Out of hospital [Archive]

happyone

22-08-08, 18:48

Well, here I am after another fortnight in the Luxury Hotel......ok, NHS mental health hospital!
I think it was therapeutic for me. Initially, it was as a place of safety. I was admitted to an acute ward. I think that is how I get ill; low mood turns bad extremely quickly but I quickly get out of that dangerous place when medicine kicks in. Once I got restarted on meds, the mood began to lift pretty quickly. Stopping the meds this time wasn't my doing though! It was on the instructions of a doctor after I had had a possible allergic reaction, which turned out not to be an allergy, but just a transient reaction as I am back on the same meds that caused the reaction.
I also did an awful lot of sleeping in the first week. I literally only got out of bed when I had to. I have a theory, that mental illness, like physical illness can be helped by sleep. My brain was getting to a point of shut down when I was at home and I think the sleeping I did helped me.
I was given the choice today of going home for good, going home on a weekend pass thus leaving my bed open for me over the weekend should I feel the need to return, or of staying in. I chose to come home for good. I think the hospital environment had stopped being of any help for me.
In hindsight, I don't think I was well enough the last time I got discharged but I was so determined not to let my family down by not being fit enough to go on holiday.
I feel a calm that I hope will last. This time, I have come out and I know I am not well. I am no longer a danger to myself, but I am recognising that I have a mental illness, I am not quite stable and I will have to take medication for several years, if not the rest of my life. I have felt twice recently the terrible way my mood can swing if I am not taking mood stabilising drugs. I also recognise that I HAVE to give up my job which is stressful and triggering.

Happyone
xx

milly jones

22-08-08, 22:11

ohh hunny u sound so much better

really glad to have u back with us

welcome home

milly xxx

alexis

22-08-08, 22:34

Welcome back! Hope all goes OK, keep us informed.xxx

bluesparkle

23-08-08, 12:30

welcome back happyone. . .
sending you lots of :hugs: :hugs: :hugs:
rach
x

honeybee3939

23-08-08, 13:34

Hi Happy

Hope things can move forward for you now hun.:hugs:

Welcome back:yesyes:

Love
:hugs:
Andrea
xxxxx

Karen

23-08-08, 21:36

Welcome back Happy :hugs:

I don't think anyone returns from an inpatient stay 'cured' as you recognise but it is a good sign that you have insight into what will help you remain stable. That's a good start.

I wish you well Happy.

Karen xx

lorac

23-08-08, 22:23

Welcome back Happy

Sounds like your hospital stay has helped you I hope your progress continues.

Carol x

happyone

24-08-08, 09:34

Thanks folks:)

karen, you are so right about not coming back 'cured'. I think the last time I thought I was more well than I was.
It is really weird though, I keep on waiting for things to go wrong. I have lost my drivers license (thus my freedom) due to my instability and non compliance with medical treatment, my group therapy which means a huge deal to me is ending this week, I am going to have to get another job which will mean less money and my 1-1 therapy is getting nearer to ending! I should by all accounts be in more distress than I have been, rather than being better! So, being the pessimist that I am, I have a little niggle in my head "when is the proverbial **** going to hit the fan?"
Happyonex

Jimbo

24-08-08, 13:59

Hey Happy,:hugs:

Sorry you've had a rough time recently, but your post sounds like you're trying to accept things.:hugs:

Try not to worry about the job etc, perhaps working at the moment isn't the best thing. Maybe get some benefits sorted out and things will be much easier.

Trying to judge your own health is always hard, I think of the times I've tried to go to work with a bug and ended up going home, it isn't much different to that.

Take each day as it comes and try not to worry about the future. You have lots of friends here who are routing for you.

Jim :hugs:

Southern_Belle

24-08-08, 16:12

Hi HappyOne,

So glad you are back. If I were you I would take things one day at a time. As for your job, I would think a less stressful one would be looking pretty good considering how they treated you. You deserve so much more. Try not to look for the bad and accept the good.

Laura xxx

Piglet

25-08-08, 16:04

:hugs: Big hugs Pegasus.

Love Piglet :flowers:

Karen

25-08-08, 21:07

Hi Happy

I'm glad you feel you are coping with these possibly difficult situations that are going to arise but don't forget to ask for help if it starts to become overwhelming again. I think we are both good at that - just keeping going until things unravel in a big way.

Maybe you could consider taking some time out of the working situation for a while. I know money is a consideration but have a look and see what benefits you could be entitled to. I would've thought incapacity and disability living allowance for a start. The Citizens Advice Bureau are very good at making sure you claim everything you are entitled to. It might give you the space you need.

Have you talked to your care team about the support you are going to need once the group and individual therapy comes to an end? Perhaps the individual therapy could continue a while longer, or maybe there is something else that you could attend for support.

You are doing well Happy:hugs: Remember you have just got home from hospital so take things easy and ask if you feel things are not going right for you.

Karen xx

happyone

26-08-08, 12:39

Thanks folks,
not working really isn't an option I favour at the moment. Hubby and I would really be struggling financially if I stopped. I already get DLA at the highest care rate, nil for mobility. However, if I remain well, which I hope to do, that will be stopped after a year. Actually I have just posted off my form for this year. I hope to get it again as my needs are actually higher than they were last year, in terms of how many hospitalisations and mood swings that I have been having.
I had auditory hallucinations last night. Not very scary, but really strange. It was like there was a load of people in the room with me, talking quietly in really hushed voices and I could hear them walking around the room and opening and closing the door. Like the last time I had auditory hallucinations, which was some time ago, they seemed perfectly ok and normal!:wacko: It was today that I realised what they were.
Karen, thanks. I am going to be getting 1-1 therapy for a little while yet. I am not sure how long, but my therapist said he will let me know when it is coming to an end so I can be prepared.
Happyone
xx

samc100

26-08-08, 13:25

Hello Happyone

You do sound brighter and focused on the future. Take things easy.

I agree with the sleep factor - I think it does help repair your mind.xxxxx

Jimbo

31-08-08, 17:39

Hey Happy,:hugs:

Hope things are going ok.

Do try to find out if there's support in your area for advice with benefits, normally there's a few organizations around that can advise you including the CAB. Getting benefits is a far better option than staying in a job that is making you more ill. Having a 3rd person to get some advice would help. Even if things are a bit tighter in terms of money, benefits will usually give you enough to live on.

