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View Full Version : Rabies concern but hear out my post please.



Seaster
31-07-18, 02:52
I have read other posts on here and so I know the chances are pretty low that I was infected with rabies. However, my situation doesn't happen too often given that I was bitten inside of a restroom at a Walmart. So I'm just gonna lay out the facts and see what people have to say. This happened a week ago tonight for what it's worth.

1.) A big German Shepherd, owned and on leash by his owner, were coming around the bend of the restroom proceeding to exit. I happen to be entering and as both of us got close, the dog proceeded to bite me real quick.

2.) I was wearing some Hyper Tough gloves (those lime green ones with polyester material on top of hand), and no damage was made to glove.

3.) The bite "wound" itself was maybe the size of the base end of an eraser in terms of roundness. A bit of redness but no bleeding really.

4.) The Doctor totally dismissed rabies and gave me Tetanus shots and x-rays of hand. He said if any symptoms were to show, they'd deal with them. Not exactly reassuring since it'd be too late then...

5.) The dog apparently comes in frequently and no other incidents occurred before that night or during the night this happened. Again, just saying this fact in case it helps cement things.

NervUs
31-07-18, 03:32
First...why was there a dog in Walmart?

I had something similar happen to me a month or two ago. Random dog on a trail greeted me then proceeded to put my whole hand in its mouth. It didn't bite but I felt my hand graze teeth. There was no blood or cut, but there was a red mark (maybe from friction) that went away the next day. I was with my kids and their friends and I didn't even think to ask for info. She had two dogs with her, they were pretty frou frou, and I would be shocked if not vaccinated and under a vet's care. Still, something like that does make you wonder....

After a little discomfort, I am basically at peace with this incident. I do sometimes check the rabies report for my state and the county I was in, lol! No dogs have died of rabies yet!!!

Your situation seems a lot like mine, only the saliva would have been buffered in your case by the glove. I don't think you have cause to worry. You could probably check to ask if the dog comes in in the next 10 days, then you will know you are fine and no exposure definitively.

I used to be such a dog person, constantly excusing this sort of canine behavior (since I once had a badly behaved dog that I loved like my own child!), but now I am just kind of like WTF??? Why do these people bring dogs around people if they can't behave?

Seaster
31-07-18, 03:48
First...why was there a dog in Walmart?

I had something similar happen to me a month or two ago. Random dog on a trail greeted me then proceeded to put my whole hand in its mouth. It didn't bite but I felt my hand graze teeth. There was no blood or cut, but there was a red mark (maybe from friction) that went away the next day. I was with my kids and their friends and I didn't even think to ask for info. She had two dogs with her, they were pretty frou frou, and I would be shocked if not vaccinated and under a vet's care. Still, something like that does make you wonder....

After a little discomfort, I am basically at peace with this incident. I do sometimes check the rabies report for my state and the county I was in, lol! No dogs have died of rabies yet!!!

Your situation seems a lot like mine, only the saliva would have been buffered in your case by the glove. I don't think you have cause to worry. You could probably check to ask if the dog comes in in the next 10 days, then you will know you are fine and no exposure definitively.

I used to be such a dog person, constantly excusing this sort of canine behavior (since I once had a badly behaved dog that I loved like my own child!), but now I am just kind of like WTF??? Why do these people bring dogs around people if they can't behave?

Because the guy apparently said it was a service dog. It had no tags or vest and it bit me so definitely not a service dog. And yeah, the gloves would definitely stop the saliva right? I don't know if they could squeeze through the very small holes in the fabric of the glove because light can be see through the glove if you hold it up to light but that's the design of the glove.

I think the dog fear bit me? Because i have only the one tiny mark and if it really were meaning to bite me, i'd have more severe of a bit I would think. Walking around the wall of a bathroom and seeing a dog might be scary, but i feel maybe it was more scary for the dog and it bit me due to fear or protective of owner?

