View Full Version : CBT - A FRESH START. Here we go then!
So I begin a thread..
a path I tentatively tread..
A little dread of what is to come.
But I should have no fear.
As those that are close to me are near.
Must work my stress and be ME…
Welcome to my CBT.
So here we go. What is CBT? Cognitive Behaviour Therapy. Please see other pages on this site for a clear description. I shall assume that if you’re reading this then you know the principles of this process.
Why am I trying it? Because it has been recommended as an appropriate therapy given my circumstances at this time and I trust the people who made the recommendation.
What are my circumstances? I guess it would be best to spend a little time outlining my condition and current state of mind so that others who can relate to my particular difficulties can follow the process with a greater empathy. Those who carry different burdens will hopefully draw experience from the process of CBT I hope to write about with clarity and accuracy as it affects me and my condition.
I have spent my entire adult working life in the entertainment industry. I am self- employed. These days I have ten staff whom work with me in production and we make documentary programmes on special interest topics. These are broadcasted on television or/and distributed on DVD.
I have always lived beyond my means, taken on too much work, lived a life of self created stress and deadlines and have probably thrived on the adrenalin and pressure produced. I have been “used to it”. I have my methods of coping.
But in reality I have always had a switch off by artificial means and from age 16 to circa 45 I smoked cannabis every evening. During those three decades I probably drank no more that 100 litres of alcohol in total. But I became aware through my partner that my nature was changing as I began to smoke earlier in the days and was spaggy if I couldn’t get to a joint. I’d also start to get too concerned if supply was getting low. I was always unable to have it around and NOT smoke.
So I quit. It took two years. Then though I did begin to drink more. Good wines and ports slowly but surely led onto Vodka and Tango. The effects of which we all know.
My nature is addictive. Work, adrenalin, drugs, alcohol, sex. Striving for “perfection” in art. My private life is complicated. And I have many responsibilities.
All was going pretty good really until along came a nasty recession and then cashflow hell hit. And suddenly all that I had built for all those that depended on me was greatly threatened. All because I’d over committed my finances both business and personal and not enough pound coins were coming in to cover the number required going out.
I am not alone with this situation. But it started to affect my sleep. And I found myself conking out early through too much alcohol and then waking all the time, sitting up and looking at the clock wondering if it was time to go to work and try to deal with the problems. At 1am this is not a good idea. Nor is at 1.47am. Or 2.20am or 3.15am etc.
Anxiety increased as I fought my fires. And got more and more stressed as now I had not only responsibility to my family but also to ten employees who depended on me for THEIR livelihoods and income.
In January I also developed a terrible dose of internal piles. And one of them coagulated. A vein blocked, went hard and sat there on my nervous system. And do what I could, they wouldn’t stop hurting and they wouldn’t go away.
More stress, more anxiety at a time when I felt I needed to be even more effective than normal. So I went to the doctor and asked for some sleeping tablets. Despite a life of cannabis etc I’ve never been keen on pills. Zolpidem was prescribed and I was warned that although they would help me get to sleep, the problems that were causing the stressful sleep patterns would NOT go away.
As the piles failed to improve so I got more anxious and took the tablets nightly until after six weeks they were most definitely having a negative effect. I began to shut myself away in my offices, my pile cushion and I. A lifetime of being gregarious and loud; fading fast into isolation and anxiety.
Then my soul mate and partner told me this was just not right.. and that I must get to the doctors again and start to deal with a worsening condition. So typically I just stopped the Zolpidem at a weekend when I was alone and the physiological reaction was really “unpleasant” as a massive band of tension and tightness wrapped itself round my entire chest and abdomen. The 3 nights of Friday to Sunday were appalling but I decided I had to go cold turkey. Despite advice that this was not a wise process.
On the Saturday night though I ironed for 4-5 hours.. everything I could find as I thought at least standing I could ease the piles ironically.
And suddenly while ironing after six weeks of pain and pressure they started to feel better. I wondered if my mental state was expressing itself through my butt frankly. Was this another symptom of the stress?
A week ago Monday 23rd I went to see the butt specialist. He marched up me with a camera where no film crew would be bold enough to venture, confirmed that my piles were most definitely going, asked me why I was bouncing all around his office in such a state and suggested I consider CBT. My partner immediately agreed. She has wisdom that I do not.
2 hours later we went to the GP. Told him I’d cold turkey’d the Zolpidem and could I try something to calm me down a bit while we dealt with more of the fires that were causing me problems and explored the availability of CBT. He prescribed Diazepam 2mg.. 3 times a day if required.
I took one and within ten minutes the band went from my chest and abdomen. No drowsy stuff, no nothing. Just some respite. A good start. But a lesson had been learnt about pills and me.
Took another at bedtime. And had a better night. Only woke twice. Struggled to get back to sleep but not too bad.
However I also booked a session of CBT with a “proper clinic” and qualified staff at a town 15 miles away for the Wednesday 25th.. Cost £46.
On the Tuesday 24th I had a call from my GP advising he’d found a CBT therapist located just 1 mile from my home. I rang her and made an immediate appointment for that day. Cost £35.
I went. Partner came with me. Very nice lady. Aromatherapy candles were burning. Magazines on a table. Comfy (ish) chairs. Cold room she was trying to heat with portable gas fires. Badly printed literature that was hardly readable. She listened, I listened. She got my Christian name wrong 3 times before I decided to correct her. When I referred to going from cannabis to hooch she asked me how many alcopops I drank per evening! This was not to be the therapist for me.
The next day I took a Diazepam and I went to the clinic with my partner. It was brightly lit. Not a candle in sight. “Hello Liam” greeted me as I walked in and a lady with bright direct and caring eyes offered her hand, shook mine and directed me to a comfy safe room, full of books, coffee table, box of tissues and plastic cup of cold water.
I sat. We sat and she asked a few questions and wanted to know why I had come and what I was looking for.
I spilt the beans and read out the statement I’d written for myself two hours earlier. “I am no longer able to cope with the stress and over burdened life I’ve created for myself”. And I cried.
We talked. I listened; she listened. Her face worked for me. So did her voice and the words she spoke. She outlined the process of CBT and what we would hope to achieve. And we made an appointment to meet again this week and diary dated the next four weeks.
She gave me legible literature, shook my hand and sent me on my way.
I have found someone I can trust and have faith in her experience and work. I believe that she cares about her patients with patience and that I will be able to change the way I cope and find new strategies whilst at the time working the issues, problems and hurdles that are still in the way, need to be faced and overcome.
Today I had the second session. But writing the above is enough for now and there is the need to tell the tale of the last week BEFORE my second session and the true recognition that I am not well and there is no quick fix.
But the lesson of the week for me when considering CBT was that it is important to find the right therapist for the job and your nature. Not the nearest or cheapest although that would have been very handy, convenient and cost saving. Seeing two helped me assess not only their approaches but the reality of their qualifications and real experience. And MY nature needed to find those answers for me to risk the trust and respect necessary to open up as best I can.. and search for new ways to be me.
“I am now learning new ways to cope with the stress and over burdened life I’ve created for myself”.
Back again tomorrow to carry on this thread with the week of revelation and the second session. Thanks to those who have read. I hope it will have some value to those considering and waiting for CBT. In the meantime may I wish all those who find sanctuary and comfort here at NMP a very good night.
What an excellent introduction,to what im sure will be a very interesting thread. Your openess and honesty is something you will probably find to be very theraputic for you. Its good you have found someone you can trust and feel comfortable with ,as sadly many dont have that choice. I for one look forward to reading the next page of your journey& i truly wish you every sucess with your road to recovery. Sue:hugs:
Thanks Sue. feedbacks encourage and indeed help both the therapy and the writing. Liam
CBT - THE OPENING HAND. A lot had to be covered really in the first part of this thread. I was wary of it being too “me me me” but we needed a bit of bedrock to continue. At the first session we covered the reasons I was there and the reactions and anxieties I was now suffering and feeling about and at work. After leaving I felt better and with a busy schedule and company every evening from my kids (I am separated from my wife and family but my soul mate stays with me 3 nights a week and we work together) I was surprised to find I took no Diazepam from the Wednesday after therapy onwards. On Sunday, partner and I headed south to a favourite hotel having given the staff the Monday 30th off so that we could all charge batteries and I didn't have to think about lack of preparation for others while not being at work. The trip down was great; the hotel room our usual one; not used for a while. No hotels, no restaurants, no takeaways, no pubs since the start of the cash flow crisis in August. No treats while others jobs were at risk. Room service for dinner, movie on the box and a reasonable night's sleep with less disturbance.
Monday morning and breakfast in our favourite panoramic penthouse restaurant. The usual reliable and good quality grub and staff with familiar faces. About 50 diners all happily munching away. And the belt came back with a vengeance. Across the chest and abdomen. WHAT?!??!??! WHY!??!??! I NEARLY had to leave and abandon the bacon. Talked to partner, saw it through, ate tasteless fare and returned to room at earliest and swallowed a diazapem. We then talked for 3 hours. I was re-assured that the day would come when we'd finally be together full time. That helped but we needed to work out why I'd "had an anxious". What triggered it? We went for a walk. Proper boots and coats and hit the coastal path. I haven't walked 6 miles for years. Very few people, we talked, the sun shone the wind blew.. the belt lessened. Had I moved beyond a comfort zone? After six weeks of going nowhere and retreating had I moved into safe boxes and the restaurant threw me? Notes for the CBT. Went to the restaurant for the evening meal. Bought a belter of a bottle and drank a good chunk of it. I know not to mix Diaz with alcohol so no tablets that night. Another disturbed one. Tues morning.. Diaz first thing.. 20 minutes for a "kick in" and then the restaurant. Not brill but better. FINISHED the bacon but wasn't keen to linger. Shopped for socks. Bought a couple of books.. and then drove back and went to work. I had made an IMPORTANT decision before going south. I left the blackberry behind. That is the first time in five years I've abandoned the ether. Only the kids have the mobile number. So there was no comms.
Saw Tuesday night through. A good night. Only two short wake ups. Diazepam. Wednesday morning I awoke WITH the belt across the chest and abdomen. Not so bad but there before I even woke up! But of course today was the day for the 2nd session of CBT. AND I KNEW we had enough cash for salaries and bills this week but next week wasn’t there. So the nagging worry is always in the background. The vulnerability of the lack of pound coins.
Took Diazepam. Went to work. Anxious but trying to breath and relax as best. Fought a couple of small fires but left the bigger blazes alone. Midday and time to leave. Mustn’t be late. Diazepam. Partner came with me but we parted in the car park and I went in alone and met with Ms soulful eyes. Partner not far away in case she needed to pick up the pieces.
This 2nd session I talked about my family, the recent separation and my complicated private life over the last seventeen years and the pressure that has been and the toll it’s taken. I’m not going into the details publicly on this part of my life. Let’s just say we vehemently believe that it’s not separations and divorces that mess up the kids as much as “Here’s your new daddy… or mummy”. So my soul mate and partner and I have lived separate lives in terms of not mixing up our children, and relished and treasured OUR bits of time together. And always been there for the kids independently.
Additionally though as well as the difficulty of living such a lifestyle for so long, the mother of my children has also had to fight breast cancer recently and it’s not easy to give emotional support for such a need when love has faded and the usual difficulties and intolerances have crept in. Add the possibility that because business has been the way it’s been, then there’s even more pressure as I try to be helpful and honourable about future funding for an ailing and not so strong ex wife to be.
This part of my talking took a good chunk of my allocated hour. Ms soulful eyes listens well, judges not, remembers my name and feels my feelings. Or at least as much as her training and experience allows her to.
With two great chunks of explanation now spoken of and the key areas of “WHY” I was there covered she asked if I could work out WHY the restaurant scene had “kicked off”. And I just couldn’t pin it on anything. So… this week’s strategy is to try and establish WHAT I’m thinking about when the belt appears and begins to tighten. See if can recognise the moments and try to write them down for reference at the 3rd session. WHAT ARE THE TRIGGERS? AND CAN I LEARN TO BREATH THROUGH THEM?
There is no doubt that one trigger is when I think about cash flow and the pressures of getting those that owe to pay. So I’ve stopped checking the online banking at 6.30am because if nothing has landed (especially when you believe it will) then what is the point in starting the day so disappointed so early? Even though I have to cope with a little anxiety in terms of not knowing until 9.30am there is always the possibility that some WILL have come in. and indeed monies arrived from America Friday last, so I felt able to go south for the useful break. (on the credit cards).
Paradoxically a one day break was a wise call. Although I yearned for a week (we haven’t taken one for years) I feel I’m better off coping on my own territory and being within reach of the extinguishers the moment I want to try and fight a fire.
After the session yesterday, I took no Diazepam. Didn’t feel the need. A busy evening with a visiting son. And I didn’t take one before bed. MISTAKE. Bad night. Woke every hour. I’d opened a new can of discomfort earlier in the day at CBT. I should have settled for that and had the respite of the medication.
Today I’ve had two Diazepam. It’s nearly midnight I shall take one tonight after a warm bath, hot milk, a little Poldark and a read. Tonight I sleep alone again but I don’t HAVE to be up in the morning particularly early.
So this is my strategy tonight. My little thought for the day. I shall REMOVE the clocks (there’s one on each side of the bed.) THAT will mean I have no time to sit up and look at. I shall set the mobile phone that’s always with me so that the kids can get me to 6.30am. A half hour earlier than normal. So that I will make myself stay in bed UNTIL I hear my alarm call. And NOT get up or look at clocks that aren’t there sooner.
The curtains will be closed with care tonight to reduce the chinks of light. And my music student son recorded “Mad world” on the piano and made it the alarm call on my phone so that gentle music will hopefully be the melody to steadily start the day. If I wake up with the belt in place I WILL tell myself it’ a horrible feeling but it’s just a feeling.
So… we’ll see what happens. The thread is now up to date. The details I particularly needed to relate to both Ms CBT and NMP are now written.
We move on and I shall report how the strategy went and if I’m managing to establish the WHY I GET ANXIOUS moments. Thanks for reading and may everyone here have a good night and a fresh start tomorrow for another day. Long live NMP. Liam
Veronica H
03-04-09, 10:48
Hi Liam
This thread is superb. I am sure that this will prove to be of great value to many in the coming weeks. Thank you so much for the time and honesty you are investing for us. :hugs:
Veronica
Good day to you Veronica H...thank YOU for taking the time to write and encourage. I just jumped on to check for spulling mistakes and there was your posting. Very much appreciated. Liam
CBT- THE DAY AFTER "The Strategy of the night". I removed the clocks. I had the bath. (Well, actually I have a hot tub in reality but I DIDNT activate it.. so it was a BIG bath!) Just looked at the stars and breathed. I took the hot milk. I set the alarm on the phone for 7am instead of 6.30am and checked my son's music. I found where I'd left off "Poldark" previously. I cleaned my teeth. I told myself that 2moro was a GOOD day ahead of work AND as my 3rd son was bringing his new girlfriend around for tea and then he and I were racing karts for the weekend it was all GOOD stuff, GOOD times. No blackberry. No emails. No surfing. Pop to the chat room of NMP. All spoken OUT LOUD to myself. Who cares? MY HOUSE! :-) And then I decided NOT to take the Diazepam but have a single Zolpidem and see if I could get a good sleep as I'd now not had Zolpidem for a fortnight. ONE night only. Within ten minutes I was spark out. And I didn't move until "Mad world" played at 7am. I pressed the stop button. And the next thing I knew it was 8.20am! RESULT! A LITTLE tightness came on when I went to work... I took 1 Diazepam today and ploughed into positive tasks. EVERYONE got paid. The bills were paid. There's not enough for next Friday yet but some had come in that wasn't expected. I didn't know until 9.30 because I now don't check the online banking at 6am anymore! JUST had an email from Los Angeles. I will shut down email totally until Monday because it's 9am there and it's FRIDAY EVENING here. And I don't do work email in the evenings and weekends anymore. Barak will just have to manage without me. ;-). Today's strategies have worked. I had to go and collect some stuff from my ex this afternoon. I began to feel tight going. HAHAH! "GOING TO SEE MY EX CAN MAKE ME ANXIOUS". I recognised it. WE WILL NOT FIGHT. I will come away feeling ok. And that is what happened. No diazepam this afternoon. I shall have one at bedtime. NOT a Zolpidem. 2moro is a GOOD day for me.. maybe I'll try no pills at all. Today's steps have been successful. Have a great weekend everyone. Long live NMP. Liam
Two more brilliant posts Liam ,Your strategies seeem to be working for you,welldone & enjoy your weekend. sue :D
CBT – the last four days and SESSION 3. Friday nights before kart racing weekends are good. I’m busy busy and have a lot to think about. If I get MY bits wrong my son won’t be able to race well. Worse still he may crash. WE are a team. He drives it… and I have to hold it together, find mechanical ways to make it go faster and pay the bills for the broken bits. That is my least favourite part. Especially when I have enough financial worries already. However he doesn’t break stuff often and we work it out somehow. We bond well, we have a shared interest and he inadvertently by his request to race, led me to a pastime that takes ALL my mind when we’re doing it and there’s no room for work, ex wives, separations, troubles or strife. It is all consuming and demanding. If you want to try and do it well. You could say that I was digressing here but the point for me is that it takes my mind off stuff that is making me anxious.
We left off previously with my strategies for trying to sleep and to try and come up with some recognition of WHY I get anxious so that I could advise Ms CBT accordingly and we could work alternative thought processes. A sort of “Let’s find something to hang the hat on” start. So before we look at SLEEP here’s the list so far.
SEEING MY EX WIFE. Years of feeling disapproved of didn’t help. There’s little point in going over old ground. We may wish to never speak again but we have children for life so it’s vital to find a way of moving forward together in their interest and as parents.
So two weeks ago I asked her over for dinner and to stay the night. We were both nervous and cautious. Both wary of “making mistakes” and “kicking off”. We differ in our approaches to parenting teenagers substantially so friction would be easily created. It went ok. We talked and in fact we talked and talked. We ate, we drank wine and we watched a movie… and then we slept in separate rooms. She is recovering from breast cancer and her nights from drug induced enforced menopause are not easy and she has far more experience than me in coping with sleep pattern problems as a result. The next day we were up at about 8.30am… and she packed to go and I made tea cos she was “off in a minute”. And we talked.. and then we talked and it was 11am. And we hugged.. we’ve known each other for 30 years… and she went on her way. Both being poorly in separate ways, we could see that if we could possibly clear out the anger, resentment and disappointment of our failed marriage and life together then it was possible to be supportive, kind and a little more generous in spirit and thought for each other. With OBVIOUS consequences for the children as well.
I decided that it would be ok to invite her again and I believe she would be happy to come. We were of course once the best of friends. I have less to be anxious about next time. JUST LIKE CBT. Confidence grows from FACING the issues and working to deal with the hurdles.
This weekend is my 51st birthday. After careful thought and a LITTLE bit of a conference with our children, I invited her to come to my party. It’s just me, the kids, the girlfriends and now the mum. A complete family. We’re doing fancy dress. Just the seven of us. It’ll be great. LAST year for my 50th I received £3,000 as a chunk of pension. I spent it all on the first party of my life. 100 people came. A daunting but memorable experience! I haven’t had a party since I was four years old. I’m one of those “broken family and beaten child cases”. No matter these days. The weekend ahead is another to look forward to. And another opportunity to make a LITTLE effort to be nicer to my ex and therefore reduce one of MY recognised moments of anxiety.
CASHFLOW. When I think about it, it makes me anxious. When the tax office calls, it makes me anxious. When I think about staff salaries and how I’m going to pay them it makes me anxious. When I haven’t paid a bill on time it makes me anxious. I feel guilty and it’s worse if I have no answers on the horizon. IF EVERYONE PAID ME WHAT THEY OWED ME ALL AT ONCE I’D HAVE ENOUGH he said self pityingly. But they don’t. And that is the way of business now and it’s going to be tough for a while to come. So I need to make a list of the hurdles I have to jump; the changes I have to make. I must then deal with them one at a time and not like a bull at a gate. I shall start tomorrow with ONE A DAY and I think that within two weeks or fourteen days I will have dealt with them all. I won’t like the way the authorities or finance company people will speak to me. I won’t like feeling they are judging me and are censorious. I won’t like their disapproval and I will feel not many of them will be friendly to me. They may hurt my feelings and I will feel bad BUT IF I CAN DO THEM ALL ONE AT A TIME, A DAY AT A TIME, THE MOMENT MUST COME WHEN THERE ARE NONE LEFT TO BE ANXIOUS ABOUT.
Then of course I still have to find the monies to service the “deals” and “terms” but the confrontational parts will be over.
I will reward myself with thinking about karting days to come. And as a bonus we MAY go for an extra test day on April 16th. I must therefore try to have completed all the unpleasant tasks by that time. It won’t matter if I haven’t but I have set that target. To take a day off during a working week is a BIG deal for a workaholic.
Diazepam usage has been reduced this week. I needed one on Monday morning as I recognised that after the relaxed and vibrant weekend, that going to work was a slight anxiety and the tension band although less appeared again. I have conditioned myself to my work place BEING a place of anxiety and that is a shame. I must work on that. I have always lived to work as opposed to working to live. As a principal I mean; not in the literal and complete sense.
So now we move on to the other key area of difficulty this week.. and that is SLEEP! The night of Zolpidem was a great kip. But despite that I have not been tempted to take another. Perhaps once a week OR when I’m climbing the walls and really need to be shut down. Is the ongoing strategy at present.
But I have taken 2mg of Diazapem each night. And although I fall asleep quite well with the strategy of hot tub, hot milk, bit of Poldark, a short read etc.. I wake and I toss and turn and doze and dream I’m awake and so on and so on. BUT HAVING REMOVED THE CLOCKS I’M NOT LEAPING UP AND LOOKING AT THE TIME. This helps. But I peep at the curtains and judge and imagine that light levels are rising.. and try to work out what time it is!
