View Full Version : wonky tongue
I was doing so much better over the weekend, then today I looked at my tongue with the sun streaming into my bathroom and, man, that thing is wonky. Asymmetrical, uneven, turns to one side at the tip, teeth marks along the edges, trembly.
Before this fear started, I can't recall ever paying attention to my tongue. I'd never look at it. Now, it's an all-consuming thing. I think about it ALL THE TIME. I just want to go back to before this started, when I used to wake up in the morning without this DREAD. Ugh.
I'm not asking for reassurance, just venting and hoping someone can relate.
I'm sorry. :( If it helps at all, I think tongues are just kind of weird in general. I always feel like my tongue is pretty weird looking too. When I stick it out it's never completely still. I don't know that it's possible for anyone to hold their tongue completely still.
I can relate to obsessing over a body part. When I first started having heart palpitations I became obsessed with taking my pulse. Anytime I felt even the slightest chest sensation I would flip out and think I was having a heart attack. I finally had to make a very deliberate effort to stop myself from paying so much attention to it. I wouldn't let myself take my pulse anymore. If I felt any kind of chest sensation I would take a moment to pause and practice taking some deep breaths to calm my mind. Checking the body part you're concerned with just fuels the cycle.
I hope that helps at least a little bit. I'm sorry I can't think of anything more helpful to say.
Ever look at a cow tongue whole in the market? Tongues in general are weird nasty things although I'm sure glad we have them ;) Tongues are just "wonky" no matter human or otherwise.
Status: licked
Positive thoughts
Thanks, guys. If you had of told me six months ago, that I'd be reduced to a dry-retching wreck studying my tongue in a mirror all day, I'd have laughed :shrug:
It's stripped the joy right out of my life
What do you want people to say though? What will help you? Will anything help you?
I don't know. My thinking is a mess :(
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I feel like my brain has been hijacked
I don't honestly think the forum can help you with this. It's down to you and your desire to tackle this all consuming issue. You can start as many threads as you like about your wonky quivering tongue but ultimately you'll stay stuck unless you decide either to seek therapy or to see a neurologist to face up to your worst fears and get tested. Not that I think for one moment that you have this awful disease but I think deep down you know that too but just need to test yourself and then you get stuck again
cyberchondriac.
31-10-17, 17:16
I have absolutely no idea what I can say that will help you. Can you request an EMG? That'll give you the proof you need! Are you on any kind of anxiety meds?
I don't know. My thinking is a mess :(
---------- Post added at 10:03 ---------- Previous post was at 10:02 ----------
I feel like my brain has been hijacked
It does sound a bit like your HA is running riot.
The one thing I would say is remember how irrationally you are thinking right now before being derogatory on other people's posts.
For those of us not in the grip of HA there is a huge similarity between any number of posts on this board.
I don't honestly think the forum can help you with this. It's down to you and your desire to tackle this all consuming issue. You can start as many threads as you like about your wonky quivering tongue but ultimately you'll stay stuck unless you decide either to seek therapy or to see a neurologist to face up to your worst fears and get tested. Not that I think for one moment that you have this awful disease but I think deep down you know that too but just need to test yourself and then you get stuck again
Yep, this is true. I just realised why I am so bad today: PMS. It always amplifies my negative thinking
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It does sound a bit like your HA is running riot.
The one thing I would say is remember how irrationally you are thinking right now before being derogatory on other people's posts.
For those of us not in the grip of HA there is a huge similarity between any number of posts on this board.
Yes, good point. It's so easy to see the flawed thinking in others, but I am an utter failure at sorting it out in myself
I'm sure PMS doesn't help but I think you would be in the same situation with or without PMS as a contributory factor. No excuses.
I'm sure PMS doesn't help but I think you would be in the same situation with or without PMS as a contributory factor. No excuses.
