View Full Version : How did you get over Insomnia?
Crystalhiggs
27-03-15, 07:34
Hi there, I'm just reducing trazodone as can't bear the side effects. It's been 3 weeks. I'm also taking zopiclone and want to get off it (4 weeks on that). But I still can't sleep so im scared! I don't want to be addicted to zopiclone but only took half a 3.75mg last night and haven't slept a wink!
Please help if you can! I hate taking pills!
Hi there.iv been on trazadone 200mg now for month and didnt get any side effects while on it.but when i was on zopiclone,i slept for the first week,then didnt sleep anymore.after increasing it my sleep got worse..when i cut down and come off it,i got rebound insomnia.worse then it was while on it.this lasted for a couple of weeks.then my sleep started to return as normal.give it time for your body to adjust back to normal.also i take 5 mg of olanzipine at night,which i find realy helps me to sleep
patience and hard work ,I finally got better by accepting that i wasnt going to get a good nights sleep.Slowly my sleep returned to normal,I also take Olanzapine that really helps a lot,it doesnt knock you out but seems to stop the racing thoughts and keeps you asleep
This book was also a great help to me and is recommended http://www.anxietynomore.co.uk/the_book.html
Crystalhiggs
27-03-15, 09:46
Thank you both for your replies. I haven't heard of olanzapine is it like diazepam? Is it addictive? I just want to sleep normally again! Looks like it's a rocky road ahead. MrAndy how long would you say it took to return to normal? I'm much more into natural remedies but can't find anything that works for this!
Olanzipine is non adictive.5mg is a low dose but has a sedative effect.i take mine about 10pm then goto bed around 11 ish..i am able to drift off and find i get about 9-10 hrs sleep most nights.works really well and helped me so much through a very bad patch of insomnia that i thought would never go
Thank you both for your replies. I haven't heard of olanzapine is it like diazepam? Is it addictive? I just want to sleep normally again! Looks like it's a rocky road ahead. MrAndy how long would you say it took to return to normal? I'm much more into natural remedies but can't find anything that works for this!
Olanzapine is an anti psychotic and nothing like diazepam which is addictive
good info on it here http://www.crazymeds.us/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Meds/Zyprexa ,its very good for general anxiety and agitation I have no side effects from it except some initial weight gain that has stabilized
I dont want to scare you but its took nearly two years but I was also very ill and admitted to a psych unit for a while.Acceptance was the turning point for me and the lack of sleep.I still have bad nights and go through rough patches but mostly its back to normal.In my opinion and experience natural remedies dont work for chronic sleep problems
Crystalhiggs
27-03-15, 10:16
Thanks Greg, I'm glad you found something that worked for you. I would so love to have an unbroken long sleep! How long did you take zopiclone for? I've been on it 4 weeks, it only gives me 4/5 hours a night (3.75mg) so not even getting a great sleep from it! Just do scared of being addicted which I probably am already :(
---------- Post added at 10:13 ---------- Previous post was at 10:07 ----------
Hi Andy thanks for your reply. 2 years, wow that does sound scary!!! I have to get off these meds but will speak to my doctor about Olanzapine. I suffer lately from bad anxiety but it's quite a recent thing for me. Just want to feel normal again! Thanks for the book recommendation will have a look at it. Good luck to you it sounds like you've had it tough :(
---------- Post added at 10:16 ---------- Previous post was at 10:13 ----------
Ps Andy how long were you on Zopiclone altogether?
Thanks Greg, I'm glad you found something that worked for you. I would so love to have an unbroken long sleep! How long did you take zopiclone for? I've been on it 4 weeks, it only gives me 4/5 hours a night (3.75mg) so not even getting a great sleep from it! Just do scared of being addicted which I probably am already :(
---------- Post added at 10:13 ---------- Previous post was at 10:07 ----------
Hi Andy thanks for your reply. 2 years, wow that does sound scary!!! I have to get off these meds but will speak to my doctor about Olanzapine. I suffer lately from bad anxiety but it's quite a recent thing for me. Just want to feel normal again! Thanks for the book recommendation will have a look at it. Good luck to you it sounds like you've had it tough :(
---------- Post added at 10:16 ---------- Previous post was at 10:13 ----------
Ps Andy how long were you on Zopiclone altogether?
I refused zopiclone even when i was in hospital because its so addictive
You will get back to normal i was extremely ill so dont be put off by how long it took me.
Take one day at a time and dont try and rush things ,try and get some support from your family and doctor having a good support network really helps
good luck and dont be afraid to ask more questions we are all here to help :hugs:
I was on zopiclone for 4 weeks..in the end i was waking at silly times through the night and when i did try and drop off again,i got these bad brain zaps really weird and stoped me going back to sleep..so glad i got off them.there ok for just a couple of nights or the odd night hear and the odd night there,but thats it.after i come off them,my doc gave me tamazipam.they were fantastic.knocked me right out..but i only took them twice a week for a while..
I was on zopiclone for 4 weeks..in the end i was waking at silly times through the night and when i did try and drop off again,i got these bad brain zaps really weird and stoped me going back to sleep..so glad i got off them.there ok for just a couple of nights or the odd night hear and the odd night there,but thats it.after i come off them,my doc gave me tamazipam.they were fantastic.knocked me right out..but i only took them twice a week for a while..
when I was in hospital they used to call temazepam "a pint of lager" because they chilled you out.They also dished them out like sweets to calm everybody down ,irresponsible realy
Yep agree with you there andy..good stuff tho.used to feel very chilled on them
MyNameIsTerry
27-03-15, 10:43
I refused to take Zopiclone the 2nd time even though my GP gave me a prescription for it due to how bad my insomnia affected me when I first started antidepressants.
I found it worked well at first but after a week or so I was really only getting about 6 hours but I would feel badly sedated for almost another 6 and would struggle moving let alone getting out of bed and then it was hours before I could manage more than a biscuit.
It took me months to re-establish a sleep routine but I was at least getting a decent nights sleep to cope after about a week or so. I had taken it solid for a month and then the Crisis Team told me it should have been alternating nights. So, I tried alternating to come off it and it had the effect of a good nights sleeo and then barely anything. This took about a week and then I just stopped then and it was manageable.
So, I think its a matter if how anxious you are and how that may be driving your insomnia. The side effects really threw me from Citalopram (my GP told me it could be loose stools & sweating!) and that would have played a big part in increasing my anxiety and I was worrying a lot about sleep by then.
---------- Post added at 10:43 ---------- Previous post was at 10:42 ----------
when I was in hospital they used to call temazepam "a pint of lager" because they chilled you out.They also dished them out like sweets to calm everybody down ,irresponsible realy
Irresponsible and poor attitude there eh MrAndy? Not very professional of them.
Is Zopiclone more a shandy then? :winks::D
citalopram send me bonkers i just couldnt tolerate it ,it made my lack of sleep even worse and it agitated me so much I would never touch it ever again
MyNameIsTerry
27-03-15, 10:48
Citalopram made me unable to sleep and I was in tears with it and found my stomach in pain but I still couldn't eat even thought I was starving.
Duloxetine was worse though. It didn't affect my sleep, which was strange because when I went up to the norepinephrine starting dose my anxiety was through the roof...I couldn't sit down for hours when I got out of bed afer hours of adrenaline rushes that made me want to sprint a few back-to-back marathons (ever seen the film Crank with Jason Statham? Picture the elevater seen and thats how I felt...without the tent though :blush::D)
Citalopram made me unable to sleep and I was in tears with it and found my stomach in pain but I still couldn't eat even thought I was starving.
Duloxetine was worse though. It didn't affect my sleep, which was strange because when I went up to the norepinephrine starting dose my anxiety was through the roof...I couldn't sit down for hours when I got out of bed afer hours of adrenaline rushes that made me want to sprint a few back-to-back marathons (ever seen the film Crank with Jason Statham? Picture the elevater seen and thats how I felt...without the tent though :blush::D)
ive read on crazy meds about how snris rev your adrenaline up ,its scary stuff and something i would avoid
Its weird because i eventually went on sertraline and i found it very mild to get on and of
I think zopiclone is a night cap of your nans best sherry :winks:
Crystalhiggs
27-03-15, 10:58
Wow, surely there are more natural things that can help! I mean our bodies are equipped to sleep aren't they? I tried citalopram for a day and my anxiety went through the roof so doc put me on trazodone. But I hate it so am now weaning off it, down to 75 for a couple of days then 50 from tomorrow. I don't want to live in a chemically induced stupor! I'm seeing a cognitive hypnotherapist who within a day had my anxiety more manageable, I hope she will also help me sleep. My doctor said yesterday that we'll "have to deal with the zopiclone addiction further down the line". Last week she said I was nowhere near to being addicted. Bit cross about the whole thing really!!! Thanks for all your replies so far. This has to get better doesn't it??? :) mynameisterry that's encouraging that it was only a week coming off zopiclone, I hope it will be that quick for me and then to feel normal again! :)
your body will find a way to restore its natural sleep pattern eventually ,using drugs is a quick fix which doctors love to dish out and move onto the next patient
If something is addictive stay well clear ,its ok say we will deal with it later but its not her having to deal with it is it ? Meds are good if used correctly and in moderation they are also not the miracle cure people have you believe.CBT and Mindfulness can help as well therapy with a good counselor
Crystalhiggs
27-03-15, 11:15
Thanks mrandy I do hope my body will find a way to do it! I'm also having counselling - my doc yesterday also said I need to be referred to psychiatric services!! I said I'm already seeing a counsellor and hypnotherapist (this all only started 5 weeks ago btw) but I think she doesn't know what else to do from a medical perspective. I don't really think I need a psychiatrist who will probably want to put me on more meds! I came out of the surgery feeling worse than when I went in. I'm learning EFT techniques which seem to be helping, tapping the meridian points whilst saying "even though I feel anxious I'm ok". Much more my cup of tea than the medical route which I wish I'd never gone down now!
MyNameIsTerry
27-03-15, 11:22
Crystal, I was only on it a month though so I wouldn't say I was addicted. Have a look on the meds board for threads by Hemps as she has recently come off Zopiclone after being on it for years. SADNoMore (Marie) has also come off it as well I think, well either that or Diazepam I think. They might be able to answer more of your questions about it. I don't believe I was dependant on it but it there was definately some withdrawal to it as Greg said. I just think it messes you around because the fatigue and how it seems to stop your digestion seems too much to me.
Your GP's response is concerning though and she doesn't sound very confident. Hopefully some of the people on here can give you some reassurance though.
Have you tried using guided relaxation, guided visualisation, Mindfulness, white noise/static, etc? Its worth a go. Maybe your hypnotherapist will have some CD's too.
I agree with MrAndy. Despite what the NHS say, these pills cost pennies per dose so they really aren't much to them. The funny thing is, if you look up what the trusts are paying, many of these medications cost them less than we pay as a prescription charge! So, they dish them out and get us out of the surgery quickly.
