View Full Version : Please help - Citalopram and some frightening symptoms
24/12/09 - NOTE:
This started as a thread requesting information about citalopram side effects, and over the course of 2009 the thread became a "survival diary" of my recovery from anxiety and depression.
A spin-off of this thread is the Citalopram Survival Guide (see the link in my signature).
Please do not reply with advice about questions raised in the first post of this thread as many of the early problems have long since been resolved.
Please read this thread and take any advice and reassurance you can from what I learned over the course of 2009. My sincere thanks to the friends I have made and to everyone who offered advice, support and encouragement.
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Hi all. Please take the time to read this as I am desperate for reassurance! :hugs:
Yesterday, my doctor put me on citalopram because I have been suffering from severe anxiety with possible depression. I took my first tablet (20mg, the lowest dose for depression) last night about 9.45pm. I also took ibuprofen for a headache.
I very quickly started feeling ill. As in, within 10-30 minutes of taking the citalopram and ibuprofen. I went to bed. It felt like someone was rummaging through my brain, my thoughts were racing and I had a huge anxiety attack, my eyes were unfocused and a bit crossed and I felt dizzy and nauseous. I actually thought I'd been poisoned.
I got up for a wee and the dizziness and unfocused vision disappeared as soon as I stood up, which is weird, and they didn't come back! I realised I'd been lying there suffering for 3 hours!!!, so I phoned NHS Direct (this is at 2 in the morning), who said it sounded like the tablets were perhaps too strong, and I should go to my doctor first thing in the morning. They said ibuprofen does not interact with citalopram and was not responsible for my symptoms.
I felt a hundred times better after that and went straight to sleep.
My doctor was a bit annoyed with me this morning, although still very polite and professional, saying there was no way the citalopram could have affected me so quickly as it takes 3-4 hours to enter the blood. This means my symptoms would have started by half past 1, instead of half past 10.
In his opinion I'd suffered a panic attack.
I used citalopram a few years ago, but can't remember if I had any side effects. I was only on it for 3 months. The doctor said that was further evidence that it should be safe to stick with citalopram.
I'm scared to take my citalopram tonight but the doctor has said I must try to continue with the course instead of giving up after one day.
Has anyone else ever been like this after taking one tablet? Am I being silly and scaring myself to death, or does it sound like citalopram is not the drug for me?
Please help, I am terrified about tonight!!
CRaig Stoddard
20-03-09, 17:42
I've been taking them for a number of weeks but I've not had any problems. Thats not to say there are none. The doctor did warn me of such problems , but assured me they would soon stop. Many people have had problems so don't be worried, things might seem to get worse before they get better, so push through and get better.
Thank you so much mate, it is such a relief to hear that!! I suppose I'll find out tonight if yesterday's "bad trip" was a one-off or some kind of weird anxiety attack.
Hope your own problems are resolved soon. :)
Hi Poet
I feel gp could have started you on 10mg. Yes, 20mg is the lowest dosage for depression, however this is a new med entering the system and in my opinion you should have started on 10mg for say a week and then raised to 20mg. I'm quite surprised by your own gp actually because I would have thought that he would have said cut it down to 10mg for a week.
You may well have had a panic attack - we can't monitor all our thoughts, and what probably happened is that you took the Citalapram and the Ibu and you thought "oh I wonder if they could react". Now, that little thought could have started off a panic.
I know what I'd do, I'd cut it down to 10mg tonight. Can't remember if Citalapram are capsules though, you probably have 20mg capsules in which case you can't halve it. I would speak to gp on Monday if you're still having a bad reaction.
I didn't like the med myself personally and I did have very bad side effects on it for first couple of weeks. All the meds have this side effect profile when first starting them. However, the med may not suit you. Doctors think they are right and they are not a lot of the time. They take us for idiots.
I really wish you well.
Cheers Yvonne :)
If you look the word "anxiety" up in any good dictionary, there will be a little picture of me sitting in a corner with my eyes wide and my fingernails in my mouth.
My doctor knows this and I think he gave me the 20mg dose because I've been so over-wrought. I haven't been able to lead my usual life this last couple of weeks.
My symptoms are largely anxiety related but I do have depressive bouts. It's the first time I've been depressive for a couple of years.
Is my doctor right -- is is true that it takes hours to feel the side effects of medication? Most of my symptoms disappeared as soon as I got out of bed and started talking to someone, so maybe it was the worst panic attack ever, but honestly it felt like I was on a bad trip or something!
Just found the citalopram forum here (d'oh!) and to be honest I am scared to take tonight's dose -- I think I might be better off struggling on as I am rather than taking something that is going to freak me out so badly! Any advice??
You shouldnt take Citalopram and Ibuprofen together, it annoys me how doctors dont explain this!
BUT saying that My symptoms were horrible for the first week...had to get through it to feel so much better as i do now, they also say the more anxious of us will get worse symptoms. Its great once you get passed the first week,but then i started on 10mg and that was bad enough, I agree 20mg seems high to start on.
we have to realise we are taking quite a strong drug here and you really must check if its ok to take other meds with them
x
Thanks for the reply Snowdrop!
There is nothing in the documentation telling me not to take painkillers at the same time -- there is quite a lot of documentation and most of it is dedicated to telling us the side effects. I didn't read about the side effects before taking the first pill.
Is it ok to just cut a tablet in half and take that? Should be roughly 10mg?
Yes you can chop it in half and stay on 10mg for a week and then increase to 20mg. I did 1st week 10mg, 2nd 20mg and 3rd 30mg...I am stable on the 30mg. I wouldnt increase though without discussing with your gp
You can take paracetamol, but the pharmacist was insistent I must not take ibuprofen, they say it can rarely cause internal bleeding (I dont want to be one of those rare ones!) I did the same as you and took 2 ibuprofen without knowing this and i felt cr*p!!
I would go with 10mg for 1st week...I couldnt have coped with 20mg straight off
x
Thanks so much, your help is really appreciated :D
It's almost time for my dose. I'm going to stick with 20mg for tonight and if it blows up in my head again, tomorrow night I'm dropping to 10mg, I don't give a damn what the doctor ordered.
I'm gonna spend the next half an hour watching "Not Going Out" with my family, so hopefully the company and the comedy will even out any side effects.
"Shields up, we're going in!!"
Update: been 40 minutes since I took the tablet, no side effects to report. I know it's a bit early to be sounding the all clear but I was in a right state by this time yesterday, so hopefully this means I'll be ok tonight :)
EDIT: Been well over an hour and I feel completely fine, I nearly pooed my pants for nothing it seems!
freakedout
21-03-09, 00:32
Update: been 40 minutes since I took the tablet, no side effects to report. I know it's a bit early to be sounding the all clear but I was in a right state by this time yesterday, so hopefully this means I'll be ok tonight :)
EDIT: Been well over an hour and I feel completely fine, I nearly pooed my pants for nothing it seems!
Hi Psycho,
Sorry to hear what happened last night after your combo of drugs and am so glad you are ok so far tonight. Your last comment make me chuckle, nearly pooing your pants. That is the kinda thing I would say, but it isn't funny when you think you are having a bad reaction to meds. I am always scared to take new meds but usually it is irrational. I took Citalopram for a while with no major side effects, sometimes you can feel a little worse before you start to feel the benefits from them but stick it out if you can tolerate them OK. I hope they help.
Freaky
Thank you :D
When I finally went to bed I did feel a bit funny, but nowhere near as severe as the first night, and I managed to get about 7 hours sleep for the first time in days :)
I woke up feeling tired and anxious as usual but I have been occupied this morning so I don't feel too bad. I am sure I can feel the drug trying to work: I feel a bit woozy, shaky and anxious, but it is tolerable.
I should point out that I have lost more than half a stone in the last two weeks because my appetite has fallen to almost zero. Will this drug help me get my appetite back? I feel weak and shaky sometimes (usually goes off if I sit or lie down) and I think it's because I'm not eating enough and/or because I don't get much exercise now.
I was made redundant at the end of last year and I've got all the time in the world to worry about my symptoms!! That must make them 10 times worse!
UPDATE
Been out with a friend for lunch and managed to eat quite a bit. I still feel very anxious but am trying to control my thoughts and I have had some success. I'm off out again tonight for a few hours for a lad's night in. I cannot over-emphasise how much it helps to spend time away from home with friends. Hopefully this advice will encourage others not to withdraw from their friends.
Well it's day three in the "big bother" house and I have decided to cut my dose down to 10mg. My anxiety has become severe and I am feeling increased depression since starting on citalopram.
I am not able to properly relax any more. Most days I was able to chill out after a good day with my family and friends, but now I feel nervous all the time. It's definitely got worse in the last couple of days.
I woke up at 4.30am this morning in a panic. I felt paralysed and had to force myself to move. I wasn't able to get back to sleep as I was so anxious! I'm absolutely knackered!
I felt like I was struggling to breathe but that must have been a bad case of hyperventilation, as I've been at a car boot sale all day with my mates and I didn't suffer lung failure! At least I'm still able to go out and do things, even if my ability to relax has disappeared!
Why can't I control my anxiety any more!!
Poet..............
You've just started on 20mg Citalapram - they aint smarties lolxx The side effects are making the anx worse at the mo that's why I suggested 10mg for a week.
You did so well going out with your friend for lunch, give yourself some self praise for that because I know that wouldn't have been easy for you the way you're feeling.
Whenever I first start meds I feel literally hungover in the mornings and it's a dreadful feeling, you feel like you are the walking dead. Lethargy and weakness are part of side effects anyway.
When anxiety is high early morning waking is very very common. When this happens, get up and make a cup of tea. I know how it feels cos last year I would wake in panic about that time of the morning and I would sit on the end of the bed just not knowing what to do or where to go with the anxiety.
I have to tell you I had very bad breathing problems with Citalapram I was hyperventilating and I had that awful thing where you cant take a deep breath in. Try some deep breathing exercises. First one to try - take a deep breath in and hold it for a count of four breathe out as slowly as you can for a count of about 6 if you can. Actually that isn't easy when you're that anxious. Try blowing out - just blow all the air out of your lungs - t his should make you automatically take a breath in. Also just hold your breath for as long as you can. It will make your heart beat fast but it will get the breathing back to a normal rythm.
You can't control your anxiety because we can't. Let it take over. Just tell it to do what it wants.
When you are h ighly anxious the first thing to go is the appetite, you won't feel like eating at all - food doesn't even enter the mind. If you are that bad and just can't make yourself eat you must buy some Complan and drink that throughout the day.
Good luck and keep us posted.
PS Oh I can defo talk the talk but often have trouble walking the walk lol.
I started on 20mg of Citalopram six wks ago, the first few days i experienced some stomach pain which can be one of the side effects, i also experienced an increase in anxiety/panic attacks and felt dreadful so i reduced the dose to 10mg, it took a good 4 wks of persevering but i have started to feel better and have not had such severe anxiety/panic...
I took my 4th dose yesterday. I realise I am not giving it much of a chance to work, but it's hard to get through.
I cut down to 10mg last night hoping to reduce the side effects.
In some ways it worked. I woke up twice during the night but was able to talk myself out of panic attacks on both occasions (hooray!).
Then when I woke up "properly" at 6am (aargh!!) I had a massive, paralysing panic attack again, which I could not come out of, and I couldn't go back to sleep. I still feel anxious and trembling now but I am improving a bit.
It's probably the lack of sleep that is making things worse. I had a long day yesterday, I did a car boot sale and celebrated mothers' day with my family and was up for almost 19 hours straight. I used to love falling asleep, now I am dreading it cos I feel like crap every morning!
How long on average do people find their side effects last?
They really dont last too long...although it feels like forever at the time I know! Mine improved about half way through the 2nd week but I nearly didnt get past day 3 it was that bad, so glad I did though they have turned my life round and thats no exaggeration.
remember you are adding a new drug to your system, give your body a chance to accept it and hopefully you will be reaping the rewards.
Hope things get better for you soon :hugs:
x
Thanks Snowdrop :) I'm nearly 30 and I need more reassurance than a kid!! ;)
My mood has improved vastly since this morning and I find myself daring to hope the pills are starting to work. I know they won't cure my problems completely -- I'm running away from something and I am gonna have to face it this week! That won't be fun!
Hallo Poet
Er can I slap your wrist??? You did a bootsale and celebrated Mothers Day with family. Hey, do you realise how good that is!!! How did you feel at the bootsale and spending the day with the family??? Still highly anxious or not?? If you didn't then I have to tell you that you are doing very well indeed.
Now, you naughty little 30 year old - keep telling yourself how well you are doing with all these things you manage. Believe me you are doing great. When people are in the grips of high anxiety I can assure you they can't do these things and if they do it's like torture. Consider yourself told off lol.
The side effects of the Citalapram won't last long don't worry, two weeks or thereabouts. You will be alright. Early morning waking is common and a lot of people wake at about 4 am.
You take great care x
Thank you :D
God I feel so much better for venting in this thread. People here are so amazing, I don't feel alone :)
Well to be honest doing those things was a great help as I was able to escape my problems for a while. Don't get me wrong, I was anxious and upset for a while, but I was with good company and I was away from the house. I help my dad out a lot, I'm basically his driver while he gets his bad eye sorted, and I look forward to getting out with him.
It helps to be doing something worthwhile.
I need to start talking about the things that are causing my problems. I think that's why I have got like this. I've spent too long running away from stuff. I'll probably end up starting a thread tomorrow.
I'm just fixing up my old mp3 player with loads of relaxing music ready for when (if) I wake up early tomorrow. Not gonna be listening to the chatterbox tomorrow!
Anxious_gal
23-03-09, 22:51
are you still on those meds? i toke them ONCE! oh my god i had the worst panic attack ever, my thoughts were racing, became afraid i was suicidal, got paranoid!
feel really weird, high, spacey......
scared me half to death, my friend had to come over to calm me down.
sometimes meds just do not agree with you
I think the first time is the worst. You're not prepared for the scale of what is coming, so your first experience is scary as hell, with sounds and colours bursting in your brain. It has not been like that since. It is simply your brain struggling to cope with something unexpectedly potent. You expect it to be like most medicine, no noticeable effect, and then it hits you harder than Rocky.
The best advice I can give from my limited experience is to take it several hours BEFORE you go to bed. That way, any weirdness will be over before your head hits the pillow, and if you are up and active you won't notice much. Take an mp3 player with you so if you wake up early you can listen to music instead of your panic attacks.
I find the anxiety slowly fades through the day. Spending time with other people helps immensely. Watching telly helps me more than reading.
EDIT: Well I'm off to bed now, can't put it off any longer lol, time to put my money where my mouth is!
justbananas
23-03-09, 23:47
hey friend - i hope you rest well tonight. starting meds is tough and scary, and sometimes even if you've been through it before - there's nothing quite like taking meds while being in the midst of a major bout of anxiety. it seems doing ANYTHING while being in the midst of a period of crazy anxiety makes you doubt, fear, and freak out.
i think what must have happened to you that first night was more of a panic attack rather than the meds having kicked in. it really would have taken longer than that for them to really filter through your system and enter your bloodstream. but i know from experience - even taking like cold medicine can sometimes send me into a spiral because i start thinking about drug interactions, how it will affect me, etc.
that said, the first few weeks can be pretty bad as the drug starts to accumulate and work. as you know from others and from this forum. using SSRI's for anxiety can be good because their overall effects can lessen the perserverance of anxiety. however - not only does it take ages for them to work, but it can be a hit and miss with dosage, drug type etc. This can all wreak havoc on your system while you sort it out and especially with anxiety - ugh!!
so sometimes docs will prescribe xanax (or some other type of immediate acting anxiety med) to take in conjunction with starting an anti-depressant to get you through it in the begining and to just take as needed. it's not good for long term treatment because .. well.. it just doesn't work that way. it's like spot treating a pimple rather treating the underlying problem. i have an 'as needed' perscription for xanax and i find myself taking it later in the day, when my anxiety is at its peak. some weeks i take it every day, sometimes i take it once, sometimes weeks go by and i don't need it. most often i find just KNOWING i have it in my drawer prevents me from going into full on panic mode when laying down. if you find it tough getting through the initial days/weeks - perhaps speak to your doc about getting a fast acting drug to take the edge off while your body adjusts. either way - just try to push through. i think you'll find it will end up helping and working out. don't forget to add some lifestyle tweaks with it because it sounds like you respond well (like me) to distractions and lifestyle changes - which is lucky and a good thing to take advantage of! huuuuuuuuuuuuugs.
Hi Justbananas, thanks :D
I only got 4 hours sleep last night again, and I was really scared by a paralysing panic attack which seemed to affect my chest. I felt like every time I breathed out my chest was going to collapse and the centre of my chest felt sore. It still feels a bit strange.
My feet went numb for a short while which has never happened before. I thought I was having an asthma attack even though I'm not an asthma sufferer. I checked up on this and it seems like I just had bad hyperventilation. Apologies to Yvonne who has already mentioned that she had similar problems, I forgot about that.
Listening to music helped slightly but my mp3 player ran out battery, dammit. I just couldn't go back to sleep.
justbananas
24-03-09, 22:25
ugh i hate that.. my feet and hands go completely numb during my bigger PA's .. sometimes i can barely get up or walk .. but it feels worse to lay there because of the head rushes it feels better to walk .. but hard to do with completely numb legs!! freaking awesome i tell u.
Righty ho, it's day six of PsychoPoet's Daily Bitch-Fest. This is sort of like a progress diary, I hope people are finding it interesting or useful.
Well I've got to say I had a much better night than I have done in a while. I still only got 5-6 hours' sleep, but the quality of my sleep was better, and the much-feared panic attacks never materialised.
Last night I spent a few hours with my family watching the film Arlington Road. I physically relaxed, just sat there and enjoyed the film and the company. I would be less tired if I hadn't also stayed up to watch Most Haunted and Time Team heh, but I went to bed feeling more laid back than I have for a few days. I listened to music for a while before going to sleep which was the icing on the cake.
When I woke up I actually felt good for a moment until I remembered that I still haven't done anything to deal with my reasons for feeling so anxious. Listening to music did help me relax somewhat. I'm a different person when I wake up to who I am when I go to bed. The condition just resets itself.
I've been feeling less shaky and anxious today but I do feel a lot more tired.
Hi :)
I am glad you got a better nights sleep! I hope you feel better for it.
When my anxiety was at its worst, the mornings were an absolute nightmare, I would suddenly wake up - not slowly - feeling like I was caught in the middle of a warzone and as the day progressed I would feel much better. I was like a different person in the evenings compared to the morning and I would put off going to bed as late as possible so I could enjoy how I felt. I was told it is down to low blood sugar caused by not eating overnight and as we eat thro the day our blood sugar levels increase. I got told treat it as you would Pms by keeping sugar levels up to avoid mood swings. I would keep hi juice squash by my bed plus biscuits or flapjacks and if I woke up in the night, I would have a drink and something to eat, and this really did lessen my anxiety when I woke in the morning for the day. Does this sound mad? lol :wacko:It worked for me tho.
I got the breathless thing last night as though I couldnt breathe and like my chest is collapsing...I have noticed this has started to happen. It eventually fades again. Do you think this is a side effect of Citalopram as I never had this before?
Poppy, all of the symptoms you listed are identical to mine, so rejoice! They can't be anything bad.
I get the "chest collapsing" thing during very severe moments of panic. I don't know what the hell it is, I always worry it's a collapsing lung, but it only happens when highly anxious and I've not had to go to hospital yet! So it's harmless, just not very nice.
I have wondered about blood sugar. Check Justbananas' post, it's number 20 on this page: http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?t=45296&page=2
She has some good ideas on how to deal with it.
I feel massively better in the evenings as well. I always try to take advantage when my appetite returns in the evening. The important things are to stabilise your blood sugar level and maintain your weight.
Hi psychopoet,
This is my first time on this site, so I hope I can be of some help.
Basically, I was prescribed "Citalopram" for anxiety caused by alcohol dependecy, and I was told by my G.P that there is no major side effects. I went to work in the morning and took one 20mg tablet, and about 2 hours later I felt dazed and confused, and I was stumbling around abit. I had a lump in my throat and had an upset stomach, So what did I do; I took another one. This relieved the symptoms for a while, and later again, I felt really bad, So...I took another one. (60mg in 7 hours). When I got home I went on the internet to look for Citalopram and was horrified by the threads and only then realised what a fool I had been to take them like smarties.
Anyhow, I've been taken ONE a day for the past week, and let me tell you they have been marvelous. I believe the side-effect vary in lenght from person to person, and I gather it is not unheard of to suffer panic attacks by just taking regardless of the actual side-effects. I find taking one at around 5 or 6 o'clock n the afternoon helps because my head is focased on other daily matters, and by the time I drowsy, it bedtime. I hope this helps. Good luck, N
Thanks mate, I'm sorry to hear that your doctor misinformed you so badly. I think doctors should be forced to take citalopram just once before telling patients that there are no side effects. It would certainly shut my doctor up. 60mg must have been horrendous for your first experience, I struggled with a third of that!
Update on side effects:
I'm still clenching my jaw (aargh!) and my tongue is moving about inside my excess-saliva-producing mouth like it's got Parkinsons, but the anxiety has only been about a tenth of its usual strength today and all other side effects are tolerable, if annoying.
I am so, so hoping the worst is over now.
I've actually started facing up to my problems today and this also helps; it's harder to let anxiety take over when you have shone a light on its reason for being.
Hope this helps!
Well I'm off to bed now fellow Pot Noodle fans, I'm gonna be like the bear who ended up with more than a nostril full of honey if I don't get more than six hours sleep. I'll try to stick an update on in the morning if I can. Don't know if anybody is interested. Might be worth something when I'm famous. *tumbleweed blows past*
I have had 9 20mg tabs and feel like I have been the subject of some KGB psycho experiment! Every morning, sweats and hallucinations I can't describe. Plus all the minor symptoms like nausea and lassitude -spent half my time lying on the couch. I just can't take the morning symptoms any more so am going cold turkey. You are not alone! Have ordered some herbs from the Amazon instead!
Lex
Thanks for that mate. I'm sorry to hear you have suffered so badly. Good luck with the other stuff.
Well then Pot Noodle pickers, if you're reading this you are probably wondering if I finally had a full night's sleep. Let's not engage in false suspense: no I didn't.
Danny_dingle
26-03-09, 14:05
Hey PsychoPoet,
Have just started taking the Citalopram 20mg myself (day three today, took my tablet about half an hour ago and still anxiously awaiting the side effects!) and am struggling quite severely too. So far have had headache, nausea, lack of breath, and general heightened anxiety with a whole host of consequent other symptoms! Irritatingly enough the heightened anxiety keeps making me read far too much into the symptoms and I keep worrying I am having an allergic reaction! Doubt that is the case though as the symptoms seems to be getting less severe. The first day was by far the worst! I felt like I had been hit by a truck! I also keep forgetting what I was going to say and my trail of thought just drops off a cliff... is that normal?!
It is good to know though (dunno if I read this in this thread or elsewhere) that if you are getting side effects it means it is working on you, as it is changing your chemical imbalances.
It is great to read about what is happening to you (well, not great for you I'm sure! But still, 'comforting' is the word I think!), especially as you seem to be staying so upbeat about everything; well done you!! I too am going out with friends; stocked up on books and DVDs to keep me entertained yesterday with my friend, as I have been signed off work for a month and will need to keep myself occupied!
I know completely what they mean by heightened anxiety levels now; I have just had a panic attack because my dog jumped on the settee unexpectedly whilst I was trying to put the net curtains up and I nearly fell off the chair!!
