Diazepam not working?

[Shazamataz]

Hiya,

Without giving you all a lengthy, tedious description, I've had a rough 3 months. Was on escitalopram, started having severe panic attacks and GP gave me diazepam, which I have used before short term with great success through a rough patch.

Long story but I tapered off escitalopram after having a bad reaction to doubling my dose. Was doing better until week 4 and the anxiety got really bad again, failed sertraline and am now on day 17 of citalopram, day 10 of 20 mg (which has worked well for me in the past).

Of course, while this is kicking in, and dealing with the effects of coming off the other one I have been using diazepam. This was supposed to be temporary but has ended up being almost daily for two months (between 4 and 8 mg). Unfortunately I am now finding the dose that worked in the past (4 mg used to send me to sleep for a good couple of hours and anxiety all gone) doesn't even touch the anxiety and am feeling a bit desperate. I expect I have taken the diazepam long enough to become tolerant/dependent so need to keep taking it and lower the dose gradually, but how to cope with the constant anxiety while the citalopram kicks in. Help!!

[MyNameIsTerry]

I struggled with Citalopram myself. It was my first of the two meds I've tried and I was ill prepared by my GP and side effects hit me really hard. I had to take Zopiclone to sleep at all and my moronic GP gave me incorrect instructions (according to the crisis team) so I became tolerant and had to taper off that after a month. So, I can understand your frustration with having some of this myself.

I think given what you have said, it's sounds likely with the Diazepam that you are tolerant to it and I know you will get some hits off people on here who look at threads like this. So, hang on and I'm sure you will get some responses.

I have to say it is extremely irresponsible for a GP to do this to you. A doctor can decide to use a treatment if it is better than the alternate but it's normally psychiatrists with meds like this long term as GP's are supposed to use them short term only if yours have the same standards as we have in the UK, which I would expect as Benzo's have been controlled for a long time under the UN.

What I can say is that I found my side effects with Citalopram did seem to ease a bit in week 3 and then further in weeks 4 & 5. Did you find the same in the past? Hopefully this will be the case for you because you are nearly there.

There are people on here who have beaten Benzo tolerance so I expect you will get some excellent advice on where to go with this.

One piece of advice is if your GP suddenly decides to pull the plug on your Diazepam, fight this all the way because sudden withdrawal can be dangerous but sadly I've seen a couple of threads in 2015 from people in the UK who's ignorant GP's tried to do just that! You need to taper down safely and some of the people I'm hoping will reply will be able to tell you how they have done it and what it was like. You can do it though!

[Shazamataz]

Thanks Terry,

My GP is actually very good. Our mental health system is NOT good and so she has been working with me instead so I don't have to go through them. Ironically I also work in mental health so have wanted to avoid the system!

With regard to the diazepam, this is something I have used on and off for years but not consistantly. Just in 'emergency' situations such as getting on a plane (an anxiety I have never conquered).

The mess I'm in started 3 months ago and, of course we tried a short stint of diazepam to calm things down but I ended up having major SSRI issues and then two SSRI changes and all that increased anxiety and before we knew it I've been taking diazepam for 2.5 months!

The GP is very good and very responsible and so I know she won't suddenly pull the diazepam. We have already discussed that I will probably need to wean down off it. It's just so frustrating now that it isn't giving me any relief but I don't want to take a higher dose and create a tolerance/dependence on a higher dose and the issue escalates.

Day 18 of citalopram today. Still feeling really rough. I can't remember it ever being so bad starting up in the past but then my anxiety is a lot worse now than it ever has been...

[MyNameIsTerry]

I'm glad you have that faith in them.

I think it would be worth getting a view off others on here because some say withdrawal from Diazepam is much harder towards the end and easier when you drop from the higher doses. This could mean that through this really rough period, a slight increase might be worth it? I could be giving bad advice here, I've not been tolerant to it, but if it's a possible low risk strategy it may give you some respite to get through this hard time. I'm hoping some of the other people on here who understand the withdrawal can give you some advice on that and tell you the possible risks so you can make your own decision.

[dally]

Hi shaz
I was prescribed a low dose of 2=4 mg Valium to help me through an exposure programme for agoraphobia..
I only took one dose twice a week to get out,and about
I did this for over a year.
Soon I was experiencing no effect at 4 mg but it wasn't until my panic attacks and IBS symptoms were becoming more severe and more frequent that the penny dropped, I was in tolerance\withdrawal.
I stopped ct on 24 Feb 2015, due due GPS bad advice. I should've tapered. But was constantly told I didn't have to, due to infrequent\low dose...
Within 2 weeks of stopping I was having severe withdrawals.

Valium is a very effective drug FOR SHORT TERM USE..no longer than 2 weeks.
But it can be tapered off successfully by most people, with educated supervision.
(Unfortunately, most GPS are not educated in this area)

I would also say tolerance\addiction can be dependent on individual body genetics, weight, other health issues etc
As does the ease in which you can withdraw from Valium. But, you CAN withdraw.

Read the Ashton manual. To be able to make an informed decision on Valium.

IMO. I would increase your dose of Valium till you reach a stable panic free state.
Then maintain that dose for up to 2 weeks. Or until your ADs have kicked in. Then begin a slow taper as per Ashton manual schedule.