Indubitably, but it does make me that much more psycho :wacko:
But you're actually in control of what you do which makes it all the more frustrating
This actually is a form of reassurance, whether it's conscious or not. Who cares what your tongue LOOKS like?
Who cares what your tongue LOOKS like?
What, you don't check out people's tongues before you date/befriend them? :shrug:
You haven't answered Josh's question
Deviation from the midline, lopsidedness on protrusion, asymmetry etc can be related to ALS. I am reassured that I can move it though
Remember your comment on 0_0's post about her medical "knowledge"...
Is that the person who is using a speculum on herself?
I am shocked anyone would own their own speculum
Different obsession but similar motivation and driving force
On a side note:
These threads always make me feel stupid, like I missed a class in school everyone else took when I have two degrees. I just looked up “speculum”. I took midwife training and I didn’t even know that’s what that was called. Holy cow! That’s the “scoot to the edge of the table” device. Why would anyone own one of those willingly?!
On a side note:
These threads always make me feel stupid, like I missed a class in school everyone else took when I have two degrees. I just looked up “speculum”. I took midwife training and I didn’t even know that’s what that was called. Holy cow! That’s the “scoot to the edge of the table” device. Why would anyone own one of those willingly?!
I know right? They are terrifying. Like medieval instruments of torture.
At least poking my tongue out is relatively noninvasive
Have you heard a song called, I've got a Tongue that's 10inches long and I've learnt too breath through my ears? It is funny.:roflmao: ( Kevin Bloody Wilson).
Not familiar with that particular song, but I know who Kev is (I'm from Sydney) ;)
I used too,now I am in Proserpine. Are you coming home?too the lucky country:winks:
Not yet. I wish I could. This country has lost the plot
Take care over there,just heard of another shooting and people killed.:hugs:
MyNameIsTerry
01-11-17, 01:45
At least poking my tongue out is relatively noninvasive
Well, maybe for you...:winks:
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On a side note:
These threads always make me feel stupid, like I missed a class in school everyone else took when I have two degrees. I just looked up “speculum”. I took midwife training and I didn’t even know that’s what that was called. Holy cow! That’s the “scoot to the edge of the table” device. Why would anyone own one of those willingly?!
I won't be looking at ducks the same now!!! :scared15:
I know right? They are terrifying. Like medieval instruments of torture.
At least poking my tongue out is relatively noninvasive
LOL Well, a lot of medieval torture also involved tongues.
MyNameIsTerry
01-11-17, 02:19
Take care over there,just heard of another shooting and people killed.:hugs:
Another truck attack on pedestrians in Lower Manhattan. Eight killed, 12 injured.
:hugs:to all over there.
Another truck attack on pedestrians in Lower Manhattan. Eight killed, 12 injured.
:hugs:to all over there.
Yeah :( They're saying this one was an ISIS associate, not a domestic nut like the last one.
Mel and I are out in CA.
MyNameIsTerry
01-11-17, 02:31
Yeah :( They're saying this one was an ISIS associate, not a domestic nut like the last one.
Mel and I are out in CA.
These trucks attacks are impossible to stop unless you can stop them getting in or home growns becoming radicalised. I hope the US isn't added to this latest trend with more attacks, although I expect a lot is going in to stop them everywhere as these methods are very easy to implement.
Another sombre day for Americans. They haven't stopped our people getting on with life each day, they won't stop you guys either. :flowers:
Deviation from the midline, lopsidedness on protrusion, asymmetry etc can be related to ALS. I am reassured that I can move it though
Yes. After weakness. Which you know. But refuse to apply to your own thinking with any conviction.
Sounds like me comparing my two hands for any asymetry!
Yes. After weakness. Which you know. But refuse to apply to your own thinking with any conviction.
Always willing to make exceptions for myself ...
(BTW: I knew you'd catch that.)
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LOL Well, a lot of medieval torture also involved tongues.
Meh, that was just for blasphemers and heretics
Always willing to make exceptions for myself ...