I see a doctor for follow up but he already said i'm good. I'm gonna try and see if he wants to do shots for me since dog's status can't be confirmed. Not likely he'll order shots for me and even if they do, my work wouldn't like having to pay for them. (i'm on workmans comp)

AntsyVee
31-07-18, 08:36
I’m not trying to be snarky here, OP, but how is this different from all the other rabies posts on here (except unless you’re referring to the invisible bat ones)? The bite didn’t even break your skin. You aren’t even sure it was a bite. You had gloves on. This isn’t rabies exposure because there was no exposure.

Fishmanpa
31-07-18, 13:06
Rabies concern but hear out my post please.

Heard, read and dismissed... :lac:

Positive thoughts

Seaster
31-07-18, 16:06
I don't know if the skin was broken or not because apparently even if the skin didn't bleed, there still can be a break. The wound looked kind of like a scab if anything but it was mostly flat. Hell, it's been a week and the wound has almost fully healed.

How much did the polyester material gloves help in this situation, given that they did not suffer any damage? Not to mention I didn't feel any wetness at all.

The only real concern I have is the not knowing the status of the dog as well as there not being tags despite having an owner and leash/collar.

AMomentofClarity
31-07-18, 16:43
Here’s the thing....for there to be any risk at all the dog would have had to have rabies first. Rabies in domestic animals in the US is quite rare. There’s absolutely no way that somebody is walking around your local wal mart with a rabid German Shepherd.

Seaster
31-07-18, 16:48
Here’s the thing....for there to be any risk at all the dog would have had to have rabies first. Rabies in domestic animals in the US is quite rare. There’s absolutely no way that somebody is walking around your local wal mart with a rabid German Shepherd.

Yeah, that's what calms me down as of late. I've gotten more calm since the bite happened. It's just down to this though: If the dog was rabid, it would actually legit bite me and cause a serious injury, and even attack it's owner too? But if it wasn't displaying symptoms but had rabies in it, it wouldn't transmit anyways. A bit confusing.

But yeah, I see my doctor for a brief follow up today. I doubt much will come out of it but i have to go since it's through workmans comp.

lofwyr
31-07-18, 17:09
There is between 1 and 3 cases of rabies in humans a year in the United States. That is between 1 in 100 million chance to 1 in 300 million chance.

Your odds of winning the Powerball if you play is 1 in 175 million.

Your odds of being struck by lightning are 1 in 7000 in a given year.

I think you are good.

paranoid-viking
31-07-18, 21:36
Do you know the dog and its owner? If the dog is alive and healthy a week after such a incident it does not have rabies and you are 100% safe.
Besides; I thought all domestic dogs in the US were required to be vacinated? You have all possible good odds with you.

Seaster
31-07-18, 21:54
Do you know the dog and its owner? If the dog is alive and healthy a week after such a incident it does not have rabies and you are 100% safe.
Besides; I thought all domestic dogs in the US were required to be vacinated? You have all possible good odds with you.

They are required but some people are irresponsible so it's possible some aren't? I have no choice but to just accept i'm likely fine because the shots aren't gonna be covered through workmans comp most likely. (doubtful they are needed.

Doctor said teeth would have had to go into my skin or parts of mouth make contact with my skin but since I was wearing a glove, the low risk gets even lower because of that. I suppose that's true? I mean, you can shine light through the glove but it's very small holes as part of the design of glove.

Fishmanpa
31-07-18, 22:19
You. Don't. Have. Rabies. There are no "what ifs" or "yeah buts" or anything else (.) Period :lac:

Positive thoughts

AntsyVee
31-07-18, 22:23
You. Don't. Have. Rabies. There are no "what ifs" or "yeah buts" or anything else (.) Period :lac:

Positive thoughts


Yup. Gloves + no broken skin = NOTHING.

Seaster
31-07-18, 22:37
Yup. Gloves + no broken skin = NOTHING.

Not sure on broken skin part. It's kind of a tricky thing because while my "wound" is small, it's hard to tell if it counts as broken skin or not.

Most likely nothing. Once I get to 10 posts, I can upload the photo of the initial wound from the bite.

