Huge anxiety after sleepless night.

[ankietyjoe]

Hello all, long time no see. Hope you are all doing well!

This is a surrogate post on behalf of a relative who has a login here, but it's proving difficult to access as it was done through my email address -




Hi there

I just wanted to ask if anybody has experienced severe, long lasting anxiety (mainly manifesting as high adrenaline and restless legs) the day after a sleepless night.

I am suffering with insomnia right now, and every time I don't get enough sleep, the next day is a never ending nightmare.

Thankyou.

[BlueIris]

Joe, great to see you!

Joe's relative, this is exactly how I feel after a bad night, so wired U could broadcast.

[LittleLionMan]

Hi Joe, hope you are good.

I’m having a similar experience today.
I felt ill yesterday, and wasn't sure if it was a bug or anxiety. I was then awake all night sweating and trembling, and still am (heart rate is sitting around 140).
It was like the first night when I had Covid, so I did a test and it's negative. I think I had convinced myself I had Covid again, so that was the worry and I just got myself in a state. Just got to hang in there today I think and look forward to a better night tonight.

[ankietyjoe]

Thanks guys (this is not Joe)

I think it's just anxiety based as when I try to sleep (I'm so tired) I get like a 'rush' in my head, then a rush of adrenaline. It's like my body wants me to stay awake even though I desperately need to sleep.

It's very frustrating.

[LittleLionMan]

I’ve had that lots of times.
Do you put pressure on yourself to go to sleep? I have to try and adopt a ‘don’t care’ attitude towards sleep. Go to bed at a time that gives you plenty of time and then take all the pressure off it.

[NoraB]

I just wanted to ask if anybody has experienced severe, long lasting anxiety (mainly manifesting as high adrenaline and restless legs) the day after a sleepless night.

I am suffering with insomnia right now, and every time I don't get enough sleep, the next day is a never ending nightmare.

Hi, Joe's relative.

Yes, I have experienced this, and it can be a tough cycle to break free from..

Parasympathetic activity (rest and digest) should be higher during sleep. This is how the repair work gets done. However, insomnia means that sympathetic (fight or flight) activity is higher, and that means that any sleep which we do get will be poor and not the restful kind that we need. We carry those stress hormones through to the next day (wired but tired is how I would describe it) and we dread the whole thing happening all over again, so our brains learn to associate going to bed as being a 'danger'. We convince ourselves we won't sleep, and it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. What worked for me was acceptance. I told myself that it didn't matter if I slept or not. I've seen some amazing sunrises thanks to insomnia, so I just told myself that I would get to see another one. Basically, I stopped fixating on sleep and gradually things started to improve. (I also improved my sleep hygiene as much as possible)

Give Joe my best. (I miss our sparring sessions ha ha)

Actually, I'm surprised Joe can't help you with this himself, as he's one of the few members on here who know their stuff when it comes to anxiety? :unsure:

[ankietyjoe]

I’ve had that lots of times.
Do you put pressure on yourself to go to sleep? I have to try and adopt a ‘don’t care’ attitude towards sleep. Go to bed at a time that gives you plenty of time and then take all the pressure off it.

I think it's a combination of things. I probably do worry about getting to sleep too much, but simply because if I don't get enough sleep I feel SO bad the next day.


Hi, Joe's relative.

Yes, I have experienced this, and it can be a tough cycle to break free from..

Parasympathetic activity (rest and digest) should be higher during sleep. This is how the repair work gets done. However, insomnia means that sympathetic (fight or flight) activity is higher, and that means that any sleep which we do get will be poor and not the restful kind that we need. We carry those stress hormones through to the next day (wired but tired is how I would describe it) and we dread the whole thing happening all over again, so our brains learn to associate going to bed as being a 'danger'. We convince ourselves we won't sleep, and it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. What worked for me was acceptance. I told myself that it didn't matter if I slept or not. I've seen some amazing sunrises thanks to insomnia, so I just told myself that I would get to see another one. Basically, I stopped fixating on sleep and gradually things started to improve. (I also improved my sleep hygiene as much as possible)

Give Joe my best. (I miss our sparring sessions ha ha)

Actually, I'm surprised Joe can't help you with this himself, as he's one of the few members on here who know their stuff when it comes to anxiety? :unsure:

Thanks Nora. As I mentioned above, the concern isn't so much about the sleep, but about how bad I always feel the next day, where I have to get up and do things I need to do. Walking around Tesco with massively surging adrenaline and my heart banging in my chest just isn't fun, but I still have to do it.