Are you getting gradually better as the days go on? I don't feel so sick any more but I keep yawning and my jaw keeps clenching, and my muscles in my hands keep going twitchy and achey. It is so strange!
Anyways, hope everyone out there reading this is getting on OK, keep your chins up; we are all on the path to getting better just by registering on here and finding out that we aren't alone or going crazy!
Take care guys! :D
Danny xxx
Thanks a lot for that matey, say hello to my buddy list :D
I'm sorry to hear you are suffering. Others have been there before, so you know you're not alone! :)
Today was looking like a bad day. I was tired, p***ed off, feeling REALLY down and starting to get agoraphobic. But although I did have to lie down for a couple of hours in the afternoon due to sheer exhaustion caused by seven crap nights' sleep, I have been out three times today. Once to do the shopping with my family (we pick my nan up and take her as well), once in the afternoon with dad (to save my sanity -- I was so tired it was getting me down) and again in the evening with dad when I took him to one of his talks.
This has made such a huge improvement in my mood. I'm still knackered, but I am very happy.
I've got tomorrow lined up as well. I've gone from having bugger all to do, to having a full calendar. Utterly essential if you're agorpahobic or panicky or feeling low.
My energy levels have improved and most of all, my appetite has come back. I've just got back with my dad and managed a "Wot Not in a Pot Noodle" (advice: make sure you remember to take the sauce sachet out BEFORE emptying the contents of the pack into boiling water) and other stuff.
It's important to keep in mind that if you feel depressed, tiredness is a MAJOR factor. Tiredness will ALWAYS distort your view of the world and your enjoyment of life. Remember this at all times!
I hope this reassures people that even if you feel tired, dejected, hopeless and frustrated, improvements CAN be made. There ARE breaks in the cloud and it is possible to see the sky.
I'll see you tomorrow, Pot Noodle fans!
:D
Well if anyone is still reading, I woke feeling a bit crap again at 20 past 6 in the morning! I go to bed feeling wonderful then wake feeling stressed! So it's still up and down. I have dared to hope that the citalopram might have been kicking in but it still obviously isn't doing its thang yet!
Today is new, cos I don't feel down, I feel sort of hyper. It feels like my heart is racing. I'm tired too. I wonder if it's cos I spend most of the day sitting down instead of getting exercise? At times like this it's hard to believe I'll ever feel normal again. And I had such a wonderful day yesterday!
My mate texted me last night wanting to go to a shopping centre this afternoon so maybe it's just a touch of nerves?
Well I'm out with my dad shortly so hopefully when I get back I'll be fine.
Danny_dingle
27-03-09, 12:05
Possibly a combination of nerves and still Citalopram side effects I'd say... you're a few days ahead of me with the meds, so thats what? About day 7/8 for you? Apparently you get the side effects for 2 - 3 weeks so maybe it just hasn't settled down properly yet...
If it's any consolation, I didn't used to get anxiety first thing in the morning until I started taking Citalopram, so I'm guessing it is responsible for the severity of your morning anxiety too! Bloomin' side effects, lets hope they pay off!!!
Keep going with them, you will get better soon I am sure of it!
Hope you have a nice time with your Dad,
Danny xxx
hi - when i started on citalopram i felt 10 times worse for about 2 weeks but stuck with it and then very gradually got better. i thought it might be the tablets but i was in such a state anyway it was probably a bit of both. my gp was really old school - he said if you think you feel bad now you will feel terrible when you start these so it is not unusual. i used to feel as though my mind was slipping away from me and my thoughts were so loud i could not concentrate on anything but it does pass. x
he said if you think you feel bad now you will feel terrible when you start these so it is not unusual.My doctor would never tell me that! It would have ruined the surprise! Cheers Doctor Page :D
Danny_Dingle, it's my ninth pill tonight. Can't believe I have gone this far. I should get a cake or something.
To anyone suffering on citalopram I must once more repeat my mantra: Stay social! I feel a hundred times better for going out with my dad today. I'm off to my mate's in a few minutes and I have made arrangements for doing stuff this weekend. Please follow my example! Your quality of life will be better ;)
Hi!
I feel really hyper some days on Citalopram - I am beginning to notice this. I can feel so happy and hyper but tired and then the next day I am a bit more grounded. :wacko:
Hi Poppy!
This is day 9 and I woke up feeling pretty much the same as yesterday, tense and stressed with my heartbeat feeling fairly normal but a racing feeling in the centre of my chest. It feels like a clutched fist.
For the first time, I managed to drift off a couple of times after waking up at 6am. I feel tired and a bit zombified.
The worst part of all this is, I still don't have much motivation to do anything that I enjoy. I think it's cos I'm having difficulty concentrating. I can't read or play computer games very well at the moment, my mind just wanders.
The anxiety is backing off slightly but is replaced with feeling down and fed up. Hopefully that will go away soon.
I hate to sound so pessimistic. Probably things will pick up later like they usually do.
Another update. This thread is turning into my life's work. I'm gonna print it all out and bind it in leather.
I not only went out with dad today, including a brief stop at a busy pub, I also went to a house party and then went round a couple of clubs, so perhaps the anxiety situation isn't as dire as I thought :D
And I pigged out on a very large Indian takeaway for dinner, then a drunk girl at the house party passed me a very large plate full of food from the buffet. I ate most of it, and what little I couldn't eat I simply stuffed in my mate's jacket pocket while he was in the bog. I wish I could see his face tomorrow when he puts his hand in his pocket and discovers a stash of three bread sticks, a dorito, a mini sausage roll with a bite taken out of it and one of those funny red things referred to by farmers as "a radish". Who serves radishes at a house party buffet!
Is the storm finally breaking? Who knows, ask me at six in the morning when I'm probably gonna be lying there cursing citalopram!!
Goodnight fellow Pot Noodle enthusiasts! *
* Why does he keep going on about Pot Noodles?
Another update for anyone who is still following the progress of my battle with citalopram! I mean anxiety! ;) I hope this is still helping people, let me know if it's not!!
I did wake up early this morning -- but for the first time, I went back to sleep! I sorted of dozed on and off until eleven o'clock. I felt like a zombie though. Could the pills be starting to have an effect?
On the other hand, now that I'm not feeling so anxious, I have started feeling down quite a lot, but luckily it is not too bad. I hope that vanishes soon. The jaw clenching and weird tongue movement are not as bad either. My appetite is still back along with a rather powerful thirst!
Pills alone aren't going to fix this. There are underlying problems that need sorting. Gonna have to start facing them this week. I wonder how many depressed and/or anxious people have specific problems that they never deal with? Could that be why some people have to take antidepressants for years?
I find that if i have too much sleep it makes me feel low regardless of whether i am on meds or not,if i awake at my normal time and stay in bed and doze then i often end up feeling worse than i would if i just got up at my normal time... I have stayed on just a low dose of Citalopram 10mg and have been on it for 8wks now,my anxiety/depression has decreased,i still have the odd day when i feel a litte low but the anxiety has not been so bad.. There are things that trigger my anxiety and unfortunately i cannot completely eliminate those things from my life,but with the help of the meds at least i feel that i have a bit more control again and am able to remain a bit more rational and stay calmer enabling me hopefully to cope better should anything happen...
Danny_dingle
29-03-09, 22:11
Hello all,
Still reading Psychopoet and definitely getting something from your posts (even if I am just deathly curious about the Pot Noodle thing you keep mentioning!) so keep going! :D
Pleased for you that you managed to stay in bed this morning, even if it did make you a little zombified; you are bound to feel a bit rough whilst you catch up with the sleep you have lost, and the fact that your panic didn't stop you dozing has got to be a milestone, so congratulate yourself for that! :yesyes:
Just thought I'd post a little personal experience on here for all you Citalopram 'fans' :wacko:
I have been finding that the naffy side effects have been getting less and less as I've been going on, but today I took tablet number 6 on an empty stomach (the leaflet in the packet says this shouldn't matter) and felt like I had been hit by a bus! Subsequently ended up asleep on the settee for 2 and a half hours this afternoon and still feel tired now!
So yeah, ignore that leaflet and make sure you eat something before you take the tablet each day - lack of food does NOT help the side effects whatsoever!!!!
Take care all,
Danny xxx
Danny_dingle
29-03-09, 22:20
P.s. I think you are right in what you say about underlying problems; if you read the link on the left under 'Self Help' that is called 'First Steps...' it makes some interesting points about this. See the Citalopram as your life raft off a sinking ship. It may stop you drowning but you aren't at the shore yet; you need to get help to deal with the issues that got you like this in the first place. You will be amazed at how good counselling can make you feel.
Danny xxx
Hi all, thanks for the feedback, hopefully this thread will continue to be useful to people in our situation! Quick run down of the days so far, might give a bit of hope to those just starting citalopram or worried about the side effects:
Day 1
Major anxiety due to bad reaction to first citalopram dose.
Day 2
New side effects - Reduced sleep; shaking; highly increased anxiety, particularly in morning; increased need to urinate; occasionally impressive burping.
Day 3
New side effects - Random tongue movements; excess saliva; jaw clenching.
Days 4 - 7
Morning anxiety lessens slightly as the days go by.
Urge to urinate returns to normal.
Ability to belch like a hero disappears as digestive system settles down.
Day 8
Appetite returns; conclusively proven by the ability to eat Bombay Bad Boy Pot Noodle with full amount of hot & spicy sauce. Self-confidence and energy levels boosted slightly due to this.
Level of tiredness increases due to lack of sleep over the last week.
New side effect: headaches.
Days 9 - 10
Morning anxiety lessens slightly but is replaced by occasionally feeling down, though this might be to do with tiredness.
Appetite and thirst increase, probably to make up for lost time.
Sex drive improves slightly -- in other words it doesn't make me feel ill any more.
Day 11
Possibility that citalopram is starting to work, as "noise chatter" in my head, a major symptom of stress and anxiety for me, is greatly reduced.
Ability to sleep starts to return. However, I am really "zapped" when I wake up.
Jaw clenching eases slightly.
Ability to spend time alone without relying on other people starts to return.
Ability to concentrate while reading starts to return.
Day 12
Ability to sleep improves further.
Negative thoughts seem less realistic.
Update for any fellow Pot Noodle lovers who are still reading. I've had a brilliant day today BUT! I've been feeling down all day. This might be due to tiredness again as I had to get up early and I am finding that I am a bit zonked when I first wake up. On the other hand they could just be residual anxiety.
I'm hoping that the citalopram will start to reduce these feelings of mild depression, if that's what they really are.
Day 13
Citalopram is definitely starting to work.
Shaking/trembling the morning after taking a new dose has stopped.
Weird tongue movements are reduced.
No panic attacks in morning, although still occasionally feeling uneasy.
Able to face major problems without feeling too much anxiety.
Increased feeling of depression, but still mild compared to what I've felt in the past.
Liverbird67
31-03-09, 19:57
Hi just read your post the symptoms you described were exactly what I had when my dose of Citalopram was increased from 20mgs to 40 mgs overnight I had three days of this (practically tripping out before I went to docs and he put me down to 30mgs which I was still a bit wobbly on for a few days)
Don't know if it was the increase or anxiety just thought I would let :hugs: know as the symptoms were so similiar
Debbie
Hiya i feel your doctor is very wrong for saying it cant enter your blood stream in that short a time ,every body is different we all react to things differently.i myself have a small frame very petite and thin and in my experiences everything effects me quicker ,weather it be tablets or alcohol.I took citalopram 1 tablet lowest dose and within half an hour i felt really ill and threw up. i never took it again it obv wasnt agreeing with me since then ive tried other tablets all of which have not done this x
Hi Poet. I was precribed Citalopram last week and have been on it for 4 days now. I too have been given 20mg and this is the first time I have ever been depressed but I didnt realise this was a high dose until talking to ppl on here!
I didnt take painkillers with mine but I have still had some awful side effects. Took my first one sat morning and within an hour i felt completely out of control. I was dizzy, couldnt focus, hearing went fuzzy (like everyone was talking to me from far away, if that makes sense), went hot then cold, had this enormous amount or rage inside, like I wanted to hit something.
The side effects are not so bad now, get horrendous headaches and still get dizzy but have been told by people that hopefully all this will pass.
Just thought I would comment as had similar problem with them. Stick with them and it should improve.
xxx
Hi everyone, thanks for commenting.
Liverbird: It's hard to tell how much is caused by anxiety and how much is caused by the pills. I suppose there's no point trying to make the distinction; you feel the way you feel and you've got to put up with it :( but if you stick with it, things start to get better :)
Shelly: When I take the tablet you can usually start feeling them within 1-2 hours. It's a weird feeling. Scary until you get used to it. You know in winter when the radiators in your house come on at night and you can actually hear the water starting to come through them? I am always reminded of that when the citalopram starts to do its stuff.
Noa: keep going with the tablets, hopefully you will feel some benefit soon. I hope the feelings of rage pass soon. Weird how this medication makes things seem so bad at first -- that's not really what people need, is it?!
I'm glad you're gradually improving P.poet . I am scared to death of taking meds. I have tried 6 different types in the past. All have made me worse.I struggled on with them for 6-8 weeks at a time and no improvement. they made me feel so depressed I couldn't get out of bed which I'm not like, lost appetite, couldn't swallow, lost weight, anxiety and panic 'off the roof' etc. So I struggle on without them. I'm getting there on my own, but now and then especially at night I do have some 'big blips' Meds do help alot of people but I'm not one of them. I keep thinking to myself I've not failed and I'm bigger than this awful thing. Keep us posted how you're doing
Danny_dingle
01-04-09, 10:48
Hey guys,
Have just woken up feeling majorly jittery, I didn't do this the past couple of days when I set an alarm for myself so maybe that is the key? Wake yourself up before the Citalopram does? Also, eat/drink sugary stuff if you can; it stops the wobbliness and helps with the anxiety I find. Let me know if it works for you too.
Hey Psychopoet, I know what you mean about the depression; in between feeling better I have felt flat as a pancake. Like all my enthusiasm has gone! At least I am not panicking now, and when I feel good I feel awesome, but now the panic has been replaced with nasty, tired, fed up lows. It's not very nice, is it? I am hoping this will pass soon as my doc said the tablets take about 2 and a half weeks to kick in; maybe this is the last hurdle for you? Anyway, if you want someone to chat to, even if it's just about rubbish until you cheer up if you're feeling low, feel free to PM me anytime, I am phenomenally good at talking rubbish! :)
Take care guys, hope you are all feeling better soon,
Danny xxx
Hi all,
Well I woke up today with a feeling of suppressed "jitteriness" like an anxiety attack that has been smothered with a blanket, and I was quite tense and shaky again in the morning, but me and dad went out for a few hours and I feel fine again. I have not felt depressed at all today.
It seems that I feel like this whenever I'm at home, mainly because once I'm at home I spend a bit of time alone. I'm trying to reprogram my brain so that I feel safe and comfortable at home and I'm trying to relax and enjoy time alone once more.
Once I manage this I reckon the war will have tilted in my favour.
I must give big thanks to my dad, my best friends and of course citalopram for supporting me through a tough time, and I'm very glad I came to No More Panic cos I do not know what I'd have done without you lot :D
Summary:
Day 14
Feelings of depression are reduced.
Continued ability to doze and get a good night's sleep.
Headaches continue, but are manageable without taking painkillers.
Slight visual disturbances: colours at the edge of vision.
Increased need for water (feeling of dehydration).
starlight78
01-04-09, 22:33
Hi P Poet,
Sorry if i've got this wrong, but are you taking your citalopram at night? I work in mental health and we always recommend taking this med in the morning as it often interupts sleep.. One fo the most common side effects is insomnia. Some A?D's do help you sleep, like Mirtazapine but Citalprom aint one of them.
Thje other thing is that you should avoid ibuprofen with SSRI's as they can increase the risk of stomach complaints and even very rarely stomach bleeds(rare, rare, rare!)
I think your GP sounds like they dont have a lot of knowledge about mental health, you should have been started on 10mg or at least lowered to 10mg when it showed that you were struggling to tolerate them. Citalopram is notorious for making anxiety and mood worst before it makes you better, i dont think people are told that clearly enough..
Wishing you so much luck and happiness x
Starlight, yes I am taking it at night. I considered changing it but now I am sleeping almost normally again. I wasn't sleeping properly BEFORE I took it, but I felt A LOT worse in the mornings after my first few doses.
The difference in my anxiety level now compared to two weeks ago is huge. It's a relief and a half.
I managed to eat a full dinner while alone in the downstairs room that I associate with panic. Ironically I did have a panic attack when I'd finished eating but it faded as soon as the football started (but I watched that in the living-room with three members of my family so I sort of cheated).
I'll be in there again tomorrow at dinner time. This phobia of the front room will end! One bad experience is not enough to scare the PsychoPoet :D
Goodnight Pot Noodle pickers!
hi poet am comn off escitolpram after 20 years side effects are s--t but take the lowest dose one day on one day off for a month then one every 3 days for two weeks n ul b ok a doin that n av not had a panic attack 4 a month n av been takin them half ma life so there is light at the end of the tunnel am proof keep well
madelaine
:D :mad: :weep: hi poet am comn off escitolpram after 20 years side effects are s--t but take the lowest dose one day on one day off for a month then one every 3 days for two weeks n ul b ok a doin that n av not had a panic attack 4 a month n av been takin them half ma life so there is light at the end of the tunnel am proof keep well
madelaine
Congratulations Madelaine for coming off the citalopram and thank you for the reassurance :D
Today has been ok, slightly shaky start but I spent most of the day with friends and I feel fine now, much better than before. The improvements are coming daily. Didn't feel weird after taking my pill yesterday... maybe my body has finally adapted to it. I'm no longer so scared by the idea of having to take medication for my anxiety. You take paracetamol for a headache, what's wrong with having to take citalopram for a bad case of nerves? This attitude has really helped me and I feel like I'm not fighting against myself any more.
My feelings of anxiety are worse when I'm at home or when it's time to go back home. I still think this is cos I have spent so much time sitting at home feeling crap, so my mind now associates being at home with being anxious.
The plan is to "sanctify" my space. I love my home and I love my family, and I'm not gonna let that change. I'm going to re-learn how to enjoy myself at home, and I'm going to get used to spending time on my own again without relying on my dad or my friends to prop me up.
I can feel a slight tremor of anxiety at the thought of that which is a GOOD thing, cos it shows me I have identified a trigger and I can now take the fight directly to my anxiety instead of waiting for it to come to me.
I'll let you know how I get on; if it works for me, the chances are it will work for you.
Kick the tyres and light the fire, it's on like Donkey Kong. :D
trust yourself sometimes we know better than they do i have had similar reactions quite quickly with anti-depressants and it scared the hell out of me if you want to try agin cut the dose in half and see what happens it wont be as bad if you want to be careful take the painkiller at a different time so that you can monitor what is happening
My feelings of anxiety are worse when I'm at home or when it's time to go back home. I still think this is cos I have spent so much time sitting at home feeling crap, so my mind now associates being at home with being anxious.
The plan is to "sanctify" my space
When i started to feel like my old self again,i went out and bought new curtains ,pictures cushions lamps etc for my living room.The stuff i had reminded me of how bad i had felt .Its suprising the diffence it made.makes me feel like im in a new place,a happier place now ! not only in my mind.Ive made a few changes to other rooms,and i associate my home as a place of retreat now ,not some where im reminded of the depression and anxiety id been experiencing. Even changing the furniture around can make a room feel different,its all psychological ,but if it works dont knock it. Hope you have a good day tommorow , Sue
It never ceases to amaze me how Drs seem to know our bodies so much better than we do. I took Lustral - half the recommended theraputic dose and within an hour was being sick, had violent diarrohea, could not see out of one eye - my Dr told me it was coincidental. I tried again a few days later - same thing - perhaps not as coincidental as the Dr thought. It may be that you are sensitive to citolopram and when I took them I started on 5mg and built up to 20mg over a period of 3 weeks. I do remember that I felt as if someone was shaking my head constantly and the anxiety was crippling. It did pass but I had other side effects from them which didn't and I stopped taking them after 6 months. Having tried over 8 varieties of anti depressants and had awful side effects to all, a more sensible Dr has decided they are not for me. Please do not be embarrassed or worried to tell your Dr how you feel. It is his job to listen to you, not judge you and treat you as an individual.
Hi, thanks for replying :)
I have had a brilliant day today but again I felt quite subdued and anxious in the morning, nowhere near as bad as last week though. I've been out all day with my dad again.
The thought of coming home made me feel tense and scared, a bit like I was trapped, but then I thought that my home is my castle and I love being here. I'm not going to get anxious or nervous about it. I'm not going to let myself be afraid of being alone. If I start thinking negatively, I'll change the subject or listen to some music or something.
The panic attacks and anxiety are definitely being caused by the things in my life that I'm scared of, i.e. getting a new job, I sometimes feel like I'm wasting my life and so on. It's got to the point where I expect to feel upset and nervous at home even though there is no immediate threat!
Waking up feeling crap is very tough but it's an illusion caused by fear. I'm going to get through this. I'm going to get back to normal.
Excellent advice Sue, things could do with a slight spruce-up around here :D
Howdy Pot Noodle poppers! God it's been three days since I last posted in this thread. This thread was a lifeline for me back then, and I haven't even looked at it since Friday, so as you can see there has been a lot of progress. I think this thread is drawing to its conclusion.
It would make the suffering of the last few weeks worthwhile if it gives other people some hope.
My recovery is still in progress -- the anxiety is slowly being replaced by feelings of (relatively mild) depression -- but I am hoping that the good stuff will keep on coming, that the depression will fade along with the remaining side effects of my medication.
I have put a lot of mental effort into my recovery and it has led me to face up to a few things that I would rather remain hidden. But you can't hide your problems away. They will find a way out. You must be brutally honest. The only way to be free is to face them and overcome them.
Day 18
* Ability to sleep has returned to normal.
* Appetite and thirst have returned to normal.
* I have regained some of the lost weight.
* Sex drive is returning to normal - now about 50% of usual. I would be happy for it to stay like this to be honest, being a red-blooded male is a pain somethimes.
* Some motivation has returned.
* Not quite as scared of being alone.
* Nebulous mass of anxiety splits into individual problems: lack of self confidence, slight agoraphobia, mild depression. Now I'm not fighting a cloud, I've got specific targets to attack.
* Able to face up to my problems and write down a complete list of everything I am worried about, everything that has contributed to my anxiety, then split them into categories for easy assessment.
* Problem areas identified: comfort zone issues (not wanting to find another job, being afraid of getting into a relationship, worried that family members might die), character flaws (being an anxious person who often looks for the worst in a situation and/or turns a good situation into a bad one) and health issues (worried about suffering from depression, unhappy about having to take medication).
That's embarrassingly honest. I hope that by baring all in this way I encourage others to be equally honest with themselves. You can narrow down a huge list of problems to just a few key areas. Not only does this make things less complicated, it's a huge boost to morale when you realise that your seventeen separate problems are actually related to just two or three issues.
http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q255/nopoet406/psy-pn.jpg
Just as I thought it was going to get better, I have backslid a bit and need to vent. I think a few citalopram users and anxiety/depression sufferers will be familiar with some of this. Please tell me if you are because I could do with some reassurance!
Day 25
* Mood quite positive and upbeat.
* No longer producing excess saliva and not clenching teeth as much. Suffered a migraine (don't think it's citalopram related as I used to get migraine all the time). Had to treat it with paracetamol -- didn't really help much.
Day 26 - 29
* Headaches persist. Fairly severe, but lessening towards the weekend.
* Eyesight feels strained, eyes are tired and aching.
