View Full Version : contact the NSPCC ?? advice
im quite worried, my neighbour has a partner whos very larger and has the loudest mouth imaginable.
She has 2 kids and this bloke ....every single day will tell those children off. He doesn't just shout at them he'll scream and give them long lectures using words i dont even know the meaning of, but the worst is when he swears at them
Earlier he was telling the 7 year old lad off saying to him, i dont no what goes on in your f***** head but you dont care, last time you were black and blue you didnt care do you want another slap.
it really upsets me becuase this is happening everyday. Hes a disgusting man to look at and yesterday he said to the girl whos 5 oh come on pick it up it wont kill you....but i will !!
seriously disturbing, can i get in touch with the NSPCC and record him as evidence?
id post a recording on here of i could not sure id be allowed, just breaks my heart hearing him scream and tell the kids there worthless, there not even his and shes just as bad.
You could call social services or NSPCC and tell them your concerns. I hate to hear of any one abusing children and i think I would want to do something about it.
What a shame! Sounds like those poor kids have a miserable existence.
Maybe it's worth giving the NSPCC a call for some advice and to find out what they can do. You don't have to give your name, you can stay totally anonymous.
ElizabethJane
07-07-13, 19:10
Dear nattynatt I really do not think that you should get involved unless you know these people personally or are related to them. It could become very nasty and the children could be taken from their parents. This really isn't the way foward. If you know the Mum have word with her first. My niece has recently lost her children to her ex husband. It is really is better if they can stay together as a family unit however nasty it might seem from the outset it really isn't any of your business. EJ
I see where you are coming from but I'm sorry, I don't agree. Countless kids have died because people thought it wasn't their business to interfere. If there are actual threats and the words 'black and blue' being bandied about, personally I would do what Annie and B-Brain have suggested, ring for advice. I know from the other side of things how very hard it is to get Social Care to intervene and take children away, they do not do it lightly. However these children have no voice of their own, We all have a Duty of Care to each other. Apart from anything else, this will be a horrible strain on you until you pass it on. You can ring and ask for advice before disclosing who it is about, ask if they think it is something you ought to formally pass on to them. The family need never know it was you.
It's a really difficult situation. I wouldn't know what to do either.
I used to live next-door to a woman who would shout at her kids all the time, and sometimes say such nasty things. I found it really upsetting to hear, but there were never actual threats of violence like your neighbour.
Social Services cannot take any action on a next-door neighbour's say so. They have to carry out their own investigations and if they take any action it would be based on their own findings. So anything that happens would not be down to you, but Social Services. So maybe the right thing to do would be to report your concerns and let them investigate.
Natt,
Follow your instincts - I think you know what they're telling you to do. Children's Services or the NSPCC will be able to advise you better than we can and anything they do will have the children's best interests at heart. There are always two sides to every story but this sounds very one-sided.
I have to disagree with ElizabethJane. If someone had spoken up for baby Peter and Victoria Climbie, they might still be alive. The mother certainly won't thank you if you try and speak to her - I suggest that you don't give the family the opportunity to find out that it's you who's concerned or you might end up on the receiving end of this nasty piece of work.
Pip
What helped me in my previous job was that there was a protocol. If a child said something to me, it wasn't my place to decide what to do, or make a judegement call. I simply had to make sure I passed that information on to the right place. It was very hard sometimes, there was one little boy who I contacted the authorities about and they did nothing. I was so concerned that I rang again and again and in the end people thought I was a real troublemaker, but nothing was done, and a few years later his sibling died in very odd circumstances. :(
The thing is, I was just about able to live with myself because I had genuinely done all I could for those kids.
Personally I would make the call, that is exactly what the NSPCC encourage, they will not think you are a nosy neighbour and as Edie says, someone will look into it and make their own decision.
For me, the clincher was always, "Would my conscience be clear if something happend to that child?"
Pip, absolutely. They are best left to others to deal with.
Thanks for the advise. Its a shame because we live on a street where we all know eachother but these neighbours are just from hell.
All has gone quiet now the kids are in bed and the "monster" told the little girl if she was going to talk about the chair anymore he would burn it. :(
I wouldnt normally poke my nose in but it makes me feel sick hearing his comments asking the children if they want another smack.
