Autism

[bluebottle]

I first came here in 2005 after my marriage ended, and since then I have discovered a lot about myself. Probably the biggest thing is that my social anxiety is due to my autism, and I only found out about the autism fairly recently. I am High-Functioning Autistic. Not Aspergers. There is a difference. Anxiety is a big part of autism, especially social anxiety. And autism is a lot more common than people think. I'm reading NEUROTRIBES by Steve Silberman at the moment. I recommend it to everyone who is curious about their anxiety, and their personality. What if we stopped trying to get rid of our social anxiety and instead embraced who we are?

[Oosh]

That's really interesting. How did you find out it was autism ? I've always been socially anxious from as far back as I can remember. I functioned very well for a long time but was definitely still weirdly socially anxious despite feeling pretty high self esteem and confidence.

[SA40S]

Hi, i've wondered for quite a long time now if there might be more to my SA than meets the eye. I've read up on Autism and seem to have some of the characteristics, i don't want to describe them all here but i've also done an online Autism test and the scores were fairly high, high enough to suggest that i may have mild autism. I don't know whether to go to my doctor or not, i'd thought about asking my doctor to refer me for a proper autism test.

[NoraB]

Hi Kenny,

My son was diagnosed autistic three years ago and it was at that time that I realised that my own lifelong issues might be due to autism. I was on the verge of going to my GP for a referral when my anxiety went orbital so getting help for that took precedence. Like you, I score high in the online tests (Aspergers) and it would definitely explain why my social problems, despite years of trying, cannot be overcome. Anxiety and autism tend to go hand in hand...

Go to your GP but when you do - go with the reasons why you want to be assessed. Write them down if possible. You have ten minutes to convince them that you should be referred. I have trouble talking in situations so I always write things down and give the paper to the GP. My reasons are an explanation for my difficulties and the fact that a diagnosis would help with employment if I was ever in a situation where I had to take any job offered. In certain situations, like working on a checkout, I would be off on the sick within a week. Not because I'm shy (I'm not) but because my brain does weird stuff in those situations.

All the best.

[SA40S]

Hi Kenny,

My son was diagnosed autistic three years ago and it was at that time that I realised that my own lifelong issues might be due to autism. I was on the verge of going to my GP for a referral when my anxiety went orbital so getting help for that took precedence. Like you, I score high in the online tests (Aspergers) and it would definitely explain why my social problems, despite years of trying, cannot be overcome. Anxiety and autism tend to go hand in hand...

Go to your GP but when you do - go with the reasons why you want to be assessed. Write them down if possible. You have ten minutes to convince them that you should be referred. I have trouble talking in situations so I always write things down and give the paper to the GP. My reasons are an explanation for my difficulties and the fact that a diagnosis would help with employment if I was ever in a situation where I had to take any job offered. In certain situations, like working on a checkout, I would be off on the sick within a week. Not because I'm shy (I'm not) but because my brain does weird stuff in those situations.

All the best.

Hi NoraB, thanks for your advice, i'll write everything down that needs to be said to my doctor. With my SA, i've tried numerous things, CBT, exposure to anxiety provoking situations and medication but nothing has helped my social anxiety, it's been like this for decades. It's only over the last 2/3 i've read about autism and started to suspect that i might have a mild form of it. For me, a diagnosis would offer an explanation for my anxiety problems.

[feelthelove]

My daughter in law is a teacher and has studied about autism , my anxiety and panic started when i was 4 and i have never been well since with one thing or another due to panic and anxiety .

She mentioned to my son that she thinks i have a mild form of autism and that many people go un-diagnosed throughout their lives.

I tick all the boxes also but my GP won't refer to see a specialist, he is a very very good doctor and very understanding but i think maybe the budget won't allow this .

I am receiving CBT at 'open minds' and i was wondering if i should mention this to my therapist to see if she can get me a referral .

I have never been able to sit in meetings such as school assembly's and find it difficult to learn due to lack of concentration , big places small places being alone being in groups and even one to one i find difficult.

Also another symptom of autism is being sensitive to loud noise, i have never been able to tolerate loud noise and have to wear earplugs , my daughter in law noticed this and she said this is a common symptom of autism .I also suffer tinnitus not sure if that's an indication of autism either , maybe its just one other thing that i suffer due to anxiety .

[NoraB]

I tick all the boxes also but my GP won't refer to see a specialist, he is a very very good doctor and very understanding but i think maybe the budget won't allow this .

The National Autistic Society is a great website. I've also phoned the helpline a few times and they are very helpful.

This link is about getting a referral.

http://www.autism.org.uk/About/Diagnosis/Adults/process

[bluebottle]

The National Autistic society are crap.

[bluebottle]

Autism is not a mental health issue, but it does cause mental health issues. As you know our brain is hard-wired to anxiety and as such we have to cope with a world always on full volume. I'm afraid getting diagnosed is not easy because the CCGs and NHS and councils are making the process hard because they don't want to help vulnerable people as it costs money. Money which is our money of course, and which they are employed as public servants to use to help vulnerable people.

[bluebottle]

Yes I have good self-esteem and confidence. I did a lot of research. One thing most of us autistics are good at is research! I started looking at highly-sensitive people. Also I am a INFJ personality. I kept coming across autistic people in these groups too. It all began to fall into place.

[NoraB]

The National Autistic society are crap.

When my son was diagnosed, we were given his diagnosis and that was that - we had no idea what to do from there. NAS helped us a great deal. That's from a parent's perspective.

