View Full Version : Proposed post-lockdown restrictions on phones in schools
I know this particular issue doesn't affect me personally, but there is an article on the BBC website today about Gavin Williamson proposing restrictions on pupils carrying or at least using their phones on school premises, due to potential fears of discipline problems attributed to the recent lockdowns.
I'm kind of 'on the fence' over this.
Whilst one half of me believes that many kids have in many ways become far too embroiled in such devices in general over the past 15 years or so, and can be detrimental to and unhealthy for them, even when not at school, when used to excess, the other half of me believes that that same policy could be a bit too draconian and potentially unworkable in practice, plus likely cause even more polarisation between pupils and teachers.
Also discipline problems amongst school kids in general have been known to exist in various forms for eons, and if it wasn't phones it would probably be other things that would be 'scapegoated'.
Back in my day (in the 80s and early 90s) it was Walkman cassette players/ portable boomboxes and even watching TV excessively that were often blamed for corrupting school kids and causing their brains to become addled!
WiredIncorrectly
10-04-21, 14:34
My lad has a phone, but it isn't a smartphone. He keeps it on him so I or mom can call him. He's only 13 though. I see so many children gazing into their phone screens constantly. It's horrible. My nephew came once and was on his phone the entire time here, now he leaves it at home when he comes and he's a different kid. I do feel smartphones, and the Internet, isn't a thing young teenagers should be focusing on.
In terms of music influencing behaviors ... it's true. Take a look at the UK Drill genre where rappers rap about killing rival gang members. Rappers from the scene are always getting caught up in dramas, either they've stabbed or killed somebody, or they've been killed. A lot of young people will listen to this and be inspired by it.
17 year old rapper got done for murder recently. Video of him getting arrested at airport: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJtL9kzPWs4
Video of the stabbing: https://twitter.com/mrloqa/status/1165964592595578881?lang=en
Just one of many. Look at the comments with how many young people are saying "free scarz". Scarz was his rapper name. The youth are desensitized because of the Internet.
KallaMouse
10-04-21, 18:08
I'm all for restrictions on students using phones while on school grounds, but not if it's during their free time. I don't believe that they should be restricted altogether. First of all, policing that would be a headache and a half. Second, parents want their children to have their phones with them, so it's kind of an uphill battle from that end as well. It's just not realistic to say no phones, ever. It's certainly realistic, though, to expect them to not pull their phones out in class.
ankietyjoe
10-04-21, 18:37
Kids are already restricted from using phones on school grounds. It's not really news.
MyNameIsTerry
10-04-21, 18:49
I'm all for restrictions on students using phones while on school grounds, but not if it's during their free time. I don't believe that they should be restricted altogether. First of all, policing that would be a headache and a half. Second, parents want their children to have their phones with them, so it's kind of an uphill battle from that end as well. It's just not realistic to say no phones, ever. It's certainly realistic, though, to expect them to not pull their phones out in class.
Agreed. It's also good that they learn this for their later working life where this is standard policy.
I'm 'old' and we didn't have any of these things when I was growing up. My parents would basically let us go out all day as kids as long as we were home for dinner and/or before dark. We walked to school with 6" of snow on the ground and you were considered privileged to have a color TV when you were a kid. Heck, I remember staying up late and listening to the National Anthem before the channel signed off for the night!
Now? It seems everyone is always looking down at their phones. Young, old and everything in between. It's become the 'posture' of modern society and there are actual physical ailments associated with it on top of injuries and fatalities it's caused due to the distraction of constantly looking at them!
I have a smart phone. I believe most of us do at this point and yes, there are features and apps that make our lives much more convenient but I can tell you for me personally, it's still a phone and a means of communication as opposed to a way of life.
While I agree with letting kids have phones, they need to be on silent and not looked at or used while in class. School is for learning and one needs to be focused on the task at hand as opposed to who posted what on the internet!
Positive thoughts
Good Lord! I sound like my parents! ~lol~
Pamplemousse
10-04-21, 20:22
I'm 'old' and we didn't have any of these things when I was growing up. My parents would basically let us go out all day as kids as long as we were home for dinner and/or before dark. We walked to school with 6" of snow on the ground and you were considered privileged to have a color TV when you were a kid. Heck, I remember staying up late and listening to the National Anthem before the channel signed off for the night!
Very similar situation to my childhood then. When I was young (early 1970s) it was only those who lived in council houses or were loaded that could afford a colour TV: here in the UK Radio 4 still plays the National Anthem at just before 1 a.m., when it closes down for just over four hours.
WiredIncorrectly
10-04-21, 20:38
I have a smart phone. I believe most of us do at this point
Not me sir. My younger brother is so annoyed with his iPhone that he now owns a 8310. He only uses the iPhone to update Twitter and Instagram because he's a musician.