---------- Post added at 11:22 ---------- Previous post was at 11:17 ----------
ive read on crazy meds about how snris rev your adrenaline up ,its scary stuff and something i would avoid
Its weird because i eventually went on sertraline and i found it very mild to get on and of
I think zopiclone is a night cap of your nans best sherry :winks:
Yeah, I'm sensitive to things like adrenaline rushes as they interact with my asthma as well so I really didn't appreciate them.
Sometimes I've had them and felt very positive, like I could pretty much anything. (thats a bit like cocaine!) I''ve also found that I feel aggresive on some occassions...its like taking anabolics!! :huh: It really makes me wonder about these SNRI's because I have mood swing periods that are there without any triggers and it reminds of what they used to say about steriod users!
Thanks mrandy I do hope my body will find a way to do it! I'm also having counselling - my doc yesterday also said I need to be referred to psychiatric services!! I said I'm already seeing a counsellor and hypnotherapist (this all only started 5 weeks ago btw) but I think she doesn't know what else to do from a medical perspective. I don't really think I need a psychiatrist who will probably want to put me on more meds! I came out of the surgery feeling worse than when I went in. I'm learning EFT techniques which seem to be helping, tapping the meridian points whilst saying "even though I feel anxious I'm ok". Much more my cup of tea than the medical route which I wish I'd never gone down now!
dont be put off seeing a good psychiatrist especially on the nhs ,from my experience once I was out of the GPs hands and under the care of a good psychiatrist my care was twice as good and they didnt want me drugged up to the max.The psychiatrist only put me on a very low dose of olanzapine and reviewed me every month.I was in primary care for about a year and they were brilliant with me,a GPs knowledge of the drugs just isnt good enough and they like to swap and change things to much.Once you get hit with anxiety one thing you need in your life is stability ,that is the ground from which you can slowly improve and move forward from
Crystalhiggs
27-03-15, 11:26
Thanks terry, I have only been on zopiclone for 4 weeks, sometimes I don't take a whole 3.75mg pill so I don't know if I'm addicted yet or if it's just an easy 5 hours sleep. How to tell??? I guess the only way to know is by trying to come off it. My doctor seemed so good at first but now I've lost faith in her. My hypnotherapist has given me a recording to listen to which relaxes me but doesn't quite get me to sleep. Hopefully next week will help some more.
Thanks for being there guys it really helps!!!
welcome to the loony club :)
Crystalhiggs
27-03-15, 11:34
Thanks Andy, I totally freaked out just hearing the term 'psychiatric services'. But what you have said is encouraging - I do want people around who will focus on me and what I want and not just tick things off a checklist! I hope it will help!
MyNameIsTerry
27-03-15, 11:35
Mine were 7.5mg Crystal so I think you will find it easier with it being a lower dose and the fact you don't always take the whole lot. Maybe the dose isn't enough to help you anyway?
I read somewhere (I need to chase this up and post it) that there had been a study on the effects of meditation and that it was comparable to sleep.
Crystalhiggs
27-03-15, 11:48
welcome to the loony club :)
Haha, thank you for being so welcoming!!! :D
---------- Post added at 11:46 ---------- Previous post was at 11:36 ----------
Mine were 7.5mg Crystal so I think you will find it easier with it being a lower dose and the fact you don't always take the whole lot. Maybe the dose isn't enough to help you anyway?
I read somewhere (I need to chase this up and post it) that there had been a study on the effects of meditation and that it was comparable to sleep.
Oh well that makes me feel a bit better, I'm going to have to get off the trazodone first then by next Friday I should be ok to start the zop withdrawal properly.
So tired today after no sleep last night!!! And my son is off sick and I'm having a new kitchen fitted! So no respite for me whatsoever today! :ohmy:
---------- Post added at 11:48 ---------- Previous post was at 11:46 ----------
Meant to add yes I need to start meditating!!!
MyNameIsTerry
27-03-15, 12:01
See how you feel after reducing the traz. I know my GP always said they were ok to prescribe for 4 weeks.
Don't use my example of cycling off though as I only did that because the Crisis Team said I should have been taking it that way. So, I corrected of it and then dropped it completely after a week. I wasn't on here then so had no clue how to do any of this. My GP tapered my off Citalopram at 50% which I now know is not the recommendation, although it didn't bother me much luckily. I'm not convinced about the Crisis Teams advice either now after being on here.
Is it this current stress of your son being unwell and the upheaval that has sparked the insomnia? If so, perhaps it will improve after this finishes?
Don't worry about psychiatric services, its natural to conjure up images of the men in white coats but it's far from that. Getting access to a psychiatrist is going to do fast more for you than a GP.
Crystalhiggs
27-03-15, 12:08
I will see my gp next Thursday and ask her how to do it sensibly. We have had a lot of renovations lately so lots of people in the house, can't relax and I don't go out to work so I guess this is part of it. But I had an operation last year and was back in hosp in January with some complications and I think it's a delayed reaction from the trauma of that. Combined with a house full of decorators and workmen! Not my son though, he's only been off 2 days and actually he's good company. :) thanks for the advice :)
hi people hope that we are having a good day. Have been to my doctors this morning as i have been on trazodone for the last 3 weeks and initially it was good to put me to sleep for about 5 -6hrs but over the last 4 days the sedation has decreased and am only getting around 2-3hrs a night.Walking round like a zombie not able to think straight so went to docs who i eventually managed to coax into giving me 7 tablets of 3.75 zoplicone that she says i should take one every 3 or 4 nights. My anxiety has increased over the last 4 days and i can only put it down to lack of sleep as my situation has not changed in the last 2 months and my anxiety levels have been about the same. Hopefully 100mg trazodone and 3.75mg zoplicone will have some sort of sedative effect and allow me to get a better nights sleep. Does anyone have the experience of taking the same dosages at all. Thanks in advance
Crystalhiggs
27-03-15, 13:45
Hi yes this is exactly what I have been taking! I was getting 8 hours a night on this - 3.5 from traz then taking zop and getting 4.5 hours. Which was great but what happens afterwards? The trazodone has sent my anxiety through the roof so last night went down to 75 and then will drop to 50 tomorrow and come off it next week. But the zopiclone I have been on for 4 weeks now most nights (3.75mg or often less) and I need to stop it. But then what I don't know hence this discussion. Going to have to brave it alone and try to get used to sleeping naturally again. I think it's going to be really really tough!! Anyway enjoy your sleep but don't get addicted to zopiclone!!! Good luck x
Hi crystal.... Sorry to read your having a bad time with your sleep at the min... I can totally relate to what you're going through... I've been struggling myself with this for the past six months, my sleep went from great to poor once I started with anxiety, I was given mirtazapine to take which did help with sleep but the side effects for me were unbearabLe. Having been on them only five weeks I came off and my sleep went from poor to non existent. I was then given zopiclone for five weeks which got me around two hours a night but again they didn't agree with me.
By this time I could hardly walk, the docs decided to try me on diazipam 5mg... Out of desperation I took the tablets but only half as I'm now petrified of meds.. They seemed to work and got me around 5/6 hours but again side effects were extremely difficult. Docs left me on these for 10 weeks, maximum period is four weeks and still wanted to keep prescribing.
I decided to take matters in to my own hands and come off the benzo... This has been the biggest challenge of my Life. Anyway there's a sticky thread on hear about sleep and insomnia and what can counter it...
I've found personally that it helps, eat as healthily as you can, vitamins and iron supplements, exercise is a big one, even if you feel you Carnt try and push yourself even if it's just walking.. Epsom salts in the bath to help relax muscles, try a form of relaxation and most importantly try not to be anxious about sleeping... If you sleep great, if you don't so what maybe you will the following night...
After six months of trying meds and feeling like death was near, I'm now slowly starting to recover med free and following the simple steps that are stated on that sticky thread... I'm now getting around six hours a night unaided which is good but far for how I used to be being able to sleep for a week.. Small steps and positivity is the key..
I've been in a very dark hole for months now and slowly I'm starting to see a light at the end of my tunnel... I've always believed that what one person can do, another can do to, so if I can, THEN YOU CAN.. I hope this gives you a little hope that you can and will get back to normal however bumpy the road ahead.. Chris...
Crystalhiggs
27-03-15, 14:21
Hi Chris. Your post brought a tear to my eye. :( Wow what a journey you've been on and how amazing are you to get through all that?! All i can say is a huge WELL DONE! I am terrified. It's so easy to continue with zopiclone but I know I can't. I didn't sleep a wink last night and feel dreadful today (no point me taking anything last night if I'd known!). How long did it take since you stopped all meds and until you slept naturally? 6 natural hours sleep would be a Godsend to me right now. I'm having cognitive hypnotherapy and counselling so I hope they will help and I will read the sticky thread. Not that I would wish this on anyone else but it's so good not to feel alone. Thank you for your inspiring post!! X
Crystal what time to do you go to bed ? never ever go until your eyelids are drooping ,black out curtains also helped me a fair bit so its worth considering them
Sleep hygiene which you can google does actually have some effect it did for me
Crystalhiggs
27-03-15, 15:01
Andy I go at 8.45 at the mo (so rock and roll eh?) as I'm literally dropping by then unless I've had the 8 hours. But always pooped by 9! I think when all our building work is done I'll feel a bit better as sleeping in guest room at the mo! So not even in my own bed/room. Will look up sleep hygiene thanks. I'll try anything right now!!!
Andy I go at 8.45 at the mo (so rock and roll eh?) as I'm literally dropping by then unless I've had the 8 hours. But always pooped by 9! I think when all our building work is done I'll feel a bit better as sleeping in guest room at the mo! So not even in my own bed/room. Will look up sleep hygiene thanks. I'll try anything right now!!!
try forcing yourself to stay awake until at least 10pm then go to bed,let us know how you get on
Crystalhiggs
27-03-15, 16:06
I'll be surprised if I can stay up that late (!) but will try tonight :)
Hi crystal.... In answer to your question I think I would have to say after about four weeks after withdrawing from diazipam I started to notice a slight difference...Don't get me wrong there's still a long way to go for me to get back to normal but I try to take the positive out of each and every setback...
I'm no doctor but I wouldn't worry about being addicted to zopiclone, you've only been on for a short period and from what I understand it's a different drug compared to benzo's like diazipam and tamazipan...maybe taper your zop night on night off then night on two nights off and so forth..
In the mean time try and cement the building blocks for better sleep, go to bed same time every night and get up same time in the morning no matter how tired... Cut caffeine and alcohol to a minimum, this doesn't mean forever, just at the moment...
For me apparently I'm medication sensitive so what ever I take seems to make me worse, lol...so as always for me it's the hard road, but I have to and will get the better of this..
My anxiety is slowly subsiding now and my body although extremely fatigued is starting to recover... So it does seem as others have said that it is possible to recover, I didn't think so at one point but now I think hell yer It can be done and recon I'm about half way back up the ladder... Once you get some positive change you'll get a lift from that and away you go...