So we come to today’s CBT 3 and Ms soulful eyes. I went on my own with my mental list of some of the triggers I’d recognised and the plan to see what we could do specifically about SLEEP. That was my target.
And of course I talked pretty much about all the above although I have just realised I haven’t talked yet to my therapist about the successful “experiment” of dinner with my ex. I think she would approve and support the strategy. Notice I say approve the STRATEGY. I am learning that her role as a therapist is non judgemental and that whether she approves of ME is irrelevant. This is part of the learning process of not worrying about being disapproved of by others.
So now we look at sleep. Because I am yawning and dozy and nodding from about 10pm to 11pm.. I try to go to bed. My alarm is set as agreed at 7am. All the new strategies are in place, I take my Diazepam and I seem to sleep for 2 or 3 hours and then it all goes into meltdown for the rest of the night.
Firstly… Having learnt a few years back that in my middle age I really only required 6 hours sleep, WHY AM I TRYING TO BE IN BED FOR EIGHT HOURS?!???!! A little nudge from Ms CBT helped me see this!
Next… She asked me what I felt when I awoke. Daft question… I feel AWAKE! But then my thick moment faded… and she broke it down into edible chunks of query…
Was I physically tired? NO. Was I mentally tired? NO. Then how did I expect to be asleep? AHHAHHHHHH! Sometimes just the gentlest of nudges can help us see some light and THAT was Ms Soulful Eyes moment of the session for me.
So here’s the strategy changes this week. You ready for this mighty revelation indulgent reader? I’M GOING TO BED LATER and GETTING UP EARLIER. I shall set the alarm for 6.30am and I shall not go to bed until midnight. Even if I yawn, doze, feel sleepy. My sons are online gaming at that time of night and they will indulge the old fart and let him play Pirates as well if need be. OR I shall read. Or I will start a jigsaw puzzle if REALLY desperate. But I will DO things.
I have yet to work out WHAT I shall do at 6.30am.. with a bit of luck go back to sleep for half an hour. OR I shall return to the cathartic process that I used for the first night just that fortnight ago to help break the sleeping pill pattern. BRING OUT THE IRONING! If needs be I shall go to work at 7am… but I will NOT go back to going at 4am.
My CBT went well today. Ms Soulful eyes actually reads this forum. Probably saves me a fortune in fees because it helps her understand me and my hurdles a little better!
This makes for better team work. We can work my problems together and overcome them. Her part of THIS team is safer tho. She CANT crash the kart.
Have a great week everyone. Long live NMP. Liam
Will,
Phew..... lots of reading lol.
Superb writing and very interesting. Good luck to you my friend.
Veronica H
07-04-09, 20:51
:yesyes: You have achieved so much in the last few days Liam. It takes courage to face your fears and ultimately it is the only way to recovery with this illness. I think that reducing the tension and building bridges with the ex will benefit you both in the coming months and the kids will be happier too. I hope all goes well with the work/life balance and look forward to your next post.
Veronica
EASTER MONDAY. Thanks for the above Veronica H.. hadn't realised there was a page two to the forum until I signed in to write today's missive! And it's a comfort to know that I'm not just writing "in the dark". It is a therapy contribution in its own right tho so I will plough on with my public relevations. It's not been such a good week and as a result I have been responsible for backward slips of my own making. Thursday was my 51st birthday.. I've got no problem with my age. Weight is dropping, salt and Pepper hair.. maybe a tad more salt than previously. I am loved by someone special and she's supporting and fighting with me all the way. I do not need to go "out on the pull" ever again I expect.. and I never need to feel alone.
So Thursday my eldest two came over.. and we played "War of the Rings" - something we do each week now for about 2 months. It's a strategy board game based on Tolkien's wonderful writings. NOW that I can sit down pile free again, it's great fun and a total switch off as my aging mind has to do "battle" with young experienced gamers.. albeit they are mostly online. I suspect it's a stress relief for them too from their much loved partners and busy lives. We have very simple rules.. we deal with any parent/son/wife/mum stuff (The eldest is now working at home as well as still living in Mum house with his partner.. and number two is a student at a university 10 miles away and lives in a flat I bought him with credit cards last Sept.. and added to my financial pressures at a bad time). And then we DONT talk about problems, families, anx.. or anything. It's a good process and means they relax and don't wonder if Dad is going to "bang on" about mum or whatever. And visa versa with my collection of adopted daughters.
Half a mile away stopping at his friend's house was youngest.. and HE is going thru "first girlfriend" stage. We shan't spend much time on THAT part of my life.. I have a "Two down.. and one to go" principal and process. Glad I have sons.. I have no idea how I'd cope with that lot with a daughter. But I have now met the "newbie".. what a puppy!
So I laid off the Diazepam, had a few beers and a port. They stopped over so they could beer too. We had an EPIC game that was a close shave finale. And then we jumped online and played a "Pirate" thing that's called "The Burning Sea". For those of you who surf and play it's a global game that's sort of "Pirates of the Carribean" and although challenging is not as adrenalin fueling and aggresive as many "shoot n kills". I spent 15 mins sailing across a chunk of ocean the other night.. just listening to the waves and wind! However eldest son who is a dope smoker popped outside for a spliff.. and I followed. a few tokes, a blasted head and I went to bed and conked out.. woke early but managed to nod and doze until a sensible time. However I asked my son for a couple of joints so that I could chill down on Good Fri evening. My excuse was that all kids AND ex were coming round for a party on Easter Sat (my youngest is 16 this week as well).. and we'd have a piss up and it's a good time. BUT my ex was coming. An acknowledged anx before we even start.
HOWEVER on Fri...she was getting one going in her own right.. as she struggles with her side of the seperation, the concern that all that I've always supplied will go, the lack of security as all that I've built fades in value. Her latest anti eostrogen (Bet I've spult that wrong) injection for her onging cancer treatment.. the youngest with his first girlfriend JUST as he's coming up to GCSE revision time.. and of course we all know EXACTLY where his head is.. and he can't JUST fly through the human biology exam to the detriment of all other subjects! I'm dropping off the youngest who's just been visiting the girlfriend and she wants him to stop karting fot the exam period. Well that could have caused a right lah lah of a row... as youngest looked at me.. and I could see the panic. I handled it well tho.. and was pleased with myself. Pointed out it was birthday week for me and him, party in 24 hours.. she could sit there with all the exam schedules and calendars she wanted.. but it was also Easter and I just wasn't going to get into a headbang with her about this at that time. But so very SADLY it was enough.. and the mind that had decided NOT to collect the spliffs my son had rolled, turned the bad corner.. and I hunted him up, collected the two joints.. and went home and puffed them.
It was a great chill down! I watched a movie, some stand-up... laughed a lot, decided to leave the housework and party prep until the following morning.. conked out.. and woke at not too bad a time. Just like it was for all those years of shut down.
Easter Sat. 1 Diazepam. It's going to be a long day... Texted EX and said nicely.. if you're head's not up to party or trying to leave "stuff" at home..that despite being very welcome.. don't come. Got consiliatory text back. So.. all back on track but damage done for me. Also she was STAYING OVER. Gulp. Vulnerable. No more tablets for the day.... wanted a few drinks with the kids. Took WHOLE day to sort out multiple beds and bits n pieces.. cursing myself for dossing the night before. Made the deadline. PARTY!
Went very well... lovely atmosphere... there was only seven of us.. the complete family.. but despite the small number we did fancy dress. Seeing my eldest as Adolf Hitler was very very funny. I host well frankly and I can cook...and just for a change I did a cold spread so that I could BE there and not bombing in and out to attend to pots, pans and plates. I had too much to drink. And then I slapped a few puffs on my son's spliff. And that did me in. Folding pages, wooshing head.. all that "You've done too much stuff". So I had to be a party poop and go and lie down! Where I promptly nodded off. But all was well and they had a good time. Apparently dancing took place that I was utterly oblivious to.
So I awoke too early on Easter Sunday. And had to kill time. But not comfortable time. My ex was in the room next door. And because the kids would all be crashed out..I suggested we go for a harley ride... if we had just done that and she'd gone; I wouldn't be in the state I am today.
We made tea and toast, and went to the conservatory and talked. And out came all her stuff. Her anxieties and concerns. For herself, her future. Her unhappiness with her work. Her concern about "college student" who doesn't come home to see her so much now. The youngest and the girlfriend. Karting and exams. Her health. She's ****ted her car, killed the gate on the drive and clearly needs a replacement. (car that is). Her aging skin. How she tells her family about the seperation that happened some time ago. Where she's going to live. How will she find someone.
And I realised that despite all the difficulties and problems between us.. that I'm still the only person she can really talk to.. so she's torn between hating me, jealousy of the relationship I have with our sons..my life with my partner, "losing the financial safety net" she's always had.. and her need for me still to "lean on and be there really".. and as a result.. her passive aggressive stuff makes ME feel bad, negative, responsible, helpless but I should help...etc.... and telling someone that there's no quick fix to the finances.. that I'm just NOT going to add to MY stresses by taking on a car finance deal for HER.. that will last four years or whatever.. that MY credit cards are chock a block and that she just has to use her own (Which are at NIL balance I'll just chuck in).. Just made ME feel worse.
Across came the band of tension... 3 diazepam through the day to try and take the edge off... She went home.. and gradually the kids disappeared to their various adventures. The party was a success. It was also excellent for the children as they can feel less concerned about those times when we WILL need to be family; graduations, weddings, children etc. There is as Veronica H says... benefit for us and the children by reducing tensions and building bridges.. but jeeeez: I can WELL UNDERSTAND why people just call it quits with each other and walk in different directions. I want to work at REDUCING my pressures, lessening the load I've created, cut back on the financial commitments.. and as well as that I've got to help the mother of my children and a partner in my life for nearly thirty years, LET GO OF ME AND STAND ON HER OWN TWO FEET. And that creates guilt and great emotional difficulty for me. I am not a bad man....I am not a selfish one. EXCEPT for the bit that wants the children to see I've done my best and not abandoned their mum.
My soulmate arrived yesterday evening..and began to pick up the pieces. I had no booze, the spliffs are gone and won't be back for quite some time. I dozed and nodded and tried to stay awake which shouldn't have been difficult with Die Hard 4. but was. I took a Zolpidem... and I conked at 11pm.. and woke and dozed at 5.30 onwards... and I woke ok.
But today within half an hour of waking.. it all hit me again.. and I was off. 1 Diazepam didn't help. Stupid stupid man. The booze, the dope, the Diazepam and possibly the Zolpidem. The stress of the ex.. and the knowledge that 2moro is Tuesday and it's back to work.. and pushing the snowball back up the hill.. BECAUSE a TV channel did NOT pay what the had promised to by last Thursday.. so I go back to face the cashflow demons again. AND those final hurdles of the disaproving finance companies etc.
AND I had to go to the family home (ex house) to fix the gate that she'd ****ted with her car... cos the youngest was worried that the dog would get out. So.. I had to go "home" in that sense and do "man stuff". I don't like being on her territory any more. I'm uncomfortable and I'm "gone" from there. A 2nd diazepam. Not much improvement. Wondering how much is side effects from the Zolpidem Hmmm... only having one a week, but maybe that's not good when I'd shocked my system with alcohol,cannabis and Diazepam.
Fixed gate. Hugged birthday boy.. and left them to it.. he has a friend over AND the girlfriend meeting his mum.. and they're off out to TGI Fridays. I'm ok about not being there... our CLOSE family party was the one for me n him on Sat no prob. I so hope the new puppy gets along alright with youngest's mum tho. I'm not there to "police" stuff. ALSO the other two girlfriends hae been on the scene for about five years each. I hope the pack behaves and there's little howling at the moon.
So...it's time to breath, knowing that I DONT need to see the ex for a little while..and I say that nicely because sometimes when you're carrying your own burdens with this head stuff it is so hard to take on others as well.... the boys are ALL here Wednesday night...2 for gaming, the 3rd cos Thursday is an extra karting day and we have to get up early. Friday he launches on the open road with his moped test (2 done, 1 to go)..and then it's KARTING WEEKEND! SWITCH OFF TIME.
STRATEGY for the week. Start again 2moro. NO booze. NO dope. NO Zolpidem I hope. STAY UP LATER AND PLAY "PIRATES" -BOUND to find a son online.. Try and get the Diazepam reduced. 2moro is CBT FOUR day... HOPEFULLY Ms Soulful Eyes will have had a chance to look at this before I go.. otherwise I'm going to have to "confess" all the stuff I did "wrong" this week.
HOWEVER... I AM making progress at changing my thinking when I awake about work and telling myself to STOP IT.. I then go.."So what shall I think about then".. and there's a period of indecisiveness.. and I seem to fall asleep again. THIS IS GOOD. This is breaking THAT cycle of THINKING-FEELING-BEHAVIOUR-CONSEQUENCE. A KEY ELEMENT of CBT.
I also have "faced some demons" with the ex.. because having conveyed my thoughts as considerately but candidly as I could, I then said we shouldn't need to go over this ground again..we must find strategies for moving forward. And she agreed. Another good step. We also don't NEED to try and get together for several months as there are no family merges in the traditional sense. A bit of text perhaps daily.. we'll see.
So.. here endeth Easter for me.
I have conveyed my thoughts quite honestly
The lessons learnt we shall soon see
And tomorrow is my CBT!
Have a good week everyone.. and long live NMP! Liam
Veronica H
14-04-09, 00:19
:yesyes: another great post. Good luck with the next CBT session.
Veronica
Well done ! its better than a serial in the news paper.Its rather common for a lot of us sufferrers ,to be always trying to please everyone ,trying to be all things to all people.Knowing when to say No ,is a start to lessen the burdens we bring and inflict upon ourselves.I think you have come to that point in a particular area of your life Liam.:yesyes: Look forward to the next instalment.Hope the cbt went well!. SUE :hugs:
Tues 14th… Session 4 of CBT. I burbled at length yesterday about the “mishaps”, trials and tribulations of the last week… so we can shortly move on to today and session four.
BECAUSE last night was a good night really, as strategies and effort are STARTING to bear fruit. Forty eight hours since I’d had alcohol and cannabis. Monday as reported I had 3 Diazepam in total at 2mgs per to try and calm down. My mental jury is out as to whether the anxiety and tightness was solely down to the hoo hah with the ex or a physiological reaction to mixing alcohol, cannabis, Diazepam and zolpidem. Let’s settle for the whole lot! PLUS concern for the return to the work place today of course. As a side note it is the FIRST Easter bank holiday Monday I have taken off in about 20 years as they are days of uninterrupted time that enable the self employed addicted workaholic to have some catch up of the 400 matters that always seem to be outstanding.
Played online at Pirates until about 1230 with enthusiastic and indulgent son who helped his old man improve his game. Decided though that I didn’t want an anxious night or the risk of one so I went for just 5mg of Zolpidem. I can HEAR the addictive voice in my head already going “two a week won’t do you any harm” and THAT is how it starts! However.. I took it at 12.45.
NEW CLOCK TACTIC. It was being a tad annoying having to switch on the bedside jobbie and re-set in the mornings so I could actually KNOW the time during waking hours. (Don’t know if I’ve mentioned this earlier in thread but there’s clocks EITHER side of the bed… his n hers.. but of course I have/had visual access to both when soulmate not here.) REVELATION.. TURN IT AROUND! Hah! The smallest ideas can be a result. If I really want to look at the time I have to make more effort than sitting up and gawping – I have to reach out and turn it around. So.. I won’t do it until I’m awake with daylight filtering through OR I have been woken by “Mad World”. Lay down, reached for a book… fast asleep in ten mins.
I awoke at some stage in the dark. A work thought slipped in.. I told myself STOP IT very loudly in my head, MADE myself think about the karting weekend ahead and back to sleep until 6.3oish. RESULT!
8am today and off to work. A BIT of anx..but not as bad. CBT at 3pm. NOTHING to fear or be concerned about there. Emailed Ms Soulful Eyes and hope she gets the jist of the tougher week. Took a Diaz. Did all the online banking. SOME money had come in. But still not enough for this week's up and coming payroll. Chased all the ones I could chase. Sorted out all the positive stuff. Looked at the file with the half dozen unpleasant jobs. Re-arranged paperclips. I SAID I’d deal with them ALL. Haven't started. Had coffee and a slightly stale hot cross bun. Looked at file with unpleasant jobs. Found excuse to do something else. CBT in 2 hours.
Had another shuffle of paperclips. Took 2nd Diazepam. Realised I was going round in a circle. Decided to RIDE to CBT rather than drive. Air blasting into face on a motorcycle helps clear your lungs! Arrived at Clinic 10 mins early. Ms CBT was having coffee breather but took me STRAIGHT in. How kind and thoughtful not to leave me waiting. She’d read the forum. Knew that it had been a tough week.
So we talked. SURPRISED HOW MUCH I WAS STILL COVERING GROUND ABOUT THE EX. SHE CAN STILL “GET THROUGH AND UPSET ME”. However, lights are dawning and I SEE THAT. And as Suzy-Sue has rightly pointed out above I must learn to say NO and encourage her to take on the responsibilities of what I've always carried. The responsibilities for her own life.
It's now gone 1am. And I'm going to stop writing for the night, take 5mg of Zolp and go to sleep. I'll pick this up again 2moro and I apologise for lack of edit and any typos. I should have started early in the evening but Russell Crowe distracted me with "3.10 to Yuma". Goodnight all. Sleep well and long live NMP. Liam
Wednesday 15th. Forgot to say NO Diazepam after CBT. My hour helped me get back under control. So that was a day with two tablets only. Conked out quick enough.. and with the odd rise during the night, again using the STOP IT strategy at the work bits.. bird song filtered thru with some daylight (I think I'll get some total blackout curtains) "Mad World" woke me at 7am. A BETTER NIGHT.
So... let's look at the session from yesterday. This is my thread so I won't disturb the privacy of the ex. I'm here to help myself get better and if others benefit from my writings then excellent. But there's no doubt really that she is well used to getting her way by making me feel bad about myself or making me feel disaproved of. Probably pretty much as my mother did when I was a kid. But let's draw a line somewhere and not go back THAT far at this time! :-)
Ms CBT said "Let's draw a line under the weekend". And move on. The work and sleep related strategies were certainly beginning to improve matters and I have more confidence about them. But I still haven't faced the 6 smelly tasks. SO along with my decision NOT to touch cannabis (and I won't) for at least 3 months (lifetime is too long a step to take at the present time) I said I would deal with ALL SIX smelly jobs by the next session of CBT. "Why?" she asked. Why not settle for ONE? DAMN IT.. THIS STUFF CAN BE SO OBVIOUS when you have just the gentlest of nudges! And that is my goal. ONE of the tasks. I am away tomorrow so I WILL do it on Friday. And if I don't I STILL have Monday to do it.. so I can "report" that one has been done before next week's session. It is so strange for me as a person who has carried much stress, burden, self created pressure for so long through a recession and total business collapse in 1992 to find myself struggling to write a few simple letters of discussion when I am sooo soooo not alone in this time of financial pressure.
But here's a thing. And here's a thing that MAYBE others might wanna consider. AND I THINK THIS COULD BE JUST AS APPLICABLE TO PERSONAL FINANCIAL PRESSURE AS WELL AS BUSINESS. Bear with me here while I take a slight detour from the CBT session.
One of my finance houses that I need to deal with rang today. One of the smelly six. I TOOK the call. And she was a very pleasant Aussie to talk to. I took the bull by the horn and "rehearsed" what I was going to write. I owe this company £50,000 for equipment. It's a lot of money but the principle is no different for someone who owes a million or someone who owes £300 on their credit card. It's all relative. I am supposed to pay £1345 a month. I KNOW the interest part (their earnings) is £250. The rest is return of monies borrowed. I said.. "I am going to offer £500 a month for 3 months, £650 for another 3 months, £750 for a 3rd quarter and £1000 pcm for the last quarter. And that EXACTLY one year from now I would return payments to £1345 per month. And they should extend the agreement accordingly to cover the shortfall and the additional interest. How did she think that would be received?" And she said "Oh I so wish others could look at the bigger long term picture. We are inundated with people unable to pay and they can't look for or come up with answers other than how to deal with and make requests about the next month never mind beyond". Now then.... it SEEMED scary to offer £500 when I should be paying £1345.. BUT I offered what I BELIEVED I could manage.. realistically and a longer term plan. And I believe they will accept it when I send it in. And HERE is the benefit for me.. .BEYOND the easier payment schedule. THEY WILL GO AWAY AND LEAVE ME IN PEACE for one year.. and there is NO REASON for them to call. And that MUST REDUCE MY ANXIETY by one more factor. I pushed it further. Said on the months I felt I might not meet the commitment I'd put SOMETHING in the pot and then do my best to catch up the remainder. She said the systems were fine.. as long as they saw something coming in. There would be no defaults, no credit rating problems.. an agreement would be in place. Inevitably they would eventually get all their money... and I would keep the equipment I needed to do my job and secure my staff. SO THERE YOU GO. It's one to chew over. And for ME.. it's the ONE I DO ON FRIDAY.. because I don't have to worry about rejection, disaproval... and get anxious about it. At the end of the day.. they'd be daft to not take my proposal of course. But this is a BIG step back to working the problems. I'm not being cavelier.. it's "only money and business". I'm not planning or trying to steal it or evade it.
So... back to CBT session four. 1 business hurdle to try and climb over. Let's not even start pretending I'll do another. (But who knows).
The ex. I must learn to begin to feel better about myself when I am not doing what she wants or expects anymore. There is no great cheque for having "put up with me" all these years. No golden handshake... we have nowt.. Just like so many other people in our situation. HOWEVER we do fair better than lots because we are NOT forced to live under the same roof and wait until the property market returns to some value and our equities can be split. (I think that could take 3 years just to get it BACK let alone move on). In time as business improves (as long as I do) I will see she gets half of whatever I've built. I will not for the sake of having her approve of me for a whole 48 hours commit myself to 48 months of car finance for her. But I will help her FIND a car if she chooses to. I WILL NOT FEEL BAD FOR NOT BEING COMFORTABLE OR WANTING TO SUPPORT HER DURING HER RECOVERY FROM CANCER. But I WILL support as best as I can. I will though take a couple of weeks of contact break in the real sense... just so I can continue to try and calm down.