* New side effects: constantly feeling very tired and slightly derealised.
I slipped into a slightly downbeat mood due to the headaches (I now officially suffer from health anxiety!) which worsens when I spend time with my mate who also seems depressed. I was also thinking I might have caught one of the viruses that's been going round.
Day 28
End of first month on citalopram. Feeling upbeat when I see my doctor for a new prescription; I mention the side effects, doctor says things should improve considerably during the next month of treatment. Doctor sets me up with counselling which should start in approximately a week. Went for eye test at opticians - no problems found - kick myself for not really discussing headaches with doctor (they weren't too bad this morning).
Day 29
Anxiety worsens - wake up feeling tense, down, shaky and twitchy like I did during the early days of citalopram. Eyesight still strained and eyes sore, but not as bad as before. Still tired, but had a good night's sleep.
Day 30
Anxiety still bad - very shaky and upset when I woke, scared that I was going back to how I was before. Confided in my dad then went out for day with friend, which greatly improved my mood. Still feel slightly unreal and the front of my brain aches along with my eyes.
I can see why people get so frightened of the idea they're having a brain tumour, even though I know that I do not have a tumour.
Hi PyschoPoet,
I have just recently started Citalopram after being prescribed them by my doctor for Depression / Anxiety. Your posts are good to read.
I found the first pill i took i hadnt eaten anything, it made me feel so rough i felt sick, was having a panic attack. Worst of all it was just as i got into College, i sat down and it started, i ended up walking around the town my College was in for a little while with my friend and then drove home.
Im on Day2 of Citalopram now, took my 20mg dose about 45 minutes ago, noticing slight anxiousness.
When i first went to my doctors, he offered me some sleeping tablets (at the time i didnt think i would need them because my sleep hadnt been too bad) but last night i woke up at 4 in the morning feeling anxious. I fell asleep again about 30 minutes later. I woke up this morning at about 8, kept getting hot and cold flushes so was forced to get out of bed.
Im bit worried that my sleeps not going to be very good, is it worth taking the doctor up on the sleeping meds?
EDIT : I used to be a heavy cannabis smoker until i started getting panic attacks because of it and depression followed suit. I know there are also some underlying problems i have (some possible agoraphobia problems, ive been referred to a counselor who i will be seeing soon) is there anything i need to be doing differently because Cannabis is involved?
I stopped smoking on the Sunday with a strong urge to really not want to do it ever again, i gave away all my materials for it. Been cold turkey since. I think its a bit of a shock to my system as i used to smoke Cannabis everyday.
EDIT : 2 hours since taking my meds, feeling a bit light headed, urinating alot and an anxious feeling. Managing to control the panic though... oh and yawning alot. Is it wise to have a nap? i dont want to not be able to sleep tonight.
Hi mate, you do sound like you've had the usual unpleasant side effects of citalopram. The side effects tend to calm down after a few weeks (2-3 weeks for me) but I still suffer anxiety and feeling down with occasional tiredness. It's ok to sleep if you need to but don't stay in bed all day.
I doubt you will need to do anything different because of the cannabis so long as you stay away from it at all costs! Cold turkey can be very tough and you might find it increases your anxiety for a short while until your body learns to cope without the drug.
If you've got specific issues then the counselling should be a godsend.
Congratulations on giving up cannabis. Many people say it can't harm you and I totally disagree with that, especially after a friend changed personality then started snowballing cocaine when the cannabis was no longer enough. The comedown you get after taking cannabis would only make anxiety and depression feel worse.
Day 31
* Suffering with bad anxiety that made me think I was having a relapse.
Day 32
* Went back to doctor to discuss headaches and anxiety -- doctor says that physical symptoms are due to anxiety with no other underlying cause.
* Spent day on a bike ride with a friend, had a fantastic time. Seeing the doctor boosted my confidence. Had a good evening but anxiety started to creep back at bedtime.
* Family and friends all say they have noticed an overall improvement in me since taking the citalopram; one friend said I'm "not such a stress-head any more".
mysonmarcus
21-04-09, 23:23
Hi Poet
What a great diary I will read through tomorow and write a reply.
Mark
Thanks mate :D
Day 32
* Bad anxiety and feeling down in morning.
* Things picked up in the evening -- thank God for Fallout 3 ;)
Last week I thought I was recovering and I was fairly happy being at home enjoying my own company and doing all the things I used to do.
Now I am finding that I suffer major anxiety attacks when I think about being at home "chilling out" -- normally I love being at home pottering about on the computer or staring at my car with a dreamy expression.
However the anxiety has distorted things so that I often feel "hopeless" when I think about being at home. The thought of everyday things such as helping out in the kitchen, or thinking of certain times of day like dinner time, freaks me out. It's really weird. It sometimes feels like there's no point in me doing anything and that scares me a lot. It makes me scared that I've got depression. Don't ask me why I get so scared about it these days -- the idea of being depressed never scared me before.
I like to get out of the house as much as possible and often feel relieved at the thought of going out. I have started feeling very down and scared at the thought of coming home.
I'm gonna keep fighting it and discuss it with my counsellor.
Day 3, not taken my medication yet, but was going to drop it down to 10mg.
Really strange today actually, i feel so much better today then i have done. It almost felt like something just clicked last night.
Basically i was out and about with my sister shopping, felt so much better then. When i got home alone i started feeling down again. I train regulally doing Muay Thai boxing, so i thought i'll go to my training tonight to see how it makes me feel.
When i first got there i was feeling a bit dodgy, started doing the warm up and started feeling a bit sick (i think thats due to lack of food) so i sat down for a bit watching everyone train. The depression felt like it was setting in again, started feeling low. But then after sitting down watching them for about 30 mins, my energy returned and i wanted to join in again. It was a strange feeling, it just snapped and i felt like "Yea i want to do this" and since then ive been feeling better.
Wierdly enough instead of the useual inner chatterbox saying "your really ill, your never going to feel the same again" instead its been saying "You're strong, you can beat this, take it as a experience you'll learn from it and emerge from it the otherside a stronger peson!"
I know its a bit early to say anything, but it cant be my medication as this is day 3 and ive not even taken it today yet. Unless i have a freakish chemical make up :S
Its given me strength to persue counselling and really stamp out my problems and inner demons once and for all.
Hi Thomson7, good man! Sounds like you might be all right with this medication! Keep going son, it sounds like your mood has become more positive since starting the treatment and positive thinking is the most powerful weapon in your arsenal.
Day 33
* Morning anxiety better than it has been for the last week.
* Mood has been up and down all day, but has been better in general than it was yesterday.
It feels like the battle has really started between myself and my anxiety/depression. The tide turns one way and another which is not particularly easy on me but it seems to show some progress.
I have been finding over the last few weeks that I am trapped in the following cycle:
Morning: Anxiety
Afternoon: Feeling low
Evening: Mood becoming more positive - starting to feel like myself again
Night: Good mood, chatty - feeling like my usual self
Summary of treatment:
Week 1 - Treatment Begins
20mg citalopram, taken at night (9.30pm). Side effects begin. No noticeable benefit from medication.
Week 2 - Side effects continue
Minor signs of improvement in some side effects at very end of week. Anxiety still severe. Ability to sleep begins to return.
Week 3 - First sign of daylight
Change dose to mornings (10.00am). Sex drive, appetite and bility to sleep return to near-normal. Become able to spend time alone without interference from chatterbox. Morning anxiety begins to decrease. Feelings of mild depression occasionally set in once anxiety had faded. Headaches begin.
Week 4 - Redemption denied
Continued reduction in morning anxiety; citalopram appears to be working. However symptoms of mild depression continue. Difficult to tell whether it is depression or just another form of anxiety. Headaches grow worse. Mood begins to worsen at end of week as health anxiety develops (caused by headaches).
Week 5 - The long road
Feelings of depression increase from mild to moderate and do not seem affected by citalopram. Morning anxiety starts to return, although not as badly as weeks 1-2. Citalopram presumably still not reached maximum effect. Subconscious spontaneously fights back against depression and anxiety towards end of week; apparently entering an important phase of recovery process.
Hey you.
Your mood throughout the day sounds similar to mine!
By night time I usually I'm ready for anything (to an extent ) apart from just now (meh)
When I was on citalopram,it really knocked me for 6..I found I was more anxious and emotional on it.
Then the doc cut me straight off it and all hell broke loose.
I hope you're ok love
xxxx
Now then Amy :D
My opinion is, I've been through hell to get this far so I might as well keep going.
I'm sticking with citalopram because in my optimistic moments I believe that things will get better. My parents, my doctor and my closest friend have all said I am getting better since taking citalopram.
What I should have done was arrange counselling as soon as I started on citalopram -- I cannot believe I didn't do that. I could have been in counselling for 4-5 weeks by now and who knows what difference that would have made.
What I also should have done after my failure to arrange counselling, was call the samaritans just to vent and get reassurance. I have been scared to open up in case everything overwhelms me and I was scared that calling samaritans would somehow make things more "real". I think calling them anyway would have made a difference for me.
Ah well, roll on Friday, let's get the pros in to sort the PsychoPoet.
Danny_dingle
22-04-09, 22:10
Hello!
Seeing as you so rudely crashed my 'ladies only' thread (sooo embarrassing! :blush: ) thought I would crash your thread right back! :D
There's no point in thinking about what you 'could' have done matey, at least not until they invent a time machine... :yesyes: I personally think it is best that you have waited for a few weeks until you start the counselling because you will hopefully have stabilised out on the meds now and that way you will have a more consistent mood and will be in a better place to talk about your underlying problems and your feelings.
And on the plus side, you have got a counsellor all lined up now, so hurray for you and getting better! :yahoo:
Let us know how you get on me 'ole pal,
Zuko :roflmao:
Danny_dingle
23-04-09, 11:36
For anyone who has been following Psychopoet's progress and has been helped by it...
http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?p=489873#post489873
Thanks guys xxx
Heh yeah sorry about the ladies only thing, my reasoning is that I'm a ladies' man so surely that counts. :)
Day 34
* Able to discuss problems in depth. Previously I could not go too far into it for fear that it would make me feel too depressed. General levels of fear and depression are reduced afterwards.
* Morning anxiety continues to reduce.
I spent a couple of hours talking about my problems with a good friend last night. I have not been able to discuss my main problems so far as I was scared that I would be overwhelmed with self-pity and depressive feelings, and I was scared that I would only end up feeling hopeless and making things worse.
You know something? We discussed my problems and instead of feeling down or hopeless, I felt unburdened for the first time in months. I actually faced up to the things that are scaring me the most and I didn't freak out, I didn't start crying or poo in my trousers.
I have spent the last eight weeks of my life hiding from a truth that wasn't even scary.
Not only that -- I discovered the root causes of my current anxiety/depression, and just as importantly, I discovered what is not the main cause.
I used to think my dad's apparent heart attack was the main cause of my anxiety. It wasn't. It didn't help of course, and it came at the end of a long series of bad events in my life, but deep down I always knew my dad had not had a heart attack and I knew he was going to get better.
I still experience panic, anxiety and moments of depression. But I've had those on and off all my life. The fact that they have been at their worst in recent weeks simply means I need to deal with them once and for all.
The line must be drawn here! This far, no further! And I will make them pay for what they have done! ;)
Thats it pyscho i cant help but think "Go on my son!!!" :D
I've always been quite in touch with my emotions and open with expressing them, getting it all out really does help. It is as you say like a burden, its like your carrying all this crap around and when you talk about it your taking some of the crap off your shoulders, which then makes it easier to handle.
Im on day 4 now of my medication, felt quite anxious this morning over... well i couldnt even figure out why. I went back to sleep to see if it would help, it did, but i still felt a little anxious. I decided to go do some food shopping to get out the house (lovely day too) and its picked me up no end.
I've decided that getting out of the house, even to do little errands, is helping me alot, so im going to continue to do so everyday.
That's the spirit Thommo me old chuck! When I look back through this diary at the early days I can't believe how scared I was about everything that was happening to me.
I feel hard-bitten and world wise compared to how I was a month ago. "The boy hath become a man." :D
Don't get me wrong, I am still experiencing panic and fear, but I have been content to do my own thing today. I've even been dabbling on Facebook, uploading photos and such. I'm trying to take back the things anxiety took away from me :)
Aw your last post really was very empowering to be honest :)
Well done Mr.
I'm sorry your dad had a heart attack,that must have been so scary but it is so amazing hearing you going and getting better and stuff. AHHHH!
*Gets excited and jigs*
I just find it unbelievable what the mind is capable of doing..
As far as guns,bombs etc..Meh..personaly I think the worst weapon of this world is the mind.
EDIT: I'm going to update this post every week
Side effects I experienced while taking citalopram
Note that my course of treatment has not reached full effectiveness after 5 weeks.
Side effects are listed in order that they started along with the time it took for the side effects to stop from their first appearance. All side effects are marked with a star. Side effects that do not occur any more are in green. If no timescale is shown, the side effects are continuing.
Sinking into Hell - The anxiety and depression set in
Week alpha - Anxiety increasingly interferes with life
To be explained soon.
Week beta - Anxiety becomes intolerable
To be explained soon.
Weeks 1-2: Treading water - The citalopram journey begins
Start taking citalopram, 20mg, at night. Experienced strange physical effects within an hour of taking the citalopram tablet each day.
Week 1 - The week of hell
Anxiety: 10/10
* Increased anxiety at all times [reduced after 3-4 weeks]
* Increased morning anxiety [relented after 3 weeks but later came back in a reduced form]
* Physical symptoms after taking tablet: tremor-like feelings in the brain, highly increased anxiety [6 weeks]
* Severe night-time panic attacks [10 days]
* Waking in early hours [10 days]
* Increased urination [2 weeks]
* Trembling after taking citalopram [6 weeks]
* Shaking in mornings [now only occurs during very bad anxiety]
* Tiredness [2 weeks]
* Weakness [2 weeks]
* Demotivation/demoralisation
* Fearful, unpleasant thoughts, usually reinforcing anxiety - these thoughts increase in strength over the coming months, possibly due to not properly dealing with them when they first appeared
Week 2 - Tough, but getting better towards the end
Anxiety: 10/10
Ability to sleep comes back towards end of week.
* Changed eyesight - blurs of colour [3 days]
* Random tongue movement [7 days]
* Teeth grinding [relented after 3 weeks but still get it occasionally]
* Feelings of nervousness and unfocused fear
* Feelings of mild depression
* Mild headaches [3 weeks - became more severe then disappeared]
Weeks 3-5: First benefits of citalopram
Changed to taking citalopram in the mornings to avoid sleeplessness and night-time panic attacks.
Week 3 - Relief
Anxiety: 6/10
Most side effects have reduced in strength or disappeared by this point. Citalopram appears to be settling down and gives hope that the medication is working.
* Headaches grow stronger [2 weeks]
Week 4 - Starting a backwards slide (the first blip)
Anxiety: 8/10
Citalopram feels ineffective by end of week. Realise that medication alone will not help, but still feel unable to seek further support due to high levels of anxiety and fear that talking about my problems will make depression worse.
* "Nervous" feelings increase
* Headaches increase due to migraine [1 week]
* Health anxiety develops due to headaches [abates after 1 1/2 weeks]
* Depression becomes moderate which increases feelings of fear
Week 5 - The fight begins
Anxiety: 7/10
Citalopram seems to be fighting against feelings of depression. Spend more time feeling happy and content, but anxiety and feelings of fear persist. The fear has "detached" itself so that it floats around freely with no specific trigger.
* Nervousness increases into a sense of lurking fear - feels "free-floating" and occurs whenever I go anywhere or do anything; fear is still manageable
* Headache strength decreases dramatically
* Health anxiety focuses on the health of other people instead (my dad and brother)
* Moods become more "up and down" and usual daily routine of anxiety -> depression -> remission -> recovery becomes random
Weeks 6-10: The fight-back begins a.k.a. "a painful rebirth"
Side effects begin to decline or disappear altogether during this period. No longer notice any physical effects after taking citalopram tablets. During this period I finally become able to talk about my problems which puts me on road to recovery.
Week 6 - Starting to recover
Anxiety: 6/10
Identified depression as major problem and launched all-out attack on it. Added helpful vitamins and minerals to diet. Became able to share my problems with others. Became more sociable. Became slightly more confident and much better able to cope with depression and anxiety.
* Depression replaces anxiety as the "main" symptom
* Morning anxiety greatly decreases in strength
* Moods remain more stable, generally happier
* Easy to distract myself from problems
* Spending more time in the real world and less time online
Week 7 - Therapy provokes a blip (the second blip)
Anxiety: 7/10
The week started well and then I had counselling, which seemed to provoke anxiety and feelings of helplessness. Went onto another backward slide which made me need more reassurance than ever.
* Generalised fear now replaces depression as the "main" symptom
* General anxiety returns but not as strongly as before
* Chatterbox returns in strength and is hard to ignore
* Become obsessed with my problems once more
* Need more support than over the last week or two
* Spending more time online seeking reassurance on NMP
Week 8 - Say hello to my old self
Anxiety: 6/10
This is the first week that I genuinely started feeling like my old self. I did a lot of soul-searching this week and managed to find a few startling truths.
* Realised that stress may be the real problem; anxiety is just a symptom of stress; fear and depression are provoked by the anxiety.
* Developed an uncontrollable need to talk about my problems; venting on NMP and talking to family and friends seemed to relieve some kind of pressure in my brain; the painful "knot" of tension in my brain begins to come undone.
* Becoming slightly obsessed with my problems.
* Feelings of depression back off as soon as I realise the main problems are anxiety and stress; realise that depression has only ever been a minor, but distressing, part of the overall problem.
* Recovery from "blip" of the previous week.
* Began online CBT (http://www.livinglifetothefull.com) and took medical tests which show my depression is minor compared to the anxiety.
* Able to go for a full week without relying on Mind or the Samaritans.
* Spent a great deal of time on my own doing hobbies and getting myself organised to fight back against depression and anxiety.
Week 9 - Anxiety mounts a counter-attack (the third blip)
Anxiety: 7/10
Bugger. I thought my anxiety was on the run. If this is a battle, my forces were pushing steadily through enemy territory capturing all their objectives; but the anxiety is much, much tougher than expected and has begun to mount stiff resistance. How can a beaten enemy fight so hard? I feel like I'm being pushed back on every front.
* Re-took the CBT tests which show an increase in anxiety but a reduction in depression.
* Anxiety increases in strength and remains with me through most of the day. "Venting" still helps but anxiety returns soon after.
* Ran out of inositol, which co-incides with the increase in anxiety.
* Managing to reduce my "obsession" with my problems and symptoms, including tearing up the extensive notes I made for my counselling session.
* Started talking about my problems in depth to my best friend.
Week 10 - The first good week
Anxiety: 3/10
Week 10 got off to a strong start when I started taking inositol again, identified more of the "root causes" of my major problems and - most importantly of all - applied for a job. This was the first week where every day was good.
* Able to distract myself almost all of the time.
* Motivation and positivity return, allowing me to spend more time doing things I enjoy and spending time alone.
* Inositol, citalopram, therapies and positive thinking continue to make progress with no setbacks.
Weeks 11-12: The fight for recovery becomes a war
Week 11 - Anxiety retaliates (the fourth blip)
Anxiety: 7/10
Counselling triggers a low mood after a whole week of feeling good. Week 11 proves to be challenging mentally and emotionally, and is a time for facing up to certain problems. It is very difficult to tell who won this week: me, or the anxiety.
* Begin to realise I may not be ready to face up to everything just yet as it is still too soon.
* Distressing thoughts - fear of depression, death, suicide and illness - which I have experienced for weeks now become the major problem, but prove tougher to deal with than other issues.
* Now feeling nearly ready for a job -- for the first time in 8 months. Realise that getting a decent job could complete the recovery process.
* Reduced concentration.
Week 12 - A blitzkreig of distressing thoughts
Anxiety: 8/10
The fourth blip continues as I deal with the consequences of facing my negative thoughts. This is the worst blip so far; this week is the first in a while where I didn't make any progress with my recovery. In fact I slipped backwards a little bit. Eventually I decide to book a course of hypnotherapy to address some of my problems.
* Booked hypnotherapy sessions to deal with anxiety, stress, lack of confidence, difficulty relaxing and upsetting negative thoughts.
* Distressing thoughts become more prevalent, causing feelings of depression, hopelessness and fear.
* Morning anxiety returns in strength.
* Need more support from Mind and Samaritans.
* Become more willing to look for a job, but need support to do so.
* Realise more of the reasons behind my negative thinking; need to have some aims and objectives in life, something to replace the fear.
Week 13 - The line must be drawn here, this far, no further [CURRENT WEEK]
Anxiety: 5/10 [so far]
* Counsellor refers me to anxiety/CBT specialist, though counselling sessions will continue until the CBT begins.
* Incidence of negative thoughts reduces as I switch tactics, and as I slowly and painfully get used to them.
* Begin to understand more of what is triggering these negative thoughts - e.g. the underlying fears which need to be resolved.
Pyscho, did you say you've tried some Cognitive Behavioural Therapy?
A friend of mine who went through depression / agoraphobia swears by it.
Ive started doing it myself, its all free to sign up and do the tutorials.
http://www.livinglifetothefull.com/
P.S Keep your chin up m8, your doing really well. You've come a long way.
I thought that my last counsellor (who I saw a couple of years ago because of stress) was a cognitive behavioural therapist but I just looked her up on her website and she doesn't make any mention of it there.
She actively encouraged me to look for solutions to my own problems. She was awesome. I had to pay for the sessions at £30 a time so I only saw her a few times.
The NHS counsellor should be free. I swear, if she doesn't phone me by 10am tomorrow, I'm going to ring her. I really need this!! I think it might eventually lead to a cure for me.
I also swear by talking therapies as you can tell :D
Thanks for the link and the encouragement mate, I will check it out!
Day 5 for me,
Feel pretty good. Actually got a uninterupted sleep last night wierdly enough. Took me quite awhile to get to sleep though. Exercise is a massive help, the endorphins really do make you feel alot better.
Got a almost empty feeling, but i think that might be down to the fact ive quit smoking Cannabis, which took up a big portion of my life for the past 5 years.
Thomson, there may be down days as well as up days over the coming weeks, so don't worry too much about it.
A friend of mine used to take drugs and he has told me a couple of times that he wishes he never had, cos he sometimes feels down for no reason (it always wears off though) and he attributes this to cannabis and other substances.
EDIT:
Oh, I forgot, I'm now entering week 6 and things have become a lot more hopeful. My counselling starts in 2 weeks and my mood has greatly improved.
I still feel anxious but the anxiety simply feels "empty", as though I am anxious out of habit rather than because there is anything serious causing it. I can't tell you what a relief that is :happy:
Righty ho I'm off to play Fallout 3 and get out on my bike again :biggrin:
Another update, cos I need a rant:
Today has been less "up and down" for me than the last few days. It's been mostly an "up" day today thank God :D
I had to take my dad to a&e but he was fine, it was just a regular nosebleed not connected to blood pressure.
I've noticed a couple of problems though. I am very happy and content when I'm busy, but when I'm finished whatever it is I'm doing and I come back to the real world, I feel anxious and scared again. It's similar to the mornings. I go to bed happy and have pleasant dreams but when I wake up I feel tense and anxious all over again.
I seem to have developed a lurking sense of fear which I didn't get in the early stages. It is not nice. I am hoping that the citalopram is reducing my anxiety and this is how that feels. The "fear" is nowhere near as tough to deal with as the anxiety. I have really been through the grinder and unfocused fear does not daunt me that much.
My health anxiety has gone. I now worry about my dad and brother instead! I can't win!