(BTW: I knew you'd catch that.)
^^^ Burn the witch!!:roflmao:
^^^ Burn the witch!!:roflmao:
At this point, I'd almost welcome it :scared10:
Well, then it’s time to see the doc. Don’t make me come up there and kick your a$$. :lac:
MyNameIsTerry
01-11-17, 05:16
Well, then it’s time to see the doc. Don’t make me come up there and kick your a$$. :lac:
We may have to bring out the comfy chair!
(Although it's probably getting a fair bit of use in Catalonia at the moment :winks:)
I will say that Mel has a great chin. Takes a verbal lashing like no other and brushes it off like nothing. Bravo
I will say that Mel has a great chin. Takes a verbal lashing like no other and brushes it off like nothing. Bravo
3235
Just learnt that the lifetime risk of dying from a gun assault is greater than the lifetime risk of ALS, which was ... comforting :unsure:
Yeah, and check out the lifetime risk of dying in a car accident...
3235
It was a compliment lol
I serve up cold dishes of reality on many, and many can't take it
Have you seen the new movie coming out?
Willy Wonky Tongue and the Chocolate Factory :whistles:
Positive thoughts
It was a compliment lol
I serve up cold dishes of reality on many, and many can't take it
I don’t know why, but I just got a craving for tiramisu! Auuuuuuuuugh...
Have you seen the new movie coming out?
Willy Wonky Tongue and the Chocolate Factory :whistles:
Positive thoughts
Good thing I like you, Fish
I feel like my brain has been hijacked
I fear Brian has taken control of your mind, Melfish. Evil mutt!
I fear Brian has taken control of your mind, Melfish. Evil mutt!
At least it wasn't Stewie :ohmy:
At least it wasn't Stewie :ohmy:
Tru dat :scared15:
Just spent the day fixing up some old exterior light fixtures. Couldn't get the paint off my hands, realised I was using rust-oleum and not a latex-based paint, and then read the small print. MAY CAUSE NEUROLOGICAL DISEASE. Now wouldn't that be ironic
Lol ...but nothing that says, “May make irrational thoughts worse,” right?
Hey melfish, I actually posted about this tongue thing in one of your threads if you remember.
Something similar happened to me aswell, I was visiting my friends and their bathroom was super bright so when I checked my tongue I thought it was the surface of the moon...
Tongues are weird :P
Hey melfish, I actually posted about this tongue thing in one of your threads if you remember.
Something similar happened to me aswell, I was visiting my friends and their bathroom was super bright so when I checked my tongue I thought it was the surface of the moon...
Tongues are weird :P
I'd like to know how I got through decades of life without even looking at the damn thing, and now I can't stop :wacko:
I can guarantee you that you looked at it, you just didn't give it a second thought.
But now that you're focusing on it makes it a different story.
Health anxiety is awesome like that.
It's the gift that keeps on giving, for sure
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Well, I don't remember it being this ... WONKY
Hey melfish, I actually posted about this tongue thing in one of your threads if you remember.
Something similar happened to me aswell, I was visiting my friends and their bathroom was super bright so when I checked my tongue I thought it was the surface of the moon...
Tongues are weird :P
Do you mean like depressions or dips in the surface of your tongue? Like it's not even? I have teeth marks, not too worried about those. But the general lack of symmetry side to side does gets me worried, ain't gonna lie.
I mean asymmetry in general.
Keep in mind that the tongue is made up of multiple muscles, one side can be longer so it pushes the other side and causes the tongue to appear curved.
I think I just need to stop looking for problems. It's like when I keep buggering up my speech because I'm paying too much attention to it :/
tryingtosurvive1
02-11-17, 02:45
Tongues are wacky looking by nature. Small asymmetries and teeth marks are normal. Tell yourself you are having intrusive thoughts.
