A memory zapping cure for anxiety?

[star2sparkle]

Hi everyone

I have been here several times before.
I have suffered from anxiety and agoraphobia, emetophobia and health anxiety (and I now also have GAD) for 30 years which probably sounds like a long time to many of you but I do have good coping strategies and have never given up.
But I want to share with you a bizarre experience to see what you think and to see if anyone else has experienced anything similar.
Seeing a psychologist can be no mean feat and expensive if not on the NHS but I managed to see one attached to my local hospital. A fluke really that I was referred.
Anyway he reckons he is the memory repair man! He zaps memories using EMDR and he really believes that this therapy works. Wish I had the faith in him!
He had the wrong notes, couldn't find the right chair. There was meant to be a trainee with me (to be on my journey with me) who never turned up. She wasn't even mentioned.
He asked me about my life. I told him and it wasn't pretty. Full of traumatic experiences.
Thing is, when I have anxiety, I am not automatically thinking...Oh God, I remember that time when...! What I am actually thinking is, Christ, not again, what if it isn't anxiety, what if I am ill? That kind of thing. I am not having flashbacks to when I was a kid or another nasty experience. This is when I am not sure EMDR works for GAD or health anxiety. I mean, I am not saying the anxiety does not have an origin, a traumatic memory, or many, (for I know it does, I know I was conditioned as a kid) but that is not often what I am thinking about when I am anxious or when I feel unable to walk down the road.
So he waggles this big ruler in front of me, and I am watching it with my eyes (slowly feeling a bit dazed) and I can't think! I can't think of the memory, or my mother or anything really. I can see him looking at the clock, scratching his groin! He raced through three traumatic memories he reckons I have (which I really couldn't focus on) and then I just said that my distress level had gone down because I know that's what he wanted me to say!
There were no phases that he went through that drpattijane has referred to in another post, and no peaceful place that he suggested I go to.
Then when it was over, it was like, there you are, you are cured of three traumatic memories and you have just found out that it works!
Ummm?!!!
He struck me as incompetent and pretty big headed too as he reckons he has cured hundreds of people. I'd like to know how...where are these people? Course I can't find anything written about him, no feedback. Yet he is a chartered, clinical psychologist!
When I came out, I couldn't even remember what day it was! How that happened, I do not know. My other half said that I seemed more relaxed, but I felt spaced out. I don't know why that is...perhaps it was the partly hypnotic effect of that damn ruler!
I have another appointment on Friday. I haven't felt better (and haven't exactly felt worse either).
What do you think? Any experiences? Would you return to a groin scratching, clock watching psychologist?! :)
Thank you:D

[MyNameIsTerry]

I'm sorry, you've just cheered me up and made me laugh! You reminded me of a guy doing a training session once who sat open legged in front of 3 women working for me at the time and "ball handled" his way through several hours. They just thought he was a bit weird which was a relief as I didn't fancy having that conversation with him!

I can't say I know much about EMDR and you've seen that expert thread but I think swgrl09 has mentioned she has experience of EMDR and I seem to recall her posting on the Therapy board.

EDIT: Yes, she has and so has SarahH and they both tend to be on here throughout the week at some point so perhaps they can help you?

http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?t=158418&highlight=emdr

Love the dog picture by the way. Very cute.

[star2sparkle]

Thanks MyNameIsTerry...good to make you smile :D.
I think the doctor who was on that thread hasn't been around for a while so I am not sure if we will hear from her but it would be good to learn of anyone's experiences and whether I should go back! :roflmao:

---------- Post added at 10:51 ---------- Previous post was at 10:49 ----------

Oh and yes, do you know, he was so bad that he reckoned that my agoraphobia was social anxiety! How can a psychologist confuse them?!

[drpattijane]

what can I say about the "ruler-waggler"?? This is not EMDR therapy but hey, if it worked, great!!!

I use EMDR therapy as my primary psychotherapy treatment and I've also personally had EMDR therapy for anxiety, panic, grief, and “small t” trauma. As a client, EMDR worked extremely well and also really fast. As an EMDR therapist, and in my role as a (now retired) facilitator who trained other therapists in EMDR therapy (certified by the EMDR International Association and trained by the EMDR Institute, both of which I strongly recommend in an EMDR therapist) I have used EMDR therapy successfully with panic disorders, PTSD, anxiety, depression, grief, body image, phobias, distressing memories, bad dreams, and many other problems. It's a very gentle method with no significant "down-side" so that in the hands of a professional EMDR therapist, there should be no freak-outs or worsening of day-to-day functioning.

One of the initial phases (Phase 2) in EMDR therapy involves preparing for memory processing or desensitization (memory processing or desensitization - phases 3-6 - is often what is referred to as "EMDR" which is actually an 8-phase method of psychotherapy). In this phase resources are "front-loaded" so that you have a "floor" or "container" to help with processing the really hard stuff, as well as creating strategies if you're triggered in everyday life. In Phase 2 you learn a lot of great coping strategies and self-soothing techniques which you can use during EMDR processing or anytime you feel the need.

