Does Depression Progress over time

[superjonboy]

I'm curious to hear other peoples experiences with depression.

Over time, do bouts of depression become more severe? Like if you had depression but then came through it, then had it again - came through it only to have another bout, is it any more likely to become a more severe form of depression like bi polar or to feature psychosis?

I've been told in the past that things like psychosis are genetic and they are triggered. Does that mean that they are highly likely to be triggered during your first major bout of depression?

It's not like a thing where by your 5th or 6th episode of major depression it becomes psychotic or something?

MY latest problems seem to have kick started with low mood. Over the last few days I've struggled to laugh or enjoy anything. My wife and my parents have tried to get me talking and laughing but I find it really hard and often when something seems funny I end up crying because I don't seem to be able to laugh. Tonight was a little better with a funny film we watched that made me chuckle a few times, but still worried about how down I feel.

[MyNameIsTerry]

You can definitely experience more intense depression when relapsing as many people do which can make it harder to recover as all the negative thinking style just becomes more ingrained.

Genes are triggered and can remain non triggered if good health is maintained, the form of science being epigenetics, but I don't know about how this works with more serious psychological disorders.

However, what I do know is a lot of anxiety disorder sufferers ask the same questions.

Plus I've read NHS leaflets that say you wouldn't realise if you had certain ones because you wouldn't identify your behaviour as anything other than normal.

If you were bipolar you would experience the mania. Do you?

[superjonboy]

Thanks Terry.

I don't think so.

People would have noticed I guess.

I know I'm kind of looking for the reassurance that - "Im not going to have a psychotic break" - which is definitely an anxious behaviour.

[MyNameIsTerry]

I think we all do seek some reassurance until we learn more about all these disorders, but it must be more challenging for you with it being the form your HA had taken.

Its also a very hidden form compared to those HA sufferers who are triggered by physical symptoms. I wonder if your focus is similar to those who experience this like headaches of eye pain and make the link to brain conditions?

I think if you suffered the mania side, once you learned about the symptoms you wound be able to spot it as well. There are some people on here who know more about bipolar and a few threads have been posted a month or so ago on the GAD board about those concerns.

[superjonboy]

I do get the physical worries too. When I'm really bad it can be about anything.

[MyNameIsTerry]

Do you mean anything as in anything including other than about your health? If so, that sounds like GAD.

So, you could have more than one disorder to tackle.

When my GAD gets really bad, usually when going onto medication, I find I start experiencing some agoraphobia, social anxiety and most likely my intense focus on symptoms strays quite close to HA.

[superjonboy]

Hi Terry,

Sorry I meant anything about my health.

On and off I've been like this since 2001. There have been periods where I've lived perfectly normal life though, when I'm on the medication and it's working.

I'm trying to convince myself that if I was going to have a psychotic break it would have happened by now with everything I've been through.

[anthrokid]

The majority of people who will experience psychosis will have their first episode before they are 30 years old, usually between the ages of 15 and 25. It is quite uncommon for someone to experience their first psychotic episode after 30 years old, and often those psychotic symptoms are related to particular stressors - e.g. pregnancy, dementia, trauma, etc. There is no association, that I know of, between the number of relapses of depression and the development of psychosis.

[superjonboy]

In my youth I used to smoke weed quite a lot (really regret it now) and I did also experiment with other drugs LSD, Ecstasy. I was young and stupid I guess.

From what I've learned, Marijuana seems to be one of the triggers of psychosis.

I'm thinking that if I was susceptible to psychosis then all the stuff I was doing back in my teens and early 20's would have triggered it. Either that or one of my previous bouts of anxiety/depression.

[SADnomore]

I'm thinking you're right. :winks:

---------- Post added at 11:42 ---------- Previous post was at 11:04 ----------

p.s. I think your fear of a psychotic break when you are very depressed or anxious is pretty common, and, pretty logical as well. Kind of like when we are physically ill, and it's so bad we begin to fear we must be dying. Anyone who has been really very ill knows that "expectation/fear". And I, for one, have been so bad off mentally that I was quite sure I must indeed be on the edge of insanity. ... But I wasn't! As you say, when you are on a medication(s) that are working well, you're fine. For what it's worth, my last bout of active SAD was the worst yet, I wasn't even functional. It hurt to breathe. Every single sad moment or guilt-ridden memory I had experienced played over and over in my mind, and I stopped wanting to engage with anyone at all. Fast-forward to this winter, and with the right medication, I'm doing great!

You say you haven't had an episode of mania, which is a good sign by now that you don't suffer bipolar, as Terry said. And the bit about kind of "not being worried" when one does have a psychosis rings true, too. I remember meeting a youngster of 16 while in hospital who said her "parents had just told" her she had schizophrenia. The doctors were working out the meds for her, and she seemed surprised to learn this. It hadn't occurred to her at all. The psychiatrist I saw while there said that in fact, where such disorders don't already exist, our minds are stronger than we think and we don't just "go crazy" because we have severe depression or anxiety. We may feel like we are, but we're not. "I know "crazy"", he said, and you're not "crazy"". Lol! ... So all in all, honestly, it seems you've dodged a bullet, and instead have garden variety depression and accompanying anxiety as well, lol! You are right though that narcotics use (and yes, marijuana is a narcotic) and LSD can cause psychoses, some of which are life-long. Bit of a crapshoot that way, recreational drugs, although it doesn't get mentioned enough. And yes, unfortunately, once you have an anxiety disorder, it would be highly unusual for drugs like that to not trigger a serious bout of anxiety. Alcohol will tend to do this too. Good luck with treatment, just try to stop worrying about psychosis now and focus on climbing out of the hole. You can and you will! xx
Marie

[superjonboy]

Thanks for your post Marie.