Will sleep on it tonight, wouldnt want them knowing it was me who dibbed them in though
ElizabethJane
07-07-13, 19:58
I just don't think you should interfere that is all. This has nothing to do with Victoria or Baby Peter. They were already in the care of Social Services and that did not help them at all. My niece has lost her children due to a false case put against her. Surely it is better for the children to remain with the Mother? EJ
I just don't think you should interfere that is all. This has nothing to do with Victoria or Baby Peter. They were already in the care of Social Services and that did not help them at all. My niece has lost her children due to a false case put against her. Surely it is better for the children to remain with the Mother? EJ
I use Baby Peter and Victoria Climbie as an example because they show what can happen when adults don't speak up and act on instinct. They weren't under the care of Social Services despite them being aware of potential abuse. The children were still in the care of their guardians/mother.
Is it better for children to remain with their mother in a highly abusive household? I doubt it very much but that's for specialists to decide after taking into consideration all the facts.
Natt - are there any other neighbours you could speak to in confidence? Maybe that would help as I know you're in a very difficult situation.
Pip
Andrea2607
07-07-13, 20:29
I really don't agree with you ElizabethJane. Too many people 'turn a blind eye' to what is going on under their noses. Communities need to stand up to these bullies and I feel it is right to call social services on this occassion even if it is just to ask advice. Nattynatt needs to go with her gut and do what she thinks is right.
Elizabeth Jane, I think if you pause for a moment, you will perhaps see that you are discussing two entirely different scenarios. I can understand how distressed you are about your niece's children, it must be awful for you all. But you can say that you are sure it was a mistake. I don't know the situation and obviously can't comment.
However, Natt has heard what is technically emotional abuse and suspects physical abuse. IMHO children are NEVER better off left with an abusive parent - not without a lot of support in any case. But as Pipkin says, that isn't Natt's call in any case.
ElizabethJane
07-07-13, 20:35
I use Baby Peter and Victoria Climbie as an example because they show what can happen when adults don't speak up and act on instinct. They weren't under the care of Social Services despite them being aware of potential abuse. The children were still in the care of their guardians/mother.
Is it better for children to remain with their mother in a highly abusive household? I doubt it very much but that's for specialists to decide after taking into consideration all the facts.
Natt - are there any other neighbours you could speak to in confidence? Maybe that would help as I know you're in a very difficult situation.
Pip
I think that the cases that you are quoting are very complex. Both children were known to Social Services. Social Services can do more harm than good sometimes if they fabricate a story so that the children are in fact placed with the abuser. It is not always good. I only suggested that Nat went to talk to the Mum if she knew her. I think that the NSPCC will always act in the interests of the children first. Others may already be aware of the abuser. EJ I meant that the children should stay with their Mother- but this is not always the case.
Like Speranza I have worked in a situation where I have had to pass information on about children who I have suspected may have been abused. I would not want it on my conscious if any thing had happened to these children. A child is not best left with a parent were it is subjected to abuse or threats of any kind.
nilepalace304
07-07-13, 20:41
PHONE SOMEONE..... even if you are wrong at least the kids come on the radar, you will be more upset if something happens to them and you did nothing. I think you should interfere and then your conscience will be clear. Go for it!!!!
I agree with ElizabethJane - I wouldn't trust social services unless I knew a child was being seriously abused. Shouting and smacking is unpleasant but I know those children would want to be with their mother and not placed with strangers or put into a home - There is the possibility that they could be seperated from each other too. My biggest fear is the children entering the secret court system (probably the sickest thing happening in Britain today) - once this happens anything could happen to them and you would never know.
Why not befriend the children and see if they open up to you - ask other people in the street to help as well.
Your idea of recording him is a good one - then if you feel the situation becomes intolerable then when you do approach social services then they will have to act on your concerns.
Good luck in whatever you decide.
AuntieMoosie
07-07-13, 21:20
EJ hun, while I really do understand how angry and upset you are about your poor nieces situation, that is a very different scenario to this case hun :)
Talking about his subject is, and always will be, very emotive and each and everyone of us will have our own views and feelings about it for our own reasons :)
I too, think that wherever possible, children should be able to remain with their families, however, that can only ever be allowed to happen if those children are 100% safe.
