Hypnic jolts and sleep issues. [Archive]

Kingdawson

27-12-17, 13:11

Hi guys, I'm new to this forum so bear with me.

So I've been suffering from health anxiety for 4 or so years but 2017 has been ridiculous in a sense that I can't seem to control it.

My issue for the last 3 or so months was that I had (or thought I had developed tinnitus). This 'tinnitus' was very very mild in which I thought I could hear a sound in dead silence (specifically in my left ear). I started thinking maybe It wasnt tinnitus when I could block my ears and hear nothing. Anyway this sound (that was barely noticeable in dead silence) eventually left my brain and I couldn't really hear it any more (maybe it was the anxiety?). Anyway it did it's damage in regards to having terrible sleep to the point that I actually panicked about bedtime. Going to sleep was fine but when I woke up it has been a struggle.

This last week I have suffered from hypnic jolts which has made my issues with sleep harder. Jusy about to sleep and bammm hypnic jolts attack. It's just so annoying.

I know the issue is regarding my anxiety of sleep and the sleep issues I am suffering so I will eventually win this mental struggle....but right now I'm at the "oh god this is gonna last forever stage" which sucks.

Any tips on how I can beat these sleep and hypnic jerks issues?

Bigboyuk

27-12-17, 13:16

Hi Kingdawson I too have sleep issues but don't have the jolts but it's annoying to say the least. A couple of things to try is lavender oil on your pillow or herbal sleeping pills both are natural and safe give them a go and let us know how you get on ATB

katniss

27-12-17, 15:53

Make sure you're not exercising too close to bedtime and avoid heavy meals 2 hours before you sleep. If you really do need some help sleeping but don't want to go the prescription meds route, try taking melatonin. It's herbal :)

Mindprison

27-12-17, 20:16

Sorry to hear you're suffering from this too, i've been getting the same symptoms this past year.

I don't really have any advice to share on how to stop them or manage them since nothing I do seems to work and they don't always happen every night so it's too unpredictable.

What I tend to do when i'm having a rough night with them is open the window (even if it's freezing) just for a little while and change my position in the bed. It doesn't always work, but I seem to have a little more success doing that.

And reminding yourself that it's nothing serious but more of an annoyance also helps. I find that the more worked up and irritated you get, the longer it goes on. Sadly the cycle feeds itself but I hope you get some relief from it soon!

Kingdawson

13-01-18, 07:34

Hi guys just an update..

3 weeks in and these damn jolts are still there. It just makes sleeping really difficult but I am happy that I know it's anxiety related so will eventually solve itself. I really don't want to go the prescribed medication route for sleep or anxiety so hopefully CBT will help me feel less tense. It just sucks that I start the day in a bad mood because of lack of sleep which makes things an uphill battle from the start. The only times I don't get the jolts is when I'm completely calm (hardly ever) or if I've drunk alcohol and I definitely don't want to go that route on a nightly basis. I think about sleep throughout the day which is also a losing battle for actually getting decent sleep when night time is here. Any tips guys would be greatly appreciated?

Anyway I will beat this eventually and you will all beat whatever anxiety issues you are suffering from. I'm just really annoyed at myself for letting everything get this far.

---------- Post added at 07:34 ---------- Previous post was at 07:25 ----------

It also sucks that before my 2017 bout of anxiety I was known as the sleep/nap king and now this latest issue makes me feel I can never truly have a decent sleep/nap again. Damn you anxiety.

worrywart29

13-01-18, 09:44

I use to get Hypnic jolts a lot. It use to drive me crazy. One day while doing one of my many google searches, I came across a forum where someone said they use magnesium oil on the bottom of their feet before bed and haven’t had anymore jerks. I ordered some magnesium oil and before bed rubbed the bottom of my feet with it. That night was the first night that I wasn’t jolted awake. Research it, I think it may help you too.

Kingdawson

14-01-18, 08:02

MyNameIsTerry

14-01-18, 14:17

Cheers for the advice mate. Is there any specific type of magnesium oil I should be looking out for? Had a horrible night last night.

It will be transdermal magnesium, which will be magnesium chloride. Just make sure it's from the Zechstein Sea otherwise it's from much more inferior sources of extraction from the US. It comes mostly as an oil but you can get bath flakes to soak in it too or even gel forms.

Epsom salts is another form of transdermal magnesium but it's not as good.

Try to look for ones that also say the mg content too so you know the concentration. They often say mg per teaspoon.

