Dr.Google strikes again-but is he correct now?! :(

[Savvy_Darling]

So tonight I decided I was caught in a moment of weakness and my curiosity has put me a terrible spot. Please read on . . . :(

I have a lil bump that's not on the side of my neck like where my ear is but it's also not on the direct back of my neck. It's kinda above where the shoulder meets the neck. I decided to say it was a muscle knot as I'm feeling some discomfort in that shoulder and arm anyways. Also seems to be the side that always gets sore when I've been bad with stress.

Anyways, I decided to look up lymph node locations>found some that could be on the location I feel the bump>posterior cervical.
Looked up posterior cervical lymph nodes so I could get a better look at the location BUT all I saw was a bunch of cancer websites. Things like Non-hodgekins lymphoma and neck/head cancer. melanoma. :scared15:

Those can cause enlargement in the posterior cervical lymph nodes.

Okay, I removed a mole myself a few monthes ago with hydrogen peroxide- it didn't seem like a cancerous mole but I didn't like it and the hydrogen peroxide did get rid of it.. I always wonder if it was cancerous and I spread it throughout my body. So this is fueling my fear.

Another thing is I don't remember between the lymphoma and neck cancer which symptoms are which and I dare not look it up again but some things I saw were ear pain and I feel like I've randomly felt a pain in my ear a few times over the last few days and now reading that I'm extremely worried. Difficulty swallowing a week or 2 ago I felt like I was swallowing excessively and it felt like I had something in my throat. I thought it was due to anxiety and the tonsil stone I discovered - which I took out. I'm swallowing fine now though.

My bump is easily flattened and and I guess soft (moveable? - which is a good thing)

It also seems small and not exactly round like a pea.. It feels like. Bump but when I press my finger around it feels smaller.
But it's not painful.. I mean I press my finger on it fir s couple seconds it kinda aches but not straight pain.

I'm 21, not sure age is on my side because I've seen cancer commercials with people my age and younger getting lymphoma. Not sure about the neck/head cancer.. I don't smoke cigarettes or drink often. The last time I drank was weeks ago and it was vodka 100proof and I remember it making my throat feel scratchy and kinda hurt (I read something about if alcohol does that to you that it's a good indicator of non hodgekins lymphoma!!) :(

I was really hoping on being a muscle knot but I'm not sure what to think and after being dumb and looking things up I've put a lot of fear in my head.

My body does this thing now where when if i've got myself really scared close to shaking I fall asleep. Which is nice because I took a nap and forgot about it with pleasant dreams but I woke up with butterflies in my tummy and had to post.

I'm gonna monitor this before rushing to the ER , I gotta make an apt with a gp and i don't know how long it would take to see her because I've never met her before but she's who I chose when I got health insurance.

I'm just really freaked out and thankfully I found a great post to read on here--a questionnaire about being able to feel nodes. But my only concern is I don't think I've felt this before - granted I've never felt around that area of my neck before but I just have doubts about it always being there. And I feel like I've experienced symptoms or things that can be lymphoma or the neck cancer and I can't get it out my head. What if this it this time? I don't wanna feel like the girl who cried wolf but seriously.... What if it's it this time.:scared15:

Hoping for muscle knots :(

Also I don't feel like I've been sick , I don't usually get sick often. Last time I was legitimately sick was close to 2 years ago and I had a viral throat infection and the lymph nodes under my jaw got big...and I remember how ill feeling I was. So like I said I can't recall being sick lately like at all. Which is another worrisome thing.

Thanks for reading.. I have a tendency to be very thorough with my posts .. I don't mean for them to see long but I appreciate anyone who reads it and helps me.. You guys are great. I haven't spoken to my family about these fears because I know they won't take me seriously .. Guess I don't blame them.
Hoping for support from my kind of people.

[MyNameIsTerry]

Hi Savanna,

First off, if you Google about lymph nodes, you will get cancer sites. You want anatomy sites really as they will show you a diagram and not be talking about cancer at the same time.

Where your bump is there is a lymph node group but there is also another one towards the back of the neck as well that is near your bump as well. However, in the picture you took you had turned your neck which means the location of these will also slightly change and this could mean the bump is in-between yet on the diagram you will be seeing a group at the exact spot.

