View Full Version : Scotland goes back into lockdown 7pm Friday
It's such a mess, isn't it? I honestly can't see how children/students would be "deprived" if they had to switch to online learning for a while. In the great scheme of things their lives are not going to be "ruined", it's not disastrous it's just a sensible response to a national emergency situation.
LOL scale this right down Pulisa and you have my domestic situation in a nutshell.
So are your schools still going to open or have they decided to go to online learning?
We’ll find out on Monday for our primary school (is it junior for you? Age 4-11) how they are going to manage it. But the children will likely do some form of distance learning. I don’t know how they manage it when there’s more than one child at school though.
We did zoom classes previously when my daughters bubble was self isolating.
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No, that's primary for us: 4-10. Secondary is 11+
I've learned from 16 years of teaching and doing it both ways is that generally, the vast majority of kids learn better in person. They're either too young/not mature enough to have the self-discipline to sit and pay attention to something without someone there guiding them or pressuring them to do or they may have a learning disability that responds much better to in-person. There are some kids who are very mature, independent learners that thrive with online or other kids who really enjoy not having the pressures of the school environment and really do well online, but those are much fewer. However, if kids die or get really sick or someone in their families die, they're going to be learning a lot less... so I'll take the online learning.
I am shocked by the comments online where people want tougher rules like ban on going outdoors and exercise I mean that’s no good for physical health is it? Why are people so scared when we have seen since March it’s a mild illness for most? I mean they want to shut everything in Scotland for 2,000 cases a day it’s England which has high cases. For example France had 60k cases a day and done a curfew and it went down.
You're scared of getting Covid though. Do you want Scotland to open up again and for everyone to stop physical distancing and wearing masks?
You would have to stay put in Scotland if so because other countries won't be ready for you just yet.
What rules would you like which would suit you best?
I am shocked by the comments online where people want tougher rules like ban on going outdoors and exercise I mean that’s no good for physical health is it? Why are people so scared when we have seen since March it’s a mild illness for most? I mean they want to shut everything in Scotland for 2,000 cases a day it’s England which has high cases. For example France had 60k cases a day and done a curfew and it went down.
Good god Phil. One minute you're saying you're terrified of getting Covid yourself, then the next you're saying it's only a mild illness for most.
And I can't for the life of me believe that such hard-line restrictions against going outdoors and exercising are likely nor even a remotely feasible option, especially as we already don't have enough officers to police the existing restrictions as it is, so therefore impracticable.
In fact, talking of France, our authorities and border control personnel even failed to stop certain Brits from sneaking over there to partake in illegal raves there on NYE. Covidiots at their most cunning, conniving and desperate IMO!
I shall have no sympathy whatsoever if any of them go on to test positive, as they all basically asked for it!
Call me heartless and shoot me down in flames all you like over my previous two paragraphs but sorry, that just smacks of blatant self-infliction, as everyone has been forewarned of the potential consequences if they fail to stick by the official Covid guidelines!
So what rules do YOU want, Phil? Just write them down so we all know and then you don't need to ask any more questions on here as we will know your agenda.
So what rules do YOU want, Phil? Just write them down so we all know and then you don't need to ask any more questions on here as we will know your agenda.
LOL Be careful Phil...you're gonna have to fight me for World Domination ;)
No, that's primary for us: 4-10. Secondary is 11+
I've learned from 16 years of teaching and doing it both ways is that generally, the vast majority of kids learn better in person. They're either too young/not mature enough to have the self-discipline to sit and pay attention to something without someone there guiding them or pressuring them to do or they may have a learning disability that responds much better to in-person. There are some kids who are very mature, independent learners that thrive with online or other kids who really enjoy not having the pressures of the school environment and really do well online, but those are much fewer. However, if kids die or get really sick or someone in their families die, they're going to be learning a lot less... so I'll take the online learning.
When my daughters bubble was isolating they had 4 zoom calls a day and the teacher talked through the work and then left them to it until the next call. Even though I had to do the work with her (her class is age 6-7), I found the structure good. They saw their teacher and friends still and we’re not just completely left to it.
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I am shocked by the comments online where people want tougher rules like ban on going outdoors and exercise I mean that’s no good for physical health is it? Why are people so scared when we have seen since March it’s a mild illness for most? I mean they want to shut everything in Scotland for 2,000 cases a day it’s England which has high cases. For example France had 60k cases a day and done a curfew and it went down.
Because nhs can’t cope with high numbers of sick people.
Because no-one knows who it will be mild for or dangerous for.
Because if lots of key workers get it then services can’t happen.
Because 2000 cases a day this week might mean 4000 cases a day next week.
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When my daughters bubble was isolating they had 4 zoom calls a day and the teacher talked through the work and then left them to it until the next call. Even though I had to do the work with her (her class is age 6-7), I found the structure good. They saw their teacher and friends still and we’re not just completely left to it.
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Yes, since I have older kids, what I do is I pre-record all of my teaching that accompanies each assignment, so they can watch the video as they do the work, and then that frees me up to do individual or small-group tutoring or just answer questions. I'll be honest, I usually get more questions regarding tech help than I do about history or English.