What upsets me the most is when I think about going through all this again tomorrow then the day after and so on. Really, I'm bored because I'm stuck in a rut, but the problem is I am afraid to get OUT of the rut. (This is the major cause of my problems.)
The anxiety and feelings of depression are unpleasant but they're not the end of the world. Trouble is, when I am actually experiencing them, they really get to me and rob me of my confidence.
My counselling won't start for 2 weeks. I am actually hoping I will be recovering by then. When the depression and anxiety fade, I realise how far I've come in the last 2 months, and it shows me that recovery is possible.
Being up and down is a pain in the bumhole.
Day 35
* Still up and down, but more up than down
* Sense of lurking fear begins to take the place of anxiety and depression
* Better able to cope with anxiety
* Finding it much easier to be content and occupied
* Health anxiety has gone; replaced by worrying about the health of others!
* Started taking Omega-3 and Zinc supplements as these are known to be effective in alleviating the symptoms of depression
Hi PsychoPoet,
I have just been prescribed Citalopram 20mg, and am putting off taking it until I'm convinced I absolutely need it. How is it going for you? Hope you had a better night the second time round!!
Sarah :)
Oh sorry, my laptop didn't load the rest of the posts after Monday! So ignore the question in the last message as you've already answered it :) xx
Hi Poet :)
How is your dad? I hope he is feeling better?
Your post is similar to how I am feeling.
I want to get out of the rut that I am in because there is no way I am spending years having my life ruined by agoraphobia and anxiety, that is caused my myself.
The thought of getting out of the rut and getting my life back scares me but not half as much as he thought of being agoraphobic for a long time which fills me with dread so much that as of tomorrow I am going out every single day, whether I find it difficult or not, whether I am with someone or not.
I think it can be very easy to slip into a rut of how we feel and get into a comfort zone of saying I have anxiety and therefore cant do this because of how I may feel or that or I am agoraphobic and cant go here or there. I know how difficult it is, and how scary it can be to get out of that rut because I am in one and trying to get out of it is not going to be easy but whats the alternative - still be sat typing away about the same old issues a year on from now? No way.
This time last year I was really ill - hospitalised -and this time this year I am so much better so I can see an improvement and hopefully this time next year I will be even better.
Like you said you are bored...thats how I am...staying indoors for me drives me mad,when I cant get out with anyone. I have noticed I am finding it 'too safe' being in my my little comfort zone at home, excusing myself for not doing this and that by saying I have anxiety and I have agoraphobia, and I know that if I dont do something drastic to get myself out of this rut I know I could easily spend years as I am being agoraphobic. That would be awful. I am not allowing myself to ruin my life by living like a pensioner.
I work from home which helps but I truly think that being out at work is beneficial to our mental well being, than ever being stuck at home is. I am sure a lot of how we feel would be relieved by working, despite it being, for me anyway, scary, to get back to working in a busy office again. However whats the worst that could happen? Have a panic attack? I have them at home, so I may as well have them at work. I have never had a panic attack at work and thats probably because there are other people around, and I am busy working and that keeps me distracted. Being at home gives me far too much time to wallow in my issues. Its not good.
You sound such a positive intelligent optimistic person and I am sure that eventually you will be much better because you truly sound like you want to improve your circumstances and not just be content to wallow in them.
I hope the CBT works for you. :yesyes:
Wow Poppy, thank you for that, it made me feel better :D
I had to take my dad back to hospital again at 12.30pm last night with bad nose bleeding. I will cut the long and exhausting story short by saying he is absolutely fine, it's just "one of those things" caused by shoving those Vicks sprays up his schnozz and sneezing like a nuclear explosion.
The fight back against depression has begun. I have realised that my recovery is too gradual and I am causing myself unnecessary suffering. I was not going to get better any time soon if I carried on as I am doing. Here's the story for those who are interested:
I went on a night out with seven mates last night and realised how hard I am finding it to socialise. My current social circle is my best mate, his bird and my immediate family. I get stressed and upset when I have to deal with anyone else. Normally I love going out with loads of people. This showed me how far things have changed and how much work I have got to do.
I have ordered chromium picolinate, inositol and magnesium tablets from Holland & Barretts as these vitamins and minerals are are known to be effective in alleviating the symptoms of depression. I'm already taking Omega-3 and zinc supplements.
I spoke to my mum about my depression and anxiety last night for the first time. Normally I share my problems, I don't know why I have kept all of this to myself. I think I was scared of "infecting" other people with it.
My mum was fine about it and I was glad I spoke to her. I like to stay positive where possible and we discussed how far I've come since I started treatment. It made me happier to talk to her again this morning when I woke with bad anxiety which again lifted my mood slightly.
This morning I phoned Samaritans for the first time. I haven't done this before because I see them as the last line of defence: I was terrified that I would have a breakdown and wallow in depression if I called them. These fears were totally unfair and unrealistic. Anyone who logs into NMP and tries to help others is doing the same thing as the Samaritans. I don't know why I had this negative view of Samaritans.
I spoke to a woman for over half an hour. She showed respect, patience, politeness and professional compassion. I was shaking with anxiety at the start of the call and by the end she told me how much calmer I sounded. The Samaritans don't fix your problems: they let you vent about them, they give you someone to run to. She did ask questions at some points and helped me to clarify a few things.
My anxiety pretty much died down from 8 out of 10 to 5 out of 10. I was able to cope with my parents yelling at each other afterwards and sorted their argument out with an ease and calmness I have rarely shown before.
I have got 2 weeks to go til my counselling. Given that I only get six 50-minute sessions at two week intervals, I need to be doing a lot more to overcome my problems; counselling alone probably won't fix me :(
I'm disappointed, but now I have learned that it is not scary or a bad thing to go to my family and I realise I can always call Samaritans even during weird hours. I'm also going to contact a local organisation called Mind who run a drop-in centre for people with any type of mental or emotional problem. If my morning anxiety is still bad by Friday I'm going to demand my doctor do something about it.
I still feel down and nervous but I guess I've come this far, things change every week, so I've got to believe this will change too.
EDIT:
I took a Kalm as well which made me feel tired but may have slightly taken the edge off my anxiety (maybe 5%?).
Day 36
* Finally accepted that I am suffering from depression
* Started to share problems with family
* Shared problems with Samaritans
* Began to look for long-term solutions to the anxiety/depression-causing problems
* Depression and anxiety still present, but depression seems to be "taking over" from the anxiety as my major symptom, which could mean the citalopram has dragged it out into the open where it can be dealt with
* Ordered inositol (vitamin B-8) 650mg, chromium picolinate 200mg and magnesium 250mg as these are known to be effective against depression and anxiety
Hi, Cut one in half for tonight. See if that is any better. Do what suits you. Build it up slowly as your body accepts the meds.
Your gp could change the medication if it doesn't suit you.
I will be thinking of you tonight, how brave you are.
Bob
Thanks mate. I've been on 20mg since I started six weeks ago and I have had a very tough time with it, but when I look back there has been some improvement in my condition and most of the side effects have disappeared.
I don't know if lowering the dose will help me as my depression has "come out" a bit now the anxiety is reduced (as if the depression was hiding behind it) and I want the citalopram to work on it as soon as possible, even if that means I have to suffer a while longer. I would rather feel anxious than depressed.
But I will definitely be seeing my doctor in a week. I want to discuss this with him and find out whether the benefits of me taking citalopram are ever going to outweigh the problems. He's going to be so pleased to see me again.
Things done to fight back against anxiety and depression:
(effectiveness of each in brackets, n/a means too early to tell, note that low scores simply indicate the treatments have not had time to be fully effective yet)
* Citalopram 20mg [4/10]
* Counselling [n/a]
* Taking one Kalm tablet when required [3/10]
* Speaking to family and friends [8/10]
* Speaking to Samaritans [6/10]
* Positive thinking [6/10]
* Taking supplements: zinc, magnesium, omega-3, chromium picolinate and inositol [n/a]
lemongrass6
25-04-09, 19:56
I don't want this to sound patronising I mean it very well as I have suffered and still do on occasions of the same thing. Sometimes when I take my tablet I worry for some reason. I think it may be that I know I'm putting a drug into my body and am not sure what it could do. My heart often beats faster and I start to feel sick and retch. therefor making me think I am having a reaction when actually I think it is my body trying to protect me from something "possibly" harmful but not intentionally. If you are really worried it is best to just tell your doctor you would like to change medication, I have had to do this many times and don't worry about what he thinks. Remember it's YOUR body and he can't force you to take something that is making you feel uncomfortable. Sometimes medication just doesn't suit. Hope this helps in some way. x
Hi Lemongrass, I would say I am an anxious type of person, but I seem to be developing a full-blown fear of everything and that isn't like me, I have built up so much confidence and experience over the last 2 years and I feel like it's all been taken away.
Maybe it's not the medicine. Maybe it is just something to do with my anxiety and depression. I just wish I could see into the future so I knew how this was going to turn out!
Woke up today WITHOUT anxiety! Spent a while listening to music and texting friends while working out some of my problems the old-fashioned way -- with pen and paper!! The music and friendship assuaged any anxiety and depression I might otherwise have felt and I think I got a lot straightened out ready for counselling.
One thing I'm worried about -- I get trembling after taking citalopram. This is different to the shaking I get with anxiety. My trembling is in my arms, shoulders and "manly boob muscles". I don't want to stress, but I am worried about the long term implications of this, as it is one of the only side effects I am still experiencing. I'm halfway through week 6.
Will this go away, or should I advise my doctor?
EDIT: I have spent about half of today in a state of mild euphoria -- in other words, I've been quite happy! Now I'm worried I've got euphoria as a side effect -- I didn't even consider that I might simply be feeling a bit better! Looks like I've still got a bit of the old health anxiety!
Awww ,I sometimes feel weird and anxious almost at feeling better heh,it's an odd feeling :)
I'm not much use right now for advice love but you should discuss with your doc about certain things that are troubling you like the trembling and stuff.
I'm happy you wok eup without the anxiety. That is marvellous :)
*jigs*
Citalopram is a funny one I think.
I was on 30 or 40 mg..not sure but it just made me a bit more whacky than usual xxxxxxxxxxx
Day 37
* Woke with only minor morning anxiety (usually it's quite severe)
* Sustained good mood through most of day, feeling of calmness and positivity
* Usual feelings of fear starting to change into excitement and anticipation
* Ability to socialise improves
* Chatterbox falls silent
* Able to calmly look at problems and find ways to deal with them
* Feelings of depression are reduced - able to suppress them more easily
* Feeling like recovery process has properly kicked in
Day 38
* Morning anxiety still at a very low level
* No feelings of depression - now able to deal with them if they occur
Looks like things are turning upwards, so either the citalopram is kicking in, or my efforts to turn things around are working. I still feel a bit shaky and nervous, and having thought about it I feel it could just be anxiety and nerves rather than a physical side effect of the medicine, otherwise I would be trembling all day rather than just an hour or two?
I should point out that I've been taking omega-3 for 2 days now. It's renowned for helping with depression. It seems a coincidence that my sustained good mood occurs just after I start taking it.
This also appears to prove that you CAN recover from a "blip".
I find that when I'm bored in the afternoons, like I am at the moment, I start feeling a bit down. But my good mood is still strong. I hate it when it's raining and everyone is busy, I end up feeling like I'm wasting time ;)
Aww..I get like that too. If you feel better,you're most definitely not wasting time.
Not at all for a mini second.
People with mental probs always really have to try and keep occupied with some sort of thing otherwise the mood can dip,with myself anyways too.
But you're still feeling good in general so *happy dance*
:)
x
Heh, Cheers Amy :D
I find that the worst time of day for me is dinner time (between 5pm and 7pm). This is the most repetitive time of day as it's always the same. My parents watch the same programmes, we usually eat the same sort of things. These days I have been "anaesthatising" myself by going on the computer to distract myself from boredom and anxiety and I can't do that while I'm having my dinner, so that probably contributes.
I don't know, my good mood usually evaporates around this time of day like it is now, but I know it will come back later.
Day 39
* Morning anxiety was absent
* General anxiety reduced to an occasional background murmur
* Feelings of depression rarely occurred
* Feelings of optimism and hope gain strength
* Started to feel the goold old sense of "wonder" which I used to have before the anxiety started
I've built up a support network of friends, I talk to my family now and I always know the Samaritans are there if I need them (I can't believe I only called them once -- four days ago -- and I still feel good for doing it!).
My depression-fighting vitamin supplements are on their way, I've got into a routine with my medication and omega-3 pills and I find it much easier to handle difficult and depressing situations without being affected.
I am not quite so worried about spending time alone. My fear has transformed into a sort of nervous excitement which is fairly empowering to me and makes me feel more in charge of myself. In fact my outlook has changed so much in the last week that I feel as if everything I've been through has been a bad dream and I am finally waking up back to my old life.
The world is still the same; I'm the one who's changed. I like to think that in many ways I am a better person for this.
I still feel "weak" though, as if I am in a state of fragile peace -- I've felt bad for so long that I can't fully trust this feeling of relief. If I carry on feeling good for a few days I will officially believe that I am recovering.
I still get nervous thoughts about "what if this is just the calm before the storm", "what if I get depressed again", and I know I haven't beaten most of my problems yet. But hope survives, and while there is hope, recovery is in sight.
Hey..I have been like that. You're scared to actually feel better because it might not last. Or it just feels odd.
You have came a long way mr :)
Don't make me dance on you!
jillmarion
28-04-09, 19:08
Hi all. Please take the time to read this as I am desperate for reassurance! :hugs:
Yesterday, my doctor put me on citalopram because I have been suffering from severe anxiety with possible depression. I took my first tablet (20mg, the lowest dose for depression) last night about 9.45pm. I also took ibuprofen for a headache.
I very quickly started feeling ill. As in, within 10-30 minutes of taking the citalopram and ibuprofen. I went to bed. It felt like someone was rummaging through my brain, my thoughts were racing and I had a huge anxiety attack, my eyes were unfocused and a bit crossed and I felt dizzy and nauseous. I actually thought I'd been poisoned.
I got up for a wee and the dizziness and unfocused vision disappeared as soon as I stood up, which is weird, and they didn't come back! I realised I'd been lying there suffering for 3 hours!!!, so I phoned NHS Direct (this is at 2 in the morning), who said it sounded like the tablets were perhaps too strong, and I should go to my doctor first thing in the morning. They said ibuprofen does not interact with citalopram and was not responsible for my symptoms.
I felt a hundred times better after that and went straight to sleep.
My doctor was a bit annoyed with me this morning, although still very polite and professional, saying there was no way the citalopram could have affected me so quickly as it takes 3-4 hours to enter the blood. This means my symptoms would have started by half past 1, instead of half past 10.
In his opinion I'd suffered a panic attack.
I used citalopram a few years ago, but can't remember if I had any side effects. I was only on it for 3 months. The doctor said that was further evidence that it should be safe to stick with citalopram.
I'm scared to take my citalopram tonight but the doctor has said I must try to continue with the course instead of giving up after one day.
Has anyone else ever been like this after taking one tablet? Am I being silly and scaring myself to death, or does it sound like citalopram is not the drug for me?
Please help, I am terrified about tonight!!
Hi,
I called into a chemist and asked what i could take for pain and I was told under no circumstances take ibuprofen the only pain killer that I was told was ok is paracetmal.
Hope you are ok now !!!
Take care
Jill
Aargh, I'm being danced on by a Scottish bird! You wouldn't believe what's hiding behind her sporran!! :happy:
Well I managed to get through my third day of happiness! Today is the first time in two months that I've been to my best mate's house without feeling uber-anxiety or moderate depression (that's not a reflection on him by the way ;)) and I was frightened I would revert to the way I was before.
But guess what? Instead of reliving bad memories, I made some new happy ones. We had a laugh, mucked around, went for a walk and a drive, he didn't offer me a cup of tea this time but I'll let that slide.
I keep expecting to go back to being depressed. The more happy days I have, the more stupid that fear is going to look.
Oh and I finally managed to get an hour on Fallout 3. *brandishes his captured flamethrower* :D
Day 40
* Anxiety and depression are reduced to the background
I'm still finding myself in a state of "fragile peace" and I phoned my local MIND this afternoon. The people there were so kind, they heard me out for about 15 minutes and told me when I could come down to see them. I'm going on Friday evening for an hour or so. I can't wait!
I really think that if I could have seen my counsellor this week it would have been ideal but MIND are a brilliant support organisation and I am probably going to be relying more on them than anyone or anything else!
I phoned Samaritans in the afternoon because I needed to do something to tackle my problems now, while I am feeling strong. The woman was very considerate and let me ramble on for ages. I actually tried to summon the feelings of fear and depression so that I could confront them while talking to someone who could help. I feel better for venting.
The main cause of my depression is still the feeling that I am "wasting time", or not doing something that I should be doing. But I'm in no state to go for another job just yet. It's such a stupid thing and yet it makes me feel so crap! I can't wait to overcome this.
I'll let you know how I get on at MIND.
Woke up feeling slightly more anxious and down than I have for a while dammit... but I dindt sleep too well, and I seem to feel worse whenever I'm tired. Gonna keep busy today as that seems to work!
purple to black
30-04-09, 16:56
You, PsychoPoet are an inspiration to me!
I love reading your posts!
Now i just need to be able to ram that wee pill down my throat and hope for better days!
Surely i cant feel any worse than i do now. :)
Hey, this is a good idea.. its like a diary. I'm on citalopram as well ans I have to say apart from feeling nauseous for a few weeks I've had no serious side effects. People react differently to different drugs though.
Day 41
* Mood fluctuates between highly positive and somewhat depressed
Day 42
* Mood stabilises somewhat
I have been using MIND and the Samaritans in order to stop my positive mood turning into a downer. Their support has been very useful to me.
I am finding that my recovery is going through "up and down" stages. I accept that this is the case and it's gonna be tough, and by accepting it I find that I am no longer afraid.
Hey not posted in awhile so thought i'd check back.
Im coming upto my second week on Citalopram, most the side effects have gone for me and the medication seems to be working, no longer feeling depressed or anxious (apart from occasions i feel a little anxious)
My main thing is that ive been having the freakiest dreams ive ever had in my life. They arent particulally scary, just really really f**king wierd. Feels like im actually there instead of it being like a hazy vision.
This could be withdrawel from smoking cannabis for like 5 years though too.
This post has been automatically edited by the NMP post filter
Hi Thomson, I haven't really had citalopram dreams, but I often have vivid and bizarre dreams anyway lol. I learned years ago that dreams are just by-products of the things we think and experience. :)
I wonder if anyone can help me. As I said in this thread (http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?t=46764), I used to have strong "surges" of what felt like cold liquid or poison in the sides of my brain before a major anxiety or depression attack. I still occasionally get them before a downer. They are very weak now though, I barely even notice them.
Does anyone think I am experiencing "brain zaps" or do I need to see my doctor about this? Surely I should not be physically able to feel a downer coming on? This is probably the last health-related anxiety I still have. I hope someone can help me with this.
You would definately know if you were having a brain zap Poet! :scared15:
Its your anxiety creating symptoms for you to take notice of! It definately dont like being ignored,thats for sure.My advice is : pay no attention and show the little beast the door , TAKE CARE, and have a good w/e. Sue
..
Thanks, that is reassuring. I'll still speak to my doctor about it when I get my next prescription as I've never heard of anyone else experiencing this and I would like peace of mind.
I've been using music to soothe myself through moments where I felt fear or negativity returning. I am now in a very comfortable and enjoyable routine with this and it has helped me a lot.
I've been out most of the day at a barbecue. When I got home I spent a lot of time with my family then went out onto the back garden to clean my bike (which I've rarely bothered to do in nearly 2 years) then sit on our swing chair reading my favourite book. I listened to my mp3 player on a very low volume which really helped to put me at ease. I feel like I'm driving my fears back day by day.
Day 43
* Mood remains stable throughout day; it is now much easier to distract myself from negative thoughts and feelings.
* Appetite is back to normal.
* Inositol seems to start taking effect.
Day 44
* Mood remains positive for the entire day -- just a little bit of morning anxiety which was dealt with fairly quickly.
* Now in a "distraction" routine which is very helpful and brings me a lot of relief.
* Motivation starts to return.
* Appetite is increased - feel "hunger pangs" occasionally which feel like the pangs I get when my blood sugar is low e.g. if I've skipped a meal or gone too long without food.
Hi
Would you let me know what your Doctor says about brain zaps as it would be interesting as I get them all the time.
Thank you
Sharona :)
Ok but it won't be until the end of this week or the start of next week :)
I've been in a buzzing, happy mood for the first half of the day, but I realise that I've spent the last few days ignoring my problems. I needed time out to "heal" myself. But now it's time to start facing up to reality. Facing things again has brought my mood down a bit and I had a reasonably positive meeting with one of the MIND staff today.
With hindsight I wish I had waited until counselling this Friday cos I feel that I have brought myself back down to earth too early. I should have allowed myself to enjoy a few more days of freedom. Ah well, it's done now, I'll just have to deal with it!
Days 45-46
* Moods more or less stable; anxiety and depression are under control.
* Feeling ready to start facing up to things (but not particularly wanting to!).
The counselling starts in 2 days. God I can't believe it is almost time to start. Two weeks ago I felt lost and hopeless at the thought of having to spend 2 weeks waiting for counselling to start.
In that time, I have spoken to Samaritans, I've visted Mind several times and I have started to open up to friends. My anxiety and depression have been reigned in so that they no longer dominate my thoughts all the time. I've started some of my hobbies again (I've even started a new one!) and I've got a date next week!
What a difference 14 days can make when you are determined to change.
I phoned my counsellor to confirm the booking and she said I am not restricted to just 6 sessions -- although the majority of her clients are able to go it alone after that time. If I need further support she will provide it.
I can't tell you what a relief this is.
I get frightened when I think of everything that's to come. Then I remember what I've been through. I haven't just survived my anxiety, I have torn my way through it with all guns blazing and yelling "For England!" at the top of my voice :D
Hi, just to let you know I agree with the others, I was given citalopram 2 years ago and I was started on 10 and worked up to 40.
I felt a bit odd when I first started taking them and like you I was unsure whether it was a panic attack or the meds. Things settled down a little after about 2 weeks.
I stayed on citalopram for about 9 months and then they changed my meds.
As time went on I realised that some of my symptoms I put down to side effects were actually part of my illness and nothing to do with the drugs.
It can be scary starting a drug (even if you have used it in the past) I hope things settle down for you.
lots of luck
Maz
Hi Maz, the side effects have practially all vanished now. :D It's been tough getting to this point but now things are definitely better for me and I am glad I persevered.
Sharona, I'm seeing my doctor tomorrow to discuss my last couple of concerns and to get my third months' prescription. I'm going to make it clear to him that I want to have a discussion and won't be cashiered out of the door after 20 seconds! I will report back anything I learn about "brain zaps".
Day 47
* Recovery continues.
I went to MIND again today and we had an enlightening discussion about where I am now and where I want to be. A couple of things came up that I hadn't thought about. This is getting interesting. I thought I knew myself inside out. Goes to show that an outsider's perspective can be totally different to our own.
Only one thing came up that worried me: the person at MIND said that I demonstrate symptoms of "manic depression" or bipolar disorder. I have high moods which crash into downers. There is a very pronounced difference between the highs and lows. I have started spending money and becoming giddy during my good moods. The good moods melt straight into downers. There is little "levelling off", I'm either burning with excitement or down in the dumps. I tend to have grand plans that I rarely follow through on and I start lots of things that I can't finish.
