Going through anxiety without medication [Archive]

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star68

03-01-19, 16:16

Happy New year everyone!

I have a doubt. Since I read Clare Weeks book "Self-help with your nerves" I have learn to deal with my anxiety and panic attacks in a "let it come, ride it and back to normal, without taking medication and so far has worked for me. So when I sense a panic attack or anxiety and my heart still pounding fast I let it go up and wait until the panic subsides.
Recently I had a lots of anxiety because I had to do a upper endoscopy and I was very worried, so a couple of days after the test I had heartburn and my heart started beating fast and ended up in A&E with a panic attack, I couldn't wait until the heart calmed down, couldn't managed I was too afraid my heart was beating at 130 bpm. They did an ECG and the doctor said it was a sinus tachycardia and gave me a tranquilizer which I didn't take because once I am checked out and find out that it's anxiety I calm down.
My question is:

Could it be dangerous in the long term for the heart to beat fast during panic attacks. I still want to use the same technique but once you ridge over 100 bpm is the heart working harder than it should? I would appreciate if someone could explained this? Many thanks.

KK77

03-01-19, 18:06

I don't think it's "dangerous" because, as you say, the heart "calms" down after a short while and returns to normal levels. Only a persistently high heart rate would be of concern.

Darksky

03-01-19, 20:41

Unless you have heart disease then all this is, is a good work out for your heart. It won't hurt you. I've had anxiety for 40 years and my heart is fine.

Carnation

03-01-19, 23:20

Strongest muscle in the body. :)

ankietyjoe

04-01-19, 10:14

There is absolutely zero danger here. Your heart is designed to beat much harder than that for much longer. For example, many years ago I used to work in construction and my heart rate would often stay over 100bpm for the entire day at work, simply because of the physical exertion. People who do sport for a living will have a high heart rate for hours on end during training.

The issue with higher heart rates linked with health problems are when the heart rate is high due to another medical issue, which is not the case here. 100bpm (or higher) in itself is NOT high...it's just your perception of it compared with a resting heart rate. Just let that sink in....100bpm is absolutely not a high heart rate and your heart can sit there for months with no damage whatsoever.

For the record, I beat anxiety without ever taking medication, and I absolutely believe it's the only true way to beat it. It's 95% gone and I haven't had a panic attack for well over a year...and my life is supremely stressful. You can do it too :)

biscuitlover

10-01-19, 07:16

sammiej123

10-01-19, 16:43

I know how you feel..My GP has been pushing me to go on Sertraline too... I am just concerned I don't want to feel worse and have no control if I am on medications..

ankietyjoe

10-01-19, 17:47

My anxiety has made a recent severe return.

I saw a psych yesterday. She was pushing sertarline as the only way to move forward

Can anxiety been managed without meds ? How did you do it esp when levels are high? Is it a chemical imbalance that needs correcting ? Feeling very vulnerable to being pushed on the meds.

Your psychiatrist is just wrong. I was told the same thing by the way "you won't beat this without meds".

Take a look at this thread :-

https://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?t=227051

biscuitlover

12-01-19, 09:45

Hey anxiety joe

I’ve been looking at that thread and other ways of dealing with anxiety

Do you think there is such as thing as a serotonin imbalance, I’ve read mixed things? I wonder if it is true, I can never get any better than a sub optimum level?

I’m very interested in your acceptance of anxiety. It is the only way I believe if you have the will power. Even cbt seems to be about challenging rather than accepting what’s here ?

I used to meditate every day but found it hard to apply the principles in anxiety situations . Do you have any tips ?

ankietyjoe

12-01-19, 11:58

Do you think there is such as thing as a serotonin imbalance, I’ve read mixed things? I wonder if it is true, I can never get any better than a sub optimum level?

Absolutely, 100% no. I do not believe this is a thing for 99.99% of the population. At best, hormonal levels (and serotonin is sometimes classed as a hormone) can only be tested as a snapshot. Without looking at historical interactions between body processes, you can't really accurately define what is high or low. Are you anxious because your serotonin is low, or is your serotonin low because you're anxious? By far the most important factor is diet (I believe). This is backed up by lots of research, but ultimately I believe it's a number of factors flying in formation that cause low serotonin. Diet, sleep, time spent relaxed but not asleep, exercise, reduction in stress etc etc. Anti depressant manufacturers would LOVE you to think you have faulty wiring that needs a pill to fix though.

I’m very interested in your acceptance of anxiety. It is the only way I believe if you have the will power. Even cbt seems to be about challenging rather than accepting what’s here ?

CBT for me (although I had it over a decade ago!!) was about 'so what'.