MyNameIsTerry
02-11-17, 02:52
Do you mean like depressions or dips in the surface of your tongue? Like it's not even? I have teeth marks, not too worried about those. But the general lack of symmetry side to side does gets me worried, ain't gonna lie.
I've got them on mine. Been seeing them since my early twenties from memory.
Tongues are wacky looking by nature. Small asymmetries and teeth marks are normal. Tell yourself you are having intrusive thoughts.
Seriously, is that what they are? Intrusive thoughts?
(You know my mind of course honed in on the word "small" in your reply, lol)
Yes, they are intrusive thoughts. Yours seems to be obsessive intrusive thoughts.
Intrusive thoughts are common with all types of anxiety. When they become obsessions, it’s time to seek help.
MyNameIsTerry
02-11-17, 04:42
I suggest you read about intrusive thoughts. All people can have them but they are a feature of depression & OCD when causing mental health problems.
You will find most HAers who have OCD are at the "Pure O" end of it. Pure O is a fictional term created by sufferers, so professionals don't use it, but it's to describe people who are considered "obsession based" in their OCD. But there is also a "mixed" which can cover these and the "compulsion based". Some maybe more "mixed" due to the intensity of the compulsion side but I doubt many are slely on the compulsive side as that's when you are getting more into things like contamination themes.
Scary thoughts popping into your head = intrusive thoughts. They are often triggers for the cycle or are responding to a subtle trigger you may not realise. But that doesn't mean obsessively focussing on symptoms is intrusive thoughts, that can just be obsession (rumination or worry) again since intrusive thoughts by their nature appear to pop out of thin air at us a lot of the time. They will obviously get more repetitive as you are obsessing though.
https://www.ocduk.org/types-ocd
But don't forget Somatoform Disorders are obsessive too. So, whether it's one anxiety disorder or another, everything needs looking at. Depression too where a differential disagnosis is made where depression symptoms are more predominant.
Obviously, if you are in the US and they are using the DSM then there will be differences to what I've just said which is based on the WHO ICD which most of the world use including the UK.
I'm yet to come across an OCDer who doesn't say when their overall levels of anxiety are higher than usual their intrusive thoughts are worse. And when their anxiety is lower, the thoughts aren't as bad. The same with obsessing and compulsions in a cycle. Reduce overall anxiety levels and it gets less intense. So, it doesn't have to be all direct therapy work and things to calm your body/mind down can really help e.g. relaxation exercises or perhaps going out for a nice meal and watching the sunset :winks: - so you don't have to wait to get help on that score, all this stuff is online or something we can purchase to help ourselves.
Thanks, guys. Terry, that's a great link! Ta for that. I tick quite a few of those boxes :scared15:
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I've done this for a long time but it's grown worse. It can really take the pleasure out of reading for me. I had no idea it could be an OCD thing.
"Re-reading words or lines in a book over and over again (fear of not quite taking in the information or missing something important from the text)."
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Also, I thought everyone ruminates like that. Surely?
MyNameIsTerry
02-11-17, 05:22
No probs, I found it helped to read about it as you realise you aren't so mad afterall!
Yeah, that's been one of mine too. I still do it now a bit but it's not a problem for me. And there is the thing about OCD - traits can be seen in many people in the population and that's why an OCD diagnosis isn't just about whether you do X, Y or Z - it's about whether it's affecting your life.
I used to ask people to repeat things they said because I worried I had missed something. And other times it was an urge, I felt I needed it. At the worst I was rereading lamp posts, car regs front & back, signs in windows, labels on anything, etc but my anxiety was fever pitch then. A living hell, I felt cursed to exist like that. It took time but I got much better and resolved loads of it. It's why we can look back on ourselves and know others suffering like yourself will dig your way out too. I didn't think I would get a tiny bit better.
For instance, how many people check door locks multiple times? That's an OCD "trait" but does it bother them? How many people talk about being houseproud and excessively cleaning their kitchens? But does it bring them fear/anxiety?