With the MHT, they won't stop contact if you don't want them to. Try to ask for a care coordinator and regular contact. They should be doing their best to meet your needs.

Stay in touch with us and let us know how things are going.

Jim:hugs:

happyone

01-09-08, 12:20

Thanks Jim,
the thing is, I think I am fit to work, just not in the post I hold at present. I work for one of the biggest local governments in the country. It is not like they don't have vacant posts.
I am just so frustrated just now.
I have just sent off a letter of complaint to occ health and my human resources dept about the last occ health interview I had.

I spoke on the phone to my manager and asked her to set up a meeting between me, her and human resources with a view to looking at my future in the post I hold just now.

My manager tells me that she told human resources that my psychiatrist had suggested that they write to him to find out how fit or unfit I am for my job. My psych feels quite strongly that I should not be doing it. He thinks I need regular hours/days and a job with less stress.

Human resources tell her they cannot write and ask for a report from my psych. Everything has to go through occ health who say there is no reason I can't do my job when I am stable and there is no reason I can't deal with stress when I am fit! Yet human resources tell my manager that there is nothing to stop her asking for a report from my psych! Occupational health...for the FOURTH time, have said there is no need for a third party report at this time. ie my psychs report.

My manager is going to seek advice from my psych but unless it is backed up with a report from the occupational health report, then it will not be worth the paper it is written on!
Redeployment cannot happen on health grounds unless occ health say they recommend it!

I am being assessed on the end of a phone by some stupid moo who knows sweet f a about my mental health other than the fact I have had three long term absences in two years.
How can my employers think that a report from a blooming nurse who has spoken to me for 30 minutes on the phone, is more worthy than a report from my psych, who is a senior psychiatric consultant who has seen me on average, once a week-fortnight for the past two years!?

Employment legal advice line, say that it really is bad practice that my psych has not been contacted before now.

I am so flaming frustrated! I am not fit to do my job. I cannot handle the stress of it any more. I have worked for my employers for thirteen years and worked blooming well for them. I have had hardly any absences before these last two years.

What the hell does a girl have to do? I can see me giving up my job and taking them to court for constructive dismissal. I don't want to give up working for them though. I just want a less stressful job.

Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr:mad:

Happy(but frustrated!)one
xxx

Jimbo

01-09-08, 14:00

Hun, :hugs:

I can only liken things to me and my illness, we are somewhat similar.

I know how it can be with employers, to cut a long story short, I eventually ended up getting sacked from my job, probably unfairly. I don't have the strength to go through a court battle against them for unfair dismissal.

In hindsight, I think a lot of the triggers of my illness were the job and the way I was being treated by my colleagues, occ health and bosses. A lot of it is discrimination and prejudice by people who don't understand mental illness. Even though it does have it's downsides, not working is probably the best thing that happened to me looking back.

You need to realize that you're not stable right now, even though you might feel ok, things can change quickly, as you know. That means that you probably aren't well enough to work, even though you feel you are now.

It sounds like you're having some of the same mental battles with how your illness is going to affect your life as me. I'm still coming to terms with the fact that I'm not stable enough to work at the moment. I feel guilty for that, even though it's not my fault.

I feel good some days, but others I don't. Till things become totally stable for me, I don't want to risk setting me back by starting a job that will make me worse.

Jim :hugs:

happyone

01-09-08, 15:06

Thanks Jim:hugs:

I do really feel though that for the largest part of my life I am fit enough to work. However lets just say I wasn't. I cannot get medically retired/paid off unless occ health have deemed that I am unfit to work! Not only are they saying I will be fit in 2-3 weeks (I was in hospital 2 days after interview, threatened with section if I did not agree to go voluntarily....shows how much they know eh?) but that I will be able to do same job!

I had an absolutely awful occ health interview at the beginning of last month. So much so that I have written a letter of complaint to the company. Do you know what they said to me? I am still flabbergasted by this. I explained that my shifts are worked round my therapy times and initially the silly moo said to me "I can't ask your employers to give you time off work" I told her that I have always done my hours but they were arranged so that I wasn't put down for shifts at my therapy times. The patronising, rude b**ch said to me in an extremely snooty voice, "well, if your employers do that for you, then I think you should be going to them and saying 'thank you!' " Every time I think of it, my blood boils!

I don't feel strong enough for fighting either, but I will make myself do it if I have to. I have worked blooming hard for them, at times giving more than was ever called for. When I was doing the management job, I was working over my hours, changing my shifts to suit work...often to the detriment of my family, doing nightshifts because agency staff didn't turn up, accruing hours and hours of time that I never asked for back and I was doing assessment paperwork at home in my own time as well as studying for a management course that was compulsory.

I am at this moment waiting on a call from an employment lawyer that I get free advice from through the bipolar organisation I am in.

Happyone
xx

Jimbo

01-09-08, 15:49

Ok hun, :hugs:

Try not to get too wound up about it tho. That's not going to help how you're feeling.

The advice I can give is that because BP is recognized as a disability they should do everything reasonably possible to accommodate you as part of the Disability Discrimination Act. Trouble is the wording is so woolly, 'reasonably' is a bit of a grey area.

Ultimately they can do what they want, be really nasty, right up to sacking and it would be then up to you to persuade an employment tribunal it was unreasonable.

Do try to see it from their point of view too. They have a business to run and if you are off sick for long periods it does throw a spanner in the works for them. It would be a lot easier if they had a person that wasn't ill.

Have you had a good think about whether work is helping you or making you feel worse. I think your health is the most important thing.

Jim:hugs:

happyone

01-09-08, 16:21

The thing is Jim, I have been advised that with an employer as large as ****** City Council, redeployment would definately be considered 'a reasonable adjustment' as would them giving me training to be able to do another job.

Jim, if money was no object, I would give up my work and go back to college.

Anyway, I have a meeting tomorrow with my manager and human resources. My manager is ok, she is on my side. Human resources will be too but it is just the stupid bureaucracy that the council operates!

Thanks for your support:hugs:
happyone
xx

Jimbo

01-09-08, 18:44

Good luck for tomorrow.