WiredIncorrectly
10-04-21, 20:39
Very similar situation to my childhood then. When I was young (early 1970s) it was only those who lived in council houses or were loaded that could afford a colour TV: here in the UK Radio 4 still plays the National Anthem at just before 1 a.m., when it closes down for just over four hours.
How could people in council houses afford color TV? I had a black and white TV in my room in 1994 :roflmao: Edit: I had it until 1999.
Remember when you could buy a TV by topping up the box at the side. My uncle had one and I remember having to run next door to borrow a pound for the telly.
KallaMouse
10-04-21, 21:50
I have a smartphone and I used it every day, all day. Here's why:
1. Alarm clock.
2. Weather and news
3. Music while I'm getting ready.
4. Pop-up reminders so I don't forget something before I leave the house.
5. Directions and music while driving to my destination.
6. Reading my e-book during lunch.
7. Ordering my groceries online.
8. Pulling up a recipe for dinner.
9. Casting a show to the TV to watch after dinner.
10. Googling something my husband said that I don't want to let on I didn't know the meaning of. (This happens more than I care to admit.)
11. Setting a timer so I don't burn the blueberry cobbler.
12. Looking at the stars and using the app on my phone to learn what constellation I'm looking at.
13. Playing some crossword puzzles before bed.
I've replaced an alarm clock, newspapers, cable TV, radio, post-it notes, dictionary, kitchen timer, puzzle book, book, grocery shopping, recipe book, maps, and star charts. That's pretty much an average day, minus the need for maps and star charts. So while I get it and agree that there is a danger to the overuse of certain apps available on smartphones, I think it's also usually the people who don't really use smartphones who romanticize the time before. Because honestly, they're just really, really useful.
Now, social media....that's the devil.
Phones shouldn't be blanket banned from school or even from the classroom. If the mobile is being used to look something up or as a tool (such as a calculator) then I'd allow that. I used to benefit from listening to music during class in school which some teachers allowed and others didn't. I can understand not wanting pupils messaging or using social media in class.
Pamplemousse
10-04-21, 22:43
How could people in council houses afford color TV? I had a black and white TV in my room in 1994 :roflmao: Edit: I had it until 1999.
They weren't getting hammered for all the costs of owning your own home. Different world back in the 70s. People with quite good jobs could still rent a house from the council and there were simply a lot more of them back then, in those pre- "Right To Buy" days that precipitated the housing crisis we have now. Over two million council houses were sold at a discount to their renters; one could cynically view it as gerrymandering on a massive scale in that people who bought their council houses cheaply might be more likely to vote Tory next time.
There were some desperately poor, admittedly; but some were canny and could afford stuff like this - and new cars - because back then, mortgage interest rates were crippling so the relative costs of owning your own home were quite high.
Remember when you could buy a TV by topping up the box at the side. My uncle had one and I remember having to run next door to borrow a pound for the telly.
That was more a rental thing back then - if you had a customer liable to default on payment the one thing you could do was fit a slot meter to the set. You could still buy those meters to fit to TV sets back in the mid-80s; there was a good trade in renting out refurbished first generation, even second-generation colour sets back then that had come out from the big rental chains. There were warehouses where you could buy sets by the van-load, at prices varying upon make and condition. I used to make a few quid taking first generation sets donated by friends and family, going over them and fault-finding as needed, cleaning them up and setting them up to as good a standard as possible and selling them as second sets for the bedroom.
A trick of the trade - how truthful I know not, but it wouldn't surprise me if it was true - with defaulting rental customers was to stick a pin through the aerial cable. When the customer rang up to complain that the telly was bust you'd visit and say the set had to go back to the workshop but you didn't have a loan set - but it wouldn't take long any way.
After a while, they'd ring up and complain - and the response of "well, you'll get it back when you pay the rent owed on it" usually produced the goods... :roflmao:
WiredIncorrectly
10-04-21, 23:47
They weren't getting hammered for all the costs of owning your own home. Different world back in the 70s. People with quite good jobs could still rent a house from the council and there were simply a lot more of them back then, in those pre- "Right To Buy" days that precipitated the housing crisis we have now. Over two million council houses were sold at a discount to their renters; one could cynically view it as gerrymandering on a massive scale in that people who bought their council houses cheaply might be more likely to vote Tory next time.
There were some desperately poor, admittedly; but some were canny and could afford stuff like this - and new cars - because back then, mortgage interest rates were crippling so the relative costs of owning your own home were quite high.