AMomentofClarity
31-07-18, 22:39
Not sure on broken skin part. It's kind of a tricky thing because while my "wound" is small, it's hard to tell if it counts as broken skin or not.

Most likely nothing. Once I get to 10 posts, I can upload the photo of the initial wound from the bite.

Nobody needs a photo. You don’t have rabies. Period. What are you looking for here? You’ve gotten reassurance from Drs, from here. At this point what’s going to convince you?

NervUs
31-07-18, 23:03
They are required but some people are irresponsible so it's possible some aren't? I have no choice but to just accept i'm likely fine because the shots aren't gonna be covered through workmans comp most likely. (doubtful they are needed.

Doctor said teeth would have had to go into my skin or parts of mouth make contact with my skin but since I was wearing a glove, the low risk gets even lower because of that. I suppose that's true? I mean, you can shine light through the glove but it's very small holes as part of the design of glove.

Maybe one way to feel good about it is that there can be severe adverse reactions to the shots, so at some point the risk of adverse events needs to be weighed against the risk of rabies. Your doctor is thinking the risk from the vaccine is worse in your case.

I have read a bit about this, and there are epidemiologists who have studied the issue and they conclude that people are over-vaccinated for rabies exposures in the US. About 1/3 to 40% of people that get vaccinated didn't really need to be. Dog bites are a huge part of this number, and owned dogs are much lower risk than if you had been bitten by a stray or wild animal.

I understand that low risk doesn't mean no risk, and you are going to have to come to peace with that. I have been in that position before (discovered a bat in the house in March, one child received PEP, the rest of us did not) and it is hard but I did find peace about it).

Seaster
31-07-18, 23:21
Maybe one way to feel good about it is that there can be severe adverse reactions to the shots, so at some point the risk of adverse events needs to be weighed against the risk of rabies. Your doctor is thinking the risk from the vaccine is worse in your case.

I have read a bit about this, and there are epidemiologists who have studied the issue and they conclude that people are over-vaccinated for rabies exposures in the US. About 1/3 to 40% of people that get vaccinated didn't really need to be. Dog bites are a huge part of this number, and owned dogs are much lower risk than if you had been bitten by a stray or wild animal.

I understand that low risk doesn't mean no risk, and you are going to have to come to peace with that. I have been in that position before (discovered a bat in the house in March, one child received PEP, the rest of us did not) and it is hard but I did find peace about it).

You or someone on this post mentioned checking the county database for cases of rabies, right? I was curious what that site is. Not that i'm convinced that I have it anymore, but would give me peace of mind if the animal isn't on there.

I doubt the owner and dog will ever come back to this Walmart due to fear of potential trouble or whatnot. Unfortunate that someone can't be responsible enough to care about the victim at all.

NervUs
31-07-18, 23:30
You or someone on this post mentioned checking the county database for cases of rabies, right? I was curious what that site is. Not that i'm convinced that I have it anymore, but would give me peace of mind if the animal isn't on there.

I doubt the owner and dog will ever come back to this Walmart due to fear of potential trouble or whatnot. Unfortunate that someone can't be responsible enough to care about the victim at all.

You cam google your state , confirmed rabies, and year you want to see. EVery state publishes their own record. It will be compiled by your state's dept of health. Mine published by species and by county.

Don't get obsessive about checking! It will help you put it in perspective though.

Fishmanpa
31-07-18, 23:49
You cam google your state , confirmed rabies, and year you want to see. EVery state publishes their own record. It will be compiled by your state's dept of health. Mine published by species and by county.

That got me curious. I looked up my state and in 2017 there was 1 case of human rabies and she got it while in India. There hasn't been a domestic case in over 20 years! As far as animals testing positive? 1 dog out of the millions and millions of dogs in the state (and that was a stray).

Anyway... It just puts things in perspective and points out the reality.

Positive thoughts

Seaster
01-08-18, 00:44
I don't even see any statistics or options for 2018 so I guess there hasn't been any thus far. You'd think a site would put up the year as a placeholder anyways and when you click on it, it'll say no cases reported so far.