:bighug1:

Jim :hugs:

happyone

02-09-08, 12:08

Thanks Jim,

Well, I had the meeting between me, my manager and human resources this morning. I had printed out all the points I wanted to make and gave a copy to each of them. I am quite proud of myself as I managed to talk, was quite assertive and firm. I told them the reasons why I feel I can no longer do my job, why I want them to contact my pdoc and about my mental health condition.:) One of the human resources women was a bit stuck and kept on asking me what they could do so that I could continue in my job. Grrrrr...nothing! that was the point of me being there! They have made all the adjustments they can and I am still unable to do it!

The long and short of it is, they have to go through occupational health! However, they are going to request a face to face interview with a doctor as opposed to a telephone consultation with a nurse in a call centre. They are going to strongly suggest that a report is sought from my pdoc, however they can't 'make' them and they are going to enclose the points I have made.

So, it wasn't a bad meeting but it aint over yet!:mad:
Happyone
xx

Jimbo

02-09-08, 13:58

Well done, :hugs:

Lets hope they can sort something out for you that will be suitable.

Jim :hugs:

Southern_Belle

03-09-08, 18:54

Sorry this has been so difficult HappyOne. When I was in the HR dept. in the hospital I worked at Occupation Health and HR were all under the same Mgmt. so we worked hand in hand. I'm surprised it isn't the same there. I do hope now that you had this meeting Occ Health will open their eyes. Try not to let it stress you out even though I know you want it resolved asap. For me I go to the Orthopedic docs today and will write you to let you know how it goes. Hope you have a good evening.

Hugs,

Laura xxx

happyone

03-09-08, 20:06

Thanks:hugs:

Do let me know how it goes Laura:hugs:

I am in turmoil! My recent calm and good frame of mind seems unsettled. I began to feel a bit odd last night and then today, my hubby, who has been on annual leave since I got out of hospital, said he was going to visit his dad. I panicked:mad: I could not bear the thought of him going away and I was frightened to be alone with my daughter. God forgive me but I was. I asked him to take her but she didn't want to go. Hubby must have sensed as he suggested that we all go out shopping instead. I am now fearing him going back to work. My good mood is beginning to show the cracks and I am really scared.:weep:

To add to this anxiety, I went to my psychologist who has thrown a spanner in the works. He said loads of stuff about me having suppressed anger and self doubt, then it was dead odd, cos he was saying that I have all these conflicting emotions running around. "It has a name apparently" he said. When I asked what, he grinned and said "bipolar...didn't you know?" but he was being really sarcastic. He knows I have had massive doubts, he has listened to them all and I have only just let myself come to an acceptance and then he throws in this big bit of uncertainty. I feel pulled apart and am now doubting the diagnoses again. I wish he hadn't done that. It is so unfair.:lac:

I am not reading too much into this, I know I am not. He did it deliberately to make me think. Earlier in the appointment I had said to him that my psychiatrist tries to suffocate my bad feelings and he, the psychologist, tries to make me face up to them! That is what he was doing...he was making me go back to that doubt and question things again. He reckons I ended up in hospital, not because I was in a dangerous state....but because I was angry!!

I am in pieces!

Happyone
xx

Piglet

03-09-08, 23:12

The following is mainly rhetorical ok! :hugs:

Mmmm - why does he do that!

What's the difference then between a person with bipolar and a person who has had a lot of stuff go on in the past that has messed with their heads and is now coming out. Is it just our ability to deal with it that would make a person bipolar or not?

If I had had the stuff that you've told us about ages ago go on in my past and naturally not been able to deal with it when I was younger, would I be bipolar too.

Is bipolar a chemical imbalance, or a reaction to traumatic events experienced, or even a mixture of the two????

Do supressed/conflicting emotions to events from the past lead to bipolar then!

I think he needs to express himself with less ambiguity (sp) actually and state straightforwardly what singles out the condition bipolar from other depression/anxiety conditions (supressed or otherwise) :shades:

It's hard when the goal posts keep moving hun isn't it - but tell him how the conversation has made you feel and see where you go from that!!

Love Piglet :flowers:

happyone

04-09-08, 07:49

Thanks Piglet hun:hugs:

You have articulated what I think I should say!

I am in different minds as to what I think he was up to. One part of me thinks he was trying to annoy me...make me angry, as he is a safe person to be angry at.
Another part thinks he really wants me to pursue the questioning of my diagnoses as he really encouraged me to do that before. I don't think he was ever comfortable about my acceptance.
Lastly, I think he was maybe just trying to throw light on what had otherwise been a heavy session.

What's the difference then between a person with bipolar and a person who has had a lot of stuff go on in the past that has messed with their heads and is now coming out. Is it just our ability to deal with it that would make a person bipolar or not?
I wonder this too. I know a lot of people who have bipolar. A huge amount of them have had traumatic childhoods. I don't actually know of any who have said they haven't. That is not to say there isn't people who haven't....just that they haven't said to me that they haven't. I don't know if this means that trauma causes it or not. It is supposed to be chemical but I don't know if trauma can create a chemical imbalance:shrug:
I suppose when people are depressed for no apparent reason, chemicals can help even up the mood. Yet when people are depressed for a reason...say loss of some kind...chemicals can still help. So unhappiness must alter the chemistry somehow.

Do supressed/conflicting emotions to events from the past lead to bipolar then!
I have spoken to one other person who has BP at length while we were in hospital together. She would definately say that is what has happened to her. I also know people with post traumatic stress disorder and that could be said for them too.
I am going to tell him how he has made me feel and ask why he said what he did. In the meantime, I am going to pose these questions to my bipolar forum!

Happyone
xx

Piglet

04-09-08, 12:36

I will be genuinely interested to hear your findings on this because at the moment the knowledge I have on it is as clear as mud. :huh:

There must be guidelines and symptoms that differentiate all the different conditions ie; we know the difference between anxiety and depression symtom wise (and we certainly know supressed emotions can lead to depression) we also know though that anxiety and depression tend to be two sides of the same coin. :shades:

Perhaps with mental health the lines can get really blurred because quite a few of us might have one prodominant feature mixed in with a few smaller ones eg; me with anxiety and that anxiety can have little touches of OCD (checking the back door a million bloody times) and a small spoonful of depression now and again, and then a massive dollop of panic too to add into the mix. :wacko:

Now is this a reaction to stressful life events, or some sort of chemical thing that would still have happened even if life had just been one big ball of fabulousness???