That was more a rental thing back then - if you had a customer liable to default on payment the one thing you could do was fit a slot meter to the set. You could still buy those meters to fit to TV sets back in the mid-80s; there was a good trade in renting out refurbished first generation, even second-generation colour sets back then that had come out from the big rental chains. There were warehouses where you could buy sets by the van-load, at prices varying upon make and condition. I used to make a few quid taking first generation sets donated by friends and family, going over them and fault-finding as needed, cleaning them up and setting them up to as good a standard as possible and selling them as second sets for the bedroom.
A trick of the trade - how truthful I know not, but it wouldn't surprise me if it was true - with defaulting rental customers was to stick a pin through the aerial cable. When the customer rang up to complain that the telly was bust you'd visit and say the set had to go back to the workshop but you didn't have a loan set - but it wouldn't take long any way.
After a while, they'd ring up and complain - and the response of "well, you'll get it back when you pay the rent owed on it" usually produced the goods... :roflmao:
To be honest council homes around here are much like that. Most are working class around here. I walk past some houses and think "how the heck do you have 2 brand new audis and a range rover" :roflmao:
Now you mention that my uncle was definitely renting. Talking of tricks, do you remember you could cut the M.E.B electric cards to get free credit?
Thanks for that in depth post though. I didn't know it was a big thing with the TV's.
MyNameIsTerry
11-04-21, 07:11
To be honest council homes around here are much like that. Most are working class around here. I walk past some houses and think "how the heck do you have 2 brand new audis and a range rover" :roflmao:
Now you mention that my uncle was definitely renting. Talking of tricks, do you remember you could cut the M.E.B electric cards to get free credit?
Thanks for that in depth post though. I didn't know it was a big thing with the TV's.
People used to make bake coins for the leccy meters too. Engineers would come out to collect them and it would just be full of sludge :roflmao:
On Steptoe and son they were putting foreign coins in theirs. :yesyes:
My lad has a phone, but it isn't a smartphone. He keeps it on him so I or mom can call him. He's only 13 though. I see so many children gazing into their phone screens constantly. It's horrible. My nephew came once and was on his phone the entire time here, now he leaves it at home when he comes and he's a different kid. I do feel smartphones, and the Internet, isn't a thing young teenagers should be focusing on.
In terms of music influencing behaviors ... it's true. Take a look at the UK Drill genre where rappers rap about killing rival gang members. Rappers from the scene are always getting caught up in dramas, either they've stabbed or killed somebody, or they've been killed. A lot of young people will listen to this and be inspired by it.
17 year old rapper got done for murder recently. Video of him getting arrested at airport: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJtL9kzPWs4
Video of the stabbing: https://twitter.com/mrloqa/status/1165964592595578881?lang=en
Just one of many. Look at the comments with how many young people are saying "free scarz". Scarz was his rapper name. The youth are desensitized because of the Internet.
There was also the video nasties scare back in the first half of the 90s, especially following a certain tragic event in Merseyside back then.
Going back to drill music, I agree with much of what you're saying about it potentially being a bad influence on youngsters, but attempts to ban it or restrict it would be futile and no doubt cause a mass backlash from the 'freedom of expression' brigades, even though said music often glorifies murder and the like. Plus the 'Free Scarz' campaign you mentioned is just totally nonsensical and totally beyond the pale. Plus it also implies that his fans seem to assume that they have a god-given right to commit the most heinous crime in the world, murder, simply because they're often hard done by, or think they are!
It really takes the mickey that people have been arrested, locked up and given ASBOs simply for being autistic over the years, or in the case of areas like Brixton and Handsworth back in the 70s and 80s, people arrested and locked up simply for being Black, even if they hadn't even committed an offence!
So Scarz fans, your 'idol' has committed murder, and has rightfully been arrested for it and will do porridge, just get over it and let it go!
ankietyjoe
11-04-21, 20:51
Phones shouldn't be blanket banned from school or even from the classroom. If the mobile is being used to look something up or as a tool (such as a calculator) then I'd allow that. I used to benefit from listening to music during class in school which some teachers allowed and others didn't. I can understand not wanting pupils messaging or using social media in class.
I could not disagree with this more.
Children are having big issues being glued to the addictive nature of smart phones. If you allow them to use them in class, they will be using them for anything but school related things.
Smart phones are an absolute scourge.
WiredIncorrectly
11-04-21, 21:49
People used to make bake coins for the leccy meters too. Engineers would come out to collect them and it would just be full of sludge :roflmao:
On Steptoe and son they were putting foreign coins in theirs. :yesyes:
Terry, are you in my brain? I was thinking about Steptoe and Son yesterday. I do love the episodes.
WiredIncorrectly
11-04-21, 22:03
There was also the video nasties scare back in the first half of the 90s, especially following a certain tragic event in Merseyside back then.