I will start teaching myself to say "No I can't afford or manage that at this time" to my children.. who like all of us parents I would die for if need be. DESPITE the guilt we feel when we consider we've not served them best as parents.
And that will do for this week. It's 2pm. I've had ONE diazepam and eased the stress by writing. I am "looking forward" to reading this again later to remind myself and reinforce what I acheived with the finance company and how I will write and what I will write on Friday. And what does that mean? I HAVE TAKEN A LITTLE BIT OF CONTROL BACK AGAIN. That is a good thing. Learning to take control without controlling.. Hmmm.. that's a debate for another day.
There's a karting weekend ahead. Friday I launch youngest onto the open road on his moped.. and suffer like all others in similar situations the pressure of a world that is far more aggresive than it used to be in the way that people move around in vehicles.
I have much to look forward to this week. Oh.. and I haven't had a drop of alcohol since Saturday night either. Which has meant a better functioning willy. Will NMP admin let me get away with that.. :-) Back next week for session 5 of CBT... and I thought I'd look at "THE ART OF LEARNING TO SAY NO" and the implications of such a challenge after 50 + years of constantly seeking approval and being devastated when people don't like me. As for those who are kindly following this thread and who generously write their encouragement I truly thank you all for playing a part in my recovery process and if just ONE person gets something back from this growing list of words.. how GOOD THAT WOULD MAKE ME FEEL ABOUT MYSELF. Have a great week everyone.. and long live NMP. (More to read this week Ms Soulful Eyes... do I get an extra bill for that? ;-)... Liam xx
Veronica H
15-04-09, 17:43
Hi Liam
Thanks for continuing to share your problems and ideas with us. I could so empathise with the need for approval and being unable to say no. Look after yourself and enjoy the time with your kids.:hugs:
Veronica
Hi Liam
I think you should publish lol. D'you know something you do pretty fantastically in my book for someone who suffers this crap. Well done. You seem so positive as well.
And a moment of feel good for me courtesy of two fellow members. Just worked out I've written over 10,000 words so far. Asked NMP admin if there had to be a limit to my wordage.. and there are none. No limits to words, honesty or openess. I've even been allowed the word willy. Shall we start ANOTHER thread and look at THAT aspect of anxiety? Willy or Wonty? In the anonymous world that protects us at NMP I haven't yet worked out the ratio of men and women. If anyone has.. please do message me! :-)
Will
No I haven't worked out the ratio of men and women but have a feeling there are more women.
Yes, please do start another thread - I know I'll enjoy reading it - content doesn't matter too much because your writing is a pleasure to read.
Take care.
Two more excellent posts Liam,well done.You seem to be making progress, the answers are inside you & im sure youll make the right desicions and compromises to eventually reach a point that you feel your life is more balanced and acceptable.Your honesty is admirable and i wish you a happy w/e . I Look forward to the next instalment. A new thread sounds like a good idea,tho men usualy shy away from such things.thou a little while back on the citalopram forum quite a few responded to such matters ,being anonymous obviously makes people more able to speak about things without feeling embarrassed. All the Best Sue
Hello Suzy Sue... thank you for your supportive post. For a SHORT update as opposed to my usual lengthy diatribes, there has been NO diazapem or Zolpidem since before Tuesday's session of CBT. I've had two glasses of port this evening after a GOOD day of kart training with my son on a rain soaked track. He'd have LOVED a training day on slicks and no slippery surfaces to try and cling onto. WHAT IS SO DIFFERENT FOR US ANXIOUS ONES? He had to confront his demons and sometimes lost control and spun off the track. What did he do? He drove back on in torrential rain, and tried to go round the bend again. And slowly but surely he chipped 10ths of a second off his lap times.. and the racer who thrashed him two weeks ago was gradually equalled in pace. A champion on the track last year was equalled in bad conditions by my youngest son today. What was different for my son? Today he had the support and guidance of someone who was a champion at the track about 30 years ago.. a man of experience and the talent to pass on his skill, support and encouragement. But if my boy had NOT really listened, not taken that suggested guidance and support, I'd have wasted the investment and he'd be no further.. he'd not show any greater control; he FOUND that control, his last laps were his best and today we quit while we were ahead. This weekend he gets the chance to reinforce the training and follow a newly attempted racing line. IS THERE ANY DIFFERENCE WITH CBT?
For me, I was proud and pleased as a Dad. Last night's sleep without chemical support wasn't great. But I've had a LOT worse. I had to get up at 6am to make flasks of tea and I'd only gone to sleep at about 1.30am. I woke a few times and stupidly I'd turned the clock back round but it WAS a better night compared to many. And I was only a little physically tired.
I've had a few thoughts today about having a Zolpidem to make sure I slept. HOWEVER Suzy-sue's post has helped me decide NOT to take one. So it's half an hour of Pirates for me.. and I'm going to bed with no tablet. If all hell breaks loose I SHALL take one.. but 5mg instead of 10. And I won't feel guilty if I do. Suzy-Sue with no forethought or personal knowledge other than this thread, with just some supportive words, has at the very least reduced my decision for chemical support by 50%. Tomorrow we will know if it was a 100% result for ME. If it was... then Suzy-Sue gets the credit for giving me the nudge to try. Good night all. Long live NMP.
Nicola_lou
17-04-09, 04:39
Well down, your really getting somewhere and facing your fears I'm following your thread its very interesting but also full of knowledge. Your therapist sounds fab, I'm looking for one that I feel comfortable with. Good luck/
Veronica H
17-04-09, 09:44
:) Hi Liam,
I think it is a good idea to reduce the meds rather than go cold turkey. I hope you had a better night. You shared a moment with your son at the Karting event, and you are right in that this illness is ultimately about how much effort we are prepared to put in to changing the way we think.....hard though isn't it? :bighug1: Keep going my friend and have a good weekend.
Veronica
YAYYYY! No meds. No more port after 9pm, Clock to the wall, bit of Pirates, Bit of Poldark. Set the "mad world" alarm. Woke a couple of times, nothing major. One of them I said to myself "Looks as if you may wake up.. perhaps read a book". Found partner's nightie under her pillows. Took a sniff of her, smiled, breathed in deeply the blue sky and blew away the cloud. And disapeared back into the land of nod. Woke when a jackdaw started having an argument with his own reflection on my bedroom window and realised there was daylight. Therefore it was ok to turn the clock and take a gawp... 6.47. "Mad World" was due to play at 7am. RESULT!
Posts above.. thanks guys. To Nicola I say I was sorry to see you were posting at 4.40am... I'm very pleased though that you found the thread to follow and I hope I can offer some comfort if you're awake again at that time of day. BUT I am just guessing that you're there cos you can't sleep; for all I know you're a nightworker having a quick surf! :-)
Veronica H - I agree wholeheartledy with the need to reduce meds rather than cold turkey. But meds have "only" played a part in my life for 3 months in terms of pills and the strategy works for me to see it thru cold - with an occasional respite if the walls begin to become a possible bounce area or sleep evades for the wrong reasons. I certainly wouldn't recommend a sudden cut off for those who are on long term support, greater strengths and more potent drugs than my takings. YES THIS ILLNESS IS ULTIMATELY ABOUT HOW MUCH EFFORT WE ARE PREPARED TO PUT INTO CHANGING THE WAY WE THINK. YES IT IS VERY HARD! We also have to get a perspective (somehow) on that effort.. so that we don't just become "addicted and focused" on ourselves and the condition. Cut some slack and think and do other stuff BEYOND what is required. I hope that sentence makes sense - I'll re-look at what I'm trying to say there another time.
I think I'm trying to say that CBT IS AN EXTRAORDINARILY VALUABLE TECHNIQUE FOR THOSE THAT IT CAN WORK FOR - BECAUSE MEDS DO NOT WORK OR CURE. THEY JUST ABATE. So there's an inevitability to finding a therapy that can ease, aid and ultimately heal, cure and be on "standby" for any future re-occurance. Just because I haven't got a bandage on my head doesn't mean I'm not poorly. I have NO concern whatsoever with any assumed stigma either.
The stresses and strains of the lives and approach to life that we've taken on and allowed ourselves to adopt.. and I'm referring to the "collective we've" here.. not a ROYAL or ME one.. I'm referring to us as a species.. burdened additionally by our material world.. means that it truly is time to take stock and re-evaluate.
I'm not saying we should all rush off to live in wooden huts in trees (although if it had broadband I might be able to consider it).. I have no wish to lose my fancy car, home or toys.. but I do think that a major part of my ongoing strategy will be to re-evaluate the value of what I do and how I spend my time.
I have now been drug free for 72 hours bar 2 glasses of port. A great weekend ahead of karting and a BRILL WEATHER FORECAST. Youngster gets his slicks and dry surface. As I write he's out there doing his bike test in foul weather. And I'm going to go look at that ONE stinky financial thing I said I would do before Tuesday's session of CBT. On the other hand... I MAY just go and clean the mud and filth off the kart, mix fuel and see if I can win a Pirate battle with any son I can find online. Hmmmm... WHICH is of the greatest significance at this moment of time?
I just have to say what a fantastic thread this is. I have been sat here for an hour reading intently. I suffer from panic and anxiety attacks and i bloody hate it! I started CBT 5 weeks ago. Things are lookin good and im really hoping it works for me. I am willin gto put 100 percent in everytime. I look forward to reading most posts on this thread.
Best wishes
Sherrie
Monday 20th April. I thought I'd post a chunk of wordage so that tomorrow I focus solely on writing about the 5th session of CBT.
I've had NO pills since last Tues morn! I have JUST completed TWO of the financial things off the stinky list! ONE at least needed to be done as that was part of this week’s strategy. There was the need therefore to come to work and "get stuck in" today.
We had a GREAT weekend at karting although we had our disapointment on the track. That said, he started off the back of the grid for the final and climbed half a dozen rungs up the ladder. There were others a LOT worse off than that. (At least six of them!) We continued to learn, it is all absorbing at the time and a great way to switch off.
I get fresh air, I now have a wind burnt face and there’s no doubt that I burn a few calories as I spend the entire time on my feet working with spanners and screwdrivers and then shoving a kart trolley around. I wouldn’t want to tax the driver with a bit of pushing now and then would I! HAH!
I have pretty much followed all strategy decisions made for the week and held the line on stuff already in place. My 3 areas of anxiety are of course now established. 1) Work/cashflow. 2) My Ex. 3) Sleeping. Obviously numbers 1 and 2 are the cause of 3.
1) I have now stopped thinking of cashflow as an area of anxiety in its own right. It is of course part of work. Cashflow DID improve last week. I pushed certain buttons more effectively and I was able to go away for the weekend knowing that there was enough in the bank to cover the bills for the early part of THIS week at least. But it is NOT going to go away in a miracle of money making. I have to learn to deal with it. Well in fact RE-learn. Because it’s ALWAYS BEEN LIKE THIS REALLY. Living and delivering to myself and the family beyond my means, but always confident that I’d find an answer. It wasn’t good to find that confidence jilted.
But it ISNT re-learn is it. It’s re-evaluate and allow myself to be human, fallible, just like every other member of my family is allowed to be WITHIN the walls of my protection. After 51 years on this planet I'm beginning to realise it's OK to be me and have needs and wants that are every bit as justified as the requirements of those I love. Today I came into work WITHOUT THE HORRID TUMMY FEELING.
2) With regards to my Ex.. I’ve TAKEN the break I needed in communications without “abandoning” her. Sent short, supportive texts. Going to take a two month moratorium as it’s GCSE season for youngest and I want it to go as smoothly as possible. He’s now on the open and wild road on his moped and this means that he can get to me or the girlfriend as and when he wants without parental taxi. The ex will have enough to cope with in terms of the “loss of last baby” as well, as he takes the first glorious steps down the equally bumpy and potholed road of first love. So I’ll give it a couple of weeks at least and then offer to saddle “mum” up on the Harley and go out for coffee but I don’t want to sit and do “depressed talk”. I have NOT told her of this part of my strategy. I wouldn’t want to add to HER anxiety.
First son is now writing for my company part time. Working WITH me is better for us both than working FOR me.
Second son starts working FOR me on Thursday as it’s not been easy for students to find work for the summer. All the jobs are disappearing fast to those who want gameful fulltime employment. He’s so laid back he can work FOR or WITH. Makes no difference to either of us!
I have therefore got even more time with my children than before. It seems that as they get older they appreciate what I’ve done and do and they are around more. I have a “no fights, bad vibes or tension” policy at my house. I truly think they respond to this and we will continue to be Pirates online together and battle plastic orcs on a Thursday.
3) Sleep. Friday night better but still awoke and fit and started for a while. Nothing too bad really. But I cocked it up on Saturday night by having my little bit (ok 2 large glasses) of port too late in the evening and that messed the night up. So. NO booze last night. BUT THE NIGHTS ARE NOT SO ANXIOUS NOW. I continue to turn the clock away, tell myself to STOP IT if work or ex intrudes and I wake and I am definitely getting LESS ANXIOUS ABOUT NOT BEING ASLEEP. I now have NO DIFFICULTY FALLING ASLEEP. So I’ve stopped the hot milk as I’m not keen on the “getting up for a wee” bit at 4am. I’ve set “Mad World” for a little earlier and I know if there’s no light then I am NOT supposed to be getting up. Last night I went to sleep about 11am because I was drained from karting. But I awoke in the small hours (don’t know when) and then had a few hours of on/off/in/out but no particularly bad dreams or thoughts EXCEPT for one about the ex and I made an effort to BOOT IT OUT, BREATH IN THE BLUE AND BLOW AWAY THE CLOUD.
Even when feeling tired I MIGHT be better off still staying up later because once I’ve had my slice of kip I awake. So we’ll see. I need to check it out.
I am getting better. The growing confidence in my CBT and my own effort is also helping me get better. And hey… NO MEDS FOR A WEEK? Well it will be a whole week 2moro.
But despite all the success and the confidence I spent a bit of time this morning wondering whether to have a Zolpidem tonight so that I WOULD have good shutdown sleep tonight. I KNEW I had to do a at least one of the stinky jobs off the stinky list. And here I was adding to the anxiety by wondering if I should have a tablet in ten hours time. My partner said why didn’t I just forget that for now.. and look at THAT matter in ten hours time.
Wise words partner. I listen and I take on board. I AM GETTING BETTER. BUT WE AINT THERE YET.
You are getting better for sure. For some reason when anxiety is high we do tend to wake in the night. It's not pleasant for sure - especially if naughty little thoughts start kicking in. However, you are dealing with it well.
My advice regarding the sleeping tablet - take it if you need to - do not be scared to take a med to help whilst you are feeling this way. Your sleep is more important to you at the moment. A sleeping tablet when you need it is not going to kill you but lack of sleep sure will make you feel sooo much worse.
Two sons working with you - hope you all get on well in the work environment. Hey, what a great dad your sons have.
Take care.
PS. Could you please write a book about anxiety and depression when you're well lol. x You have a wonderful way in your writing of allowing the reader to step inside your world.
Another pleasurable read Liam.Im pleased to hear you had a good w/e .Im sure you find it s a great help to escape from the anxieties of life doing something you enjoy alongside your son. Too much work and no play ,is no good for anyone,even if you love your job. How nice to be able to work with your sons ! and i agree with Yvonne what a great Dad you are.You have done great this week not relying on the sleeping pills,well done .It wont hurt now and then tho ,as being tired is bad for your nerves.Sometimes we want to run ,but our body tells us to slow down a bit,catch our breath ,and just to walk for a while . Hope your CBT went well, you are doing great.Take care Sue:hugs:
Tues 21st AM. Quick footnote so that today's writing is solely about the CBT session. As I'd only had a pint of Woodpecker at about 7pm I decided I WOULD take a Zolpidem as 3 nights of slight disturbance were enough to make me wonder if there would be a forth. Does that make sense? LOL So I stayed up until 11.30pm, popped 10mgs, went to bed, read for a bit, sniffed sleeping partner who was conked out.. conked out and suddenly it was 6.55am and not a clue about anything that happened either in or out of my head. Did I fail myself by taking a tablet? As Suzy-Sue says above; not at all. I gave myself a short break and today I tackle stinky list matters number 3 and 4 and then go to CBT. As we have now established the causes and recognised the danger areas and have strategies in place to re-evaluate and deal with them as I go along, apart from the pleasing aspect of "reporting" to Ms CBT about no chest band for a week, no BIG anx, only one tablet, wayyy less alcohol and matters being taken in hand and control taken back.. (Should take all of 5 mins)... it will be interesting to see WHERE WE GO FROM HERE. Session 5. I have already decided to do the 6th next week and then move 7 to a fortnight after. Unless we decide to push deeper and dig up older cans of worms.
For now though we are acheiving what I set out to acheive with CBT. We do not at this stage need to make a decision about further potential. The time and brain thinking may be better spent reinforcing the strategies that have been brought in so that I cope and CHANGING THE VERY WAY I LIVE as an ongoing challenge, rather than digging up the long ago but never forgotten childhood and past. Back at you later after the session. Have a GREAT DAY everyone and long live NMP.
Tuesday 21st. PM! I got stuck in this morning after writing the above post. Attended to stinky matters number 3 and 4 and then got an email about number 5! So I dealt with number 5. Number 6 is a "fate accompli" situation. I just have to write a letter. And that is that. Until the next problem comes along.
BUT HERE IS THE THING ABOUT WORK. I'M BACK TO IT. I realised in the middle of the day that I HADN'T HAD ANY ANX about walking in the door. That is another result.
So I carried on and then slipped away for my session of CBT. "Reported" and summarised as I'd expected. And then discussed what I was going to be doing next as I ticked my way through the list of reasons that had brought me there in the first place. We’ve done well really in a short period of time. I was able to see that I HAD met all targets and was dealing with what just a few weeks ago were anxieties and seemingly impossible tasks and hurdles.
Work I have under control. The moratorium with kindness and compassion is the way to move forward for 3 months with my ex. But here’s when the big tear arrived. I can’t help her with her future. Oh I can find money probably, I can find ways to be with her in company when necessary for those times with the children but I can’t be emotionally responsible anymore. I have to find a way for her to let go of me and stand up in her own right. Without feeling guilty about it. And I DON’T. But here’s the rub. It doesn’t mean I don’t feel very very sad that I have to do this “to” her.
This one is going to be hard to explain I think so I’ll take the time to think about it and write further later. When you take responsibility as seriously as I do… (The badly chosen or inappropriate dog must be kept well until it has died) is my firm policy. And that is a useful analogy even if it seems a little harsh. But I’m only using it because of the following piece of history.
When the ex and I first got together nearly 30 years ago we got TWO dogs because I was a firm believer that a dog should not be left on its own if you were a working couple. We saw two puppies in a pet shop (that used to happen!) and on enquiry were advised they were brother and sister lurchers; “A cross between a retriever and a greyhound”. I heard the word retriever and thought “That’ll do nicely”. I didn’t take into account the greyhound bit.
Since that time I’ve now made quite a few dog training progs and have learnt a lot about “breed specifics” and lurchers were definitely not for me. It’s like “Don’t have a collie unless you are happy that it’ll try to herd your kids”!
They lurchers were a bad choice in life. But there was no question of getting rid of them; 14 years later they died of natural causes and I had provided for them responsibly for their entire lives and done the best for them that I could.
The ethic is not dissimilar here. My ex is not a “dog” but is a responsibility as the chosen partner of my life at that time and more importantly the mother of my children. The commitment was and is for life in some form or other. And I have to come to terms with that and work out HOW I step forward causing as little pain and suffering as I can in the process.
No flippant lines or clever wordage to end this post. I have matters to think about and decisions to make. But I have given myself 3 months before I have to address this matter. And a lot can happen in that amount of time.
3 weeks ago I would not have said I’d be in the much improved frame of mind that I am now. I will therefore be stronger and more capable of facing these decisions than I was. Have a good week everyone. Liam
Veronica H
21-04-09, 21:20
Hi Liam
Glad that you are moving forward and getting a handle on things. I understand how seriously you take your responsibilities, but as I know nothing about your Ex I wonder if she really is expecting the same level of responsibility from you now. Have you considered that it may be that you feel this sense of responsibility so strongly that you are not seeing subtle changes on her part to be more independent? Has she always been totally dependent on you?....these are just thoughts. Take care of yourself and thanks once again for sharing with us.
Veronica:bighug1:
Hey ho... sadly in so many ways the ex has ALWAYS depended on me... which isn't good for either for us these days. And I truly wish I could see signs and changes on her part. She has always wanted to "control" and has always used guilt as the process. I am at least out of that influence relatively but I'm still not comfortable when I don't act or behave as she would wish it! But I guess that is my problem not hers and I'm the one going through CBT! :-)
Will
You are an honourable man for sure. The ex does still rely on you to a great degree. She obviously doesn't have a new partner as you do ? Unless I've missed something, if so do excuse me.
I loved what you write about your dogs, awww - I'm an animal lover. even though those dogs weren't your "ideal" but you looked after them all those years - other people may have given them away.
I think you do so well considering the ex is still heavy baggage on you. I can see where your anxiety emanated from what with work issues and the ex wife responsibility. You are doing very very well I have to say.
This CBT therapist sounds very good, good and bad CBT therapists are out there just as there are good and bad doctors - you have been lucky to get such a good one.
Take care xxx
Finding the RIGHT CBT therapist is an important start. But APPLYING the strategies you DECIDE TO WORK ON is probably the priority. It's not important to find "approval or be liked" by your therapist.. equally to "like" them. But to find someone you're comfortable with is important. I respond far better to females.. simply part of my nature. My "Ms CBT" happens to look good and dress well as well... "Caught myself" looking at her legs (Good shoe taste) while I was talking yesterday. No harm in that. I'm not there to try and "chat her up".. but there's no doubt that being "chemically comfortable" with her makes it easier to trust and open up. Above all the legs is a GREAT BRAIN with experience, compassion and a true drive to help others. And in response to other posts seen in forums, my sessions cost me £46. I get a LOT for that money frankly.. and I'm saddened to see "newly qualified therapists" out there at £90-£120 an hour. It is such a shame that there is not more financial facility on the NHS as it is so clearly recognised that drugs and medication are NOT the answer for the challenges we face.