I heard the lockdown could get tougher it’s very hard on mental health. I go to work go home go to work go home. Seems little end to it and sadly Jan/Feb look dark months ahead. They won’t commit to 2 million vaccines a week so it could drag on and on. I want to try and be positive but it seems there is none right now. I read a headline the Oxford vaccine won’t work with the South Africa variant I mean what then do they have to restart the vaccines scratch and revaccinate?
Pamplemousse
03-01-21, 22:49
Have I developed tinnitus or can I hear a whining sound?
I heard the lockdown could get tougher it’s very hard on mental health. I go to work go home go to work go home. Seems little end to it and sadly Jan/Feb look dark months ahead. They won’t commit to 2 million vaccines a week so it could drag on and on. I want to try and be positive but it seems there is none right now. I read a headline the Oxford vaccine won’t work with the South Africa variant I mean what then do they have to restart the vaccines scratch and revaccinate?
We're all taking it day by day. that's reality. No sense in speculating and making yourself sick over it. Just listen to the experts. Wear a mask, social distance and use proper hygiene.
FMP
Good god Phil. One minute you're saying you're terrified of getting Covid yourself, then the next you're saying it's only a mild illness for most.
And I can't for the life of me believe that such hard-line restrictions against going outdoors and exercising are likely nor even a remotely feasible option, especially as we already don't have enough officers to police the existing restrictions as it is, so therefore impracticable.
In fact, talking of France, our authorities and border control personnel even failed to stop certain Brits from sneaking over there to partake in illegal raves there on NYE. Covidiots at their most cunning, conniving and desperate IMO!
I shall have no sympathy whatsoever if any of them go on to test positive, as they all basically asked for it!
Call me heartless and shoot me down in flames all you like over my previous two paragraphs but sorry, that just smacks of blatant self-infliction, as everyone has been forewarned of the potential consequences if they fail to stick by the official Covid guidelines!
This is very true we don’t have the resources. Maybe a Tier 5 for England will happen. I mean we went from stuff open to stuff closed and numbers went down I fail to see how Tier 4 (lockdown essentially) can drop numbers by going into lockdown which is same as Tier 4 other than schools not being closed.
So what rules do YOU want, Phil? Just write them down so we all know and then you don't need to ask any more questions on here as we will know your agenda.
Well masks don’t work numbers are high but we won’t start a mask debate. You can close clothes shops and buy clothes in Tesco what’s the difference? Plus transmission in pubs was always quite low. Clearly they will want to increase vaccination faster rather than these never ending rules
They are closing schools for a month seemingly but what I don’t get is schools have been closed what maybe 2 weeks due to Xmas and numbers are rising anyway. I mean I think we are seeing the Xmas rise?
Phil, masks work. Do some reading: https://health.clevelandclinic.org/new-study-highlights-new-evidence-that-masks-prevent-coronavirus-spread/
What doesn't work is people getting together in close quarters, which is what people have done over the holidays, especially when they take their masks off indoors to eat or drink. They have also traveled. Plus add in a new variant which spreads easier, and yes, you see the rise. Schools should close. I work in one. They are cesspools of germs.
Vee, I couldn't agree more. I work behind perspex screens and the first thing every student does is lean around the side of them. Ours are mostly 16-18, but they're still kids and you can't stop them thinking they're immortal (not a complaint).
Phil, I get that you're scared. However, the bald truth is that preventing millions of deaths matters way more than mental health issues caused by phobias or simply missing the old normal. Life goes on, and for now we simply have to go with the flow.
Vee, I couldn't agree more. I work behind perspex screens and the first thing every student does is lean around the side of them. Ours are mostly 16-18, but they're still kids and you can't stop them thinking they're immortal (not a complaint).
Phil, I get that you're scared. However, the bald truth is that preventing millions of deaths matters way more than mental health issues caused by phobias or simply missing the old normal. Life goes on, and for now we simply have to go with the flow.
Yeah, I don’t even know how you do it, Iris. I have enough trouble trying to help and check in with every student in a 50 minute period, I can’t even imagine how much time you lose cleaning off a pencil for everyone who needs to borrow one or keeping kids separated who want to get too close. Have you had to become a social distancing enforcer as well as the 100 other hats we wear as teachers?
Of course. Don't get me wrong, I love the students but if you try to explain that you're trying to keep yourself safe, it's not unknown for the response to be "f off and die, you're old".
Yeah, I can imagine the students being respectful in their distance to me....but with each other? No way.
The latest development is that when we go back next week, we're going to be trained to administer lateral flow Covid tests :/ It's insane.
Of course. Don't get me wrong, I love the students but if you try to explain that you're trying to keep yourself safe, it's not unknown for the response to be "f off and die, you're old".
And these "students" want to learn? I would have thought that they would be delighted to have an excuse to bunk off and good riddance. That's disgraceful behaviour but I suspect that you're not allowed to challenge the little darlings on their choice of language? Respect is so 19th century after all..
We can challenge them, yes, and we have a security team we can and do call. Unfortunately, their home life is often such that wherever possible they'd rather be at school than at home. It's tough sometimes, but I try not to succumb to anger because we have no idea what goes on behind closed doors.