[pulisa]

Yes I have good self-esteem and confidence. I did a lot of research. One thing most of us autistics are good at is research! I started looking at highly-sensitive people. Also I am a INFJ personality. I kept coming across autistic people in these groups too. It all began to fall into place.

I know you won't like me saying this, bluebottle, but too much "research" can be unhelpful and can make you extremely vulnerable and suggestible to all kind of theories. generated by unscrupulous individuals. All this just generates anger and anxiety.

[bluebottle]

I know you won't like me saying this, bluebottle, but too much "research" can be unhelpful and can make you extremely vulnerable and suggestible to all kind of theories. generated by unscrupulous individuals. All this just generates anger and anxiety.

It may make you anxious. Not me. I take what I need and leave what I don't. And I don't mind you saying it, as long as you aren't insinuating that research is a bad thing for me. You see I am intelligent and able to decipher fact from fiction.

[pulisa]

I've no doubt that you are intelligent but you are also very vulnerable.

[pulisa]

The National Autistic society are crap.

I think they struggle with high functioning autism and consequently a lot of people fall into that "grey area" where appropriate help is very limited if available at all.

[bluebottle]

I've no doubt that you are intelligent but you are also very vulnerable.

What a patronising comment. Kindly don't respond to my posts again.

[pulisa]

Fair enough.

[jojo2316]

What a patronising comment. Kindly don't respond to my posts again.
I feel I should point this out to you bluebottle: Pulisa is one of the compassionate people here and we are so lucky to have her on NMP. She would never intend to make you feel patronised. She has experience of autism - as do I - and she is kind

[NoraB]

What a patronising comment. Kindly don't respond to my posts again.

Taken from a previous thread..


I've been a member of this site for almost 20 years but I haven't visited for a while. Back then I hadn't got my diagnosis of Asperger's and I'd recently got divorced. Now I find myself isolated and lonely and I'd like to make a few friends.

You might want to reign in the hostile attitude when commenting then BB..

Pulisa is one of the best on here. She's kind, compassionate, and everything that makes for a lovely human being. She has a lot of experience around autism. She was trying to support you!

[jojo2316]

Hi again Bluebottle, I’ve been debating with myself about whether to reply to you again. I wondered if you might view my words as hostile, as perhaps you often view the words of others as hostile? But then I thought even if you do think I am being unkind, then that won’t make anything worse for you. But, if there is even the remotest chance that we can help you by suggesting you look at things differently, then it is worth it.

You say you are isolated and lonely and that must be really hard for you. I have loved ones who are autistic and may have autistic tendencies myself so I know a little bit about how social interactions can be stressful.

I feel I have got to know Pulisa a bit over the years. I’ve seen her help so many people with kindness, tact and great wisdom. She has helped me in my very darkest moments. So I know with certainty that she replied to you with nothing other than a desire to help a little, to offer support and insight.
It was interesting to me that you viewed her words as malign (“patronising”). And then, as NoraB pointed suggested, I began to wonder if this is a common theme for you? I wonder if you often find people are being hostile, patronising or unkind? And whether this leads to a difficulty in forming friendships...... and in turn your feelings of isolation? If there is even a remote chance this is true I would very much urge you to think carefully and openly about how you interpret people (incredibly hard I know)..... because the key to unlocking a more rewarding and connected life might be there.

[NoraB]

I began to wonder if this is people are being hostile, patronising or unkind? And whether this leads to a difficulty in forming friendships...... and in turn your feelings of isolation? If there is even a remote chance this is true I would very much urge you to think carefully and openly about how you interpret people (incredibly hard I know)..... because the key to unlocking a more rewarding and connected life might be there.



We see anxiety as a way of coping. It may have been when we were young. Now we can use kinder and more efficient ways. Like reaching out to loving people, in mutual compassion.

A comment of BB's from 2014 (pre-diagnosis) and plenty more where that came from!


I am sending you my heart-felt respect and compassion. Good luck.

Beautiful, no?

Autistic now means autistic then.

Getting an autism diagnosis - especially later in life - is very challenging and can be as problematic as it can be helpful. I sympathise and empathise, but this person clearly knows how to conduct themself on a public forum looking at their historic threads/comments.

BB will always have had issues interpreting people; it's par for the course of being autistic, but this blatant (and consistent) rudeness wasn't there historically as far as I can see, and that's my issue.

Whatever the cause is for this current attitude malfunction; it isn't autism.

We all deserve to be treated with respect - especially Pulisa - who couldn't be any kinder or respectful to people and who has her own crap to deal with.

Hopefully BB will see fit to mend that particular bridge? I hope so, because life is tough enough without alienating people who are trying to support us.

Anyway, that's me. I'm off to wipe bird shit off my conservatory roof. :yesyes:

[Ponder]

Sarcasm only serves to injure more. Especially when it is publicly directed from an elevated position. This is not a helpful for those browsing in hope to find helpful connections. Seeing all this dragging up of past comments shows well the futility of public admonishing. Most certainly best dealt with by those who understand such things.

I understand well from my own experience and like to think I have tempered well having to undue such things. The active forums seemingly full of pit falls when it comes to tight nit groups who often tar and feather as they do. Just reading summons up on air of defense not so much for those who have a hard time conducting themselves. To be sure I agree that the issue in finding it hard to respond with such polite precision is not as much related to autism as it is to intellectual brow beating.

I took the time to read between the lines and sorry I missed the opportunity to join in.
____________________

I'm here now - but again from my reading doubt I will be for long. I don't take kindly to anyone being publicly roasted like that. I suggest you do it in PM - or otherwise you can fence with new comers like me.