They say rub it in the soles of your feet because it won't sting. It only stings because it is touching an area of magnesium deficiency. I used it for ages (need to restart it :doh:) and it worked great on my joints (thought I was getting osteoarthritis) but I spread it on my lower legs, back, forearms, etc. Some days it would sting. It's not painful, just like rubbing a cut or graze really. I rubbed it into cuts a few times by mistake, which they tell you not to as it's a salt after all, and that did burn a bit. Some even rub it into their heads for migraines.

It's healthy stuff, it won't do any harm. Most people are likely deficient anyway. It does get used in hundreds of body functions so it might mean playing around with the dosage as they will be trying to use it too. Mg dosing may mean going above RDA's but there is plenty of advice out there from specialists.

I've always found that the jolts are more present in higher anxiety stages. Once you get them down, the jolts largely go or reduce in intensity. I still get the odd one now but the reaction is very different to back then when they were a scary symptom.

Careful1

14-01-18, 17:35

I agree with worrywart29 and Terry, magnesium really does work... I use it as well...

natzsteveo

14-01-18, 18:39

I get this badly as well I get it even when im asleep so I get it as I'm drifting when im asleep and even now im awake I'll jolt t's awful so where do I get this magnesium oil from
Nat

MyNameIsTerry

16-01-18, 02:08

I get this badly as well I get it even when im asleep so I get it as I'm drifting when im asleep and even now im awake I'll jolt t's awful so where do I get this magnesium oil from
Nat

Hi Nat,

There are lots of forms of magnesium and some help with different things so I'll post in a thread where some have adding some useful links.

But as far as the oil goes (and the bath flakes) you can buy them in health food shops, pharmacies and even supermarkets these days. Obviously online gives you more range and cheaper prices. Places like Tesco shop the BetterYou ranges which have this, for instance.

EDIT: Link added http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?p=1754379#post1754379

Kingdawson

29-01-18, 13:41

Bigboyuk

29-01-18, 13:47

Hi It makes sense and sounds like you have good dr so trust and cooperate on this, continue with the CBT and your anxiety issues you wont go far wrong :) Keep us updated on any developments ATB

Kingdawson

29-01-18, 14:25

Hi It makes sense and sounds like you have good dr so trust and cooperate on this, continue with the CBT and your anxiety issues you wont go far wrong :) Keep us updated on any developments ATB

Cheers mate.

It's just that I really become down after a night of bad sleep and start thinking "I'm never going to sleep properly again" or "these jolts are gonna start up when I'm about to sleep so what's the point". I always forget the amount of decent sleeps I've had recently and it seems like it's back to square 1. Just feeling sorry for myself and reading stuff cancers, tumours, MS to make me feel more bloody depressed.

Bigboyuk

29-01-18, 15:22

Cheers mate.

It's just that I really become down after a night of bad sleep and start thinking "I'm never going to sleep properly again" or "these jolts are gonna start up when I'm about to sleep so what's the point". I always forget the amount of decent sleeps I've had recently and it seems like it's back to square 1. Just feeling sorry for myself and reading stuff cancers, tumours, MS to make me feel more bloody depressed. I used to think like that used to get many sleepless nights still get them but not as often, so I know it will get easier for you :) Yeah Been there 'feeling' sorry for my self too it's often like a game of snakes and ladders you just feeling good and you land on a snake and down you go nearly to square one. A tip is don't google stuff that is likely to cause you to go down hill, it's doesn't take much to get feeling bloody depressed I know that from experience mate! ATB

Kingdawson

29-01-18, 18:44

I used to think like that used to get many sleepless nights still get them but not as often, so I know it will get easier for you :) Yeah Been there 'feeling' sorry for my self too it's often like a game of snakes and ladders you just feeling good and you land on a snake and down you go nearly to square one. A tip is don't google stuff that is likely to cause you to go down hill, it's doesn't take much to get feeling bloody depressed I know that from experience mate! ATB

Went to my CBT class today and felt slightly better. Still panicking about night time/lack of sleep/ jolting randomly but I can't predict the future so need to stop panicking and predicting the worst (that I won't sleep...that I will have twitches at sleep time forever). I will eventually overcome this.

Kingdawson

12-02-18, 17:56

Hi guys just wanted to post a bit about my state of mind and my issues which I'm really scared about.

So I've been suffering from HA(on and off) since 2013 but 2017 was a very bad year with one HA issue after the other. Of course with HA it leads to bouts of insomnia which finally clears up when you feel reassured that you don't have this particular illness you are concerned about.

Anyway late December I finally reassured myself that I was ok in regards to my latest health scare issue (tinnitus in left ear only audible in absolute dead silence and extremely low level). The 'tinnitus' I thought I had for months and was looking out for 24/7 suddenly vanished and I c ouldn't hear anything much to my relief (although I always questioned whether it actually was tinnitus being that I couldn't hear it when I put ear plugs on.