...The exception to this is people who come in wanting intensive tech support five minutes before closing on a Friday afternoon; insult me all you like but DON'T remove my opportunity to sail out the door on the dot of 4.27pm ;)
When will we stop making excuses for students' boorish and unacceptable behaviour though? Does it do them any favours to take it on the chin?
Sorry..I know I sound "old" (and I am) but I just can't bear hearing about things like this and then we bang on about their poor mental health..
No, no need to apologise. Management are usually fairly good about disciplining the students, and in the normal run of things the worst we get from the kids is being ignored - frustrating, but if we need to escalate, security has our backs.
At the same time, I get incredibly frustrated about ongoing governments who cut FE services to the bone and would rather pretend they don't exist at all.
but if you try to explain that you're trying to keep yourself safe, it's not unknown for the response to be "f off and die, you're old".
Heart-warming isn't it Blue? Gets you right here. *taps chest* :whistles:
Wonderful, yep. Honestly, though, my supply of f***s finally gave out a few months before Covid, when one of the students brought in and discharged a can of pepper spray. I was caught in the crossfire and half the managers present wanted me to continue working in the fug for another three hours. Fortunately half of them didn't and sent my coughing-til-I-puke ass home, but that half's moved on to greener pastures now.
I heard the lockdown could get tougher it’s very hard on mental health. I go to work go home go to work go home. Seems little end to it and sadly Jan/Feb look dark months ahead. They won’t commit to 2 million vaccines a week so it could drag on and on. I want to try and be positive but it seems there is none right now. I read a headline the Oxford vaccine won’t work with the South Africa variant I mean what then do they have to restart the vaccines scratch and revaccinate?
Where did you read the headline about the OAZ vaccine being ineffective against the South Africa variant, Phil?
Where did you read the headline about the OAZ vaccine being ineffective against the South Africa variant, Phil?
I read it here https://metro.co.uk/2021/01/04/covid-vaccines-may-be-ineffective-against-south-african-mutation-13841998/amp/
I read it here https://metro.co.uk/2021/01/04/covid-vaccines-may-be-ineffective-against-south-african-mutation-13841998/amp/
Well that's just one publication and no mention of it on the BBC so far.
And it's still only just a suggestion rather than true fact at this stage, but said article however, wasn't all doom and gloom.
Seems Scotland will go back into lockdown today. Until spring..I mean level 4 is lockdown already so who knows what she will shut next other than schools.
Regarding any vaccine not working against a particular strain, that’s exactly what happens with flu. That’s why the vaccines are changed every year in order to combat the most dominant strains.
So no, it wouldn’t mean starting vaccine development from scratch, it would simply mean the vaccines would need some adjustments in order to accommodate the strain.
Expect more of this as time goes on. This is what viruses do, this is also why people need to start trusting science and medicine and stop reiterating bulls*it that they’ve stumbled upon on social media or from the gutter press.
Regarding any vaccine not working against a particular strain, that’s exactly what happens with flu. That’s why the vaccines are changed every year in order to combat the most dominant strains.
So no, it wouldn’t mean starting vaccine development from scratch, it would simply mean the vaccines would need some adjustments in order to accommodate the strain.
Expect more of this as time goes on. This is what viruses do, this is also why people need to start trusting science and medicine and stop reiterating bulls*it that they’ve stumbled upon on social media or from the gutter press.
Exactly. That article in the Metro that Phil posted the link to does however state that it's possible to 'tweak' the vaccines in due course to be more effective against the SA variant and others, if necessary.
BTW, the BBC News channel ARE now mentioning it.
It’s simply a case of the new strain being a bit of an unknown quantity. They can’t say any vaccine will work on it as they probably still haven’t completely broken it down.
Again, there will be variants of this virus that are better at evading vaccination. That’s just biology for you. However, it would take no longer than around two months to tweak any vaccine to become effective.
Coronaviruses are coronaviruses. They invade cells by using a spike protein to latch on to other cells. If they do not have this spike protein then they are not coronaviruses. The Pfizer, Moderna and Oxford/AstraZeneca vaccine all target this spike protein. Any other mutation within the virus will involve proteins that don’t really alter the viruses main route into a cell. For that reason, most vaccines will be effective against ALL strains of coronavirus, it’s just a question of how effective.
Again, these are things witnessed every day in life by microbiologists, it’s just that right now they are dealing with a virus that is transmitting across the globe and any mutation or variant of it is headline news.
It’s simply a case of the new strain being a bit of an unknown quantity. They can’t say any vaccine will work on it as they probably still haven’t completely broken it down.
Again, there will be variants of this virus that are better at evading vaccination. That’s just biology for you. However, it would take no longer than around two months to tweak any vaccine to become effective.
Coronaviruses are coronaviruses. They invade cells by using a spike protein to latch on to other cells. If they do not have this spike protein then they are not coronaviruses. The Pfizer, Moderna and Oxford/AstraZeneca vaccine all target this spike protein. Any other mutation within the virus will involve proteins that don’t really alter the viruses main route into a cell. For that reason, most vaccines will be effective against ALL strains of coronavirus, it’s just a question of how effective.
Again, these are things witnessed every day in life by microbiologists, it’s just that right now they are dealing with a virus that is transmitting across the globe and any mutation or variant of it is headline news.