I was brought up in the care of Dr Barnardos, I'm very proud to say :)
Thankfully, for myself, my sister and my brother, we were not ill treated or abused in any way by our natural family. Our circumstances were that our father walked out and left my mother with 2 young children and me on the way, needless to say really, my mother became unwell, had a nervous breakdown and was unable to care for us.
My mother went on to remarry a nasty brute of a man and I know that if we had been returned to her that he would have emotionally abused us as he did when we were on short visits there, once, even locking me in a cupboard!!!
There were children in our home that came from the most distressing backgrounds having suffered all forms of abuse from family members, so I have seen it first hand, I have also seen and experienced how these children suffer, they see themselves as BAD, UNLOVABLE, UNWORTHY, DIRTY and are left basically screwed up through it :weep:
So, like I have said, I do understand EJ's feelings on what happened to her niece, but this is a very different ball game to the one we're really talking about :)
nattynatt you have to do what you feel is right for you hun.
Now having said that, if it were me in your shoes, believe me, I would be blowing every whistle loud and clear!!!!!
Contrary to what many believe, social workers do NOT just go in willy nilly removing children for no reason, sorry, but it just does NOT happen!!!
They will have to launch and carry out a thorough investigation, which will include studying the family, speaking to the children, speaking with the schools and nurseries, speaking with the family GP, the local hospital, health visitors and neighbours.
The only time that they will take immediate action is if, when carrying out a formal visit to assess the situation, they feel that the children are in immediate danger or they feel that the children are already suffering some sort of abuse, neglect or cruelty, in those circumstances, the social worker will have a duty of care to those children and will have the power to remove them to a place of safety.
Please remember, children often can't speak up for themselves, as has already been said, and we have all seen the tragic events of when people have not been listened too or taken seriously. It is especially children who are being abused, that cannot speak out for themselves, so we, as responsible adults, have a duty to that child/children to make sure that we speak, shout or scream for them.
Hugs to all :hugs: :hugs: :hugs: :hugs: :hugs: :hugs:
Doing nothing is not an option, you know something is not right and must not ignore it.
Children are not taken away from their parents and into care without a good reason and after a thorough investigation, a single report of abuse will not result in the children being removed from the home.
Some years ago I became aware that a neighbour was mentally abusing his son and I was unsure what to do. I made an appointment with the headteacher of the school I knew the boy was attending and discussed my fears with her. She contacted social services and informed them of my concerns, this was done confidentially through the school. As there had been no other concerns raised with social services about this family no further action was taken but they said the schools call was on record and if any further contact was made about this family or the school noticed any problems they would escalate the investigation quicker.
The school was very thankful that I had voiced my concerns, they said they would monitor the child more closely and as far as I know nothing else came of it BUT I felt so much better knowing that I had voiced my worries, I could not live with the thought of a child being at risk because of my inaction.
Do you know which school the children attend? Could you contact them, every school has a safeguarding lead - a teacher who is responsible for the safety of the children in their care. It maybe that they have concerns already or are aware that the family are struggling and could do with some support.
Good luck with whatever you decide
Sam
I would call them for advice. Nspcc are very good at giving advice. Why not call childline too.
Mee
Although I understand your concerns unless you've actually seen physical violence occur, I would mind my own business.
Having Social services in your life is no joke, and making that call is not to be taken lightly.
Despite you not liking there rough style of parenting they may all be perfectly happy. Unless you want the very real possibility of children being taken of there parents and a couple split up on your conscience, stay out of it. In fact the pressure of social services could make life very much worse for these children.
So unless your sure and can live with the repercussions stay out of it.
AuntieMoosie
08-07-13, 01:49
Clint I'm sorry but I totally disagree with you on a couple of your comments.
You don't have to witness violence to know that it's happening or that it could be happening. Just a mere suspicion is enough to have it looked into especially if children are concerned, which they are in this case.
No child that I know of would be happy to have that sort of "rough parenting" it's not "rough parenting" it is abuse, simple as that!!
I'm sorry but I really just don't understand this "mind your business" stuff when we're talking about the safety and well being of children, and to be perfectly honest I find it quite disgusting and very worrying.
Can you think back to when you were a child??