So what if I have a panic attack in the supermarket? :shrug:

Nothing happened last time, and nothing will happen this time either. It's a crappy sensation for 10 minutes, then I'll be in the car on the way home again. Of course in practice it doesn't work out quite like that, but the more you say 'so what' to yourself whilst it's happening and don't avoid the situation, the easier it gets over time.

It's also about distraction. Even simple things like running your finger across your keys in your pocket can move your mind away from focusing on the way you feel.........

I used to meditate every day but found it hard to apply the principles in anxiety situations . Do you have any tips ?

.......which brings me onto the real power of meditation.

Meditation isn't really a tool to use while you're anxious, although if you find it works for you, then it's not going to hurt.

The absolute point of meditation is the practice of re-focusing your mind away from distraction. It does not matter if you don't achieve focus, that's not the point. It does not matter that your mind wanders, because it will, 100% of the time. What matters is that when you do lose focus, you gently re-focus on the subject of your meditation, which is usually your breathing. It's THAT practice that builds resistance to anxiety over time. You're effectively re-training your brain not to react to stimulus.

I also found it useful to read about meditative thought, and mindfulness. The idea that nothing is permanent is very powerful, as it emphasises the idea that a panic attack is temporary. When you keep telling yourself this, when a panic attack occurs it makes it much easier to let it run it's course. I think the trap is that you try to make it stop, and nothing will make it stop...unless you tranquillise yourself. Not a road I ever thought was suitable long term. Anxiety isn't an unnatural state to be in, it's there to keep us safe. It's there to make us fight or flee. The problem begins when WE start to fear the sensations of anxiety, that's when it becomes a disorder. A self feeding wave of hell.

Carnation

12-01-19, 17:47

Some very good points there AJ and I watched your link, all of it! In fact I watched more via you tube and already started to introduce the advice in to my life.
As a medication free person, I am very interested in alternative help and some of it has been very affective.
However, there are times when the stress levels topple over or an illness occurs where you feel like you are back to square one again and I am guilty for not keeping up the rituals that keep me calm and healthy.

pulisa

12-01-19, 17:55

It's not a question of being "guilty" of anything though, Carnation. You're only human after all and all of us have blips and times when we are better able to manage anxiety. We can follow advice to the letter and yet still have bad days. There's no guarantee that every day will be a breeze-life circumstances guarantee that.

Carnation

12-01-19, 18:08

I forgot I was human Pulisa :D

ankietyjoe

13-01-19, 09:42

Yeah Pulisa is right. Don't worry about blips, that's to be expected. In fact I'm in the middle of one right now, post Christmas :yesyes:

Recovery isn't linear, but you need to stand back and look at the bigger overall picture.

pulisa

13-01-19, 13:10

Absolutely, Joe. I hope you get back to how you were feeling before Christmas very soon but don't put pressure on yourself? You'll get there in your own good time. Christmas can put the mockers on the best laid strategies!

ankietyjoe

13-01-19, 13:30

No it's fine, I've seen blips regularly over the last 18 months and you just ride them out. For me it was a combination of poor diet, running out of probiotics, having a work deadline OVER Christmas, my misses being unwell (long term problem) and having two kids at home for two weeks AND finding out my Dad has cancer, along with his brother...and it's probably hereditary. It's bound to be stressful.

The thing is, you just carry on as normal rather than worrying about the blip. Life is life, and sh*t will happen. You just have to roll with it and carry on as normal.

WiredIncorrectly

13-01-19, 14:37

The thing is, you just carry on as normal rather than worrying about the blip. Life is life, and sh*t will happen. You just have to roll with it and carry on as normal.

:yesyes:

biscuitlover

13-01-19, 14:51

This forum is so useful to normalise feelings Like guilt and worry over blips ( I thought mine was the end of the world rather than just a set back)Thank you for the information Joe on the mindfulness. Trying to be more accepting and in the moment.

pulisa

13-01-19, 17:41

You DO just have to carry on as normal. I'm so sorry about your Dad and his brother-you are doing the right thing by having yourself screened for your family's sake as well as your own. Stress is absolutely normal in these circumstances so I hope you have some support for yourself whilst you deal with all this.

Look after yourself, Joe.

ankietyjoe

13-01-19, 18:16

shelly1816

14-01-19, 20:00

Hi,

I'm joining the conversation a bit late but just wanted to say this thread has made me feel loads better! Thank you guys!