Also, how close to the surface are these lymph nodes and how big are they in a normal person? So, would you even be able to feel them at all, and if not, a muscle knot you know you can feel.

I did look at an anatomy diagram last night when I posted you the neck muscles but I didn't read whether the groups I saw could even be felt. Without knowing that, you could be jumping to conclusions anyway but also remember to factor in turning your neck when the diagrams are based on you facing forward.

See what I mean? People with anxiety miss these rational questions that they need to learn to be asking in challenging a fear.

[Savvy_Darling]

Terry, yes I was looking at lymph node locations and your right it's hard to judge. I googled the name of the group that it might be and when I did that that's when all the cancer sites and malignancy info was. I was really trying to google safely but it didn't work.

I felt my boyfriends which I can't say he didn't enjoy because it got a maaaage in the process lol but within the muscle areas there is this slightly bumpy texture. Not sure if that's purely muscle or what. But the weird thing with mine is that if I just have my neck normal looking forward the lil bump is harder to find and when I find it it doesn't feel too prominent and like I said it feels like I can move it around easily it doesn't feel like a solid bump really... Just a small one that seems a little soft..But then when I bend my head to the right I can find it easier . The bump feels easy to find and when I rub it like I said it's easily flattened and malleable. Then when bending my neck to the left it's harder to find again and when I do like I said it feels small like a pea or smaller. Like between the size of a grain of rice and a pea.. Somewhere in between.
I don't know if a swollen lymph node would change like that or be easily felt regardless.
My left shoulder blade feels achey and sore as we speak. Not sure if it's from pressing on that lil bump or not. Regardless it's hard to get myself back to rational after everything I saw today.. Maybe it's not rational. Maybe it's bad.

Like in my original post my fears that there are some things I've felt before worry me about this newfound bump.
& ever since I removed that mole myself with the hydrogen peroxide I've always had a thought in the back of my head is it was cancerous and I spread it throughout my body.
Last blood test I had was December and it was fine but it's February now and things can change. Terry I'm definitely having a hard time.. I can't stop wanting to touch it. And sometimes I get excited and feel like it's gone down and then other times I'm like nope it feels the same. I've spent some time reading other threads about lymph nodes and they do help calm me but at the same time I feel like these people have had colds or have had the bump for years and I don't think I've had any cold and I don't know for sure how long this has been there. I also might add that the bump isn't seen like there isn't a bump coming out of my neck but it's something felt . /: I feel like I take one step forward and 3 steps back and I'm upset. And obviously very anxious and sad. Ugh

---------- Post added at 04:09 ---------- Previous post was at 02:41 ----------

Another thing I wonder is that it says something about head trauma .. I did hit my head off that wooden beam.. Is that the kind of head trauma they say ans could that have caused it and I wonder is that is something bad /: ugh I know everyone in the house will probably roll their eyes about this so I'm keeping it to myself. Except with you guys on NMP.
Wishing for the strength to make a doctors apt.. Thinking about that makes me sick.

[MyNameIsTerry]

How you are moving your neck can expose a lymph node there. Moving it a certain way will allow the node to be more exposed. So, that is probably all you are finding when you examine it, you are doing what a professional may ask you to do when examining you or simulating it e.g. using pressure can expose some.

The thing is, lymph nodes swell due to the detection of localised infection. They drain of fluid hence they become enlarged. This can be due to bacterial infection. Now, you said above you had a tonsil stone. Did you know they can contain bacteria and can also result in an infection?

So, a rational scenario could be that your tonsil stone has been detected to have something that needs addressing and the immune system has just done it's job. Only a doctor can really say for sure, and explain this properly, but it's a likely scenario.

Poking & prodding always makes them sore and enlarged. I remember this from when I've had them checked as a kid when I had infections. People on here are always being told to stop poking & prodding as they are just making it worse and making it sore. As a test, I have just examined that area using a guide (not all, just the ones you are suggesting) and guess what? My neck's acheing!!!

You know with the head trauma that it's been a while now. Don't you think you would be quite ill?

