View Full Version : Big row - so upset
My parents, my sister and myself are at home together for New Year.
I hate NY and my family are aware already of that, and I tend to keep it low key and myself to myself and spend most of the time up in my bedroom.
Today had been a nice day, watching tv, chatting, etc. until I mentioned to my sister that I would watch the fireworks on tv upstairs, and then come down to wish all a Happy New Year.
She didn't like this. She said 'so in other words, after midnight?'
I said 'Well you know what I meant, just after the fireworks'.
She then blew up on me, saying that they all have to do what i want every year, because I don't like NY, and that I was selfish and that she was sick of 'Debbie's mental health problems' being 'kowtowed to' all of the time, and how they all have to walk on eggshells around me. She got near hysterical, got right in my face as if to hit me, and then stormed off to another room.'
I feel so upset, guilty about having mental problems - which do affect my mood at this time of year - and like I am a drain and an annoance for my whole family.
I am typing this sobbing to be honest. My sister is an overachiever, and we are poles apart. I have never shaped up to her, and she has never been a disappointment to anyone....and then there is me. I feel like a loser and a cause of grief for everyone.
What was a relatively good day for me - usually I cannot even get out of bed during NY because of my low mood, has turned awful.
Aww Debs, what a horrible nasty thing for your sister to say.
Chances are if she is an over achiever she is not satisfied with what you has managed to do so far either.
Don't be so hard on yourself, and personally I think that you are doing the right thing keeping out of the way.
Hope it all passes quickly for you
Thank you for replying, Elen.
I feel so guilty now. That I ruin things for everyone, but i cannot help the way I am.
I don't want anyone kowtowing to me, which i why I isolate myself.
Thank you again Elen.
I have been right where you are, Debs. What I thought though was, how can they possibly think that yelling at me is going to help at all! Especially if I am already in tears? Second, I wonder where is the compassion? And others told me that I was no more at fault than if I was under the weather for any other reason. Remember this! All you can do is your best. ... I have to say that your sister has issues of her own! Anger management clearly among them. I can't see that she was being made to "do" anything "your way"! It's not as if you were turning the lights off and telling her that she must go to her room too! She was way out of line, honey, just let it go. Dry your tears and find something to distract yourself now. It is after all, just one night. Tomorrow is really the "new year"!
Big hugs,
Marie
Another perspective is that it's their choice too. I mean, if you want to stay home and watch the ball drop etc... then cool. Why does that have to stop everyone else?
Sorry you had to take the brunt of your family's personal issues.
Positive thoughts
Thank you both, Marie and Fishmanpa. xx
My sister is a partner in an Accountants, Marie, and is a pretty hard boss. I just cannot cope with her need to bring it down on me.
Fishmanpa - I did mention that to her. I said that i don't try to change anything they want to do, so why can't she respect my needs too, but she sees my needs as selfish....that i 'put on' my mental health problems as and when.
I honestly don't.
Lots of people don't understand mental illness. It's not your job to teach her. You're doing what you need to do for yourself, and you have that right. It didn't interfere with her enjoyment of the night at all. Push it out of your mind, and look after yourself. Happy New Year, Debs!
Marie xx
I'm sorry your sister has let you down so badly on a day which you find so painful. She is the one with the problem. The fact that she can't control your mood must be very frustrating as she is obviously used to controlling everyone in her "high powered" job.
You sound like a wonderfully caring and compassionate person, Debs. Your sister doesn't. I hope your parents were suitably disgusted with her?
Warmest wishes-let her stew in her own spiteful juice? xx
Thank you, Marie and Pulisa. If i didnt have you and this forum, I would be lost here.
Pulisa, my sister and I are utterly different. Even before I was diagnosed with mental health stuff, she was always the confident one, and I was shy and inhibited. We have always argued and don't get each other very well.
She has a way of dictating without knowing she is. I think you are right about her need for control as she is used to that, but i can't cope with that. Every time I am around her I feel a failure.
My parents agree with her I think, but don't show it to me. My Dad suffers mental health problems too, so he is a bit sympathetic, but I know I still disappoint both of them. My sister said I ruin every New Year.
Thank you all again so much. I couldn't cope without NMP.xx
Wow...sounds like she doesn't really see mental illness as illness at all.
almamatters
31-12-15, 22:21
Sorry to hear about your argument Debs, had similar things said to me by family members and it really hurts. Hope you are feeling better soon. :hugs: x
Thank you so much, alma and Urisainaa for your replies.xxx
I'm sorry you have been so upset Deb.