I've always been anxious, but 3.5yrs ago I had a major melt down and lived in a constant panic attack for several months. It was the most horrendous time of my life. I have since worked tirelessly to beat it, determined never to take meds. I've faced my challenges, volunteered myself to do things, pushed myself all the way (not jumping out of a plane or anything extreme just living life! - completing courses at work, signing up for Uni, making myself more social, talking the kids into London - on my own!). I was still living with my anxiety everyday but kicking its butt!

However, it had been a extremely stressful year. Major house renovation on the go, I increased my Uni hours to go full time instead of part time and I already have 4 kids and a job! I suppose it was expected but just before xmas, out of nowhere I had a panic attack. It was the run up to xmas so pretty stressful, I work in a school and Dec is carnage. I was pretty pleased with myself that id held it together, pulled of a class nativity and prepared for xmas. Then... day after boxing day I get flu, not just any flu, the mother of all flus... I was officially dying.
My anxiety went through the roof, I stopped sleeping and didn't feel like eating much of anything.

I now feel like I'm crawling through life. I'm a bit down on myself, majorly lacking positivity right now and when I'm feeling low and un-positive I struggle to deal with my anxiety and panic. But reading your threads has reminded me where I was 6 months ago, how far I had come. I know I feel cruddy right now but I've gotten through it before and I'll do it again.

Any tips for bringing back the positivity and good moods greatly appreciated!!!

Sending good luck to you all on your journey. We've got this!:bighug1:

biscuitlover

30-01-19, 06:03

ankietyjoe

30-01-19, 09:53

Hi

Just wondered how everyone was doing ? AnxietyJoe? Shelly ?

I had moved forward since my last post, even went to the theatre last Monday . Then night before last didn’t sleep and got it in my head that I was relapsing and then i worried and it happened.

All day yesterday constant anxiety , can’t eat , took a sedative to sleep. Obsessed about getting worse and crying over where I got to vs here.

I’ve noticed anxiety can make me very selfish (I’m not when I’m not anxious) and feel I am I only one suffering (which I know I am not) strange thing is I can’t remember how I got myself out of this a few weeks back so panicking I’ve forgotten and can’t do it !

This just goes to show that your own thought patterns can really effect the way you feel, and actually having a bad nights sleep can compound negative thinking.

I'm actually going through a bit of a relapse at the moment, but it's fine. Christmas meant I ate badly and then continued that trend into the New Year. I fell off the exercise wagon a bit and for various other reasons stress levels have spiked during the last couple of weeks too. I'm therefore sleeping badly and I can feel adrenaline spikes and the odd sensation of anxiety. But...I'm just letting it ride. I know it'll pass, and yours will too. In essence, just don't think about it, it requires no thought. It's you worrying about that WILL make it worse, and you already have evidence that it can and will go away. Focus on that if you have to focus on something.

Peru83

03-02-19, 15:22

Hi Biscuitlover,

I’ve noticed anxiety can make me very selfish (I’m not when I’m not anxious) and feel I am I only one suffering (which I know I am not) strange thing is I can’t remember how I got myself out of this a few weeks back so panicking I’ve forgotten and can’t do it !

Firstly, you're not selfish. I promise you're not. You are just someone who is going through some sh*t, and who needs to focus on themselves for a bit. That is definitely not selfish, it's just the way it is for us. Please don't convince yourself you're selfish, as this will only lead to you being overly self-focused and self loathing. Remind yourself how utterly badass you are, as you have gotten up today, despite the panic, despite the perpetual worrying, and you're doing everything you can to try and feel better within yourself, but still lead a 'normal' life. All these 'normal' people out there, the non-worrying folk, don't realise how easy they have it :winks:

Unfortunately, there is no way to eradicate the anxious feeling entirely, because we need it to keep us safe. Our issue is we have an anxiety disorder, so a lot of the time our anxiety is very much disproportionate to the situation in hand. Plus, I'm sure everyone who suffers from anxiety of any kind can agree, we are all very much acutely self-aware, and we're over thinkers. Terrible combination lol

The best way to manage our anxiety for the long term, is to find coping mechanisms and better ways of thinking. Medication is a good crutch, but not a long term fix, and that is just my honest and humble opinion.

I have been through counselling and therapy over the years. Some of it helpful, some of it not so much. I guess we take from these things what suits us best, and each one of us is different. So what works to help me, may not work for you.

You're sounding pretty well grounded to me, and I'd say (as much as you may feel like it's not the case all of the time) that you're doing really well! Especially given that you were able to gear yourself up to head out to the theatre and try to distract yourself! That's fab :) Take the victories where you can, however small. It's too easy to be fixated on what we can't do, what we perceive we're not doing right, the blips etc, and we never take the time to celebrate the stuff we do each day that scares us, or we find hard!

I hope you're starting to feel a bit better :)