[Savvy_Darling]

The tonsil stone was indeed on the same side. I get them out with a cotton swab though? I do like this scenario better than the cancer ones for sure. Is it a harmful thing the tonsil stones ? And if they are causing the lymph node? I'm about to go cheek to see if I have any to get one. What causes people to get them? Can they be a omen of a bad thing to happen?

If they get infected is it gonna harm me?

Is this more of a likely cause than lymphoma or head:neck cancer or melanoma? /: I'm too afraid to look up statistics.

EDIT: Just checked! I have 2 tonsil stones I just picked them out. Gonna go find some hydrogen peroxide and do a gargle.

I feel like I've been getting these often.. Is this something bad? I remember looking up about them before and it saying they are nothing serious.. But why would I be getting them more often over the past couple of monthes? Stress?

---------- Post added at 04:34 ---------- Previous post was at 04:23 ----------

"If the condition persists and if ignored tonsil stones cause cancer and there is also certain tonsil stones symptom of lymphoma that should never be ignored and one should immediately consult an ENT specialist."

Okay I'm totally freaked out ;-( on the brink of tears. Just looking up tonsil stones and I see this on a website about them. I'm really about to loose it.

[MyNameIsTerry]

Not an omen, thinking that would easily fit the Magical Thinking category, something I suffer from with my OCD. So, no point thinking about such things. Why would the calcium in your body conspire against you in an omen?

Tonsil stones are just calcifications. They occur throughout the body, eating healthily keeps things running as they should.

It's on the same side as the stone was so that's another tick in a box there then. :winks:

Infected lymph nodes occur through all sorts of things like cough, colds, infections, etc. If they don't go down, you can ask your GP to have a look. If they think an infection needs treating, they will deal with it for you. But this is all standard stuff to the body, it will either deal with it on it's own or a bit of a hand may be needed from a GP.

Is it more a cause of form of infection. Absolutely! Tons of people must see their GP's with this every week because of infections. Infections are always stated as the most likely culprit.

Remember I said people raise threads about neck lymph nodes and through questioning people on this forum expose a most likely possibility (subject to asking a doctor, of course) and then the lightbulb comes on in the person's head? This is how anxious thinking works.

You won't find accurate statistics. Not everyone sees a GP about raised lymph nodes - I don't. Why? Because my mum told me many years ago as a teenager that this is supposed to happen when you get infections so if you've had one, isn't that the most likely reason? Why would a form of cancer coincide with the exact days an infection pops up?

---------- Post added at 09:48 ---------- Previous post was at 09:37 ----------


"If the condition persists and if ignored tonsil stones cause cancer and there is also certain tonsil stones symptom of lymphoma that should never be ignored and one should immediately consult an ENT specialist."

Okay I'm totally freaked out ;-( on the brink of tears. Just looking up tonsil stones and I see this on a website about them. I'm really about to loose it.

I think you may have looked at a dodgy website.

[Savvy_Darling]

I added an edit to my last post. ... Something I just got off of a website. Did you read that? That's exactly what it says and now I'm ready to go to the ER because I'm really scared.

Also did you mean to say that like that or was it an error ? :unsure:

"Is it more a cause of form of cancer? Absolutely!"

I've been getting these tonsil stones more recently and now I'm really concerned about them. They don't cause me pain and my left tonsil the one that gets the stones is bigger than my right but it also doesn't hurt or anything. I'm really worried about it being a symptom of lymphoma now like that website said. I can't believe this

[MyNameIsTerry]

:doh::doh::doh: Sorry, now corrected! Having a bit of a brain fog at the moment.

You won't find tonsil stones listed as a cause of mouth cancers on the NHS website over here.

In fact, I even did a Dr Google in my browser and looked at sites on the first page and none of them said it was linked to cancer and two, including a US one in late 2014, even stated it was not although it had been an issue in the media.

[Savvy_Darling]

It really must have been a dodgy website because I checked out another (and ones I read before this have never said that). Why would someone write such horrible things to scare people? Probably to sell the product they have in their page.

I guess I'll disregard that dumb fearmongering site. Thanks for letting me know that your NHS site says nothing about it either!

I think I'm gonna just wait and see what this possible node decides to do. I've removed the tonsil stones and I gargled with some hydrogen peroxide. Hopefully the infection will take care of itself.