And with rumination, all human beings probably do it. Just as all human beings seek reassurance or experience anxiety or fear or panic. But it's about when it is no longer in a normal range. Worry is part of OCD, as it is with all anxiety disorders, but worry is natural until it becomes excessive. Then the irrationality is common.
Notice how you say it's grown worse? It starts to get frustrating. Things are moving out of a balanced range into a problem. Just the same as normal anxiety starts to turn into a disorder, that's all. You can sort it all out, my compulsions are gone these days after having tons of them. I still feel the "pull" at times but I just dismiss it and move on.
The thing about intrusive thoughts is that it's a false target to demand you must get rid of them. Since studies show anyone can have them without any mental health problems, it may not be achieveable so it's sets us up for failure. I still have intrusive thoughts but I've sorted my reactions out and my subconscious has learned I don't care about them either way so I get a "rider" thought straight on the back of them that goes "meh, what a load of nonsense" and I have no reaction. But I still see them more now than I can remember. I think that's probably true for a lot of us, we notice things more than we used to but that doesn't mean they bother us.
That's not an exhaustive list but it covers a lot. I ticked loads too as I'm a bit of a mixed case but you can beat it all.
Wow, all great stuff. Thanks again, Terry.
The one thing I have not allowed myself to try with this fear is to just say no to it. "No, you do not have ALS, you have anxiety." Shut it down every time the thoughts sabotage me or I go to check something.
BUT I go back and forth between feeling this would be to tempt fate, or else a form of denial. Of false comfort.
I hope that makes sense.
(Last night, I found this amazing Airbnb on the Oregon coast and found myself looking forward to a mini-vacation there. Then I went into a panic about how I might not be able to make the stairs etc etc, and I spiralled right down.)
If you went to the doc, you could shut it down. You’d know it’s just anxiety. You could rule out anything physical. I know docs are far away, but just make an appointment. Even a minute clinic doc at CVS could probably rule out ALS for you.
A minute clinic? Never heard of that
Wow, all great stuff. Thanks again, Terry.
The one thing I have not allowed myself to try with this fear is to just say no to it. "No, you do not have ALS, you have anxiety." Shut it down every time the thoughts sabotage me or I go to check something.
BUT I go back and forth between feeling this would be to tempt fate, or else a form of denial. Of false comfort.
I hope that makes sense.
(Last night, I found this amazing Airbnb on the Oregon coast and found myself looking forward to a mini-vacation there. Then I went into a panic about how I might not be able to make the stairs etc etc, and I spiralled right down.)
It's counterintuitive, but this is actually not the way to beat something like this. You have to lean into it, you have to agree with the thoughts. Instead of saying no I do not have this, you say if I do have this, this is what I'm going to do. This is my plan. Yes it would be bad to have this, but I am mentally prepared if I do.
I have the same theme is you, and I did come up with a plan as to what I would do if I do have it. It still scares me, but my plan does make me feel a little bit better and makes me feel a little bit more powerful over the situation and that totally helpless. It's a less terrifying and I have a plan that I'm comfortable with. We all die at some point, anyway.
This might actually be more scary at first. But it takes the teeth out of it, in the long run. Besides, your goal isn't to reassure yourself, because that just creates a never ending cycle of reassurance seeking and testing.
Right now I'm having a hard time not testing my hands all the time and inspecting for atrophy. That's my current battle.
That's definitely the approach I take with pretty much everything in my life: plan for the worst, hope for the best. I always imagine the worst-case scenario and how I would deal with it. It's just the way I'm wired. BUT ... our "theme" is just so hopeless. There is literally nothing you can do about it. The only plans you can make, well, ... there's no need to enumerate. It's the utter bleakness of it that f%*$s me up.
Yeah. It’s a real b1tch. No getting around that.