Your sister has no right to pass judgement on you and your illness. It's a shame no one else was able to step in and give her an education on just how difficult living with mental illness is.
I would also like to say well done for socialising tonight. I known how difficult it is to be amongst people when things are tough.
:hugs: xx
dakotasmom
31-12-15, 23:25
I've been in your position a lot, my family used to go outside and do fireworks which really upsets me and sends me into an instant attack so I chose to stay inside while they did them. Well to them I was ruining their fun and was being too sensitive. Some people just don't understand this is an illness and not something we just make up.
I'm sorry she upset you so badly and I hope you can still enjoy the rest of the day don't let her ruin things for you! :bighug1:
MyNameIsTerry
01-01-16, 05:49
I am typing this sobbing to be honest. My sister is an overachiever, and we are poles apart. I have never shaped up to her, and she has never been a disappointment to anyone....and then there is me. I feel like a loser and a cause of grief for everyone.
Hey Debs, remember, Cognitive Distortions and all that jazz. SHE caused a load of grief for the family who were just ticking along as normal whereas YOU opted to do something quiet that did little more than perhaps cause very mild disappointment. By mild disappointment, I mean the same as the many years I would go out NYE and get hammered with my mates and how my mother would have preferred her kids there with her BUT she accepted that we were adults with our own lives.
So, your parents may only see it along those lines at most DON'T get drawn into the whole negative thoughts & self perception issues we struggle with as this is a very minor thing compared to all the other things you are likely thinking of right now.
And you say your sister has never been a disappointment? Well, how disappointing is it for your parents to see HER over the top aggressive behaviour which has ruined a lovely family day for literally a couple of minutes of it? Aside from being disappointed with her, I would imagine they felt embarrassment too. Can you imagine if she acted that way in the street? How embarrassed would they be with her?
She is a business professional. You can't act like that in business. Nobody respects you if you act like a petulant child! Progressing through the management ranks means you have to lose any behaviours like this or you will simply be mocked behind your back by your peers and probably laughed at too. In larger organisations you have to be quite measured in your responses. It's not the same in SME's but you would still have no respect from anyone if you couldn't control your behaviour.
Was she drinking? Has there been anything else that has caused her to get wound up? Her reaction is very over the top to me and it's makes me wonder whether there are other factors. I don't mean this to reduce the impact of the issue in terms of making her seem more justified, I mean could it be that you have found yourself on end of her anger because of other people or perhaps some booze?
:hugs::bighug1::hugs::bighug1:
I hope you are OK Debs? I'd far rather have a daughter with your qualities than have a daughter with no compassion, empathy or tolerance when things don't go according to plan. I think your depression is making you feel a "failure" as compared to your apparently successful sister? If your sister feels that you "always spoil New Year" why does she choose to spend the day/evening with you? xx
Thank you all for your very kind replies, and sorry for my late one.xx
My sister has gone home now, but my parents have not spoken to me at all today. I feel quite flat and demoralised.
Terry - that is what I don't understand. I had already spoken with my Mum earlier yesterday to let her know that I would watch the fireworks in my room, and be down afterwards to say Happy New Year. She was fine with this. The day was fine up until the discussion with my sister who just blew up about it.
She has control issues. Most things in the family are organised by her. She is a leader and expects others to follow, and I am just not that way, and I kick against it. I feel inferior around her and my esteem drops. It is reaching the point I can't handle her subtle bullying. My parents also get frustrated with my mental health issues, but they understand that I cannot help the way I am, but I get no support from them when she chastises me. This is why i prefer to isolate myself.
I don't know where she is coming from. On one hand she has said to me ' you have a chemical imbalance and it is an illness like any other', during her tolerant moments, but then she also gets angry with things like this, where my mood is up and down, and especially down at NY.
I don't know, Terry. She wasn't drinking yesterday, so it wasn't that. It is just she could not accept what i wanted to do.
Pulisa - Thank you for your kind words as ever. You are right that my depression affects my feeling a failure. I don't have much going for me - I am an unemployed ex-nurse who resigned in 2009 on health grounds, and my life is stuck with no idea which direction to go in. I try to make my own money now by selling clothing via the internet, which is very hit and miss. I love doing it, but don't earn much, but I feel like I am stuck in concrete, have zero confidence and a lot of self-loathing.