I decided to dive in and look up symptoms of lymphoma and I really don't think I have any symptoms beside the one slightly enlarged possible lymph node. Again, shouldn't dive into the scenario like I was before now that I've discovered I had more tonsil stones that needed taking care of.
Plus symptoms of tonsil stones say things like
Ear discomfort / pain
Swollen lymph nodes
Difficulty swallowing

Which are things I have experienced. This would be a more rational scenario like you said and I am seeing this now. So I think I'll hold off running to the ER just yet.

Only thing I wonder is its okay that my left tonsil is bigger than the right. I've noticed this monthes ago when taking out my first discovered tonsil stone. It doesn't look swollen or red it's just larger in size ? Wonder if that's okay.

Oh Terry once again you have been such a tremendous help !! I can't thank you enough for helping me tonight. I was so terrified when I wrote this thread but now not so much. Keeping the intrusive thoughts at bay with all this very real evidence of tonsil stones now being the possible rational cause.

Terry you're a saint! :)

[MyNameIsTerry]

No, tonsils don't have to be symmetrical. They may have always been this way. If there was swelling then it could be something like tonsillitis but you would probably have worked that out, so this just seems like a case of normal asymmetry. Many areas of the body are asymmetrical. And that's coming from a tonsil eunuch! :roflmao:

I think the fact you have discovered more tonsil stones just means a greater chance that your lymph node could be responding to bacterial issues.

Perhaps just ensure oral hygiene is tip top at the moment. Sometimes with infections when you disturb things, it can cause some spreading and this maybe a reason for the lymph node too BUT your body will either resolve this all on it's own with your immune system or a GP may need to treat it with perhaps some antibiotics but that's a big IF because I don't even know if what you did to remove the stone would have even caused that, I'm just thinking about how dentists like to resolve infection before removing a tooth to keep an infection isolated. Keeping your mouth clean is going to help stop this.

You see, you can rationalise these things once you get beyond that initial panic stage. Looking at that lymphoma information tends to make people scared they have it because they aren't doing what you are doing here, working through your symptoms and looking for a more likely culprit. Good spot on the ear pain too, I thought I remembered you talking about that with your headaches.

So, the key is to bring that forward and intercept it. Intrusive thoughts are all about provoking a strong negative feedback response, the area of the brain looking for the response can only see a negative response. Learn to challenge or accept or merely observe, the more you starve that response with positive/neutral actions on your conscious part, the more you break intrusive thoughts.

[LilGsMama]

I've had a slight lump in the place where you described.. had it for 16 years! xx

[Fishmanpa]

Good Night! What are you doing to yourself? Stop Googling for goodness sakes. A pea size bump and a couple of tonsil stones are not something to be making yourself sick over. Just keep an eye on it for a few weeks. If it persists or gets larger, see your doctor. To rush to the ER over this is not something you should do. The ER is for "emergencies".

My wife gets tonsil stones. Has been that way her entire life and she's old enough to be your Mom. It happens. Her doctor said it was due to allergies and some people are just more prone to them.

You said in your OP that you don't discuss "this fear" with your family. BUT... have you discussed just how your HA in general is affecting your life? I told you I have a daughter your age. She came to me and talked about what she was going through. I called her Mom and we made sure she got help. She's in therapy and on meds and doing great! Please consider asking for help. You don't have to live in fear like this.

Positive thoughts

[Savvy_Darling]

Lilgsmama- well good to know its not an unusual place to have bumps! I wish I could say I've had this for years but honestly i don't know.. :wacko:

