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ConfusedByLife
02-12-06, 15:19
I am a strong believer in Darwins theory of evolution and natural selection. The thing which is baffling me at the moment is why do these anxious genes still exist today. From what I can see there are many millions of people suffering from anxiety disorders round the world which plague their lives, but still the genes are passed on from generation to generation. I know my anxious genes come from my mothers side of the family (many suffer from anxiety) and is why i am not having kids to pass these genes on. The question is then. If these anxious genes are so bad, why in evolutionary terms do they still exist. Is there some evolutionary benefit in having an anxiety dissorder? Cuz i can't think of one. Will people be anxious still in millions of years time or will the anxious people have "died out"?

eeyorelover
03-12-06, 03:31
Well I don't know if I should reply or not cuz I definitely don't believe in evolution but something came to mind when I read your post.

Personally I think that alot of the problem isn't as much genetics as it is lifestyle and the faster pace of today's world. Think about it - have you ever read about anxiety problems in say the 1800's? Not really as prevalent in part because their diets were more balanced. They went to bed and got up at a set time. And there weren't all the gadgets that make our lives so hectic today - ex. cell phones, emails, answering machines.
I also think that part of the reason anxiety is so widespread now may have something to do with the toxicity of our world.
Our air and water are polluted. We use chemicals for everything from washing our bodies and clothes to adding it to our foods for preserving.
I know that people can have a genetic disposition to certain ailments but in my opinion, alot of what ails us could be caused by our environment and time that we live in.
xxx
Sandy

ConfusedByLife
03-12-06, 14:07
I agree that a large part of our anxiety comes from our experience rather than our genes, but I think people are genetically disposed to anxiety. As I said, I know it runs very far back in my mums side of the family, but not my dads. I am very like my mum. In my case it was exam stress that seemed to push me over the edge, but I was always shy and quiet from childhood. I also agree with the fact that todays lifestyles are far more stressfull and hectic which only exagerates the problem, but I think the fact that people are more aware of the terms "social anxiety" and "panic attacks" etc, and the fact that we can communicate with people across the globe now means we are much more educated and aware of the problems. Im sure these problems existed millenia ago as a way of avoiding predators etc, but ppl were unaware of them/misunderstood as mad or simply could not find like minded ppl and so hid their problems.

ksmith
03-12-06, 17:04
This debate centres around the nature/nurture argument. However, if anxiety were simply genetic, then surely by now scientists would have identified the gene?

I believe I have learned this behaviour from my mother who in turn learned it from her mother (my gran) who was always referring to her 'nerves'. I used to wonder what she meant when she said things like "oh, me nerves are bad today" and think to myself, well, we all have nerves in our bodies. Today, I'm all too keenly aware that she meant her anxiety and stress levels were raised!!

Also agree with previous post about pace of life and toxins etc. Darwin was probably right about the survival of the fittest when observing animal behaviour but humans are far too complex for this simplistic theory to be applied. Afterall, if humans observed this theory then there would be no disabled or gay people in society!! Don't not have children just on the strength of some mad old guy from another era!!!

Kayx

mico
17-12-06, 16:27
The old nature v nurture debate, but an interesting question all the same...

You're right in the fact that anxiety dissorders are very common in our current society, perhaps greatly more prevalent than our survival warrants. My thoughts, from the top of my head, are this:

Anxiety is unarguably beneficial to our survival. Otherwise, if we didn't fear life threatening scenarios or more to the point, death itself, we wouldn't get very far. But, as has already been mentioned, the pace and volatility of today's society is something never seen before in history. When you couple this with the fact that a healthy level of anxiety must be so finely tuned so as not to tip the scales one way or the other there is every possibility of it tipping when exposed to our new culture.

However, it is not only the pace of our society. Cultures have always been threatened with danger far more real than most of us are exposed to today. For example the danger of not being able to feed yourself come teatime. Obviously cultures throughout history have been subject to vast quantities of stress and stress has never been so unjustifiable as it is today as we live out our simple, secure lives, sipping tea and smokin' cigars. I believe there's two major reasons for the surge of this unjustifiable stress.

Firstly, we are constantly put under pressure to multi-task. Modern technology gives us the power to talk on the phone, send emails, make the dinner, listen to music and organize day out for the kids all at the same time. It's overload. And because that technology's there, we're expected to utilize it. A multi-tasking society is an unhealthy society in my opinion, it provides nothing but mental chaos and ironically slows down productivity.

Secondly, because of the comforts that have been handed down to us through our technological achievments we have too much time to think. Without thought you are without stress.




'Security is mostly superstition. It does not exist in nature, nor do the children of men as a whole experience it. Avoiding Danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. Life is either a daring adventure, or nothing.'

Piglet
17-12-06, 16:43
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote"> I used to wonder what she meant when she said things like "oh, me nerves are bad today" and think to myself, well, we all have nerves in our bodies. Today, I'm all too keenly aware that she meant her anxiety and stress levels were raised!!
Kayx

<div align="right">Originally posted by ksmith - 03 December 2006 : 16:04:22</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">

I used to hear people say this when I was young and thought it meant either their skin was sore or that movement may be painful - unfortunately I now know different!!

Really interesting thread with some top replies :)

Piglet x

"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.

sandie
17-12-06, 19:27
Hi everyone

I know it might seem odd to a lot of you, but whilst I have leanings towards the science belief of evolution, I also have a faith and belief in God, Jesus and Christianity.

With regards to anxiety and genetics, I think its more true to say its 'familial' ie, a predisposition in families because it is "learnt" behaviour. Our parents, and to a lesser degree other family members are our first role models, and we copy them. If one or more of our parents are 'anxious' people, who constantly worry about certain or all aspects of their life, would it not follow that we are going to mimic them? Certainly, my brother and I have both become anxious adults, having been exposed from a very early age to both parents constantly worrying and being anxious about almost everything in their lives. They were (and my mum still is), very negative people, for whom in their own words " nothing but bad luck happened). I've been fortunate at times in my life to have the influence of other significant people who have had a more positive effect, and whilst this has lessened my anxiety overall, and specifically at certain times, I know that I have some extremely deep-rooted anxiety issues.

I think the whole nature/nurture argument for most of what we as individuals become in our personality and characater, is more heavily weighted to the nurture.

Great Debate

Sandie

ConfusedByLife
17-12-06, 20:49
Thanks for replies guys. For a while there i thought i was the only person who found this interesting, lol. I think Mico's points about multi-tasking and increased pace of life seem to be a large contributing factor to increased rates of anxiety and other mental health disorders, which, again brings me back to my initial thought that todays lifestyle seems to be getting out of control. This makes me think those people prone to anxiety (be it nature or nuture) will be "overtaken" by so called "fitter" people, as they will find it easier to cope. I dont know what the answer is but it seems our bodies, originally designed for primitive life (with the fight or flight response etc) are becoming more and more ill equiped for todays lives and it may take many thousands of years for this to evolve out of the gene pool. Sorry if I go on, but I often think about philosophical things like this and find it fascinating. Too much time on my hands i guess. lol