[MyNameIsTerry]

Thanks dally, you were one of the people I was hoping would notice this thread. :yesyes:

What you mention about raising it until you reach a beneficial stage before withdrawing is what I have seen mentioned on here before. I think Nicola also said this to someone else.

[nicola1980]

Hi I ended up being on 10mg of Diaz daily for over a year due to struggling to find an AD to suit me, to be honest the withdrawal wasn't bad, I just took it very slow and reduced by 1mg at a time and then when I got lower like 3mg i would cut my pills into quarters and reduced slowly at a quarter a time. I agree tho for now you need to increase your Diaz so your anxiety is bearable but please don't worry about withdrawal as it was fine for me XX

[lindadiana]

ive been on diazepam for 20 years,2mg 9 tablets daily,yes you will need more and more as time goes by that's what happens,but I always run out of pills a day before they are due,im really anxious when I have none but after 24 hours without them I still get relief after taking them,i was put on them at 19 years old in 1979 I spent all my twenties on them and that was on 5mg 4 times a day then,i stopped taking them bit by bit and it took me a year,im sure I could have done it quicker,but I wanted no side effects withdrawel wise,so the longer you take to wean off the less you will feel,i, was off them for 8 years,but was put back on them after a really bad thing came about concerning my then husband,i had to get divorced things were really bad, id also had a bad chest for weeks and I was in a state of panic all day every day.i was put on six a day 2mg aged 38,then my son died the following three months later, I was put on 9 a day2mg I got back down to 5 2mg a day,right up until my mum died xmas 08 then it was back up to 9 2mg a day,ive stayed at that,my dad died the following xmas so with having three youngish kids as well with no man around it was very hard to cope,it still is very hard to cope alone,but without diazepam I don't know how I would have got through stuff at all,my grandma took diazepam(it was nicknamed mothers little helper)it wasn't known apparently how addictive they are.so yes they are addictive,dependig on how many your taking and for what reason,odd ones here and there for dentists etc,no you wont get addicted I doubt vey much,i became addicted the first time in 1979 because my sisters son had died and the drs suggested we all take a valuim for the day of the funeral,i felt so much better after taking it,nobody else in my family carried on taking them,so its the person too that counts as well,i aws already bad with my nerves they were not.so you see no matter how long you have been taking them you can get off them again im proof of that,you can reduce doses or step them up a little,my gps have offered me anti depressants etc,but I say why use something else that may make things a lot worse,they said I can take them with the diazepam long term no worries,ive always refused,being on diazepam knowing its my only way of coping is not really the best,but if needs be then so be it,a few months on them or even a year would be more easy to stop them,but like I said ive been up and down and on and off them thoughout my life.

[Shazamataz]

Thanks for your helpful replies. It certainly makes sense to up the dose temporarily to actually get some relief. I know that a lot of what I am experiencing is the settling in with the citalopram which has made me anxious 24/7 instead of just having panic attacks.

I will still be careful but it sounds like if I need to take a little more for a few days it won't be a big deal.

I will admit to being worried about coming off it and then not having it there as I have for years for 'emergencies'. So I have some personal work to do on dealing with anxiety without the quick fix assistance.

Thanks again :)

[MyNameIsTerry]

I think what people mean is lifting the amount you take ongoing so that you become stabilised at a new dose because the current dose is putting you in withdrawal on top of the rest. Then withdraw later.

Maybe upping until outside the side effects window could work but you need to be prepared for it not being the case too and have a strategy because these meds can take longer to help us. I hope not though and they kick in sooner or at least the side effects reduce soon but perhaps the question to ask is whether the Diazepam was doing enough before all this and if the answer is no, then upping to a more regular dose may be more appropriate? I'm sure the others will know about this.

[Shazamataz]

I think what people mean is lifting the amount you take ongoing so that you become stabilised at a new dose because the current dose is putting you in withdrawal on top of the rest. Then withdraw later.

Maybe upping until outside the side effects window could work but you need to be prepared for it not being the case too and have a strategy because these meds can take longer to help us. I hope not though and they kick in sooner or at least the side effects reduce soon but perhaps the question to ask is whether the Diazepam was doing enough before all this and if the answer is no, then upping to a more regular dose may be more appropriate? I'm sure the others will know about this.

I'm confused about how I could be experiencing diazepam withdrawal if I take it every day? Admittedly I don't take the same amount every day as it's been so drummed into my head how bad it is to be on for a lengthy period. I wonder if part of the reason it's not working well is because I'm so anxious about the drug itself?

[dally]

Hi shaz
You can suffer from interdose withdrawal.
I had this. I only took a dose roughly one or twice a week, but if I had missec a dose or hadn't taken valium by the end of a week, I would get a major panic attack for no reason, which eventually I realised was on a 7=9 day cycle and was shortening as time went on

So people end up taking valium more frequently or up the dose to prevent these symptoms escalating.
This is tolerance\addiction forming. But i\people think it is 'just' their anxiety increasing.
It is your body's need for more Valium.

You CAN withdraw from Valium. So do not worry about that. Take whatever dose you need, in order to relieve your symptoms right now. Maintain that stable daily dose so that you are symptom free. Then start a taperi g schedule. As per the Ashton manual.