As I write, I'm listening to the budget live.. and I wonder just how many people are facing EXACTLY the same pressures and stresses I am facing at this time and it's obvious shift to creating even more anxiety in families, marriages and homes. Shame Mr Darling can't allocate a chunk of change to help the nation balance its mental books.
The less said about the budget the better.!Ive been trying not to think about things that bother or annoy me,& things i cant change. You certainly have had a lot of things to address and i think you are really doing well so far.I really dont envy your situation with your Ex at all.I can imagine she feels very alone ,now the boys have left home (empty nest syndrome and perhaps after her illness afraid about her mortality. Perhaps she should look on life now , as her chance for a fresh start. Take up some new interests and go out into the world and make some new friends. You are a very responsible person and she has been very lucky to have your support. You have the right to lead your life as you wish ! no one has the right to make you feel guilty.There comes a point when its ok to set yourself free. To offer a helping hand is fine ! but being a crutch is not. Only a selfish person would demand the latter.I wish you luck, but some how ,i dont think youll need it.Always a pleasure reading your posts.Have a good w/e SUE:hugs:
Hi
I agree Sue that Will shouldn't feel guilty about his wife, however how could he not after so many years of being married to her. I feel dreadfully sorry for the woman. I hope she can move on and then Will's mind will be at rest in that direction. I think if Will works on actually making her stand on her own two feet a bit more it will do her a favour.
Hey Will, sorry to talk about you as if you're not here lol.
Anyway, oh you do make me laugh - the legs of the therapist and the good taste in shoes. I reallly grinned ear to ear. See, you are helping me lots with your posts. What make of shoes do you think they were? Don't tell me Jimmy Choo or I'll get very jealous. Is she a flat loafer type or a heel person?
I have a good therapist and I do get on well with her but I just feel that some of the stuff she says to me is patronising. However, I do pull her up when I feel she is being patronising and she doesn't mind because we do, luckily, have a very open and honest relationship.
I just know that CBT isn't the answer for every anxiety sufferer, reason; because we all suffer different types of anxiety. Yes, anxiety does manifest itself with the same sensations/symptoms in people but where these symptoms are coming from cannot always be treated by changing one's thoughts if the person's mind has got into the anxiety habit over many many years of suffering. The brain feels it is doing the right thing by reacting to the thoughts the way it does.
I haven't listened to the budget yet - not had radio or tv on. I will watch the news tonight and listen to hubbies moans and groans and inevitably some foul language about his favourite man Gordon Brown and his other partners in crime lol.
Anyway Will, keep up the good work - and the posts. Take care.x
I can do nothing about the ex for 3 months even tho I want to. Must leave that home as trouble free as possible for the youngest to get on with his GCSEs and the eldest to settle to his work there. MY nature is to get on and confront my problems and deal with my responsibilities.. especially when I recognise the source of the trouble. When I can't "deal or sort it".. it aint so good for me.
In a flick of an eye it can go to a bad day for us tho can't it. A company that should have paid a bill last week hasn't and today I'm onto my 2nd Diazepam after a bad night's sleep and the anx is there and the first (small) band across the abdomen for 8 days. Dammit. But that is what the medicine is for.. these moments when I can't cope and it all starts to bounce back. I JUST HAVE enough in the bank for this week's payroll but NOTHING spare to pay the debts that I said I would. So here we go again and the skin of my repairs is very thin and fragile still. Liam is sad now but my youngest is over and I'll go to the garage and clean kart. Pirates later with the eldest online... and a Zolpidem to sleep. Mustn't think I've failed as a result of these decisions. Tomorrow I get up and fight my condition another day. As to the shoes... tasteful sandals with heels and well painted toe nails. xx
Veronica H
22-04-09, 19:14
Hi Liam
I think your therapist will be wearing trousers and wellies the next time you meet, as she reads these posts doesn't she?... Sorry the stress is creeping up again. Take care.
Veronica
Veronica - brilliant - yep I reckon she will be well covered in a long dress and sensible shoes lol. Has she replied to any of Will's posts?? Who is she?
Will, for many many years I was the most anti benzos person on the earth - almost. Not that I was ever offered them. Until...... a few years ago when I was in bad Seroxat withdrawal and I was given a rather strong benzo to help me calm down. I now take a small amount of diazepam and I was encouraged to take it last year by my therapist. This is another med which is no magic wand because although it can take the edge off anxiety - when one is in a true anxiety state where the mind refuses to shut up I reckon you would need about 10mgs. Only my opinion. I take the stuff now and I will not allow the gp to stop my prescription! I was encouraged to take the stuff and it is unfortunately "mother's little helper".
You should feel no guilt whatsoever whenyou need to take it, or indeed the sleepers. At the moment you need something to help you ... and why not?? You would take a Paracetemol for a bad headache wouldn't you? Don't tax the brain any more than it already is at this stage, take the little demons it's better than suffering in anxiety hell.
Take care Will. xx
Winston Churchill used to call his depressed days "Black Dog Days".. and he'd spend a fair bit of them when he could in the company of his pigs. "Cats look down on you, dogs look up at you - pigs treat you as equals". I haven't got a pig.
But today is another day and I will just have to tell anyone who rings and complains that there isn't any money! Simple as that. As with my CBT, strategies are in place for helping me cope, as are strategies in place and in discussion for reduced payments etc and of course shortfalls and bad payers weren't just going to sail away on a sea of paid invoices and cheques. (Little bit of the Pirates game creeping in there).
So I have to face my demons today, take positive action where I can, TAKE MY DIAZEPAM and my sleeping tablet if needs be. I had a week with no meds and had a total of 6mg of Diazepam yesterday and knocked myself out with 10mg of Zolpidem. Then it was 7am. Great kip. I am not tired. 2mg of Diaz today and time to tell myself that the meds are there to help but WHILE THEY ARE IN PLACE - BE EFFECTIVE ABOUT DEALING WITH THE PROBLEMS THERE AS BEST AS I CAN. Here's a simple thought that's just sprung into my head. "Failure" IS sometimes an option. And excusable if I can't come up with an answer.
As for Ms CBT - I suspect she will dress as attractively and elegantly as she always does. She certainly wouldn't feel threatened by the compliment and is more than capable of coping with my occasional glance. She does indeed read this forum and complimented me by asking if she could offer it to other CBTers to follow if they wished and draw their attention to NMP.
Meanwhile I'm off to find a pig.
Veronica H
23-04-09, 15:46
:yesyes: Well done for dealing with the financial stuff Liam. Glad you are getting some sleep.
Veronica
Well that was a poo day in the "anxiety feelings" department. I've had 4 x 2mg of Diazepam and still can't knock it. I shall take a Zolpidem again to sleep because after such a day I just don't want to nod off wondering if I'm going to be waking up all the time. I know my partner is concerned that some of this anx is a chemical reaction thing to the Zolpidem but I'm not sure. It was a good week until Tuesday's CBT with no tablets at all for seven days but I came away troubled about "ex" stuff and then compounded it with the "Here we go again" cashflow problems. And although I've done all the "Will you accept blah... " payment letters and formal requests stuff, at the end of the day.. even if they say yes to all the requests and schedules... there's still got to be enough coming in to pay the deals made. And THAT is the crux of cashflow.
And just cos it's gone belly up again this week (enough for the staff salaries but nowt for me).. I'm all in a tizzy again. So Veronica.. despite your praise I aint dealing with the financial stuff in my head properly yet.. and that is so much harder than the real thing.
I was given a book today called "Stress proof your life" by Elisabeth Wilson. I've never looked at such a tome... "52 brilliant ideas for taking control". Chapters include "Cure yourself of the disease to please", "Ditch the debt", "Burnt out?" Relevant topics and chapters but possibly a bit flippantly written for me.. at least in this current state.
So it's time for a bit of Pirates.. and then hit the sack and hope that the body can calm when I'm asleep. the two eldest were over this evening for "Table War" and 2nd son started working with me as well today so he's staying over. I imagine that'll happen for the weeks he's working so I am not alone. 2moro night I am and that will be IRONING night. Eldest and girlfriend to stay Saturday and then soulmate is back on Sunday.
Tuesday we have an important meeting in London, so I've actually booked train tickets instead of driving, booked the Holiday Inn at Regents Park because I had a stack of reward points so a freebie.. we'll TRY to take the evening off and maybe go see a show or a movie.
Something to look forward to. I have LOADS of that tho. Soulmate sent me a skype message at work today saying.. "You're much loved and surrounded by life rafts. You just have to keep hanging on until you get better". After Pirates I shall go sniff her nightie.
Tomorrow she has to go to the dentist. HER biggest fear and phobia. Nothing I can do but be there with her in spirit. I so wish I could have her dentistry for her.
A downward curve on this rollercoaster thread after two weeks of pretty good movement and up tempo writing. I hope it starts to level out 2moro. I've set a day where apart from paying staff I DONT spend too much time at a computer doing finance and poo jobs. Half an hour in the voice over booth and then a PHYSICAL day.. Let's hope the sun can shine in my head a bit again. However the forecast at present appears cloudy and a little overcast. Liam
Veronica H
24-04-09, 08:50
:bighug1: Hi Liam. I love your soul mates message about the life rafts, what a lovely supportive partner she is. Sorry about the financial hassles, but these are extraordinary times and hopefully therefore more understanding out there on all sides regarding financial problems.....I know how optimistic of me...but lets run with it.
It is a huge relief to know what causes the anxiety and panic and it brings instant relief because we start to let go and this reduces tension. The nerves are still sensitised though and there is so much to 'unlearn' about the way we think. Look back to how you were a few months ago and I can guarantee that you will have made progress with this. Expect it to be a bit of a rollercoaster ride though, and remember that thoughts can become feelings instantly with this illness, so float the negative thoughts out without tuning in to them if you can, so you give yourself some peace. Have a good weekend with your kids and soulmate.
Veronica
Friday 24th. I suppose if yesterday was a poo day... then today was slightly less poo..eee. On the basis that I've only just had the 3rd tab and hopefully that will get me through the remains of the evening. Yawning like a good un tho. Does Diazepam accumulate in your system? I am new to these meds. As it's Friday I'll cut the 10mg of Zolpidem to 5mg tho.. and if I wake, so be it. There's a stack of ironing to do as student son brought round a santa sack full of washing last night.. including all his hoodies.. So I'll go watch a movie in a minute, crank up the steam and try and fight the negative thoughts.
Cos of the trip to London on Tuesday I've brought forward my CBT to Monday. And it can't come round fast enough so that I can go "WHAT THE HECK HAPPENED" at the last session that set this downward curve off before I got wound up by the cashflow? What nerve did we touch that I've still not fathomed out?
Short posting today. Going to try and do lots this weekend... domestic, garden etc. Taking a poorly Bonsai to a garden centre but I think it's a gonner. Get in the pond and clear some weed so that the fish can SEE it's spring. And get this. Thin out the ridiculous accumulation of allen keys and drill bits with the aid of a "digital vernier calliper". That's got you all going eh? How radical is THAT for a bit of therapy?!?!?!
Here's my next daft statement. Why did I think I'd get my head into trouble, decide to follow advice, take medication and go for CBT and think it would all be sorted in a month?!?!? WHAT A NUPTY. Veronica has helped me take that on board. Compared with a month ago I AM better. And I'm sure there's plenty of people on this site who have the experience of going "Yeah yeah... writes a bit of forum and thinks it's all on the mend in a jiffy".
Well this is something else I'm going to have to take on board. I guess tho that gradually you LEARN TO SEE THE TRAIN COMING IN ADVANCE and strategies put in place while on this learning curve can be applied sooner in the future. And perhaps that's how we prevent the potential crash.
Enough cliche and metaphor. Time to spit on the iron, roll up the sleeves, face the music, take the bull by the horns, look the devil in the eye...
And get on with my student son's monumental pile of ironing. SOMEWHERE in there I have a shirt as well. Lucky me.
Well that wasn't a very good day either. Reading back through my ownposts briefly I'm beginning to think the Zolpidem is part of the problem. I've had four nights worth on the trot.. and although it's good to be knocked out I better go "cold turkey" again tonight.. because the Diazepam just isn't stopping this "Adrenalin chest band thing" and I know I'm not thinking about work or my other "trigger" areas. Eldest son and his girlfriend here tonight.. so I have to "cook and make merry". No booze either I suspect after 4 days solid Diazepam. Great. But I haven't had any alcohol for a week. And I seem to have acheived very little today. I DIDNT get on the with the ironing last night.. just dawdled at the PC. Didn't eat properly either. It's like a spiral staircase isn't it? Gotta try and turn myself around and head back UP the stairs.
Hi Will
I doubt if the sleeper is the problem - however, we do all react different to these sort of medications and if you are noticing a pattern of feeling more anx day after taking then yes stop taking it. A good sleeper I came across was Nytol - not the herbal one but the other one - in a blue box. They contain anti histemine - pretty harmless really. I found them very good. Try them. It's horrible not sleeping well whilst suffering anxiety because when you wake in the night/can't get off to sleep the troubling thoughts just keep going around in the mind.
Will, if you did make merry with son and girlfriend then I think that's brilliant. I think the company would have helped you. The distraction of cooking and focusing on others' may be good therapy for you.
When you don't achieve anything in a day, that's fine at your stage of anxiety. So what? It just does not matter. Sitting at the computer just surfing or whatever is relaxing - providing you're not googling anxiety lol!. There are times we can't "achieve" as you put it, at this moment it's not something to beat yourself up about.
Lack of appetite is completely normal as well and very common. Eat little and often if you can - if you had a complete loss of appetite I would suggest complan.
So far, you're doing really well so don't let a few days of not being as good as you think you should be bother you.
Have a good Sunday xxxxx
Hey ho world.. and thanks for the post Yvonne. Had a very good evening with eldest. He's also an alpha male and it can't be easy for him trying to "rise past" the old man. That's not to say I've been a dominant or overbearing dad.. but I am the Dad at the end of day and with me being the one that has carried all members of the family "forever", he's actually coming into his own in so many ways INCLUDING being a supporter of ME now in MY hour of need. His girlfriend is the first one he had and they've been together for nearly six years now.. so she is daughter in all senses. We just talked and laughed a lot for 5 hours.. I cooked sliced fillet with a cream and dijon mustard sauce... and REAL chips deep fried for a rare change. There's no deep fry at his mum's house as she believes it played a part in her getting breast cancer so chips at dad's (about twice a year) is a big deal! :-)
I had two modest glasses of port (none after 11pm) and NO ZOLPIDEM. Went to sleep ok at 12.45.. clocks to the wall.. all the usual new strategies. Conked out to a bit of "Poldark".. woke four times BUT DID THE STOP IT ROUTINES.. and just went back to sleep each time. CBT IN ACTION. Had a weird dream last thing that one was of those "real ones" where I'd telephoned my mum.. and was telling her I'd was in a dark place at the mo.. and then "Mad World" woke me! So.. as far as I was concerned a much better night and a bit of confidence that the application of CBT was working. ALSO.. LESS ANX feeling. So.. I had 1 diazepam and it's started to reduce the anx at last. I then went and rode Harley.. and went to the ex and sorted a couple of household matters. Not a pleasant feeling frankly. Now I can leave it for a fortnight. As soon as I left "the family home" and rode away some anx faded. There's a surprise.
So.. I rode back to my house, eldest and daughter were on their way out.. and we went for a walk for a mile or so. Lovely.. hugs all round and back home.
9 hours later.. I have taken my 2nd Diazepam. So here's how I see it. I DO think Zolpidem mixed with Diazepam has a negative affect on ME. The band of adrenalin/cortisone is EXACTLY the same feeling as when I'm being "pursued" by a chasing pirate in the online game. Pirates is a relaxed play.. EXCEPT when you have conflict. I believe that Zolpidem is a problem for my body chemistry.. it is a hypnotic drug designed to knock you out. I could probably get away with ONE.. but an accumulation over a few nights has now shown me twice that MY physiology doesn't like it.
Others could debate that I've "chilled down" over the weekend.. but I can say that there has not been a lot of conscience thought patterns about my key areas of anx at present.. really. So I shall now eliminate this chemical and stick with the Diazepam when needed. I shall take a single Zolpidem with me to London on Tuesday.. just in case I struggle in a hotel away from home. But as soulmate has pointed out.. there's no meetings on Wednesday so if I'm nackered through lack of sleep.. it's no big deal.
Soulmate here within the next 15 mins.. i've thought of something really good to take to the negotiating table for Tuesday meeting.. which is a "bit of old self" kicking in... I shall have a couple of glasses of cold cava 2nite.. but earlier than normal. I shall go to sleep later.. and apply the sleeping strategies. I suspect that my body WILL feel better in the morning as the hours pass and it cleans out the effects of the Zolpidem. I am confident already that 2moro WILL be a better day.. and I have learnt from experience that my body doesn't like this particular drug.
2moro is CBT.. and I shall discuss all the above with Ms Soulful Eyes. And of course I will check out her footware and report accordingly. Have a good week everyone.. and long live NMP. Liam
Veronica H
27-04-09, 09:36
:bighug1: Hi Liam, I think both you and the soulmate are right about the Zolpidem. It looms large in many of your posts. As you are very generous with you time and insights here, I consulted Dr Google ....:ohmy: don't be alarmed fellow sufferers, I realise that this is generally a no no and rarely do it now.......
Often Zolpidem users find that their medication over time turns against them with frequent awakenings during the night. This is often caused by rebound or withdrawal effects of the zolpidem. Zolpidem undergoes rapid metabolism in the body and the half life of Zolpidem is about 2 hours which is very short. People can experience withdrawal symptoms within as little as 1 or 2 hours of taking the drug. This often leads to a very disrupted sleep pattern with long term use of this drug (beyond 2 - 4 weeks).
Have a good week Liam, be kind to yourself.
Veronica
YAY! Two nights no Zolpidem.. only 2 Diaz yesterday.. and woke 3 times instead of 4 last night... straight into the strategies and back to sleep. No "anx adrenalin" feeling this morning. And no Diaz yet today... No doubts in my mind now that Zolpidem does not work for me beyond 1 night without causing MY chemistry a problem. SO that's that. Today is another step in the direction of recovery. I must however stop rushing from task to task and deal with matters one at a time. Prepare for London tomorrow.. and leave more time to get through each stage of the trip. No "I'll just take that call 30 secs before I'm supposed to be out the door". Short post this morning. RESULTS THOUGH! And back here this evening after my CBT. Have a good day all. Weather poo here in Gloucestershire.
Will
Very good news then. Yes, the offender does seem to be the sleeper, and.. only two Diaz yesterday - very well done indeed.
Let us know how you got on with your therapist and what she is asking you to work on now - I'm interested.
Monday 27th. CBT session 6. Discussed "what went wrong" with the week in terms of feelings, physical and emotional. Explained how I'd "lost ground" due to the medication not being right for me. But the lesson had been learnt about Zolpidem. FAR BETTER, IS TO PRACTICE THE NIGHT TIME STRATEGIES AS AGREED AND THAT WERE CLEARLY WORKING OVER THE LAST TWO NIGHTS. I have only had 1 x 2mg of Diazepam today.
We re-confirmed the decisions made. And nothing has changed in that sense. The "loss" of the week is not a set back. It's part of the process of healing. But I did book a session for next week rather than run the fortnight "just in case".. and reserved the ability to call friday and cancel it if I felt I could leave it for the two week period.
I can see that having established the way to move forward with CBT, the HOMEWORK THAT I DO AND THE EFFORT I MAKE IS NOW THE KEY TO REINFORCING THE PATTERNS AND IMPROVING THE STATE OF MY MIND. If the week goes steadily in my favour then there is less point in going there to confirm that it went steadily in my favour! (We have this forum to advise that!) So we'll see how the week pans out.
At the end of the session Ms CBT offered a quick "survey/test" on DASS Scales. This apparently is an Australian development and goes as follows:
"Pyschometric Properties of the Depression Anxiety Stress Scale. (DASS). DASS is a 42 item self-report inventory that yields 3 factors: Depression, Anxiety and Stress. This measure proposes that physical anxiety (fear symptomology) and mental stress (nerve tension and nervous energy) factor-out as two distinct domains. This screening and outcome measure reflects the past seven days. Gamma coefficients that represent the loading of each scale on the overall factor (total score) are 0.71 for depression, 0.86 for anxiety and 0.88 for stress".
Now I have no idea what that lot means in reality.. but after flying through the tick the boxes for the 0-4 aspects of the 42 questions by my immediate reaction to them, I came out as "normal" for Depression, "normal" for Anxiety and "moderate" for stress. I know I don't feel or really suffer from depression.. although I sometimes SAY "I'm depressed" to my partner.. but it's just a phrase for when I'm feeling a bit low really.
What would have been interesting would have been if I had taken the report when I FIRST ARRIVED FOR CBT.. and then had the reactions to compare. So that was the end of session 6. Checked that I had no stubble and hugged Ms Soulful Eyes.
Had an email when I got home where I have been advised that I'm not getting some monies that were expected THIS coming friday.. but I'm not climbing the walls about it. (Yet.) I shall have to find other ways to meet the staff commitments and find contingency. There is no point in me bouncing off the walls now.
Sadly now though soulmate is feeling very poorly at work (I come home after CBT so that I can think about the session and ongoing procedures rather than diving back into labours). She's feeling very sicky.. and may well want to go to her own house in order to "be ill" and try and get back on her feet before we leave for London 2moro. I AM IRONING STUDENT SON'S MASSIVE PILE OF WASHING AND LISTENING TO "All Angels". Saddened by the fact that she might not be here tonight but understand her desire not to risk passing it onto me and respectful of her need for her own space when ill.
