidence that certain genotypes are more vulnerable to the problems you describe.
In Epigenetics, there is a lot of research into how our environment can affect how our genes (inheritance) are expressed - eg someone might not get depression if their life didn't trigger it, even though they are genetically predisposed... but someone else might find things more stressful simply because of their genetic make-up.
She tells me there is a 'short 'S' allele' of the serotonin transporter gene, which is particularly linked to mental health vulnerability. So of course things can run in families - but different families will respond differently too so that all has to be considered. She says it isn't overly helpful to tell someone to think themselves better if they have inherited a gene which makes that more difficult for them than for others.
So there you go! :shades:
Thanks Speranza! What an intelligent daughter you have! I love hearing the scientific facts like that! That's all really helpful to know so please tell her I said thank you :yesyes:
Do you think proving a genetic link will help you come to terms with your anxiety Jayjoe?
Thanks for the response Tufty, I've had anxiety now for about 7 years so I've come to accept it but after having a lot of therapy and never really seeing much improvement I really want to look into the possibility of genetics as maybe I'm not getting the right treatment? I know therapy does help your way of thinking, there's no doubt about that, but I think maybe if my anxiety is mostly due to genetics I might be on the wrong treatment path and may possibly find meds more helpful in combination with the therapy. I've been thinking about meds for a while but really want to do my research to make sure it's the best thing as it's a big decision! So that's basically why I'm so interested to know and just because I'm intrigued :cool:
JayJoe - you are so on the right lines thinking that anxiety is genetic. Your therapist is talking cr*p.
Mine is such a long story, but I'll try to keep it short.
Started with panic and anxiety at 16yo, suffered it for 35 years, (I'm now 51). I always thought "something was doing this to me" and it wasn't all in my head.
Over the years I've panicked in almost every place, and I also found that I would become dizzy/drunk like, my head feeling funny, which I eventually found out was hypoglycaemia (low blood sugar).
Fast forward those 35 years and I was making a lovely sponge cake. I had 3 large slices over 2 days tasted great. Following day I was stuck in the bathroom with bad diahorrea. So I go and see my GP and I suggested it might be the eggs (sorry, I know it's a too much information time, but "IT" smelt eggy). GP said that was unlikely but to try cutting out the wheat.
I cut wheat out and after a few days I felt calmer, heart slower, breathing slower and less/no hypos. After much research into symptoms and links between one disease and other it became clear I have Coeliac Disease.
Sadly my parents are no longer with me, but it is plainly obvious that I inherited this from my father!
There is a direct link between hypos and coeliac. None of my family have any past history of diabetes, but 2 of my dads brothers were alcoholics and his other brother had epilepsy (which does have a link).
I hardly panic now, but I get the odd twinge now and again, I think it's because my nerves are conditioned to it, and I have to "un-learn" all my anxiety triggers as they don't matter now, but I can't remember the last time I was truly anxious - I'm so much better.
If you want to know more please send me a private message.
Regards
Wow, thanks for the reply! That's brilliant that you were able to trace the cause of your anxiety like that! (obviously not good that you have these physical problems though!) It just goes to show that there can not only be genetic links but physical links too! I hope you're well now and have the physical conditions under control?
There have been several heated debates on this forum in the past about whether anxiety is caused by a chemical imbalance or whether it's a learned behaviour. I personally think both theories have merit - for some people, anxiety is genetic (ie caused by a chemical imbalance) and for others it is a learned behaviour. Then for some other people, it may be a combination of the 2 factors. I think these 2 different theories explain why some people can recover from anxiety with CBT alone, while others need medication. I'm aware that anxiety and depression often can run in families, which gives weight to the genetic theory.
For me, I think my anxiety is partly caused by a chemical imbalance (serotonin deficiency), but I'm not anxious all the time - mine comes in episodes which can last for a few months, then I go back to normal again until the next episode starts. These episodes seem to be mostly triggered when I go through a stressful phase in my life, for example being made redundant from a job, or other major life changes, although occasionally they can come out of the blue with no clear explanation. So in my case, I think it's partly a chemical imbalance and partly due to environmental factors. I'm assuming that the chemical imbalance must always be there, but I usually only enter an anxious/depressive episode when there are other stresses in my life.
I've had these episodes on and off ever since I was about 8 or 9 years old. Thankfully when I was a child they weren't too severe, and I felt like I could handle them on my own. I was too scared to tell anyone in case they thought I was crazy or they laughed at me(I felt like I was the only person in the world with these sorts of thoughts). I was also worried that my mother wouldn't know what to do. It's only in recent years that these episodes have started getting more severe, more long-lasting and often accompanied by depressive symptoms. So when I had a major episode last summer, it was so bad I felt like I had to tell my close family members and also go to the doctor for help.