Have a look at that sticky and pick some things to try, see what benefits and what doesn't try something else...oh and buy a blender, get your fruits and veg in a smoothy..this has helped me in a big way along with healthy eatin...
Anxiety and sleep deprivation is merry go round, if you can try not to worry about sleep, easier said than done I know, the better you may find it to sleep...
Hope this helps a little.... Chris
Crystalhiggs
28-03-15, 14:24
Thanks Chris. I'm in a bad place right now. My anxiety is going through the roof. I hardly slept last night even with zopiclone. I'm starting to feel really down now and scared. Constantly shaky. I hope I will have the strength you have to get through this. :( it's not like me to be so gloomy, sorry.
Afternoon... Sorry to here you had another bad nite, I did too and once again I'm rattling like a tin can, people think the mrs has kicked out cause of the size of the bags under my eyes..... But never the less keep pushing on, 2nite could be better..... Try to keep positive, if you Carnt change something that's happening to you at the min then try not to worry about it... I know how hard it is, days into weeks, weeks into months of exhaustion head all over the place and body feels like a garbage bin, it's awful but there has to be and will be a change... Try your best to stay upbeat, try and relax and be patient...
Hope you have a better nite 2nite
Chris.
Crystalhiggs
28-03-15, 17:21
Thank you Chris. I picked up a bit and played footie with my son, I feel so bad for him seeing me so miserable! Now just so tired I wish it was bedtime and I could take a pill! Sorry you had a bad night too :( at least you know you can do it naturally and I envy you that. I think like you I have a sensitivity to meds as none of the ADs seem to agree with me. I haven't tried mirtazapine though ... What were your side effects? I would take that if I thought it wouldn't send my anxiety sky high but after trying the trazodone and citalopram I think nothing is going to work.
Hope you have a good night and thanks for the encouragement :)
Hi crystal, well I think each person responds differently to each medication so of course you won't no till you try but I seemed to get alot of the rarer side effects which in its self scared the crap out of me and added to my anxiety...
I was only on them five weeks and was given a dose of 30mg, after two days I halved the tablet as I felt like a walking zombie... Two weeks in at 15mg I did feel ok but as the next wk rolled in I started to get all sorts.. Really bad runs, servere dizziness, all my periferal vision went, involentry moment of my right arm, that's just to name a few..
They may work well for you though, I've been told they are popular ad... Question is are you willing to try another..for me personally I still feel like a rotting cabbage but feel better than when the docs were giving me all there sweeties... So as always with life I suppose it's down to choice....
It's funny because years ago I was well into the club scene and dabbled with all the illegal stuff, they worked great, now all the legal stuff doesn't lol... So just my luck...
Chris.
Crystalhiggs
29-03-15, 14:33
Hi Chris, right now I just want to get off these meds. I totally hear what you're saying about the doctors giving them out like sweets! Last night I listened to a meditation clip my hypnotherapist gave me. I was so relaxed I just lay there for 2 hours drifting, it was wonderful. Then I took a lower dose of traz and was out like a light. Woke at 1am and really didn't want to take the zopiclone but I can't just come off it like that so took less than half and again, out like a light until 6 (well, 5). So I hope this mediation/hypnotherapy will be the road that works for me, I still feel awful today as you said like a zombie but an anxious zombie! Want to feel real again!!! I need to take traz for 4 more nights at 50 then I'm off it. If I can sleep by then I'll get off the zop too but one day at a time. Feel I'm getting a bit agoraphobic as dont want to leave the house feeling like this!!! Did you sleep last night?
Evening, glad you got some sleep crystal, I know you will probably still feel terrible but you should be really proud. Look at it this way, you've started taking tablets to get you some sleep. You've started off on higher doses for that reason, NOW you're tapering to half what you were taking and still managing to get some sleep so there's the POSITIVE. Keep that in mind...
In so far as feeling agoraphobic, don't wait for yourself to feel better, keep doing what you would normally do before all this, push yourself no matter how bad you feel..I felt awfull yday but still went about my daily dutys plus extra exercise On top of my normal.
I slept well last night because of this, well that's what I tell myself.. Think I got about 7.5 hours. I know I woke once briefly, but I try not to monitor it and just let it be..
I think before all this started you just went to bed woke when you woke and on with the next day never giving sleep a second thought.... Once insomnia starts you become in tune to it, watching the clock, worrying about it, and the cycle starts... Then comes the anxiety and the constant researching which in turn compounds it further..
Can you see what I'm trying to get at... For myself now I just try and leave it be, IF I SLEEP GREAT, IF I DONT OH WELL...and just let the next night come, as you would have before all this hell... That's my way of thinking anyway, don't no if you'll agree..
Anyway keep the POSITIVE and keep pushing forward..
I hope you get some of the same sleep 2nite...chin up.
Chris.
hi people. well after taking the zopiclone on friday evening with the trazodone i managed to have a full 4hrs sleep:). Last night i only took the trazodone as directed by my Gp amd managed a full 2hrs:D and now have difficulty thinking straight or sitting still or concentrating on even tv. I eventually gave in and spoke to the crisis team at the local hospital and explained the situation with the insomnia and the zoplicone and the first thing thay advised me to do was to go against my gps advice and take 2 x 3.75mg zopiclone as this would be the normal dose as recommended in the NICE guidelines. Why cant medical people agree on things?
Anyway would love to get 5 or 6 hrs tonight as i am back at work in the morning and need to function properly.
I believe my anxiety stems from the fact that my partner left me two months ago and it was a complete bombshell and now i seem to find myself anxious about being on my own after being with someone for over 25yrs. Does anyone else suffer the same sort of anxiety and if so what sort of coping strategies have you found that work. hope everyone gets a good nights sleep
Crystalhiggs
30-03-15, 12:09
Evening, glad you got some sleep crystal, I know you will probably still feel terrible but you should be really proud. Look at it this way, you've started taking tablets to get you some sleep. You've started off on higher doses for that reason, NOW you're tapering to half what you were taking and still managing to get some sleep so there's the POSITIVE. Keep that in mind...
In so far as feeling agoraphobic, don't wait for yourself to feel better, keep doing what you would normally do before all this, push yourself no matter how bad you feel..I felt awfull yday but still went about my daily dutys plus extra exercise On top of my normal.
I slept well last night because of this, well that's what I tell myself.. Think I got about 7.5 hours. I know I woke once briefly, but I try not to monitor it and just let it be..
I think before all this started you just went to bed woke when you woke and on with the next day never giving sleep a second thought.... Once insomnia starts you become in tune to it, watching the clock, worrying about it, and the cycle starts... Then comes the anxiety and the constant researching which in turn compounds it further..
Can you see what I'm trying to get at... For myself now I just try and leave it be, IF I SLEEP GREAT, IF I DONT OH WELL...and just let the next night come, as you would have before all this hell... That's my way of thinking anyway, don't no if you'll agree..
Anyway keep the POSITIVE and keep pushing forward..
I hope you get some of the same sleep 2nite...chin up.
Chris.
Hiya. Tried to take your advice on board last night. Didn't do quite as well as the previous night (took same amount of meds) but think I was a bit anxious about being able to function today! Anyhow I did manage a few hours after my beautiful meditation and hey I got my son to school this morning, cleaned the house, went for a walk and I'm still here! :) what I am going to take on board is the 'do what you would normally do' bit as hard as it is. And take each day as it comes, as worrying about Easter/parties/mother in law coming is too much on my mind. And I don't feel too bad today. So onwards and upwards and thanks again for the positive encouragement and making me smile with your 'rotten cabbage' type humour! :D
---------- Post added at 12:09 ---------- Previous post was at 12:02 ----------
hi people. well after taking the zopiclone on friday evening with the trazodone i managed to have a full 4hrs sleep:). Last night i only took the trazodone as directed by my Gp amd managed a full 2hrs:D and now have difficulty thinking straight or sitting still or concentrating on even tv. I eventually gave in and spoke to the crisis team at the local hospital and explained the situation with the insomnia and the zoplicone and the first thing thay advised me to do was to go against my gps advice and take 2 x 3.75mg zopiclone as this would be the normal dose as recommended in the NICE guidelines. Why cant medical people agree on things?
Anyway would love to get 5 or 6 hrs tonight as i am back at work in the morning and need to function properly.
I believe my anxiety stems from the fact that my partner left me two months ago and it was a complete bombshell and now i seem to find myself anxious about being on my own after being with someone for over 25yrs. Does anyone else suffer the same sort of anxiety and if so what sort of coping strategies have you found that work. hope everyone gets a good nights sleep
Hi there. Sorry you're having such a tough time too! My doctor told me to take 7.5mg but my fear off addiction took over so I'm getting by on half a 3.75 plus trazodone at the moment. Am reducing the trazodone and hope to come off it Thursday but I don't know how I'll manage my sleep afterwards as it gives me an extra 3.5 hours a night. Just hate being on meds but totally understand where you're coming from its so hard not sleeping.
Have you been offered counselling at all? I'm seeing a therapist once a week for my anxiety plus a hypnotherapist for my sleep. She gave me a wonderful meditation to listen to and it does help me relax a lot though not quite to full sleep. Do take the counselling if its offered or find a private one as you're coping with a lot and are only human!
Good luck and keep us posted :)
keep going Crystal and stay positive ,time is a great healer
Crystalhiggs
30-03-15, 12:37
keep going Crystal and stay positive ,time is a great healer
Thank you Andy I'm taking one day at a time will do my very best to stay positive!!! :yesyes:
Hi crystal, well done you for getting on with things, happy days...so that's two positives now, less meds and still able to go about your day now...another few nights and you'll be dropping one med completely, so there's another plus... One med left then and for the dose your taking at the min it's probably a placebo anyway.
You may have a few rough nights and feel like you should be put out with the garbage on a Monday, you may not, but does it matter...NO...you can still function as you've just proved...looks like your on the ladder now so one rung at a time and up you go...
Hope some of my nonsense helps.
Better days ahead.
Chris
Crystalhiggs
31-03-15, 07:14
Ugh. 3.5 hours sleep. Yesterday I was light and happy and didn't feel as exhausted at bedtime. So traz didn't work. Today is gonna be a tough one!
Morning, never mind crystal 3.5 hrs is better than none..I didn't do to well last night, recon I got about five hours but broken sleep...anyway some news for you, there's a post on here about vit d deficiency which I kinda looked at the other day which I found interesting.. I had a gp appointment last nite with my doc just for a check up... When I got there he'd gone home sick so they squeezed me in with the practice's head doctor..
Turns out that when I had my bloods done in December my doc told me I was text book apart from my vit d which slightly low... So I thought well it is winter no sun and all and left it be.... The gp I saw last night went through my records and immediately picked this up and said my vit d wasn't just low it's very low, am at 23 and should be above 50 which is minimum, average is 70...
He then asked how I was feeling so I told him I'd gone through hell but was starting to get the better of it and come out the other side but I'm always fatigued and my sleep although better it's not what it was..
