PAS is a form of PTSD...

[ThreeBee23]

I volunteer at a Pregnancy Resource Center in my town and have worked there for 4 years now (volunteer 1 time a week for 3 hours).

PAS is a form of PTSD. (Read more below.)

I don’t think women realize that there is help if they have ever had an abortion in their past. Most Pregnancy Resource Centers (or Crisis Pregnancy Center, same thing, different names) offer a post-abortion ministry.

1 out of 4 women will experience at least 1 abortion in their lifetime.

Some of the symptoms of Post Abortion Syndrome are sadness, long-term grief and anger, flashbacks, guilt, depression, anniversary reactions, suicidal thoughts, sleep problems, increased substance abuse, and difficulty maintaining relationships. A good information web site for PAS. (http://www.afterabortion.com/pass_details.html)

There is hope for healing from a past abortion. I just attended a Care Net conference in Atlanta and realized how far reaching globaly this issue is. http://www.careconfidential.com/Centres.aspx Here is a great site for finding a Pregnancy Resource Centre in the British Isles.

Here is one if you are in the US. http://www.pregnancycenters.org/

Also, you may PM me for more information or if you have a general question feel free to post here.

I just wanted you all to know.

[Lynnann]

[quote=ThreeBee23;409302]I volunteer at a Pregnancy Resource Center in my town and have worked there for 4 years now (volunteer 1 time a week for 3 hours).

PTSD is a form of PAS. quote]

I am a little confused by your comment are you trying to tell us that all sufferers of PTSD are in fact suffering from Post Abortion Stress Syndrome?

I am sure a few of our male PTSD sufferers will be a little astonished. I also had a look at the website that you linked to your post and if I can quote from that site?

"What is PASS?
PASS is an acronym for Post Abortion Stress Syndrome. PASS is an unofficial name, because it is not officially recognized by the medical community yet. Some sections believe in PASS, others do not. Until enough studies have been done to confirm it's 'existence', the syndrome is still 'unofficial'. This does not mean it does not exist! For more details on PASS, and why it's not "officially recognized" yet."

While I applaud your efforts in trying to reach out to people who are suffering from the effects of the decisions they have made it is incomprehensable to me the statements that you are making as they seem to be in conflict with the resources that you are recomending.

Lynnann

[mila]

ThreeBee just said it is a form of PTSD, and if u take ab to be traumatic experience i don't see confusion with PASS... Anyway, she was reaching out to those who experienced it and they would know what it feels liken and don't need anyone to confirm the existence of the syndrome officially.

[Lynnann]

Hi Millie,

If you read Threebee's post it states PTSD is a form of PAS not the other way round. That was the point, if you are going to make a statement then you need to make sure it is correct. I realised she was reaching out in fact I applauded her efforts.

While I realise an abortion is a traumatic experience it is a choice; a choice I believe should be available but a choice non the less. It is not an unexpected event counselling is available before and afterwards and although I believe there is the possibilty of PASS I don't believe it is the same as PTSD and neither do the medical community.

There is so little understanding of PTSD as it is and I don't think it helps when comments are made that would make people think that everyone who has PTSD has had an abortion.

Lynnann

[kittyk]

I agree Lynnann....I found the link made confusing to say the least. PTSD seems an unusual "anxiety" and is usually linked to an event that someone has no control over. I am trying to understand the condition but can equally understand that abortion may create feelings of depression.

[ThreeBee23]

I was stating that PASS is a FORM of PTSD and is a possibility as to why a woman may be suffering from this. Obviously PASS does not affect all people, but it CAN affect men who have been involved in this decision or one who had no say in this decision.

Don't brush it off lightly. Anyone suffering from PASS knows it is very real just as anyone suffering from PTSD knows it is very real.

I was just putting it out there for anyone who may benefit from having the information.

[Lynnann]

Hi Threebee,

If you would like to reread your first post on this thread, not the title but the thread second paragraph, you will find that you state that,

"PTSD is a form of PAS (Read more below)"

While I realise there are differences between American Grammer and English Grammer I don't think they are that different!

I haven't brushed off PAS in any way in fact I applauded your efforts in trying to reach out to those suffering from the after affects of abortion.

I still and always will believe that PTSD and PAS are completely different things, again abortion is a choice, it is not an unexpected event. There are consent forms to be signed beforehand. After all we are not talking about miscarriages or stillbirths, which is an horrific and unaticipated event.

This is not an event that there is no control over, while I realise there is a certain amount of horror to the men that have not been involved in the decision making process it does not equate to the experiences that PTSD sufferers have experienced.

I do not diminish in any way the after affects that people who have experienced this event have but I firmly believe this is a different disorder and I do not think you should try to pass PAS off as PTSD until it is recognised by the medical community as such. There are a lot of criteria that has to be met before a diagnosis of PTSD is reached and I don't believe that PAS meets that.

Until that time you are doing a diservice to the experiences that PTSD sufferers have endured.