When I'm on medication (which I started for the first time last year) and it's fully kicked in, I hardly get any symptoms at all, which is what makes me think my body probably doesn't produce enough serotonin naturally. I briefly came off medication earlier this year, because my doctor and I thought I had recovered, but 4 weeks later my anxiety symptoms came back again. I tried to carry on with my CBT/self help techniques, but they no longer seemed to be working as the anxiety and intrusive thoughts felt too powerful. I began to feel very hopeless and apathetic about everything, so that's why I asked to restart the medication. Thankfully in the last week or so my anxiety and intrusive thoughts have died down significantly, and I feel a lot happier in myself and more motivated again.
Thanks Sparkle, that's exactly where my thinking is at right now, that the CBT may not be enough alone for me to recover fully and I may need medication. Sorry if it's a daft question but can you get diagnosed with serotonin deficiency? That's really interesting that the medication has helped you and you believe your anxiety is partly to do with chemical imbalances, may I ask what medication has worked well for you? Also, do you think you would stay on medication for life because it helps? Sorry for being so nosey it's just nice to know what people think who have actually experienced this sort of thing. I hope the medication kicks in fully for you soon and you start to feel better again
I don't think chemicals force you to think certain thoughts...a lot of anxiety is choice...avoidance, safety behaviours, over-reacting etc. And I think the family line thing is a lot to do with learned behaviour from my parents.
But I think you can be predisposed, my grandmother had a nervous breakdown in the 30s. Predisposed does not mean "resigned to" though, it's just a possiblilty factor.
Nothing should stop someone from trying to get better. Drugs are never the complete answer.
Hi PanchoGoz, yeah I agree it has alot to do with avoidance and safety behaviours I have definitely done this to ease my anxiety! It's just so hard to stop doing these things when you feel so bad! I wish I hadn't avoided and run away from things as it's just made things much worse! For me as I said above I doubt I have learnt anxiety from my parents (my mum has been on successful meds since I was a baby so much so she runs her own buisness and I've never lived with nor see my dad) but I understand it's completely different for everyone.
Nobody actually knows why some people suffer from anxiety (or any other mental illness) and why others don't. Genetics has been thought to play a part but scientists aren't sure if it's a learned behaviour from the parents or if the susceptibility of developing the illness is passed down. It is still a debate whether anxiety and depression is a 'chemical imbalance' is the brain because no part of the brain or chemical has been found responsible, some believe that anti-depressants are just a 'placebo affect' and only help people because they believe it helps them.
I really couldn't give you my two-cents on what I think. I've done research myself and nothing seems definitive to me. I hope funding can be given into this research because what ever causes us anxiety and depression is found then treatment (or at least the development of) would follow shortly afterwards.
I've read stuff like that too Rennie which is why I feel like I'm banging my head against a brick wall right now! :roflmao:
I think they should definitely do more research into it as so many people seem to suffer and it's just no way to live! Hopefully in time there will be a development of more effective treatments, it's just what to do in the meantime!
Damn right :yesyes: your daughter is spot on im not a neuroscientist but biomedical scientist and it is all about a mixture of factors. External and internal.
I know I'm naturally very very strong and without sounding dramatic , Ive had a very very difficult life continuously for over a decade. I've constantly tried to stay afloat BUT as you dauoghter said about the gene thing, maybe I am predisposed to the S allele and therfore my psychology has been disturbed by too much eternal stimulus. It's a good job then, if this is right, that I'm naturally strong in personality because otherwise I would have not managed to get to my 30's and achieved what I have. I would have possible suffered years ago.
I don't know even as someone with a degree and an academic how some psychologists can be so narrow minded and dismissive of scientific developments! It's funny because psychologists do categorise themselves as scientists though:lac: when they want!
No I definatly believe what your daughter is saying :winks:
Thanks for the input Col, I shall be researching the S allele in a minute haha! It is funny how psychologists are so narrow minded. That's why her comment annoyed me, I like my facts and I trust science much more than anything else :)
I believe it can be either or both. I personally have no underlying problems from my childhood that make me anxious or depressed, I've explored this when I ended up in hospital with a psychiatric nurse. I've always been quite an anxious person, I think the anxiety causes me to get depressed and have panic attacks. I know my biological dad has similar personality traits to me and similar mental health issues, so I believe I'm like this because of him. I don't cope well with stressful situations like other people may be able to cope fine, my anxiety/depression is often triggered by stressful situations but sometimes I get like that for no good reason.
Pennyjoann I'm quite the same, no underlying problems from childhood, infact I had the best childhood possible, but still ended up this way!
Hi Col, I will tell her you approve! :winks: To me it is obvious really. I'm the youngest of four, you can see MH issues running through our family for generations when you look. I've just (at almost 53) been prescribed Fluoxetine, my first time ever on a medication, but when I think back I have been highly anxious for the whole ofmy life (including exaggerated startle reflexes as a baby and debilitating childhoodphobias which I eventually fought by myself).