I think she still spends NY here for my parents, really.
Sorry to moan. Thank you to all your replies. It means a lot to me.xxxxxxxx
OMG, she sounds like she has a few issues herself Debs.
As Pulisa said if it's such a chore for her why did she bother coming??
I'm stuck in a row at the moment with my 22 year old daughter, who is still in Liverpool,
I went down in July on a visit, I asked her a question and she tore into me, so rather than get into an arguement about the way she spoke to me, I just walked out of her flat and ended up coming back to Scotland early.
I let it all calm down, before I texted her, she doesn't like talking on her phone!!!! I sent her a Christmas card and put some cash into her bank account, but I think I left it too long and now she's dragging things up and 'beating' me over the head with them, and saying some really cruel and nasty things, She wants me to be sorry for walking out of her flat and for being upset at the way she spoke to me. I'm seriously considering deleting her number and just leaving her be.
It's not moaning Debs, it's getting things off your chest. That's what we're here for!!:hugs:
I'm sorry I missed this thread debs. Many before me have answered brilliantly, your sister was way out of line in taking issue when if anything you were thinking of the family rather than yourself.
It sounds like you are being punished for having mental health issues and that just isn't on. Its discriminatory and unfair. You have my total support :hugs:
MyNameIsTerry
04-01-16, 04:54
Debs, this is a classic mistake made by people who haven't learned the lessons of management. I've been through it myself. You make the mistake that you are the one to lead it all and you delegate less & less. It's a personality thing. It can increase someone's self importance and they begin to live for it.
Some of the most important lessons any manager will ever learn are that it's a team effort, people have to be trusted & grown, you can't be a one man army (or woman) unless you want to burn out - and you have to learn to respect your people or they will dislike you and work-to-rule so that when you really need them, they won't be there.
She obviously hasn't learned these basic lessons and I guess it makes sense in a SME. In a big corporate you come undone pretty quickly with some of these or never progress much. Better managers are more balanced managers that value your team. It's no good being this way just because you are the boss, your people just won't work as hard for you...a well known human development subject. Work isn't a workhouse, unions & groups stick together and weaken management because they don't have full control in the modern workplace with all the rights we have and the supporting society we have. People are no longer thrown to starve if they back chat to the wealthy factory owner.
---------- Post added at 04:54 ---------- Previous post was at 04:51 ----------
OMG, she sounds like she has a few issues herself Debs.
As Pulisa said if it's such a chore for her why did she bother coming??
I'm stuck in a row at the moment with my 22 year old daughter, who is still in Liverpool,
I went down in July on a visit, I asked her a question and she tore into me, so rather than get into an arguement about the way she spoke to me, I just walked out of her flat and ended up coming back to Scotland early.
I let it all calm down, before I texted her, she doesn't like talking on her phone!!!! I sent her a Christmas card and put some cash into her bank account, but I think I left it too long and now she's dragging things up and 'beating' me over the head with them, and saying some really cruel and nasty things, She wants me to be sorry for walking out of her flat and for being upset at the way she spoke to me. I'm seriously considering deleting her number and just leaving her be.
It's not moaning Debs, it's getting things off your chest. That's what we're here for!!:hugs:
Sometimes you just can't win, eh?! :doh::doh::doh:
You would think giving her some time to consider her behaviour would do something. Is it more time for something harsher to point out how she should behave?
Regardless of argument, there should always be some level of respect. I hate arguments with my family and try to resolve them quickly as they weigh on me greatly. I'm not sure there is anything they could ever do to change how I feel about that.
Was she always like this?
You're so right !!!! To be honest Terry I'm damned if I do and damned if I don't, yes she's always been a bit 'spiky'. I'll just leave her to stew for a bit!!
I am so sorry I haven't replied recently. I have been trying to sort my head out a bit, so please accept my apologies.