Plus the media being the way they are will no doubt blow it all way out of proportion and of course the antivaxxers/serial doom-mongers will proclaim 'I told you so' with glee!
I couldn't believe Boris's words last night, he said 'Things will get worse before they get better'.
Well for crying out loud Boris, just go the whole hog and impose a full-on third national lockdown for once and for all and stop faffing about playing for time as usual. Also keep all schools shut until further notice.
But as per usual, it's all talk and little to no action from him.
And if he loses in the opinion polls, tough!
He and his fellow cronies need to own their mammoth screw-ups, and like I've already said a gazillion times before, Labour have been shunned and booted out of power for far lesser things.
Professor Sarah Gilbert appears to be taking it in her stride with the Oxford vaccine and anticipates another mutation with a possible spike in the Autumn of 2021 again..which they will deal with successfully.
I think all these virologists and scientists coming out of the woodwork for media interviews and their 5 minutes of fame just adds to the panic and uncertainty. Let those who are actually involved in the formulation of the vaccine have the stage.
Professor Sarah Gilbert appears to be taking it in her stride with the Oxford vaccine and anticipates another mutation with a possible spike in the Autumn of 2021 again..which they will deal with successfully.
I think all these virologists and scientists coming out of the woodwork for media interviews and their 5 minutes of fame just adds to the panic and uncertainty. Let those who are actually involved in the formulation of the vaccine have the stage.
That does sound like some may be overdoing it and trying to jump on the bandwagon. How about 'one step at a time'?
But on the other hand, it's probably a good idea to be prepared for all eventualities.
Pamplemousse
04-01-21, 14:23
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-55531069
People in Scotland are to be ordered to stay at home until the end of January amid a fresh Covid-19 lockdown.
First Minister Nicola Sturgeon said new curbs would be introduced at midnight in a bid to contain the new, faster-spreading strain of the virus.
Pamplemousse
04-01-21, 14:28
I couldn't believe Boris's words last night, he said 'Things will get worse before they get better'.
Well for crying out loud Boris, just go the whole hog and impose a full-on third national lockdown for once and for all and stop faffing about playing for time as usual. Also keep all schools shut until further notice.
But as per usual, it's all talk and little to no action from him.
And if he loses in the opinion polls, tough!
He and his fellow cronies need to own their mammoth screw-ups, and like I've already said a gazillion times before, Labour have been shunned and booted out of power for far lesser things.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Eq14RgAXYAQmS2l?format=jpg&name=medium
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Eq14RgAXYAQmS2l?format=jpg&name=medium
How Boris and Co still managed to remain ahead in the opinion polls for the most part of last year (2020) is beyond me.
Labour most certainly would have been toast by now had this pandemic happened under them!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6qD1EO1T9c
These guys led by Vincent Racaniello. The younger woman (Breanne Barker) is an immunologist and states the vaccines are designed to attack all parts of the covid spike protein, not just the few that have changed. She's not worried. The discussions are very long and 'geeky' but fascinating.
The mainstream media should be held to account for sensationalist headlines. Just how many vulnerable people (like us) could be prompted towards doing something silly? This is bad enough already.
It’s simply a case of the new strain being a bit of an unknown quantity. They can’t say any vaccine will work on it as they probably still haven’t completely broken it down.
Again, there will be variants of this virus that are better at evading vaccination. That’s just biology for you. However, it would take no longer than around two months to tweak any vaccine to become effective.
Coronaviruses are coronaviruses. They invade cells by using a spike protein to latch on to other cells. If they do not have this spike protein then they are not coronaviruses. The Pfizer, Moderna and Oxford/AstraZeneca vaccine all target this spike protein. Any other mutation within the virus will involve proteins that don’t really alter the viruses main route into a cell. For that reason, most vaccines will be effective against ALL strains of coronavirus, it’s just a question of how effective.
Again, these are things witnessed every day in life by microbiologists, it’s just that right now they are dealing with a virus that is transmitting across the globe and any mutation or variant of it is headline news.Brilliant summary Gary, thank you.
Sorry you're suffering. It's a scary day, isn't it?
Pamplemousse
04-01-21, 16:23
Not doing well today.
Sorry to hear that...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6qD1EO1T9c
These guys led by Vincent Racaniello. The younger woman (Breanne Barker) is an immunologist and states the vaccines are designed to attack all parts of the covid spike protein, not just the few that have changed. She's not worried. The discussions are very long and 'geeky' but fascinating.
The mainstream media should be held to account for sensationalist headlines. Just how many vulnerable people (like us) could be prompted towards doing something silly? This is bad enough already.
You have to stop all this researching, Fishman? I understand why you think it might help but it doesn't help your anxiety. Far from it.
Keep things simple and concentrate on the facts from people who are actually involved in the manufacture of the vaccine rather than those "experts" wanting to jump on the bandwagon with their "views"..Limit your exposure to all things Covid-related and stick to the basic facts and all you really need to know as a carer with an anxiety disorder?
Sorry guys I was in midst panic when I posted that. Just finished my youtube workout so feeling a bit better. I think what triggered this is this 'feeling' exactly like last January, like we haven't moved on. And seeing the headlines about vaccines not working etc, it got me thinking why don't I just get covid and be done.