So anyway that was clear and I thought my sleeping issue would resolve itself but it didn't. Constantly panicky before bed , thinking I won't fall asleep etc etc. Anyway I then developed random hypnic jerks at sleep onset (which I don't remember ever having). These were random movements just when I'm about to fall asleep (usually effecting shoulders but sometimes legs And hands). The jerks are still here, they've never been intense just subtle movement but they obviously stop me from stalling asleep which then in itself becomes a battle. They've been with me now since late December and I'm literally thinking about 'how much sleep I'm going to get throughout the day. Sometimes I get decent sleep but I'm not relaxing in bed and I'm always thinking "when is this twitch going to come".

Since a week or so ago I've really had some poor sleep and developed a twitch in my right lower eyelid which is annoying. My body generally feels twitchy and I feel very panicky. I keep looking for weird feelings in my body somehow convinced I have MS. Keep going on MS forums and reading up on it constantly which only makes it worse if course. I'm just so scared.

Spoken to my doc about the sudden movements before bed and twitchy eyelid but he doesn't seem concerned at all. He says it's anxiety related but I don't know. I'm scared and feel jittery.

---------- Post added at 17:56 ---------- Previous post was at 16:50 ----------

Any help/advice would be much appreciated.

Imeleedi

12-02-18, 18:35

So the last week I was sleeping much better. I'm taking a mix of chelated magnesium, taurine and cod liver oil.

The last few days it's been quite troublesome though
Little to no sleep and the twitches/jolts are happening when I'm about to drift off. I just get really panicky during sleep time and instantly think I'm going to start twitching when I'm about to sleep. I really focus in on it and inevitably I usually get a subtle shoulder twitch that makes me panic more.

Went to the docs who seems to think it's definitely an anxiety issue. As I said before, I've had massive health anxiety the whole of 2017....the numerous health concerns only calmed down at the beginning of December 2017 where I finally thought to myself "there's nothing physically wrong with you". I just assumed after I finally came to the realisation that I was ok the sleep wouldn't be an issue anymore. After a few nights of very little sleep I panicked more and more about sleeping .....And then the jerks came (previously don't remember ever suffering from them my whole life).

Doc said he could prescribe me either diazapam or Zopiclone but warned against it due to the risk of of dependency. Advised to carry on with CBT amd work on my anxiety issues. Did prescribe promethezine as he said there's no risk if dependency but again advised me to not use it until I've exhausted all other options.

Just a heads up mate, I always suffer extreme sleep issues during and after a major bout of health anxiety. Currently going through one now.

I can tell you from first hand experience that it takes months to retrain your body to start sleeping undisturbed again. It's not easy, and you'll have setbacks. Medication can be helpful in the early stages, but it will come with time. 2 years ago I had the jerks, I also got a vibrating feeling throughout my body (which was just from the sheer terror of knowing another stressful night was ahead of me) and eventually I even started having some weird colour blast close eye hallucinations that scared me beyond belief. Was a really bad time. This time, I have developed this weird loud bang that just wakes me up, very similar to a body jolt, happens at the same stage of sleep apparently.

As for the twitches, especially eye twitches, they seem to go hand in hand with disturbed sleep for whatever reason. I had it last time and it lasted 3 weeks.

This time I have something else with my right eye, its more of a pulling sensation and is almost constant. Had it since late December about 2 weeks into the sleep disturbance starting again. Definitely 100% not suggestive of MS.

Kingdawson

13-02-18, 19:03

Just a heads up mate, I always suffer extreme sleep issues during and after a major bout of health anxiety. Currently going through one now.

I can tell you from first hand experience that it takes months to retrain your body to start sleeping undisturbed again. It's not easy, and you'll have setbacks. Medication can be helpful in the early stages, but it will come with time. 2 years ago I had the jerks, I also got a vibrating feeling throughout my body (which was just from the sheer terror of knowing another stressful night was ahead of me) and eventually I even started having some weird colour blast close eye hallucinations that scared me beyond belief. Was a really bad time. This time, I have developed this weird loud bang that just wakes me up, very similar to a body jolt, happens at the same stage of sleep apparently.

As for the twitches, especially eye twitches, they seem to go hand in hand with disturbed sleep for whatever reason. I had it last time and it lasted 3 weeks.

This time I have something else with my right eye, its more of a pulling sensation and is almost constant. Had it since late December about 2 weeks into the sleep disturbance starting again. Definitely 100% not suggestive of MS.