I got many labels and care less to use any of them as an excuse. It's this kind of contention that drives people to the brink.

BB - I know we got issues like many others and propose we would do well to hold back when others do not understand. I won't tell you what to say, how to feel or what you should do - but I do understand how it is that intellectual masturbation as it often be with forum cliques drives and how they love to press our buttons. Some people make it an art or have a PHD in niceties and saying all the right things. We do better focusing on what works for us and leave them be. I know it's hard when all we have done is hit out for so long. There antics in reply show they need just as much work.

As far as the challenges go re said labels - I'd like to think I know you well but mindful not to assume as I understand well the damage that can do.

I do hope you come back. I clearly sense I am going to need a few friends if I am to stick this place out; as was myself invited a few months ago buy good online friend. Unfortunately they have no journals here which I find a much safer place. I'll tread carefully but don't mind lending support when I feel it's needed.

Peace be with your friend.

[bluebottle]

Peace be with your friend.

Thank you. Very nice of you.

I am leaving the forums. They aren't what they were. I came here after my divorce about 15 or more years ago. I can't remember the exact dates. It was a life-line. Not any more. So good luck to you Ponder. In all that you do.

[pulisa]

I'm sorry you find us hostile, BB. People who don't have autism can also be affected by aggressive posts.

[Ponder]

Hi Bluebottle. Not meaning to influence you either way but just share is all with maybe the hope it helps you, myself and others similar ... feel more 'ok' Like I thank 'you' for responding! Oh man if I only had a dollar every time I said I was going and in fact often do only to come on back in the hope to meet up with an old friend or two. I do this often in the over at http://anxietyforum.net/forum/forum.php [A Home for Those with Anxiety, Fear, or Panic Attacks.]

Now if I just broke the law by linking another anxiety forum, I do apologize and ready to be roasted but in all fairness it was in fact through the latter that I heard about this place and why I am even here. Where I hail from is a ghost town compared to this place. Although in saying that, ghost towns still have appeal. I am willing to keep trying here but will share how and why that is so hard for a fellow like me. BTW the topic of this thread plays largely into how I came into this world. My perspective on said traits, I see more as a limitless ability that plays with well with my strengths. This world from my personal experiences I see as no other than an uncontrollable force that keeps me bound.

Now whilst it is often often said that none of 'us' (for lack of an appropriate word) are the same (and OH MY to the irony of this world doing all it can to box us 'all' in) the clinical compartmentalization of 'autism' as with that now being on the 'spectrum' with let's say our very good friends of 'aspergers' in many ways highlights just how it is that indeed, we all have many similarities. YET the compulsive desire to dissimilate/separate is something that is in my opinion, who is someone with many labels and many years, something that affects each and everyone living on this anxiety ridden rock! The context here being more the focus on how we overidentify in a world that loves to diagnose. This includes all sides of the equation from the curriculum, worker/busy bees all the way down to the honey suckers. Sorry - I'm trying hard to keep things sweet. Truly, it's a sour world and I oh so get the tone from that which I have read. Connection is everything! It's hard to be indifferent at a time we need it. If only we were really like bee where every time someone stung another, they only got to do it once because as you know once bees do that, it's game over! How much more mindful would we be?

I guess this plays into the reality of what burning bridges is really about. Thankfully we all have the capacity to rebuild. Even if we are the only ones walking the bridge. Just keep walking because eventually if we do it long enough, we will learn how to connect soon enough. Learn and time perhaps words the trip us up but as long as we just keep taking one step after the other no matter who or what crossed out path, only those that come to matter will eventually show up. We may burn those bridges too but that's OK - because if we just keep walking we get to see just how all along what's inside us has always been good enough.

Many of these labels are so misunderstood but not as much as the desire to sell them and identify. Like I say, I myself am doubtful of how long I could survive in a place such as this with all things being what they are. No safe space for a journal means many of us are sweet pickings when we start painting 'the world according to GARP.'

I'm learning when speaking my mind to do so mindfully and do my best to ignore individuals that like to hurt others whilst highlighting how it is that such toxicity is what makes the world insane. Rinse and repeat until there are only a few walking on shared bridges without care if they break or not. Worse comes to worse ... we can stand on eachtoher shoulders all with the mind in taking the next step regardless of what we previously said!

Edit → Note the division in replies and pay them no mind - it misses the point that we are all one and the same. Moreover, it clings to past transgressions only serving to drag things on. If you reply I hope it's more about my long winded post. Either way I am here. Again - pay those replies no mind. I have all the labels ... but not into Us & Them ... that tact in itself is as hostile to which it alludes. Hope you get the gist. Just focus on what appeals. To me those antics do not. Is the only way to survive in public. Perhaps not so easy for us. Let's practice? I'm always feeling guilty and worthless but it does get better the more we try. The more we move on, the further those accusations fall behind.


Here - I found the answer in this. From my online Journal. I go now for a walk and try to think of nothing for a while. I hope we cross paths again and or anyone else who feels similar:

Whose coming?

https://i.ibb.co/kHJ3FVv/Spaceship700-32bit.gif

[NoraB]

____________________

I'm here now - but again from my reading doubt I will be for long. I don't take kindly to anyone being publicly roasted like that. I suggest you do it in PM - or otherwise you can fence with new comers like me.

Who is this aimed at?

You do realise that it's Bluebottle who is being rude to people here?

Again. Bluebottle knows how to conduct herself/himself on here and you'd see that if you took the time to read his/her historic posts. Pre-diagnosis, they couldn't have been nicer!

Meanwhile, after DX..