Turns out vit d deficiency can mimic many symptoms from anxiety, depression and the big one...INSOMNIA...apparently there's bin studys to prove this...so I bin given a script for vit d3 to take for seven weeks...
It seems as I told you in another post that since I've been eating really healthy and using the blender I bought to get my five or more a day, I have felt alot better than I did, so maybe there is a connection somewhere... I'll just see what happens..
Maybe you should get your bloods done if you haven't already... Could be some of the same for you..
What I will say though if this works (I'm dowtfull) and all this has been attributable to something so simple, I'll be back at my normal gp and FEED HIM all the crap he's give me... Lol..
Chris.
Crystalhiggs
31-03-15, 12:13
Hiya Chris. Interesting post. This could be the answer you've been looking for then??? I'm absolutely sure that diet can have a huge roll to play! I'm tiny and underweight and sure this is part of my problem. I know my diet is shot to pieces at the moment. I'm going out for a walk in the sunshine soon and I'll buy some salmon and mushrooms! And maybe a supplement! :) let me know how you get on with it and yes give your gp hell if he's missed that vital piece of the puzzle!
On another note last night I was talking to my son's piano teacher who said she went through this exact same thing as me last year. Just stopped sleeping. What worked for her was Paul Mckenna's 'I can make you sleep'. She said she was sleeping naturally within a week. So have ordered that too. I'll try anything!!!
Right now to summon up the energy to go out! :) thanks for the info :)
I had Paul McKennas sleep ap on my ipod it did work and helped me drift off to sleep so its worth a try
Crystalhiggs
31-03-15, 13:17
Really Andy? That's encouraging! Was it the audio clips that did it or the steps to do every day like getting up half an hour early etc? Or both? :)
the audio clip helped,I only read half the book to be honest
Crystalhiggs
31-03-15, 13:31
Great, anything anything anything just to get me off to sodding sleep! ('Scuse my French!) ��
Great, anything anything anything just to get me off to sodding sleep! ('Scuse my French!) ��
it will happen but it will take time ,I know its hard but you have to put it to the back of your mind and not focus on it,you need a if it happens it happens attitude
Hi crystal, how are you managing.. Hope these past few nights have been better for you...did you manage to drop one of your meds?....
Chris..
Crystalhiggs
02-04-15, 12:20
Hi Chris, thank you for asking :) hmmm well, it's not going quite as I expected. I stopped sleeping completely now with the trazodone. Zero, zilch, nada. However, my anxiety has dwindled hugely and I can only presume this is because it has kicked in as an AD rather than a sleep aid. Because if this I'm thinking now I might stay on it a bit as I'm more chilled out! (Only on lowest dose).
Sleep wise I'm still not managing a wink without the Zopiclone. Which is unfortunate although I'm grateful for 3-4 hours a night for now and am functioning surprisingly well! I seem to have more energy now it's bonkers!
I listen to a hypnotic meditation every night and it sends me into a beautiful trance so maybe that's helping. My hypnotherapist said yesterday that I seem so much better, look healthier and my spirit is stronger. My counsellor this morning said the same thing.
I don't know what's going on, I'm seeing the doctor later today and going to tell her I don't want to see a psychiatrist but any chance she can refer me to a sleep clinic as that's what I need right now!
So that's it, the new assertive me. :) She'll probably tell me to bog off but worth a try!
How are you Chris, still managing a good few hours a night! :)
Hi.. Well that's good news for you, I'm so glad things are slowly starting to change for the better... Another few weeks and hopefully there will be more improvement...
I'm still about the same really, some nights are better than others... But I recon it's gonna take time to revert back to normal...
Sometimes I wish you could just flip a switch and be back to how things were but as they say these things take time and slowly come off in layers...
One day hopefully soon we gonna have a great sleep and wake up feeling on top of the world Instead of feeling like a retired old donkey that's bin up and down blackpool beach more times than the tides bin in...
Carnt wait..
Chris.
Crystalhiggs
02-04-15, 14:34
I know it just doesn't seem fair does it? It will happen it just has to!!! Wanted to ask, you said it took about 4 weeks to get a proper sleep again after coming off your meds? What happened in that 4 weeks? I mean there must've been some sleep right? I really do want to get off zopiclone, it's been 5 weeks now and I wish I'd never started it. Just been reading up on it loads and really I should get off it Now before I put myself at serious risk. Why is nothing simple??
Will let you know what the doctor says later... :)
Hiya, DON'T READ AND RESEARCH IT... By doing that your just going to add to you anxiety...knowledge is power sometimes but can go against you... Other people's horror storys about withdrawing may not be yours....by reading about it your already setting your self up for every symptom under the Sun....
From what I know lots of people including girls aloud singer Sarah Harding have been on that many years and been able to come off and they were on much higher doses.... You've only been on for a short period and a minimal dose....
Don't worry about it and just see how you get on, you may find it real easy....
As for me getting off that diazipam, well it was hell but a different drug to zop.. Don't wanna tell you what I went through incase it worries you into thinking you might get some of the same...
All you can do is see how you go, hopefully it will be a doddle....Try not to worry to much...
Chris.
Crystalhiggs
02-04-15, 17:47
Just had a long chat with the doctor. She really, really advised me not to make any rash decisions as it's still very early days and as you say I'm not taking much. She basically said I ahould wait a bit until I feel better but she's monitoring me. I got myself a bit worked up which was a shame as I'd been feeling good today. It's so hard when you're tired I wish I had some clarity! Feeling wobbly now. :(
Logan_Five
02-04-15, 17:58
I'm kind going through something similar, Crystal. Have had a ropey few nights sleep, but the Temazepam that I've taken has helped a wee bit. Still undecided if I'm going to take one tonight or try and do without. I get daytime anxiety too, which is fed in part by being back on Citalopram (5/6 weeks in now) and then also worrying about not sleeping the following night after a bad one. GP told me today to go to bed not expecting to sleep and whilst I can understand the logic behind it, am not sure I can convince my subconcious of that! She has also given me 7 7.5 Zopliclone tablets to use 'sparingly' - which I plan to if I've had a couple of bad nights. I certainly don't fancy popping one every night - although I know some people do and have to. I've also got a sleep relaxation exercise on my iPhone - so I might try that tonight too. I've been neglecting my relaxation exercises for the past week or so - very naughty. :( However, I did one today and fell asleep during it for 15mins.
[QUOTE=MyNameIsTerry;1407746]Crystal, I was only on it a month though so I wouldn't say I was addicted. Have a look on the meds board for threads by Hemps as she has recently come off Zopiclone after being on it for years. SADNoMore (Marie) has also come off it as well I think, well either that or Diazepam I think. They might be able to answer more of your questions about it. I don't believe I was dependant on it but it there was definately some withdrawal to it as Greg said. I just think it messes you around because the fatigue and how it seems to stop your digestion seems too much to me."
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _____________________
Hi, all!
Yes, Terry you're correct about both.
The Diazepam/other assorted benzos, I withdrew from at a detox facility 20 years ago. These are classically addictive drugs, which responsible doctors restrict (no refills) or refuse to prescribe. I had been taking them for sleep, actually, and because there had been times I had tried to stop and couldn't (dependency), I knew that it was a mistake to go on. I was beginning to increase my dose (tolerance), to skip supper so as to heighten the effects, and began to pop up at emerg for one of these little restricted prescriptions from whichever doc was on shift, to "tide me over" until a regular refill was possible. These two markers define classic addiction, the dependency plus the tolerance. Which calls for a detox facility, if it can be arranged.
It made me feel safe there, under medical supervision, and the people were very kind. They knew that the point was for me to withdraw completely (I'm afraid that for some of us, slow withdrawal does not work), and they did not offer me anything else. They explained how it is that anxiety is a normal result of withdrawal, and would go away. It took awhile, and meant all kinds of changes to my lifestyle, but the side effect anxiety did leave me. It's been all to the good.
Note: Once a person has become addicted to benzodiazapenes, there's no going back to them. A relapse of addiction would be guaranteed.
I did share this history with my doctor in my new town some 12 years ago. Seven years ago my mother died, and I was unable to sleep for some time. Had a lot of depression, and for me that means insomnia. With the very best of intentions at heart, he prescribed me Zopiclone, which was being hailed as non-addictive at the time. As we now know, they were wrong. I know he feels bad, so I put on my big girl pants and agreed to do what it takes to address my ongoing (mostly winter) depression, and then to come off the Zopiclone. I am afraid I know better than to bother with the slow withdrawal, truly, it only prolongs the agony. In my experience, it doesn't work.
What can often work in these situations is switching straight onto another medication. Trazodone, for one, has been in use a long time, and classic addiction is not normally found associated with it. I am taking 50 mg, which has worked, from the first night. Not the skillet upside the head that zopiclone is, but I prefer it's natural-feeling effects, even if it does take a bit of patience and commitment. It has been two weeks now, and yes, there have been side effects that mimic anxiety increasing. Heart palps, dizziness, dry mouth, stomach clenches, headaches. From what I have read from members here, these arise from startup side effects, which will pass. Just after taking it and as it begins to work, I feel calm knowing that it will work, as that has been my experience. Grateful. Meanwhile, I support it on all sides with good sleep hygiene, including unplugging from technology hours before bed, and turning off the light shortly after getting into bed. Yes, that is taking a bit of getting used to. Last night I listened to a radio program on CBC for a little bit to relax first. I do feel calm, and use this calm to work through progressive relaxation lying on my back, while practicing relaxation breathing. I described these techniques in my response last night to your other post, Crystal, so I won't go into it again, but I think they are something you would enjoy doing, and they will help you immensely. You might ask your counselor for some help getting comfortable to do them on your own.
Within another month or two, I will cement in the sleep hygiene practices and give it a go without the Trazodone for sleep. I am on another antidepressant, and the doctor had wanted to try a low-dose anti-psychotic before agreeing to the Traz. I'm pretty sure it was olanzapine, and would like to see if it will help the depression-related anxiety I have had these past few years. MrAndy's good results have been mirrored by some who have pm'd me, too, so, by all accounts it is worth a try! Don't be afraid of its being an antipsychotic, it is such a low dose for these reasons that it can't act in its antipsychotic capacities. You are lucky to have a pdoc to work with, my town has no resident psychiatrists. My physician is quite crackerjack though, very knowledgeable. Will ask him for a straight swap from the Trazodone, since this worked so well for dropping the Zopiclone.
Hang in there Crystal! You've gotten some wonderful advice from our brothers on NMP! I've picked up some good tips myself, many thanks guys! :bighug1:Good luck to anyone else who is struggling, you can trust these fellas won't steer you wrong! And Terry, your advice to supplement Vitamin D, fish oil and magnesium have helped me in all sorts of ways, much appreciated. :flowers:
Marie
---------- Post added at 11:17 ---------- Previous post was at 11:02 ----------
Crystal, on re-reading your other thread with MrAndy, I think you might do well to take a leaf from his book and do a straight swap of zopiclone for olanzapine or the other low dose antipsychotic. If it works for anxiety as well as sleep, then that'll be a bonus for you!! :yahoo:
Crystalhiggs
02-04-15, 18:38
Wow thanks guys :) such a knowledgeable bunch! :) I'm going to listen to my hypnosis download tonight and see how I go with the trazodone and take it from there. I never usually take a whole 3.75mg dose of zopiclone because I know the higher I go the harder it will be to eventually come down.