Thanks gor the reasuring words mate. Ive also lately got that vibrating feeling when im lying down. Dont think im actually vibrating and only happened once or twice but i know the feeling you are talking about.

Ive just read sooooo much about MS/ALS/Brain tumours that im petrified.

Imeleedi

13-02-18, 20:34

Thanks gor the reasuring words mate. Ive also lately got that vibrating feeling when im lying down. Dont think im actually vibrating and only happened once or twice but i know the feeling you are talking about.

Ive just read sooooo much about MS/ALS/Brain tumours that im petrified.

I've been there man, don't worry.

I was physically vibrating, I could see it and even showed my brother and he saw it too. It is just a by product of extreme stress.

If you have read everything bout them all you will no doubt know that none of them really present in ways typical of each other. Brain tumours occasionally present with MS type symptoms (because of direct interference with nerves in the CNS them-self. However, the vast majority of the time they present with swelling symptoms as a result of the mass effect itself.

Things like seizures, headaches enough to make you vomit, severe lethargy, and losing ability down one side of the body. Seriously, seriously obvious stuff that scares even the most normal of people, and would send anyone with HA directly to the A+E demanding a contrast MRI (not that you'd need to ask)

Kingdawson

26-02-18, 13:15

Update:

Eye twitch is still present. Annoying really but that's life and hopefully it goes eventually.

Hypnic jerks there somedays but better.

I twitch in other body parts at random parts of the day which is weird. I would sometimes get a random stomach/arms/leg twitch that lasts a few seconds or until i move.

I cant seem to shake the ALS/MS/Briain tumour fear for a prolonged period though. I would be ok and sleep fine for a few days but then i start getting scared and panicky
really weird. How do i get over these fears? Are they realistic from the symptoms ive described? I just want to enjoy life again.

Kingdawson

26-02-18, 21:26

Anyone?

Kingdawson

03-03-18, 12:06

I think i'm starting to get a breakthrough in my mindset. I really think, for the first time very strongly, that i'm experiencing symptoms that are related to anxiety/stress. Let me explain why...

1) as i said previously...2017 has been a really bad year in terms of health anxiety. Was getting rubbish sleep due to constant worries about 1 health issue after another.

2) in december i finally accepted that i had no major health issue but unlike other times...i didnt go back to immediate decent sleep once i got some relief. This panicked me and i was literally scared of bedtime and a few days later i get my first hypnic jerk? Coincidence? I think not.

2) eyelid twitch came a month ago after a run of terrible sleep and still being ridiculously anxioys? Coincidence? Probably not.

3) now i can feel a twitch at random body parts at certain times thtoughout the day (when resting/sitting). Lasts a second or 2 and stops when i move but i noticed it just after reading loads of stuff about twitching? Coincidence? Probably not.

4) Also noticed hypnic jerks are not as much anymore and lessened when i started worrying about twitching instead. Sleeping better too because of this. Coincidence that the jerks hace decreased when ive not thought/worried about sleeping or the jerks? Probably not.

5) eyelid twitch still there on and off throughout the day but rarely present when my mind is preoccupued? Coincidence? Probably not.

So thats where im at now. Eyelid twitch still present but will go in time. Hypnic jerks occur but most days i sleep without them being present.

I think i'm suffering from BFS that isnt bothersome except eyelid which is annoying but its not intense. Reading tge BFS site where quite a few suffered from hypnic jerks before the twitches makes me believe this is probably my issue. Especially when ive read most of those had health anxiety before the jerks/twitches.

Kingdawson

17-05-18, 12:16

Advice needed guys:

So after 2 months of eyelid twitching that finally went thank God. Still does it every now and again but not very often at all and i'm happy about that. Think CBD oil helped massively with that.

Random body twitches still there but not very often and ive accepted them. Not at all bothersome and last a few seconds or until I move the limb. Just a quick rumble basically.

My brain and train of thought is also good for the most part and i have accepted that I probably don't have anything physically wrong with me BUT i still panic when im about to sleep and i still get hypnic jerks although not every day. Any suggestions on thing I can do?

Kingdawson

17-05-18, 16:42

The only thing I'm anxious about now is the jerks. I've literally come to peace with everything else. I'm very grateful im not googling scary things such as MS, ALS etc etc anymore.

If anyone can give me tips I would be grateful. It's annoying becauae they are not even big jerks...just minor movements but the anxiety associated with them make me feel worse.

Fishmanpa

17-05-18, 17:13

My wife has them and I know she's falling asleep because of it. The snoring starts soon after too! ~lol~

Here's the thing. Most everyone has them and it is what it is. You cannot stop your mind and body's involuntary reactions and will just have to come to terms and deal with it :shrug:

Positive thoughts

Kingdawson

04-10-18, 08:05

Hi guys just need some advice on sleep issues.