Would you have been happy with some "rough parenting" ??? or would you be wishing every day and night that someone would come along and help you??? I know which option I'd choose.
Those children were brought into this world by 2 adults, they did not choose to be here.
Once it was decided that they were going to be here, they have a right to be treated with kindness, respect, understanding, love and care, they deserve no less and if the parents can't provide that, or the parents abuse and mistreat those children, then action needs to be taken and the children should be removed to a place of safety.
I'm sorry but I know first hand what it's like to be brought up in care, and it's not the nightmare you may think it is. I'm glad I spent my childhood in care, I know that I was certainly a whole lot happier than I would have been with either my mother or my father.
No it's not ideal, but now things are better in the way that children are now placed for fostering or adoption and have the chance to experience a happy and near normal family life :)
You say
"Unless you want the very real possibility of children being taken of there parents and a couple split up on your conscience, stay out of it. In fact the pressure of social services could make life very much worse for these children."
I don't know how you come to that conclusion??? How about if something dreadful were to happen to these children?? How would your conscience feel then???
Social services, as I've already said before, do not just remove children at a whim, it does NOT happen!!!!!
Do you know how much it costs to keep a child in care??? do you know how hard it can be to get children placed into an appropriate family??? Do you know the court process that has to be gone though????
Social services would want to do everything that they can in order to keep families together and they will work towards that aim, but they just cannot leave children in dangerous or abusive situations, they have a duty of care to those children, they work for those children so that if there is no alternative, children will be removed and rightly so in my opinion.
I've never known of childrens lives becoming worse because of input from social workers either???
If you're hinting that the parents could abuse the children more because of it, then that answers everything doesn't it??? then you moan that children end up being taken away????
I've lived 13 years of my life with children in care, I've seen some really damaged children believe me. Do you really think that's right and okay??? because I certainly do NOT!!!
So it depends on what "repercussions" you want to live with doesn't it.
Try looking at it from another angle, you could be rescuing those children from a life of living hell, you could be giving them the opportunity to have a happy childhood, to experience love and belonging, to be able to reach their full potential and lead a happy and healthy adult life, those are the "repercussions" I'd be thinking of :)
---------- Post added at 01:49 ---------- Previous post was at 00:53 ----------
A very helpful video from the NSPCC
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=db_5xxfgwfE
Dear nattynatt I really do not think that you should get involved unless you know these people personally or are related to them. It could become very nasty and the children could be taken from their parents. This really isn't the way foward. If you know the Mum have word with her first. My niece has recently lost her children to her ex husband. It is really is better if they can stay together as a family unit however nasty it might seem from the outset it really isn't any of your business. EJ
My heart goes out to your niece. I'm a mum and my parents had an hurrendous separation and my brother in his 20's now & quite frankly hasn't spoken to my mum in over 8 years ever since my parents split. Very difficult all round as I and my kids are in contact with mum and see her as normal etc.
However providing Nattynat is not a busy body ( which I'm sure she's not ) I'd be inclined as others have said and anonymously get info,advice & would even report this kind of behaviour.
Now in this country UK , we do nothing but "turn a blind eye" to bloody everything. Common curtesy , manners and care have gone out of the frigging window! Everyone's ME ME ME & separated. So I'd consider reporting.
WHY- because it says a lot about his personality, to allow neighbours overhearing him swearing at young children in a threatening tone & this man isn't even their biological father. And witout Semising - that begs the question, if he says stuff like this openly, it would be interesting to see what he's like in private??? Also the bit about black and blue like last time ........WHAT THE HELL. Implying hes got physical with them. Even if he was their father, my choice would still be the same but being in essence their mothers boyf - he has absolutly NO right over these children!!!!
Also let's not forget the mother - she might not know, on balance maybe she leaves him to mind the kids if she nips to the shops etc BUT chances are she is aware & WHAT kind of mother does that make her, anyway????
As for having a word with the mum , a big NO NO!!!!
Because later down the line - if someone else then overhears and reports , they will automatically blame NattyNat OR if eventually NattyNat witnesses something more sinister & reports after the chat with the mother , YET again shell get accused!!!!
Plus from what I know and as others have mentioned - social services are so stretched and won't just go in and IMMEADIATLY take the kids. It's not like that.