You know it's funny because when I see my hypnotherapist I come out feeling amazing, same with my counsellor but with the gp I always feel a bit crap!
Anyway for now I just can't wait till bedtime and slip into a trance knowing that I will at the very least get a few hours sleep!
By the way I havent quite worked out how to get notifications if someone replies to one of my posts so I'm sorry if there's anything I haven't seen or acknowledged! I really do appreciate all your replies, thank you :)
---------- Post added at 18:38 ---------- Previous post was at 18:33 ----------
[QUOTE=MyNameIsTerry;1407746]Crystal, I was only on it a month though so I wouldn't say I was addicted. Have a look on the meds board for threads by Hemps as she has recently come off Zopiclone after being on it for years. SADNoMore (Marie) has also come off it as well I think, well either that or Diazepam I think. They might be able to answer more of your questions about it. I don't believe I was dependant on it but it there was definately some withdrawal to it as Greg said. I just think it messes you around because the fatigue and how it seems to stop your digestion seems too much to me."
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _____________________
Hi, all!
Yes, Terry you're correct about both.
The Diazepam/other assorted benzos, I withdrew from at a detox facility 20 years ago. These are classically addictive drugs, which responsible doctors restrict (no refills) or refuse to prescribe. I had been taking them for sleep, actually, and because there had been times I had tried to stop and couldn't (dependency), I knew that it was a mistake to go on. I was beginning to increase my dose (tolerance), to skip supper so as to heighten the effects, and began to pop up at emerg for one of these little restricted prescriptions from whichever doc was on shift, to "tide me over" until a regular refill was possible. These two markers define classic addiction, the dependency plus the tolerance. Which calls for a detox facility, if it can be arranged.
It made me feel safe there, under medical supervision, and the people were very kind. They knew that the point was for me to withdraw completely (I'm afraid that for some of us, slow withdrawal does not work), and they did not offer me anything else. They explained how it is that anxiety is a normal result of withdrawal, and would go away. It took awhile, and meant all kinds of changes to my lifestyle, but the side effect anxiety did leave me. It's been all to the good.
Note: Once a person has become addicted to benzodiazapenes, there's no going back to them. A relapse of addiction would be guaranteed.
I did share this history with my doctor in my new town some 12 years ago. Seven years ago my mother died, and I was unable to sleep for some time. Had a lot of depression, and for me that means insomnia. With the very best of intentions at heart, he prescribed me Zopiclone, which was being hailed as non-addictive at the time. As we now know, they were wrong. I know he feels bad, so I put on my big girl pants and agreed to do what it takes to address my ongoing (mostly winter) depression, and then to come off the Zopiclone. I am afraid I know better than to bother with the slow withdrawal, truly, it only prolongs the agony. In my experience, it doesn't work.
What can often work in these situations is switching straight onto another medication. Trazodone, for one, has been in use a long time, and classic addiction is not normally found associated with it. I am taking 50 mg, which has worked, from the first night. Not the skillet upside the head that zopiclone is, but I prefer it's natural-feeling effects, even if it does take a bit of patience and commitment. It has been two weeks now, and yes, there have been side effects that mimic anxiety increasing. Heart palps, dizziness, dry mouth, stomach clenches, headaches. From what I have read from members here, these arise from startup side effects, which will pass. Just after taking it and as it begins to work, I feel calm knowing that it will work, as that has been my experience. Grateful. Meanwhile, I support it on all sides with good sleep hygiene, including unplugging from technology hours before bed, and turning off the light shortly after getting into bed. Yes, that is taking a bit of getting used to. Last night I listened to a radio program on CBC for a little bit to relax first. I do feel calm, and use this calm to work through progressive relaxation lying on my back, while practicing relaxation breathing. I described these techniques in my response last night to your other post, Crystal, so I won't go into it again, but I think they are something you would enjoy doing, and they will help you immensely. You might ask your counselor for some help getting comfortable to do them on your own.
Within another month or two, I will cement in the sleep hygiene practices and give it a go without the Trazodone for sleep. I am on another antidepressant, and the doctor had wanted to try a low-dose anti-psychotic before agreeing to the Traz. I'm pretty sure it was olanzapine, and would like to see if it will help the depression-related anxiety I have had these past few years. MrAndy's good results have been mirrored by some who have pm'd me, too, so, by all accounts it is worth a try! Don't be afraid of its being an antipsychotic, it is such a low dose for these reasons that it can't act in its antipsychotic capacities. You are lucky to have a pdoc to work with, my town has no resident psychiatrists. My physician is quite crackerjack though, very knowledgeable. Will ask him for a straight swap from the Trazodone, since this worked so well for dropping the Zopiclone.
Hang in there Crystal! You've gotten some wonderful advice from our brothers on NMP! I've picked up some good tips myself, many thanks guys! :bighug1:Good luck to anyone else who is struggling, you can trust these fellas won't steer you wrong! And Terry, your advice to supplement Vitamin D, fish oil and magnesium have helped me in all sorts of ways, much appreciated. :flowers:
Marie
---------- Post added at 11:17 ---------- Previous post was at 11:02 ----------
Crystal, on re-reading your other thread with MrAndy, I think you might do well to take a leaf from his book and do a straight swap of zopiclone for olanzapine or the other low dose antipsychotic. If it works for anxiety as well as sleep, then that'll be a bonus for you!! :yahoo:
Marie thank you so much it really does help to know people understand. I have been on trazodone 4 weeks and am only just beginning to feel less anxious. When I see my gp next I'm going to ask her about switching from zopiclone, I dont know why don't offer the less addictive alternative in the first place!
Thanks again :)
Hi crystal, just wondering how you got on with that paul mckenna book and cd.. Did you find it helped any?...
Hello people this is probably the wrong place to post this but looking at the trazodone posts there isn.t much activity. Looking to see if anyone who has taken trazodone has experienced headaches that last way into the afternoon and find that their anxiety levels during the morning rocket up until after lunchtime? I have been on 100mg trazodone for 5 weeks now to help with my insomnia, which does seem to be helping, but i havbe a constant headache from when i wake up until late afternoon and my anxiety goes mad until middle of the afternoon. Wondered if anyone else has experienced the same sort of thing? Thanks Paul
Crystalhiggs
03-04-15, 16:03
Hi Chris, Thx for asking. Well it relaxed me a lot and I felt I couldn't move my body afterwards but sadly no sleep, will keep going with it though.. I got 5 hours with the Zopiclone. My legs feel like jelly today and my son has told me I need to stay and watch at least the first half of a football match tonight so that I'm properly tired when I go to bed... I could go right now tbh!
McKenna basically advocates getting up half an hour earlier than normal and not going to bed until you're really tired, no daytime napping and a good comfortable sleep environment. That's the majority of the book but the audio is good, just not quite good enough for my crazy wired brain right now!
How about you did you have a better night? Looking forward to your latest anecdote :)
---------- Post added at 16:02 ---------- Previous post was at 15:57 ----------
Hello people this is probably the wrong place to post this but looking at the trazodone posts there isn.t much activity. Looking to see if anyone who has taken trazodone has experienced headaches that last way into the afternoon and find that their anxiety levels during the morning rocket up until after lunchtime? I have been on 100mg trazodone for 5 weeks now to help with my insomnia, which does seem to be helping, but i havbe a constant headache from when i wake up until late afternoon and my anxiety goes mad until middle of the afternoon. Wondered if anyone else has experienced the same sort of thing? Thanks Paul
Hi Paul yes trazodone did exactly the same to me! I've been on it 4 weeks now but had to go back down to 50mg (I went up to from 50-150 in three weeks) because I couldn't stand the side effects which were basically the same as yours. It doesn't really help me sleep either although I occasionally get a nice surprise! The side effects have mostly worn off now but as I say I'm in a lower dose. Glad it helps you sleep at least!!!
---------- Post added at 16:03 ---------- Previous post was at 16:02 ----------
Sorry for bad spelling :)
Well, I've not done to well these past four nights, don't no why... My brain doesn't seem to want to shut down at the min...was thinking of asking the mrs to put a bat round the back of my head later...I've just bought that book youve got... See if it does anything more for me... Tired of being tired... Lol...
Hope you get a better night tonight
Chris..
Crystalhiggs
03-04-15, 17:23
Oh no sorry to hear that :( I still envy you doing it the natural way though! Hope the PM thing works for you - with no drugs in your system it might work better.
I've just reconnected our old WII to do the wii fit so I'm getting more exercise than just walking. I'm cream crackered and spaced out but I want to be super-pooped tonight (as recommended by you last week)!
Also going to buy a nutribullet to ensure I get good nutrition as the Trazodone has taken away my appetite and can't afford to lose any more weight!
Hope tonight better for you, hang on in there and again, you're doing it naturally so you know you can do it! Good luck! :)
GREAT, great, healthy supports you're putting in place, Crystal! We especially need a healthy diet when it is what we are depending on for exercise. :) Good on you! Coincidentally, another NMP member has just now suggested Walk It Out for Wii to me, as we are still locked into the minus digits in Northern Alberta Canada. Am excited to try it! :)
I've been getting the headaches too, on the Trazodone. Unfortunately, if I try to stay up too late, I just end up being awake all night, it's like I get a "second wind", like it or not, and believe me, I don't. I'm the kind of insomniac who needs the rigid proper bedtime, lights out by 10. ... Mind you, although I do get the lovely calm that gives me patience to work the progressive relaxation routines with Trazodone, and am doing much better really on shorter hours with it, I still want to get a full night's sleep, you know? I feel I have established it, it works every night for me (however short that may be), so I want to put it away for occasional use only now. I do like it so much better than zopiclone, which, by the way, wasn't working overnight anymore, itself. Plus it's addictive. :(
I feel I want a trial now with the olanzapine. Maybe it might allow me to sleep longer? The lowest dose is 2.5 mg (also, by the way, it takes less of it to work on women, truth!) I will ask the doc for that next week, and give it a whirl, hopefully I will be able to find you lot again on another thread by then, ha ha!
Don't worry about not responding before, Crystal. I'm same as you, I have no idea how to get notifications either! I am always plowing through pages of threads to check! PLEASE CAN SOMEONE TELL US HOW TO GET NOTIFICATIONS? Not shouting, it's a plea of despair, lol! :roflmao:
MyNameIsTerry
03-04-15, 22:09
You can click on Thread Tools when in the thread, Subscribe To Thread and it will take you too a new page to click save and this has a notification box with it.
You can view all subscribed threads in your profile as it's in the options down the left hand side near the bottom of the list. From here it shows a list and check boxes to turn notifications off and on.