All these worries I've had for the past 10 - 15 years so I just need to focus on doing what I did before to get better.

January seems to be a bad time of year for me, when I've had these bad issues before.

Thanks,

John

[SADnomore]

Hmmm. Have you ever considered that you may have Seasonal Affective Disorder (SAD)? This form of depression can be very severe at times. Mine is accompanied by GAD, which is pretty common, and gets bad too.

[superjonboy]

Yeah I've thought about it before.

It normally always starts with worry and panic though. Just this time it started with me feeling really down.

[crystal17]

Hi

I think depression's effects can certainly get worse over time. This is just my experience though, and is directly tied to the relationship I'm in.

It has kind of crept up, some of the time over the last few years has blurred into one very long day, and although sometimes I'd say I'm no different than before, I occasionally see a photo and realise that theres a different look in my eyes that was there, that has gone now.

Theres a weird emptiness or void now, and as though things I enjoy are just temporary.

Hope this hasn't made you feel worse! I do believe though that there is hope, and you must hold onto that too somehow, even if 99% of your being is struggling, fight for that 1% that believes in a happy future.

[superjonboy]

I've taken my first Sertraline tablet this morning. 100mg.

Definitely did good on these before so hoping they help me again this time.

[lior]

Well done for taking that step! I've also just started on meds, Day 4. Must be the time of year, wabbit1 has just started on meds too.

This is my second bout of severe depression. I don't think it's any worse than the last time. There's more out-of-control episodes, but I'm also more able to get out the house than last time. I think.

[superjonboy]

Thanks Lior.

I've only been off Sertraline for about 5 months. Do you think it should start to work fairly quickly and I should oly get the same side effects as last time?

Really worried it will make me manic/psychotic :weep:

[lior]

You know how unlikely that is :)

My doctor said that the side effects will be familiar - so I doubt I'll get any new ones. It's possible I guess but I'm not worried. The effects of being depressed are much worse than the side effects of Citalopram! So what if I feel nauseous and a bit disconnected - when I'm depressed I can barely do anything, I can't concentrate, I'm low and impulsive... side effects of meds are nothing compared to living with depression without them.

If you're on them, it's worth it. The side effects will most likely be worth it.

[superjonboy]

Its just so hard.

Last time on Sertraline I was able to get back into full time employment. I had a few side effects at the start but I think these could have been anxiety anyway.

I just don't want it to take forever to get better again. Or for it to get worse with the psychosis and mania I'm worrying about.

[lior]

That's great that you got back into work. That's what I'm hoping for too.

Medication takes 4-8 weeks to kick in, as far as I know... it gets easier if you accept that it will just take time.

[SADnomore]

Please tell your fears that your meds are not going to make you psychotic. And if you have never had an episode of mania before, then you're not manic-depressive and need not fear the meds. Hang tight, get through the start-up side effects, and it is very likely that the med that helped you before will do you good once again! :D

[superjonboy]

Thank you.

I just hope the medication works again and it doesn't take too long.

I feel like at the minute I can't face my work which is obviously not good :weep:

[SADnomore]

I needed to hang about the house the first while. With a blanket and the laptop and water for sipping. I found this site kept me going. All the support, and advice and tips. Like eating regularly. Drinking lots of water. Some people barely notice side effects. Me, I was grateful I didn't have to leave the house. So spacey and tired. Restless but couldn't do more than just sit, really. It's kind of like a job on it's own, startup is. You're doing fine! :D

[superjonboy]

I'm having terrible fears of going manic.

Worrying that when I've had these really bad times in the past that they have misdiagnosed me.

[superjonboy]

Well last night was tough. It was my brothers birthday and my parents and brother came to our house for a few hours for some food. I normally love spending time with my family but I found it really difficult which made me sad. Constant fear of schizophrenia or bipolar. Kind of ruined the evening for my brother which left me feeling down.

I managed to get some sleep last night though. Tried to stop reading about bipolar/schiz and red up on health anxiety/depression and tried to do relaxation and read a book before falling asleep.

A few of the things that make me feel I could have been manic in the past are:




I went through a really reckless period of gambling. I took out credit cards/loans and ended up throwing a lot of money away on gambling.
I was almost desperate to find another girlfriend after my previous relationship broke up. I had a few short relationships and then I got with my wife in summer 2006. I'd proposed by the end of the year.
For a while I became obsessed with my wifes ex partners. Like how many she had been with e.t.c.
During this period I again maxed a credit card out and did some gambling. Most of the money was spent on my wife, holiday, Christmas and an engagement ring.
I had another period of gambling in 2010 where I would get a Wonga loan and use it to gamble with. I actually won a lot of money and spent a lot of it on fishing tackle.