Sometimes I think about how lucky I am, considering current circumstances and the history of the world, to have even have made it this far. 37 years is pretty dang good. I am leaving a legacy of family (an adorable 8-month-old) and of work that made a small difference in people’s lives. Good friendships and fun adventures. Even if I die tomorrow or in a couple years, it’s bedn a good run. And a privilege to do all the things I’ve done.
This is how I combat the utter bleakness.
I'm not scared of dying per se. It's the bit in between
Then don't allow them to put you on a breathing machine or feed you via a feeding tube. That'll cut down on the misery you experience. All part of the plan.
MyNameIsTerry
03-11-17, 05:03
It's counterintuitive, but this is actually not the way to beat something like this. You have to lean into it, you have to agree with the thoughts. Instead of saying no I do not have this, you say if I do have this, this is what I'm going to do. This is my plan. Yes it would be bad to have this, but I am mentally prepared if I do.
I have the same theme is you, and I did come up with a plan as to what I would do if I do have it. It still scares me, but my plan does make me feel a little bit better and makes me feel a little bit more powerful over the situation and that totally helpless. It's a less terrifying and I have a plan that I'm comfortable with. We all die at some point, anyway.
This might actually be more scary at first. But it takes the teeth out of it, in the long run. Besides, your goal isn't to reassure yourself, because that just creates a never ending cycle of reassurance seeking and testing.
Right now I'm having a hard time not testing my hands all the time and inspecting for atrophy. That's my current battle.
There's different schools of thought on this one. Thought "blocking" is counterproduct and can make it worse but then we have methods like CBT where you work on reframing, dispelling, etc. Basically you try to reframe it in a positive/neutral way. I'm sure you know that, it's just for the purpose of a discussion point.
But then there is the acceptance approach which you find is best. I found Mindfulness worked with my intrusive thoughts for much the same reasons. And I found acceptance really hard to achieve but the good thing about Mindfulness is how it guides you into learning that skill through exercises.
But when you look at the reaction either of these methods are trying to achieve to that trigger, they are both looking to remove negative reaction. It takes the teeth out of it as you say.
Even in CBT there is the exposure route, which is the standard for initial OCD treatment here, and they have you working through exercises like reading real patient stories about your fear. This desensitises you through learning your intensified panic comes to nothing & settles down so you gradually fear it less.
Some using CBT have you agree with the thoughts. This an interesting one, it's again leaning into them, but it's not necessarily about agreeing you have X, Y or Z but agreeing that you are "having thoughts of X, Y or Z" and that's all fine and means nothing. But I found learning Mindfulness also touched on this because it works by training you to be an observer of thoughts, no interacting with them other than to steer them away without bringing emotion into it.
It's whatever works really but acceptance is seriously important in anxiety, and very hard to learn, and very very important for a HAer.
So, melfish you can try different things. I had to shift strategues for some compulsions as previous winners just weren't budging some of them. But the idea is to kill the panic process off by not reacting with negatives as that's exactly what the cycle expects and it's very important in intrusive thoughts since they are firing off with the intention of getting that feedback. The amygdala in question can only see negative feedback, the stronger the better, so changing reactions to a positive/neutral stops the process and this means you don't keep reinforcing it but because the process works on negative feedback it does mean it takes time for the subconscious to learn it's not getting the required feedback and change to not bothering sending it in the first place.
This is why I'm not much of a fan of thought blocking styles. I think they give something importance that doesn't need it. And we tend to be like "no, no, no, go away" and "I hate feeling like this" and that's just negative reaction that the cycle can feed on. Although, it's probably impossible not to be like that until you reach a certain place in recovery.
In some ways it's like dismantling in stages.
For me now my intrusive thoughts just get "meh". They've only made a short comeback a couple of years ago for a few months and I did the same and they went back in their box.
But the idea is to kill the panic process off by not reacting with negatives as that's exactly what the cycle expects and it's very important in intrusive thoughts since they are firing off with the intention of getting that feedback. The amygdala in question can only see negative feedback, the stronger the better, so changing reactions to a positive/neutral stops the process and this means you don't keep reinforcing it but because the process works on negative feedback it does mean it takes time for the subconscious to learn it's not getting the required feedback and change to not bothering sending it in the first place. ears ago for a few months and I did the same and they went back in their box.