Answers on a postcard please! :yesyes:

Love Piglet :flowers:

happyone

04-09-08, 18:52

well,
I have done a bit of research. I had a survey of my bipolar buddies from the bipolar forum I use. The general idea is that some folk for them think it is an inherited genetic condition, other think theirs is caused by early head trauma, others a chemical imbalance, others by traumatic pasts and some of these and others think it is a combination of these.
Research seems to back up this inconsistency. Researchers also think there can be different causes or a combination of a few.
A lot of research seems to suggest that bipolar is 'triggered' by something. So say a person who has a disposition to a mood disorder/depression, maybe due to genetics as do I as my father had anxiety depression (I think he was possibly bipolar judging by his mood swings, depression, high creativity...) that life events, or 'stressors' can trigger off, both the illness and episodes in people.
If that was the case, then it explains why I had bouts of depression from age 12. It also explains why I was free of any sort of mental illness from the age of 22-26 as I had no traumatic life events, it was the most secure time of my life.
What makes it bipolar as opposed to anxiety depression? Anger! According to my shrink. My rages lasting several days that have promted me to do dangerous stuff, like drive round the country, sleep in my car, try to get to Cape Wrath in January. Yet, my psychologist reckons I am expressing anger that has been pent up for many a year:shrug: However, I cannot deny the other aspects of bipolar that I have, such as racing thoughts, inability to sleep for the thoughts driving me crazy, dangerous behaviour and severe and marked mood changes. I also cannot deny that the medication for people with bipolar makes me feel better.
So, to conclude (thank god says the readers!) my shrink and my psychologist are right. I think:shrug: ! I have a genetic disposition to a depressive illness, possibly bipolar...I have had early trauma and I have had trauma later in life to trigger off the illness. This keeps the shrink secure in his diagnoses!
I also have unresolved and pent up anger that causes me to behave in a particular way but this has also triggered off the illness. I think:shrug: !!
So, there is no easy. one definite cause or reason.
This is all as clear as mud eh? LOL
I am still going to ask psychologist why he said what he did!
Happyone
xx

happyone

04-09-08, 19:36

Now is this a reaction to stressful life events, or some sort of chemical thing that would still have happened even if life had just been one big ball of fabulousness???
I think the answer is, it might have, it might not! Mental illness strikes those who reckon they have had a great life. However, I think for most....possibly all...people have something that triggers the illness. No one gets through life unscathed by the stresses that life has to bring. One study I read suggested that something that is a major trauma to one, might be someone elses walk in the park! Childbirth for example.
For me, this illness, or rather, this bout of illness was triggered by taking on a job that demanded more than I could give and then feeling unappreciated for the work that I did. The tin lid if you like was a dreadful interview where my senior manager was excetionally rude to me. That wasn't the cause as the cracks were already there in force, this was just the straw. I don't think if that hadn't happened I would not have got ill, I think something else would have happened to create the same effect.
I think it was initially triggered by my brothers death. Again, not this alone. This was the straw (bloody big heavy straw!) It is from then I can chart back my various depressions and bizarre behaviour from age 12-21. Each time increasing in intensity. Then a break for 5 years.Remission if you like! Then on off depressions and increasingly bizarre behaviours from age 27 until now.
Maybe I am due another remission eh?
Happyone
xx

Piglet

05-09-08, 19:13

So to sum up am I right in thinking from your findings that anger is the extra component in the difference between bipolar and anxiety/depression?

So much of what you found and wrote makes perfect sense - while I didn't have a traumatic childhood (other than the usual normal good and bad experiences) I did have a parent who had anxiety (took valium for 30 years)and I think I have inherited this (the tendency - not the valium), so that when numerous amount of stressers happened in my life all at the same time ie; my divorce etc this was the trigger to something I was already predisposed to anyway!!

You know mate recently (having had a somewhat pooh time with anxiety again) I have truly begun to accept that this is part of my particular journey and I'm finding I'm beginning not to mind so much.:ohmy: :yesyes:

When you feel able I want to suggest a book to you called 'Making a change for good' by Cheri Huber. Have a little peek on Amazon cos its one of those books you can have a look inside of. It's written using a handwritten font and is an incredibly accessible view on living in the moment and accepting things as they are.

It has some good suggestions for things to try, one is journalling (abit like that site you recommended to me about mandalas for relaxation) and it has a 30 day awareness plan at the back of the book, which I am starting as soon as my ordered journal arrives. It's not really a cognitive behavioural book its more about the Zen of life but easy to grasp the concept of (unlike some high brow new agey books).

Love Piglet :flowers:

milly jones

05-09-08, 19:17

hey pigs that book sounds good, ill take a look

ty mill xxxx

Southern_Belle

05-09-08, 19:32

Hi HappyOne,

Does it really matter regarding the diagnosis? Would it change your medications that much? My reason for asking is it seems an awful log of energy seems involved in whether or not you are bi-polar or not. Unless it would determine your benefits, medication or whether you can work or not, I can't see why it matters so much.

As for something that finally makes the little cracks break you can relate that to many things. I for one was working in a brand new building that had mold growing on the walls. My house was on a lake and we had mold in our a/c system. We did not know at the time that our home had mold in it but I did know about the new building at work, they just closed the conference room that had green muck growing on the walls. Of course, they ignored the fact that the spores were being blown throughout the entire building due to the a/c system. The most important fact that no-one knew at the time was that I was highly allergic to mold. The beginning of the end of my immune system and a physically healthy Laura. All these little factors came to play to make a huge impact on my life. The same could be said for you.

I too do not know the criteria to diagnosis bi-polar vs. depression. I think you have every right to be angry and would hope they allow you to express it in a safe environment. I would think it would help. I also agree that he needs to be more straightforward and not play any head games at this point or maybe I just misunderstood. When your hubby does go back to work, maybe your Mother can come help out. I do hope you have a good evening.

By the way, I got more shots from the Ortho and can walk a bit better. Now that two Hurricanes are headed towards us the weather is acting up so it doesn't help at all.