This will be one of those evenings where I need to rise above my own selfish disapointment, get on with tasks that can be done, have just a couple of glasses of port, play Pirates and go to bed at a realistically late time, sniff her nightie.. and hope she is better tomorrow.
And to close this posting on a note of levity for those who want to know FAR MORE IMPORTANTLY THAN MY RAMBLINGS the make of shoe that Ms CBT was wearing today.. the answer is Gucci Mules. The ones that caught my eye last week encapsulating well painted but dignified toes were Ted Bakers. I rest my case and thank you for reading. Long live NMP.
Veronica H
27-04-09, 19:37
:) Hi Liam
Glad the CBT session went well. Gouchy and Ted Baker....a well heeled therapist. I think I took the Dass test but I was not given the results....:scared15: or a hug even. It sounds like positive news for you though.
I hope all goes well in London Liam and that the soulmate recovers quickly.
Veronica
Definately a good result at the CBT Liam.Also with the conclusion about the Zolpidem. Got a box of them,but dont take them. A night nurse tab does the same for me,contains (antihistamines). Sorry your soul mate is sick, hope she feels better for tommorow. All in all id say ,you definately made progress last week.It can sometimes seem like its three steps forward and one step back, pretty frustrating, but when you look back at the end of your journey ,its the same one no matter how long it takes. Hope tommorow goes well and you have a good evening. in London. Sue:hugs:
Hi Will
The survey test sounds good. Now, why have I never been given one of those?? I will be asking my therapist this question on Thursday and may be taking a copy of your post with me. See... you get a private therapist who wears Gucci and Ted Baker shoes and you can just guarantee she is going to be good. Very jealous of the Gucci mules I have to say.... bet she has a bag to go with them!
Sorry about your partner being under the weather, you will see her soon though. Couple of drinks tonight and pirate game sounds good to me.
You're doing so well - I am very impressed at the way you have immersed yourself in the CBT - it's not the easiest thing in the world to completely dedicate yourself to.
Take lots of carex
Wed 29th. JUST back from London. Soulmate came down from work, decided she’d rather be ill here with me than go home which was a compliment. EVERYTHING went to plan yesterday. I’d allowed more time, pre-booked the train etc, sorted hotel and done all I could to make the journey and project as anx free as possible. The meeting was important; relevant to future, current cashflows etc. I needed to be on form and “my old self”.
Half an hour before going in, I took a Diazepam; first of the day. Why take a risk? Arrived 3 mins before 2pm. It went perfectly. Everyone there including me and soulmate were pleased with the results. We didn’t go there to “sell”. We went to gather information and look at future possibilities. Therefore there was no particular pressure of “Will they like me and will they buy”. It was an approach we’d decided upon before we went.
Meeting finished at 4pm and therefore we had time off and return train booked for today at 4pm. 24 hours for a BREAK! We had a lovely evening, walking London’s West End. Found an Italian restaurant I’d last visited about 27 years ago. Had a great meal with good wine and a couple of brandies.. Talked and chilled and were pleased with ourselves and how I was feeling. Made decision to visit the National Gallery and the Portrait Gallery on the moro. Walked back to hotel, had cuddle and went to sleep. Woke at 6am but hardly surprising because we’d conked at about 11pm. Easy sleep no problems.
But here now is the thing. I haven’t written the above just to “blog” my diary. Because today the problems came back. WHY? We went to the galleries. Seeing “The execution of Mary Jane Grey” is a moving experience. It’s an extraordinary painting and along with all the other treasures you can be quite bombarded emotionally. So after, we went outside and sat down in the glorious sun on a bench in Trafalgar Square and BANG – THE ADRENALIN FEELING CAME BACK “for no reason”. WHY?
I wasn’t under threat of people or the place. It wasn’t all crowded. My head wasn’t jumping about with work. I was just taking some time off and trying to relax.
AND THERE IS THE PROBLEM. EXACTLY AS HAPPENED A FEW WEEKS AGO AT THE HOTEL IN PLYMOUTH. WHEN IT COMES TO TRYING TO RELAX – I CANT. Work addiction. AND the problem with being an adrenalin junkie for so many years. AND NOW I DON’T LIKE IT BECAUSE I CAN’T COPE WITH IT AS I USED TO.
So today I’ve had my ration of 3 Diazepam, dropped soulmate back at her house and youngest is due here later for his Wednesday visit and to prepare the kart for a racing weekend. Racing is a distraction and very good for me. But of course I don’t stop.
So here’s the next thing. It’s a lesson learnt today like the Zolpidem was after two experiences. IF I TRY TO STOP AND RELAX DURING THIS DIFFICULT TIME IT STRESSES ME OUT. I don’t mean, chilling at home, playing Pirates, having hot tub, walking, cooking or the ironing. I mean the conscious “going away for a break and a rest”. We feel that If we'd come home this morning after the successful meeting and the lovely evening I’d have been fired up and been able to USE THIS ADRENALIN with purpose and decisions made and pushed forward through this period of difficulty. WHICH IS WHAT WE’VE DONE FOR 17 YEARS. Generally a short sharp break and back to work within a day or so.
Just as I had to learn “Why try and stay in bed for 9 hours when my body only wants 6 hours sleep and rest”, today I have had to learn from the experiences “Don’t try and FORCE myself to take a break during tough times when I haven’t ever done so”.
Oh and Soulmate is just as bad in that sense. Workaholics. Knocked herself out on Monday so that the staff were sorted while we “took our break”!
So… to conclude. I’m looking forward to racing this weekend. My “rest and distraction”. Eldests are around tomorrow for gaming. Pirates later tonight. Get stuck into work tomorrow and work not only on continuing to clean up the business difficulties I’m still under pressure with but also steps forward with proposals from the meeting yesterday.
Keep busy, keep distracted when anx’d and NOT try and force a break on myself for a little while UNTIL there’s some stability in the world I am still currently struggling with.
I came straight onto NMP as of course writing the forum helps me rationalise and work my problems and I feel supported by those who read my wordage.
Won’t now be cancelling that session of CBT next week. We have a different matter to discuss and I’m going to need guidance as to how we deal with it.
So glad your meeting went well Liam.A nice evening out and a good sleep too!. id say thet was a pretty good result. As for the rush of Adrenaline and why it happens like that ! :shrug: there are many theories on that. Years of living a certain way are not going to be easy to change,and thought patterns are the same ,it will take time for your brain to be able to switch off,but if you do something enough ,it will learn to react in a different way. You sound like you enjoyed yourself ? so dont let the memory of a little anxiety spoil things. I believe its more how we react to it that matters,and not so much why it reared its ugly head..It doesnt like us to be enjoying ourselves,,probably because it hasnt been invited.......Sleep well and have a good w/e Sue:hugs:
Good post Suzy-Sue... responses from experienced NMP members for us rookies is valuable. I forgot to say that the tight AB (Adrenalin band) lasted for the rest of the day.. and 2 more Diazepam didn't shake it off. Which saddened me and did spoil things a little. Tomorrow though is another day and I haven't got to go anywhere.. I have to get "stuck in" to work.. as well as my head fix. Sleep well everyone and long live NMP. Liam
Veronica H
30-04-09, 09:37
morning Liam/Suzy
Suzy's post is spot on Liam. It is much more important to pass through it than to look for a single cause. I have had attacks when happy, relaxed, stressed, angry. I had an attack on a grand day out in London myself:weep: so know how disapointing it is. Unfortunately when the fight or flight response is present it is also looking for a threat and it seems in this case you have perceived the threat to be 'forcing yourself to relax'. Once you have found the 'threat' it is hard to convince yourself that this is not so, because fear of the threat is also present then. I had one when I was eating and couldn't swallow food for three days. I had one in a traffic jam as a passenger and for months after had to fight the urge to leave the car and run on to the hard shoulder every time we were stuck in traffic. If you tell yourself that this is just the result of sensitised nerves and accept that you will get these attacks for a while yet, without over analysing them or adding
too much fear then they will become less important to you and they will become less powerful. I would have rated my attacks as a 10 in the beginning now they are probably a 3 and I get less of them.
:bighug1: sounds like a successful trip though Liam. Glad that the soulmate made it .
Veronica
Thurs 30th. Slept ok... no wake ups until about 5.50 and "had a go" at putting myself back to sleep. It worked.. I got another hour. But I woke with the "anx band" and it stayed for the day.. relentlessly. Took my Diaz.. but although it eased it a bit.. a bit was a bit. It's another week of terrible cashflow.. and now the company that I was counting on two weeks ago that still haven't paid advised THEY were having a cashflow problem. So we're all trying to pass around the same 50p piece. The difference is that companies are companies, the company people go home and are paid, the little people like me worry about OUR little people. And everyone expects to be paid 2moro. I came up with an answer but there's nothing left for contingency or next week so frankly.. no wonder I'm anxious.
The company people all probably worry about whether they have jobs the next day tho and what a state we're all getting in.
My sleep strategies are working. This is POSITIVE CBT IN ACTION WITH RESULTS. Now I have to work out what to do with the daytime stuff. But it's been a long day of working through as many issues as I can and I've got more decisions to make and more unpleasant letters and telephone calls to make.
Anx has eased a BIT this evening. Eldests were over for plastic war and there was a lot of laughing and nonsense. Student son stopping over again as he's working with me tomorrow.. so I am not alone and there is someone who loves me close by. I know I am distressing my soulmate with my discomfort but at least I don't have to pretend I'm "alright" with her and we'll see it through.
For staff, bank holidays are "days off". For me and soulmate it's another day to work, and another day to pay for others to have a day off. But we've always done it.. and it gives us quality catch up time.
I hope 2moro I have a better day and I have a weekend of karting. So there's stuff to look forward to with just one more day to go and if I can climb some more hurdles then maybe the anx will fade a bit.
Sleep well everyone. What a tough journey this can be at times.
Hi Liam
It's a tough journey indeed and takes courage and lots of hard work to start to return to our old selves.
You have immense stress on the work front and it's the mind telling you that it's had enough. However, you are coping very very well considering.
Ah, I was touched by what you said about having your son over and having someone you love around - and someone who loves you - so nice and so true.
It's hard on our partners - however, at least you are not hiding it - that would be so much worse. I am sure she gives you much needed support and motivation.
I think you are very postive and I know you will get through this soon. You have complete faith in your therapist and in the CBT and you are doing everything you should be. I'd give myself a very big pat on the back.
Liam, as I am sure you know only too well... your mind is reacting in exactly the way it should considering the work stress etc. If the stress didn't manifest itself in anxiety it would release itself in other ways, physical illness for example. A good friend of mine suffered a long period of stress recently and the way it affected her was that she developed alopecia (spelling not sure?) - her hair was falling out and as you can imagine it was completely distressing for her. So, if the anxiety wants to get you it will - so let it do it's worst - you will be fine I can assure you.
You have yourself a lovely weekend.
Tuesday 5th May. The witching hour approaches but it’s too early to go to bed. I’ve popped into NMP on a daily basis since last Thursday, but the quill has been left drying next to the inkwell and the goose left in peace as I’ve focused on my strategies and worked at my discomforts with CBT and a few shots of Diazepam.
Slowly but surely the “band of anx” faded but I established that the Diazepam has little affect on it in its own right. Although it is a tranquilliser I’m not sure if it has any particular physiological contribution to the dissolution of Adrenaline and Cortisone.
I pushed on through Friday dealing with uncomfortable business matters one at a time; each email decision and proposal reducing each possible opportunity for someone to ring me and make me feel stressed or bad about my business decisions. And reminded myself that one effective decision and action at a time meant something good that HELPED ME GET BACK IN CONROL OF MY LIFE and that it was ok to stop any time I felt I needed to.
It was a karting weekend. And youngest needed me to be as best as I could be to give him as much chance as possible as usual. And this time, I NEEDED HIM TO BE AS BEST AS HE COULD BE FOR ME so that I could feel positive about the pursuit of our racing goal. The weather was great, the air cold and windy; I still felt anxious and it’s worse of course when your child launches himself around a track at 50mph + with his body about 2 inches from the ground with nothing but a bit of alloy between his face and the tarmac.
But here’s a thing. His trainer for karting also suffers from adrenaline “band of anx”. And he was talking about when his drivers crash or nearly crash and his chest “explodes” with the adrenaline.. and he says to himself “Well that’s me F*£*U%HFN for the next three days”. Nothing makes it go away. It just has to fade gradually. It’s the first time I’ve said out loud to someone what you can read here on the NMP website. “It’s a dreadful feeling isn't it but you know it isn’t going to kill you; it just feels horrible and it will go away”.
Youngest climbed the slippery pole and drove the best he’s driven. Extra pressure of trying to look good and not fail in front of his girlfriend, his mother and all the family. I’d already decided to leave the “ex” to quietly visit and after a quick hug I just got on with the never ending job of preparation and tweaking engine and brakes. As I’ve said before it’s all consuming and there’s little time for thoughts away from the track. Check and double check matters of safety. Decisions about a pound less or more of tyre pressure; a jet change, a different piece of gearing as we try to shave literally 100ths off a second.
I was greatly rewarded as was he, by his highest finish ever. He “hung on in there” with the top guys… the piece of elastic between him and the winners was little stretched. The girlfriend showed wisdom beyond her young years and left us alone on the starting grid and at the end of the practice heats and races. She played her part and I have another daughter.
Bank holiday Monday. Soulmate and I went to work and I prepared a list of ALL the crappy tasks, hurdles and jobs that had to be got through to save my business and the jobs of those who work for and with me. I felt a little better for this definitive task although it’s quite surprising how long a list can become. And then I worked ON IT, ONE STEP AT A TIME. An unpleasant task and then one not so unpleasant task. I wasn’t sensible enough to work out ONE PLEASANT TASK IN THREE. Next time I must remember that. I’ll write why in a minute.
As there’s no quick fix to the challenges that bring us to NMP so there’s no quick fixes to business problems including my main one of cashflow. Even the emails to enter proposals of terms and propositions for moving onwards seem to take a substantial amount of time and I got to the end of the day with “only” five done. But that was five.. the desk was cleared and I lined up the 6th ready and waiting for me to attend to straight away this morning when I got in. No excuses. All the bits of paper neatly there right in front of my keyboard.
I went home earlier, left soulmate hard at it in an empty but interruption free office and I played Pirates. She came home when she was ready (ok I begged a bit). She had her dog here to stay, we went for a walk and the humble pooch who is such a good natured animal and loves me too, provided much merriment. Even if she does break my life long rule of not letting dogs kip on my bed.
This morning I woke too early. I’d drunk some port and nodded off. The price I pay is waking sooner than I’d wish but at least I know why these days and I don’t worry any more about being awake. I’m glad I did really. Because there’s a limit to how long you should spend dreaming that you’re dancing with Dawn French. Especially as Jennifer Saunders didn’t really approve. Strange dream!
The time came to go to work. I knew exactly the first task after dealing with the online banking where enough money had landed to deal with today’s and tomorrow’s bills.. the post was uneventful and the only emails were receipts of acknowledgment from the bank and the other finance houses I’d written to yesterday. While they'd had their day of bank holiday and salaries. NOW THE STRESS WAS THEIRS. Without running away from the responsibility or the debt I’d let them know that there was no money and my proposals for how we dealt with that matter. THEY would now have to deal with the problems WITH me.
And then before I started the first task all lined up from yesterday, I remembered a pleasant task that needed doing. And I did it.
I filled in and posted the entry for the karting meeting in two weeks time. Usually I forget and then get anxious that I’ve forgotten and that we’ll be a late entry. Not this time. THE DAY WAS BEGUN WITH A PLEASANT TASK. And then I moved onto the first of the not so pleasants.
Gradually through the day I dealt with one matter after another until it was time to leave and go and meet Ms CBT. I was very glad I hadn’t got cocky, over confident and cancelled the appointment. We are by no means ready to stop working together but we are sooooo making progress.
That’ll do for today. Tomorrow I’ll come back and tell you about CBT session number seven. But I’ll close by advising an important matter. In addition to the well painted toes and different shoes, flared jeans appear to be back in fashion. Goodnight all. Sleep well and long live NMP. Nice one Nic. Liam
CBT 7. The one I thought cockily I could cancel. After last week’s horribleness, not a chance! I suppose it would be fair to report that we didn’t “do much”. I did most of the talking as usual and we worked through what had happened. Ms CBT is constantly updated of course as to how my life is going because she reads this forum and thinks the whole of NMP is excellent actually.
So the report of the session won’t be a very long one. I’ve “stayed away” from the ex and I’m getting the sleep pattern back in order. Except last night. When I drank ¾ of a bottle of Port, went to bed too late and then had a horrible disturbed and sweaty night of constantly waking and feeling yuuuck. TOTALLY MY OWN FAULT AND RESPONSIBILITY. As I write this I have 1 pint of cider and that will be it. Hopefully I’ll sleep better tonight.
But I digress. As I am a pro-active person, trying to stay in London and have a day off when I knew all was not well back at work was probably not going to be a success. I KNEW there was not enough money coming in for salaries and I had to come up with a payment answer. And sitting in Trafalgar Square mumbling about the pigeons that are no more and wondering how they’d got rid of them wasn’t an ideal way to try and pass time as relaxation.
Ms CBT agreed and we talked about the need for me to tackle the “smelly jobs” that still had to be dealt with and that breaks should be short and sweet. The weekend ahead gives this opportunity to rest a bit, go and work a bit, do a job, do some ironing… keep it busy but break it up. Pop to work if I want to. Don’t if I don't.
STAY OFF THE HEAVY BOOZE. But a bit here and there is ok. So that was clever wasn’t it. Came home and supped too much Port. twit!
It’s good to talk to her. She clearly has sound business sense as well or at least an awareness of those sort of pressures and although we didn’t particularly go “Today’s CBT is about…. “ it’s all part of the process and training the mind to new thinking patterns. And I was able to say to myself in the middle of last night’s crap kip that this was my making, and that although tired tomorrow I’d sleep better the next night. And I knew immediately what to do to TRY and go back to sleep. Didn’t work brilliantly but Port can interfere.
She helped reinforce my thinking about the ex and the maintainance of my “bit of space” for a while. Encouraged me to deal with the work demons one step at a time and generally helped me relax. That’s it really. No new miracles to report. Steps forward, steps backward…
Youngest has made decision that he’s best not karting during his GCSE exams so we’ve got no track days until beginning of July now. Bit sad about that but totally his decision and a very responsible one. On the plus side I’ll save some monies and have a bit more time to try and relax and keep working on getting control of the adrenaline and general feeling of anxiety. Must take more walks, breath air and try to chill.
Perhaps I’ll even start to write something of value for others to read on this most valuable of websites. Have a great week everyone. The Bluebells are out, the trees are in full bud, the male birds are singing “Look at me, look at me” and another British summer is on its way. Let us hope we can be filled with sunshine and not rained on or in our souls.
Liam
Aww, the last bit was very sweet and positive too. Yep the bluebell woods are teaming with families with their kiddies taking photos. Not exactly teaming, but you know what I mean lol!
Sometimes a drop of alcohol is good I reckon. It's something to look forward to after a hard day's work, take that couple of glasses of wine away from certain people and they may not get through their days as well as they do. I don't drink - not with the meds.
Don't try to control the adreneline - just let it come - allow it to take you (all good Claire Weekes stuff) resisting will only make it worse. Controlled breathing can help of course.
Changing the thought patterns is the hardest thing - we think how we think. We think like this because of the problems and stressors in our lives. We hve to tweak these thoughts into more manageable and friendly thoughts rather than allowing them to be catastrophic.
Take care Liam, you're doing very well. x
Veronica H
07-05-09, 10:40
Morning Liam:)
I think it is a good plan to break things up and have short breaks because it keeps all areas of you life moving in the right direction. Yvonne is so right about letting the adrenaline wash over you. Accept it and don't fight it. Take time to watch the clouds go by this week and keep sharing your thoughts with us. :bighug1:
Veronica
Last night I zonked out but I took 10mg of Zolpidem to make it happen and disappeared for 7 hours. Therefore not physically tired but despite the Diazepam today can't reduce the adrenaline and gut feeling. Is it the Zolpidem? Haven't had one for a week or so, so I'm beginning to not be so sure about that one. With reference to the above responses I'm going to have a go at just "living with it and letting it be there". It wasn't there the other week and I'm sure it'll go away again. But probably not until I can get control of the cashflow. So when SOMEONE pays a big bill then maybe that'll be the moment of the beginning of the relief. Tempted to take 2 Diazepam at the same time or go and ask the doctor for a higher dose. See how the addictive mind works? Will do my best to do neither and also not take a Zolpidem tonight. OR DRINK.
Wading through the next stage of finance hurdles today. One at a time. Must remember to eat lunch in a minute and shop for simple food. It's "plastic battles" with the two eldests tonight and 2nd son is working just yards away from me, doing a good job and stopping over tonight. Soulmate is just a few further yards.. and it's time to wander over.. "take a sniff of her".. and ask for some lunch. Daft isn't it.. 51 years old.. but can't do the eating bit very well on my own at present. Need the food for the adrenaline though I gather. Hard to write an "up tempo" forum at present. We'll get there.
Liam
I don't think for a minute it's the Zolpidem. It gets us some days - other day it retreats into it's dark hole. Something must have triggered today's anx. Examine the thoughts.
Well you can shop for the food but you can't eat alone - usually with anx doing the shopping bit is the hardest part. You need the comfort of having your soulmate with you because she is obviously something of a comfort blanket so you will feel easier eating in her presence?? Yes?