What a patronising comment. Kindly don't respond to my posts again

Maybe BB should have taken this to PM instead of publicly sneeping one of the nicest people on here?

I'd call that a bit of a roasting, friend. Not to mention - uncalled for!

This isn't about 'intellectual masturbation' or cliques - it's about manners and as far as I know, autistics are not exempt from using them.

Here's what I do. I ask a question or make a post (not on here, but in FB groups. I thank every person who's taken the time to respond to me (trolls aside) because it's good manners, and it's nice. I know how it feels when my efforts on here are ignored by people and I wouldn't do that to anybody else. So I read that aggressive response to Pulisa and it REALLY bothered me, and here you are seemingly defending that behaviour?

Pulisa gave her time to try and help and support BB and this is the reply she got. That's Ok is it?

Well I'm also autistic, and I say it's not OK!

[pulisa]

Thank you for your support, Nora.

I shouldn't have made that comment. I don't know BB and my judgement was poor. I do agree though that autism- or any diagnosis- shouldn't be seen as an excuse for aggressive online behaviour.

[NoraB]

Thank you for your support, Nora.

I shouldn't have made that comment. I don't know BB and my judgement was poor. I do agree though that autism- or any diagnosis- shouldn't be seen as an excuse for aggressive online behaviour.

I really don't see that you did anything wrong here? :shrug:

[NoraB]

Seeing all this dragging up of past comments shows well the futility of public admonishing.

I 'dragged up' an historic comment of BB's to illustrate my point that this person KNOWS how to conduct themselves on a predominantly NT public forum.

More so, that there's a been a distinct difference in attitude after receiving an autistic diagnosis.

Autism isn't an excuse for being shitty to someone - especially someone who doesn't deserve it.

'Kindly don't respond to my posts again'

Rude. Aggressive. Unpleasant. Toxic.

And you're defending this behaviour because you think being autistic is an automatic 'get out' card? :huh:

[Ponder]

Who is this aimed at?

You do realise that it's Bluebottle who is being rude to people here?

Again. Bluebottle knows how to conduct herself/himself on here and you'd see that if you took the time to read his/her historic posts. Pre-diagnosis, they couldn't have been nicer!


Two questions here:
Who is this aimed at? → "I'm here now - but again from my reading doubt I will be for long. I don't take kindly to anyone being publicly roasted like that. I suggest you do it in PM - or otherwise you can fence with new comers like me." ~ Ponder/Me

The reason you may be confused as to who that statement is aimed at is because I am careful not to publicly point the finger at any one individual ... regardless of what they say/said or did not. I'm not always that careful but have found it's better to keep things universal. None the less I could of said that better. I can see I have lot's of room for improvement. My apologies.

Basically I found some of the responses to the subject of interest, to be as vindictive and reactionary to that which others were protesting. (edit ... I know that sounds harsh - It's just how I felt. It's not a personal judgment on how others live their lives.)

Given my own statement is reactive Vs proactive, I will now mindfully brake it down further since it is now in question.

When I said 'I am here now' I should of said or was thinking 'as a new forum member reading on'
When I said 'but again from my reading' This just meant that I had read over the forum in many places. (Not just someone's profile but yea I did that too)
When I said 'doubt I will be for long.' This end of the first sentence relates to the beginning, meaning in this new light information I am now giving, that as a new forum member having read over much of the forum that I doubt I would stay for long.'

So basically as a new forum member reading over a number of posts, I found a lot of negative tones where the responses were just as vindictive and reactionary. (As a would be forum creator [myself in the past] this would concern me and why it's a fine line in the knowing of how long to let something drag on - no easy task ... latitude is also needed for growth re all parties involved.)

When I said 'I don't take kindly to anyone being publicly roasted like that.' This is 100% subjective and says more about me than anyone else. If you had known me back in 2013 when I joined UKAF (UK Anxiety Forum) I struggled very similar to what I took the time to read. I saw myself struggling when reading along. I said I read between the lines. I actually alluded in my post that I had in fact read. But that's OK - I understand when we get riled up with invested emotion that our egos get the best of us and we miss a lot. Srry ... I am losing track. Know that point I just brought up is as much about me. Point is I can so relate, however I know so well how it is with (hmmm I don't want to say 'us' as it plays into the ego game) ... like even now I am sure the urge to defend, to be right and so on is strong for all involved. Let me come back to this ... I'd like to get to find time to address the others

Lastly when I said 'I suggest you do it in PM - or otherwise you can fence with new comers like me.' The first I feel is warranted, but the last part of that sentence is 100% ego. I should not of ended like that. My bad. Best I can do is take the time to reason as I am now doing. I don't know who is who here, but I do understand a thing or two about public admonishing. I'll get to that but was meant as well intended advice. There is rarely a PRO to allowing such things to drag on. Drama would be one pro as in the same way controversy attracts likes, hits, subs and so no. It's popular but more so at a cost and contaversy can be done when its not fueled within the context I have tried my best to express. It's rare you get people who chime on in to take a stand when seeing it unfold like so. But yea I did and still doing it now. At least I can acknowdele and half curb my tongue. There is always going to be contentious people, culture and personality clashes but that is not what I am talking about. I still struggle myself very much.

No where did I say having autism is an excuse to talk down to people. In fact I said the opposite. Overidentification is imo just as much an epidemic as whatever label one wishes to associate
I got many labels and care less to use any of them as an excuse. It's this kind of contention that drives people to the brink.