I seem to recall it gives the OP an option when creating a new thread too but I rarely create any so can't remember for sure.
Thanks Terry! I think I just created my first "subscription" to a thread! :yahoo: Yay! I didn't choose the email option though.
How will it notify me of another post, do you know? xx
MyNameIsTerry
04-04-15, 01:35
If you didn't select the option to receive a notification at all then it won't do anything, it just means you can find it easier in the subscribed threads section of your member options. You can always change to be notified or not notified anyway in the subscribed threads option as there is a check box next to them.
MyNameIsTerry
04-04-15, 11:06
Also going to buy a nutribullet to ensure I get good nutrition as the Trazodone has taken away my appetite and can't afford to lose any more weight!
Thats a good idea. Its easier to take liquids, its what they do for people who are physically ill too. Mr brother had to have his food liquidised for a month when he had his jaw wired up after he broke it. He didn't really have a choice though!
I've got a nutribullet. I saw the ads late at night and thought it was a good way to get the 5 a day and beyond. The books with them are useful but you will find a lot more online and I don't think you need to stick to their 3 stack formula anyway as long as you are getting nutritious food into you.
You could also consider adding some dark chocolate as thats supposed to help with anxiety. Maybe Marie will know more, but I've been considering adding cacao to mine as its far more nutritious than dark chocolate or cocoa because the heating process they use to make them kills a large quanity of the antioxidants in them.
Just make sure you read the book. There is a shortlist in it for fruits that you have to remove the pits/stones from first. Its not many and its easily done with a corer. Its just that because it breaks down to access the phytonutrients, some fruit pits/stones release cyanide! Who would have thought it! The domestic assassin only needs a nutribulllet and some plums!
I felt a bit more alert the first few times I drank them. It says in the book that this can happen, but it quickly disappears. Its something to do with the phytonutrients being released. So, perhaps don't drink it too close to bedtime or points of the day where you are most anxious right now, but it will be ok and I just wanted to mention that incase you notice it so you know its nothing and will pass very quickly.
Shop around though. I bought mine off Ebay for £25 cheaper. There is a newer model out now so the original should be slightly cheaper.
Now then crystal, how was last night for you... I was out like a light last nite, recon I got a good 7 hours, woo hoo... Well chuffed.... Happy days...
Chris
Crystalhiggs
04-04-15, 14:49
Now then crystal, how was last night for you... I was out like a light last nite, recon I got a good 7 hours, woo hoo... Well chuffed.... Happy days...
Chris
Whoop whoop! That's amazing, well done! I'm sure the body can Only go so long without eh? So so envious of you!
I had a different sort of night but it started off well. We've just had some building work done so last night was first night back in our own bed/room. I was so happy and relaxed, listened to PM hypnosis, felt myself drifting. After a while I took my trazodone and fell asleep. Even though I'd taken the traz it felt quite natural and I was really happy.
Woke up though at 12.30! Took zopiclone after a while and got another 5 hours.
So although I've slept, it feels like I have a pill hangover today and still not happy that I'm on the Zop! I seem to need more now to get me off - not good!
So mixed blessings for me really!
Did you listen to the hypnosis last night or haven't you got it yet?
Anyway, fab news your end. You must feel brilliant, happy Easter!!! :)
---------- Post added at 13:40 ---------- Previous post was at 13:35 ----------
Thats a good idea. Its easier to take liquids, its what they do for people who are physically ill too. Mr brother had to have his food liquidised for a month when he had his jaw wired up after he broke it. He didn't really have a choice though!
I've got a nutribullet. I saw the ads late at night and thought it was a good way to get the 5 a day and beyond. The books with them are useful but you will find a lot more online and I don't think you need to stick to their 3 stack formula anyway as long as you are getting nutritious food into you.
You could also consider adding some dark chocolate as thats supposed to help with anxiety. Maybe Marie will know more, but I've been considering adding cacao to mine as its far more nutritious than dark chocolate or cocoa because the heating process they use to make them kills a large quanity of the antioxidants in them.
Just make sure you read the book. There is a shortlist in it for fruits that you have to remove the pits/stones from first. Its not many and its easily done with a corer. Its just that because it breaks down to access the phytonutrients, some fruit pits/stones release cyanide! Who would have thought it! The domestic assassin only needs a nutribulllet and some plums!
I felt a bit more alert the first few times I drank them. It says in the book that this can happen, but it quickly disappears. Its something to do with the phytonutrients being released. So, perhaps don't drink it too close to bedtime or points of the day where you are most anxious right now, but it will be ok and I just wanted to mention that incase you notice it so you know its nothing and will pass very quickly.
Shop around though. I bought mine off Ebay for £25 cheaper. There is a newer model out now so the original should be slightly cheaper.
Hi terry, thanks for the info! Yes I'll look into all the recipes and be aware of what time I'm drinking them, the last thing I want to be is alert at bedtime! Or poisoned!!! :)
Think my hubby has ordered one already so not sure of the model but will let you know how I get on with it!
Thanks again! :)
---------- Post added at 14:49 ---------- Previous post was at 13:40 ----------
GREAT, great, healthy supports you're putting in place, Crystal! We especially need a healthy diet when it is what we are depending on for exercise. :) Good on you! Coincidentally, another NMP member has just now suggested Walk It Out for Wii to me, as we are still locked into the minus digits in Northern Alberta Canada. Am excited to try it! :)
I've been getting the headaches too, on the Trazodone. Unfortunately, if I try to stay up too late, I just end up being awake all night, it's like I get a "second wind", like it or not, and believe me, I don't. I'm the kind of insomniac who needs the rigid proper bedtime, lights out by 10. ... Mind you, although I do get the lovely calm that gives me patience to work the progressive relaxation routines with Trazodone, and am doing much better really on shorter hours with it, I still want to get a full night's sleep, you know? I feel I have established it, it works every night for me (however short that may be), so I want to put it away for occasional use only now. I do like it so much better than zopiclone, which, by the way, wasn't working overnight anymore, itself. Plus it's addictive. :(
I feel I want a trial now with the olanzapine. Maybe it might allow me to sleep longer? The lowest dose is 2.5 mg (also, by the way, it takes less of it to work on women, truth!) I will ask the doc for that next week, and give it a whirl, hopefully I will be able to find you lot again on another thread by then, ha ha!
Don't worry about not responding before, Crystal. I'm same as you, I have no idea how to get notifications either! I am always plowing through pages of threads to check! PLEASE CAN SOMEONE TELL US HOW TO GET NOTIFICATIONS? Not shouting, it's a plea of despair, lol! :roflmao:
Hi there thanks for replying. :) the Trazodone relaxed me a lot last night and maybe if I wasn't taking zopiclone I could've slept longer with it. I'm in a real dilemma re Zopiclone. Last night it took more than 3.75 to get me to sleep which isn't good. I do want to get off both the meds, today I feel spaced out so even though I've slept 6 hours it's at a cost to my daytime functioning so would I be just better off tired??? I don't know, I'm too tired and spaced out to think! My fear is that if I stop the zopiclone I won't sleep a wink!
Sure one day it will all be ok! :)
Now then...I do feel better but as always, I seem to get a flat spot every day from between 4pm and 7... Recon that's just through months of exhaustion though...
At least you managed a better night than you have been, who nows, maybe now your back in your own room things might start to settle... try a night off the zop In a few days...
Happy easter to you too..
Chris..
Crystalhiggs
04-04-15, 18:28
Well wish me luck tonight cos the zopiclone have been flushed down the loo! Just can't do it can't risk the addiction. Think it's gonna be a rough few days....!
Well done crystal... Take the bull by the horns...hang in there and hopefully you'll be fine...
Sleep well.
Chris...
Good stuff, Crystal! Wish I'd done the same years ago! That courage must stand you in good stead in life! You'll be fine! The Traz will work, you just need to give it more time and be patient with the awakenings. It's not going to be like that always. Last night, I only vaguely woke up just the once. The relaxation breathing and methodical, limb by limb progression through tensing on the in breath, relaxing on the out breath, followed by natural slow breaths will put you back to sleep in due course. I find it quite peaceful, really. :) I had to do several rounds to get to sleep last night, but I thought to myself, this is really very relaxing, and it's lovely to have the time ... what else am I going to do at this time of night? Lol!
Thanks again Terry, and Happy Easter, all!!
p.s. where do you find your cacao, Terry? Is it the nibs? There is an organic food store in BC. I will look there. :)
MyNameIsTerry
05-04-15, 07:15
Yes, thats it Marie, nibs. Thats what they create cocoa and chocolate out of by heating it and burning off most of the goodness.
I only came across it because I flicked over to a shopping channel for a minute as they were selling the Nutribullet, (ages after I bought mine) and the guy demonstrating was adding cacao so I thought it would be good to sweaten up some of mine along with the antioxidant boost.
I understand that cacao is of the superfood level due to the volume of antioxidants in it.
I was looking around online to be honest. Over here, pretty much everything is cheaper online. I'm sure a health food store would have it, if not even supermarkets may.
Happy Easter!!!
Crystalhiggs
05-04-15, 09:15
Well as expected it was a tough night! I was awake until 5ish then must've slept a bit as I was dreaming. I hope tonight will be better! Will try to be more relaxed tonight and do the relaxation exercises as was too nervous last night!
That's the first time in more than 6 weeks have slept 'naturally' though albeit short lived. Pleased my brain can actually do it!!!
It's gonna be a long old day ... :)
---------- Post added at 09:15 ---------- Previous post was at 08:29 ----------
Marie do you eat something when you take trazodone? I feel shaky every morning and realised I don't have a snack when I take it so could still be traz side effects? X
MyNameIsTerry
05-04-15, 09:39
But do you feel ok other than knackered, Crystal? If so, then thats a very good sign that you will be able to continue this natural route.
It does take time to re adjust. I remember how Zopiclone made my sleep a bit off for a while afterwards, although some of it was the Citalopram and my anxiety.
Yeah, relaxation exercises don't always have the effect people say they do if your anxiety is just too high. If you are very nervous about doing them, just start small and go with the easier less intense ones until you can again later.
Crystalhiggs
05-04-15, 11:21
But do you feel ok other than knackered, Crystal? If so, then thats a very good sign that you will be able to continue this natural route.
It does take time to re adjust. I remember how Zopiclone made my sleep a bit off for a while afterwards, although some of it was the Citalopram and my anxiety.
Yeah, relaxation exercises don't always have the effect people say they do if your anxiety is just too high. If you are very nervous about doing them, just start small and go with the easier less intense ones until you can again later.
Hi Terry, I don't feel too bad so far thank you. I really hope I won't have any withdrawal symptoms! Can you remind me how long you were on zopiclone for and how you came off it?
You know yesterday I felt terrible, like I was in a dense fog which didn't clear until late afternoon. At the moment I feel I can think more clearly and even though the tiredness is in the background I feel more positive! :)
The hypnosis audio helps on a night too so I'm definitely relaxing more generally and the trazodone is gradually taking the edge off the anxiety.