I hope that in the future PAS is given the recognition that it deserves as a disorder in it's own right.

I wish you well in your endevours

Lynnann

[mila]

Lynnann, you say it's a decision, that makes it even harder, do you even have an idea about things that can be involved in you having to make that decision! She made a mistake, switch the things around, and i didn't even notice it, ok, but who decides what is traumatic to a person, medical community? You can't be saying these things, they can be very hurtful to those who have actually been through it. Do you know what it is like to have to make a decision, and live with it forever, when you were almost forced to make that decision?

[kittyk]

There are clearly different aspects to these experiences....the point being made is that PTSD generally is an event that people have no control over whatsoever. The key is the feeling of helplessness, lack of control and someone/something creating a major impact on our feelings and life. There is no choice with PTSD...there is a degree of choice with abortion, devastating though it is...it is a different kettle of fish entirely(in my humble opinion). Being forced to make the decision about an abortion is subjective and any pressure is usually self-made, a weighing up of pros and cons. PTSD derives from a sudden change in circumstances, usually violent and is a normal reaction to an abnormal event. I am not denying there are difficult decisions involved with abortion but there is careful consideration usually....surely consent needs to be obtained before any procedure?

[Lynnann]

Lynnann, you say it's a decision, that makes it even harder, do you even have an idea about things that can be involved in you having to make that decision! She made a mistake, switch the things around, and i didn't even notice it, ok, but who decides what is traumatic to a person, medical community? You can't be saying these things, they can be very hurtful to those who have actually been through it. Do you know what it is like to have to make a decision, and live with it forever, when you were almost forced to make that decision?

Mila,

You seem to be missing the point, if you are going to make a statement like the one Threebee has made then you need to ensure it is accurate, hers wasn’t.

It has taken a long time for PTSD to be recognised and although PASS and PTSD may share some symptoms the root causes are completely different as Kitty has quite accurately explained in her post. There are no forms of PTSD, it either is or it isn’t PTSD.

Again there is so little understanding of PTSD even within the medical community that I don’t think inaccurate statements are helpful.

You say that I am being hurtful, how? I have accepted that PASS can exist as a syndrome in it’s own right and I have also told Threebee that I hope it gets the recognition it deserves. I just believe they are different things.

I have never diminished someone’s experience or reaction to abortion I have said throughout this thread that an abortion is a difficult and traumatic choice. I accept that some people would experience sadness, long-term grief and anger, guilt, depression, anniversary reactions, suicidal thoughts, sleep problems, increased substance abuse, and difficulty maintaining relationships and I am glad that there are support networks in place to help people who are suffering from the after affects of abortion but it still does not make it PTSD.

I personally found your comments very hurtful; you say that because it is a decision that makes it even harder, are you then saying that the child abuse and rape that I endured was easy as I had no choice in the matter? I get to live with someone else’s decision forever. Are you saying that people who have suffered a miscarriage or still birth have an easier time? and Yes I been in the situation of facing the decision over abortion in the in the past so I do know what I am talking about.

Do you know what it is like to live with an experience that you had no control over and no consent? Maybe you might consider what you are saying and how you phrase things before you post as you are unaware of others personal experiences.

Again I applaud Threebee’s efforts in trying to reach out to those suffering, I have never said PASS does not exist I believe it does, it is just something different and if there is to be better understanding of PASS and PTSD she needs to be more accurate.


Lynnann

[ThreeBee23]

PAS is a form of PTSD

Ok, I switched it around. You are correct Lynn in that I had the wording incorrect. PASS is a form of PTSD. My whole point in posting this was not to get into disagreements over words, but to help any woman or man who have suffered through or because of an abortion decision. It can definitely be a traumatic experience for women or men who have experienced it or helped make the decision or who had no say in the decision.

I am genuinely sorry for the confusion. I didn't understand what you were saying until I read your 11-28 post Lynnann.

My heart really goes out to a woman who suffers because of a past abortion regardless if it was her decision or not. This condition is closer to being realized in the medical field for the PTSD that it is. Unfortunately, there is a lot of money, influence and politics involved in the abortion industry and it is slow going to bring to the forefront the trauma many, many women suffer from a past abortion. (Please notice here I did not say ALL women.)

I was just puting it out there so anyone who had this in their past could at least think about whether that choice from so long ago could possibly be affecting them now.

[ThreeBee23]

http://www.afterabortion.org/psychol.html

This portion of this article below is from the above web site.