Take care & hugs,

Laura

Southern_Belle

05-09-08, 19:42

Thought I would add one bit since reading Piglets' insightful post. I think I must have been born with anxiety because it is all I remember. I was an induced premie born two months early so that might be traumatic but who remembers that? Nothing that I can recall (nor my parents) caused or brought it on. I had an extremely happy normal childhood and none of my siblings suffer with anxiety. The only time I can honestly say I probably ever had depression was when my Grandmother died but I think that was grief. I will say I did go on meds for the anxiety after my second child turned 3 just because he was so high maintenace and I do say this with love but it is a fact. I can't imagine a life without any anxiety because I have never experienced it, even on the meds.

happyone

05-09-08, 20:29

Hi,
yes Piglet, my anger was the deciding factor for my shrink to say I had bipolar. I do have to say it was an exceptional anger that lasted for days. I was screaming down my mobile to him in the middle of Asda, to do something about it:blush: I then went on one of my mad escapades. However, while anger was the deciding factor, there have been things since then such as paranoia and extreme elation. Another main deciding factor is my racing thoughts. Without one of my meds, I can literally 'think' for days. I can get a thought in my head and it becomes all consuming. I do not sleep for thinking about it, I drive for miles and miles in my car so I can talk to myself, I get up when everyone is asleep and talk to myself. I can do this for days on end and definately the only thing that stops it is my medication.

You know mate recently (having had a somewhat pooh time with anxiety again) I have truly begun to accept that this is part of my particular journey and I'm finding I'm beginning not to mind so much
I understand that Hun. When I was diagnosed originally with anxiety depression, my CBT woman told me that I would possibly always be anxious but I would need to learn how to work with it. I was devastated. However, when I took this on board, I strangely found it easier to deal with. I wasn't giving myself as much of a hard time any more. For me though, I later found out that a large amount of my anxiety is attributed to being a 'mood swing'. This makes sense as I can at times be absolutely terrified to go out the front door, yet at other times this fear seems completely alien to me. During the summer when I was ill, I begged the doctor for valium. She really did not want to give it to me but I honestly pleaded. To think now, that I was so anxious then, seems a lifetime away:wacko:
The book sounds great and I shall go and give it a look:)

Laura

Does it really matter regarding the diagnosis? I have been asking myself this. I have been struggling to make sense of why I found what my psychologist said to me so difficult. The conclusion I came to is that he made me feel ashamed. I have sat with him so often and gone on and on about not having bipolar and I know he agreed with me on the basis of what I told him. He encouraged me to get a second opinion from a shrink who is known not to be scared of disagreeing with another docs diagnoses, which I wouldn't do.
After my two recent stays in hospital, I decided that I need to accept the diagnoses of bipolar and work with my shrink, rather than against him. I came to the conclusion that if the meds help, which they do, then I need to accept them too. A part of me still thinks that my shrink has it wrong but he is never ever going to change his mind and the meds help me, so I should just get on with life with as much ease as possible.
When my psychologist made that comment, I felt bad and wrong for all this acceptance. I felt like somehow I had let him down by not continuing to fight with my shrink. Earlier in the appointment I had made the comment to my psychologist
"my shrink tries to smother my bad feelings, you try to make me face them?"
He replied
"which would you rather have?" and then reminded me of a comment I had made early on in the therapy where I had said I didn't know if I wanted to face my demons, or try to put them away out of mind. He gave me the impression he was making me choose. He made me feel like he was saying I couldn't do both at the same time.

I also agree that he needs to be more straightforward and not play any head games at this point or maybe I just misunderstood.I don't think you have misunderstood. He is a psychologist and as such has to take responsibilty for the impact his words have on people. I don't believe he said it as a throwaway comment. He did it to make me think. I even suspect that I may be a pawn for a personal grievance he has against my shrink. I am not being paranoid, honest. I just think with all the stuff he has said to me before, I suspect he doesn't think a great deal of my shrink. It suited him to have a patient who was mouthing off about the shrink but it is not so comfortable having a patient who actually likes this shrink!
I am going to tell him when I see him just how I felt. It is nice and safe to be angry with him so I will let loose my anger!:ohmy:

Like yourself Laura, I can remember anxiety back to childhood. I lost my hair before starting school as I was so excited/anxious about it. Most of my anxiety was around them drinking though. Anxious that they wouldn't start, anxious that they would stop, anxious that my friends would see or hear them, so many things that I was anxious about when they were drinking. It makes me want to cry remembering it so I will shut up!

My hubby is off work until Thursday. I am hoping I will be fine. If not, I will get my mum over.

That is wild about the mould! Did you ever tackle your employers about it? It is so unfair you have all this illness cos of that.

I am glad the shots helped a bit. Are you in a a part of states that gets a lot of hurricanes? I know you have told me before but I can't remember. Is one of the hurricanes heading for you the one that hit New Orleans? Apparently in UK, we get about 30 a year but they don't generally cause much more than high winds and maybe a few roof tiles. We have had a couple that have done a bit more damage. there was a picture in my local newspaper that someone had taken of a twister on one of the western isles. The photograph was clear enough but the met office said they didn't have one!

I am rabbiting I know!

Hope you have a nice weekend and the weather doesn't get too extreme.:hugs:
Happyone
xxx

milly jones

05-09-08, 20:45

u rabbit away hun, 'enjoy' reading ur thread

take care

mill xx

Southern_Belle

05-09-08, 20:52

Hmm doesn't sound right you being caught between the two of them. At least you do feel safe enough to show your true feelings and I am glad for that so go for it and show your anger, he deserves it! I'm sorry you had such a rough time of it growing up and it makes you sad to think about it. When I remember my youth and the anxious times it always involved vacations in mountains and going over bridges and such. I can remember my parents pleading with me that it would be safe and looking back I now realize how much patience they had with me. More often than not Dad would finally scoop me up and we would go on the chair lift or wherever we needed to be and I would be fine. I just could never figure out why they could not leave me and go on which of course they could not do. Why only I have this anxiety and no one else does I don't know. I do think my Dad's mother had it and she also had the other health problems that I also suffer with too.

Yes, I moved from Florida to the next state in America that gets all the hurricanes, lol. I just can't get away from them! No I'm not in New Orleans nor even on the coast but for some reason we always get bad weather when they hit the U.S.