You're still positive mate, and that's the only way through it. xx
:D Excellent posts again Liam,and well worth reading.You have certainly taken a few steps this week and lessons learnt .Hopefully next week a cheque will come and give you a relief from the current band of anxiety.Youve done what needs to be done for now .what more can you do?.Did you manage to sleep last night?( have you ever tried anything herbal? ) I hope you have a stress free w/e and you manage to spend some quality time with your partner,she obviously makes you feel safe.If its any comfort I dont like eating on my own either lol. Heres to a weekend with the sun shining, fresh air in our face and positive thoughts in our heart.Take care Sue:hugs:
Stupid, stupid man. Zolpidem Wed and Thurs... Partner CONVINCED it messes me up. So last night I didn't take any. I was on my own, drank too much port through the course of the evening, stayed up till 2am playing Pirates. Now here's a thing. As the game has progressed and I've "been promoted" so the game gets harder and more adrenaline is being created and Adrenaline control is where I think my problem lies. It's hard to say whether the Diazepam has an affect on that.. the "anx" feeling in the gut.
Through the course of the week I've now made a list of EVERY apect of the work hurdles to try and sort and I've made contact and offers with EVERY creditor. Enough cheques came through to cover the bills for the week AND enough for next week JUST. I'm supposed to be pleased with that result and it's supposed to make me feel better as I should be able to relax. But it hasn't and I haven't. What a disapointment. There's a feeling that there's too much damage done already to my head and today I'm in a dark place. Soulmate ISNT with me at weekends.. she has to attend to her own family.. and I've never had a problem with that except of course the wish that she was.
As I write this I'm listening to claire Weekes http://www.controllinganxiety.com/downloads/weekes1DSL.mp3 (http://www.controllinganxiety.com/downloads/weekes1DSL.mp3) available as a free download from NMP shop. Just trying to let her filter through my head.
I'm going to go for a motorcycle ride in a minute. I've packed a drink, a pork pie, a book and some spare clothes. My wallet and mobile phone. I'm on my own until soulmate arrives 2moro at 6pm ish.. so I've got 18 hours to try and get myself under control a bit.
This evening I doubt if I'll play Pirates (unless I can find a nice relaxing simple task like "Pirate Gardening").. and the ironing baskets are already plopped on the couch to start that process of distraction later. There's clean linen dropped on the bed and the bedding is stripped so I have no choice but to make a fresh bed before I go to sleep. I've even got some Nytol and Kalms.. I have no idea whether a natural remedy will have any benefit for me..but last night's sleep was so unpleasant that I will probably try to be totally drug and alcohol free.
I was actually awoken BY the "adrenaline anx" feeling several times.. so the physiological thing was obviously going on while I was asleep. I also had one of those incredibly weird dreams where you're sure that you're awake and it's happening and I was going to the bedroom window to open the curtains and someone's face (a stranger) was pressed up against it..and I REALLY jumped.
Hopefully after a couple of hours of enforced motorcycle oxygen this state will calm a bit and I can look forward to sleeping with a bit of confidence and no chemical support.
Last year on my birthday my three sons gave me a framed picture of themselves that they'd gone off and had professionally taken. It usually lives on the computer table above the monitor I'm writing on now, along with other family treasures and gifts from them over the years. It's a happy smiling picture with three grinning lads who I know love me, care for me and are probably rather anxious about their dad.
The other day I moved it so it is RIGHT BESIDE THE KEYBOARD 12" from my eyes. When I start to lose hope I'm now looking at the picture and the smiling sons "right in my face".. and I am using it to remind myself what I live for and why I must FIGHT TO GET CONTROL OF MY HEAD AGAIN as well as the other "battles" and challenges I currently face.
This morning I have made two decisions. When I've posted this I shall telephone soulmate and ask her to bring me TWO PICTURES.. one for by the PC and one for my wallet. Then I can SEE HER when I'm having an anx.. and see if that helps check the moment.
I shall also remember to ask Ms CBT on tuesday for any specific approach or exercise she has experience of, to try and utilise at these critical moments - Apart from learning to breath properly, ironing and distraction.
Today is a "dark hole place".. I even went to see if any of the people who kindly write in this forum were in the chat room but they were all unfamiliar "faces".
I have been warned that there's no quick fix.. and the progress of this forum has mostly been up tempo, positive and responsive through and with the ongoing CBT.
But at the end of the day, it's me who takes the pills, me who takes the alcohol, me who played an adrenaline game for too long, me who can't be pleased and triumphant when I've climbed a hurdle and beaten an obstacle. Me who HAS to find the way out of today's black hole. Let's see how I'm feeling later after a couple of hours of focused motorcycling and fresh air. I MUST GO BACK AND READ MY OWN RAMBLINGS. The night I first began to calm down from the Zolpidem was the "Evening Epic of the great ironing session" when I remember FEELING the anx sliding away and I shouted out loud to myself.. "GO ON SON.. YOU CAN WIN THIS".
It's Midday Saturday. I'll write again at midnight tonight. Have a good weekend everyone. Long live NMP.
Hi Will
I find your posts so interesting, they make me laugh and cry. Its like my daily soap.I miss them when you don,t post for a few days.
Anyway I just want to let you know that you are very brave, you have people that love you around you so keep focusing on thier pictures. I never knew how many people cared for me until I got anxiety as I was the one who always looked after everyone so find it hard not to be that person so I kind of understand what you are going through. I hope you have good day on your bike and a better night.
Look forward to your next post
Take care
Sharona :hugs:
Sunday 10th. TRAH LAHHHH! Phew. How good to start the day better than yesterday and with lessons learnt and amended strategies loaded into the head. The “anx band” began to fade a little early evening. I forced some food down, put on a Sky movie and started the ironing. I FORGOT that I had decided to listen to Claire Weekes downloads. But the movie was tense, noisy and not a good choice and I wasn’t focusing too well on the creases and corners so I switched off the TV, put some Gregorian Chants (have you tried that) on the music system, switched off the iron and decided to jump into the NMP chat room and just sit in the corner and read the others.
However you get such a warm welcome when you “arrive” that I felt able to say I wasn’t feeling good and the troops rallied around… I told my tale in a short form and it was confirmed that alcohol and diazepam do not mix and I was re-assured I WOULD feel better today. Tetley was doing a great job of running multiple chat lines with various members. I then had a brief chat with someone who was just starting their CBT and was able to point them to this thread as a possible prop to find moments of empathy, said goodnight, left the room and found a couple of PMs from members.
One member appears particularly experienced in chemicals et al and I’d asked if they thought I’d created the problem with the mix of drugs and alcohol and extensive late night gaming while consuming too much port. This is the relevant cut n paste from their reply.
“We all have to find what works for us, as we all respond in different ways to treatment and drugs. It’s true though that diazepam, taken with alcohol has a bad reaction when mixed, the alcohol enhances the effect of the diazepam and vice versa. Hence why you had such a bad night. You would also be dehydrated due to the alcohol; it would be like drinking double the amount you consumed.” (Makes sense. I wasn’t “sozzed” but my body probably was.) “Did you know that diazepam can cause sleep probs? Zolpidem is something I would never touch unless in a dire emergency, the more you take the more you need, it only works for 3 hours anyway. BUT that said the odd pill now and again wont hurt, as long as it works for you. There does seem to be an element of doubt there?
Now to the computer and games! I have found out and also read on here people saying, they don’t sleep well when they have been on the computer LATE. Allowing an hour or more to unwind, before you go to bed, have a long soak in the tub and play some gentle relaxing music or deep relaxation tape for half an hour, will prepare the body for rest. Games are good but over stimulate the nervous system. Best done earlier in the evening.”
THIS CONFIRMED WHAT I’D THOUGHT AND IT’S GOOD SUPPORTIVE ADVICE. Previously this member has recommended some herbal remedy as a possible sleep aid too.
So last night, I stopped computing earlier, took 2 Kalms Sleep an hour before as per the advice, went to bed with a bit of Poldark, set the alarm for “Mad World” at 7am, vowed I would NOT look at clocks (still turned to the wall, curtains tight) until I HEARD the music, read a little and was out by about 1am. A couple of minor wake ups.. applied my CBT, conked out again, two minor weird “real” dreams and woke minutes before Mad World. Switched it off.. and dozed, napped for another hour! Rang soulmate at 8am, chatted (she might be a little late tonight.. busy day with her oldies) and she approved and supported the trial with the Kalms Sleep. “You can get addicted as you like to a herbal remedy” she jested! Kisses bye bye on the phone, rested and thought about the day ahead for an hour till 9am. Got up.
Each time my head “went to work” though I reminded myself that I was seeing her later and there was no point in going down that thinking road at this time of day on a Sunday.
But here’s a thing. It’s funny what you remember and how you can find stuff filed away long ago. A couple of years ago I kept waking up because I’d be sleeping on my hands or with my arms in daft positions that meant that I was squashing nerves or compressing veins or something because I’d wake up with dead arms or hands! Completely numb or “asleep”. I knew it wasn’t a health problem. It was just annoying, a nuisance to wake up that way. Meant I had to go through pins n needles or just waggle them about to get feeling back before I could DO anything with them.
So I taught myself step at a time, to consciously put my arms and hands in sensible places when I was going to sleep. It took a little effort and a bit of pre-thought and I’d wake and have to re-arrange limbs during the night but I knew why, what I was doing and how to deal with what had began to happen. THIS WAS CBT IN ACTION IN MY SYSTEM TWO YEARS AGO. I applied it without awareness of the therapy to my body. AND IT WORKED. I rarely wake with the problem these days, but when I do I take five seconds to re-arrange “stuff”, allow about 15 seconds to check that circulation and nerve is responding and go back to sleep assured the matter is dealt with. IF I CAN DO IT WITH THE BODY – IT IS A PROCESS OF HAVING CONDITIONED MY THINKING – I CAN DO IT WITH MY MIND. Because of course, my mind has had to deal with the physical problem.
It had happened this morning with one hand and I suddenly joined up the dots. It’s not a major miracle of revelation; just an anecdote but we have to hang our hats on good results and positive achievements and this one helped me this morning.
As a result of a successful night, I feel better today, partially but not totally de-toxed. I’ve eaten, the boys are smiling beside me, the weather is good and I shall do some gardening and then ride to where I know the bluebells are particularly prevalent and walk some woods. Student son’s washing is drying outside and the windows of the house are all open. The squirrell is trying to open the bird feeder and two robins are having an argument in the conservatory.
I’ve taken a single Diazepam and I will re-new my prescription tomorrow. When I see the doctor I have questions to ask. My Diazepam packaging says “One a day up to 3 times when needed”. I’d like to know if I should fight the demons and only take the pills when bouncing or whether it is wiser to (like a pain killer) to take 3 a day as a pattern regardless, while I deal with the issues and problems that got me in this condition in the first place. I also want to learn a bit about “Paradoxical Anxiety” but it is easy to over intellectualise this condition. However it is chemistry at the end of the day… even with the human mind.
There we go. Again PHEW. Of course it’s not all over and there’s a bit of anx there now. But nowhere near as bad as yesterday. Fresh air, a bit of sensible breathing and time to stop writing. Have a good day everyone.
Veronica H
10-05-09, 13:11
:yesyes: Great post Liam. I will be interested to know the answer to the Diazipam question from your Doc as I was wondering about that myself.
Veronica:bighug1:
Hi Will
Glad you had a better night, so to speak, interesting to hear about your CBT from a few years ago.It shows it can be done.
Take care
Sharona
Good post Will - I find your posts really interesting.:yesyes:
Monday 11th. Thanks for the posts guys. Like all the issues we face that brought us to NMP in the first place, encouragement in all forms has a positive effect and I must confess to having just a few doubts recently as to whether people were finding my ramblings and rumblings worth reading. I seem to have had quite a few viewings but that doesn't mean that they stay the course! LOL. If you put CBT A FRESH START into Google this little forum comes out on top. What a great machine Google is and hopefully it helps more people facing challenges similar to our own to locate NMP quickly and in greater numbers.
The demons I face of seperation from my family, cashflow crisis and substantial stress from work must be affecting many people now in a recession and not everyone can step into the world of CBT quickly for various reasons.
So although I use my own situation as the example and explain MY problems in this forum, I must try to remember that apart from the empathy of others going through similar problems, that there is a vast value to CBT as a therapy for a vast range of conditions. So I will try to write more about CBT as I go along and broaden the explanations as best I can.
Last night was another night of no Zolpidem or alcohol, but I stayed online too late gaming and went to bed too soon after. I dozed off quickly with the book; soulmate had gone to bed tired 2 hours previously. But as soon as my head hit the pillow.. BANG the mind started thinking. Not particularly "anx" thoughts.. just thinking. And I didn't have a great night really. But I've had worse. What I should have done is immediately my brain woke up was put the light straight back on and read my book again! But I didn't.. I tried to think about other things. I did realise that I just wasn't that tired even tho it was 1.30am.. I HADN'T DONE A LOT TO MAKE ME TIRED. And there was a tell tale sign earlier really. I usually nod off when partner is doing my feet but I didn't last night.
When I did nod off I did wake VERY sweaty though.. as in LOTS of water coming out of me. Quite strange that.
So I added another question for the doctor this morning and that was "Could I please try a different type of sleeping tablet to knock me out SOMETIMES." He prescribed me ZOPICLONE and re-newed my Diazepam prescription. A quick glance at the leaflet shows me it's printed by the same company that prints for Zolpidem because there's numerous errors on the sheet where they refer to Zolpidem instead of Zopiclone! So a little homework later there I think.
In answer to the question about Diazepam and specifically for Veronica H above. I have been advised that in MY case "As required" is a better way to run forward. It is a drug of dependence at the end of the day and the less constant a stream of ingestion then the better in the long run. I understand it takes 15-20mins to "kick in" dependent on quantity of stomach content, has an effective but slowly diminishing influence of about eight hours and remains resident and fading for up to 30 hours.
The doctor is a doctor not a bio-chemist though at the end of the day, in the nicest sense of the words. He was doubtful about my combination of alcohol and Diazepam causing the dreadful physiological band of tension across my abdomen that I had to live with over the weekend as a result of my lack of sense on Friday. Hmmmm... I personally need to continue with a process of NO ALCOHOL if I am taking medication because I believe it DID affect me. Time will tell.
Because it's not been a good week overall and I had a bit of an anx this morning and was short tempered with my soulmate I rang Ms CBT and boosted tomorrow's appointment to today and I'm writing this having just got back. I have made a "battle plan" of certain decisions for how I am going to live for the NEXT FORTNIGHT. This is important to me and I need to apply it because it is quite easy to "slip back" or "neglect" strategy decisions and the reinforcement is vital to the process of CBT.
For example I visited the family home yesterday as eldest and girlfriend had got new pets and wanted me to come and see them. I went and of course this meant that I had to chat to the ex and this is NOT good for me. Or indeed possibly her. I was sad to hear that SHE had been prescribed Citalopram but hadn't in fairness taken any yet as she was not impressed with the list of "stuff" you get in every drug packet these days.
I must reinforce my own decision to stay away for a little while and communicate ONLY about youngest and the very important GCSE schedule of exams. All other matters and discord must be put aside. This is not a decision of avoidance; it's a matter of priority and what will help us get better.
When I've completed this battle plan list.. I'll add it as a post in its own short right.. rather than buried in a diatribe.
And now I'm going to close this post and go back to work knowing that the weather is beautiful and soulmate and I are going to walk amongst the bluebells this evening.. and NOT talk about stress, therapy, work, critical analysis of the human mind and bio chemistry. Just bluebells, woods and trees. Fresh air, lightness and frivolity.
DONT KNOW yet whether I'll take a pill tonight to sleep and haven't needed a second diazepam yet today. So this is good. But I do have a little cliff hanger for my head and I'll close with it. WHAT IF THE "FROWNING DOCTOR" WAS RIGHT AND MY ANX BAND WASNT A BIO CHEMICAL REACTION.. what if it's an underlying thought process? If so.. then I'm NOT out of the woods yet... but a walk in real ones tonight gives me greenery for thought.
Hi Will
I hope you enjoy your walk, we always hang on to every word the doctors says and then go home wondering what they really meant. I went to my doctors on Saturday and told her about the side effects/head zaps, she was not sure what they were but felt it best I stop seroxat immedietly and gave me sertroline. Now I am scared to start them as I do not want to go through the initial getting used to the new ones stage. I came away wondering why she asked me when my last blood test was, it was in february. She did not offer me another one so came away wondering.
Anyway, hope you have a good week.Keep posting and stay positive.
Sharona xxx
Good evening,Liam! Was going to post last night but the service provider decided otherwise:mad: .Since then I see you have posted again.Sorry you have had such a rough few days,but was pleased you felt better yesterday compared to Sat. The sleeping pills com bined with the booze doesnt mix too well either .So could your feelings be down to more than just the diazepam? just a thought!. Its similar to taking two types of medications and not knowing what is causing the side effects,taken on their own you would know . So what sometimes we have to do is eliminate certain things to find out what works for us. Booze and medication isnt a good combo. If you were just taking the odd Diazepam a small night cap wouldnt hurt, (one) My Mum used to have a whiskey every night and she swore by it for getting her off to sleep , she doesnt drink now thou . Dont know if the chant music you mentioned is the same to what Ive heard ,but when I went for acupuncture she played chant, and I found it extremely relaxing..more so than anything else she played. . I will be interested to see your Battle Plan for the next couple of weeks. Hope you sleep better tonight and have enjoyed your evening.! Its always a pleasure to read your posts. Wishing you a relaxing sleep . Sue:hugs:
Good evening Suzy-Sue.. just popped on for a quick "nightcap of NMP" while I wait a little for the Zopiclone to kick in. As you say could feelings be down to more than just Diazepam and a dollop of Port? Anyway... only had two Diaz today.. and of course no alcohol now since Friday. It's also 1 month to the day since I had a spliff... so there's a milestone. I said I'd do 3 months.. and then of course hope to decide another three months. Reasonable goalposts rather than the steps that may be too big to take. My father swears by whisky. Sadly for him about half a bottle + a night for many many years. 2moro I hope to list the battle plan. It doesn't include Whisky! :-) Sleep well all. Liam xx
Veronica H
12-05-09, 13:20
Hi Liam
It is so hard to stick to any program for recovery when our nerves are sensitised because we are so impressed by any new thought and tend to follow it or be distracted by it, as it calls us to take action. Thanks for letting me know about the Diazipam. I take the odd one but very rarely. There was a point last week when if the answer had been 'yes go ahead and take three a day' then I think I would have, as the fear was beginning to set in....I managed to turn that episode around and have posted about it in the Success Stories forum. keep going and get that plan together. I look forward to your next post as always.
:bighug1: Veronica
Hi Liam
All interesting stuff as usual.
The diazepam isn't causing the tight band Liam, if anything the diazepam will be relaxing the body and the tight band should fade. It's psychological, it's the thoughts causing the tight band and this really is what the CBT is about. It's about changing those thoughts/modifying those thoughts to ones that sit easier in the mind.
The combination of alcohol and diazepam would only relax you more - might not feel great the next day but you would be lethargic - could feel low as well with the combo. However I feel I know it isn't causing the tension you are getting. You are feeling tension from stress.
Keep practising relaxation in whatever form you prefer. You have to bring the levels of anxiety down and by continually practising relaxation hopefully over time it will bring the level down.
Anyway, you aint doing too bad - you are a trooper and you will get there.
Take care x
CBT – DECISIONS FOR ANXIETY OVER CASHFLOW AND BUSINESS PROBLEMS. (Equally applicable to domestic financial worries)
DEAL with one headache/hurdle a day minimum.
DEAL with one incoming headache/hurdle a day minimum. Even if they are “horrid”.
DO NOT LET THEM STACK.
TRY to deal with one bill a day if possible if such requirements arrive beyond the usual.
I have created a folder with strong see thru plastic insert pages. In EACH there is a separate matter. Rent in one, Council tax, electricity, telephone, credit cards (Individually) etc. NOT a big pile of pieces of paper in a thick frightening folder.
When I turn these pages I see ONE issue only – not a heap of issues. There is a single sheet of A4 in each slip page for simple notes to show exactly how I stand and I record the date of that memo, action, decision or state of play.
I have opened an individual file for EVERY “horrid” task and put them in a filing cabinet. I take out ONE file at a time and when I have done what I need or can… I put it away before I take out another. There is no stack on my desk. They are not hidden; they are where I can find them but not an “eyesore” or distraction when doing something else. There is a single sheet of A4 in each file where I write the notes to show how each situation currently stands. This stops me having to make myself try to memorise it all and REMOVES THE NEED FOR ME TO THINK ABOUT IT AND REMEMBER IT AT NIGHT TIME WHEN I SHOULD BE ASLEEP. It’s written down at work.
For my personal banking I have written a list of every direct debit, payment, standing order, etc and on what days they occur. This is simpler to do because of the availability of online banking. Although I could easily do this with an accounting package the action of writing it down helps me take on board WHEN such payments are coming out and as a result WHEN money must go in. As a self employed person I don’t have a fixed amount arriving monthly or weekly and I can refer to this daily and thereby reduce the anxiety of a shock discovery.
For the first time in years, I have put in my wallet my “cash allowance” for the month of May. I use THIS to shop with and it stops me picking up extras that I’d just pay for with plastic when passing checkout. It helps me THINK before I buy an extra DVD or similar luxury during difficult financial times and also helps when I’m shopping with youngest and we just “bung stuff” in the trolley.
Additional “rules” are now in place:
CHANGE the "check foremails" timer on my servers to get my emails every 15/20mins as opposed to every minute. This STOPS me being distracted by the "ping" of an email arriving when I'm in the middle of a task or thought process. ALSO I've learnt to shut the email off when trying to have a meeting, or staff have come in to ask a question or make a request. The mobile phone is ALWAYS ON tho and with me at all times. As a seperated father my kids must be able to get me whenever and whatever time. However the work people who have my mobile number are VERY limited.
No checking emails after 7pm.
No emails until I get to work the next day.
No emails over the weekends. (THAT ONE WILL BE HARD) but I don’t have personal emails.
No checking online banking before arriving at work.
No checking online banking (except private accounts possibly for family matters) over the weekends or when at home.
Leave the Blackberry at work on a Friday night.
Skype and MSN are ok because I only use them for family and limited friends.