I rarely use exclamation marks. I am a hell of a lot better than I used to be. I stand by the essence of my reply and whilst my meanings may come off as uncomfortable and it may ease discomfort to justify a reactionary tone when bring up past dealings ... it does little for the rest of the public who are reading who should not have to take the time to read into the past and most of all are better of without it. I mean no malice in that (just re-edited),Is more my observation of how I happened to read it and can only sense there are others who've had to reason with it.
_______________________________________________
______________
__


I'm sorry you find us hostile, BB. People who don't have autism can also be affected by aggressive posts.

This response will get through. I understand it is for BB. Because it is not vindicate. People who have been deeply abused are easy targets because of their reactive nature. This is mindful and open without sarcasm unless I am reading it wrong. The point is how it works with what's not in it. You - Us - Them - CAPS !!! Past Tense and so on. Without all that ... the sryy comes across as genuine and matters not even if sarcastic which I don't beleive it is. What follows is reason enough. Makes me feel like I am forgiven. : ) ... even though it's not directed at me.

I can only hope that I am too not seen as hopeless (which I do not beleive BB is - not by a long shot. I understand how those of us that constantly struggle appear to be that way) and I agree I could of said things better here and there. The way this response reads is pretty much what I was trying to do. Yet the task on my mind is usually deep and complex. I understand deep and complex cases differently to others because I am myself a chronic complex case. I understand the need for validation when at such a point so it was that I hit on some hard truths hoping they would be well received as much needed support by someone whom I thought would understand and as well as someone I could sympathize with in a helpful way (I just wanted to help in a way that would be heard by the person I felt mattered) ... but as a cost to myself for not being more able to reason both sides of the coin. Apologies again. I did try and having another go now because I do not wish to alienate myself. I did come here wanting to meet others, however I guess what happened what I saw reminded me of myself and what used to happen in the UKAF. I managed to grow from the experience and did so mainly through the use of making a space to Journal in. Perhaps I can make a positive post on that elsewhere in this forum. The pros and cons as to what happened over there as now that place is like nearly dead. That said, some of us actually find solace in it - but its kind of a two sided affair (love / hate) ... anyways, I often struggle when people use sarcasm. This is a good healthy response [pulisa's response above I mean] and am sure it reached its mark regardless of outcome.
____________________

I've run out of steam here. Sorry if I did not better pull my punches for lack of a more appropriate metaphor. I am not defending toxic behaviour. I guess I am prepping to see how I am going to handle such antics on all sides now having attempted to come back into an active forum. Kudos for allowing so much space for these events. That said, self moderation that evens the keel is pivotal/key.

BB - if your reading, this was exactly me back in 2013. I know enough not to go reading someone's past. I had pretty much already pegged what was going on. My disruption challenged for not being well read - moreover written. That is not meant with ill intention for those taking offence of me, but more as a point in how I am betting, that yourself BB ... and I ... often miss read others and respond all bent out of shape because of our own unresolved stuff. It can be hard for complex cases to remain indifferent (lack of better word) when it would be a good time to be. I just persisted despite wanting to give up. I stay in the UKAF because I was fortunate enough to meet others who at least could see similar to me. It can be a struggle in an active forum at times with main stream being what it be. Forget about the labels. We really don't need them to identify as humans who've had a bad experience.

I've made a couple of random posts here already and terrified someone is going to lash out at me. Sometimes we set ourselves up, other times we just stuff it up regardless of well meaning. Best advice I can give it that 'tone' is everything. Yep I screwed up in my replies in here. I was not defending past behaviors as thought of my reply - I've already explained that. I was just trying to reach out was all. For what it is worth I actually read a lot of good things you said. If you feel you are a certain way, you don't need others to tell you what that is or even a diagnosis. We only get those things to fit into boxes. Of course it's not quite as back and white as that. I don't know the history, but a lot of what you did say minus what has upset others shows you know quite a lot. Sometimes we just go to try harder to be read.

Final Tips re Communicating online for both you and I bb [at least for us [just broke my rule with us and them but I deem appropriate because I still like you ... as well as the others ... read bellow] :) ... if I may or if I have enough Character left:

*Do our best to refrain from using exclamation marks "!" Use later when we have a good habit of seeing just how misread they are.
*Also avoid using CAPS ... often read the same as !!!
*Be careful using the terms - Us & Them - We & They and especially 'You' as well as 'Need' This is a grey area as once you build rapport/ a relationship then yea such talk can be used to connect, however in be beginning it can easily trigger under a group mentality pretext, to which imho plays largely into separatist thinking. Is hard to explain.

Tone - Play some music that is settling/calm and at a level where you can still here your thoughts as you make your post.
EDIT - Don't be afraid of editing after you have posted. I do it often ... almost all the time. Consider the impact your words will have. I know I messed up but I do often try. Those that knew me back in 2013 and know me know - whilst I still have my hang-ups - I am way more understood when I write. I still upset people with my take, but the difference is I am not as insane as I used to be. Is OK for those that don't understand my needs or the way I be.

That's it. Just trying to help and again I stand by all I said. Just keep keeping on as best you can. Do some of the above really helped myself. I can't say enough good things about Journaling.

Anyways - if you have not been banned (I know that one well too) there is no reason you can't post whatever when your feeling better. Depending on how I am received I may or may not be here. It's a fair bet you will find my in the other forum in my journal where it's much easier to express without upsetting others. Such is a personal space open to those who don't mind reading often do. Which comes to my last tip ...

When not in our own personal space, that's when we need to proactive more of the tips above.

Sorry peeps - I did not really mean to upset. For the most part I tired to use most of my own tips on a topic that was very confronting for me.