NattyNat go with your gut! Perhaps start by doing research and getting advice about reporting first & then take it from there. Good luck:flowers:
---------- Post added at 11:39 ---------- Previous post was at 11:18 ----------
"Unless you want the very real possibility of children being taken of there parents and a couple split up on your conscience, stay out of it. In fact the pressure of social services could make life very much worse for these children."
I don't know how you come to that conclusion??? How about if something dreadful were to happen to these children?? How would your conscience feel then???
Social services, as I've already said before, do not just remove children at a whim, it does NOT happen!!!!! DAMN RIGHT AUNTIE MOOSIE:emot-highfive::emot-highfive:
Type "Social Services ruin families" into google and read the results before you get those N***'s involved.
Social services get a cash incentive to take children away from parents and put them into adoptive/foster homes.
There are also loads of stories of paedophiles working for social services yet they are allowed to continue their activities for years because the authorities ignore the evidence. So phoning social services may make the situation a lot worse!
Type "Social Services ruin families" into google and read the results before you get those N***'s involved.
Social services get a cash incentive to take children away from parents and put them into adoptive/foster homes.
There are also loads of stories of paedophiles working for social services yet they are allowed to continue their activities for years because the authorities ignore the evidence. So phoning social services may make the situation a lot worse!
I am open minded to those things happening in the world. There will always be corrupt individuals and silent schemes at work. I know things and "the system" aren't always as they seem and these organisations haven't always got your best interests at heart and of course theres always money involved , above all and above everything.
But put it this way, if I kept hearing a child next door being battered and treat like ****, and it went on and on, I'd end up depressed and would cry myself to sleep every night. I couldn't bare it! On balance ,I would ultimately , Report:shrug:
AuntieMoosie
08-07-13, 20:22
My heart goes out to your niece. I'm a mum and my parents had an hurrendous separation and my brother in his 20's now & quite frankly hasn't spoken to my mum in over 8 years ever since my parents split. Very difficult all round as I and my kids are in contact with mum and see her as normal etc.
However providing Nattynat is not a busy body ( which I'm sure she's not ) I'd be inclined as others have said and anonymously get info,advice & would even report this kind of behaviour.
Now in this country UK , we do nothing but "turn a blind eye" to bloody everything. Common curtesy , manners and care have gone out of the frigging window! Everyone's ME ME ME & separated. So I'd consider reporting.
WHY- because it says a lot about his personality, to allow neighbours overhearing him swearing at young children in a threatening tone & this man isn't even their biological father. And witout Semising - that begs the question, if he says stuff like this openly, it would be interesting to see what he's like in private??? Also the bit about black and blue like last time ........WHAT THE HELL. Implying hes got physical with them. Even if he was their father, my choice would still be the same but being in essence their mothers boyf - he has absolutly NO right over these children!!!!
Also let's not forget the mother - she might not know, on balance maybe she leaves him to mind the kids if she nips to the shops etc BUT chances are she is aware & WHAT kind of mother does that make her, anyway????
As for having a word with the mum , a big NO NO!!!!
Because later down the line - if someone else then overhears and reports , they will automatically blame NattyNat OR if eventually NattyNat witnesses something more sinister & reports after the chat with the mother , YET again shell get accused!!!!
Plus from what I know and as others have mentioned - social services are so stretched and won't just go in and IMMEADIATLY take the kids. It's not like that.
NattyNat go with your gut! Perhaps start by doing research and getting advice about reporting first & then take it from there. Good luck:flowers:
---------- Post added at 11:39 ---------- Previous post was at 11:18 ----------
"Unless you want the very real possibility of children being taken of there parents and a couple split up on your conscience, stay out of it. In fact the pressure of social services could make life very much worse for these children."
I don't know how you come to that conclusion??? How about if something dreadful were to happen to these children?? How would your conscience feel then???
Social services, as I've already said before, do not just remove children at a whim, it does NOT happen!!!!! DAMN RIGHT AUNTIE MOOSIE:emot-highfive::emot-highfive:
Col I fully agree with everything you've said too hun :yesyes: :hugs:
gypcyg there will always be different stories about social services and the like. And people who feel that they've been wronged by them will want to have their say, for which they a right to do. The thing is though, when you go looking for sites like that, it will all be full of bad stories and tales of woe, you're not ever going to hear the other side of the coin and you're not ever going to hear the good stories with the good endings :)
Out of interest, where have you got that information about social workers being paid a cash incentive to remove children from families????