In phase 2 you learn how to access a “Safe or Calm Place” which you can use at ANY TIME during EMDR processing (or on your own) if it feels scary, or too emotional, too intense. One of the key assets of EMDR therapy is that YOU, the client, are in control NOW, even though you weren’t in the past, during traumatic events and/or panic/anxiety. You NEVER need re-live an experience or go into great detail, ever! You NEVER need to go through the entire memory. YOU can decide to keep the lights (or the alternating sounds and/or tactile pulsars, or the waving hand, or any method of bilateral stimulation that feels okay to you) going, or stop them, whichever helps titrate – measure and adjust the balance or “dose“ of the processing. During EMDR processing there are regular “breaks” and you can control when and how many but the therapist should be stopping the bilateral stimulation every 25-50 passes of the lights to ask you to take a deep breath and say just a bit of what you’re noticing, anything different, any changes. (The stimulation should not be kept on continuously, because there are specific procedures that need to be followed to process the memory). The breaks help keep a “foot in the present” while you’re processing the past. Again, and I can’t say this enough, YOU ARE IN CHARGE so YOU can make the process tolerable. And your therapist should be experienced in the EMDR therapy techniques that help make it the gentlest and safest way to detoxify bad life experiences and build resources.

Grounding exercises are essential. You can use some of the techniques in Dr. Shapiro's new book "Getting Past Your Past: Take Control of Your Life with Self-Help Techniques from EMDR." Dr. Shapiro is the founder/creator of EMDR but all the proceeds from the book go to two charities: the EMDR Humanitarian Assistance Program and the EMDR Research Foundation). The book is an easy read, helps you understand what's "pushing" your feelings and behavior, helps you connect the dots from past experiences to current life. Also gives lots of really helpful ways that are used during EMDR therapy to calm disturbing thoughts and feelings.

Pacing and dosing are critically important. So if you ever feel that EMDR processing is too intense then it might be time to go back over all the resources that should be used both IN session and BETWEEN sessions. Your therapist can use a variety of techniques to make painful processing less painful, like suggesting you turn the scene in your mind to black and white, lower the volume, or, erect a bullet-proof glass wall between you and the painful scene, or, imagine the abuser speaking in a Donald Duck voice... and so forth. There are a lot of these kinds of "interventions" that ease the processing. They are called "cognitive interweaves" that your therapist can use, and that also can help bring your adult self's perspective into the work (or even an imaginary Adult Perspective). Such interweaves are based around issues of Safety, Responsibility, and Choice. So therapist questions like "are you safe now?" or "who was responsible? and "do you have more choices now?" are all very helpful in moving the processing along.

I want to share a bit about the research and validation of EMDR therapy:
EMDR has been around since the late 80s and is NOT an experimental treatment. However, ask the hundreds of thousands of people who've been helped significantly around the world and they may tell you it is indeed a wonder-cure. It is considered a first-line treatment by organizations such as ISTSS (International Society for Traumatic Stress Studies), the American Psychiatric Association, the American Psychological Association, the Department of Veteran Affairs, the Department of Defense, the Departments of Health in Northern Ireland, UK, Israel, the Netherlands, France, and other countries and organizations. I can't say enough good things about EMDR therapy. It's changed my life both as a person/consumer, and as a therapist. It's so satisfying to have someone come in for help and then to witness them get through their issues and finish therapy relatively quickly (compared to regular talk therapy, it's like night and day). I am both humbled by and grateful for this wonderful method that heals suffering.

There are 35 randomized controlled (and 20 nonrandomized) studies that have been conducted on EMDR therapy in the treatment of trauma to date. And more excellent research now on the role of eye movements, mechanism of action, and other Randomized Controlled Studies, not only on trauma and PTSD, but also on the use of EMDR therapy with generalized anxiety disorder, treatment of distressful experiences that fail to meet the criteria for PTSD, dental phobia, depression, body dysmorphic disorder, chronic phantom limb pain, panic disorder with agoraphobia, obsessive-compulsive disorder, and peer verbal abuse.

The Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration (SAMHSA) is an agency of the US Department of Health and Human Services (HHS). This national registry (NREPP) cites EMDR therapy as evidence-based practice for the treatment of PTSD, anxiety and depression symptoms. Their review of the evidence also indicated that EMDR therapy leads to an improvement in mental health functioning.

The World Health Organization published Guidelines for the management of conditions that are specifically related to stress: Trauma-focused CBT and EMDR are the only psychotherapies recommended for children, adolescents and adults with PTSD. “Like CBT with a trauma focus, EMDR aims to reduce subjective distress and strengthen adaptive cognitions related to the traumatic event. Unlike CBT with a trauma focus, EMDR does not involve (a) detailed descriptions of the event, (b) direct challenging of beliefs, (c) extended exposure, or (d) homework." (Geneva, WHO, 2013, p.1) I was a member of the review committee for the World Health Organization (cited above) which examined evidence on a number of "standard" treatments for trauma, so I know how rigorous they were in making their determination for these guidelines.

[star2sparkle]

Okay, that's good drpattijane, but I must confess to reading all you have said before.
What about my experience of EMDR?

[Carnation]

Hi Star2Sparkle.

I have just been offered EMDR as part of my recovery.
I had already decided NOT to take it for exactly the reasons you mentioned before you even mentioned them. It just confirmed my fears and gut feeling of what it was going to be like and I am just not willing to take that risk now that I am 80% recovered anyway.

I have to admit that the way you described it made me laugh, but considering it is supposed to be a serious method for one's well-being, it is not funny at all.
I think the ruler would have had me running from the start for fear of what he/she may do with it!?! :ohmy:

[graham58]

what can I say about the "ruler-waggler"?? This is not EMDR therapy but hey, if it worked, great!!!

I've just read star2sparkle's post and I didn’t interpret it as her saying that EMDR worked for her. She seemed at best ambivalent about the procedure and not sure about whether to continue with it or not.