My bridge is open. No one really owns it. It mostly always is and anyone is welcome to cross it. I'll leave it at that.

Here comes first edit ... Oh crap {it's an art learning when to use *&^%} - be careful of bolding as well. and also laughing out loud + using emotes :) ... all these things can mess with peoples heads. Use them but be mindful .. Humor helps even when not known how to do well. All the best with that.

[NoraB]

@Ponder I have literally only just seen the above post.


I don't take kindly to anyone being publicly roasted like that.

I don't take kindly to a person taking a dump over someone who was trying to help them, especially someone who has significant issues of her own going on.

I also don't take kindly to people enabling such unpleasantness. There was absolutely no excuse for a response like that and if you want to enable that kind of behaviour then that's up to you but you didn't do BB any favours here.


I suggest you do it in PM - or otherwise you can fence with new comers like me." ~ Ponder/Me

Am I supposed to feel intimidated here? :unsure:

[Ponder]

Hi Nora, whatever you feel is on you. What I say is on me. Vise versa.

Please consider watching the video in the following post. It explains a lot. Basically another way to get my point across is by saying "... we reap what we sow..." An uncomfortable truth for us all. No good trying to help if all we do is lay on conditions then blame and shame. Of course we gloss it over as we go along.

I'm no here to incite popular opinion nor care for anyone's approval.

I state a facts as I see them and don't need agreement nor validation. Any of that I struggle within myself.

I am glad you saw my response when you did.

[Ponder]

One last thing before we part ways. There is no offense to be had other than what we feed your own ego/s. In this we are not alone. Something we all struggle with.

I share the following so that in the future we may consider the importance of allowing people to express in their own space without the need to interject with conditions nor the pretentious offense we so often take when others do not wish to accept that which we so often project.

Give it a good listen; It's only short. However, requires an open heart. Very insightful to say the least. It's also very relevant to what's transpired + how we so easily cling to labels.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6StRwsSBubw

Yea yea - hypocrite I know. I take all that onboard as well ... this applies as much to myself as it does to all.

I never dump and run. I often do my best to take the time in the revealing of problems I see. I'm not perfect but have come far. I understand the nature of where the OP is coming from. It's episodic & life long. The lack of understanding and care given in response has no doubt negatively impacted my own replies. Yes I understand how long it's been going on. I actually think where this thread has come to has been beneficial no matter what side of the fence regarding the obvious pain, suffering & disruption. Yet I stand by the essence of all I have said. However, regretful for my own reactions. As I see it, we would all do well to allow for more space in this seemingly shrinking world. It is the same with our interactions.

Having said that though, I have now placed you on ignore because because I think that will be best for all. Just another tool to provide said space. I think it's a feature not used enough.

I understand the need for resistance and do not blame whatever follows. Here's wishing us all the very best.

[NoraB]

To everyone else..

If BB left this forum because of my responses to them then that's regrettable, but it's not my responsibility. I'd do it again, and in exactly the same way.

I read the comment of BB's and felt hurt for Pulisa; that's 'my' autism.

As it is, I spent my Sunday morning rage-typing at some random idiot (Ponder) whose contribution to NMP appears to be the total of 19 posts starting from June of last year. He/she has stuck me on ignore without giving me a chance to respond to his latest post - and request that I watch a video about 'ego' - and this coming from someone whose own ego makes Robbie William's look non-existent? :huh:

When I researched into BB's posts, I saw something that bothered me - as in a distinct difference in attitude to people on here pre-diagnosis and post-diagnosis. Alarm bells time. Regardless or intention etc, BB's comment to Pulisa was snarky and unkind - not to mention unnecessary. This - especially when you're autistic- is not the kind of behaviour that should be enabled or defended. It will only serve to create more social issues and in BB's case - isolating him/her even more. BB burned a bridge with Pulisa and this is PULISA we're talking about here - as in one of the nicest people on this forum! :shrug:

I'm fair game. I have a big mouth, but not Pulisa..:lac:

Anyway, that's it. I'm upset and frustrated but someone thank Ponder from me for hitting that IGNORE button as this means that I won't have to engage with the dickhead again! (feel free to quote me on the dickhead bit)

[pulisa]

That's a pretty patronising post, Ponder. Not sure that Herr Tolle would approve. I'd hate to be the target of such treatment on here but maybe I deserve it more than Nora as I antagonised Bluebottle in the first place? You can chastise me instead..

[NoraB]

That's a pretty patronising post, Ponder. Not sure that Herr Tolle would approve.

Ponder's probably been watching Tolle's live streams on mute and with the auto-closed captions on, P..

I had the auto-closed captions on when I was watching the Johnny Depp trial (cos I'm a bit deaf) and there were lots of references to Mr Death (Mr Depp) and sausages..:huh:


I'd hate to be the target of such treatment on here but maybe I deserve it more than Nora as I antagonised Bluebottle in the first place? You can chastise me instead..

There was no malice in what you said Pulisa. It came across as you trying to help BB. It was also factual; autistics are vulnerable.

The quote below was Ponder to BB...


I guess this plays into the reality of what burning bridges is really about. Thankfully we all have the capacity to rebuild. Even if we are the only ones walking the bridge. Just keep walking because eventually if we do it long enough, we will learn how to connect soon enough.