It's almost as though you're personifying the anxiety here, giving it an existence outside of yourself. I need to think on this some more when I'm not so tired, lol. Do you think HA is the subconscious trying to deal with conflict or extreme stress by narrowing the focus and/or deflecting? It's something I keep wondering about. Night
MyNameIsTerry
03-11-17, 05:46
Here's a metaphor that explains the talking between the "brains" at a very basic level. It's a good illustration of where we go wrong when we receive these thoughts:
https://psychologytools.com/worksheets/free/english_gb/intrusive_thoughts_brain_metaphor_free_en-gb.pdf
Yes, it's certainly a way it can manifest. Just look at the HAers who experience it off the back of an ill loved one or bereavement.
I don't know why some may go this way though. It's obvious when you've witnessed a terrible event with a sick loved one. But some people just seem predisposed. When I had my breakdown it was only about being overwhelmed and mine came out as GAD initially, the OCD side came later (and that was because of a med anyway).
Get some well deserved rest! :yesyes:
Really good points and info Terry, thank you. I'm sorry, I didn't mean to imply that acceptance is the only way to get over this. It's just the way that happens to work for me, or has worked for me in the past. Certainly other ways to skin the cat.
But fighting the thoughts usually doesn't work.
I don't know why some may go this way though. It's obvious when you've witnessed a terrible event with a sick loved one. But some people just seem predisposed. When I had my breakdown it was only about being overwhelmed and mine came out as GAD initially, the OCD side came later (and that was because of a med anyway).
I can trace my HA back to childhood. It started off as fear of the end of the world stuff that would regularly do the rounds back then, then it evolved into HA. I used to be super scared of any perceived external threat and then I guess I internalised it. I remember I also became really focused on my elbow, which had been dislocated years earlier and not reset properly (thanks trainee ER doc!), so it kind of jutted out oddly compared to the other one (still does). I became convinced I looked deformed, so I spent a whole summer wearing a woollen school jumper over my uniform. Summer in Sydney is HOT and MUGGY AS HELL. But I didn't care, I just didn't want anyone to see my "deformity". SO I think maybe it started as a fear of abandonment stemming from being adopted and then just became this general thing about not being perfect always, which is where the health anxiety came in, because if I were ill, I would be imperfect and therefore rejected. Dunno, but that's my take.
I've been diagnosed with GAD and panic disorder, as well as depression secondary to that, in the past. One psychiatrist also dangled the "avoidant personality" tag at me, thought he said it was a tendency in me, not a fullblown PD.
I will shut up now :blush:
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Today my thumb has started twitching. Oh great :/
Interesting post melfish. We all carry around some baggage. Some carry a carry on bag and some, like what you described, are packed for a vacation ;) How it affects us varies greatly. Personally, I think exploring some of that, as you've done previously with a professional, would be the most beneficial approach.
Positive thoughts
MyNameIsTerry
04-11-17, 04:55
Really good points and info Terry, thank you. I'm sorry, I didn't mean to imply that acceptance is the only way to get over this. It's just the way that happens to work for me, or has worked for me in the past. Certainly other ways to skin the cat.
But fighting the thoughts usually doesn't work.
Nothing to apologise for atl, I understood what you meant and in many ways I agree because it has helped me to work that way. I think the CBT side was useful at goal setting, getting moving, tackling my compulsions, etc but dispelling the thoughts came largely from acceptance too. Especially with intrusive thoughts.
I believe in finding what works for you, and for me I think you mix & match stuff.
Totally agree on fighting thoughts. It's just another negative with a load of negative emotion and the cycle feeds of that.