Thank you jimsmrs, fishman and Terry for your replies. I really do so appreciate your support and words. They make me feel less alone in all of this. xxx
jimsmrs, I am so sorry to hear about the problems with your daughter. I do agree with Terry that you can't win here it seems. You very gracefully tried to offer an olive branch by texting and by sending her the card AND money, and it appears she cannot let it lie. It shows some immaturity on her part, to be honest, as life is far too short IMO. I agree that maybe leaving her be at the moment would be primarily the best FOR YOU. You do not need the stress of it, and maybe she needs more time to realise that it is a silly response on her part. You have done all you can do and are blameless....the rest is up to her.xxx You are a kind person and don't deserve her tantrum.
fishman, thank you very much, and please don't apologise. I really was trying to just keep myself to myself as my mood is not the best at New Year, so I thought I would just play it quiet and then come down after midnight. I really did think this was best, but she just wouldn't have it. She think she does have issues with my mental health problems. I honestly think she thinks I put them on for effect, when I feel like it, but I honestly don't. Your support mean so much....thank you.xxx
Terry - You are so eloquent with your replies and so right. My sister is what i would call an 'Alpha Female'. She is confident, outspoken, a hard worker, a perfectionist and has always done things right her whole life - Well behaved child, easy teenager, top student, Top graduate, high achiever, etc, etc. I have found it hard following her as life has not been as smooth for me - Shy and anxious child, academically struggled, bullied at school, low esteem, unstable work history, terrible with money, and the list goes on.
My Mum works in the same place as my sister and even my Mum mentions how forthright she is in the office, and at times seems intimidated by her too. My sister TELLS people what to do, rather than asks, much of the time, both at work and at home, and when we argue I always tell her ' you may be the boss at work, but don't try bringing that home on me', but still she carries on. This is what I can't handle. Because I live with my parents too, I feel like a teenager still, and get treated as such. I don't know what the answer is really.
Thank you for your advice and feedback.xxx:hugs:
Debs
You are a much better person than your sister will ever be. :)
Remember that, and also that you are not alone. People here understand mental illness, and have the compassion to listen and support .
:hugs:
MyNameIsTerry
11-01-16, 08:25
Debs, thanks I really appreciate that!
I think sometimes people get too big for their boots. Let me put it this way, if I acted like your sister in my family house, there would a swift intervention by the one person that has always worn the trousers - my mum! She wouldn't put up with that no matter how successful you are because she is the mum and you are in her house so it's her rules. That simple.
And there, perhaps, lies the problem. She acts like this in the office around your mum, something I would find very uncomfortable as she's my mum and the boss to me growing up. So, because of this, she believes she is the head of the wolfpack no matter where she is.
It's just like when your dog is playing up, you have to show them you are the pack leader or they advance above you.
She might have been the front runner all these years but she has failed in many aspects of her life - her personal qualities. What's the point of being successful if no one respects you? What's the value in having friends that are only your friends because of what you can give them? How fast will they desert you when you need them? Wouldn't you rather be highly successful but respected for being a good & decent person? Why can't the two be associated with success?
I did the whole status chasing thing for years. It brought me to where I am now. Or rather, it did years ago as I have greatly changed. I would rather be friends with an unemployed decent person than a rich & successful nob! All those people who complemented me on things or thanked me...quickly disappeared. It's a different world to them and they just carry on in their rat race so you get left behind. I have lost a few really good friends, I regret this, but I pushed them away so hold no grudges.
I don't want to appear disrespectful of your sister here, and my examples above are not about her personally.
I always think that kindness and empathy are two of the most important qualities to have in life. The bossy control freaks in life are not happy people and are feared more than liked.
I know that doesn't help your situation, Debs. I hope that you are moving on from your distressing experience? Don't let your sister's controlling behaviours get you down? x
Thank you again, Carolin, Terry and pulisa. I really appreciate your kind words and support.xxx
Terry - you are not at all disrespectful here. You speak the truth and make a lot of sense. It really helps me to have a second opinion on things as I feel quite alone sometimes with my thoughts, esepcially on family stuff.x
pulisa - I agree with you. I think those qualities are far more valuable. I could never understand ambitious, driven, bossy people in life, I have met many during my nursing career, and I could never relate to that kind of thing, and I never wanted to surge up any career ladder. I fought agaisnt getting my first low management position on the ward, becasue I knew I did not want that, and was not the type to lead others, but got cajoled into it regardless. I think that it takes a certain type of person. I agree that the bossy, control freak-types are not altogther happy folk, as they are always striving for the next thing or to be the better one at something.
Thank you, pulisa. I am not too bad now, but not looking forward to Friday. It is my Dad's birthday and we are going out for a family meal, so it will be the first time I have seen my sister since the row. I really don't want to be around her right now, but for my Dad I will do so and try to keep a low profile with her. xxx
Thank you all so much again. You are so kind and I am grateful for your advice and friendship xxx:hugs:
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