But then there are people much worse off than myself.
You have to stop all this researching, Fishman? I understand why you think it might help but it doesn't help your anxiety. Far from it.
Keep things simple and concentrate on the facts from people who are actually involved in the manufacture of the vaccine rather than those "experts" wanting to jump on the bandwagon with their "views"..Limit your exposure to all things Covid-related and stick to the basic facts and all you really need to know as a carer with an anxiety disorder?
It still isn't absolutely proven that the SA strain of Covid is invincible to the vaccines, it's still very much 'might be' and pure speculation ATM. And of course, like I said upthread, the gutter press and many sad cases on social media etc will run with it.
But at least the BBC so far have acted responsibly and kept it relatively low-key.
It's quite sad that a large proportion of the French appear to have pooh-poohed the vaccines so far, and Macron is rightly concerned.
MyNameIsTerry
04-01-21, 22:13
...The exception to this is people who come in wanting intensive tech support five minutes before closing on a Friday afternoon; insult me all you like but DON'T remove my opportunity to sail out the door on the dot of 4.27pm ;)
B@stards! :biggrin:
MyNameIsTerry
04-01-21, 22:20
How Boris and Co still managed to remain ahead in the opinion polls for the most part of last year (2020) is beyond me.
Labour most certainly would have been toast by now had this pandemic happened under them!
It probably boils down to so many losing faith in Labour and the nuttier ones that keep popping up who are we known to annoy traditional Labour voters outside the metropolitan bubble.
Starmer has a massive uphill task. Some looks good, some bad. It's for the Tories to lose even now.
It probably boils down to so many losing faith in Labour and the nuttier ones that keep popping up who are we known to annoy traditional Labour voters outside the metropolitan bubble.
Starmer has a massive uphill task. Some looks good, some bad. It's for the Tories to lose even now.
From what I read Labour would win the north again and Boris would lose his seat that’s what was on the news yesterday.
Anyway seems Scotland is in lockdown again as is England. Until Easter I mean who believes this will end on next review? They can’t be trusted with vaccine roll out. Long year ahead and another wasted year like 2020 sadly.
I believe England is 15th Feb I think the only good news is Sturgeon said end of Jan for Scotland! For now anyway..
MyNameIsTerry
04-01-21, 23:05
From what I read Labour would win the north again and Boris would lose his seat that’s what was on the news yesterday.
Anyway seems Scotland is in lockdown again as is England. Until Easter I mean who believes this will end on next review? They can’t be trusted with vaccine roll out. Long year ahead and another wasted year like 2020 sadly.
Depends which media you read. Like all those polls that got in wrong for over 4 years.
Labour lost over Brexit. Getting that out of the way will allow Starmer to work on it but he was part of the problem with Labour and I doubt people will forget that. He has a chance but I think he's a long way off at the moment but Boris may drive people back there. His Brexit deal, and for some months all the broken deadlines from both sides, look more likely to drive votes to Farage. Labour has long been losing its support as it turned into a metropolitan party.
Cases at a record high today but scotland’s numbers about 2,000 and down on other day this is good news?
Cases at a record high today but scotland’s numbers about 2,000 and down on other day this is good news?
Far too early for either lockdowns or vaccination programmes to be having any effect. Expect the numbers to dance around the 2000-2500 per day mark for the next few weeks.
Another lockdown is coming it seems
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/circuit-break-lockdown-scotland-being-24839693
Another lockdown is coming it seems
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/circuit-break-lockdown-scotland-being-24839693
I clicked on your link and it seems like Sturgeon is basically implying a lockdown is still only being considered as an absolute last resort measure, so still nothing set in stone as yet.
However, the article does go on to mention that overall hospitalisations and deaths still remain significantly lower than during the height of the second wave at the beginning of this year.
Phil, to put your mind at rest (at least for the time being), I have just read on the BBC website that despite Scottish cases being at an all-time high, Sturgeon is currently ruling out any 'firebreak' lockdowns within the nation and even admits to feeling reluctant to re-imposing minor restrictions there.
As far as England is concerned, there's still no talk of any restrictions being re-imposed at present, and our R-rate this week is 1.0-1.1 vs 0.9-1-2 last week.
It's also believed that many of the cases over the past week or two have been linked to major festivals and other public events, but of course only time will tell with regards to the hospitalisations and deaths.
Phil, to put your mind at rest (at least for the time being), I have just read on the BBC website that despite Scottish cases being at an all-time high, Sturgeon is currently ruling out any 'firebreak' lockdowns within the nation and even admits to feeling reluctant to re-imposing minor restrictions there.
As far as England is concerned, there's still no talk of any restrictions being re-imposed at present, and our R-rate this week is 1.0-1.1 vs 0.9-1-2 last week.
It's also believed that many of the cases over the past week or two have been linked to major festivals and other public events, but of course only time will tell with regards to the hospitalisations and deaths.