So mentally I feel well...doing well generally...only thing I'm now bothered about is sleep issues. I get anxious at night and hope I'm gonna get a decent night sleep. The jerks are there but not every day and they are for the most part minor ones.
I keep waking up during the night though(not from jerks)...Quite a few times actually. I toss and turn a lot as well. I definitely suffer from sleep state misperception though because there are times I feel I'm awake..then a second later my girlfriend wakes me up complaining about snoring. She actually recorded me snoring for 5 or so minutes when I was definitely sure I was awake....and I do feel fine in the morning generally.

I definitely do wake up quite a bit though so can you guys give me a few tips on improving my sleep? Any decent supplements?

Kingdawson

31-10-18, 21:09

So sadly I'm back..

Took some time off this site and for the most part i've been decent. Sleep has been ok and the twitching has lessened until last week.

I do strength training 5 times a week and a week or so ago I did my usual chest press work out. Thing is...my form isn't fantastic but I've been steadily moving up in the weight I'm pushing. I notice chest presses gives me right shoulder pain but the day or 2 after a chest workout I was getting this odd wrist/forearm pain. It's like a sort of shooting pain that comes and goes (particularly when I move my wrist a certain direction). It's not always there...sometimes it's there and others it's fine. Well a day after the pain I noticed my wrist would twitch if I used my right hand or moved it a certain way (not all the time but it's there).
A week later the wrist seems better pain wise ( although still feel a slight pain certain times on my wrist and sometimes forearm and the twitch happens sometimes as well.

No weakness or anything but I started to worry a little about ALS again which totally sucks. Anyone give me some assurance to calm me down a little would be great.

Carys

31-10-18, 21:22

Kingdawson

31-10-18, 21:26

Twitching is just tired muscles in essence. You did work outs, you did weights and probably overdid it, you stretched and stressed the nerves, ligaments and muscles - and that is the cause. Simple, sorted.

From the www.. (http://www..).

Muscle twitching is also called muscle fascilation. Twitching involves small muscle contractions in the body. Your muscles are made up of fibers that your nerves control. Stimulation or damage to a nerve may cause your muscle fibers to twitch.

Thanks. You've always been supportive on here and for that I'm very appreciative.

I've been twitching for 10 months and in that period I've never been stronger so I know I'm being silly. I just get so anxious which then leads to rubbish sleep and even more self pity. When I feel/see something new I just panic and never think rationally.

Carys

01-11-18, 11:07

You are welcome! :blush: You are winning, your head really knows things are ok, this is just a blip. You are clearly prone to fascilation, like my good self. :)

Kingdawson

03-04-20, 11:01

bump

So these Hypnic jerks are back again and quite a lot of them (well they never really went they just happened once or twice before sleep and that was it). I think its because I'm anxious about Coronavirus and am experiencing a few minor symptoms so maybe my anxiety is high.

Thing is I don't get them if I drink alcahol but obviously can't rely on that. Do people get these jerks? I know they are common about sleep onset.

Kingdawson

05-04-20, 14:47

Anyone? Really could do with some support.

Fishmanpa

05-04-20, 19:39

Do a search. There are plenty of threads about this.

Positive thoughts

dizzy1

24-07-20, 14:12

Hi. Yes I get them! How are you getting on? Did you try magnesium?

BackRoads

25-07-20, 05:31

I've had the twitching for over 4 years now. Still hate it, and wish it would resolve. I don't get the hypnic jerks as much, but sometimes I do. I did last night, and I noticed it was after a stressful day and being anxious about a bad evening of twitching.

Kingdawson

27-07-20, 16:14

Update for anyone going through this:

So a little over 3 weeks ago I became a father for the first time. Its been tiring but amazing at the same time.

Regarding the jerks. The day my son was born until yesterday I didn't experience one jerk after experiencing them off and on since Dec 2017. My mind wasn't occupied on the jerks and guess what? They didn't come. I had something else to pre occupy my thoughts which leads me to believe they were definitely caused by anxiety. I then had 1 or 2 yesterday when I became annoyed i couldn't sleep but I get what they are now.

You got to remember hypnic jerks are completely normal. People twitch before sleep onset..'normal' people and they don't give a damn. My brother came to my house a few times this last week and I could see him twitching as he was falling asleep but he couldn't give a single damn and he has zero anxiety. My son i see twitch before sleep and a thats a 3 week old who I somehow doubt is anxious.

Took a while to understand but I get it now. Still not sleeping very well but thats for other reasons and couldn't be happier.