It's probably not as bad as I've made it sound. I'm gonna talk to my counsellor tomorrow and see what she thinks.
I was told in the past that I am "not mentally ill" which I assume means I am not suffering from bipolar disorder. I'm also gonna discuss this with my doctor as I want to get this resolved now.
hiya psychopoet. im glad to be reading, your feeling so much better now! im new to this citalopram, so still trying to take in all "side effects" but did you feel at all, that the back of your neck started to stiffen up to the point that when you move your head, it feels like its going to roll off? (a bit like when your having an anxiety attack, but not quite the same!) oooh its hard to explain. i just know its making me feel horrible! im glad i found this site, other wise, i would of stopped these tabs on the 1st day. and panicing about them alot more then what i am. x
Hi all, I have been to the doctor and I discussed all my concerns with a student doctor and the main man himself. While they were interested in the idea of me having "hyper" or "manic" periods, they did not feel that I am bipolar as they said the manic phase is very difficult to control -- their example was running naked down the street. So far I have never felt the urge to take my clothes off.
When I asked if I could be bipolar, my doctor replied with "it's not impossible" but that choice of wording suggested he thinks it is unlikely!
I also asked about "brain zaps" and the funny feelings I get in my brain before an anxiety attack or a downer. Both doctors agreed that these were caused by anxiety rather than anything else.
I was with my counsellor for over an hour and a half! What a first session! Then I went to MIND and I was with them for nearly the same amount of time. I felt very chilled and relaxed afterwards but of course when I was almost home I started to feel depressed. This always seems to happen after I have talked about my problems. I think it's caused by leaving a safe, comforting environment and being on my own. I also tend to go onto a downer directly after feeling good.
I feel that I have learned a lot. I'm not entirely sure that this first session of counselling was much help -- it's early days yet and we did discuss a lot, so maybe there was just too much to take in. Maybe I'll start feeling the benefit later today or tomorrow.
I think there is a long way to go and I won't be completely fixed any time soon... hopefully the recovery will continue gradually, one step at a time.
Oh, and I also feel some of my anxiety coming back! This happens every time I try to deal with my problems! I feel so vulnerable and afraid when I'm on my own -- it's like I need people around me 100% of the time!
Glad the Dr comfirmed the brain zaps as anxiety Poet.Something less to worry about.Your feelings of being hyper and then on a downer are what i used to be like with my depression only eventually the good feelings got less and less .I have a good friend who is Bi -polar ,and you dont sound to me like you have that.Your good moods only seem to change when the time of being at home on your own with nothing to do happen. You seem to be happy doing something all the time ?and find it hard to enjoy your own company and relax properly.Too much self analysis isnt good for you , it just feeds the anxiety. Im sure the counselling will be a help to you but as you say itll probably be small steps,like the rest of this process.Good luck with the date next week. Have a good w/e Sue:hugs:
Hi
Thanks for the info re brain zaps, I am glad you asked. I am going to my doctors in the morning as I had them really bad yesterday and felt giddy when they came on. I find it strange as I got them as soon as I was driving home, I was a bit anxious as I was on my own. I am on my 9th week of seroxat and do feel a little bit better but have moments where I am not sure what to do with myself which are scary but the leaflet does say you may get them. i will discuss this with my Doctor tommorow and let you know. I am glad you feel a little better.
Thank you
Sharona :hugs:
Hi, thanks everyone :D
had a brilliant night at my mate's and my first ever monster truck arrived tonight (it's a nitro-powered remote control one, not a real car!) so I am buzzing. It's good that I am able to control my downers in this way and I like to think it gives hope to others who feel depressed or anxious.
Sharona, I don't know much about seroxat but I do know that "brain zaps" are a known side effect of medication. They are not harmful in any way but you should have a word with your doctor if you are worried. People can also suffer from brain zaps when they are coming off medication (withdrawal symptoms).
Hi
I know they say you get them from withdrawul but I am not coming off them at the moment, I will have a word with her today.
Well done, i am glad you have had a good night.
Sharona
Hi, let us know what your doctor said about brain zaps. As far as I know they are normal and nothing to worry about.
My anxiety has come back -- I've been feeling anxious all day, nowhere near as bad as before but still not very nice. I am surrounded by people but sometimes I feel like I'm alone. Yesterday was a tough day and I went to bed exhausted. I had to phone Samaritans to offload, as I felt depressed and very anxious. The phone call really helped.
Part of the problem is I'm worried counselling won't fix me -- there is an irrational fear that nothing will -- I'm scared that nothing will be able to stop me from having depressive or anxious bouts now that they have started.
I am using Samaritans and MIND whenever I feel like my mood is slipping. They help a lot... but when I am back on my own, my good mood starts to slip once again. I'm hoping that this is simply a natural part of the problem and I will overcome it one day. Anyone got any reassurance?
I had a lot of fun with my friends but as soon as that was over I feel scared and shakey again. I've been out with friends again today and I've got stuff going on over the next few days. So at least there will be a lot of good times to come!
I just wish that I could feel permanently good without this unfocused anxiety hanging around, or the doomy thoughts that sometimes come with it. I suppose the positive side is I don't feel nearly as bad as before and I do spend long periods free of anxiety or depressive thoughts, so my recovery is going somewhere.
Day 48
* Anxiety returns, probably triggered by visiting counsellor and discussing problems in depth. Anxiety is not as strong as before.
Day 49
* Still experiencing some anxiety.
Hello Psychopoet, this is a very interesting and inspiring thread, thank you for starting it. I'm glad you are working your way through your problems and good luck with your counseling.
I've been on Citalopram 10 mg for about four weeks now and one of the side effects I had was the first four days I only had about 4 hours sleep but after four days I was fine. The only other thing I had was that my scalp kept itching about 4 days after taking it and did so for about two weeks but it's not so bad now. Oh yes, also I don't know if it's affected my sinuses but I get very blocked up in one side of my nose.
Anyway my doctor is happy for me to stay on 10 mg and I don't want to take a higher dose so that suits me. I have felt better from being on the medication, my anxiety isnt so bad.
Good luck to you and take care x
Hi
At least you are going out and keeping your mind active. thats what you need. I went to the doctors and told her about the brain zaps, she told me to stop taking seroxat staright away as I should not be getting side effects after this time. She has put me on sertroline which I am scared of taking as I do not want to have any anxious moments. She does not know what the brain zaps are! I asked the pharmasist about coming if seroxat, she was really helpful and said lots of people come off them due to the side effects. She said I should not get as many on sertroline, she also said a lot of people get on better with them.I ahve got to go to ENT next week about my ear, I have really bad wooshing sounds and its so sensetive, I am going to ask them about the head zaps just to see what they say so I will keep you posted.
Anyway I hope you have good days now, keep posting, its so interesting.
Take care
Sharona :bighug1:
Hi Sharona
From research I've done into brain zaps, which I'd never heard of until I joined No More Panic, it seems that many medical professionals don't know that brain zaps even exist.
Brain zaps are generally a side effect of discontinuing a course of SSRIs and are classed as a "discontinuation effect" (withdrawal symptom). I have not read anything which says they are in any way harmful.
Some No More Panic members experience brain zaps while following their standard course of medication, so it is not purely a discontinuation problem -- it seems that anyone who is taking SSRIs can experience them.
Medically, brain zaps are classed as a form of "paresthesia", which means a prickling sensation of the skin. I don't know why they class brain zaps in the same category as a sensation in the skin. I think it's because they don't currently understand brain zaps.
Some people who experience anxiety also report hearing loud noises which appear to simply be a symptom of anxiety. It could be that this symptom is in the same class as brain zaps as they are weird phenomena that probably originate in the brain.
My anxiety is trying to creep back in but I am fighting hard to stay in control. Some people suggest allowing anxiety to take over and run its course -- but I am frightened to do that in case it makes me feel more depressed. I'm resisting it and trying to overcome it by force of will. It is hard going but I believe I will prevail with a little help from my friends!
Today's update - I am officially classing myself as going through another "blip" which seems to have been triggered by spending half of Friday trying to deal with my problems. I think it's because my problems were not resolved straight away, nor do I feel like I have any kind of "plan" to follow in order to recover.
I know I'm being unrealistic. I know one counselling session is not enough, and I know I have only been visiting MIND for a week or two. I'm still trying to pull everything together so I can sort a recovery plan. I know that people often feel more unhappy when they first start a new form of treatment.
It's just that I am tired of feeling unhappy and anxious, and the occasional depressive moment still scares me. Sometimes it feels like the last few months have been one long dispiriting day, as I often wake up feeling the same as I did when I went to bed. Normally each day is like a separate adventure for me. These days it's like one long film that is annoying and boring. (I don't mean that to sound suicidal by the way, I'm not that depressed.)
I am a hundred times better than I was when I started this thread, I have had a lot of ups and downs and this one will be no different -- I guess I'm just scared by the scale of the task in front of me. In the past all I've had to do is spend a couple of hours talking to friends and I've been fine again. Now I find that I do feel better when I talk, but I go back down again afterwards.
New things scare me. My whole life seems to have changed and I find it difficult to deal with sometimes.
I find myself wondering if it's normal to be "obsessed" with your own depression/anxiety, and I wonder if it's normal to need to phone Samaritans or visit MIND nearly every day. Does anybody else find they need support more or less constantly?
EDIT: I've noticed that I tend to feel more depressed when I'm very tired and I have had a few very late nights this week. I wonder if that's one factor in this "blip"?
Hi
Sorry to hear you having a blip. Try not to fight it, I know its hard. Try to let it come and go. It does not like being invited.
Some people have good days and bad days.Its not always going to be that way, you will eventually have more good days.
You are in no way different from a lot of people I know when you say you need to talk to people all the time. I ahve to be around people and I keep going on my laptop just to keep myself busy.So your way is going to talk to people. You just need conversation.Stop beating your self up.
Take each day as it comes.
Take care.
Sharona
Thanks Sharona, I feel better now that I know someone else needs as much reassurance as I do! I spent the afternoon out with friends and then we sat in front of their telly with both their dogs curled up in my lap! It really chills me out when I go to theirs.
I realised that I'm not so much scared of going home as I am scared of being alone with myself. It's been a nagging fear at the back of my mind and I have only really visualised it today: my main problem at the moment is I'm scared that I have turned into my own enemy! I keep dwelling on my problems and inserting negative thoughts into all my happy moments. I feel like my subconscious has turned against me!
I actually feel better for knowing that! I feel like I have unearthed a major problem. I am gonna talk to MIND tomorrow to get reassurance and guidance, and learn how to trust myself again. I don't want to be my own enemy, I like myself, I want to be friends!!
Been out for my birthday meal tonight, had a fabulous time! I have learned a few lessons about myself this weekend and I am hoping that they will be the key to me beating this b*****d depression for all time. It's so good to still have times when I am free of the worry. I want to build a suit of mental armour that can withstand the occasional bouts of depression and anxiety. I will prevail! That seems to be the point of my life at the moment: to overcome depression so I can help others to overcome theirs.
Day 50 of PsychoPoet's citalopram circus
* Experiencing my second "blip" on the road to recovery, but still fighting hard against anxiety and depression.
* Has it been 50 days already? It feels more like 49.
Poet
Is it your birthday today????? Today as now is Monday or do you mean yesterday???
Hi Poppy, Monday the 11th is my 30th birthday... or it will be at 5.30am :)
Awwww, HAPPY 3OTH BIRTHDAY, POET!!!! :yahoo:
I have put a message in the birthday announcements part on here.
Hi psychopoet, how was your night then? I started on 10mg 11 days ago, mine is more for anxiety and panics than depression (even though have suffered with bad depression before) I am doing ok, i felt terrible fot 1st week though, nauseas and dizzy and weird and had alot of bad nights, they do tend to heighten the symptoms your feeling anyway for first few weeks, my doc said it takes 4-6 weeks for them to start doing there job properly, so stick with it, yes some days are really awful but i'm sure you'll get through, i am, and i was petrified bout taking them to be honest. take care xx
Hi, last night I went out for my birthday meal and it was a fantastic night. I did experience moments of fear and I was able to fight them off. I'm ok now, still a bit anxious, just tired of feeling crap I suppose! Mind you I still haven't had an early night in a while, tiredness seems to be a factor in my bad days!
Hi
Happy Birthday.
I am glad you went out and had a good night. I had a really good wekend then today I feel so tired.
We all get good and bad days mate, just keep on enjoying the good days.
Where do you live?
Take care and keep talking to people, it does help you know.
Sharona xxx
Thanks Sharona, I like you, you're going on my Buddy list :D
I'm just between Sheffield and Rotherham in South Yorkshire.
Ok, I am getting a bit more organised in my fight against anxiety and depression :D
I have started a new thread here which is going to deal exclusively with my feelings of depression: Fighting back against depression (http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?t=49342)
I've come a long way since I started taking citalopram and most of the side effects are now gone. I'll carry on with this thread cos it seems to be popular and it has been a tremendous help to me. Who knows, maybe one day after I've recovered from my problems (now that would have been the ultimate birthday present!), this thread will be like the golden thread that led Theseus out of the minotaur's maze. Look it up. ;)
Day 51
* The "blip" continues.
* Very reliant on reassurance from other people during this blip.
Well then Pot Noodle pickers, have a good night. May your troubles soon be resolved. :)
Today's update: I don't feel quite as bad this morning as I had a good night's sleep. I have been practising breathing techniques to calm my morning anxiety and it has helped a lot.
I feel like there's a "knot" in my brain which needs to be unsnarled but every time I touch it with my thoughts, I recoil from it. It's like I have found the centre of my pain. I don't know if I am strong enough to deal with it yet.
I have got a busy schedule today so I don't know if I will be able to drop in to MIND to discuss it with them. I certainly don't want to open the floodgates while I'm on my own.
Weekly progress update
Check this post: http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showpost.php?p=490071&postcount=83
Hi
Thats it keep busy, its keeps your mind off things. I don't live live far from you in Mansfield.Hope you have had a good day.
Sharona
You can probably hear my car from there. It's got a sports exhaust that makes it sound like a touring car!
I have had a good day today: I've been working on my breathing and that does seem effective against my moments of fear. I've kept busy all day and I have got more planned for the next few days. I'm able to ignore the odd depressive thought but I don't want to ignore it forever -- I want to face it with the support of MIND, and I intend to discuss this with them as soon as I get a chance to drop in!
Keep replying to this thread people, it motivates me so much! This thread has been my friend through a very tough time!!
Goodnight Pot Noodle pickers!
Day 52
* Starting to fight back against the "blip"
* Ability to ignore the chatterbox starts to return
* Starting to feel as if I am getting somewhere in the fight against depression
* Determination to face the cause of my problems beings to develop
Hi
I am glad you have had a good day. Thats what the noise is that keeps waking me up every hour?
Keep talking to people, it will really keep you motivated,
Sharona
Haha, yeah that's me doing a 6000rpm wheelspin!
I'm going to confront my depression head on tomorrow at MIND and I am expecting it to be very tough. This is it, no more falling back, no more hiding, I'm going to face it and flick the love spuds of fear with a wet flannel.
Day 53
* Realised I am now ready to start tackling my depression head-on with a view to beating it.
* Developed breathing techniques which seem to be effective against rising panic.
There's no MIND where I live :lac: I rang the nearest one yesterday and was told they don't cover my area and that there isnt one that covers my area :weep: What happens to people with mental health issues who need such help in this area then!!! :mad: Maybe I am the only mentally ill person in the village??? :wacko:
If I were you I'd just drop in at the nearest one and don't tell them where you live. If they do ask you, say "under a bridge", as I'm willing to bet that in today's society a charity will help someone of no fixed abode even if they aren't allowed to help someone who pays tax.
The Samaritans also operate drop-in centres. I find that talking to someone face to face is what makes most of the difference. Their face to face people will probably have some limited training in medications and counselling techniques (although they are not counsellors) and I would imagine they have plenty of experience.
Phone your local Samaritans and find out when you can see them. I would imagine their opening hours aren't as weird as MIND's.
Hi
Well done, face them, just to let you know as you don,t live that far we trying to get a meet in Derby or Notts, you should come? I can see your car then. LOL.
Sharona
Poppy
Thats so funny, I mean the only mad one in the village. I know how you feel as some towns/citys have really good links etc.
Never mind, excuse the expression.
LOL
Sharona a
I might come if I can find the nerve :D
I will definitely bring Valiant. You know what, I might even clean him first ;)
http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q255/nopoet406/12.jpg
Hi Sharona :)
Thanks for your message! I am glad I made you laugh. Its true though what I said lol
Poet makes me laugh (have you seen his comment on the Erections thread tonight! lol) - I come on here feeling all gloom and doom and then read some of the things he has written and end up laughing.
Which meet are you going to Sharona? The one in Nottingham?
The meet is gonna be awesome! How many pairs of socks will I need to stuff down my trousers to make me look attractive to women? I trust your advice Poppy.
Ok Poet - You trust my advice....ermmmm....you will probably need about 100 pairs of socks??? :D
I am having a good day today - I feel really good and upbeat and like I dont have a care in the world! Maybe past few days were citalopram 'blips'? I woke up feeling really happy and I keep laughing at things too!
I am going to make the best of this whilst it lasts! :yesyes: :yahoo:
Poppy, you will definitely experience blips -- sounds like you're going through what I've been through -- all blips come to an end :D
I don't know, in one thread you want to see a photo of Winky Willis, in this one you criticise his girth -- I'm in a state of confuzzlement here. Winky Willis doesn't know whether he's coming or going. (Are we allowed to make jokes like that on NMP?)
Well I went to Mind and spent 90 minutes talking over my problems and trying to get everything I could possibly think of out of my head! It was therapeutic, and while it hasn't cured me, it has given me lots to think about and it has made me feel better. I look forward to the day when I am over all of this!
I still feel like I've got more venting to do, more to get off my chest, but I have literally talked about everything I can think ofeither to the people at Mind or venting on NMP. I'm used to feeling better straight away after discussing my problems.
It does definitely help, I just feel needy at this time, like ababy who can't stop suckling its mother's teat heh.
On the positive side I have found it easier to fight off my negative feelings today and I did not feel depressed after discussing all my problems at Mind. Got to be a forward step considering what happened on Friday after counselling - I felt like a turd with a footprint in it for 4 days!
Day 54
* Able to discuss problems without feeling depressed or unsettled afterwards
* Able to ignore and distract myself from depressive thoughts and feelings
I'm not going out with friends today although I've been out for a few hours with dad. This is my first "chill-out day" (as I used to call days spent at home) since early last week and I keep going in and out of a state of nervousness.
Being stuck at home is the worst fear I have at the moment. This is closely followed by a dread of having no friends available, even though I am surrounded by my family! If I can beat these then my quality of life will really improve. I still don't fully understand why I equate being at home with being unhappy.
I'm a bit bored and I feel stuck in a rut but surely these problems should not make me feel anxious or depressed? The feelings go when I'm busy but return when I finish whatever it is I'm doing. I wish this would settle down so I could feel relaxed and safe all the time while I'm at home.
Hi Poet :)
I would say that being bored when you are at home and your friends are not available is good enough reason for you to feel down and anxious. You feel you are stuck in a rut, but that's understandable when not working.
I do love being home on my own and love my own company but it can get depressing at times and I know its being stuck at home that does it, because as soon as I go out I am much happier. Not having the routine of a job is depressing, even though when I worked away from home, I would always whinge about the 9-5!
Working from home like I am is depressing at times as I miss all the office banter and having people around me to take my mind off my own self.
Try not to get into the habit of just going out with other people only as it could lead to agoraphobia symptoms, when you go out on your own. I still prefer going out with someone but I make myself go out a lot now on my own.
Have you got any plans to do things? I find that having something to look forward to, be it a weekend away, or whatever, really helps me to keep positive. Do you belong to any clubs? What do you do like as in interests/hobbies?
Maybe you associate your house with you being unwell? I associate my previous house with the awful breakdown time I had there, and I sometimes have to call there to collect post and as soon as I go in, I can feel my anxiety start to increase, and I feel sick - I am better going there now than what I was - at one time I could barely go near the place for fear of it. I am glad I bought this house now! However if I had not moved I would have tried to change my thoughts about the house and think of happier times spent there. I know its easier said than done though.
OMG - It has gone so dark here - I hope there is not going to be a thunderstorm - I have panic attacks about those!!!!!!!!!!!
Oh Roonie you gentle flower, sometimes I think I was guided to NMP by a higher power just so I could get to know you and follow your example :D
It is unbelievably reassuring to read that you and other people know exactly where I'm coming from. Most people in my life haven't got a clue -- and I pray to God they never will!! I wouldn't even wish this on Mr Swiffen, my ignorant ape of a science teacher. Just imagine a cave troll from the Lord of the Rings films if it had an egg-in-the-nest hairdo, embarrassingly bushy eyebrows and a poor attitude (even for a cave troll). That's Mr Eyebrows Swiffen. Yeah we did all used to call you eyebrows behind your back you ugly get.
That said, I think that in our fragile states of mind we are vulnerable to any negative feelings, even the ordinary ones like mild boredom or loneliness. We see everything in terms of our depression or anxiety, including happiness (oh God! why am I happy when I should be sad? how long will it last? does being happy mean there is something wrong with me? am i in denial about my depression? etc etc yawn).
If we feel lonely or bored we magnify it times five due to our depression or general negativity. Sod depression, I hate it and wish someone would invent a way for us to cure it straight away. Until that day we have to keep going and make ourselves better one day at a time!
I'm not going out with friends today although I've been out for a few hours with dad. This is my first "chill-out day" (as I used to call days spent at home) since early last week and I keep going in and out of a state of nervousness.
Being stuck at home is the worst fear I have at the moment. This is closely followed by a dread of having no friends available, even though I am surrounded by my family! If I can beat these then my quality of life will really improve. I still don't fully understand why I equate being at home with being unhappy.
I'm a bit bored and I feel stuck in a rut but surely these problems should not make me feel anxious or depressed? The feelings go when I'm busy but return when I finish whatever it is I'm doing. I wish this would settle down so I could feel relaxed and safe all the time while I'm at home.
This almost exactly how i feel mate, except I dont really have any family round me and Ive only got a couple of closefriends that are married and gone away, so Ive got no1 to talk to this week.... Im so the same if i keep busy im not to bad but as I stop....it all comes back with a vengance, im 34 years old ive got no gf im always at home if im not at work etc...I feel so anxious even striking up random conversations with people..it does get on my tits I wish I could be more confident I wish i had a group of mates i could go to the pub with and chat with girls etc...god this must sound really sad...I'll shut up now
:unsure:
That said, I think that in our fragile states of mind we are vulnerable to any negative feelings, even the ordinary ones like mild boredom or loneliness. We see everything in terms of our depression or anxiety, including happiness (oh God! why am I happy when I should be sad? how long will it last? does being happy mean there is something wrong with me? am i in denial about my depression? etc etc yawn).
If we feel lonely or bored we magnify it times five due to our depression or general negativity. Sod depression, I hate it and wish someone would invent a way for us to cure it straight away. Until that day we have to keep going and make ourselves better one day at a time!
I think Ive just demostrated this in my last post....like you say depression sod it...
Couldnt agree more poppy Id love to meet some peeps from here, it would be nice to meet people that I could relate too if you know what i mean :)
I often feel that if I meet other like-minded people it will trigger me! That's the one thing I don't like about going to Mind. If I see someone who is feeling the way I do or worse I feel sorry for them and cannot help myself from putting myself in their shoes. People tell me I should say "thank God I'm not as bad as that" but I can't do this, it is contrary to the way I think or behave. If I see someone in distress I feel the need to carry their problems.