I never sued the hospital I worked for mainly because I was too ill. I just didn't have the fight in me and honestly had no idea the longevity the ill effects would have on me. If only I knew back then what I know now!

I hope you have a great weekend. I'm supposed to go away on Sunday with hubby on a short vacation thru Wednesday to some island if the weather permits. Not quite sure I want to right now as storms are brewing, as usual my head is spinning with anxious thoughts...

Laura xxx

ElizabethJane

05-09-08, 22:27

Happyone I have read your posts with interest. After my last serious depressive episode my then new psychiatrist was asking me questions about my impulsive behaviour and racing thoughts. I know that he was trying to 'fit' a diagnosis of bi-polar on me. I'm just not sure for me that is. I exhibit some charateristics but not others have spectacular lows but what about equally spectacular highs? I do well on a mood stabiliser lithium which I have been on for over ten years as well as other meds. I wish you well happyone and that you deserve>

happyone

06-09-08, 08:46

u rabbit away hun, 'enjoy' reading ur thread
Thanks Milly. I missed that post last night!

Elizabeth Jane, firstly I have to say I love your avater! I want to go and walk into it!
You are not the first person I know that has been treated for depression with lithium, successfully too. My shrink has always hung back on this. I am not sure if it is due to my early reluctance or he doesn't think I am safe with it.
In my opinion, if your medicine is helping you, don't worry about getting a diagnoses. I have found it to be detrimental in as much as I have lost my driving license due to instability and non compliance with medical advice.
With regards to your symptoms that the doc was seeing if you 'fit' bipolar. My pdoc believes that bipolar is on a spectrum. You may have some but not all of the symptoms. It is a myth that people with BP all get spectacular highs. Some just get a time of feeling better. I have had anger and racing thoughts but only had one spectacular high and it only lasted 1/2 a day. This was after stopping meds though.
There is also unipolar where the problem is depression.
As I say though, try not to get caught in the diagnoses thing. If your meds are helping you, then let them. If they stop working, or you feel worse, maybe that is the time to seek a concrete diagnoses.

Happyone
xx

happyone

06-09-08, 08:57

I hope you have a great weekend. I'm supposed to go away on Sunday with hubby on a short vacation thru Wednesday to some island if the weather permits. Not quite sure I want to right now as storms are brewing, as usual my head is spinning with anxious thoughts...Laura, I hope you go hun. You told me about it and I am looking forward to you coming back and tellling me all about it! Go on...make me green with envy!

I understand what you are saying about not fighting your employers. I feel kind of the same just now. I feel a possible fight brewing and I don't feel in the slightest bit comfortable with this thought. Or brave enough. However, money really is a factor so if it comes to it, I will have to fight them.

It sounds tough being so anx as a child but your dad sounds lovely, scooping you up. I was in the school playground yesterday and joined in a conversation with a couple of the other mums. One was saying that her little girl who is in her second year of primary has been crying her eyes out every morning, whereas her younger sister who is in the first year, is fine about going into school. It is really common for the second year children to cry and often there are more of them crying than the younger ones. However, this mother had no compassion at all and was just getting angry at her daughter, comparing her to the young one, threatening to withdraw treats if she didn't stop crying, telling us other mums in earshot of the girl that it was a load of nonsense. I really felt for that little girl.

Anyway, got to go!

Happyone
xx

Piglet

06-09-08, 10:45

hey pigs that book sounds good, ill take a look

ty mill xxxx

Snort! :roflmao:

Elizabeth Jane I too love your avatar! :)

I've found all our conversation to be interesting and thought provoking. For sure mental health has many many blurred lines because it's base has so many options

1. Your individual genetic/generic makeup - inherited or aquired (learned behaviour from those around us while we were growing up.

2. Your life experiences - covering a massive array of possibles here from physical shocks to the system to all the little (and obviously the big) shocks that get stored up etc!

This then leads on to again another massive amount of variables in our mental health and physical health symptoms - we only need to see the subjects covered on this site on the information pages to see that symptoms come in many forms don't we!

And again these are all a matter of degree arn't they as which symptoms will form your particular cocktail!

My cocktail is an extremely generous dose of anxiety with a measure of panic and a splash each of OCD and health anxiety which I sip through a straw regularly!:blush:

Love Piglet :flowers:

happyone

06-09-08, 15:07

Glad you are enjoying the topic cos I am still in rabbiting mode!

I've found all our conversation to be interesting and thought provoking. For sure mental health has many many blurred lines because it's base has so many options
I find this really frustrating as I feel I am boxed in from all corners.
Say for example, I tell my shrink "I am not bipolar" I am told that it is really common for people with bipolar, or any mental illness to deny their illness.
I tell my shrink I don't want to take meds anymore cos I really think I don't need them. He tells me that it is common for people with bipolar to think this.
I tell my shrink that I feel my problems come from within me and with the right amount of therapy and willpower I could get over my present troubles. He tells me....you've guessed it...it is common for people with bipolar to think like this.!!!
So, I am in a no win situation. This is part of the reason I gave up fighting. There is also the symptoms I have that are undeniable but the fact is, my shrink is never ever ever going to change his mind. He has told me so.

My cocktail is an extremely generous dose of anxiety with a measure of panic and a splash each of OCD and health anxiety which I sip through a straw regularly!:blush: Well....my cocktail is a large quantity of depression, mixed with a little elation, a big amount of racing thoughts, splash of paranoia and a genrous drop of stability.

lets celebrate with our cocktails!

http://images.replacements.com/images/images5/china/W/wedgwood_grand_gourmet_cheers_canape_plate_P000014 3187S0012T2.jpg

Happyone
xx

Pink Panic

06-09-08, 15:35

Hello Happy and everyone else on the thread,

I just wanted to say that i have found this thread totally thought provoking.
I myself am still struggling to accept a diagnosis of bi polar which i discussed with Happy recently via PM.
I tell my Psych exactly the same things as you do re the diagnosis, the meds, etc., etc., .... I'm seeing him again in a couple of weeks and i'm still hoping that he's going to say he's made a mistake !!!

Love & Light to all.

