Need Advice on work anxiety

[Chocolateface]

Hi

I have a couple of issues I need advice on.

The first is at work today I spent sometime doing what I truly believed to be the right task following information I wad given, it seems I did not need to do the task. I asked my manager what I wad supposed to have done and what the task meant but she could not remember why she had set it. As we were leaving she told me not to worry about it but that has made me worry more. I do have this thing where if I think something may happen I play out the situation in my head and get to the worst scenario then this gives me a panic / anxiety attack. Not sure how to approach this or what will happen from it.

The second issue is we had a work meal out (which I didn't want to go to because of the above but couldn't see a way out, so I went and it was ok). My manager didn't go due to other plans which was fair enough, however a colleague didn't come as she said after 5pm is her time, so fair enough she doesn't have to attend. During the meal the conversation got on to her in that if she is asked to do a task before 9am she informs people her start time is 9am, likewise if she is asked at 4.50 she informs people it is almost hometime and she always has her full hour lunch break. A more senior manager then said that this needs to to tackled or they will be looking for another member of staff. Now I like this girl, so should I say something to her or just keep out of it?

Feel a bit confused right now, not sure what to do

Clare

[Fishmanpa]

Ok... I'm a manager so I'm giving you my first hand experience.

1st scenario? Leave it be. Your manager doesn't seem to be concerned about it. In the future, it's always a good idea to clarify (repeat back) instructions given.

2nd scenario? Instead of spilling the beans about what was said at that gathering, I would approach it another way. Many employers/managers look at the work ethic of an employee and one that is a clock watcher, refusing to do anything outside of their scheduled time are typically frowned upon and eventually replaced by someone willing to go the extra mile once in a while. When you observe or hear her say these things, that's an opportunity to say just that.

Positive thoughts

[Oosh]

1st issue. I'm exactly the same ! We've got to learn to recognise when there's really nothing there and that its just us being neurotic and be able to completely look away and forget. Step back and observe so you can say "this isn't a real concern. This is just me doing that worrying thing again".
Work on completely forgetting. Throw yourself into something else fully. Then it's gone :)

I've got to admit I'd probably tell her. I'd weigh up if she was going to be hot headed and go blabbing and confronting everyone. If I thought she'd just appreciate it and take it on board I'd tell her. It's just watching her back for her. It's what friends do. I don't think anyone would think negatively for watching her back.

[Chocolateface]

Thanks for the replies, will try to relax and see what happens from it with regard to first topic and if I get to speak to my friend on our own will try yo subtly rsise it with her

Clare

[MyNameIsTerry]

Don't worry about the first issue, that's just your anxiety focussing on something like before.

Ok, the first thing that shines out to me is that either this "more senior manager" had been drinking or doesn't understand what professionalism is. It's a rookie management mistake to discuss these issues in front of their staff. All that does is create animosity in the workplace when it gets back and staff will be quoting that manager against the employee.

This manager should have moved the conversation on, shut it down telling them it is an inappropriate topic of conversation, etc. Whilst people talk about issues in their work or about other members of staff, managers can't allow themselves to be dragged into it or sit and see it discussed as it's basically moaning. It can be hurtful to the other employee. Remember, you could be the best employee and have people complaining about you.

Complaining to a manager means you are following procedure, gossiping is not procedure and can be very unpleasant if you are on the end of it.

A manager should also not be joining in, they may state they understand how & why people feel that way but that's as far as it goes. To state you may take a Capability process action against someone to dismiss them is a confidential matter between them, their manager and a HR team. It's NOT to be discussed with everyone, it's a DPA issue when actually taking place for a start.

To suggest they may replace them if they don't change is pretty disgusting in front of that persons peers. It's similar to voicing it in the workplace, it's unprofessional.

What are this person's crimes?

1) They have their allotted breaks. The law states minimum break times and by taking them she is only taking what the DWP says she should and this is also for health & safety reasons. No employer should have a problem with that, they have no choice but to follow it.

2) She won't start before 9am. Fair enough, are they paying her to work overtime? If they want her to work earlier for nothing, she could just come in a couple of minutes before. There is nothing wrong with that.

3) She stops working 10 minutes before her shift ends. This is the opposite of 2) and in this case she is at fault. She is paid until 5pm and so should work until then. This is simple to address and the manager should have spotted it anyway. This is a Capability issue and can be taken forward & monitored. If she won't comply, they can follow their procedures up to dismissal if they wish too and as long as they do it properly, there will be no comeback in a tribunal.

It depends on the work too. You can't just hang the phone up on a customer or walk out leaving boxes all over the floor. If you need to do a couple of extra minutes, you do. But some employers try to make staff work an extra 10-15 minutes all the time and this ends up amounting to hours in over time and they get sneaky by adjusting contracts to say anything under X can't be added to overtime claims. So, employees are right to keep an eye on this behaviour.

Should you tell them? Well, how much do you want to put yourself in the firing line over it? How will the people at that meal be if they find out you did? What if she kicks off? The level of frustration may depend on the amount of hassle it causes.

"Working to rule" is something staff (and unions) do when management refuse something and the staff group together and demonstrate how much management suffer for all those little extras that staff do for them that they really are not entitled too. There is a world of difference between taking your breaks and sticking to your contract than digging your heels in over a dispute.