I actually take exception to such a theory. Why on earth would a social worker want to just remove children from families where there is no need???? Why would they be paid extra for doing that????? who's paying this money to them????
Do you know, that like many other government agencies, social services, especially their child protection and working with families department, are being stretched to the absolute limit, in regards to funding and staffing levels. There simply wouldn't be money in the pot to pay social workers extra for removing children for no reason.
They also have to go through the court system, yes they have the power to remove children that are considered to be in immediate danger, straight away, but they would then have to go through a court system after that, the parents and family and everyone else involved in that family would also have the opportunity to have their say in court, just like in any other court situation.
I'm am also offended by your calling social workers "n***'s that's a very nasty thing to say and it's really not called for at all :mad:
I've had a lot of social workers through my life, and not one of them has ever been nasty nor has any one of them been a paedophile.
Have you had a tough experience with a social worker?? I'm only interested because you seem very angry towards them for some reason.
Of course, there are bad apples in all walks of life, and of course, mistakes are sometimes made but, on the whole, I feel that mostly things are done correctly.
All I know is that I want every single child to feel safe and secure, I do not want any one child to feel neglected, abused or hurt in anyway, shape or form. Children have as many rights as adults, they have the right to be safe in any circumstances. If you were walking down the road and some awful person came up to you, grabbed you by your hair and then proceeded to punch and kick you, what would be the first thing you would do????? I know I'd be dialing 999 for the police and I'd be wanting that person charged for the damage they had done to me.
So, how do you think that feels if you are a young child, is it okay to do that to a child, just because you're an adult. Would you consider that to be an assault on that child???? I would, and, yes, I'd still do a 999.
Type "Social Services ruin families" into google and read the results before you get those N***'s involved.
Social services get a cash incentive to take children away from parents and put them into adoptive/foster homes.
There are also loads of stories of paedophiles working for social services yet they are allowed to continue their activities for years because the authorities ignore the evidence. So phoning social services may make the situation a lot worse!
Not only is this post wrong in just about every aspect, it doesn't help Nat in the slightest. When faced with a very difficult decision, we have to consider both sides to be able to make an informed choice. Although I don't agree with some of the replies to this thread, they have been a fair representation of the other viewpoint which will help Nat to decide what to do.
I know from personal and professional experience that the above post is an inaccurate and stereotypical view of children's services which belittles the work of the vast majority of social workers who are kind, compassionate people with only the interests of their clients at heart.
Pip
MusicNotes
08-07-13, 20:42
Child protection is EVERYBODY'S responsibility - the argument that social services were already involved with Victoria and Peter ... Well how do you think they became involved?
You should make that call xx
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-511609/How-social-services-paid-bonuses-snatch-babies-adoption.html
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/columnists/christopherbooker/7840626/Big-money-to-be-made-in-the-adoption-trade.html
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/are-overzealous-social-services-acting-on-orders-to-meet-adoption-quotas-394647.html
http://www.forced-adoption.com/introduction.asp
http://nameshamesocialworkers.blogspot.co.uk/2008/08/shame-your-social-worker.html
Remember how social services will stop you caring for a child if you are too old, overweight or a smoker. Keep social services away from your children or you will regret it!!!!
Secret courts which lead to prison sentences if you dare speak out against injustice or even mention your case to a friend, family member, the Media or even your local MP! What kind of system needs those kinds of measures in place? A corrupt one!!!
Cash incentives for every child they adopt - yes it sounds unbelievable but guess what - its true - God help those children. The British government has been stealing children for generations - look at the kids sent to Australia.
Baby P and Victoria Climbie have both been mentioned - what did social services do to help them?
Neighbours and family members should always be given the chance to help first. The internet is full of stories of parents pining for their forcibly removed child/children. Social services can make any accusation they like and parents are either ignored or demonised.
Why do people consider Social workers with such high regard? They are people of limited intelligence (just like all us) who have been given a position of power - and we know what happens when people of limited intelligence are given positions of power don't we.