All of those things happened when I was on medication (Citalopram or Sertraline). In between some of those periods when I've not been on medication I've had episodes of extreme anxiety with depression.

[MyNameIsTerry]

I think you need to think about this from a different perspective.

People are afraid of things like bipolar because all we see in the media are the extremes. I remember meeting a lady who was bipolar and I had no idea. She was rebuilding her life successfully after she had got the help she needed.

I get that schizophrenia would be more scary but that is very different as you into hallucinations, delusions, not being in touch with reality, etc which doesn't seem like you.

[superjonboy]

Thanks Terry.

I don't know why I do this to myself. I've been told by doctors, mental health nurses, psychiatrists that I have Anxiety (Healthy) and depression.

The consultant psychiatrist actually told me that in some cases things like schizophrenia are easier to treat than anxiety/depression.

This latest episode seemed to start more with low mood but all the same old traits are here again. Googling, checking, avoidance e.t.c.

[MyNameIsTerry]

Its the classic health anxiety cycle they talk about on the HA board.

Logically you know they are right but your subconscious just keeps sending the worrying symptoms along with the associated thoughts of what you fear and your Cognitive/conscious mind struggles to stop it and you feel compelled to take the next step.

Many of us worry about developing more serious mental illness, we just don't have that added compulsion that makes it HA. I've had these concerns and I have several forms of OCD so why didn't I progress onto HA? Who knows, its just all so strange and unknown.

Its interesting that he said anxiety disorders can be harder to treat. I guess its the diversity and or capacity to use the power of our minds to analyse it and makeourselves treatment resistant by questioning those trying to help us.

[SADnomore]

I think you've hit the nail on the head, Terry. By applying every scrap of online info that would confirm the fears to oneself, it becomes easier to believe Dr Google than one's own physician. Who, by the way, actually has one's health records PLUS his own experience with testing and diagnosing and treating or referring on for treatment others with the 'feared condition' and the ability to closely compare them to oneself. Neither of which this plethora of sites has. Instead, it's an anxiety disorder run riot on the internet, cherry-picking some symptoms and ignoring others to feed itself. With more anxiety.

And so the physician is discounted as having surely "missed something" that Dr Google (unbridled Anxiety) has "diagnosed". This will be the same response to being prescribed medication. It will be "researched" online and rejected due to "side effects" or remote possibilities of harm that are also cherry-picked and stacked against the good they might do.

Terry, I'm same as you, burdened with different forms of OCD all my life, and yet somehow not developing health anxiety (although I have a sister who does). As such, I am able to also consider recovery from all sorts of conditions and diseases. Why does someone with health anxiety not go a bit further and "play the tape to the end" when "researching" these things? Schizophrenia and bi-polar are successfully treated and supported, perhaps because patients are motivated towards getting well ... not being sick?

Superjonboy, I wonder if you could bring yourself to google "hope" "treatment" "recovery" "coping" and the like in conjunction with bi-polar and schizophrenia. Just a shot in the dark here. I realize ha isn't "logical", but if you remain convinced that you have one of these, then at least you will learn about the good outcomes you can have. Type them together in the google box. Tap enter. What have you got to fear from doing that? That you will be allright? xx
:hugs:
Marie

[MyNameIsTerry]

Hi Marie,

I wonder if its because until you read about them, all you know is what you have seen which unless you have known people with it comes back to the media and soap opera & dramas.

If I forget what I've read, all I have left is:

1. Bipolar as shown in soap operas as a) highly erratic people b) limited social skills & intelligence c) sleeping around d) so depressed they appear catatonic e) attempts to take their lives.

Who wouldn't be afraid of that?! But thats the sensationalised view to get ratings. They often portray those on medication as unemotional zombies. Of course, they do the same with antidepressants.

I just think how intelligent & socially capable Stephen Fry is.

2. Schizophrenics are portrayed as the violent knife wielding types randomly attacking people in the streets or rocking in corners fighting the voices off.

Again, sensationalised rubbish. Who wouldn't be terrified by the possibility of that?!

Its often the same in that they portray depression as the people who go into hospital which we all know is nothing like the truth and only for those who are the extremes and at risk.

So, its no wonder the OP is afraid and I'm putting this here not to shock and if it does OP, tell me and I will delete it, but I'm hoping it will show what many of us probably perceive and why its important to use official resources to get educated about it.

Before I read about OCD I had no idea about how diverse it was and didn't think I was suffering from it. Again, per the media view its something that causes hoarding, excessive cleaning, checking light switches, checking windows & locks. The cases are also trivialised to make silly programmes like house swapping an obsessive cleaner with a hoarder to show the clean up. Victorian freak show TV.

It was a comfort to read & understand it. Before this I thought I was losing control of my mind and a weirdo which just adds to the negative thoughts.

[pulisa]

Brilliant posts, Marie and Terry. I wholeheartedly agree with your views.

[superjonboy]

Thanks for the posts.

It all makes good sense.