Joe has actually been a huge help with this all along, but he has suggested that I need to go and learn things for myself too, instead of relying on one source of knowledge all the time, and I think he's right. The more I read about things that concur with his experience, the more I realise the problem is my relationship with life events and anxiety itself than anything else. Or at least it's as important as the anxiety itself.

[NoraB]

Thanks Nora. As I mentioned above, the concern isn't so much about the sleep, but about how bad I always feel the next day, where I have to get up and do things I need to do. Walking around Tesco with massively surging adrenaline and my heart banging in my chest just isn't fun, but I still have to do it.

It feels very unpleasant doesn't it. The best thing is to keep things as normal as possible. Try not to sleep in the day (It'll make things worse). Being active will help to burn off some of the adrenalin. Some people find running or walking to be helpful with this. On the other hand, cardio exercise naturally releases more adrenalin so this can be problematic. (I found that gentle exercise was the best option for me.)

My heart used to race when I was doing nothing at all, and that's an unpleasant sensation. We expect the heart to beat faster when we're moving, but not when we're at rest. I found it best to do my deep breathing and not to fixate on the sensations. Bottom line, your brain thinks you're in danger, even when you're in Tesco wandering down the pet food aisle. When we've been anxious for a long time, the stress response starts triggering when it doesn't need to, but breathing deeply physically turns this response off, as in, no more adrenalin is released, but we still have what's already been released swirling around our system, do you see?


Joe has actually been a huge help with this all along, but he has suggested that I need to go and learn things for myself too, instead of relying on one source of knowledge all the time, and I think he's right. The more I read about things that concur with his experience, the more I realise the problem is my relationship with life events and anxiety itself than anything else. Or at least it's as important as the anxiety itself.

Good to hear that Joe's been helping you, and I agree with him that you need learn things for yourself. (Like I said, Joe knows his stuff when it comes to anxiety)

However, his experience isn't your experience. There will be similarities, but we all have different causes and triggers behind chronic anxiety. And then there are those add-on disorders such as health anxiety. Some of us are predisposed to anxiety, others develop it later in life after an event or trigger. I think it helps to understand the root cause of anxiety, but the main thing is that you learn how to challenge your thoughts and how the stress response works (and what you can do to help yourself)

Have you looked at your diet? There are lots of stimulants in food and drink (and some meds) all of which will add to the problem.

In simplest terms, you have to listen to your body, and it's telling you to slow everything down and not add stimulants. This means dietary stimulants and anything else that gets your heart beating faster, like dramatic TV, movies or music. You have to literally go through everything you do and make changes where possible. Once you've gained some control over the physical symptoms then you can really get to work on the thoughts that have created the problem..

[mbXC393]

Sorry to hear about your relative, sleep is so powerful that without it many things can seem worse, anxiety included.

Having completed a CBT course for insomnia (Sleep Station) after a prolonged period of insomnia in the past, I'd offer the following tips:

(on a cbti programme called Sleep Station). My tips;

1. Only go to bed when sleepy. Tiredness isn't enough.

2. Set a time to get up. Earlier is better, but stick to it. I.e 7am everyday, regardless of weekends, etc.

3. Remove clocks from the bedroom. Do not check the time as this can cause anxiety and increase subsequent alertness.

4. If after ~20minutes you aren't asleep, get out of bed and go and do something like read or listen to something. Only return to bed when you feel sleepy.

5. Do not fight your thoughts about "oh I can't sleep" Or "I'll be so tired tomorrow" welcome those thoughts and see them for just what they are, thoughts.

Sleep hygiene is a minor contributing factor in my experience, but try and avoid screens and excessive lighting for an hour before bed.

[ankietyjoe]

Thankyou both

My sleeping did improve a little bit after I just decided to not worry about it so much, or at least try and not worry about it so much.

Yes, Joe has been incredibly helpful with this, to the point where he was endlessly repeating things to me over and over again, but ultimately he mentioned I needed to get to the place where I had to choose to get better and either take the advice or not, which is why I'm here.

[LittleLionMan]

I had to choose to get better and either take the advice or not.
That’s the most ‘Joe’ line I’ve ever heard! Haha

[pulisa]

"Stop Reading Too Much Into It".

That's probably what you should tell yourself every time you DO start reading too much into it?

[NoraB]

Hi Joe's relative, Joe has asked for this thread to be used to support you, and you alone, and of course we want to respect that, so we've deleted some messages that are not applicable to you.

Hope you're doing ok today.

Nora.