Finally my comment about social services being infiltrated by paedo's http://pbepring.blogspot.co.uk/
I personally know men who were abused as children by social workers amongst others - the Waterhouse enquiry was a cover-up and paedophilia is rife amongst children's care homes. The neighbour may shout and smack the kids but is there a possibility that the situation could become a lot worse?
If you are going to pull apart what I have written then please come back with facts.
AuntieMoosie
09-07-13, 03:30
I feel that I've already stated "facts"
As I have already mentioned, I have first hand experience of social workers, I have seen them at work, and I've had their help and guidance throughout many years of my life. What more "facts" do you want me to explain please??
Okay, let's break this down a bit and talk about it bit by bit. You say.........
"Remember how social services will stop you caring for a child if you are too old, overweight or a smoker. Keep social services away from your children or you will regret it!!!!"
Where on earth you get this information from I just can't even imagine, but you are dreadfully mistaken. Social workers would NOT remove children because of any of these reasons, that is a fact, why not phone them and ask them??
I think though where you may be confused is that years back people who wanted to foster or adopt were under very strict criteria, and it is true that couples were turned down because of what you have mentioned, I think you will find that the criteria has been changed an awful lot since then though, but I really have never heard of a case of a child being removed from it's birth family due to those reasons alone.
"Secret courts which lead to prison sentences if you dare speak out against injustice or even mention your case to a friend, family member, the Media or even your local MP! What kind of system needs those kinds of measures in place? A corrupt one!!!"
I'm completely baffled by your above statement. Where are these "secret courts"?? I think with this one you may be getting confused with the data protection act, which you will find, we all have to adhere too. Remember these children will grow up and it's really not fair for their personal and family details to be out there in the public, heaven only knows they've gone through enough, without having everyone knowing their private background. I would imagine that the reason that the media would not get involved is because of the delicate nature of these cases, but I certainly do NOT think, neither have I seen or heard any evidence of any sort of "corrupt" system. I think you'll find that social workers are under just the same spotlight as a lot of other professions, they do have to answer for their actions, their not on some sort of "free for all"
"Cash incentives for every child they adopt - yes it sounds unbelievable but guess what - its true - God help those children. The British government has been stealing children for generations - look at the kids sent to Australia."
Sorry but I really don't believe this to be true at all, I just cannot believe that that would be happening. Just why, oh why, would anyone want to break up a family, remove children in the most horrendous of situations and place those children into care??? Please look at it rationally, I'm sorry but I just can't get my head around this one at all???
The British government "stealing children"???? what the heck for??? The children that you are talking about that were sent to Australia, were NOT "stolen" but, yes, I will agree with you that what happened way back then was utterly disgusting and wrong. As far as I can remember, I think it was David Cameron who stood up in the Houses of Parliament and made a formal apology to all of those effected by that. But you're talking about something that happened many years ago, and things were very different back then, I cannot see anything like that ever happening again, at least, I hope and pray that it doesn't.
"Baby P and Victoria Climbie have both been mentioned - what did social services do to help them?"
I agree with you in that case, I'm not going to defend any of the professionals who were involved in those cases. I think we all know that massive mistakes were made, which were unforgivable and which lead to 2 children loosing their lives :weep:
But, as I've said, we all in life make mistakes, humans will always make mistakes, that's what makes us human. I'm not in any way excusing it or defending it as it should NOT ever happen, but it does sadly.
But just try and put yourself in the shoes of a social worker. I know it's a job that I'd never want to do. How do you make your decisions?? How can you judge and decide whether children really are in danger or not?? I'd hate to be faced with such decisions. Social workers, do though, in my opinion get the rough end of the stick whichever way they decide to go, they're dammed if they do and they're dammed if they don't.
"Neighbours and family members should always be given the chance to help first. The internet is full of stories of parents pining for their forcibly removed child/children. Social services can make any accusation they like and parents are either ignored or demonised."
I'm sorry but the above statement is NOT true. Social services cannot make any accusation they like!!! For goodness sake, they have to be answerable to the courts, they have to follow the laws of this land in exactly the same way that we do, no one, whatever and whoever they are, are above the law.