For whatever reason, it appears my innate resilience is higher than that of my siblings - however, this hasn't prevented me from eventually needing a bit of help to rebalance things in my brain.
I find it all fascinating. I am really interested to see how it feels to live without anxiety, because I have just accepted it and 'got on with it' for so long, it never ooccurred to me to seek help. So in a way, my workplace bullies may have done me a favour!
How is the Fluoxetine going Speranza if you don't mind me asking?
I've tried to recover without meds but it hasn't worked so far and I just don't want to waste my life away in therapy! Maybe I don't have a strong enough personality, I don't know? Now I'm starting to think why should I just put up with something that could be treated and could give me a full life that I should have, you know?
Someone once said to me people don't think twice about taking medication for physical illnesses do they? So why should mental health be treated any differently? Of course, I would say that makes sense for people with a chemical imbalance/genetic link. It is all really interesting!
---------- Post added at 16:41 ---------- Previous post was at 16:39 ----------
I've looked into my family history and there was a relative back in the 1800s who was declared *insane* and set to an asylum.
My dad is definitely bi-polar and a little OCD. My mum is a little Heath obsessive too.
Both me and my brother have OCD and anxiety tendencies.
Wow, how did you look so far back into your family history? That's brilliant, I'd love to do that! That seems to me there's some sort of genetic link, most definitely. My grandma spent all her life nearly in hospital and had that electric shock treatment more than once, horrible! I'm glad mental illness is a bit better understood nowadays!
This is a very interesting thread. It is a question I have often asked myself. Both my sister and I have both suffered from bouts of depression and anxiety, obviously we will be similar genetically but had the same upbringing. We moved house many times as children suffered the break up of our parent's marriage and lost our mother very suddenly. I've always tried to get my head around whether our circumstances in childhood led us to experience these problems as adults, or if we both had a genetic time bomb which these events triggered. One positive for both of us is that because of our shared experiences we are able to confide in each other. As many of you will know having someone who understands what you are going through is very important.
Hi again,
the fluox is so far, so good... the only noticeable SE so far anyway has been a headache, comes and goes and I thought it had gone but I woke with one yesterday. However it soon went. I am beginning to feel a lot less panicky. I am testing myself today, my daughter is writing a dissertation in the kitchen and I am sitting with her even though the washing machine is on. For some reason that has always been one of my biggest triggers for anxiety - for many years I had to go outside the front of the house when it was on spin! lol I feel a tiny bit anxious but not too bad... am distracting myself with you guys! :hugs:
Sparkle1984
01-07-13, 20:03
Jayjoe, I'm on citalopram, same as last year. The first time around, it took about 12 weeks for me to feel the full benefit. Unfortunately you can't actually get diagnosed with serotonin deficiency - there is no test for it as yet. It is just a theory that I have serotonin deficiency, but I have no way of proving that. However, the fact that I feel a lot better when I'm on the meds means that serotonin must have something to do with it.
As for whether I'd stay on medication for life, I hope I don't have to, but if it's necessary then so be it. I was only on them for 6 months last time, and I'm thinking maybe that wasn't quite long enough for me to change my ways of thinking. Maybe I will try coming off them again some time next year, but if I suffer another relapse after going med-free then I will have to seriously consider going back on for a 3rd time and staying on them indefinitely.
---------- Post added at 20:03 ---------- Previous post was at 19:56 ----------
Nobody actually knows why some people suffer from anxiety (or any other mental illness) and why others don't. Genetics has been thought to play a part but scientists aren't sure if it's a learned behaviour from the parents or if the susceptibility of developing the illness is passed down. It is still a debate whether anxiety and depression is a 'chemical imbalance' is the brain because no part of the brain or chemical has been found responsible, some believe that anti-depressants are just a 'placebo affect' and only help people because they believe it helps them.
I really couldn't give you my two-cents on what I think. I've done research myself and nothing seems definitive to me. I hope funding can be given into this research because what ever causes us anxiety and depression is found then treatment (or at least the development of) would follow shortly afterwards.
I have read about this "placebo effect" theory in the newspapers in the past. I don't think it's logical - if it was true that ADs are just a placebo effect, why do they make people feel worse for the first few days/weeks? Also, why would they take several weeks to kick in if they are placebos? Why do different people find that different meds work for them? If they really were placebos, then it wouldn't matter whether someone was on citalopram or sertraline or whatever - they would recover regardless, and this clearly isn't the case. I've personally found that the improvement is too dramatic for it to be a placebo effect.
That's just my personal opinion. When I was first offered the meds last summer, my opinion was that although I originally had doubts about whether they would work, I may as well try them as I wouldn't have lost anything if they didn't work, I'd just try something else instead.