This would have made some sense had it not been for the fact that BB knows how to connect on here because he's spent years doing it. It's no good waffling on about 'being the only person walking the bridge' when that person (post-diagnosis) is actively pushing every other bugger over the side.. :shrug:

I greatly appreciate you sticking up for me, P. Thank you. :hugs: However, I don't think our Ponder appreciates people who question his questionable wisdom so prepare to be informed of your imminent arrival on his IGNORE list (which I imagine is staggeringly huge) but not before he's patronised the crap out of ya and posted another Tolle vid for you to watch) :zipit:

[Lencoboy]

The National Autistic society are crap.

The NAS are crap? A bit of a sweeping generalisation methinks?

Surely they would have ceased to exist ages ago if they really were so crap!

[Lencoboy]

Ponder's probably been watching Tolle's live streams on mute and with the auto-closed captions on, P..

I had the auto-closed captions on when I was watching the Johnny Depp trial (cos I'm a bit deaf) and there were lots of references to Mr Death (Mr Depp) and sausages..:huh:



There was no malice in what you said Pulisa. It came across as you trying to help BB. It was also factual; autistics are vulnerable.

The quote below was Ponder to BB...



This would have made some sense had it not been for the fact that BB knows how to connect on here because he's spent years doing it. It's no good waffling on about 'being the only person walking the bridge' when that person (post-diagnosis) is actively pushing every other bugger over the side.. :shrug:

I greatly appreciate you sticking up for me, P. Thank you. :hugs: However, I don't think our Ponder appreciates people who question his questionable wisdom so prepare to be informed of your imminent arrival on his IGNORE list (which I imagine is staggeringly huge) but not before he's patronised the crap out of ya and posted another Tolle vid for you to watch) :zipit:

I know it's probably non-PC to say this and I'm by all means prepared to be shot down in flames but I can sense elements of Phil in both BB and Ponder; e.g, being in blatant denial and unwilling to accept any help/advice.

I also agree 100% with Pulisa and feel immense sympathy towards her for being pooh-poohed.

[NoraB]

The NAS are crap? A bit of a sweeping generalisation methinks?

Surely they would have ceased to exist ages ago if they really were so crap!

They were very helpful when my son was diagnosed. (I've been to a few of their Autism Shows too and there have been some excellent speakers, especially on female autism)

[NoraB]

I know it's probably non-PC to say this and I'm by all means prepared to be shot down in flames but I can sense elements of Phil in both BB and Ponder; e.g, being in blatant denial and unwilling to accept any help/advice.

The difference is that BB and Ponder both have an autism diagnosis. My issue with BB was his/her post-diagnosis attitude (which differed greatly to their 'norm' on here). (An autism diagnosis doesn't give us licence to treat people like shit)

Ponder was here simply to bore everyone shitless with his 'musings' (And woe betide anyone who tried to stop him)

The issues on this thread all started because Pulisa was trying to help BB and BB's response was both unnecessary and unpleasant. I felt bad for Pulisa because she's one of the nicest people on this forum, and she has problems of her own to deal with. (Plus, as an autistic, I don't care to see other autistics try and excuse their bad behaviour)

BB chose not to stick around where he/she may have made a few friends. One of his/her complaints was of not having any friends. Well, attitudes like that are a sure way to make sure that you don't have any, right? :shrug:

Similarly, Phil chose to ignore us. More than that, he shut his entire thread down and along with it the many pages of people's time and effort. He was called out on his bigotry towards autistic people, and instead of sticking around to maybe learn something and change his opinion on the spectrum that autism is, he chose his offensive response. Before I placed him on ignore, I saw his comment on his Gambling thread (this thread has since been deleted) but not before he blamed everybody else for his behaviour. It was admin's fault for not locking the thread. It was our fault for 'going off topic', even though I don't consider suggesting autism as a possibility for his numerous issues and difficulties to be 'going off topic'.

To sympathise with Phil is to enable his behaviour. That's what Ponder did with BB on this thread. (And I don't care if it's NT's doing the enabling or other autistics, it's not acceptable)

This isn't just about Phil being unwilling to accept advice, Lenco, it's about his prejudice towards autistic people. Ignorance regarding autism I can understand. (I was ignorant about autism until my son was assessed) and Phil might have learnt something about autism (and himself) had he chosen to listen to people instead of throwing his toys out of the pram and then kicking the pram over. :lac:

[Lencoboy]

The difference is that BB and Ponder both have an autism diagnosis. My issue with BB was his/her post-diagnosis attitude (which differed greatly to their 'norm' on here). (An autism diagnosis doesn't give us licence to treat people like shit)

Ponder was here simply to bore everyone shitless with his 'musings' (And woe betide anyone who tried to stop him)

The issues on this thread all started because Pulisa was trying to help BB and BB's response was both unnecessary and unpleasant. I felt bad for Pulisa because she's one of the nicest people on this forum, and she has problems of her own to deal with. (Plus, as an autistic, I don't care to see other autistics try and excuse their bad behaviour)

BB chose not to stick around where he/she may have made a few friends. One of his/her complaints was of not having any friends. Well, attitudes like that are a sure way to make sure that you don't have any, right? :shrug:

Similarly, Phil chose to ignore us. More than that, he shut his entire thread down and along with it the many pages of people's time and effort. He was called out on his bigotry towards autistic people, and instead of sticking around to maybe learn something and change his opinion on the spectrum that autism is, he chose his offensive response. Before I placed him on ignore, I saw his comment on his Gambling thread (this thread has since been deleted) but not before he blamed everybody else for his behaviour. It was admin's fault for not locking the thread. It was our fault for 'going off topic', even though I don't consider suggesting autism as a possibility for his numerous issues and difficulties to be 'going off topic'.