True and I know 1/3 of new cases are actually under 19. Half are under 24 I am sure so the community spread is lower. Some may even be hospitals schools ect. My wife’s gran possibly got it on bus as someone sat next to her a few times. For me it terrifies me having to ever sit next to anybody at a concert or train again unless we get this under control case wise but I am sure one day it will be under control. I think it’s best to avoid crowded places at the moment that’s what I tend to do. I admit for me when cases are lower I feel a little more relaxed when cases are so high i mega social distance. Usually when we see a peak it falls very quickly?
“Denmark will end all coronavirus restrictions by 10 September, according to health officials, who say the virus no longer poses a "threat to society" thanks to the fact more than 70% of the population is fully vaccinated, AFP reports.
In a statement, Health Minister Magnus Heunicke said
(https://twitter.com/Heunicke/status/1431180032274280448): "The epidemic is under control, we have record vaccination levels. That is why, on 10 September, we can lift the special rules we had to introduce in the fight against Covid-19." However, he insists "the epidemic is not over" and says the government "will not hesitate to act quickly if the pandemic once again threatens the essential functioning of society".”
and they are ending COVID passes can we not all move to Denmark seems to have moved to epidemic rather than pandemic and no longer a threat?
Let's see whether record vaccination levels are enough to bring case numbers under control. Give it time and then reassess whether Denmark has made a good call?
Pamplemousse
27-08-21, 19:39
and they are ending COVID passes can we not all move to Denmark seems to have moved to epidemic rather than pandemic and no longer a threat?
Whilst this disease is prevalent all over the world it's a pandemic, Phil.
The bottom line is common sense (which seems to be lacking greatly in the world today). We have a vaccine. Take it. We have common sense protocols. Follow them. By looking after yourself, you're also looking after others. Simple eh? :shades:
FMP
Michael Gove doing his bit for Covid on an Aberdeen dancefloor...https://www.thenational.scot/news/19545385.michael-gove-shocks-scots-turning-aberdeen-nightclub/
MyNameIsTerry
30-08-21, 06:56
Michael Gove doing his bit for Covid on an Aberdeen dancefloor...https://www.thenational.scot/news/19545385.michael-gove-shocks-scots-turning-aberdeen-nightclub/
That's not the most shocking thing either. Scots bought a Tory drinks all night :roflmao:
So why are rates so high in Scotland but not rest of UK? England was down on last week can’t just be schools?
Football...I can imagine that Glasgow will see a spike after yesterday.
Tourists from England.
Human behaviour.
Covid apathy.
Rates are high because they are at the moment. They could go down next week, stay the same or go up. No one knows.
meltedchic
30-08-21, 13:22
Let's see whether record vaccination levels are enough to bring case numbers under control. Give it time and then reassess whether Denmark has made a good call?
Until when are we going to wait? Another year again?
Pamplemousse
30-08-21, 13:52
Until when are we going to wait? Another year again?
As long as it takes.
You see, this disease doesn't care if you're bored with it and want to get back to "normal" because as far as it's concerned, you're just helping it spread better by ignoring restrictions.
Good news cases over 3,000 but under 4,000 which is a lot less than yesterday maybe it’s peaked?
Pamplemousse
30-08-21, 14:19
Good news cases over 3,000 but under 4,000 which is a lot less than yesterday maybe it’s peaked?
It's after a Sunday, Phil - don't get your hopes up. Just wait until the kids go back to school here in England and watch the figures rise.
It's after a Sunday, Phil - don't get your hopes up. Just wait until the kids go back to school here in England and watch the figures rise.
Perhaps PM but I thought it was more deaths that are affected by typical weekend lags rather than cases.
As far as Scotland is concerned right now, yesterday's record case increase to 7k (unusual for a Sunday, even UK-wide, and also despite England's cases still being slightly down on Saturday's) and back down again to around 4k today (as mentioned by Phil) seems rather random to me.
Another possible factor might be that Scotland could be testing more people now on a daily basis than at any time throughout the entire pandemic, which will inevitably bump up the numbers.
It will be most interesting in due course to see how many double-jabbed who have recently caught Covid (lite), fully recovered and successfully developed antibodies/herd immunity or also already having been infected prior to being jabbed at all and still developing said antibodies/herd immunity.
Obviously only time will tell but if it does largely pan out that way it will be most encouraging.
Where do think they are testing? As far as I know every care home festival and school tests. We have these asymptomatic testing centres opening up in former shops too! We have a festival in my hometown this week coming and testing is optional :)
Where do think they are testing? As far as I know every care home festival and school tests. We have these asymptomatic testing centres opening up in former shops too! We have a festival in my hometown this week coming and testing is optional :)
I was only surmising/guessing the possibility of increased testing in Scotland, nothing absolutely gospel Phil.
Probably also a lot to do with schools recently returning after the summer break. Often more testing = more cases found.
So these discrimination passes have come in Scotland I wonder what the exemptions are? In England you can self exempt not sure what they will do for the backlog of people like my wife who had a reaction to one jab or for someone’s mental health like me for if I had a vaccine I could risk a mental health breakdown? I would legally fight this in court rather than have this jab it has to be about choice people can die of the vaccine so how can they force it? Already I fear today having a breakdown as I feel so worked up?