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I can trace my HA back to childhood. It started off as fear of the end of the world stuff that would regularly do the rounds back then, then it evolved into HA. I used to be super scared of any perceived external threat and then I guess I internalised it. I remember I also became really focused on my elbow, which had been dislocated years earlier and not reset properly (thanks trainee ER doc!), so it kind of jutted out oddly compared to the other one (still does). I became convinced I looked deformed, so I spent a whole summer wearing a woollen school jumper over my uniform. Summer in Sydney is HOT and MUGGY AS HELL. But I didn't care, I just didn't want anyone to see my "deformity". SO I think maybe it started as a fear of abandonment stemming from being adopted and then just became this general thing about not being perfect always, which is where the health anxiety came in, because if I were ill, I would be imperfect and therefore rejected. Dunno, but that's my take.
I've been diagnosed with GAD and panic disorder, as well as depression secondary to that, in the past. One psychiatrist also dangled the "avoidant personality" tag at me, thought he said it was a tendency in me, not a fullblown PD.
I will shut up now :blush:
---------- Post added at 13:13 ---------- Previous post was at 10:21 ----------
Today my thumb has started twitching. Oh great :/
Perfectionism is another OCD problem too but it's obviously found elsewhere (e.g. BDD). The USA APA believe BDD is connected OCD and so it's in their OCD Spectrum Disorders. WHO disagree with this and have oddly included BDD into a specific Somatoform Disorder.
OCD UK seem to go with OCD & BDD being related. As well as things like hair pulling, skin picking, etc which are not even in the anxiety disorder but in Impulse Disorders. The APA have recently moved these disorders into OCD Spectrum. And somethem else interesting is how a % of children born to parents with OCD have a BDD condition.
So, the docs are all still arguing over where things fit. But what I find interesting is how so many of us have traits of certain things like the BDD. I got so self conscious over my body with the GAD that I wouldn't take my jacket off in summer no matter how hot. I still have this issue although it's not quite as bad.
Personality Disorders are something I've had a look at because my therapist mentioned the possibility nof OCPD instead of OCD near the end of my CBT course (great timing! :doh:) but said it was above her pay grade to diagnose. I had the minimum 4 traits in the list. But when I looked into this what I didn't have was the mindset that came with someone with OPCD - they are major perfectionists and anxiety comes from not achieving it. Then I looked across all the PD's and found there were isolated elements of some of others I could see in myself.
But it's about having enough to justify a diagnosis. I didn't. But it's interesting that so many of us may have personality traits that overlap into them in some way.
I think what you may find beneficial is looking at core beliefs. What you mentioned above shows how over time you have built your thinking a certain way, but that's true of all people really as we learn from our experiences. So, perhaps you need to have a look at what beliefs hold you back and how to adapt them.
On that site I posted with the metaphor they have core beliefs work books. It might be worth a read. It's never going to be an easy thing but if you can find beliefs that are blocking you getting better, they can become a goal to work on in therapy. Issues of perfectionism could be one such belief to tackle (there's another work book on that site for this too).
I guess we've got to learn to love & accept ourselves more and stop being so hard on ourselves too. Something interesting is Compassion Meditation which is a lot less wellknown compared to Mindfulness and it includes directing loving thoughts to ourselves as well as to others. I've wondered how much we could benefit from that and how it could help us change how we apply the beliefs about ourselves.
The vast majority of people who have major episodes of anxiety and/or depression are predisposed. Then after a build up of stress, mix in some major life events or a traumatic experience...and viola! There you go, into the spiral, down the rabbit hole. And once you go down, it takes a lot of work to get out.
I've never had it the anxiety/depression just magically disappear. People just think it will magically go away one day, but it doesn't work like that. Unless it's a really traumatic experience, the anxiety/depression usually didn't develop overnight. It takes time to retrain your brain, balance out your chemicals, neurogenesis of cells, etc. I've only ever gotten out with a combo of meds, therapy and lifestyle changes.
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