This list forms the basis of my strategy for utilising the principles of CBT for moving onwards and through the process of recovery from the anxiety created in myself at the loss of control and feeling of possible helplessness and failure that kicked off the “BUSINESS PART” of my current difficulties.
I’ve written it as a single thread in my forum so that I can find it with ease as my ongoing reminder and also with the hope that its simple structure may be easily cut n pasted for any other NMP member or guest who feels they could use it. Cheers... Liam
Looks like a sound strategy Liam.Breaking the old habits will be a bit trying to start,but they say if you can do something 11 times the pattern in the brain changes.??Heard this twice in one week ,so sounds like there could be something in it. I found writing lists helped with the chatterbox feeling during the night,so no reason it cant work for you. Might mean talking to yourself at times :wacko: lol but who s going to tell? How was the sleep last night?did the change of pill help any? Let us know how your getting on with it. Wishing you good night and a good first day of change tommorow,Hugs Sue:hugs:
Well done Will
A massive strategy that I hope will work.You sound so organised now, it will help you if you follow your rules. Remember these will make your life and decision making easier.
Well done so far.
Sharona
You are so organised! I think it's completely brilliant. All your own work? or did the therapist help you to devise this plan. The act of sorting out all the files etc must have given you an immense feeling of satisfaction. You have done really well.
Veronica H
13-05-09, 19:12
Hi Liam
:yesyes: Great plan and so much that others might use too. Let us know how it all goes and of course the new meds, sleep etc.:bighug1:
Veronica
Wed 13th... And the day draws to an end. Monday I took my first Zopiclone. Slept quite well to the new strategies. No weird "real" dreams. Woke up Tuesday feeling not to bad and no side effects. GOOD START! Glad that I'd slept ok and that the new tablet seemed fine. Went to work with a little trepidation but more confidence and ploughed into tasks one at a time and shook off as much anx as I could by pushing it out of my mind and trying to "live" with the feeling. ONE TASK AT A TIME IS GOOD.. what used to be "multitasking", soulmate now describes as "headless chicken routine".
I TOOK NO DIAZEPAM AT ALL TUESDAY. This was a good result. Nothing particularly horrid came in and I worked hard frankly and pushed along the pages of the folder and worked in my head on the edited “Business list” posted yesterday. Which I'm going to have to print off and stick next to this computer because I haven't memorised it yet for the home bits! YES YVONNE IT'S ALL MY OWN WORK! :-). I began to create it straight after my first session of CBT where I “got the point” immediately about the need for changing thinking processes and operating procedures. I read out the basics To Ms CBT on Monday. She approved. As a by the by, when I arrived Monday, having brought the appointment forward because of the bad week we immediately did the “Test thing” again and my numbers had risen a lot for stress and anxiety. No depression though.
Last night I confidently took a single Zopiclone again but failed miserably to do all the other stuff I must bring into the “shut down” process so avidly encouraged by members of NMP. The warm bath, the hot drink, the processes of relaxation. I’m aware of this though.. and tonight I MUST combine a bit of them (alien to me to think that way despite the fact that it’s obviously beneficial) with the sleeping tablet. And then MORE effort tomorrow night as I strive to substitute the chemicals with these more appropriate methods.
Today was an “interesting day” for a different challenge. Those of you with vulnerability about eyes might wince at this. 3 years ago I had laser surgery for correcting my vision. Having been blindly shortsighted all my life it was a miracle to get up the following day and SEE the clock by my bed etc with no fumbling for glasses or jamming in of lens’. But it didn’t quite work well enough and th company I use are very good – I have a lifetime “guarantee” so we did it again and that seemed to do the trick. Mostly.
Then last year I gave the gift of the procedure to my eldest for his 21st (still paying for it in drips)..and for him he now has a life of no glasses and a perfect result. Apart from Life, “being there as long as I can as a dad”, this is probably the best thing I could have ever done for him.
However mine has gone off the boil slightly and although my age means that reading and computer requires specs, the slightly out TV viewing, the not perfect driving and the edge off the distance means that I’m going to get another go. This meant that today I had to have my eyes scanned and tested, anethatised and dilated.. which means you have to be driven there and back and then sit around in a darkish room while your eyes recover and function properly again.
It took a single Diazepam to calm me to get there but then there was a quality 3 hours chatting in the car with my eldest cos we “do” the eye stuff together. But then there was the sitting around in the dark alone bit for a few hours after he dropped me home.. hmmmm… Fortunately with sunglasses on and a muted screen I could play Pirates, so I have done for most of the afternoon and evening – shutting OUT the work thoughts as best as I could.
No more Diazepam today. (So far) Soulmate goes to back to her house on Wednesdays and youngest comes over to stay. He immediately went to bed for a kip because he’s cream crackered from all his revision and has started the GCSEs. So I shall stop this “report” in a minute, wake him and feed him.
I FEEL as if I’m making a little progress. Candidly the postings I receive make me FEEL GOOD ABOUT MYSELF and they do encourage. I am looking around the other forums more and chuck in my two pennies where I can offer some support or encourage others. And of course there’s a WEALTH of material on this site collected and so well put together by NMP Nic. Haven’t spotted a typo or a spulling mistake yet either! (Wonder if she edits herself)?
So…I’ll close down now. I was asked the other day about “homework given” etc by Ms CBT. It’s a topic probably worth covering. I’ve “done” the business bit and “blogged” my diary. So hopefully tomorrow after the eldest two have been and gone (although student son is staying over) I’ll write some more on Ms CBT and HER way of helping WilllLatch.
NO DIAZ YESTERDAY, 1 TODAY. Tomorrow I’ll have another go at another day without. Warm feelings to and from one and all. Liam
You have been doing very well Liam. Hope your eyes are feeling more comfortable ?.You did so well managing to have that done ,with everything you are going through .How did the strategy go today? The headless chicken remark made me laugh lol! Do a good impersonation of one myself,or should I say used to. :doh: Hope you have a relaxing evening,Hot tub and all that! Lucky b-g-er! Another day nearer to winning the battleX take care Sue:hugs:
Veronica H
14-05-09, 18:13
:) Hi liam and well done getting through the laser eye stuff with sensitised nerves and not much medication. You have made progress with the work tasks so that must be giving you a boost. Onwards and upwards....keep posting.:bighug1: Veronica
Thursday night. Eyes back to normal. 1 Diaz and then an unexpected visit from the tax man. NOT fun. When he arrives unannouncd there's no chance to prepare for anx. You just have to cope. HOWEVER I saw it through and it is another tick on the "horrid" list.. for the moment anyway. Decided to just ride out the anx feeling afterwards and took no more Diaz. So means only 2 in 3 days. Tempted to try and sleep tonight without a pill.. but will take the packet to the bed and put it aside. OR is it better left downstairs where I have to make more effort to get it. But that would mean becoming more alert. Hmmmm...quandry. Well, as I've only had such a small dose of Diaz.. and only 3 nights of sleepers.. perhaps a sleeper is acceptable. Remembering it was only last weekend that I was "dying"... and now it's coming under control. HOWEVER it's 12.40 and I've not done any of the prep for sleep that I'd planned.. Gamed with the boys and student son is here.. brought more washing.. MORE IRONING this weekend. 2moro eve is Claire Weekes and ironing. Focus on those words and that guidance. So decision made. Pill to be taken, book to be read. Interestingly I was awake at 5.50am this morn.. after only 5 hours kip. Not been tired tho. Maybe just needing even less. Time will tell. Like it does for all of us! Short post...sleep well everyone and thanks to Veronica and Suzy-Sue. LOT of raining 2nite.. so no hot tub. But sometimes it is great to just sit in there at night, look up at the stars.. or even be rained on. It's an immediate bath always ready at 36 degrees. I really ought to use it more. It came with the house.. wasn't impressed when negotiating the price. But the moment I stepped in it 3 years ago for the first time, I realised that I had found somewhere that really was good for me. And I've been in it most days since. EXCEPT since bouncing off the walls for the last 2 months. How strange. Liam xx
Saturday 16th. 27 years ago today it was a Saturday and I got married. 27 years later part of my current strategy is to stay away from my ex at present! We exchanged texts and that will be it. A week ago last night was the bad night where I took too much Port and then spent the weekend in bad anx guessing that the problem had been a combination of Zolpidem, Diazepam and alcohol. Not all forum members agreed with me but most confirmed that alcohol and medications do not mix. So one week later I've had no alcohol at all, changed the sleeper to Zopiclone and had a fair few less Diazepam. During the course of the week I followed the work strategies almost to the letter and climbed two of the biggest of hurdles on my list. Not a bad week. Steps at a time. Last night I tried no sleeping pill. I went to sleep ok but woke a few times. I woke earlier than I wanted to but with the clocks to the wall etc and the alarm set i drifted back from time to time and there were certainly less anx thoughts about the key areas that have led to my current condition.
As I'm writing this I'm actually listening to Claire Weekes part 2; the free downloads from NMP and her words on de-sensitisation. "Set-back is your friend; don't be despaired by set-back".
I have realised that I seek refuge in the computer too much and what was a good game of Pirates is now at a level of adrenaline production that's not particularly comfortable. What a paradox. I want to calm down and yet I obsess a game that makes me uncomfortable!
It's time to focus on some specific topics for this forum. I shall write a very BRIEF summary of the four key areas that brought me here later and then specifically target each one as I did with CBT - BUSINESS STATEGY. Followers of this particular forum will see I've now noted four key areas whereas most of the writings have been about the three I established through CBT. I also hope to expand on the aspects of CBT application and answer the questions I receive about the validity of the therapy, the "homework" and my experiences.
Meanwhile, there is housework and chores to do.. shopping for kids arriving later, the decision already made that I will take a sleeping tablet tonight so I can stop thinking about it and wondering through the day. ONE note to write tho.. the change from Zolpidem to Zopiclone... MUCH better for me... no drug based mood swings or anxiety feelings as a result, the following days. This is good. I'm now on a better medication.
My target success for the day? There's a tap that's dripped very slightly for 3 years +. I have decided that I must change the washer. Which means switching off water, undoing tap, finding washer, removing it.. driving eight miles to get a replacement, installing and restoring. One of those not big deal jobs that has NEVER been done since I've had this house. What a tiny job. What a big target. I'll write later to report! :-)
Veronica H
16-05-09, 15:14
Hi Liam
I think you are getting to grips with this 'thing'. Glad that the new meds are making a difference and a big:yahoo: for not taking terrible fright at the arrival of the tax man. I think I would have had a drink after his departure so well done you. :bighug1:
Veronica
Hi Will
Glad the new meds are working. You need to use your hot tub more, its so relaxing. I would love one, my friend has one and they sit in thers in the rain!!!
I hope you have a good weekend and a better sleep.
Keep it up, you will get there, you are a great man.
Sharona :hugs:
Saturday night. 11pm. 16th May. Before we even get to anx, CBT, stress or any of the other topics that bring us all together on this wonderful site.. here is my moral of the day. DON'T KEEP YOUR WELLIES UNDER THE DOWNSTAIRS TOILET WASH BASIN. There. Take that one on board world. Some things just need to be said. Warning issued.
Found stop cock. (Can I say that Nic?). Removed tap bits. Washer was kaput but so was tap really. Decision. Go for the big plumbing operation and change the taps. Underneath... with spanner.. undo pipe work. WOOSH! Big pile of resident water straight into wellie boot! Useful container by proxy and better than carpet soaked. Gotta dry out boot now tho. Hence the above new proverb. Went to the DIY which really does stand for Do it yourself with our useless local staffless store. Bought taps. And then had small brain wave. (From my small brain.) MOVE CURTAIN RAIL IN BEDROOM AND FIND BLACKOUT CURTAINS. Stop the light coming in at all if I can. THAT will beat my brain. Get out of that one sucker.. with your "Oooh there's a tad of light.. does that mean it's 5am or 7am and a dull day"...
While hunting for curtains in the local "We sell everything that's not bad quality and at a reasonable price" store.. I found a long tube with the words "blackout blind" on it. I was assured it will cut to size with ease. So.. having triumphed over the tappage AND changed the toilet seat (the new one I bought 2 years ago has been just sitting by the loo since that day).. tomorrow I shall take my time, cut to size and install the blackout blind!
When I rang soulmate she reminded me that I'm always impressed with Holiday Inn curtains.. which are totally light excluding. This blind will recess nicely into the window bit and then there's still curtains as well. Should be able to create a complete WW2 bunker! :-))
I just looked back to last saturday's posting and what a dark night that was. Followed by a not easy but progressive week of small improvements. When soulmate hugged me goodbye yesterday she said it was time to spend some time moving on from the key words STOP IT when I'm thinking black thoughts or matters that cause anxiety and stress at inappropriate times. The new key words are CHEER UP.
So.. last night I worked on IRONING, doing stuff, a bit of Pirates..(ok more than I should have really).. but as an example of one of the better aspects of the game as a minor therapy apart from absorbance and distraction, is that behind this screen the game is open (can't see it of course) and I'm standing on the beach at Bartica in Guyana. The surf is up, waves are pounding, the wind is blowing and if I shut my eyes.. (*££*£Q£H*)-57-2hc2kkkq (Oops you can't do that and carry on writing) I truly can find myself on the beach in Cornwall where I grew up. Handel is watering his music on the stereo across the room and I have the remote beside me to balance his suites 1-3 with the waves at Bartica. At this moment I am "normal". Just the tiniest bit of anx in the faded distance.
CHEER UP. Followers of this forum will hopefully have read that I'd amended the reasons for being in my state to four instead of three. Because I'd forgotten HEALTH. First postings on this thread had me dealing with acute piles with one vein blocked for about six weeks. A painfull and debilitating condition that definitely contributed to my slide down this slippery path at the time and I forgot to "mention" that I'd been diagnosed as pre-diabetic. Again. Been holding that one off for about seven years. Get close sometimes but manage to push it away. Insulin, Adrenline, Cortisone.. blood sugar levels...all connected with this stuff.
Piles and pre diabetes were enough to help me find the effort to work on the weight. I am pleased to report that I've now lost 2 stone. Honesty must prevail at all times here of course and lack of appetite has played a part. However I was aware of it.. and have worked hard to eat the RIGHT FOOD when I can get it down. And soulmate does a valiant job of feeding me cos I'm a nupty with it at times. Of course the overall substantial reduction of booze will have played a big part.. 1/3rd pints of Vodka topped to the brim with Tango can contribute a few calories it has to be said! A little more exercise and the walks we're now taking. Behind me now.. and installed today having recovered it from a distant corner of one of the company store rooms is the most boring of devices.. the exercise bike! I've deliberately put it close to hand.. where I can listen to the waves or/and Ms Weekes.. I can even watch the TV.. all excuses are eliminated... and it doesn't intrude or get in the way. I just have to shift my backside from this chair to that seat and peddle. Next time I have a tight band I'm going to peddle.. and peddle hard.. to see what happens to it under such conditions...see what the Adrenaline does.
So... HEALTH for me is no longer a condition that is affecting my mind. My rear end no longer makes me anxious and is completely sorted. The loss of two stone will undoubtedly reduce the potential for piles in the future (I have also lost 2.5 inches off my waist measurement) and of course I will have backed further away from the diabetes numbers and will continue to do so. I was 15 stone. I'm now 13 stone. Another stone off will be a good challenge and an acheivable one. Steady but sure progress in that department. I no longer THINK about my rear and I just get on with it. Six weeks ago this was a very different matter. The body has healed that part of itself and therefore makes no call on the brain. Make note to self Liam - Now you must do this with the brain.
CHEER UP. So last night.. for the first time in months.. I HAD CHOCOLATE! One chunk of cadburys at a time, tucked into the roof of my mouth while I ironed. Very pleasant.
One diazepam today. And slowly the anx has dropped as the hours have passed. I have made efforts with the house and the distractions have been useful. I've already broken the CBT BUSINESS RULE LIST and checked the emails.. DUMB. There was one requesting money. If I hadn't have looked I wouldn't have known about it until Monday at work Another lesson learnt. I will NOT open the emails tomorrow.
Sleeping tablet time. I shall take one, because tomorrow I will put up the blind and make a dark place. The simple act of turning the clock is a strategy that has worked. I've looked at it twice in the last month and both times found an unfavourable result. Reinforcement of the training takes place by such experiences.
So.. PHYSICAL HEALTH AS A CONTRIBUTOR TO MY CONDITION IS NOW OFFICALLY OFF THE LIST. We're back to work stress and cashflow anxiety, Sleep difficulties, seperation and the ex. And it would be fair to say that there's improvements in all three areas.
Thanks to all those who contribute to this thread. I am beginning to believe I can beat this condition. And I'll pick up the reins again and write tomorrow when I've "blitzed" the window in the bedroom, cleaned the fishpond filter, been for bike rides (motorcycle and peddle machine) and finished student son's ironing. Have a good sleep and a great Sunday everyone. Long live NMP. Liam
Sunday 17th. Little notes from this morning. Cornflakes and Rice Krispies are now fine without sugar. While working on cutting the blackout blind to size I suddenly remembered one of my mother’s phrases from when I was a child. “SETTLE DOWN TO A STEADY GALLOP”. 45+ years later it doesn’t need to be explained to me anymore.
Just making a cup of tea with a low calorie sweetener which I’ve also got used to. (It’s all CBT). On the label it says “Fancy a brew? I’m on my time now”. Must remember that one. It’s the simplest’s of phrases. CHEER UP.
Wow. Just realised we're passed 1500 viewings on this thread. I Wonder if insomniacs have found some useful nod off tool. Or whether 15 people have just popped in a lot of times! :-)
Veronica H
17-05-09, 12:57
:bighug1: Hi Liam
Found it is easier to alter a window than accurately trim a blind so will be in deep awe if this works....sorry being negative...CHEER UP. Your honesty and humour are really helping me to keep going when things take a dive. I will try not to pop in too often as I may be bumping up the viewing figures. You have inspired me to sign out, get off my a** and tackle my chores. Catch you later.
Veronica
Seems I may have confused our Veronica… Perhaps I confuse her enough that she’s popped on 1500+ times! J No - I trimmed the blind and it’s fittings, didn’t alter the window and then installed it the wrong way round and spent a fair time trying to work out if the windy up bit was broken or not. Then I reversed it. HAH! SUCCESS! Up with the curtains again. And there’s now a double wammy to the intrusion of daylight in my bedroom.
As soulmate and I only get to be together 3 nights a week I’ve never stayed at her house where one of her children still lives with her. As a consequence I’m not familiar with her “going to sleep” routines in her own home. So I asked her and she pretty much follows all the recommended principles. Her bedroom is her sanctuary and special private place and where she deals with her anxieties and pre-menopausal issues, hot flushes and restless nights. As a single mother she put her two kids through college on her credit cards and there’s a big number owing and no end in sight. So she has financial stress in her own right.
She does her housework, and then has a hot bath, takes some writing, a book and watches old comedies on cable, reads or writes and chills down in her own den for about an hour before sleeping. If she wakes with hot flushes she gets up and goes outside and sits on cold concrete! If she wakes with brain activity she won’t lie there and wallow. She gets up and “does stuff” and carries on until she’s tired enough to go back to bed and sleep.
The key part for her was letting me know that her bedroom was HER SPECIAL PLACE. And she suggested I make more effort to make my bedroom a place that’s good to be in… rather than just a “sleep room” that’s half finished since I knocked it all through about two years ago.
My soulmate has a lot to deal and cope with. Her own youngsters, her own oldies, the death of her dad, her financials and of course last but I know not least – Me. What a workload and to hear that she retires at the end of it all daily to her own special place makes me feel good about it. We are probably both often awake at the same times and I look forward to the day when we can be awake together in the same house – all the time and forever more.
Veronica H
17-05-09, 18:29
Hi Liam
Have finished the ironing....thank God for the Tefal steam generator...how on earth did our forebears cope with the flat iron? Well done with the blind....respect. Lovely writings about the soulmate. One of the ways to recovery is to see what we do that is different from those around us who seem to cope well despite similar stresses and strains.....they are certainly 'doers' and when they switch off then they are determined about it, thus giving their nerves a rest.
Hubby says if I want my bedroom to be a sanctuary then I will have to move to the spare room, as he refuses to have rom/coms playing and whale music at bedtime, as he winds down to old war movies....lol.:bighug1:
Veronicaxx
lol Veronica! mine falls asleep most nights as soon as the light goes out. But It can be difficult to form a routine when you share a room. Im sure the blind will do the trick Liam,especially now the mornings are getting lighter.But soon the birds will be singing so loud well all need some ear plugs.You have certainly made a lot of progress this week.Well done. Its onward and upward from now on. :yesyes: The weekend seems to have been a very a busy one ,but nice to get those little jobs done ,something less to clutter the mind with. I too ,have fond memories of Cornwall,family holidays spent in Padstow and Rock,in days before the tourists had discovered this beautiful place...Tonight relax and enjoy .Take care ,the suns coming out again . Sue:hugs:
No Diaz since a single 2mg yesterday morning. So I allowed myself 2 short glasses of Port early this eve with dinn. Soulmate here.. gone to bed now. The blind should kill the light and the secondary windows shuts out MOST of the birds. A nuclear bomb should be able to go off and I'd neither hear it or see the flash of light!
Tomorrow I'm going to have to have words with Mr and Mrs Squirrell. Ok I encourage them into the conservatory... they stamp their feet if the monkey nuts aren't on the table.. but there's no need to try and destroy all the bird feeders. And they are already digging up the lawn to bury stuff.. do they know that next winter's going to be a dodgy one?
So Veronica has to try and sleep in a war zone with Charlton Heston or Gregory Peck and Suzy Sue has to try and conk out with Sleeping Beauty. I've just popped my Zopiclone and will go and snuggle up to my soumate, watch Poldark and perhaps read. Setting the alarm for 15 mins later in the morning and hoping that the blind does the trick.