Rennie1989
03-07-13, 12:59
Just to echo what everyone else has said I do agree that there are genetic influences. My mum is an anxious person, but that may have been learned on my part, but my aunt and nan from my dad's side were both sufferers of depression. My nan smoked weed and was on valium and my aunt is now on antidepressants. I never met my nan (she died a month before I was born) and I didn't often see my aunt so those behaviours cannot be learned.
After coming through yet another depressive/low mood episode I think we can all say that depression is not a learned behaviour. Nobody can learn those debilitating thoughts and fatigue. But then again with anxiety nobody learns paranoid and cautious thoughts either, but I suppose you can to an extent. I think I'll leave it to the scientists and doctors!
Is anxiety inherited? A simple question with a not so simple answer...or is there?
To say that humans have a fear response written into their DNA should be clear: we've inherited it from the earliest lifeforms on Earth some 500 million years ago - the vast majority of lifeforms have needed to know fear to avoid danger, or when something needs to change. So what we're really asking is are some people born with a higher of lower fear response than others? In answer to that i'd rather say that i don't know. I don't know what effect a particular environment has on a person because no scientist has followed an individual around from birth 24 hours a day - and should any do that wouldn't they be irrevocably altering the experimental conditions anyway? But surely such an epic experiment would be needed to give a reasonably confident assessment of a person's inherited and learnt characteristics.
I think it's probable that people's response to fear - how it's processed, or understood - has a basis in heritability, but that doesn't mean that whatever that is can't be superseded by a particular environment.
My truth is related to my parents who've basically never talked to me on an emotional level - my emotions have often been ignored as well. And i'm firmly with Nietzsche when he says that "A single joyless person is enough to create constant discouragement and cloudy skies for a whole household."
Thanks Sandywood, that's really interesting and helpful!
Hi again,
the fluox is so far, so good... the only noticeable SE so far anyway has been a headache, comes and goes and I thought it had gone but I woke with one yesterday. However it soon went. I am beginning to feel a lot less panicky. I am testing myself today, my daughter is writing a dissertation in the kitchen and I am sitting with her even though the washing machine is on. For some reason that has always been one of my biggest triggers for anxiety - for many years I had to go outside the front of the house when it was on spin! lol I feel a tiny bit anxious but not too bad... am distracting myself with you guys! :hugs:
Sorry for the late reply but that's brilliant Speranza, hope they continue to help and things keep getting easier :hugs:
Jayjoe, I'm on citalopram, same as last year. The first time around, it took about 12 weeks for me to feel the full benefit. Unfortunately you can't actually get diagnosed with serotonin deficiency - there is no test for it as yet. It is just a theory that I have serotonin deficiency, but I have no way of proving that. However, the fact that I feel a lot better when I'm on the meds means that serotonin must have something to do with it.
As for whether I'd stay on medication for life, I hope I don't have to, but if it's necessary then so be it. I was only on them for 6 months last time, and I'm thinking maybe that wasn't quite long enough for me to change my ways of thinking. Maybe I will try coming off them again some time next year, but if I suffer another relapse after going med-free then I will have to seriously consider going back on for a 3rd time and staying on them indefinitely.
---------- Post added at 20:03 ---------- Previous post was at 19:56 ----------
I have read about this "placebo effect" theory in the newspapers in the past. I don't think it's logical - if it was true that ADs are just a placebo effect, why do they make people feel worse for the first few days/weeks? Also, why would they take several weeks to kick in if they are placebos? Why do different people find that different meds work for them? If they really were placebos, then it wouldn't matter whether someone was on citalopram or sertraline or whatever - they would recover regardless, and this clearly isn't the case. I've personally found that the improvement is too dramatic for it to be a placebo effect.
That's just my personal opinion. When I was first offered the meds last summer, my opinion was that although I originally had doubts about whether they would work, I may as well try them as I wouldn't have lost anything if they didn't work, I'd just try something else instead.
Thanks Sparkle, I think I'm more leaning towards Citalopram but I'm interested in Cipralex, I think that would be one I'd be willing to take. I hope they kick in soon :) As for the placebo effect, you made some really good points there, I hadn't looked at it that way before, really interesting!
Just to echo what everyone else has said I do agree that there are genetic influences. My mum is an anxious person, but that may have been learned on my part, but my aunt and nan from my dad's side were both sufferers of depression. My nan smoked weed and was on valium and my aunt is now on antidepressants. I never met my nan (she died a month before I was born) and I didn't often see my aunt so those behaviours cannot be learned.
After coming through yet another depressive/low mood episode I think we can all say that depression is not a learned behaviour. Nobody can learn those debilitating thoughts and fatigue. But then again with anxiety nobody learns paranoid and cautious thoughts either, but I suppose you can to an extent. I think I'll leave it to the scientists and doctors!
That's a good point Rennie that debilitating thoughts can't be learnt, that really has made me think!
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions Inc. All rights reserved.