Pink
xxx

happyone

06-09-08, 16:17

Pink,
I have fought so much with my pdoc and myself over the past 20 months. I have argued black was white with my pdoc. I have been downright rude to him, challenging him on his ability to diagnose, been scornful of him and asking him how many mistakes he had made in his career, I have stomped out of his consultation room....the list is endless.
I was advised on two other forums that I would find peace once I had accepted the diagnoses. I cannot say I am 100% there but I cannot deny that I have a mood disorder of some kind. If that places me on the bipolar spectrum, then so be it.
If I was fortunate enough to have several years of stability on meds, then came off them and was still stable, I might challenge the diagnoses again. I might if that was the case, say that I think that this period in my life was one of mental turmoil and not indeed bipolar.
BUT.....I would only do that if I had reached mental stability for a long time, both on and then off meds.
Good luck with your journey hun.:hugs:
Happyone
xx

Pink Panic

06-09-08, 16:22

Thanks Happy :hugs:

All the best to you too. You are a very wise woman.

Piglet

06-09-08, 17:05

I think Laura made a good point about does it really matter what the diagnosis is if the medication is working and you're feeling better. Obviously if you went into the surgery with a sore throat you wouldn't expect to come out being bipolar but if you have most of the symptoms of bipolar condition its not too surprising if that becomes the starting point for treatment.

It the same with me accepting 'anxiety' or someone accepting 'clinical depression' or OCD as their diagnosis. The bottom line is whatever we've each got we'd rather like to feel better and by that token we are looking into to allsorts of ways in how to do just that.

It also means that finally we are listening to our innerselves at last and making changes. It takes a long time for all our issues to build up and so it takes a long time to get back on an even keel.

I think unless you truly felt by being diagnosed bipolar you were being given the wrong treatment I would just go with it for the moment. All I would add is I'm not sure how helpful it is for you to be seeing two different people that don't seem to agree with each other. They should be consistent in their views or how the hell are you supposed to feel.

Do they confer with each other at all over your treatment??

Love Piglet :flowers:

happyone

06-09-08, 17:32

Obviously if you went into the surgery with a sore throat you wouldn't expect to come out being bipolar
Oh boy, did that make me laugh!
I agree. I have to accept the fact that mood stabilising drug treatment helps me. So, I have to go with the diagnoses.

All I would add is I'm not sure how helpful it is for you to be seeing two different people that don't seem to agree with each other. They should be consistent in their views or how the hell are you supposed to feel.
I agree again! However, I cannot give either of them up! I get very attatched to all of my care givers and the thought of losing one of them is just too hard. I did feel as though I was being given a choice, "his treatment or mine" which is totally crazy! However, I do know that other therapists have done similar with their patients.
I copied this from a site comparing psychologists and psychiatrists

Psychological distress is usually deemed to be social in origin and therefore able to be changed. Psychologists CANNOT prescribe medication as they are not medically qualified. Their treatments are based on changing behaviour without medication.

I think this is the crux of the matter.

As a result, most Psychiatrists adopt the 'disease' model, emphasising the biological origins of psychological distress.Psychiatrists CAN prescribe medication and are specifically trained for mental health problems.

It does seem as though they are at opposite poles......ha! You would think that would be good for a bipolar eh! LOL!
So, it figures that my psychologist may be a bit put out at my acceptance to accept my illness and the medications that go along with that. He may feel strongly that I cannot be getting treated for a social and biological problem. It is one or the other:shrug:
I sensed a couple of weeks ago that my sessions may be coming to an end. It may be because he feels he can't do that much more for me. If I am correct, I will not be seeing him that much longer anyway.
Conversely, my psychiatrist is more than happy for me to be seeing both. He says that I have a depressive disorder that needs to be treated chemically but I may also be 'unhappy' too which he says is different from depression. In this he says therapy is the tool to be utilised.
Sooooooooooo, whilst I agree it is maybe not the best recipe to be seeing both of them, I cannot give one of them up.
Happyone
xx

milly jones

06-09-08, 20:13

hunny u just keep doing whats best for u

the decision to take meds is not an easy one

i just got to a point where i couldnt and wasnt prepared to exist the way i was feeling

i felt i needed to give meds a shot

if only they could find the right combination lol

dont really care what my condition is called as long as i can live again

take care all

milly xxx

Pink Panic

06-09-08, 20:55

[quote=Piglet;383339]I think Laura made a good point about does it really matter what the diagnosis is if the medication is working and you're feeling better. Obviously if you went into the surgery with a sore throat you wouldn't expect to come out being bipolar but if you have most of the symptoms of bipolar condition its not too surprising if that becomes the starting point for treatment.

When i was diagnosed i was mortified. I was terrified to tell anyone even my closest family, even typing about it on here gives me an uneasy feeling and none of you actually know who i really am. The reason being that everything that i had seen regarding bipolar whether on tv or in magazines etc., depicted people who were out of control or grossly erratic .... take Britney and the head shaving incident for one !!
I totally do not believe that i could or would ever be like that!
Bi Polar is generally depicted in a bad way where people are thought of as freaks and i certainly didn't want anyone thinking that way about me !
I know my reaction is very common and i have to accept my diagnosis but in short yes Laura it matters a hell of a lot to me !!!!

happyone

06-09-08, 22:01

I think Pink hun, that the 'does it matter' comment was directed at me. I have been on and off this forum for 2 years and people have seen me at my worst and my best. People have got to know me really well and know that when I am on medication, I am far more stable than without. People have observed me stopping my meds, having the dilemma "am I, am I not???" and people who have come to know me really quite well, whom I have become friends with, have worried about me when I am ill, when I am at rock bottom and when my life has been taking a scary turn. Friends on here just want me to be better and from observation, they know that when I am not accepting my illness and prescribed medications, that I become ill.
At least twice,if not more, I have stopped my meds and ended up in a really scary place. I have certainly been unstable a few times more than twice. This has been scary for people to watch and whilst I have been careful to not mention the suicide word (this is probably the first time I have said it) people have known where my head is from reading between the lines. There is also all the other times when I have been driving round the country like a possessed woman. That has been an awful place for people to have been in, to observe but be unable to do anything. Well...people gave their support on here, by e mail, by text, by phone calls, for which I am eternally grateful.
So, from my point of view, I understand the question put to me "does it matter?" cos for me, whether I am BP or not, the meds do help me. They stop me wanting to drive round the country to get to some crazy destination, they stop me having fanciful ideas about angels and demons living inside me and they stop me, most importantly, feeling suicidal. My friends on here knew that, probably long before I accepted it. So, for me, it doesn't matter whether I am BP or not, as long as the medication helps me.