But yeah, I feel better and better on it by the day. Finding this message board has shown me that i really am alright.

KK77
01-08-18, 01:07
But yeah, I feel better and better on it by the day. Finding this message board has shown me that i really am alright.

Good to hear. So strike while the iron is hot and seek treatment for your anxiety disorder. Even self-help. There is a link in Fishmanpa's signature for free CBT prog at CBT4Panic.

---------- Post added at 01:07 ---------- Previous post was at 01:03 ----------

Here http://cbt4panic.org/

MyNameIsTerry
01-08-18, 02:03
If what happened to you happened to me the result would be it floating past me or me smirking at a daft thought. But that's because I have no HA elements to my anxiety disorders. I would only recognise the thought now and automatically label it because I've been through intrusive thoughts in my OCD and come out the other side of them. Prior to this it would have passed through even quicker without even a label, as the non anxious would do.

That's the issue to look at, the reaction. You can look at the lack of evidence and produce counter evidence (like the rabies statistics) but these need to be used in a productive way and not as a "checking" which is compulsion and only feeds cycles. Take the counter evidence and look no further in it because that's all about all-or-nothing thinking, digging for the 100% certainty that doesn't always exist no matter how unlikely as the mind will always find something.

Work to change your reactions. CBT4Panic will be useful but it's not aimed at OCD, which is where HA often comes in and may lack some things that help with reacting to intrusive thoughts, but you could supplement it with the CCI workbooks which the same author has created a sticky for on this board to cover that. It's worth trying.

I said at the start how I just wouldn't care about this but that's because it's not a theme that has ever developed in me. Substitute it with one that has, say I needed to change a t-shirt for a clean one and how that minor change in my life triggered an intrusive thought about the dangers of it, and my reaction was no different from yours or anyone else's. But I spent years working against it and found my way through them until it became intuitive.

Seaster
01-08-18, 02:39
Honestly, when I first was bitten, my fears were more hoping the symptoms just don't show up than anything else. Because I felt like this is it for me mentality but I'm not in the minority in that fear regarding rabies.

Now, I'm more calm because of the fact that I had gloves on. The doctor told me today that I should feel good because if the gloves are not damaged, then my wound wasn't caused by teeth penetration. I just have to be positive and not think of things like what if symptoms do show?, etc.

MyNameIsTerry
01-08-18, 03:26
So, are you saying your not in a minority thinking about the risks of rabies because it is more common in the US? Out of all the people bitten by dogs every year?

But cases are so rare, it would be more practical in a country with big rabies problems.

NervUs
01-08-18, 03:29
Honestly, when I first was bitten, my fears were more hoping the symptoms just don't show up than anything else. Because I felt like this is it for me mentality but I'm not in the minority in that fear regarding rabies.

Now, I'm more calm because of the fact that I had gloves on. The doctor told me today that I should feel good because if the gloves are not damaged, then my wound wasn't caused by teeth penetration. I just have to be positive and not think of things like what if symptoms do show?, etc.

I hate to be the one to break this to you, but the symptoms are very likely to show. I am a zoonotic disease fearer, and I have feared many, and the symptoms show every time! Plus, with rabies, the incubation period is so long that you will get sick in that time. You need to have some mental reserves for that and a way to process what is happening.

Rabies hypochondria is actually a very old phenomenon. IN the 1800s. maybe even earlier, doctors used to believe rabies was not inherently fatal b/c so many people who had been bitten by animals would come down with rabies symptoms and then recover. Some was psychosomatic and some was other illnesses that mimic rabies. Why do I know this? Hypochondria of course-- I think I have read everything every produced about rabies and, when I am not fearing it, I actually find it all very fascinating! But the bottom line is, you are likely to come down with twinges, headaches, sore throat, etc and you will have to fight to see it clearly. Hypochondria is a cruel B!