Onwards and upwards!
Hi, all, thanks Terry I look forward to finding the chocolate nibs! I feel like we are all making progress, together on our quest for normalized sleep again. :D
Congratulations, Crystal, I am over the moon for you! Keep practicing the sleep hygiene, no technology after supper. That means no laptop tablet or cell phone at all. Tape shows you can watch earlier on another night, and shut it off before getting ready for bed. Nothing to eat after supper, unless you are uncomfortably hungry, or do decide to take a trazodone some night, because, yes, the pharmacist said a snack helps it to work 20% better. Consider oatmeal and/or 1/2 banana for a snack within an hour and a half or so of bed. These compounds are said to help with sleep. Nothing spicy or heavy. No alcohol, as it may work at first, but it interferes with sleep as the night wears on. Cool, quiet bedroom, some peaceful music or a good book for a bit if you still feel too awake for sleep. If you have LED lights on anything in your bedroom, cover those because they can interfere with your melatonin - I noticed that a blue light on a printer cast light up onto the ceiling and down one wall, quite bright once the other lights were off! Covered that! Turn your alarm clock to face away from you. And I am sorry but I disagree with the notion of staying up as late as possible. Good sleep hygiene is based on setting up the ideal conditions for sleep at night, every night, with lights out by 9:30 or 10 pm for those of us who have had chronic insomnia. We really need to be rigid with our sleep. Early to bed, early to rise, even on weekends, very rarely can we get away with changing this for more than one special late night, without sliding down that slippery slope towards sleeplessness again.
So, I am so happy to share that I too, went without sleep aids at all last night! The trazodone has got me to the point I was willing to try it, and after two weeks of practice, I have re-established full body relaxation and breathing. I did get off to sleep by employing them, although I had to do several rounds first. I did wake up a couple of hours later though, and lay awake for hours until I was finally able through much, much hard work, get back to sleep for an hour or so more. In between, I wasn't all stiff and sore from laying awake for hours like before, and feeling the need to get up for my poor joints and muscles. This was a real comfort to me mentally as well as physically. I got through. No panic, no anxiety or tears of frustration and fear.
Meanwhile though, I was plagued by negative thoughts and feelings and memories they are associated with. And fears based in the present and the future. You could sum these all up as anxieties, I suppose, and for sure, in therapy I hope to resolve as many as I can. But for now I am not able to cope with them, and will be talking to my gp about the olanzapine this next week. I like how the trazodone takes the edge off the anxiety as it does for you! It is so easy to push the intrusive thoughts and feelings away and calmly do the routines and rest and ultimately, to sleep. Way better than the zopiclone!
But I feel I need more help, in the night and the day. Whether that means a higher dose of Trazodone, or an earlier bedtime with a switch to a stronger anti-anxiety drug remains to be seen. Right now I'm feeling great, doing a little dance here for you and me both being free of that nasty hypnotic, lol! :yahoo:
Marie xx
MyNameIsTerry
06-04-15, 05:59
Hi Terry, I don't feel too bad so far thank you. I really hope I won't have any withdrawal symptoms! Can you remind me how long you were on zopiclone for and how you came off it?
You know yesterday I felt terrible, like I was in a dense fog which didn't clear until late afternoon. At the moment I feel I can think more clearly and even though the tiredness is in the background I feel more positive! :)
The hypnosis audio helps on a night too so I'm definitely relaxing more generally and the trazodone is gradually taking the edge off the anxiety.
Onwards and upwards!
Thats a good sign then, Crystal. If that bad nights sleep had been a trigger then I would think you would be finding it hard to withdraw from the medss as your insomnia could return. This has proved that you can do it and you should be proud of that and hang onto it!
I remember being unable to move much in bed, get up or eat for 6 hours upon waking. The strange thing is, this wasn't at first when it helped me, it came a little later so maybe it was a matter of just too much with me taking it daily. This went away when I stopped taking it.
I was on Zopiclone daily at 7.5mg for 4 solid weeks. I spent 1 week coming off it which I started by taking them bi-daily for a few days and then just dropped it completely. The days I hadn't had it the night before, it was hard the first few times but I think lack of sleep was more of an issue for me than it sounds to you as I would be in catastrophixing mode about how rough I felt and how I had to force myself through a tough day. Plus I had only had all this due to starting Citalopram which hit my mood, had me in tears and I was hungry but couldn't eat which added to it. Zopiclone at least gave me some rest but after about 2 weeks it wasn't working as well and making me a zombie for a goood 6 hours every morning.
I don't know how its best to come off it, I wasn't on here to get advice back then (it was about 8 years ago now). Its just the Crisis Team told me my GP shouldn't have told me to take it daily after they advised him to give me something to help me sleep! So, I just tried it this way. There may be better ways from the other people on here (Marie?) as there are some threads about it.
Crystalhiggs
06-04-15, 11:04
Hi, all, thanks Terry I look forward to finding the chocolate nibs! I feel like we are all making progress, together on our quest for normalized sleep again. :D
Congratulations, Crystal, I am over the moon for you! Keep practicing the sleep hygiene, no technology after supper. That means no laptop tablet or cell phone at all. Tape shows you can watch earlier on another night, and shut it off before getting ready for bed. Nothing to eat after supper, unless you are uncomfortably hungry, or do decide to take a trazodone some night, because, yes, the pharmacist said a snack helps it to work 20% better. Consider oatmeal and/or 1/2 banana for a snack within an hour and a half or so of bed. These compounds are said to help with sleep. Nothing spicy or heavy. No alcohol, as it may work at first, but it interferes with sleep as the night wears on. Cool, quiet bedroom, some peaceful music or a good book for a bit if you still feel too awake for sleep. If you have LED lights on anything in your bedroom, cover those because they can interfere with your melatonin - I noticed that a blue light on a printer cast light up onto the ceiling and down one wall, quite bright once the other lights were off! Covered that! Turn your alarm clock to face away from you. And I am sorry but I disagree with the notion of staying up as late as possible. Good sleep hygiene is based on setting up the ideal conditions for sleep at night, every night, with lights out by 9:30 or 10 pm for those of us who have had chronic insomnia. We really need to be rigid with our sleep. Early to bed, early to rise, even on weekends, very rarely can we get away with changing this for more than one special late night, without sliding down that slippery slope towards sleeplessness again.
So, I am so happy to share that I too, went without sleep aids at all last night! The trazodone has got me to the point I was willing to try it, and after two weeks of practice, I have re-established full body relaxation and breathing. I did get off to sleep by employing them, although I had to do several rounds first. I did wake up a couple of hours later though, and lay awake for hours until I was finally able through much, much hard work, get back to sleep for an hour or so more. In between, I wasn't all stiff and sore from laying awake for hours like before, and feeling the need to get up for my poor joints and muscles. This was a real comfort to me mentally as well as physically. I got through. No panic, no anxiety or tears of frustration and fear.
Meanwhile though, I was plagued by negative thoughts and feelings and memories they are associated with. And fears based in the present and the future. You could sum these all up as anxieties, I suppose, and for sure, in therapy I hope to resolve as many as I can. But for now I am not able to cope with them, and will be talking to my gp about the olanzapine this next week. I like how the trazodone takes the edge off the anxiety as it does for you! It is so easy to push the intrusive thoughts and feelings away and calmly do the routines and rest and ultimately, to sleep. Way better than the zopiclone!
But I feel I need more help, in the night and the day. Whether that means a higher dose of Trazodone, or an earlier bedtime with a switch to a stronger anti-anxiety drug remains to be seen. Right now I'm feeling great, doing a little dance here for you and me both being free of that nasty hypnotic, lol! :yahoo:
Marie xx
Hi Marie
Glad you are relaxed and happy! What a difference a positive attitude makes eh? Yesterday was a surprisingly good day for me considering the lack of sleep. I was sure I would get more last night but I wobbled! :( I took the trazodone (50mg) - at around 9.30. Then I freaked out because traz doesn't send me to sleep it just relaxes me - but anxiety kicked in as I had no sleeping pill and what if I was awake all night? Well because of this I was awake all night until 5am :( my alarm went off at 6.30 as I'd forgotten to turn it off! So another terrible sleep and unfortunately today in feeling it!
I think this will take a bit of getting used to, this doing it on my own again. Don't get me wrong I'm glad I'm off the zopiclone, but I have a long way to go to get a good nights sleep!
I still want to do this naturally so am going to have to really work hard at being relaxed and positive! Xx
---------- Post added at 11:04 ---------- Previous post was at 10:59 ----------
Thats a good sign then, Crystal. If that bad nights sleep had been a trigger then I would think you would be finding it hard to withdraw from the medss as your insomnia could return. This has proved that you can do it and you should be proud of that and hang onto it!
I remember being unable to move much in bed, get up or eat for 6 hours upon waking. The strange thing is, this wasn't at first when it helped me, it came a little later so maybe it was a matter of just too much with me taking it daily. This went away when I stopped taking it.
I was on Zopiclone daily at 7.5mg for 4 solid weeks. I spent 1 week coming off it which I started by taking them bi-daily for a few days and then just dropped it completely. The days I hadn't had it the night before, it was hard the first few times but I think lack of sleep was more of an issue for me than it sounds to you as I would be in catastrophixing mode about how rough I felt and how I had to force myself through a tough day. Plus I had only had all this due to starting Citalopram which hit my mood, had me in tears and I was hungry but couldn't eat which added to it. Zopiclone at least gave me some rest but after about 2 weeks it wasn't working as well and making me a zombie for a goood 6 hours every morning.
I don't know how its best to come off it, I wasn't on here to get advice back then (it was about 8 years ago now). Its just the Crisis Team told me my GP shouldn't have told me to take it daily after they advised him to give me something to help me sleep! So, I just tried it this way. There may be better ways from the other people on here (Marie?) as there are some threads about it.
Thanks terry, well as I just said to Marie last night was hard! Even though I had a good day yesterday, I hadn't banked on the psychological consequences of not having a back up. So am exhausted today BUT I still feel more like me again so I'll just have to deal with this for now.
2 nights of 1.5 hours sleep - but hey I'm still up and functioning, not very well today but I must get over this!
Thanks for replying about the zopiclone . :)
MyNameIsTerry
06-04-15, 11:21
I know what you mean, Crystal. I can remember clock watching, tossing & turning and then finally feeling relaxed enough to fall asleep an hour or two before having to get up! Then being so tired I just wanted to sleep all day and then it starts all over again at night time!
Its frustrating because its like something in your brain is doing it on purpose out of spite.
One thing I can say is that it really use to rock me when that happened. If you can function and not being very anxious, its a step in the right direction. If not, thats ok too, it will come in time.
I think when you come off these sleep aids, you have to wait for your body to reset itself and this is going to come from having a rough week where you sleep little and end up so knackered that you just start sleeping again. Then after that, you get into a rhythm of normal sleep again.
I'm sure I read a sleep method somewhere for body clock resetting that worked by reducing down then going back up.