Bare in mind that some people may have been mistreated, or feel they have. This may have been by a previous employer and they have become wary. They may just like to keep work as work and prioritise their real life, the one outside of work, over their working lives. Not everyone wants to waste their time on their employer to attend a meal when they could be spending it with their loved ones or on something important. This is why employers end up scheduling team meals inside working hours as sometimes you don't just get the odd person, you get a load of them asking why they should lose out just because a manager wants a team bonding exercise.

Replacing someone just because you don't like their work ethic when they are servicing their contract is Constructive Dismissal territory. Managers doing that lack scruples. Employees have cover under the law but if managers want to get nasty, they can use various dirty tricks to "manage out" people e.g. a push here & there, a bit of extra pressure, create some bad feeling, make the person feel bad, etc. Seen it done many times and it's unpleasant. It's also very hard for an employee to prove.

From a former manager.

[Chocolateface]

Thanks Terry I believe I am overthing the first part but given what has happened in the past I struggle to rationalise it. I think I will stay quiet for now on the second one and see what happens. Scary to think that managers can manage people out if they want to and is what I feel my manager is doing or going to do to me.

Your advice is as always much appreciated and does settle my anxiety somewhat so thank for for taking the time to reply

Clare

[MyNameIsTerry]

Yes, the first one is like before. Just think though, perhaps there is a thread on an anxiety forum somewhere on the internet titled "I set one of my staff a task and couldn't remember it when they said they had done it, am I losing my mind??? HELP!!!" :winks:

She is probably questioning it herself and likely shrugging it off as "one of those days".

I think you just worry about your performance and how you are being perceived. You have no need to with that issue. It's a minor thing that happens all the time. I've done it with people that worked for me a fair few times, sometimes managers are just working on something else and forget like everyone else. They would be robots if they didn't do things like this.

The thing about that other person is whether it's a friend. If it were me and they were a friend, I wouldn't be happy and would be telling them as my own morals would be stronger towards my friend than my work...and I would have felt bad just for being there and not defending them, which I think is normal. But if it's just a work colleague, you can decide whether it's worth the trouble. She may know that her work style means she won't be looked on favourably by management and she may accept that.

It's the same in management circles. I worked with managers we termed "9-to-fivers" who just came in, did their bit and disappeared without a care in the world while the rest of us were doing overtime for free to get the job done. The thing is, it doesn't matter how much good you do if you don't "fit" anyway and a "9-to-fiver" could "fit" regardless because managers also understand that we have lives ourselves and don't always want to be working over our shift hours, often for people who won't say thank you anyway. So, it can depend on so many things.

With managers, you will know if they are like that. They won't be nice people for a start. If your manager is fair with you, the chances are high that they are a good person who will continue to do so. If your manager displays negative character traits, you will see them, staff always did wherever I have worked. Those managers tend to be unfair to their staff, treat them more like numbers than a team, can be irrationally unfair and blame people.

If your manager isn't like that, I doubt there is any worry. You had some worries along those lines before and then you had a good appraisal of it all and that's an important thing to remember about how you were treated, the rest was an anxiety thing.

[Lucinda07]

I have a couple of comments re: your work colleague.

Does she have children (or other dependants) to care for & this is why she works just the set hours? Does she have a v long journey to work?

It was inappropriate for the Snr Manager to participate in the gossip. If you tell this lady about the conversation what would the outcome be? The others could deny having made such comments & round on you! It might be an idea to say (at an appropriate moment) that flexibility & the willingness to go the extra mile, occasionally, goes down well with colleagues & management alike.

[lior]

On the 'don't worry about it' thing - it's a phrase lots of people use to mean different things. I find that people who aren't anxiety sufferers don't really mean 'worry'. The word 'worry' can trigger anxiety in me, even if it has the word 'don't' before it. It's similar to telling someone 'don't look down!' - you end up looking down, because the idea to do so is put in your head.

You might also have been picking up on the emotions in the situation rather than the words. It's your manager's responsibility to delegate tasks to you, and make sure you understand what you need to do. It's your job to get those things done, and make sure you understand what she means to the best of your ability. You did your best. Sounds like your manager slipped up. She's human. We all do that. You, also, are human. Doesn't sound like you slipped up though.

About the other situation - there are all sorts of reasons why people work 9-5. She might have worked too much in the past. She might not enjoy her work. She might be protecting her time off. She might think in principle that she shouldn't work for when she isn't paid. She might have mental health issues, who knows?

Whatever the reason, it's her right to decide her approach. If that doesn't make her right for the job, she'd probably move somewhere else. I find that if someone is asserting their right to just work 9-5, they're probably not going to change their mind for one job - they can find another job that lets them work 9-5 only.

[Chocolateface]

Thanks again Terry, I did ask my manager again today and she didn't seem overly concerned by the whole thing.

As for my friend I think it is at a point where something will be said regardless, so I think I will let them have a chat to her then if she doesn't do what they ask talk to her then.

Lucinda, she doesn't have kids or live far from work I think she just sees it as a job whereas a lot of us see our company as a family as this is how our executive team want to lead the company

Clare

[Fishmanpa]

As for my friend I think it is at a point where something will be said regardless, so I think I will let them have a chat to her then if she doesn't do what they ask talk to her then.... I think she just sees it as a job whereas a lot of us see our company as a family as this is how our executive team want to lead the company

Clare

Good way to look at it. There's also the MYOB approach which I find prudent in situations like this.

Positive thoughts