Seaster
01-08-18, 03:43
I've had worries about health issues in the past and each time, it was a struggle but I got through it. One instance was Diabetes, and it resulted in me getting blood tested to ease the mind. But with this, I just got to live my life like I normally would. Posting on here and having reassurance helps.

If I see the owner/dog again, that'll be a good sign but I will have to let a manager know because a dog that bites shouldn't be in a store.

---------- Post added at 02:43 ---------- Previous post was at 02:33 ----------

For the record, this was the mark left on my hand when I took off my glove after the dog "bit" me. I'd love to know whether this is even a "breaking the skin" situation for future reference if nothing else.

http://i1303.photobucket.com/albums/ag141/steven_munn1/38041949_1735333963171249_7349830504029356032_n_zp sd2rxgdkc.jpg

AntsyVee
01-08-18, 03:48
Looks like a small bruise. My prognosis: You're gonna live.

paranoid-viking
01-08-18, 09:06
They are required but some people are irresponsible so it's possible some aren't? I have no choice but to just accept i'm likely fine because the shots aren't gonna be covered through workmans comp most likely. (doubtful they are needed.

Doctor said teeth would have had to go into my skin or parts of mouth make contact with my skin but since I was wearing a glove, the low risk gets even lower because of that. I suppose that's true? I mean, you can shine light through the glove but it's very small holes as part of the design of glove.

You did not answer the question? Do you know who the owner of the dog is or were they complete strangers? Do you have any opportunity of follow-up? I mean so that you can relax your mind. It is not good being extremely hysterical over rabies.

---------- Post added at 10:06 ---------- Previous post was at 09:58 ----------


I hate to be the one to break this to you, but the symptoms are very likely to show. I am a zoonotic disease fearer, and I have feared many, and the symptoms show every time! Plus, with rabies, the incubation period is so long that you will get sick in that time. You need to have some mental reserves for that and a way to process what is happening.

Rabies hypochondria is actually a very old phenomenon. IN the 1800s. maybe even earlier, doctors used to believe rabies was not inherently fatal b/c so many people who had been bitten by animals would come down with rabies symptoms and then recover. Some was psychosomatic and some was other illnesses that mimic rabies. Why do I know this? Hypochondria of course-- I think I have read everything every produced about rabies and, when I am not fearing it, I actually find it all very fascinating! But the bottom line is, you are likely to come down with twinges, headaches, sore throat, etc and you will have to fight to see it clearly. Hypochondria is a cruel B!

I know. There was a doctor in that time period who thought that he could cure rabies by putting patients in a steam bath. He had claimed that himself had developed rabies and cured himself that way but I guess he was a hypocondriac himself as doctors with hypocondria is not an unknown phenonomen(they are often the biggest HAers themself considering their medical knowledge). Anyway; he thought that he had cured patients of rabies by using this method. Well, unfortunately, he just cured hypocondria for people with psychosomatic pain. Sort of placebo medicine I guess.

Seaster
02-08-18, 00:21
You did not answer the question? Do you know who the owner of the dog is or were they complete strangers? Do you have any opportunity of follow-up? I mean so that you can relax your mind. It is not good being extremely hysterical over rabies.

---------- Post added at 10:06 ---------- Previous post was at 09:58 ----------





Complete strangers and there is not way to track them down other than hope they return to the store one of these days.

Seaster
03-08-18, 16:30
And now it would seem that the owner of the dog has been spotted shopping in the store but did not have his dog with him this time. I wasn't in at the time but this kind of makes me wonder/worry a little bit because from what I know, he usually has his dog with him. But since it bit me, he either decided it best not to take it with him after that, or something happened to the dog (shudders at that possibility.)

I'm trying to find out something because it would just be nice to know why I got bit and all.

MyNameIsTerry
03-08-18, 19:13
He's probably had a complaint made against him or is keeping his dog away to prevent a complaint. Or maybe even he had decided his dog needs to stay away due to it's behaviour?

Chasing for information is really just chasing the obsession. You're worrying something is wrong with the dog but there is no evidence of this.