I did end up going to a friend's yesterday. I was supposed to be seeing him today but he let me down at the last minute. I always feel worse at the weekends for some reason: this is another aspect of my depression that I really want to deal with. I used to LOVE the "Saturday feeling". I used to feel excited, like I should be out exploring the countryside, then if I was stuck at home I'd just indulge in all my hobbies and really have a lazy, fun day. I want that back!
You will get that feeling back again, Poet. I think you are doing really well and you give me and a lot of others on the site a lot of inspiration.
I am sorry when your friend let you down at the last moment. Its so annoying when people do that but maybe he had genuine reasons?
I can understand a bit about how seeing other like minded people may trigger you - but what's the worst that can happen?
I would get massively anxious but at least if I broke down or started hyperventilating I would be around the best people who could understand and help me.
When I see seriously mentally ill people out and about I really feel sorry for them - not in a patronising way - but in a caring way. I often wonder if I will end up like that. I really don't think a lot people get the appropriate help they need with mental health issues and I don't think care in the community works for everyone. The mental health services are overstretched. This is what worries me.
My elderly mum has manic depression and she refuses all help and therefore she doesnt get any now -the mental health team took her off their books - but my opinion is she is not making the correct decision because she has dementia due to her heavy drinking and is manically depressed. To see her suffering is awful at times - very sad.
Ok I am rambling on again.....I think its time for my medication! I have forgotten to take it :scared15:
Poor old Popperoonie, it never rains eh? Well if anything I can say or do will make you feel even remotely better, I guess my day has been worth it :)
I'm so scared that my feelings of happiness are only temporary... I don't want them to be... I just need a reason for why I felt so sh*t, I need to understand it, I guess this will come in time.
Hi Poet
Your day will come mate, just you wait and see. I know it does not feel like it will but you must be strong. Keep talking to people and keep posting.
Take care
Sharona :bighug1:
Hi Sharona, thank you :D
Days 55-56
* Second "blip" is officially over with no change to my citalopram dose.
* Citalopram is officially working and is not presenting any problems.
* Feelings of fear and depression relegated to background.
* Feelings of "normality" come back.
* Able to undertake some hobbies once more.
* Spend more time talking to my family rather than ringing Samaritans or visiting Mind.
* Venting in threads online has made a huge difference over the last few weeks.
* Begin talking to distant friends online including my ex-girlfriend and team leader from my previous job.
* The desire to talk about my problems and my past becomes a need, as if a mental blockage has broken down and everything is flooding out.
My "battle" with citalopram is over now, I have settled on it and I don't get many side effects now, just the mild "hangover" feeling some days. In general the medication is benefiting me a lot more than it is hurting me!
This is gonna sound really sad: when I chucked my empty box in the bin I actually said thank you to it, cos this month is the month where citalopram became my friend lol and I appreciate what it is doing for me. Funny how different things are now compared to four weeks ago. Back then I couldn't imagine feeling normal again. Now I feel normal 75% of the time.
I don't want to wind this thread down cos it has helped me so much and I love it, it has got me through a really bad patch, so I'll keep it open throughout my recovery.
Most of the action will be moving into my Depression thread as my anxiety has taken a back seat and depression is the main problem. Please drop in on my depression thread, it is not triggering (hopefully) and it tried to be as optimistic as possible given the subject material. I still need support and encouragement to get past my problems and if I get anything like the amount of support in the depression thread as I have in this, my recovery is guaranteed :D
I'll come back for you all if I make it out.
Fighting Back Against Depression (http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?t=49342)
( http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?t=49342 )
Day 57
* Woke up early and spent time downstairs alone for first time in ten weeks!
* Motivation to work on my writing has returned for the first time in two months.
* Confidence begins to grow that I really am coming out of my depression and am not just experiencing a temporary "high".
I am still experiencing down moods and anxiety but only for short, isolated parts of the day. They seem to happen less each day. This weekend has been a big step forward for me as I was really upset at the thought of having two full days at home and I ended up really enjoying them. I feel like I have got a lot of constructive venting done and I have enjoyed a few of my hobbies including one or two that I haven't done since I became depressed! If that isn't a clear sign of progress I don't know what is!
If anyone feels up to reading through the story of my life please check this thread out: http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?t=46265
I am wanting to recruit someone who can work with me on this one, please give me some of your time to hear me out, you will be helping me more than you know!!
Hi
I just wanted to say how much I love your diary and how much its helping me to read how you are doing. I am on day 20 of fluoxetine and currently the side effects are crippling me. The anxiety and panic has amplified so much in the last few days and I was going to give up.
I know its the side effects though and I know if I stick it out I can get through it somehow. I know we are on different meds but your diary is still inspirational to me and is getting me through the bad times because I read your diary and I know that I can get through it just as you have.
Many Thanks
Maddymoo xx:bighug1:
Wow thank you Maddymoo :D :D :D
I have read that gingko can help with citalopram side effects -- maybe the same is true of fluoxetine? I am glad I stuck with my medication even though it was harrowing to start with. It taught me a few lessons about dealing with panic attacks, and it taught me to appreciate how good it is to feel "normal" (i.e. not depressed or anxious)!
EDIT: I am starting to feel ready to write the story of my suffering and recovery over the last couple of months. I know I've got threads like that all over the place but I think I and other members would benefit from the story.
EDIT #2: This life story thing is taking forever, I have never tried to get myself organised to this level before and there is so much to sort out! I think this is going to be really helpful to people once it is completed, maybe a rival for the citalopram survival guide! We're looking at a week at this point before I can get it all posted up!
I have started telling my life story (which is a separate issue) in another thread in the General Anxiety forum. Please check my story out, there's a link to it in my previous post, it's not depressing or anything, I haven't been getting any help since I re-started the thread a couple of days ago and I really need someone to provide me with some encouragement!
This is interesting...I have now registered for online cognitive behavioural therapy (see the link in my sig) and I took their depression/anxiety test.
Here are my results. Text in RED is from the results page; text in GREEN is from elsewhere on the site. The results were very unexpected:
HOSPITAL ANXIETY/DEPRESSION (HAD) SCORE
A commonly used scale for assessing anxiety and depression.
ANXIETY
Score = 18
Your anxiety score is over 16:
A score which shows you have very significant symptoms of anxiety which are affecting your life. We would also advise that you discuss this score with your doctor so that you can discuss whether other ways of helping anxiety are likely to be helpful.
DEPRESSION
Score = 7
Your depression score is between 0 and 7:
In the normal range with no evidence of strong symptoms of depression.
If you scored between 6 and 9: Scores between 6 and 9 suggest significant low mood, but not so severe as to count as "clinical depression". 80% of people with this kind of low mood will find they feel better within 6-8 weeks without any treatment at all.
Antidepressant medicines, therapy or counselling dont usually work for people with scores less than 10. If you come into this category you might find "self help" useful - click here for more information.
But it is important to make sure your mood does get better over the next month or two. Keep a note of your PHQ score and check it again in 6-8 weeks. If it hasnt improved over that time it might be worth discussing with your GP.
PATIENT HEALTH QUESTIONNAIRE (PHQ) SCORE
Used by doctors to assess depression - my doctor gave me one of these questionnaires before I received antidepressants.
Score = 4
Your score reflects minimal symptoms of depression - a very low score, despite this you may be feeling low and could benefit from the life skills materials on this course.
--
Day 58
* Begin online CBT course.
* Take medical tests which confirm my main problems are anxiety rather than depression, which comes as a surprise. EDIT: Though perhaps it shouldn't considering I have been a million times more anxious than I have depressed.
* Begin to organise myself to cure my anxiety and depression, not just in the short term but for all time; previously I thought this would be too much to hope for, now it seems like I have a good chance of actually doing it.
* Begin preparing an organised, easily understandable account of my battle with anxiety which will hopefull inspire people on NMP more than this thread has done so far!
* Begin to keep a diary again - my last diary entry was 18/03/2009!
I've been buzzing ever since I took that test... I've had some time to think about it and it all makes sense.
I thought depression was the cause of my anxiety. Now it looks the other way round. I think my feelings of depression were caused by the fear and bewilderment I was going through. I have had anxious moments this evening and I was able to control them quite easily by keeping in mind that I am simply suffering from a stronger than normal form of anxiety which I am already learning how to deal with.
I am really happy, I have finally found some of the answers I was looking for; I've finally started to make sense of what is happening to me.
I'm still in the same good mood as the last few days. I feel that a lot of stuff makes sense and I feel unburdened, like the knot of fear in my brain has been undone once and for all. I am able to look inside myself without being afraid of what will happen.
This morning I woke expecting to feel depressed after a rather unhappy dream. My first thought on waking was: "Now I'm going to feel depressed." I was surprised that I didn't feel bad at all. I felt good. I can't even remember what the bad dream was and this is the first time I have even thought about it since I woke up!
I still get nervous moments, that's only to be expected. I crush them quickly. It seems ludicrous how easy it is to do that now I know what I'm up against. Anxiety might have changed its clothes and got a cool haircut but it's still my bitch.
Having said that, I am now experiencing today's "blip" and I definitely think I do have a mild form of depression, as the mood I am experiencing is not anxious, it is a slight downer. Nothing I can't handle though -- I think the "trauma" of what I've been through lately is to blame -- it is just too soon for me to feel comfortable with being happy a lot -- I'm learning though.
As mentioned in other threads I feel different somehow when I am depressed, my thought patterns change, my moods change, I feel like crying or like being upset, my brain feels "different" in a way that I can't explain and I get a tension headache coming on. I have explained this to my doctor and he reckons it's anxiety! Just another one of those things that I don't understand and probably never will.
I suppose I'm disappointed that the depression isn't entirely beaten yet. It will be one day!!
hi mate, weird cos the exact same thing happened today for me. I thought I was doing alrite today but then when i got home and thought..great this is it for tonite again.. i started to have negative thoughts about all sorts.. i hate this illness :(
i was on 10mg for 8 months then told to take 20 for a week then up to 40 i lasted a week on 40 i couldnt think straight my vision was blairy and i felt so tired as if i hadent slept in days i wnt back to 10 then up to 20 this week im still feeling side effects but i know theyl go away,i was on citalopram for 4 years when i was 17 until 21 and i didnt get any side effects at all
What are you doing deleting your replies Popperoonie, I always feel better when you reply to one of my theads!!
I still get extra-tiredness towards the end of the day and I am tired and hungover in the morning but it is quite easy to live with, especially when you compare it to the other side effects I used to have.
My battle against anxiety continues and if today is any indication, I'm winning :D
always-ill
20-05-09, 15:06
Hi,
Wow, ive just come accross this thread and read it, (nearly!), all through and have thoroughly enjoyed it :-) I have a box of Citalopram in my cupboard which has been sat there for nearly a year as I am too scared to start taking it and have been trying to combat my anxiety and depression with more natural treatments from hypnotherapy and reiki to diet and exercise, all which work to an extent for a short while but not enough and I feel like Im fighting a constant losing battle. Its come to a head this past week, I feel like a big angry, scared, worried, fustrated walking pile of goo and I want it to end an d to just feel 'normal' again. My biggest concern is that I wont be able to function normally and go to work, take my kids to school, do the shopping etc and that is not an option, its something I have to do. I am taking solace from your words that you actually benefit from being out and about and busy, so Im hoping that will be the case for me. Im going to try one later and see how I go, but Im sure I will be posting on here for support.
Thanks.
Hi Always_Ill, I'm glad I can help :D
I'm going to concentrate my efforts on three threads, all of them about different subjects which I have struggled with and all of which have really helped my recovery.
This thread ("Citalopram and some frightening symptoms") (http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?t=45973) will be about citalopram, side effects and anxiety.
This thread ("Fighting back against depression") (http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?t=49342) will follow my fight to explore and vanquish my feelings of depression.
This thread ("The Reasons") (http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?t=46265) will be where I examine why I am the way I am and how it eventually led to me the situation I'm in now, in other words this will be my life story.
My anxiety has come back a bit since last night. It's only about 3 out of 10 compared to how it was before but it is noticeable. I think I may be at risk of developing agoraphobia. I can't entirely blame medication/illness for that as I have spent the last 4 days relaxing at home or with friends and if I don't go out for a while I get lazy!
On the plus side, yesterday was the first day where I spent significant time free of any symptoms: no depression, no anxiety, no fear, no side effects. I was at my friend's house yesterday with both his dogs asleep in my lap and we were watching Top Gear and I was just so chilled and happy like I used to be before I became ill. I think this is a huge step as it is something I was not expecting to happen again (even though I know I'm getting better!). It was the first time I've been so relaxed at his house.
Today I went to the pub with my brother and his mate and I was lounging in my chair laughing and joking and I thought, "God, I'm turning into me again - properly this time!!"
Some downsides though -- I get nervous when I'm taking my dad to his talks, which I have always enjoyed. It might be something to do with them taking a long time and I've heard them all a dozen times. So maybe it's natural boredom. I don't know, it's not too bad these days, certainly not as bad as weeks ago when I used to sit there worrying and feeling dreadful!
Finally, I have been able to get up earlier in the mornings and spend time downstairs, a very significant improvement!
I worked out a few of the "triggers" for my anxiety and depression and I have also written extensively on how I feel when I'm in those moods. I wrote it on paper so I have a record that I can take to my counsellor and doctor to discuss it as I sometimes still worry that there is something physically wrong with me. Here is how I feel when I go on a downer or experience anxiety:
Symptoms of anxiety/depressive episode
Not all of these symptoms happen for every attack.* Feelings of fear and a sense of impending doom, not tied to anything specific (e.g. there are no particular threats, I just feel scared). Creates a chill down my spine.
* Sense of being vulnerable, unprotected, at risk - no-one can protect me, not even me.
* Headache e.g. tension headache, eye strain, pressure band in temples, dull ache in forehead.
* Vague nausea or sickness during severe attacks - sometimes a reduced appetite.
* Feeling that I want to cry or run away - feeling that I am crying or screaming in my head during severe attacks.
* Mood becomes low or flat - able to think positive thoughts, but not always able to believe them or feel reassured by them.
* Thought processes become scared, upset, almost childlike, different to my usual way of thinking - I become withdrawn - I feel like a different person.
* Sometimes feel "apart" from "normal" people, e.g. living in a different dimension - I'm in a state of bad distress and they are all happy and full of energy.
* "Shivering" feeling in brain before and during bad attacks, like someone is rummaging in my brain.
* Fear that I am physically ill or dying.
All of the above symptoms are much worse when I am very tired. UPDATE: The anxiety seems to come from within my chest; depression seems to come from in my brain. I don't feel any of the above during the times when I am calm or not experiencing bad anxiety or depression.
I think I am discovering a hidden fear of death -- this might explain why I sometimes feel that I might simply die or cease to exist -- it might also explain why a recent death and news that two people I know are dying have hit me even harder than everyone else. It would also explain my recently acquired fear of suicide (e.g. fear that I might suddenly "go mad" and commit suicide, fear of hearing or reading about death and/or suicide in any form).
I used to be very scared of death as a child and I never really dealt with that. Looks like it stuck there in the back of my mind and has become dislodged.
A lot of work for my counselling and CBT sessions!
EDIT: It feels like the anxiety is a living thing inside me, like it is intelligent and operating beyond my control. What's even more interesting about this observation is something I heard on the news once: apparently there are intelligence cells in the human gut, which means the phrase "gut instinct" is actually based on truth. What happens if these intelligence cells are where the anxiety lives? Is it possible that anxiety can exist as an independent being in your body, able to control itself and ignore your will? Someone get Mulder and Scully...
Hi Poet
You will get there mate, one step at a time. Look how far you have come.
Keep posting and take care.
Sharona xx :bighug1: :bighug1: :bighug1:
* Sometimes feel "apart" from "normal" people, e.g. living in a different dimension - I'm in a state of bad distress and they are all happy and full of energy.
Hi Poet,
I have had a day in meadowhell shopping, and even though I am starting to feel better, I think I spent the biggest part of my time not feeling a part of what was going on around me, I found myself just observing people and not thinking about what I was doing, I think it could have just been boredom but I felt quite stressed because I didn't feel like I was there. Is this depersonalisation or derealisation? very weird anyway!
Back home now, I think I need some chill out time!
Hope all is well
Lion King
Hi Poet & Lion King!
Poet - You have been doing so well, so allow yourself this little blip. Maybe as you said, you are tired.
When I am tired, my emotions are everywhere, and I get really tearful and my anxiety gets worse. Getting good quality sleep makes such a big difference to how I feel.
Hopefully you will feel much less anxious tomorrow!
Lion King - I can relate to your post. I thought I was the only one who felt like this!
I have had agoraphobia for a while but trying to overcome it which is working at the moment.
When I am out, I look at other people and they all seem 'strange' to me, almost distant. The whole atmosphere seems surreal. I find it makes me anxious and its such a horrid weird feeling. I think it is to do with derealisation and depersonalisation, which I have experienced a lot in the past. Once I am home I feel fine though.
Thanks for the replies everyone. I have done a lot of research into myself and my past. I now feel that stress is the underlying cause beneath everything. I am sure that sustained high levels of stress, caused by unhappiness in my last job and followed up by repeated difficult events in my life, have led to the development of the anxiety I am experiencing now.
I think my depression is simply a sideshow of the anxiety -- feeling anxious, upset, tense and stressed for so long with no hope in sight and continual bad news led to mild but distressing feelings of depression. So the pecking order from worst to least is now stress -> anxiety -> depression.
This makes a lot of sense to me and is consistent with everything I have been through over the last few months as well as in my previous job.
I notice that I've got loads to write in each post these days. I take this as a GOOD sign: it means a lot is happening with my recovery. Insights and revelations are coming day by day, it's like I have been trying to pick individual bricks out of a wall and now the whole wall is coming down. I hope people are staying with this thread as I feel like I am working so much out and hopefully other people will be encouraged by this. If I can "un-muddle" myself like this, anyone can!!
On to today's update:
I've been with friends for the last few hours and we had a right laugh.
Things started off a bit depressing as my mate was very down but he perked up as the evening went on. We were discussing the usual unsolvable problems of unemployment, the credit crunch and other stuff that causes us pain but we can't do anything to change. We started having a laugh and relaxing afterwards.
Once again I forgot about my problems and sat with the dogs in my lap and it was so relaxing. My faint feelings of anxiety came on when I got in the car to go home. Two triggers: thoughts of being alone and thoughts of coming back home where I will have time to dwell on my worries. I already know about these triggers. Somehow knowing about them makes them weaker.
I've had a good few days at home and it dispelled a lot of my fears. There are still a few to work through.
Day 58
* Ability to relax returns; significant portions of day spent free of worry or depression for the first time in over two months!
* Started feeling like I am healing and getting back to my real self.
* Stress identified as a major trigger for anxiety -- need to learn stress management skills.
* Identified need for time management and organisation skills to reduce stress and anxiety and improve ability to cope with life's changes and challenges.
Days 59-60
* Identified stress as a more serious problem than previously thought and it may be the root cause of my anxiety.
* Tiredness identified as a major trigger for stress and depression.
* Portions of day free from worry; feelings that I am getting back to my real self grow slightly stronger.
EDIT: I've updated this post (http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showpost.php?p=504266&postcount=185) with a bit more information about my anxiety/depressive moments.
Weekly Update
Updated with Week 8 in this post: Citalopram Diary - Weekly Progress (http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?p=490071#post490071)
I visited Mind today. There is a wonderful woman called Sue who has helped me more than I can express; it's because of my chat with her last week that I have been able to finally let all my problems out. That was a major step in my recovery. We explored many things in preparation for tomorrow's counselling session.
I felt depressed afterwards for a short time which I am now getting used to! We touched on some disturbing stuff and I have learned a lot about myself and my anxiety. There is still a lot of work to do, I've been arranging some stuff for counselling and I am writing my own life story to work out where my problems really began. It is very cathartic. I'm conscious that I could become obsessed with this and make the problem worse -- I'm reasoning that a few hours of hard work now will set me up for the rest of my life!
I used to talk about my problems to a friend but I don't speak to her any more. I have started opening up to my family and friends a bit more -- this is still very hard as speaking about it to family is painful -- I suppose it is progress though! I guess it's always better to rely on your family than people you don't really know!
This has been a good week for making progress!
I've had my second counselling session today. It was supposed to last 50 minutes - it went on for almost two hours! Needless to say I got nearly everything dealt with. The only things I haven't really touched are getting a job and dealing with worries about my brother. Those are the topics for my next session. They were too big to go into today when we were exploring so many other things.
The counsellor is lively and intelligent, she understands where I'm coming from and she is able to point out the odd thing that I have missed. I find the sessions tough but very helpful. It is nice to vent all this stuff to another person and get rid of the negative feelings.
The major things I've learned are WHY my anxiety is unfocused and generalised, and that I always have a CHOICE of how I feel.
In the past I have always had significant life events to attach my fear and worry to. There is nothing happening in my life at the moment that is directly causing anxiety. I can't attach the anxiety label to anything, so now it just seems free-floating, which makes it scarier. The truth is I am prone to anxiety and I have not learned to cope with the worst of it.
The idea of "choice" is something we all have to an extent: how do I want to spend my day - do I want to sit with my fear and indulge it for hours, or do I want to put it aside and get on with doing something I enjoy or need to do? While I'm worrying, I am wasting time I could have spent getting on with my writing or cleaning the house or getting my car fixed etc. While I'm worrying, I am not feeling good about myself or moving on from my problems.
Free will is sometimes a difficult concept. We're so used to other people telling us what to do and how to behave -- I don't know about you lot but when I don't have those guidelines I feel lost and end up going around in circles.
I still feel anxious and upset sometimes. This is going to happen. I am trying to accept that. The point is things are improving every week so the anxiety is based on a lie.
God I've got a right headache after that intense counselling session! My counsellor is awesome for letting me speak for 2 hours.
Hi Poet,
2 hours is a long time, do you find yourself coming out the sessions feeling positive? I have had 3 sessions so far and I have found them so useful, it feels really good to speak out your thoughts and have some sense made of them, each session becomes more relaxed which enables me to be more open and flowing with whatever is bothering me.
I am glad I have suffered from anxiety otherwise I would have carried on not really living and enjoying things, I would have just avoided situations due to negative thinking, I always thought myself to be a positive thinker, but that was only after checking for the negatives first, I had far too much focus on -ve views rather than the +ve, this was due to my insecurities, low self esteem that prevented me pushing myself.
Hope you turn the corner soon, its only a matter of time!
Lion King
Hi Poet & LionKing
Glad both of you are feeling much more positive and happier.
Poet - How did you get counselling through MIND? Did you just contact them yourself, or do you have to go through your GP.
I am willing to pay privately but I am always a bit dubious about a lot of therapists. I would love to go through MIND -even though I was told though there isn't one near me - which there is but my postcode is not covered by them.:wacko:
Hi Poppy,
Will your gp refer you to a psychologist?
This is how I got my CBT, I went to gp who reffered me to a psychologist, this took about 3-4 wks, the psychologist decided what treatment would suit me best, it took 4-5 wks to hear from the mental health department about an appointment which wasn't too bad as I was warned that was a long waiting list. I would see your gp, he should make a referral, its takes quite a bit of time but definitely worth waiting for.
Hope this helps
Lion King x
I got my CBT without any waiting list. I signed up at www.livinglifetothefull.com (http://www.livinglifetothefull.com) (the link is also in my signature - click on CBT) and I have found the CBT service offered immediate benefits. I found that it brought relief and reassurance by identifying my major problems straight away and providing a framework to resolve them. There was no messing about, this went straight for the jugular, which is sometimes the only way to make progress.