Fishmanpa- yikes , definitely wish I hadn't.. Even if I was trying to be safe - there is no safe googling anymore! :scared15:
Anyways, I also didn't put the tonsil stones & lymph node together until terry started to help me rationalize. I didn't know any possible cause and it definitely did scare me no matter the size. And about these tonsil stones, I only began to get them (or notice them?) monthes ago when my throat felt odd and I peeked back there and discovered the little white thing in my tonsil. Ever since then I seem to get the fairly often now.. Which worries me because how does something like that just start happening?
I will keep an eye on it for a couple weeks and see what happens..
My only concern is if my tonsil stone did cause this because of an infection if this is something I should go get antibiotics for like if it's gonna spread to other places and be a dangerous thing? That's why I was close to going to the ER .. That and the probably dodgy website said something about tonsil stones causing cancer or being an lymphoma sign. But decided to disregard it because I didn't see any thing about that in other sites. Must have been some made up thing. I felt like it was an emergency and kinda still somewhat.
My own mother doesn't say anything of this or getting help but my boyfriends mother has tried urging me to make my first apt with my gp so I could get meds-- hate the idea of pills.
I'm glad your daughter is doing great and things have worked out for her.

[Fishmanpa]

my boyfriends mother has tried urging me to make my first apt with my gp so I could get meds-- hate the idea of pills.


Tonsil stones can make your breath nasty enough to knock over an elephant too ~lol~ (like I said, my wife gets them... nuff said!)

Concerning meds? I pose the question... "If you had an infection that was making you feel like crap, would you take meds to make you feel better?"

The same applies to mental illness IMO. I know some are phobic or just don't want to take them BUT, if it's going to help you feel better, why wouldn't you? Would you rather continue to freak out over normal everyday bodily functions and anomalies? My daughter is on meds. My sister has been on Prozac to ten years. I did a stint on Zoloft for depression and I have a chill pill now that I can take if needed. Listen to your boyfriends mother and at least speak with your GP about it. There are many different meds on the market that could help you.

Positive thoughts

[Savvy_Darling]

And you know what.. I've been wearing my retainer every night for years now because I don't wanna take the chances of my teeth getting wonky again.. I wonder if they need a good cleaning or could cause my tonsil stones ? Even though I've worn them forever now it seems.. I also was better about brushing my teeth 2x a day once before bed and once when I woke up... Now it seems I've been only doing it before bed and less often after waking. Something to improve I guess.if I've been really anxious I start to loose desire in doing things except be worried.. So that's why.

---------- Post added at 10:13 ---------- Previous post was at 10:11 ----------

You're probably right fishmanpa. I guess maybe I'm still in denial that I have a problem. Only starting being like this starting almost a year ago.. With it hitting peak last August. I keep thinking I'm gonna be me again and not worry anymore about my health and it's just me being a worry wort but alas.. Maybe not. I just don't get how it can hit you like a ton of bricks like this & then you can't get back without meds or therapy. Why can't I just go back to being the somewhat normal I was naturally without drugs. It's quite scary but so is this illness. :/

[Fishmanpa]

You're probably right fishmanpa. I guess maybe I'm still in denial that I have a problem. Only starting being like this starting almost a year ago.. With it hitting peak last August. I keep thinking I'm gonna be me again and not worry anymore about my health but alas.. Maybe not.

Just take a few minutes, go back and review what you've posted since joining and the website you're posting them on ;)

There's nothing wrong with asking for and getting help. I can't tell you how proud I am of my daughter. She worked hard, took the dragon by the horns and kicked his a$$. She's gotten into exercise and healthy eating, lost weight, her self esteem is building and she's graduating college this year. That's after totally crashing and taking off a semester at school to get well. She still gets a blip now and again but she knows how to deal with it now.
You can do it too! AND... you deserve it!

Positive thoughts

[Savvy_Darling]

Thanks fish , it's something I know I gotta think about and really want . Of course I do wanna be better but there's still some things I have to face before I can.. Like my fear of doctors and my insecurities. It would definitely be a big step to take.. One I feel like I am close to taking. Maybe when I finally make my apt with my doctor she will help also convince me of the good I can do for myself.. Not to mention if I get a clean bill of health that will also help. Wish I wasn't such a sissy lala. It's so hard overcoming fears and they are best overcome when facing them straight on but i don't know if I'm ready ;(
Thanks for your help though. It's really something I have to talk amongst myself.

[MyNameIsTerry]

Well your retainer will be getting bacteria on it and underneath it which is why they are supposed to be cleaned on a regular basis. Once a day, I think, although I think I did mine every day or so many years ago.

Are you sure you even still need it? With you saying you've had it years, it sounds like it will no longer be needed as they are more a temporary thing for a more minor correction or after dental braces or corrective work. I think you need to ask your dentist about this.