POST-TRAUMATIC STRESS DISORDER (PTSD or PAS): A major random study found that a minimum of 19% of post- abortion women suffer from diagnosable post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD). Approximately half had many, but not all, symptoms of PTSD, and 20 to 40 percent showed moderate to high levels of stress and avoidance behavior relative to their abortion experiences. (6) Because this is a major disorder which may be present in many plaintiffs, and is not readily understood outside the counseling profession, the following summary is more complete than other entries in this section. PTSD is a psychological dysfunction which results from a traumatic experience which overwhelms a person's normal defense mechanisms resulting in intense fear, feelings of helplessness or being trapped, or loss of control. The risk that an experience will be traumatic is increased when the traumatizing event is perceived as including threats of physical injury, sexual violation, or the witnessing of or participation in a violent death. PTSD results when the traumatic event causes the hyperarousal of "flight or fight" defense mechanisms. This hyperarousal causes these defense mechanisms to become disorganized, disconnected from present circumstances, and take on a life of their own resulting in abnormal behavior and major personality disorders. As an example of this disconnection of mental functions, some PTSD victim may experience intense emotion but without clear memory of the event; others may remember every detail but without emotion; still others may reexperience both the event and the emotions in intrusive and overwhelming flashback experiences. (7)
Women may experience abortion as a traumatic event for several reasons. Many are forced into an unwanted abortions by husbands, boyfriends, parents, or others. If the woman has repeatedly been a victim of domineering abuse, such an unwanted abortion may be perceived as the ultimate violation in a life characterized by abuse. Other women, no matter how compelling the reasons they have for seeking an abortion, may still perceive the termination of their pregnancy as the violent killing of their own child. The fear, anxiety, pain, and guilt associated with the procedure are mixed into this perception of grotesque and violent death. Still other women, report that the pain of abortion, inflicted upon them by a masked stranger invading their body, feels identical to rape. (8) Indeed, researchers have found that women with a history of sexual assault may experience greater distress during and after an abortion exactly because of these associations between the two experiences. (9) When the stressor leading to PTSD is abortion, some clinicians refer to this as Post-Abortion Syndrome (PAS).
The major symptoms of PTSD are generally classified under three categories: hyperarousal, intrusion, and constriction.
Hyperarousal is a characteristic of inappropriately and chronically aroused "fight or flight" defense mechanisms. The person is seemingly on permanent alert for threats of danger. Symptoms of hyperarousal include: exaggerated startle responses, anxiety attacks, irritability, outbursts of anger or rage, aggressive behavior, difficulty concentrating, hypervigilence, difficulty falling asleep or staying asleep, or physiological reactions upon exposure to situations that symbolize or resemble an aspect of the traumatic experience (eg. elevated pulse or sweat during a pelvic exam, or upon hearing a vacuum pump sound.)
Intrusion is the reexperience of the traumatic event at unwanted and unexpected times. Symptoms of intrusion in PAS cases include: recurrent and intrusive thoughts about the abortion or aborted child, flashbacks in which the woman momentarily reexperiences an aspect of the abortion experience, nightmares about the abortion or child, or anniversary reactions of intense grief or depression on the due date of the aborted pregnancy or the anniversary date of the abortion.
Constriction is the numbing of emotional resources, or the development of behavioral patterns, so as to avoid stimuli associated with the trauma. It is avoidance behavior; an attempt to deny and avoid negative feelings or people, places, or things which aggravate the negative feelings associated with the trauma. In post-abortion trauma cases, constriction may include: an inability to recall the abortion experience or important parts of it; efforts to avoid activities or situations which may arouse recollections of the abortion; withdrawal from relationships, especially estrangement from those involved in the abortion decision; avoidance of children; efforts to avoid or deny thoughts or feelings about the abortion; restricted range of loving or tender feelings; a sense of a foreshortened future (e.g., does not expect a career, marriage, or children, or a long life.); diminished interest in previously enjoyed activities; drug or alcohol abuse; suicidal thoughts or acts; and other self-destructive tendencies.
As previously mentioned, Barnard's study identified a 19% rate of PTSD among women who had abortions three to five years previously. But in reality the actual rate is probably higher. Like most post-abortion studies, Barnard's study was handicapped by a fifty percent drop out rate. Clinical experience has demonstrated that the women least likely to cooperate in post-abortion research are those for whom the abortion caused the most psychological distress. Research has confirmed this insight, demonstrating that the women who refuse followup evaluation most closely match the demographic characteristics of the women who suffer the most post-abortion distress. (10) The extraordinary high rate of refusal to participate in post-abortion studies may interpreted as evidence of constriction or avoidance behavior (not wanting to think about the abortion) which is a major symptom of PTSD. For many women, the onset or accurate identification of PTSD symptoms may be delayed for several years. (11) Until a PTSD sufferer has received counseling and achieved adequate recovery, PTSD may result in a psychological disability which would prevent an injured abortion patient from bringing action within the normal statutory period. This disability may, therefore, provide grounds for an extended statutory period.

[kittyk]

At the risk of sounding possessive/competitive about disorders...I still can't equate anxiety over abortion as comparable to PTSD....there are clear differences already described...post abortion syndrome is just that...a collection ofsymptoms that could relate to any anxiety. The fact the writer of the above article has included PTSD in brackets alongside PAS at the beginning, shows the argument is loaded from the start and the points are made to fit what the writer has already concluded.

[ThreeBee23]

My hope is that this thread just helps someone who is suffering from either PASS or PTSD.

God bless.