Pink hun, you are 20 months behind me in your journey and please don't think I patronise you when I say, 20 months ago....10 months ago....actually as little as 3 months ago...to me it mattered a great deal. To me, correct diagnoses was everything. Not only correct, but an overturn of the BP diagnoses. I have fought like an alley cat to not have this. It is s***e, I hate it, I wish I didn't have it, or I wish I didn't have whatever it is that makes me behave as I do when not stable. But I do. I have a mental illness. Whether or not it is BP has become less important to me. All I know is, I get ill, my moods are all over the place, at times I feel and behave positively crazy but meds help with all of this and give me a semblance of normality.

I have to accept where I am at the mo, as anything else is too scary.

With regards to Britney and all the other stars. Well...it is little comfort (or to me anyway!) but we have a 'fashionable' illness. I don't believe all the stars who have it, do. I think it has been used as a cover for drug and alcohol problems. I do think there are stars who have it, but not all the ones who are reported to.
There is also the 'extreme' element. Before I had my diagnoses, my only experience of bipolar was a friend of the family who was....unbelievable! He is on some sort of section thing, whereby he can be pulled into hospital at the drop of a hat. His behaviours are REALLY bizarre. I am positively calm next to him. The only other experience I had was knowing of someone, not actually knowing them, who comitted suicide (I said it again) so telling my family was really hard. It was hard for me too as I could not identify with these people.

My shrink like to look on BP as on a spectrum. Within that spectrum you will have some aspects go to the end of the scale but others that sit just slightly off centre. Not everyone with BP has huge extremes.

I am not sure if I have told you already, but I use a bipolar forum which has helped me immensely. If I haven't told you, pm me and I will give you the link.

I know how hard it is hunny, I really do. You know where I am, you can pm me any time, I come in here at least once a day.:hugs:

Happyone
xx

Piglet

06-09-08, 22:24

It does seem as though they are at opposite poles......ha! You would think that would be good for a bipolar eh! LOL!

ROFL :roflmao:

He says that I have a depressive disorder that needs to be treated chemically but I may also be 'unhappy' too which he says is different from depression.
Sooooooooooo, whilst I agree it is maybe not the best recipe to be seeing both of them, I cannot give one of them up.
Happyone
xx

Yep that's abit like me with Pringles and Kettle chips!! I like both but I need Pringles for medicinal purposes and the Kettle chips for less intense cravings! Course next time you see either of them you will be visualising one as a tube and one as navy blue packet!!

Pink hun I used to feel just like that about anxiety - I really really wanted it to be my thyroid! :blush: Anyway now we know Stephen Fry has bipolar you are in extremely good company!:yesyes:

Love Piglet

milly jones

06-09-08, 22:24

what a lovely post happyone

we are so lucky on nmp

hugs to all

xxxxxx

milly jones

06-09-08, 22:25

pigs u snuk in before me lol

happyone

07-09-08, 10:02

Yep that's abit like me with Pringles and Kettle chips!! I like both but I need Pringles for medicinal purposes and the Kettle chips for less intense cravings! Course next time you see either of them you will be visualising one as a tube and one as navy blue packet!!LOL!
Not only will I think of this...I will probably tell them! I am picturing my shrink as a prigle tube with arms legs and head sticking out and my psychologist as a big scrunchy crisp packet!
This has real potential to see me giggling my little head off during appointments!
Happyone
xx

happyone

07-09-08, 14:10

A very crude representation of how I will see my shrink and psychologist
787

788

Happyone
xx

Piglet

07-09-08, 16:41

OMG now that made me crack up and youngest piglet is giving me well weird looks (that is sooooo how I saw them in my head)!!!:roflmao:

Your therapists are gonna bann you from contact with me after this lol and suggest that maybe I should have an appt with them too!!!

I think my CBT lady thought I was a bit of case aswell as her mouth often twitched!! :yesyes:

Love Piglet :flowers:

Karen

07-09-08, 17:54

Some great posts on this thread!

I trust and have complete faith in my CBT therapist even though she's described herself and her ideas as 'wacky' and 'way out there' at times! What she really means is that she takes an eclectic approach to therapy, which is good.

Going back to what was being discussed a couple of pages ago, I haven't really had the conflicts with mental health official about my various diagnoses, but I frequently have with psychiatrists over how it affects me. I know I have anorexia but not everything is my life is caused by 'anorexic thinking'. Sometimes it's like banging my head against a brick wall as they never listen.

Karen x

happyone

07-09-08, 20:26

Your therapists are gonna bann you from contact with me after this lol and suggest that maybe I should have an appt with them too!!!
Many a true word spoken in jest.........:D

I trust and have complete faith in my CBT therapist even though she's described herself and her ideas as 'wacky' and 'way out there' at times! What she really means is that she takes an eclectic approach to therapy, which is good.You have done this before Karen....used a word I didn't know the meaning of! Eclectic....give me a mo...I am looking it up!....right...I got it!

I haven't really had the conflicts with mental health official about my various diagnoses, but I frequently have with psychiatrists over how it affects me. I know I have anorexia but not everything is my life is caused by 'anorexic thinking'. Sometimes it's like banging my head against a brick wall as they never listen.
I don't get this so much but I use another forum for bipolar. A few people using it have borderline personality disorder and some have received horrific treatment as it is assumed that everything they do and say is down to the disorder (BDP) I know of people who have said they felt suicidal and it has been put down as manipulation, blackmail. It is though any emotion they express, professionals have dismissed it purely because they have BDP. I don't know a great deal about BDP, but it upsets me when I see someone writing about the horrific time they have had, purely because of their diagnosed illness. Thankfully my pdoc doesn't believe in it, as often when a patient kicks up a fuss about their diagnoses of bipolar, the diagnoses is changed to BDP:mad: I imagine this must be similar to anorexia, where all your difficulties are put down to that?
happyone
xx