I would also ask your dentist about mouth hygiene and the tonsil stones because they are not just calcium, they are bacteria and fungi too. So, can you see the possible link there? A GP won't have much of a clue about mouth hygiene, although they will probably know tonsil stones, but really a dentist is best for oral things. Dentists are trained to look out for things in the mouth to a level you would have to be a specialist in MD roles, so they are better.

You don't have to go on antidepressants. Therapy is as effective. And besides, no one ever recovers from antidepressants alone, it takes a whole load of work to resolve the issues that got you there in the first place or when you remove the med, it could start again. Antidepressants should really be for when therapy can't work because you are too severe and need some support, although they are used long before this and it is often driven by cost. Therapy is best, or therapy with meds, but meds alone just prop up someone who may not even understand what they are going through.

I did well on my first med, got back to work and recovered my old confidence. There were still some issues in there but largely I was back to normal. Then I withdrew the med and within 3 months I was getting the old signs back and by 6 months I had a full relapse, I'm still working through it now. I never had any knowledge back then, no leaflets, no guides, no books, no advice, no forums - nothing. Just my GP and a 10 minute appointment to monitor me. In my relapse I went the therapy route and whilst this wasn't successful for me due to various factors that had made things even worse, it did provide a springboard. I joined a charity, got more knowledge, joined here later and learnt more, and did a load of my own research. I'm far more equipped to deal with it all now.

You don't seem in denial really because you aren't fighting against what we are saying, like some do. Anxiety creates a lot of ambivalence about things and you want to change but fear it at the same time. Change & uncertainty are cornerstones of anxiety disorders.

[Savvy_Darling]

Well I had a different method of braces... It was called Invisalign and it's like a series of plastic retainer like molds that straightened my teeth over many sets. I just worry about them getting out of line again.. I'd I don't wear it for days and decide to wear it again my bottom teeth hurt. I'm gonna go ahead and give them a good cleaning tonigh.. They're the plastic ones that go over your teeth not the metal ones btw.

Well is the bacteria and fungi gonna hurt my health or cause serious problems ? I'm gonna step up my teeth brushing routine and gargle with hydrogen peroxide more as well. The last dentist I went to says I take great care of my teeth ( should floss more -- which I have been) oh and to brush my gums more on the top which I have been doing.. I have veneer caps in a couple of my top teeth and was being more gentle but my dentist said I don't need to be. But I think my apt I will ask about the tonsil stones.. Probably will be close to May because my gram takes me 1x a year. I'll ask her about moving it up though.
Ugh medication is definitely such a rough thing for me as I grew up with parents telling me I don't need to rely on pills . So I feel the same way even though I've found myself in a rough place. Wish I could go a more natural organic route . Bought camomile tea for nighttime though. Is rather go natural than drugs . /: i don't know.

[MyNameIsTerry]

I had the old wire ones. Each have to be cleaned constantly. Your will still collect bacteria. I assume you take it out to brush your teeth but unless you clean it then, you are putting when was in the retainer back onto your teeth. So, it's just more bacteria in your mouth than normal and maybe this is where the tonsil stones come in? It just seems very likely when they are partially made from bacteria collecting together.

Yes, it would be a good idea to be using mouthwash. Flossing too.

It's not harmful but it can mean more mouth problems like infections, the basic kind. I have asthma so use inhalers. I am supposed to clean these frequently (I don't) because it heightens the possibility of things like oral thrush. Your body may deal with them all anyway and at the worst, you see a GP or dentist and you may get some antibiotics. They only give out antibiotics if they are needed these days unlike years ago when they dished them out for anything like sweeties!

Meds are a minefield, you have to find something that works and this isn't always the first one you try. Doctors' rarely understand much about them and they can't know what will work for each individual so use their guidelines. Some people get lucky with them, others don't. I think if your anxiety is not strong enough so that you can try to recover without, all the better.

If you need them, you need them. Just like how people need an antibiotic for an infection. That argument about not needing pills dissolves pretty quickly when they get something that truly can't be dealt with without or some trauma like a bone break. People soon change their minds then!