So these discrimination passes have come in Scotland I wonder what the exemptions are? In England you can self exempt not sure what they will do for the backlog of people like my wife who had a reaction to one jab or for someone’s mental health like me for if I had a vaccine I could risk a mental health breakdown? I would legally fight this in court rather than have this jab it has to be about choice people can die of the vaccine so how can they force it? Already I fear today having a breakdown as I feel so worked up?
Well all I can suggest on this particular matter Phil is that you write to your local MSP if you have so much beef over said measures.
https://ibb.co/BzxdYvh
Please see photo above that’s in England you can self declare exmwtipn same way as face masks will this be Scotland too?
ExemptionsThere will also be a small number of exemptions for individuals who have a medical reason which means they cannot vaccinate or test. These individuals will need to self-declare their medical exemption directly with you.
A digital solution is being developed which will enable individuals with a medical exemption to show their COVID-19 status using the NHS COVID Pass. In the interim, please follow the advice below.
Please be mindful and respectful where there are potentially circumstances where a customer or individual cannot safely demonstrate their COVID-19 status by taking a vaccination or a test. This could include people:
with learning disabilities or autistic individuals, or with a combination of impairments which result in the same distress
those suffering from or under medical supervision for acute or evolving serious diseases or those receiving palliative care or undergoing treatment with unpleasant side effects
Event or venue organisers in England that choose to use the NHS COVID Pass as a condition of entry can decide whether to accept self-declared medical exemptions where an individual cannot vaccinate or test, ensuring they comply with the Equalities Act 2010 (https://www.gov.uk/guidance/equality-act-2010-guidance).
Your customers may declare a medical exemption directly with you. You and your staff should not ask for evidence of the exemption.
If businesses decide to require evidence of Covid-19 status as a condition of entry, they should ensure that they comply with all the relevant legal obligations (for example, the Equalities Act 2010) and guidance that applies.
https://www.nhsx.nhs.uk/covid-19-response/using-the-nhs-covid-pass/
So these discrimination passes have come in Scotland I wonder what the exemptions are? In England you can self exempt not sure what they will do for the backlog of people like my wife who had a reaction to one jab or for someone’s mental health like me for if I had a vaccine I could risk a mental health breakdown? I would legally fight this in court rather than have this jab it has to be about choice people can die of the vaccine so how can they force it? Already I fear today having a breakdown as I feel so worked up?
You have to be over the age of 18 and legally have to show documentation to attend places like nightclubs. I guess that’s discrimination as well now? Or what about smokers who need to stand outside to smoke? Or people wanting to drive without a seatbelt? Or people who want to drive whilst drunk? Is it all discrimination, or is it done to protect people who apparently don’t know what’s best for themselves and others.
This isn’t discrimination, it’s a major public health issue. You’ve been told for months now that not having a vaccine could potentially affect your freedoms, now you’re maybe getting the idea.
You have to be over the age of 18 and legally have to show documentation to attend places like nightclubs. I guess that’s discrimination as well now? Or what about smokers who need to stand outside to smoke? Or people wanting to drive without a seatbelt? Or people who want to drive whilst drunk? Is it all discrimination, or is it done to protect people who apparently don’t know what’s best for themselves and others.
This isn’t discrimination, it’s a major public health issue. You’ve been told for months now that not having a vaccine could potentially affect your freedoms, now you’re maybe getting the idea.
Spot on Gary!
Perhaps those currently moaning and getting indignant about all the legislation you mentioned above which are only in the best of interests of everyone should visit somewhere like Afghanistan right now and basically see for themselves what amounts to 'real' discrimination and dictatorship.
Most of us here in the UK, whilst we most certainly do have our problems and injustices, have it relatively easy by comparison.
BTW, how are you Gary? I haven't seen as many posts from you on here over the past few weeks.
Hope you've been keeping OK?
You have to be over the age of 18 and legally have to show documentation to attend places like nightclubs. I guess that’s discrimination as well now? Or what about smokers who need to stand outside to smoke? Or people wanting to drive without a seatbelt? Or people who want to drive whilst drunk? Is it all discrimination, or is it done to protect people who apparently don’t know what’s best for themselves and others.
This isn’t discrimination, it’s a major public health issue. You’ve been told for months now that not having a vaccine could potentially affect your freedoms, now you’re maybe getting the idea.
Its called there’s exemptions which you have no control over also having a vaccine = still spread it. Enjoy your fully vaccinated night club can still spread that’s a known fact.
Its called there’s exemptions which you have no control over also having a vaccine = still spread it. Enjoy your fully vaccinated night club can still spread that’s a known fact.
Phil, it's also a known fact that totally unvaccinated nightclubs (and likewise venues) can be far, far more problematic and potential hotbeds for Covid 'super-spreading'.
Thus the fully vaccinated venues are a total no-brainer by comparison.
Phil, it's also a known fact that totally unvaccinated nightclubs (and likewise venues) can be far, far more problematic and potential hotbeds for Covid 'super-spreading'.
Thus the fully vaccinated venues are a total no-brainer by comparison.
Fully vaccinated gigs have also seen thousands of positive cases google it.
Its called there’s exemptions which you have no control over also having a vaccine = still spread it. Enjoy your fully vaccinated night club can still spread that’s a known fact.