To sympathise with Phil is to enable his behaviour. That's what Ponder did with BB on this thread. (And I don't care if it's NT's doing the enabling or other autistics, it's not acceptable)

This isn't just about Phil being unwilling to accept advice, Lenco, it's about his prejudice towards autistic people. Ignorance regarding autism I can understand. (I was ignorant about autism until my son was assessed) and Phil might have learnt something about autism (and himself) had he chosen to listen to people instead of throwing his toys out of the pram and then kicking the pram over. :lac:

Mind you, I can certainly talk on occasions, especially as I can be rather opinionated over certain things, but I don't actually intend to 'bore people sh1tless' though, as certain issues that I personally find a cause for concern might seem relatively trivial and insignificant to others. But I do within reason try to look at other peoples' points of view on such certain matters and acknowledge that some of my views and opinions might not always be correct nor rational. For instance, I have had a bit of a thing about graffiti for many years now, but my dad admitted recently that he's now basically beyond caring about such issues, as he's got far more important things to be concerned about, especially my mom right now, though he obviously doesn't condone the serial graffitists going around recklessly tagging (and vandalism/ASB in general).

And I agree with you about Phil and his alleged ignorance/prejudice towards us Auties, plus his endless pooh-poohing of the advice many of us on here took the time and effort to give him, though it's obviously not right for us to be 'ganging up' on Phil in this thread right now and 'talking about him and not to him', especially as he hasn't yet posted on it. Hence my cautious remark a couple of posts back about it probably being a bit non-PC.

[NoraB]

Mind you, I can certainly talk on occasions, especially as I can be rather opinionated over certain things, but I don't actually intend to 'bore people sh1tless' though, as certain issues that I personally find a cause for concern might seem relatively trivial and insignificant to others. But I do within reason try to look at other peoples' points of view on such certain matters and acknowledge that some of my views and opinions might not always be correct nor rational. For instance, I have had a bit of a thing about graffiti for many years now, but my dad admitted recently that he's now basically beyond caring about such issues, as he's got far more important things to be concerned about, especially my mom right now, though he obviously doesn't condone the serial graffitists going around recklessly tagging (and vandalism/ASB in general).

Get yourself to Manchester. The street art is something else. (Great for photography)

Regarding 'boring for Britain', I can also drone on (and on) about things that interest/trigger me. (I bore myself on a regular basis). I have no doubt that I'm boring the pants off people on here when it comes to 'Diana', but it's an interest see, so I have a lot to say. (Best not to engage an autie on their interests lol) :ohmy:


And I agree with you about Phil and his alleged ignorance/prejudice towards us Auties,

Nothing 'alleged' about it, Lenco. It was all there in his own words. (Before he deleted the threads)

Several of us tried to help him to see things differently, but he wasn't interested in what we had to say. (As per)


though it's obviously not right for us to be 'ganging up' on Phil in this thread right now and 'talking about him and not to him', especially as he hasn't yet posted on it. Hence my cautious remark a couple of posts back about it probably being a bit non-PC.

Nobody is 'ganging' up on Phil. (His prejudice re autism was challenged, and rightly so)

It was his choice to refuse to engage with us and then delete those threads, and not because he was in any way remorseful for offending people, but because 'certain people' had taken his thread "off topic" etc. People might be wondering why those threads have disappeared and this answers that for them, that is if they happen to see this thread - which let's face it, most people (including Phil) won't bother with because it's entitled 'autism'.

It wasn't me who brought Phil's name up on this thread, but I responded because I'm still very hurt by his 'opinion' of autistics. Maybe I shouldn't have responded to your comment, Lenco, but I did, and I am ok owning my own behaviour. (I will respect the mods if they feel I've crossed a line here)

But I need to draw a line under this now. (And for my own MH wellbeing)

I genuinely wish Phil (and his arse) well and I hope he is able to get a handle on his issues one day. I don't like putting people on ignore (it feels like a failure on my part) but I'm trying to see it for what it actually is - self-care.

[Lencoboy]

Get yourself to Manchester. The street art is something else.

Regarding 'boring for Britain', I can also drone on (and on) about things that interest/trigger me. (I bore myself on a regular basis). I have no doubt that I'm boring the pants off people on here when it comes to 'Diana', but it's an interest see, so I have a lot to say. (Best not to engage an autie on their interests lol) :ohmy:



Nothing 'alleged' about it, Lenco. It was all there in his own words. Several of us tried to help him to see things differently, but he wasn't interested in what we had to say. (As per)



Nobody is 'ganging' up on Phil. It's his choice not to be here. It was his choice to make those comments and then delete those threads, and not because he was in any way remorseful for offending people, but because 'certain people' had taken his thread 'off topic' etc. It was his choice to talk about me, not to me. I spoke directly to him until it was clear that he was no longer reading people's posts. (Also, this thread is entitled 'Autism' so I don't expect he will have looked at these posts, or ever will)

It wasn't me who brought Phil's name up on this thread, but I responded because I'm still very hurt by his 'opinion' of autistics. Maybe I shouldn't have responded to your comment, Lenco, but I did, and I am ok owning my own behaviour. (I will respect the mods if they feel I've crossed a line here)

But I want to draw a line under this now; I need to do so for my own MH wellbeing. I struggle on a daily basis, not that I ask people for help very often. (I prefer to help others)

I genuinely wish Phil well and I hope he is able to get himself to a better place one day. But he'd do well to start listening to people and also thanking them for all the time and effort they put into helping him.

It was actually me that felt as if I may have been 'ganging up' on Phil as I brought up his name, despite a word of caution.

But like you just said, it's probably best we draw a line under this now and move on.