Parents are NOT ignored either, I know this first hand believe me. But where the tables have turned, and rightly so in my mind, is that now, it is only the safety and well being of the children that are considered, parents are still listened too and are included in decision making, but it has to be the childrens interests that are put first and foremost. Surly that's just the way it should be.
Also I know for a fact, that social workers will always try to keep children within their own families before they take any action to remove them. The families of both sides are considered and are usually preferred to that of placing children outside of their families. Now obviously and sadly this cannot always be done for reasons of child protection and if the social worker believes that the children would still be at risk then there really isn't any alternative.
"Why do people consider Social workers with such high regard? They are people of limited intelligence (just like all us) who have been given a position of power - and we know what happens when people of limited intelligence are given positions of power don't we."
I really cannot agree with your statement that social workers are of "limited intelligence" they have to go to university and study for a degree, they then have to undergo placements and training on the job, where they would be supervised by a qualified social worker, that doesn't strike me as someone with "limited intelligence"
I do hold them with high regard probably due to my background and the way in which I have been helped by them. I hold them in the same regard as I would lots of other professions.
I'm not going to make out that they are all perfect or angels because that would be untrue, but the majority are lovely, kind hearted and caring people, well maybe I should say, the one's that I've met have been.
"Finally my comment about social services being infiltrated by paedo's
I personally know men who were abused as children by social workers amongst others - the Waterhouse enquiry was a cover-up and paedophilia is rife amongst children's care homes. The neighbour may shout and smack the kids but is there a possibility that the situation could become a lot worse?"
On this one, some of what you say is correct. Sadly, actually, tragically, paedophiles will infiltrate anywhere they can if it gives them access to children. This includes, schools, nurseries, the brownies, the cubs, the church choir and the list goes on and on.
But this is why we each have to be alert and watchful, each and everyone of us and is even more the reason why I say that any suspicion, no matter who it is that you're suspecting, has to be reported. Now we don't all want to go around snooping and putting everyone under suspicion, we have to keep rational and clear thinking about it all. Thankfully the majority of children are in safe and loving families and are safe as they go about the day to day activities, but sadly, we must always remember those that may not be, and where we think there may be a problem, we need to alert the authorities, the safety of that child/children is of extreme importance.
I also agree in part to what you have said about abuse being carried out in SOME childrens homes. Thankfully, and to my knowledge, this wasn't going on in my childrens home. I feel so saddened and so angry for those children that it did happen too and my heart goes out to them, I can only imagine what that must have been like for them :weep:
There are not many childrens homes left in the UK now. To my knowledge, I believe that the homes that do exist are special units doing very special work with children for various reasons.
Mostly children are placed with foster families or adoptive families.
There's never, ever going to be a full proof way of dealing with some of this stuff, it's very emotive, we all have different opinions for different reasons, which doesn't make any one of us right or wrong, it just means that we think differently :)
The only experience I have of Social Services was when my friend's son's school reported concerns and she was investigated. The boy is quite severely autistic and by 8 years old was still in nappies and not speaking. My friend felt the school were not educating him very well, and so she decided to home educate her son. Now, there have been some cases where parents have removed their children from school just so they can abuse/neglect them with no one noticing, so wheb the school informed social services that an 8-year-old boy who never speaks and still wears nappies was being removed from school, you can understand why they were concerned.
My friend decided to be open and honest with Social Services. She told them about her son's autism and showed them diagnostic reports, appointment letters showing she was addressing her son's speech and continence issues, allowed them to observe her and her child learning some Maths, showed her lesson plans.
If Social Setvices were looking to fulfil some quota, they had the perfect opportunity here with this child who was clearly not normal, being cut off from the outside world by the mother who made him wear nappies. Her confidence was already knocked by the school criticising her parenting skills for years. But instead they were very sensible about the whole thing, recognised the boy's difficulties were caused by his autism, and that the school's allegations were clearly malicious.
They do have to investigate reports, but they most certainly do not appear to be removing children just for the sake of some quota. The issue with Baby P and Victoria Climbie was more that they failed to remove them when perhaps they should have, not the other way around. It's an imperfect system run by imperfect people, but that doesn't mean they are going to steal children who are best off remaining with their parents.
There have been some good replies to this thread but I am now closing it as I no longer think it's helping NattyNatt with the original question she raised.
Pip
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions Inc. All rights reserved.