Going back to drill music, I agree with much of what you're saying about it potentially being a bad influence on youngsters, but attempts to ban it or restrict it would be futile and no doubt cause a mass backlash from the 'freedom of expression' brigades, even though said music often glorifies murder and the like. Plus the 'Free Scarz' campaign you mentioned is just totally nonsensical and totally beyond the pale. Plus it also implies that his fans seem to assume that they have a god-given right to commit the most heinous crime in the world, murder, simply because they're often hard done by, or think they are!
It really takes the mickey that people have been arrested, locked up and given ASBOs simply for being autistic over the years, or in the case of areas like Brixton and Handsworth back in the 70s and 80s, people arrested and locked up simply for being Black, even if they hadn't even committed an offence!
So Scarz fans, your 'idol' has committed murder, and has rightfully been arrested for it and will do porridge, just get over it and let it go!
Agree with you 100%. Whoever that "scarz" lad is, he'll be forgotten in 6 months. Nobody from his "gang" will be supporting him while he does his murder stretch. People like him go into jail killers, and end up bullied because they can't back themselves up in jail. He will be shipped to a jail where there are no gang affiliations too.
There is no forgiving people like him, and it's disgusting the amount of "free blah blah" that goes on in murder cases. It proves the warped perceptions the youth have as a result of this music.
I could not disagree with this more.
Children are having big issues being glued to the addictive nature of smart phones. If you allow them to use them in class, they will be using them for anything but school related things.
Smart phones are an absolute scourge.
Maybe the compromise would be to supply tablets or phones for pupils to use in class which are locked down to block social media, then ban them from using their own phones. That way they can still access music to listen to whilst working and are still taught how to research online effectively. Children need to be learn how to use technology, use it well and use it responsibly. If they can be taught this in the classroom then all the better.
MyNameIsTerry
12-04-21, 01:25
I could not disagree with this more.
Children are having big issues being glued to the addictive nature of smart phones. If you allow them to use them in class, they will be using them for anything but school related things.
Smart phones are an absolute scourge.
Isn't that what teachers are for?
MyNameIsTerry
12-04-21, 01:29
Terry, are you in my brain? I was thinking about Steptoe and Son yesterday. I do love the episodes.
Yes, you might have got rid of your phone but Wallace & Gromit have built me a device to get into your brain :yesyes:
https://horrorobsessive.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/Wallace-Gromit-The-Curse-of-the-Were-Rabbit-The-Mind-Manipulation-O-Matic.jpg
ankietyjoe
12-04-21, 10:17
Maybe the compromise would be to supply tablets or phones for pupils to use in class which are locked down to block social media, then ban them from using their own phones. That way they can still access music to listen to whilst working and are still taught how to research online effectively. Children need to be learn how to use technology, use it well and use it responsibly. If they can be taught this in the classroom then all the better.
This already happens. Children have access to all the tech they need during school hours, and they do not need access to smart devices for any reason.
And yes, that's what parents are for.
I think it's all a typical 'beat around the bush' situation.
Thus, damned if do, damned if don't!
ankietyjoe
12-04-21, 17:33
There is an argument for children having a phone on the way to and from school. During school they are looked after. There is no reason for them to have a phone IN school, in the same way there's no reason for them to have a Playstation, TV or any other kind of distracting device.
There's no argument here......in my opinion.
There is an argument for children having a phone on the way to and from school. During school they are looked after. There is no reason for them to have a phone IN school, in the same way there's no reason for them to have a Playstation, TV or any other kind of distracting device.
There's no argument here......in my opinion.
You have a valid point there AJ.
Perhaps a secure phone bay of some sort in every (form) classroom is in order.
But even that idea as per usual will no doubt get pooh-poohed as impracticable!
MyNameIsTerry
13-04-21, 08:46
It will help get them used to the working world where phones aren't allowed and possessions are often stowed until breaks or you leave.
Massive bugbear for managers, not just teachers. People sit fiddling on Facebook. Managers do it too though.
ankietyjoe
13-04-21, 10:31
Perhaps a secure phone bay of some sort in every (form) classroom is in order.
Again, this is already in place. They have lockers which they have to put their phones in at the start of each day.
Another reason why the article itself is non-news.
It will help get them used to the working world where phones aren't allowed and possessions are often stowed until breaks or you leave.
Massive bugbear for managers, not just teachers. People sit fiddling on Facebook. Managers do it too though.
This isn't necessarily always the case. I've had jobs where you can sit on your phone at your desk and go on social media and I've had jobs where you're not even allowed your phone on the floor, let alone out in front of you. I've never liked hypocrisy and managers using their phones for entertainment or personal reasons when their staff can't does get to me.
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