By doing it online there are no waiting lists and no appointments. You do it as and when you want. Obviously there is a large advantage over weekly or fortnightly appointments, and because it's free you save yourself thirty quid an hour. Any English-speaking person can sign up and start working on it immediately.
It is there so that people can have access to CBT and use it to resolve some of their problems. It helps us to get around lengthy waiting lists and it saves us a fortune. I cannot see any reason why someone would not want to sign up for this online service.
Lion King: My sessions overrun cos I'm her last appointment of the day. I think she's just a part-timer to be honest and there is no reason for her to chuck me out early. I used the extra time to the full. I got nearly everything off my chest. I saved the really weighty stuff for next time as I had too much to cover in one session, even with two hours. I did find it helped me a lot and I didn't feel as down as last time. It was tough though; we covered a lot of unpleasant ground and I learned a few truths.
Poppy: I phoned Mind and arranged a private room. I told them I was finally ready to discuss my real problems (not just the anxiety and depression they cause) and I was worried I might get distressed, and I didn't want people listening in as much of my story was personal (including stuff I would never post online). They agreed to give me a private room for one hour for this one occasion. My session overran by 35 minutes. Like I said, there was a lot to talk about, and I can talk for Britain. It wasn't officially "counselling", it was an informal chat about my problems, but to be honest I don't see the difference. Counselling means listening and offering occasional constructive advice.
I get distressed when my anxiety comes back. It's like a free-roaming animal that lives inside me, acting outside my will with a mind of its own. I have never suffered anxiety like this before. It likes to remind me that it is still here. It doesn't always abate even though I know I have nothing to fear. It is very unsettling to feel scared even when everything is ok. It's very real. It's not my imagination. I have never been through anything like this before. But I will prevail, because that's what I do.
Well I am going to try to reduce the time I spend thinking about my problems. I am finding that it is holding me back from my recovery. I feel that I need to start putting things behind me now rather than dragging them back up every day.
I will still be updating this thread, I'm just gonna back off for a bit, spend some time in the real world rather than seeking comfort on the internet. I'm not going to overcome my fear of everything if I am not a part of the world ;)
Awww Poet - I will miss you :weep: We will all miss you :weep:
Why don't you stay and just reply to other peoples posts? :)
I agree with what you are saying and I posted a similar post the other day, but you can do both, still come on here and still get out in the real world too!
Who will I whinge to now :shrug:
yeah dont leave us poet...and you can always whinge to me...that goes for anyone!
Well done Poet,
Only you know whats best for yourself, I find the more time you spend on here the more of a safety behaviour or another way of avoidance it becomes. The real test is facing upto the real world with a fresh approach and an open mind in yourself, but for times when you need a little reassurance there is no harm in coming on here as part of maintaining your balance with anxiety and depression.
Hope life goes well
Lion King
Hi all, thanks for the reassurance and kind words. I'm just planning to reduce the time I spend on NMP -- as Lion King says it becomes a "comfort trap" -- constantly talking about my problems is becoming counter-productive. I feel the happiest when I forget about it and do something else. I'm not planning on leaving!
Another problem I've got is that I am not in a position to help other people out. My own recovery is taking all my strength and reading about other peoples' problems makes me feel worse at this moment in time. I'm rotating myself away from front-line duty so I can rest, re-arm and recover. Once I'm back up to strength I will start helping people again. Think of the scene from Black Hawk Down where the helicopters are flying around the city shouting "We won't leave you behind" to the troops still stuck in battle. I'm the one in the helicopter :)
After all the fanfare of me trying to spend more time in the real world and less time online, I need to report what happened today:
My friend and I went for a drive in the countryside to get away from it all. I did talk to him a little bit last night, but today we did have a big talk about our own problems and the way we see the world. We have very similar world views with a couple of important differences: he tends to view other people negatively, I tend to view myself negatively.
It was awkward and difficult to start talking today but it got easier and we both opened up a bit more. My anxiety is with me all the time, a silent fear which tells me that my headaches are a serious brain problem, I'm not going to ever get better etc etc. Talking about it and explaining it to my friend made me feel like I was getting rid of a bad secret. I think it did my friend a little bit of good to talk as well. Getting out in the country was amazing, we had a fantastic time, then we went back to sit in his garden with the dogs and generally take the mick out of each other.
I realise that I am actually getting past some of the major problems but there are several big ones that I have barely even scratched yet. This feels like progress, and it reassures me that I am still feeling anxious for a reason. I am feeling more ready to confront these remaining problems every day.
My anxiety makes me feel sick, headachey and distressed. I have started having "heavy dreams" which wake me up with headaches and a sense of panic. I think my anxiety has realised that it cannot hide any longer and is attacking with everything it's got left. It may take weeks but I will win this war. I've been through hell over the last few months -- I am not going to let the weak shadow of that anxiety beat me after all the work I've done!
Hi Lionking :)
You asked about my gp referring me to a psychologist. He won't do. I have met different people last year when I had a breakdown but I wanted to get better myself with no counselling and no medication and I did, although I had some counselling.I just would not admit what was happening back then because it scared me so much.
I have a CBT therapist who thinks I have very mild anxiety -and the gp will not refer me further than CBT as he doesn't think that the amount of anxiety I get warrants it. I have enquired previously. Last year my anxiety was full blown, so I suppose in comparison I am almost recovered. I was in such a state then - so bad I could barely talk. I know I should have continued with seeing a psychologist then but I just didn't want to.
I don't feel at all anxious mostly anymore. I just get emotional. Its like I start to feel anxious and then it must be that the effects of the citalopram kick in and I cant go any further with feeling anxious.
I can get very upset and cry. My partner has yet again gone this weekend and I am upset but where my anxiety would be usually be kicking in by now about us splitting up, I can't seem to feel much at all.:wacko:
Hey this staying away thing is harder than I thought, I've logged in about 3 times since 5pm, I am kind of struggling with my anxiety -- it is not as bad as a few weeks ago, it's just driving me round the bend!! I feel that "going it alone" without relying on NMP is good for my recovery -- I'm just wondering if I am taking that step too soon. I'll feel fine, then suddenly fear strikes for a while making me feel horrible and I don't know whether I am anxious or depressed -- what a pain in the a*se!!
Hi Poet,
It is harder than you think, especially when you think you are getting better and you then experience a set back, my anxiety is still there but I don't stay away from it, I try to check with myself to see what is setting it off, it appears that I am threat spotting most of the time subconsciously without even thinking about it which makes me nervous, I have learnt to stay in situations to experiment when the anxiety subsides, it does subside when I repeatably tell myself that there is no threat, its ok doing this as long as I learn from it and don't avoid situations. Difficult but well worth it, the anxiety will not defeat me, I know I am much cleverer than this little set back!
Poppy: It sounds like you have done well to reduce the anxiety by yourself, there is nothing wrong with being emotional, it is only another form of release. Hope your recovery continues!
All the best to all in difficult times!
Lion King
Thumbelina
24-05-09, 06:45
I take cipralex (i think similar to yours) and had all possible sideeffects (which i will not mention so you wouldnt copy them) for 3 months.
I was feeling very vulnarable with severe constant anxiety and then i was told that any medication would need adjustment period. So its pointless to go through all of them, better try with the one and get over it. I did.
I take cpralex for almost 3 years now. 2 years 20mg, 1 year 10 mg.
I had relapse recently, still getting out of it. I am considering to think over the whole way my body is used to this medication, though I agree that some people should takle it a lifetime.
I am not sure whether I am one of them.
I want to believe not. It has been mainly improving road. Though the recent relapse was very scary, though i dodnt know maybe because of withdrawal to 10mg, or anything else.
My biggest fear now not panic attacks, and anxiety, its DEPRESSION.
Oanic attacks are lovely - you have one and you are out. Glooming after is what gets me out of control.
Take care
Hi all, I am going to make one post per day in this one thread. It's too risky to cut myself off from online support as most of my worrying comes when I'm at home and posting on NMP helps to relieve the feelings of anxiety.
I spent most of today with friends and got very badly sunburned! I look like I've got scarlet fever! I managed to hold my worries off and enjoy a relaxing day -- but as it drew nearer to home time my anxiety and depression climbed again. It is sometimes difficult to tell anxiety and depression apart. I don't know if I am even depressed at all.
It seems that I still have problems with being at home -- I have touched on this with my counsellor and Mind and I started to move on from it. But now it's coming back.
I've also been suffering tension- and tiredness-related headaches for the last few days and my anxiety seizes on this as something to be worried about. I know it's nothing, I get headaches all the time, it's just that this anxiety can make me feel a certain way and I cannot fully stop it. Does anyone else feel like their anxiety has a mind of its own?
I alternate between feeling normal and feeling doomed/distressed.
On the other hand I feel that counselling, visiting Mind, speaking to the Samaritans and posting on NMP have helped me to move on from several of my problems, so I am still making progress.
The remaining issues I need help to deal with are below. I have not felt strong enough to face any of these problems in depth.
These are the most serious of all my problems. This is it, this is my anxiety and depression in written form.
1. Feeling bad/upset/scared at the thought of being at home.
Maybe because I'm scared to be alone or bored of the daily routine? I get upset or depressed by everyday things like hearing my mum's voice or hearing an ordinary conversation (this doesn't happen often, maybe once or twice a day for short periods).
When I'm out, I get upset and panicky at the thought of going home. I get stressed at the thought of spending time in my room on my computer, but I don't get worried about the thought of going to bed.
There is a bit of tension at my house as my mum and dad always argue about the same pointless things and my brother is ill.
2. My dad and my brother are ill
My dad has a temporary medical problem which is not fatal or serious but is causing him distress. He also has a problem in one eye and his eyesight and hearing are not brilliant. My dad always dressed immaculately and looked clean and smart but these days he looks a bit ragged and is taking slightly less care of his appearance - a bit dishevelled, nothing too bad, just unusual for him. To see my dad in a state is very distressing and reminds me that my family (and I) are mortal -- I think the events of this year have triggered a fear of death I used to have as a kid, which explains my fear of hearing or thinking the word "suicide".
My brother suffers from schizophrenia which is under medical control, but severe. He receives a lot of help and support and is being seen by the region's top specialist who luckily works at our local hospital. He is on heavy meds which make him sleep late and they slow him down. I worry about him so much, I could cry for him, and I used to be a d1ck to him before I realised he was ill, which I think may have made him worse. I cannot forgive myself for that even though I have tried -- I feel like I've done nothing but let him down. I wonder how bad things must be for him if I've been struggling with "mere" anxiety. If I think he looks tired or down, it triggers my anxiety and depression quite strongly.
3. Getting a job/planning for the future
This is the big one.
I think I'm hiding from my future (I always have ever since I was a kid!) and I can't enjoy myself at home because there feels like a sword of judgement hanging over my head. I need a job, my jobseeker's is going to stop soon and I don't have much in the bank, but I do not feel ready for employment yet, although I'm a lot better prepared now than I was a month ago!
It's only in recent years that I can face the idea of a mortgage and children without feeling sick! But those things are not even on the calendar cos I am single, I am very unconfident when it comes to relationships, I never took any of my jobs seriously, I spent all my money on cars and other stuff I didn't really need.
I was left behind by almost everyone I used to know. I still feel like I'm floundering, directionless and scared -- my life has no point, no purpose or direction, nothing to aim for -- I believe this to be the real root cause of all my problems -- I am just not prepared to face my life at this point in time. If I can fix this problem, I can deal with anything!!
4. Bad habits and bad memories
This is like the "leftovers" of all my problems and is probably going to cause the most problems in the long run. This is probably why I feel bad most of the time even when there is nothing immediately threatening in my life, and it's why I am trapped in a state of fear and distress.
Basically I have had a horrendous time, not just over the last couple of months while I've been anxious, but over the last few years if I'm honest. There is so much that I am unhappy with about my past. The worst thing is my memory of my depression and anxiety over the last ten weeks. I am upset and frightened by how bad I felt, I'm confused, hurt and upset, and I am terrified that these feelings will come back at full strength and I will never be free. I keep remembering how sh*t I have felt and it just brings me down again.
It's worse when I first wake up or when I am alone and these memories keep coming back. I'm not strong enough to remember what I have been through. maybe in a few weeks I will be tough enough to look back without being affected. This is a very difficult problem for me at the moment and it is responsible for a lot of suffering.
If anyone has any feedback or just a few words of encouragement please let me know. I just bared my soul here :)
Thank you for reading all that!!
Oh, we can add another major fear:
5. Fear of becoming permanently depressed or anxious and/or committing suicide.
Another one I haven't been able to come to terms with. I'm scared that I will somehow become suicidal or unable to cope with my life, or that I will "go mad" or otherwise stay in this state of fear and unhappiness for the rest of my life. Recovery from depression and anxiety is slow and painful, and this reinforces my fear that I will always be like this.
I cannot claim to be free of anxiety even on my good days and I still secretly fear that I am trapped in a "black hole". Part of me knows this isn't true as I have made a clear and measurable recovery compared to how I was two months ago. I also realise that I am trying to change my own nature and that is not an easy task (to say the least!).
At this moment I would definitely say I am still a prisoner of my fear, and that fear is reinforcing itself. I thought the enemy was collapsing under my counter-attack. It turns out the resistance is stronger than I had expected.
I feel like I'm developing a weird kind of agoraphobia: I'm scared to go anywhere on my own. I am not scared to go out with friends or family and I can visit crowded places like Meadowhall and nightclubs without feeling any distress as long as I'm with someone. How strange. I think it's tied into my fear of being alone as that is when my mind is most likely to obssess about my problems.
This thread seems to have taken a turn for the negative. I don't mean it like that. I'm trying to get all this fear out of my head so I can deal with it on my terms. Maybe other people find it helpful to write their worries down?
Days 61-64
* General increase in anxiety, but not to same levels as before.
* Reduction in feelings of depression.
I re-took the anxiety and depression tests mentioned in this post (http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showpost.php?p=502933&postcount=176). My results for anxiety on the HAD test are now 20, which shows an increase, and the result is very high. My depression remains at 7 which indicates either significant low mood without being depressed, or mild depression.
My depression result on the PHQ test (which doctors use to assess your level of depression) is now zero. According to that test I do not meet the criteria for being depressed.
These results do seem to reflect the general reduction in my feelings of depression and the step-up in my anxiety. Two steps forward, one step back.
Hi Poet,
I think its just a matter of taking one day at a time, don't look back at what has happened and look at what you can change with a more positive outlook, the furtures bright and its what you make it, the world is waiting for you to play a part!!
Keep Well
Lion King
Just found the citalopram forum here (d'oh!) and to be honest I am scared to take tonight's dose -- I think I might be better off struggling on as I am rather than taking something that is going to freak me out so badly! Any advice??
I really hope you are feeling better my doctor prescribed citalopram last wednesday I too had horrific panic attack and have decided not to take anymore my gp was quite insistant that i continue with them I dont know if its in the mind but I feel a little bit better after restarting flupenthixol and have brought a relaxation tape . I really hope you feel better now
Hi Deb-22, I am a lot better than I was when I started this thread! To be honest I have started wondering if I have reached a "recovery plateau" and need to increase my dose as I am finding that my anxiety is staying with me for most of the day now. Every time it goes away, it comes back and I wonder if I am seriously ill and if I'm ever going to get better -- it's very demoralising at times.
I have dealt with a lot of my problems and I am trying not to obsess as much each day. It's working -- to a point. (Maybe 4 out of 10?) Yet I still find my anxiety is there in the background. It's more noticeable than it has been for weeks. I seem to be getting worse at the same time as I am recovering!
At Mind we discussed how it can be "comfortable" to stay anxious or depressed. Feeling happy and free are not things that I usually allow myself to feel. I am "scared" to be happy or successful cos it feels like I should be worrying or feeling guilty about something. I've spent my whole life feeling guilty. I can't make myself stop after 30 years.
Tori Frances
26-05-09, 08:35
Hi Poet,
Its really interesting to read your posts. You clearly have a lot of insight into your illness. I too worry about ever getting better - I think we all do when we have had this as a long term issue. I think when I do have good days I am terrified they will be over soon and so I sort of make them disappear by stressing like this. However I have been free of anxiety in the past and I have to believe I will be again. Its just a horribly long process. Your positive posts have inspired me though - thank you!
blindmetalhound
26-05-09, 14:40
Hello
This is my first time on this website, I have only just joined a short while ago but I was pointed to this thread by my support worker and I would like to put my opinion, I have been on these pills for the last two years (Can't spell the name) and in my expierence they are great, one advantage that they have over most pills are that they are not addictive, and don't really have any side affects, unfornately for me I have been on them for so long that I no longer see the difference, however when I started on them I was completely different, I was chatty, happy and full of confidence so in my opinion you should trust your doctor it's worth a try. x
Hi everyone, thank you for your comments :D
I have only just joined a short while ago but I was pointed to this thread by my support worker
Wow... am I getting famous?? If I write a few more threads I can be NMP's rival to the "Hairy Angel" :D
The last few days have been very difficult for me. I made a decision to step away from NMP so I could "go it alone" and see if that helped my recovery. I think I made this decision too soon.
For the last 4 days I have tried to think about other things and keep myself distracted. It does work (to a point) and I have spent more time than usual in the "real world" but I always end up feeling the fear starting up all over again. I'm sick of the bad feelings coming back. It's not like I'm even scared of anything in particular. It's like if I don't feel fear, something bad will happen. If I feel happy, I think that I should be feeling sad. I don't know why!!
My anxiety is not as severe as it was a few weeks ago -- but now I am experiencing anxiety and distress nearly all of the time without much of a break. Sometimes I feel like I'm relapsing or somehow getting worse.
I thought I was beating it. I definitely haven't! I visited Mind but they didn't have enough staff on to speak to me so I phoned the Samaritans to vent. This helped, as usual, but the fear returned after I got off the phone. I'm going to Mind again tomorrow. I want this sorting out.
I've reached a point where I am tired, stressed, frustrated, frightened and upset and I feel exhausted by my war against anxiety. I know I've been recovering, I know this is probably another "blip", I know I won't be like this forever, but none of that seems to help. Aaargh! I need a "Mr Motivator" to shout at me all day.
On the positive side I tore up all my written notes that I made about my problems. I was using them as a "comfort blanket" but they were just reinforcing my negative feelings.
I've identified the cycle that I am trapped in:
1. Anxiety and/or stress build to boiling point
2. I vent about my problems
3. Usually feel better or calmer, more controlled, reasonably positive
4. Positive feelings rapidly give way to a feeling of mild depression
5. Go back to number 1
I hate to ruin a positive thread with this stuff. I think of this as my actual recovery. The first half of this thread was my struggle to adapt to citalopram. The rest of it is my fight to get better from anxiety and depression.
Things to say to your anxiety when you wake up in the morning:
"What are you still doing here? I thought I told you to go and (have intimate relations with) your mother!"
Hi again Poet
Why dont you maybe stop analysing (maybe thats the wrong word to use?)just for a while, and go go with the flow of how you are feeling. Take each day at a time. Maybe increase your meds,(I know you are not happy at increasing them at the moment - but perhaps you could up by 5mg a time) still have counselling, keep yourself occupied and just give it time. It has taken me over a year to get to where I am, almost totally free of anxiety, - I know a big lot of this is due to me now taking 30mg citalopram. I feel so calm now I cant even be concerned with thinking about what I went through.
Maybe sometimes too much soul searching and analysing can be counter productive?
Hope you feel less anxious soon :hugs:
Hi Popperoonie, it's good to hear from you again!
I've been told by everyone that I analyse too much and I am putting too much pressure on myself. I realise this, I am just not sure how to stop it. Both of these are lifelong problems of mine. You know what I said about feeling like I've got to deal with my whole life? This is more evidence.
I do want to get better and I do want to be a better person. I'm gonna take everyone's advice and LEARN to switch off!! If I get stressed or upset I'll come here or use the Samaritans to vent my emotions, then when I'm feeling better I'll get on with my life!
It is tough at the moment with my anxiety being so prevalent... I guess I will just have to keep going and see if the anxiety does start to go away.
I am like "I want to be better NOW dammit!" -- perhaps I should add "impatience" to my list of things to fix ;)
Weekly progress update (http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showpost.php?p=490071&postcount=83)
I re-took the CBT tests as if I was still feeling the way I did when I started on citalopram nine weeks ago. My depression score was the highest possible and it said I required urgent help because I was "really quite ill". Very scary, but at least it proves I have made progress!
I'm gutted that my anxiety has fought back so hard. I thought I had broken its back. I know it was unrealistic to expect to recover so quickly. It's hard when I keep lapsing into fear. I hate being obsessed with it; that's why i don't like being at home, not because my home life is depressing, but because I know I will have plenty of time to think about my worries! It's driving me mad!
I am definitely getting some more inositol, I am 100% certain that my anxiety has increased because I stopped taking the stuff. If anyone is still reading this, PLEASE try inositol if you are able!
Hi again Poet :D
I know you dont want to increase the 20mg of citalopram you are taking right now, but maybe if you did, then you would feel a bit better? I know personally speaking, that the 30mg that I am now taking, makes me feel a lot better than when I was on 20mg. I know its early days on 30mg yet, but I do feel much better so far.
20mg is not a very high dose if you are suffering with higher levels of depression and anxiety.
It takes a long time I found to deal with my anxiety (pre taking citalopram days) It took a year for me and then I went onto medication. All the self help in the world that I did, never helped as much as the citalopram. It depends on how unwell we are with anxiety and depression - for some people, self help alone may be enough and a low dose of anti depressant, but for someone with more serious anxiety and depression they will need more.
I am taking Insitol too and maybe it is helping? I dont know - maybe its a combination of both...and I take the B vitamins too and have now bought Omega 3 because I don't get enough of that in my diet.
I know its not easy to switch off analysing. I was terrible for that. I could sit and analyse all day and night about eveything that was going off with me and my life. That's what made me so unwell in the end I know. I just became worn out with it all. Now I feel so calm and floaty on these tablets, that I cant be bothered to be bothered. Maybe it wont last, but for now at least my head and nerves are getting a rest.
Have you been back yet to see your gp???
I know its not easy to switch off analysing. I was terrible for that. I could sit and analyse all day and night about eveything that was going off with me and my life. That's what made me so unwell in the end I know. I just became worn out with it all.Yeah, I have been feeling overwhelmed (to say the least) these last few days and it seems to me that I am analysing and over-thinking more than normal. I am tiring myself out. Switching my brain off is a skill I have never had and it is taking time to learn.
You really do sound different now you have increased your dose, a lot more confident and assertive. I'm going to stick with 20mg until my next counselling session. Once that is over, if there is still no improvement in my anxiety level, I will speak to the doctor about going up to 30mg.
EDIT: I am starting to keep an "anxiety diary" where I will write down every instance of panic and anxiety - what happened, what triggered it, what I thought, how it made me feel, what time each instance occurred. After 2 weeks I will post my results. It might be interesting and useful.
EDIT 2: I forgot to mention this -- a deadline for applying for a job, the only one I've seen in six months that I actually want, is up in less than a week. I think this might be one of the underlying causes for my increase in anxiety. I'm going to apply today... *very deep breath*
Had a very helpful session at Mind, where we agreed that my current bout of anxiety may be stress-related because of the job deadline.
We discussed my apparent "backwards step" and agreed that I have only been recovering for a few weeks -- the process will take a long time as I was very ill just two months ago -- this backwards step is not going to be anything more serious than a temporary, and very normal, blip.