Have you thought about taking up meditation? Mindfulness is good for anxiety & depression anyway but meditation is also known as an aid to sleep because it helps produce more melatonin. I know there have been studies of meditation and how a session of it gave greater performance benefits than 40 minutes of sleep. Its not going to solve your deficit issues but maybe it can help?
Crystalhiggs
06-04-15, 15:37
Thanks terry, I'm going to do some meditation tonight that my hypnotherapist has given me. It's more relaxing than the Paul McKenna hypnosis which feels heavy and serious. I really don't know how I'm going to get through this but I just have to! It's the worst week as well as my mother in law is coming tomorrow for 2 weeks and we have a big party in Saturday that I can't miss! Testing times!!!
Terry, you've got such great advice and suggestions, I benefit every time I try something from your arsenal! :D I really think we each have something to offer up that will help someone, and because when it comes to meds and how to approach (or stop) we are all different, then when one of us finds something that works, it behooves us to add it to the table! It truly is trial and error, but one that must be done. And you couldn't be more right about the body needing to reset, and that it takes some time, but it will happen. I think that's all most of us want, a decent night's rest that has us up at a good hour in the mornings, and functioning properly. What works for one may not work for another person, however, there will be things that help, we just need to keep selecting until we find what we need.
For me, what worked to come off the Zopiclone was to take a leap of faith with the Trazodone and just do the switch. For you, it was to take it every other night. For some, a slow reduction has done it. Sleep will come again in time, as you say, Terry. And Crystal, because you weren't on them that long, your body will right itself all that much sooner, yes.
I have been where you all have been, too, that place where anxiety about sleep rules, and just the fear of not getting to sleep by itself is a self-fulfilling thing. Laying awake and increasingly upset and uncomfortable, sleep arriving just before it was time to get up. This is where so many of us, in desperation, start with the sleep aids or tranquilizers, and this is where we eventually land up again. And begin taking more, trying to get that sleep we are desperate for. Or like you, Terry, we end up staying up later and later until we find ourselves completely nocturnal, and cut off from our fellow beings. I could get there inside of a week, if I'm not vigilant every single night.
It is a sacrifice, I'm one who enjoys my laptop in the evenings, and watching tv shows when I'm tucked in at night. I have readily fought off sleep because I want to see how a program ends, and then not been able to get that feeling back again all night. I know this sleep hygiene stuff works for me. I know I can relax and drift off when I cut out the technology in the evenings, and really try with the body relaxation and breathing. The question is, how much do I love and care for myself? It's a lot like parenting, I have to be firm with myself. At the same time, I need to free myself to enjoy the process. I really "appreciate" the coziness of the sheets and comforter, the plump of my pillow. How luxurious it feels to stretch out at the end of the day.
And guess what?? After not taking it for the one night, I took my usual 50 mg and slept all night last night!! Didn't get to bed quite on time yet, again, but I have cut out the laptop and the phone. Onward, I will now focus on the bedtime. My little experiment does tell me that once Trazodone is established, then afterwards it is possible to get it to work again as an occasional thing. This reassurance makes me happy.
What a supportive bunch on this thread, I love it!!! Thank you Crystal for starting it, and every person who has dropped in so far. Takin' what I need, and leavin' the rest, I am ...
Marie xx
MyNameIsTerry
07-04-15, 06:09
Thanks Marie. I agree, I have learned loads since joining this place. It has also provided me with ideas to go away and research to try or post on here. I picked up the Omega 3 off here which has definately helped me.
Crystal, thats good. I haven't used PM's sleep one but I have tried a couple of his others and they were based on distracting the conscious mind with backwards counting. Mindfulness is less of an effort in that you only notice and pull thoughts away but the initial exercises to start meditation need some effort as they are breathing based. Mindfulness just can take a while before you see it helping, so stick with it and I have learned by stopping daily practice that you can fall backwards so its something to consider as healthy behaviour for life and professor Mark Williams describes this as a skill rather than a treatment.
Crystalhiggs
07-04-15, 13:36
Completely agree Marie and Terry, this board has been a life saver for me these last few weeks, still is! I feel so supported on here and you guys really understand more than anyone in my 'real' life who as much as I love them realise they don't know how to help that much other than being there for be, which of course I also appreciate hugely!
Funny that the only person I know who has been through this is my son's piano teacher, who have actually developed a lovely friendship with due to having this in common!
Last night I was so, so tired I couldn't eat, went to bed just after 7. Despite how bad I felt I couldn't sleep! Thought this is it, I'm about to die/go crazy. Words in my head started to not make sense it was scary! I did some meditation and heard my husband come to bed around 10. Next thing I knew it was 3.30! So either I got a few hours sleep or I did go mad and list the memory of what went before!
I'm guessing I slept. Even though I still feel rough today it's not like yesterday. Although I've been awake since 3.30...!
Hope tonight will be better!!! X
---------- Post added at 13:36 ---------- Previous post was at 13:33 ----------
Well done crystal... Take the bull by the horns...hang in there and hopefully you'll be fine...
Sleep well.
Chris...
How are you getting on Chris? Have you managed to maintain your 7 hours sleep? :)
MyNameIsTerry
08-04-15, 05:02
It sounds like you slept Crystal, exhaustion must have taken over. This is a good sign though because with insomnia you can find you don't have that and I think thats when you worry most.
Things are going to probably be like this for a short time until your body resets itself. Don't be surprised if it resets with less sleep initially either and then extends from there.
Crystalhiggs
08-04-15, 09:27
Hi well last night was awful, finally dropped off around 5am and woke just after 6. Feeling weird. I hope this will get better!!!
MyNameIsTerry
08-04-15, 09:33
Hang in there Crystal. Just tell yourself that its an adjustment period and can't last. Each new day is a chance to change and it will break.
When I went on Duloxetine (you have to taper up if its for anxiety) at the dose that interacts with adrenaline, I had the worst 8-10 days of my life. The anxiety was far far worse than when I went to my GP because I couldn't handle it anymore. Stupid meds! I knew there was nothing I could do as it would mean going through side effects to start a new one so I just grit my teeth and got on with it. It was very hard but I kept telling myself "tomorrow it could all change" because I knew it was side effects and eventually it did.
Crystalhiggs
08-04-15, 10:44
Thanks terry, that sounds hard what you went through with that. Very difficult to be patient when you feel so bad!
I went back to the doctor this morning, a different one as mine is on holiday. He said he totally agrees with my natural approach and that eventually the body will just sleep. He said to remove my phone from the bedroom completely so I can't check the time or how much sleep I've had.
He was quite a breath of fresh air really and focussed on me finding the root cause of all this. I do still have to get my head around having no crutch to fall back on though, I guess this is where I've become psychologically dependent on the drugs!
For now I'll try and get through the day as best I can, going for hypnotherapy this afternoon so hopefully that will help!
MyNameIsTerry
08-04-15, 10:52
Yeah, it was tough. If you look at Nicola's recent thread on the Ven board, she's just been through it by increasing. It not a pleasant process but oddly some people don't have this at all. When I checked in the leaflet I found I was experiencing one of the less common side effects, adrenaline rushes.
Have you ever seen the film, Crank? With Jason Statham? If you have, think of the lift scene where he comes runnng out screaming...that how I would wake up each morning. It felt very wrong and scary.
Sounds like a good GP. Want one!
To be fair to mine, he doesn't like prescribing for sleep. He prefers the natural route too. I think they are wary of messing around with it because of the dependence issue and sleep is massively important. I'm talking to Greg on his thread about sleep issues and I asked if he ever saw that sleep deprivation experiment on channel 4 many years ago. It was like Big Brother without sleep. I can still remember one of the young guys barely knowing his own name at one point.
Sleep deprivation is a form of torture. Bung someone in a dark cell, barely feed them and keep slamming the lights on in short intervals so they can't reach the required depth of sleep. After a while you get very confused. They did it to break people.
Well don't let her charge you an extra 4 hours if she leaves you there asleep in the chair!
Definately don't clock watch. Resist doing it when you wake too if you can, I know that was an issue for me back in my insomnia days. If you have things going round in your head, write them down on a notepad and leave them. This can help stop you overthinking when you are trying to get to sleep.
Hi crystal....Sorry to read your struggling a little, as they say times a good healer... I've been doing ok, getting around the same amount of sleep... Still waiting for my book to come but I've bin using a guided meditation on you tube... Works quite well...although the mrs is pushing zzzs far before me with this so I've to nudge her awake for me to sleep... Lol...
You'll get there in the end, as hard as it is you've just got to keep doing what you do...as terry says it comes back slowly And starts to reset it's self..
Chris...
Crystalhiggs
09-04-15, 18:00
Hi all, well last night I slept, I don't know how many hours as never looked at my phone but I know i had a good few!
The weird thing is I've felt awful today! Really shaky this morning and a pounding headache and pain all around my eyes this afternoon. I don't get it!!!
Can anyone explain how that would work? Trying to stay positive!!!
MyNameIsTerry
10-04-15, 04:32
Something I have noticed with my Crystal is that if I get a good nights sleep, my anxiety can be a bit more pronounced. The same goes when I am exhausted one day.
I don't get enough sleep and haven't, other than 4-5 nights, for about 9-10 months now. So, I have the odd day where I am exhausted and it kicks in then. On the days after those 4-5 nights of a lot of sleep (10-14.5 hours I had) I found myself more alert but also more 'edgy'.
What I found was if I did 2 good nights back-to-back, that edginess seemed to disappear.
At last you are starting to get something back though which is a good sign. I think your body is so messed about by all this that its going to be up & down a bit until it restores itself so you may have mood issues to go with that.
Crystalhiggs
10-04-15, 07:58
Cheers terry, interesting the way our bodies react isn't it? It's taking a while to get my sleep back. Last night I slept 2.5 hours then was awake for ages then slept another 2-3 I think, although I've stopped clock watching so not exactly sure. Hope today will be better than yesterday. Still glad I stopped the zopicline though, but hoping and praying for full nights followed by good days!
MyNameIsTerry
10-04-15, 08:21
I had some of that too, Crystal. That will go in time, its just all messed up at the moment, its like you body needs to learn what a sleep pattern is again.
Its good that you have stopped any clock watching, thats one that can keep you awake and becomes frustrating.
They always say to get up if you spend 30 minutes trying to get off to sleep but I can't say that helped me as I just woke up further.
It is interesting how it affects our bodies. I've have bouts of dreadful fatigue, months of headaches daily, and adrenaline issues, energy issues, etc. Its hard to manage, I guess its a matter of finding the right groove and settling into it.
Crystalhiggs
12-04-15, 20:16
Hi Terry, I just can't get out of bed in the night no matter how frustrated I am with not sleeping! Was just feeling I was getting a bit of routine but have been away for the weekend and only got 3 hours last night after a party. Think I had too much adrenaline going on! Hey ho, tonight is another night... Fingers crossed it's a good one!!! :)
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions Inc. All rights reserved.