Well then find an exemption. I don’t know what this latest bout of “OMG WHAT ABOUT MEEEE” is trying to prove to be honest.
Once again, if you don’t want to take a vaccine, don’t. If you make the choice not to, learn to accept that you may end up being more restricted than those who do.
I had both doses and by doing so I accepted there was a small risk of adverse effects. I took responsibility for my own decision and it’s potential consequences. I didn’t take the decision then expect the world to rearrange itself in accordance with what was most convenient for me.
Fully vaccinated gigs have also seen thousands of positive cases google it.
Phil, I'm very wary of googling stuff willy-nilly, especially where some of such websites don't always tell the truth and are often in pursuit of some kind of agenda/ justification for not getting jabbed.
AFAIK, reputable sites like the BBC haven't so far said anything specifically about fully vaccinated gigs being Covid 'super-spreading' events.
I genuinely don’t understand someone who is apparently “terrified” of Covid but would happily stand in a crowded environment such as a gig without being vaccinated. You’ll even go to court for the right to do it.
At a certain point you’re coming across as preferring the problem to any type of solution. You’re far from alone with that on this forum, I suppose.
Some are just "terrified" of COVID because they fear of dying with loneliness in their heart and without freedom to do things they used to do before. That's why they enjoy going out even without being vaccinated.
Covid is terrifying, yes, but there are still precautions we can take to minimise that risk, some of which involve very little sacrifice.
Also, life as we know it isn't suspended in amber, it's constantly changing. Yes, it can be scary but there's nothing we can do about it except work on ourselves and do our best to adapt. Some battles are worth fighting, but viruses have existed for a lot longer than we have.
elizabethalice
02-09-21, 07:55
I think one major argument for covid passports is for the health of the people in the venue. If a lot of vaccinated people catch it in one place, they will likely be ok. However, if a load of unvaccinated people catch it, they could get very sick.
A lot of people say "it's my health so it's my choice" but a big worry is pressure on the NHS. If someone gets sick and needs hospital treatment, they will go to hospital. If there are a lot of them (ie. Lots of unvaccinated people who have been attending busy events), then this turns into a big problem for the NHS.
This is what i think the gov is trying to avoid going into winter to keep us out of lockdown.
I am in no way a fan of the gov but I do kind of see where they are going with this one, especially as the tests are so easy to fake. Ideally, we'd all be able to get a negative PCR a few hours before going to the venue, but I just can't see the capacity with being able to get this done. Having a crowd of vaccinated people will always be better than having a crowd of unvaccinated people.
I think one major argument for covid passports is for the health of the people in the venue. If a lot of vaccinated people catch it in one place, they will likely be ok. However, if a load of unvaccinated people catch it, they could get very sick.
A lot of people say "it's my health so it's my choice" but a big worry is pressure on the NHS. If someone gets sick and needs hospital treatment, they will go to hospital. If there are a lot of them (ie. Lots of unvaccinated people who have been attending busy events), then this turns into a big problem for the NHS.
This is what i think the gov is trying to avoid going into winter to keep us out of lockdown.
I am in no way a fan of the gov but I do kind of see where they are going with this one, especially as the tests are so easy to fake. Ideally, we'd all be able to get a negative PCR a few hours before going to the venue, but I just can't see the capacity with being able to get this done. Having a crowd of vaccinated people will always be better than having a crowd of unvaccinated people.
I reckon some people are basically trying to use the 'what about fully vaxxed venues/persons still spreading Covid so what's the point in getting the jab' argument to essentially justify their not bothering to get jabbed.
While there will always be the odd cases that slip through the net, the fully jabbed 'breakthrough' cases will for the most part be by far the lesser of the two evils compared to the unjabbed cases.
There's good news re the nasal spray vaccine, Phil. Could be ready by the end of next year according to scientists at Lancaster. Would you consider this option or would you still be wary of the "ingredients" of this vaccine? It may be an option for you if it gets approved?
Pamplemousse
02-09-21, 17:56
I thought it was merely an anti-viral spray rather than a vaccine, P?
You only have to compare this thread with Phil's other regarding his grandmother's funeral to see how much turmoil all this is causing him.
https://twitter.com/lancasteruni/status/1425751416044507136?lang=en
Hopefully this will develop into a viable alternative to a jab?
elizabethalice
02-09-21, 22:37
I reckon some people are basically trying to use the 'what about fully vaxxed venues/persons still spreading Covid so what's the point in getting the jab' argument to essentially justify their not bothering to get jabbed.
While there will always be the odd cases that slip through the net, the fully jabbed 'breakthrough' cases will for the most part be by far the lesser of the two evils compared to the unjabbed cases.
Yes definitely, and even if people are getting breakthrough cases, they are much much less likely to put a strain on the NHS
Well I have new neighbours which are not too good I feel like moving but I am very worried about letting strangers view my house to sell or even visiting new houses and process of moving. I hate serving customers on a till at work too.
Yes definitely, and even if people are getting breakthrough cases, they are much much less likely to put a strain on the NHS
Probably one of the main reasons for far fewer restrictions now.
Plus they're technically getting a 'phantom' third dose at the same time.
Good news things slowing down in Scotland now
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