Also, feeling ill gives you certainty -- you KNOW when you are ill and the world gives you room to BE ill. Once you start feeling better, everything becomes uncertain again. Am I really getting better? Will I recover completely? Will I have a relapse? Is this a false hope? Is it just a blip? Etc. The world starts crowding back in with its stress and pressure and you can feel overwhelmed at first. Again, this is normal, and should get easier as recovery continues. (This made me feel A LOT better.)
We also talked about how my anxiety is tiring me out and how I am always unhappy and scared at the thought of being at home; we explored the possibility that my fear of being at home is simply a fear of being alone with my negative thoughts, and we discussed ways to make my thoughts of being at home and/or being alone more positive.
I've bought some more inositol and some 1000mg fish oil tablets which are very high in EPA and DHA, both of which are thought to help with stress, anxiety and depression.
I am determined to enjoy the rest of today: I'm making the choice to stop thinking about my problems and replace them with hobbies and positive thoughts.
Sorry for the bombardment of posts today, I really need some encouragement!!
I have made a post in this thread here (http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?t=50352) which I beg you to read! I am really struggling with the "fear of being at home" problem and it is driving me out of my mind -- I cannot ignore this or put it off any longer, this problem is affecting my life to a significant degree and to be honest it has been for a while.
The positive side is that this problem is obviously needing some attention, it is like I am being forced to confront it and deal with it. I've always said that if I can overcome this problem I will have taken a huge step towards recovery. I should never have put it off for this long, it's gone from being a fear to a full blown phobia!
I really need a mentor to help me out. I used to have one but she's deserted me. I tried to carry on alone but it isn't working, I need some help!!
Hi Poet,
Sounds serious, have you discussed this with MIND. I found that writing down my thoughts that led to the fear or phobia have helped greatly, at first when I did it, I didn't have much to put down but with practice you start to analyse your thoughts in more detail and you start adding more to the list. If you can analyse your thoughts on your own thats good, but in my case I analyse them but not deep enough or in a way in which I could put them into perspective. I found that when I went to the counselling sessions I would take these thoughts I had written down, the counsellor would then ask questions about the way you think from another point of view to make you think more out of the box, its clever but simple cos when you give the answer its like a cloud lifts as you see your problems from a less fearful perspective. I don't know if this helps in anyway, but it has helped me and I am no different from anyone else.
Keep positive about your recovery, you are doing really well!
Lion King
Hi Lion King, thank you for the comments.
I agree that this has become serious, so I started a separate thread here (http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?t=50352) to see if people think this is anxiety or depression, so I know where I stand and what I should be doing to deal with it.
I have had a few insights into this problem and I posted them in that thread. Maybe these insights will help other people -- there seem to be a few others suffering from the same thing. It is very distressing; fixing it will help get me past this "plateau" I have reached with my recovery.
I did a blood test and it came back as "ideal".
It is hard when I feel good and then my anxiety descends on my again. It is giving me headache, it sometimes makes me feel sick and I can feel the tension in my chest, almost like I've got a chest infection. I then get scared that I am ill or dying or something.
It makes me wonder whether I am as far along the road to recovery as I thought, cos a lot of these problems remind me of how I was a couple of months ago. Somatic symptoms, harmless, but somehow they feed my anxiety. I won't let the b*stard win.
I think I am going to have to vent a lot about this. I'm gonna use the Samaritans for a few days as they are always good for venting and getting rid of fears. I wish I was seeing my counsellor tomorrow. The sooner I can deal with this problem the better.
I forgot to add in my last post, I am suffering from very high levels of stress. I am applying for a job, the only one I've seen that I actually want, and although it doesn't sound like much it is really distressing me. Today is my last chance to apply. If I don't send the form back today they won't get it before the deadline.
I am gonna get it done now! I'm gonna listen to powerful, inspirational music (where's my Birdy Song LP) and hope it bolsters my courage. Hopefully my stress levels will drop when this application is in the post!
I'm in the middle of it now!! I am facing one of my worst fears, and the anxiety has reduced to a feeling of strained calm! I wish I'd done this weeks ago, maybe things would be different now.
But you wernt at the same place you are now weeks ago! The main thing is you are doing it now,so well done for that. You cant beat the buzz of confronting your fears! What we did or didnt do in the past cant be changed,but we can choose the path we take into the future.. Sue
Thanks :)
I'm still working on it, I'm nearly done to be honest, and I feel like I'm getting into a sharper and more professional frame of mind. I'm listening to my favourite music and I keep popping downstairs to see my family if I get stressed by the monotony of filling this form in.
I feel like I'm taking another positive step towards beating my problems. This should be a weight off my mind.
EDIT: 4:15pm
I did it! It's done! I finished it, proof read it and sent it by email :D
I feel A LOT calmer now, just got the normal background feelings of "Why aren't I afraid? I must have something to be afraid of!"
Got a lovely evening lined up tonight, so I am gonna put all my worries on hold and visit Mind tomorrow to work them out. That's right anxiety, I'm going to fight you to the last, and then do you know what I'm gonna do? I'm gonna make you my little BITCH!
EDIT 2: 5.20pm
I am still feeling ok, a lot calmer, like walking out of a gale and into a quiet room where you can still hear the gale outside, it just doesn't bother you much!
I phoned Samaritans after I had submitted my job application. Why would I do this when I'm happy? Because I wanted to STAY happy and re-affirm my own commitment to getting better. It helped, I still feel good, I have taken a MAJOR step towards my recovery. I feel like a dam has burst!
I'm a bit nervous in case the anxiety comes back. It's been hard to deal with this week. It's wonderful to have spent an hour free of it. I guess this is just one more fear that I flushed down the toilet of life, leaving me free to concentrate on the few that remain!
You know what I think helped? I spent the afternoon thinking about my strengths. I wrote a personal statement that made me sound like a perfect angel. Instead of worrying about things I basked in my own personal glory. It really helped me. I think we should all spend an hour a day writing good things about ourselves, it's such a boost to your confidence.
Recovery continues slowly but surely! All roadblocks will be overcome, no matter how long it takes!
grannynotts
28-05-09, 19:26
i have been on Citalopram for a year now, was the same as you when first started, I even has the doc out on a home visit on the first day, but he told me to try and different time of day to take them, I always take them after I have eaten about midday , after two weeks felt a lot better so stick with them, x
Thanks Grannynotts!
Well I have had a good evening and I still feel quite happy and calm, first time I've been this happy for a few days, it's a nice feeling and I want to hold on to it.
I am going to stop looking at myself as someone who is "ill" or a "victim" -- I'm going to look at myself as someone who is actively working to better himself and who has already made a lot of progress. Instead of thinking ahead to "empty days" with fear, I'm going to make sure I organise and plan my time ("time management" skills) so that I know what I'm doing and I know what to look forward to. I can plug any gaps in my calendar or simply look forward to them as relaxation time.
It's times like this when I know my problems can be beaten -- I can feel what it will be like when they are gone -- I'm going to hold on to this memory. Recovery is painful and hard because that's the way it's got to be. I look forward to the day when I wake up and feel good all day without any worries, little or large, bringing me down. I'm going to be me again.
Pleasant dreams everyone.
Woke up feeling like the anxiety has backed down a lot, now I just feel nervous and tense like I'm expecting something bad to happen any minute. I've got my day planned out and I'm wanting to drop in at Mind for a chat just to keep myself on course. I like to visit them on Friday evenings before I go to my friend's, I need reassurance to get me through the weekend.
I find the weekends much tougher than weekdays because there is less support available -- Mind is closed and the NMP forums which I usually use are quiet. Hey I've just identified another problem -- "weekends" -- something else to go on my list of things to sort out.
It helps me so much to keep track of all my problems like this... only problem is it sometimes seems like the list keeps getting added to every time I cross something else off. Ah well, the positive view is that nothing lasts forever so eventually I am going to run out of problems! That will be a nice day!!
Been to Mind, had a good chat with the staff to bolster myself for the weekend.
I am suffering from the dreaded "fear of being at home" and "groundhog day" problems that I have mentioned in other threads. As I've said before these are very tough and cause me a lot of distress. I touched on these at Mind.
Thinking and talking about these problems feels like touching a very sore bruise; maybe it's too soon to face them full-on? But they make me unhappy when I get them and I still believe that beating them will be a significant step in my recovery.
I still need lots of support. Suppose there's nothing wrong with that, everyone needs help now and then.
EDIT: 00:15am
I find that I sometimes struggle to tell the difference between anxiety and depression. I have a thought that strikes me with what I believe to be depression, then it fades after a minute or two (probably the citalopram kicking in as much as my self-help techniques) and in the relief that follows I feel like I had anxiety rather than depression. This is really confusing me. Hopefully it will become clear as time goes by and I get used to it.
Well, if anyone is still reading this and getting anything from it, I have had a new insight into my morning anxiety.
For most of the last 3 months I have been lying in bed until late in the morning (late for me, anyway). I normally wake up around 9, and in the past I was too excited by life to go back to sleep -- I had to get up.
Now I stay in bed until around 10.30, even if I wake up early.
I was worried that this might indicate depression (I'm still in a state of phobia when it comes to depression). I haven't been able to fully analyse my morning anxiety because it hurts too much and I was scared thinking about it would bring me down. The anxiety fades through the day and by the evening it is difficult or impossible to remember how bad I can feel in the mornings.
That means this is the FIRST time that I have actually faced up to my morning anxiety despite suffering it for nearly 3 months!
So I was lying there this morning feeling tired, bored, demoralised, demotivated, upset at the thought of facing another day feeling like this. Thoughts of going out with my mate cause me feelings of gloom, opening my bedroom curtains and looking out at the world makes me fearful and gives me depressive feelings. This is basically how I feel every morning.
I thought about it in depth today. I realised that I'm not lying in bed because I am depressed. I'm lying there because I am scared of nearly EVERYTHING.
I'm scared of my anxiety, I'm scared of the times when I am depressed.
I'm scared of what I have gone through when I was at my worst; I'm scared of what I am going through now.
I'm scared to spend time with my friend because he can be in such relentlessly bad moods that it brings me down and sometimes makes me feel depressed, especially when the conversation turns dark, e.g. complaining about things we can't change.
I'm scared to carry on feeling like this all the time - I'm scared and distressed by the thought that my anxiety will stay with me nearly every minute, making it hard to enjoy my life - I get upset at the thought of sitting in my room writing and thinking about my problems cos that is one of the few things that makes me feel better.
I'm scared that even if I recover, I will relapse.
I'm scared that I will gradually get worse and suddenly become suicidal or manic depressive or psychotic or otherwise unable to live a normal life. (I realise how impossible most of this is, it still scares me though!)
I'm scared of death and suicide, two long-buried fears that I have kicked up in my soul-searching. (Lots of old problems have come to light and I have dealt with most of them -- a few, like this, are so unexpected and frightening that I simply don't know how to overcome them.)
I'm scared of being NORMAL -- I'm scared of recovery -- because I will have to take my place in the big wide world after so long staying in the comfort of home; I will have to fight for my place in life, I'll be under constant stress, I'll have to do things I don't want to do, my hobbies and social life will play second fiddle to some job that I probably won't want to do.
I'm scared to deal with my remaining problems because they are so painful and threatening to me.
I hope someone manages to read all that. I need help with these problems if I'm ever going to be free of them. At least I recognise my problems and I know how they affect me: surely I am a step closer to recovery.
Another update, Pot Noodle fans.
Since my brief flirtation with anxiety in the morning, I have been all right today. Applying for that job a couple of days ago has brought my stress levels down and has given me something to feel good about.
I have had nervous and anxious moments throughout the day, mainly worrying that my anxiety and depression will return in force. This hasn't happened all day and I am hoping it won't for a long time.
It's interesting to note that I have been taking inositol again for 3-4 days and I am noticing that my chatterbox is not as dominant and I am finding it easier to distract myself.
Of course, I have been taking positive steps to deal with my problems, but this is the second time that I have started feeling like this after taking 6 inositol tablets per day (total of 3.9g).
Now there's the inevitable worry that I am only recovering cos of medication and inositol, that if I stop taking them I will become ill again, etc, etc. Yet more worries for an ever-growing list; ah well, sorting my problems out will give me something to do until I get a job!
Another update! I know people are reading this, I can hear you breathing! :D
Well I am still in the same state of "nervous tension" but it is not as bad as yesterday. I spent a couple of hours in the sun cleaning my car inside and out (made a horrible job of the outside by the way) and during that time I didn't think anything negative.
I find that I get more nervous when I'm indoors alone. The inositol, tiredness and a general good mood are stopping me from dwelling on my fears.
I am finding that fresh insight into my problems comes with every passing day. It takes a while to reach the stage where you start thinking "Aaah, so that's why this is happening..." and now I have reached that stage I find I am learning things about my problems and myself as a person. It is encouraging and inspiring.
It's nice to know that I can phone Samaritans and vent if I need to. Knowing that support is there often makes me feel like I am brave enough to carry on alone.
My problems haven't gone away forever, I will have to start dealing with them again soon, it's just nice to have one weekend where I have been free of fear.
Hi Poet,
its definitely hard work, I am feeling better but I am still living as an anxiety sufferer. I don't feel free completely, I get relapses all the time but I have learnt to cope when it does happen. It proves to me like yourself that we still have a lot of work to do to be free from all this stress, it is a long road but we will make it eventually, remember to keep looking forwards not backwards.
Hope you keep strong
Lion King
Thanks matey. I have had a relatively good weekend, the best in about three months, and there are quite a few factors in this: the citalopram, the inositol, the beautiful weather and my improving mental attitude. I haven't needed to call the Samaritans or spend time trying to cope with my problems. In fact if I had tried to deal with things I would have made myself feel worse: I needed a break. I'm going to stay away from Mind for a few days and wait for counselling on Friday. I'm going to concentrate on having fun and relaxing until counselling.
I took my weekly cognitive behavioural therapy tests again today.
Anxiety score - HAD test (lower is better)
2 weeks ago: 18
1 week ago: 20
This week: 18 (severe)
Depression scores - HAD/PHQ tests (lower is better)
2 weeks ago: 7/4
1 week ago: 8/2
This week: 7/0 (mild/none)
Interesting results which reflect the constant "up and down" theme to my battle. They show that although I am dealing with my problems, I still have work to do. I might be better taking these tests every 2-4 weeks as I am likely to see more progression over longer time periods. I am still encouraged though; both my anxiety and depression scores have dropped slightly in the last week.
I am certain that my feelings of fear, panic and anxiety are still holding me back from having a normal life. The fight goes on!
Continuing the battle for recovery with another success!
Took a big step today -- spent most of the day out with my mate racing our remote controlled off-road trucks then went back to his for a curry and lazing in his back garden with his girlfriend and the dogs. Had almost no upsetting or distressing thoughts. Did have the odd moment of course, but on balance I felt good nearly all day.
The only thing that is negative is that we were playing a competition game we normally play which I look forward to and enjoy. Unfortunately when we played it today, it put me straight back in the anxiety loop for a few minutes. It seems that I now associate this game with the bad feelings I used to experience. Oh no. But not to worry, I'm sure I can do some "positive association" as time goes by.
I felt a little bit nervous at the thought of coming home but put it aside quite easily. That's the first time I have brushed this fear off so easily. I am really encouraged by this. I feel that I have come a long way since counselling 2 weeks ago and my session this week will hopefully feel more positive!
Weekly update (http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?p=490071#post490071)
Nice one mate,
One step at a time, you will get there!
Lion King
Continuing the battle for recovery with another success!
Took a big step today -- spent most of the day out with my mate racing our remote controlled off-road trucks then went back to his for a curry and lazing in his back garden with his girlfriend and the dogs. Had almost no upsetting or distressing thoughts. Did have the odd moment of course, but on balance I felt good nearly all day.
The only thing that is negative is that we were playing a competition game we normally play which I look forward to and enjoy. Unfortunately when we played it today, it put me straight back in the anxiety loop for a few minutes. It seems that I now associate this game with the bad feelings I used to experience. Oh no. But not to worry, I'm sure I can do some "positive association" as time goes by.
I felt a little bit nervous at the thought of coming home but put it aside quite easily. That's the first time I have brushed this fear off so easily. I am really encouraged by this. I feel that I have come a long way since counselling 2 weeks ago and my session this week will hopefully feel more positive!
Weekly update (http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?p=490071#post490071)
Nice 1 mate Im glad to hear it :yesyes: I kinda took a step back this last week and the side effects have been really getting to me. Today hasnt been so bad, the nice weather has helped a bit...still feel very isolated though...
Str33tboy, sounds like you are going through a "blip". I find my minor blips last around 3 days and the major ones last longer than a week. You start to notice such patterns over time and that can be helpful in beating your problems. You don't need to be so scared of blips once you know you can get better from them.
I'm still feeling good, more motivated, definitely a lot more relaxed, able to enjoy myself and take a well deserved breather from my war against anxiety. I am 100% certain the inositol (over 3g per day) is helping. It dulls the emotional pain and makes it harder to think negatively. It is the perfect complement to citalopram.
There is a new problem though: I am going to counselling on Friday and I will have to open Pandora's box once more. I tend to feel rough for a few days after seeking support cos I end up having to wallow through my problems again. I am looking forward to helping myself, I'm just not looking forward to the "anxiety backlash" that usually comes after counselling.
I haven't visited Mind for the same reason. I am happy to not have to deal with my troubles for a while BUT I know that once I do have to deal with them, I may feel low again.
EDIT: 10.40pm
I'm going to put my troubles aside until counselling. I haven't really allowed myself to have a rest from them before so let's see what happens when I do.
Today's update. Another good day of relaxing and stress-busting. I did feel a bit nervous about going to my mate's but it went well and I enjoyed the journey home for the first time in a while. My distraction techniques are working.
Following frightening thoughts to their conclusion
I think I'm going through the stereotypical "existential crisis", you know, when you ask the usual deep questions such as who am I, why am I here, where am I going etc. Being anxious and depressed, it is the wrong time to be asking these questions.
I am going to talk to my counsellor about this on Friday. I just saw my brother happily sorting something out for his dinner tomorrow and I had the usual "What's the point of everything" thoughts. Sounds like a scary thing to think? Well yeah, it was at first, but now I've realised that there is a second half to that statement: "What's the point of everything if it's only temporary".
The clue is in the second half of the sentence. If what is only temporary? The what in this sentence is the key to this particular problem. In this case the what is "happiness". What's the point of doing anything or being happy or even being alive if happiness ends and you're going to spend the rest of the time being miserable?
Obviously this is an unrealistic thing to think. Moods do end, emotions come and go, but just cos I might only be happy for the next five minutes doesn't mean I won't be happy again later. I'll talk more about this when I've got time. Thinking like this is helping me to work some things out and it's helping to overcome the feelings of sadness and fear I would normally have at this point.
Good night Pot Noodle pickers.
Today's update. Another good day of relaxing and stress-busting. I did feel a bit nervous about going to my mate's but it went well and I enjoyed the journey home for the first time in a while. My distraction techniques are working.
Following frightening thoughts to their conclusion
I think I'm going through the stereotypical "existential crisis", you know, when you ask the usual deep questions such as who am I, why am I here, where am I going etc. Being anxious and depressed, it is the wrong time to be asking these questions.
I am going to talk to my counsellor about this on Friday. I just saw my brother happily sorting something out for his dinner tomorrow and I had the usual "What's the point of everything" thoughts. Sounds like a scary thing to think? Well yeah, it was at first, but now I've realised that there is a second half to that statement: "What's the point of everything if it's only temporary".
The clue is in the second half of the sentence. If what is only temporary? The what in this sentence is the key to this particular problem. In this case the what is "happiness". What's the point of doing anything or being happy or even being alive if happiness ends and you're going to spend the rest of the time being miserable?
Obviously this is an unrealistic thing to think. Moods do end, emotions come and go, but just cos I might only be happy for the next five minutes doesn't mean I won't be happy again later. I'll talk more about this when I've got time. Thinking like this is helping me to work some things out and it's helping to overcome the feelings of sadness and fear I would normally have at this point.
Good night Pot Noodle pickers.
another great post I can relate to mate. I ask my self those questions all the time. I know what you mean about it being the wrong time to ask those questions of ones self. At the moment I keep asking myself who am i? what is my point to being on this planet?..its all about the anxiety and depression
Yes I have experienced immediate reactions our doctors do not know everything about pills trust yourself. I would reduce the dose until you feel ok on it. Some of these pills can be very toxic.
My counselling appointment is tomorrow, and I am still nervous that it will bring me down after a fantastic week.
I wonder if I should simply start forgetting all this stuff. I've vented about it until there is no real urge to speak about most of it. Maybe this is how recovery really feels.
It is hard to think about my time as a prisoner of fear and I feel like it has left a deep, painful wound. I'm so confused at the moment. A week ago I was desperate to unburden myself, now I find myself close to being happy.
Weekly update (http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?p=490071#post490071) - Now entering week 11 after the first truly positive week; hoping recovery continues.
I've been looking through my old threads to find stuff that I can discuss with my counsellor (hopefully I will get another epic session) and I find that I identified most of the major problems months ago but I am still suffering from them and I haven't done a lot to move on from them. D'oh!
I am still very confused: I sometimes feel like I'm developing agoraphobia yet when I go out I'm fine and I do go out nearly every day? When I am at home I am sometimes scared to leave, and when it's time to come home I am scared of going back? Lord knows how I got so muddled up! It's time to untangle the knots!
Ok, I went to counselling, and found some comfort in it. I do feel a bit "dented" as we explored some of my more painful issues and I felt like I was going to cry or something at one point.
The good thing about having counselling every 2 weeks is that I spend the first 5-10 minutes of each session telling her how much progress I've made. Obviously this is very encouraging.
I might pop into Mind this evening when it's quiet and discuss a few things. I don't want to start getting obsessed with my problems again. I'll see how I feel later.
EDIT: I'm hoping not to go onto a downer after counselling and I am hoping to have another good week.
EDIT: Been to Mind, I do feel a bit down but not really in a "depressed" way. I think today was the wrong day to have a counselling session. If I can bounce back quickly I will feel more confident that my recovery really is underway. At the moment I am feeling a bit of the old fear for the first time in a week, and I can remember now why I was having such problems escaping from my fear.
Hi Poet,
Its difficult to get to the bottom of the anxiety, as you aware I went back to work and I found myself feeling a bit down or a bit flat with very little motivation, I was getting a bit worried as I had not felt that low for a few weeks especially as this mood continued for such a long time, I thought depression was kicking in. I am still a bit in this mood and I need a rocket up my backside to fire me into action, I think it could be the pressure of tackling all your major issues in one hit, but it can be too early a stage to start tackling these to cope mentally so the mind ends up shutting off.
My next counselling session is dealing with the automatic thought process that makes me anxious, I have to record the situation and the very first thought that enters my head, I keep finding that I self doubt myself from the word go, so my offset becomes negatives so I have an internal to turn this positive and overcome self doubt. Hopefully with further counselling this will be dealt with.
Hope this helps in some way.
Lion King
Hi mate, thank you for your reply. I wish you well with your counselling.
I think that, for the time being, I have come as far as I can by analysing my problems. I no longer have as much need to vent and I am fairly sure I have identified everything that I need to be aware of at this time.
Analysing my thoughts and feelings has helped me to reach this point in my recovery; now I feel that it is time to stop trying to use science and brainpower, and to simply relax and enjoy the peace for a while. A change of tactics, if you like.
The lady at Mind remarked that I seem to be at my best when I put my problems aside. It is only recently that I have been able to do this. She is right though, it is making a difference. I'll still vent when needed and update this thread. Hopefully this thread will become more positive now.
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