Desite winning some of the battles at work last week, the war is not over by a long shot. Although the weekend went very well compared to the last, I could FEEL the storm clouds close by at times. "KBO" said Winston and Clemi Churchill. KEEP BxxGGxxing ON. Night all. xx
Hey Liam
I love these strategies you work out to overcome problems. Oh these light mornings! I know how you feel - blackout blinds are good. I'm having similar probs - keep waking about 5.30 to 6 am and can't back to sleep cos it's light and my mind thinks I must get doing. I bought a mask and I have ear plugs.
Yeah course your posts are getting lots of viewings, I did once tell you I thought you were something of a writer lol!
Just very quick story about squirrels. A few years ago when we lived next to a wood and had squirrels by the dozen in the garden, one got in. I was in another room and Iheard the cats hissing and dog barking. Went in kitchen, two cats with backs high on the work surfaces and Holly the boxer doing a sort of dance on the floor all excited. There in a corner was this squirrel scared to death of course.
Anyway, I got the cats and dog out - put them in another room and when I went back in kitchen no sign of Squigs - so I thought he had legged it. Later that night I was relaying story to family and we heard a scratching behind the fridge. Husband pulled fridge out and there was Squig in the corner. He'd been there all afternoon.
Sorry to take over your post mate. Just had to tell that story.
I think you are doing brill mate, you keep up the good work and keep to your wonderful strategies.
How's today been?
You are so domesticated by the way - you would make a wonderful wife you know.
Lotsa Love
Monday 18th. Well how about this then? NO DIAZEPAM since the tablet Sat morn. The Zopiclone helps me sleep and doesn’t mess my head like Zolpidem did. This is good! I can have a good kip and that helps a lot. The strategies are in my system for when I do wake up and last night the blackout thing worked very well except for some bleeding over the top which of course I was sort of looking for really. I woke about 15 mins before the alarm went off and then when it did was pleased that I’d not been awake long. Ironically though because “me n her” had a dark room we snuggled back down and were reluctant to get up! Can’t have it both ways.
I went to work in a better frame of mind. A little anxious but not too bad. There were yet more hurdles; some older and a couple of new ones and as the anx came in so I shoved it aside and did not give in to the tempation to take a pill just cos I’d had a difficult phone call or challenge. I “rode the waves out” and they weren’t as bad. As the day went on I felt pleased with the conquests, resisted the urge to come home early and saw through the day.
A single small glass of port earlier in the evening, dinner on the sofa with her and a movie, a chat about dealing with MAY before I try thinking about JUNE, a bit of Pirates and I’m ready for bed. Had a short debate with myself about not taking a sleeper cos I’m yawning my head off but thought I’m beating the Diaz so settle for one challenge at a time. I’ve only had 3 nights on the trot so “give me a break”me.
Also I stuffed some pillow cases along that top edge as I now add “light exclusion” to my obsessions. AND we’ve actually set the alarm on the clock with snooze so it can still face the wall but we won’t just hit “mad world” on the phone and that’s the end of the reminders.
Tomorrow is CBT session number 8 I think. I’m going to get back onto that plot hopefully for this forum in the evening and I shall arrange to see Ms CBT in a fortnight’s time. I know what has to be done in reality so I know I can hit an emergency button if need be and get an appointment at short notice.
So with health “out of the way” I’m back to my 3 primary areas of concern.
1) I’m finding solutions at work. (The over reference to WW2 last night was because I’m doing 24 hours in total of WW2 voice-overs for programming at present. It’s not the easiest of topics to narrate stories of POW camps, Belsen, Auschwitz etc when burdened with this condition!)
2) Staying away from the ex has been of great help in the nicest sense of the words. JUST been texted by eldest and his girlfriend to ask if they can come and stay Saturday so there’s no shortage of visiting offspring.
3) And with the blackout curtains installed we’re able to repel all boarders in the light department, keep intrusions to a minimum (except the squirells) and continue to condition my head to stay away from work for the allotted hours. I haven’t checked emails this evening but I did forget to print the list off (again) and pin it next to the computer.
So there we go me hearties.. with my timbers well and truly shivered because I’m sitting here writing with just a shirt on it’s time to hit the sack, get my head down, turn in, pat the pillow; remember that TOMORROW IS ANOTHER DAY to fight the good fight.. and always to try and remember.. MAKE HAY WHILE THE SUN SHINES. Goodnight all. Liam
Veronica H
20-05-09, 10:59
:) Hi Liam
Glad the blackout blind has been a success. Husbands love of anything WW2 continues, but I have had enough and he now has to wear his headphones. He doesn't want blackout blinds as he says I will give him seasonal affective disorder, as he loves to see the sun coming in first thing....that spare room is looking more and more inviting. I hope the CBT session goes well and look forward to your next post.
Veronica:bighug1:
Hi Liam
Glad the blinds working, well done going without tabs and good to hear you are pushing the anxiety to one side.
Well done so far, again really interesting post.
Sharona :bighug1:
And then as you think the clouds are passing by, you goof it up... and suddenly you don't seem as far from the starting post again. It's being another tough week at work; although I'm climbing over hurdles I've got a mindset developing about the difficulties of the future. And that's not an easy one to deal with. Like every industry the one I'm in is facing its own problems and I wonder despite all the years I've been in it, whether I have the capability to survive the drastic downturn. My skin is still very thin from this recent condition and fight away with strategies as I do and can, it still very hard.
Saw Ms CBT yesterday... and advised I was now going to try for a fortnight without an appointment. We were already "in danger" of going over the same ground and although it's great to talk I KNOW what my problems are and I know what I have to do to overcome them. It's not rocket science. It's CBT.
I have been asked a couple of times on NMP what homework and exercises I get given. And the answer is.. none. And the reason why? Because I TAKE the strategies to Ms CBT; I've already worked them out before I get there usually. Her job is to gently draw my attention to amendments, suggest changes and "cuff me round the head" metaphorically. And help reinforce.
Any form of therapeutic action opens a deeper process of thinking and reaction logically and having confirmed all my strategies in place I came away yesterday feeling not as "chilled" as normal. Interesting. I'm not bothered by "letting go" or anything like that. Some people are clearly greatly troubled about the thought of such sessions coming to an end. In Ms CBT's own words at some stage I will make her redundant and that is the right way forward.
No.. I came home and gabbled and gabbled and tried to be all logical about the work problems with my soulmate and guzzled about a half a bottle of port as I'd not had any Diazepam since Sat morning.. and then I gabbled some more.. and chilled with the port.. and stopped drinking at about 9pm.. and then as I sobered up from "merry"... I got anxious. I took my sleeper tho and conked out no problems. The blind works.. I woke a bit before the snooze stuff started and Sarah Montaque was in full flight on Radio 4. I got up ok. I'd drunk a pile of water before bed and didn't have a sweat or anything.
However from the moment I got to work, the anx band kicked off. And I kicked myself all day because it was probably the booze that disturbed the process of de-tox and process of de-sensitisation. I had an important meeting; one of the others being a growing friend in business. He's a Samaritan. Deals with some heavy stuff sometimes. He rang me after to see how I was as he could detect that I "wasn't my normal self". He's right!
So I pushed through the day and had a single 2mg of Diaz in the middle of the afternoon. Helped a bit.. but I don't think it does much for the anx band. I maybe wrong.
Also of course there may just as easily be a reaction between alcohol and THIS sleeper. I am a bio chemical process at the end of the day and I'm aware now that certain cocktails don't work for me.
So, we now have to go for another chunk of days without alcohol. Without looking back through this thread I can't remember if I said a fortnight with no booze or a week. I managed 9 nights. 1 glass Sunday, 2 glasses Monday and the other half a bottle last night. Foolish boy.
Of course these slip ups will occur. I must not berate myself or see taking a tablet today for the first time in four days as a failure. It all has to be looked at in a bigger framework.
I'm not keen to go to work tomorrow but if I don't go and be effective we WILL lose all that we've built over many years and that would be a shame.
So... no booze. Push through the anxiety at work. Avoid the ex. Look forward to the distractions of the children visiting in the evenings. Line up the next lot of ironing for Friday night. There's enough in the bank to meet this week's salaries...and if those that say they will pay do.. most for next. (Again though this week a sum of money due and promised that would have offered a week of respite DIDNT turn up. They sent 10% of it despite assurances.) I suppose I must be "glad" that they'd said on Friday it was on its way.. because that helped ease the weekend. But when I saw it was only 10% on Monday morning (Not checking the online banking until 9.30am or so.. and at least I didn't have to cope with disapointment at 6am as I would have done before implementing the business strategies).. I had a pretty good reason to start to feel lousy again. Cashflow problems can be relentless in a recession.
Ahead there's bank holiday Monday and that gives soulmate and I a day to re-group and work out moving forward.
We/I HAVE TO STOP the "what if" part of my head and I must deal with tomorrow and this week before I start worrying about June and July.
And deal with hurdles as I go along. Ms CBT's closing line was.. "Instead of trying to climb a mountain on Friday that would frighten Moses, try to stamp on a mole hill every day".
It would have been good to post another positive thread but this treadmill does of course have its upward path at times. And once again subliminal anxiety or not, I AM RESPONSIBLE for the drinking and the disturbance to my system. I must get on with dealing with it and paid the price with another not very pleasant day. Let us see whatI can do about tomorrow. Good night All. Liam xx
Veronica H
21-05-09, 08:25
Hi Liam
We have all had those one step forward and two back days....things can turn around very quickly for the good though, as you know, so hang in there. You will not drink a half bottle of port again when things get tough, as you now know that there is a high price to pay, so leave it at that. I almost got a tight band myself reading your latest post as there is no getting around the fact that the pressure is on in many areas of your life. These are extaordinary times though in business terms, and you must not let this undermine your sense of achievement in what you have built, or question your ability to do so again. Take it day by day at the moment anxiety buddy.
:bighug1: Veronicax
Hope to-day was better Liam. ? Its not suprising considering the pressures you have ,to sometimes have a little lapse . Sometimes its a case of what ever gets you through the day.Trouble is as we know,moderation is the key,but not before we have learnt the hard way . Dont be so hard on yourself.It will pass as it did before. Have you tried the exercise bike yet? you are doing very well with your diet . Its good to have a treat now and again thou . WW2 documentarys are pretty heavy going at the best of times,it must be difficult to do a job like this when you feel so anxious !! .By the way any one who likes squirrels in my book is a pretty good sort. Sleep well , TGIF TOMMOROW. Luv Sue:hugs:
And another day ends. This one required 3 diazepam to get through... there were of course business hurdles to climb but I'm still standing... and as Veronica says it'll be some time or hopefully not at all until I have a half bottle during a tough time. When will I learn?
No I haven't made it onto the exercise bike yet. There's a surprise. But prompted by Suzy-Sue I'll jump on 2moro and see what happens with the anx band. (Name of a group?) Just a short post tonight to say I'm still banging the drum but it's time for blackout curtains and my bunker. Here though to close is a little cut n paste from an email today from one of my tougher american clients. And as I haven't worked out how to change the colour.. he's going to have to have the last word tonight! LOL "Don't give up now, because I'm telling you that those of us that are left after this mess is over are going to have a good business. But in order not to give up you have to change the attitude from desperate to hopeful. I can guarantee that if you think desperate, you will be desperate. And when you're desperate, you can't accomplish anything. I speak from experience."
freemymind
22-05-09, 01:34
Hi there after reading what you had wrote about cbt i have reffered myself for cbt also as it does sound very posative but in my case im told i have to have a few counciling sessions first, as for the piles man i feel you there as i also had Very internal piles ( they would have got a better view puting camera down my throat ) ...agony for a long time but after starting mirtazapine i started to de-stress and funny enough they started to go away ...apart from one which they removed ..ouch.
thank you for your inspiration and good luck buddy
May 22nd. So here we are on a Friday evening at the start of a bank holiday weekend. I get three days to rest up and try and calm down. Not an easy week but better than others. Despite goofing it up with the Port bottle on Tuesday night. No alcohol since. TEMPTED TONIGHT. Just one glass of Port.. says the demon voice at the back of my mind somewhere. But no. I AM THE ONE WHO CAN AND MUST MAKE THE CHOICES AND I CHOOSE NOT TO TAKE THE PORT.
It’s been a couple of days of trying to get my head a little more optimistic about the business and the future of it all. De-sensitising myself about it will be the next step and not an easy one.
So those readers who are following this tale know that I’ve got the list of “issues” down to 3. It’s another whole week without contact with the ex. That has helped greatly and indeed I’m teaching myself the “Stop it” strategy with her quite well. I can let that happen because if there were any real issues the boys would let me know quick enough. Also it's been good that Ms CBT can make candid comments and suggestions about my ex that my soulmate and partner cannot. By choice; not by restriction. Sometimes such questions can only be raised by an impartial observer.
It also helps youngest who’s bang in the middle of the GCSEs and needs as little stress around him as possible. He came over Wednesday evening for the night as normal but spent so much time on the phone, online and texting his girlfriend that we didn’t actually have our usual hot tub chat but he seems fine. And first girlfriends` are very absorbing concepts!
Two eldest sons came over Thursday for plastic battles and we yacked and yacked and didn’t really focus on the game. Which is all very good. Student son stayed over as he’s still working for me at the studios.
And tomorrow eldest and his girlfriend are coming to stay for the night by their own wish and request. I do a mean mashed potato with egg yolks and chopped lightly fried red onion chunks. I think that’s what draws them!
In reality I know it’s because despite my anxiety and current difficulties this is a house of peace where there are no rows, there is no tension and we just chill and enjoy each others company. There’s a golden rule for Thursdays when plastic battles take place. No family matters, no issues, no problems. Unless there’s something crucial we have to deal with. Otherwise it’s switch off time, strategy of game and an awful lot of banter. Much of the time I stay quiet and just enjoy listening to my two eldest very intelligent sons wind into each other. It’s good therapy and gradually through the evening I can feel the anxiety ebb away.
Sleep is improving although after a fortnight of Zopiclone I seem to be waking a little earlier. Perhaps it’s the lack of physical activity or it's a chemical adjustment. I’m not doing a lot of energy burn in reality. And I ought to make more effort. Banging my fingers on this keyboard cannot possibly be considered exercise. The blackout blind makes a big difference. Although this morning because I woke early I turned the clock and damn it was 5.10am and the chinks along the top were enough to have fooled me that it was later. Somehow though I drifted back but for the wake ups I am winning the battle of “STOP IT” and getting off whatever train track I was just about to ride down.
Tonight is an opportunity to not take a sleeper. I’ve had 10 now. It can hardly be considered a problem but for an addictive mind there’s already a debate going on in my head this evening because I welcome the switch off and am still “scared” of waking and just being awake. On this one it’s hard to follow the strategy of my soulmate and get up and do something or even put on the bedside light and open a readable. Perhaps I’ll try the book again. Give it ten minutes and if not gone off, reach for the latest Dan Brown. Bought it on impulse the other day and then realised I’d already read it two years ago. Pah!
I shall also make an exaggerated effort to REALLY black the window edges with pillow cases and napkins at bedtime tonight. Sounds silly but if it works and I just can’t detect the light, it’ll be as effective as turning the clock to the wall has been. GREAT LITTLE STRATEGY - SO SIMPLE BUT DID THE TRICK. Then if the light thing works and I stay in bed and hopefully asleep until the alarm goes then excellent. Tomorrow I can cut up an old sheet bespoke style and deal with the chinks in an easier manner.
Diazepam intake was up this week after the stupidity of the Port issue. No more than my 3 a day allocation and surprisingly I still haven’t tried one at bedtime to see what the effect is while I try to sleep. However today I had a little respite in business by actually getting some unexpected bank support over a matter. The FIRST for eight months. I don’t think it’s because they’re becoming more flexible. I think it’s because my manager is off sick and there’s another guy covering. Anyway we dealt with a matter effectively and within half an hour I was feeling a little calmer and I had only had 2mg mid morning. Because I’ve known there was a dark cloud on the banking horizon for the last ten days it has clearly contributed to my stress and having resolved it albeit temporarily, I immediately starting to feel the anx slip away. I am therefore sure that what has “got to me” is the struggle to maintain control of the stress and adrenaline these days that I’ve lived with and carried for years.
As a side note for Suzy-Sue I have now peddled the exercise bike during an anx belt moment. Did it help? I don’t know. My legs had so turned to jelly I couldn’t think about anything else but trying to stay upright when I got off!
Back to stress and Adrenaline control. Is it age related as well? Probably. I am not the sprightly mountain goat I used to be. I am quite fed up with it now. And I consider throwing in the towel a fair amount of the time. Which is also an alien thinking process for me in terms of the years I’ve worked for myself. Thirty years now and I know I’ve been in worse situations in the past and with my history, but it is hard to shove it into that sort of perspective when trying to cope with the way I am at present. THAT SENTENCE HAS JUST BEEN RE-WRITTEN because it said “of perspective when trying to cope with the way I am now”. The word NOW had to go because it could suggest an acceptance or a permanence of state. And this is not the way it’s going to be. (Hah.. brave words Liam. Let’s see how you are a week today).
WELCOME FREEMYMIND to the thread and thanks for joining in. I am delighted for you with the decision to explore CBT as an option. I was perhaps more fortunate than many to have “got the point” of CBT right from the start. But I should say that it is not a miracle process. It’s a very good one to be sure and for many people I do so hope it provides answers and also strategies for pitfalls and minefields that may appear in the future enabling us all to cope if we see the road train rushing towards us.. But it is not going to be a success for people wanting to “visit someone and go and get a cure”. The workload has to come from inside you and the desire for change and a will to get out of whatever hole we’re in.
I’ve been listening to Claire Weekes and the concept of “welcoming back” the tension and pressures. “By acceptance I don’t mean putting up with it. I mean utter acceptance, utter surrender, utter resignation to whatever your body cares to bring you. If you do this the flashes of panic will gradually subside and you will be able to sit there if not at peace at least comfortably enough to see the function through.” THAT IS HARD. I’m not saying it’s wrong. I’m saying it’s hard.
But here’s a thing. I’m now going to take the free Claire Weekes downloads available here on the NMP site to work and install them in my computer there. When it “kicks off” I’m going to switch Claire Weekes on and I’m going to listen to what she has to say. Because I just know if I can make it work once I can do it again. And then I can do it again. ”PANIC DOES NOT GROW MORE INTENSE OF ITS OWN ACCORD. YOUR BODY CANNOT PRODUCE INCREASING PANIC UNLESS YOU GIVE IT THE FUEL WITH WHICH TO MAKE PANIC.IT IS YOUR OWN WITHDRAWAL IN FEAR FROM THE FEELING OF PANIC THAT SUPPLIES THE CHEMICAL TO MAKE FURTHER PANIC. YOU BUILD YOUR OWN CRISIS BY WITHDRAWING FROM PANIC IN PANIC”.
There we go Claire. I’ve written it accurately. And for someone who looks at it all in a bio-chemical way DESPITE THE FACT THAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT OUR "FEELINGS” I can hang my hat on her words and give them a better go.
I have produced for work the previously written strategy for dealing with issues and reducing potential stress.
Therefore my strategy for the work arena this week is to make more effort IN the work arena to DEAL WITH THE PANIC AND ANX rather than just the processes of work around it.
By importing Claire to my office I can have immediate access to wise words and the reinforcement of a process and strategy to help me learn and cope on a continuous basis..
THAT is CBT in action. Let’s see how matters are next Friday night. Enough wordage. Thanks for reading me, thanks for the responses and contributions. NMP IS A SUPERB SUPPORT SITE AND A UNIQUE THERAPY IN ITS OWN RIGHT. I only thought of taking Claire Weekes to work purely as a result of writing here this evening. And it’s a positive action decision and it’s made me feel good about it. CHEER UP. Have a great weekend everyone. All congratulations to those who can have just a single tipple or night cap. I wish I had your strength and control. Liam xx
Sunday May 24th. Uggg. Last night I “had” to do a night without a sleeping pill because I didn't Friday as planned. Saturday was a tough day because soulmate had a bad sleep in her own right on Friday with her own issues and I drain her spare strength. I had to make sure I didn't text or call her for the day so she had a chance to re-charge her batteries a bit. Carers need to have breathing space and I clearly need her care. I have to take on board that me "banging on" can get tough on her, especially if I am going over the same old ground. I didn't like it, but it was necessary and fair. Led to a full day of anx belt though which faded a little with the company of the kids through the evening.
With regard to Zopiclone it is hard to work out whether the “anx belt” is part of that or just sits there in its own right. Went to sleep ok ish. Took time. "Daughter" goes to bed like “normal people” as I did at about midnight but eldest tends to stay up late gaming (Probably Pirates) and 3 times I heard him clunking up the stairs or opening and closing the patio door. Last one at 2.45am.. I HAD to look at the clock.
In my light proof, bullet proof bunker I sleep alone of course except when soulmate is here and naturally when she is, there’s no “clunking”. So of course it woke me each time especially my one squeaky stair and then the head kicks in quick with work and other anxieties. Sigh.
Did a fair few work decisions though in the early hours which will make it a tougher week ahead but effort at progress during difficult times. Had a bit of a debate about taking a Zolpidem at 5am but decided it would be best to just bumble through the Sunday with little consequence to anyone else and hopefully sleep easier tonight. Soulmate will be here. I will try and increase physical activity today. It looks to be a beautiful one out there.
Naturally the young people will stay asleep and in bed until midday plus. Especially Mr 3am gamer. So now I have to mince around the house and try not to disturb them. Hah!
Have a good day everyone.
Veronica H
24-05-09, 09:04
:flowers: Thanks for another great post Liam. Claire Weekes is a great help. Dr/Scientist and fellow sufferer, she made sense of this by 'working the problem', and I have absolute faith in her. I suspect that she talks about setback being 'your friend' as she knows that it is very hard, and takes much practice to ignore the instant grip of fear that these chemicals induce, and the powerful urge to find the threat and to run from it.
Yesterday I was out with a friend in her car and she left me for a few moments to collect her dry cleaning. We had been relaxed and happy up to this point, but I instantly remembered when I first became ill on holiday in Cornwall and I honestly felt that I would die on the journey home...6 hours. That was almost a year ago. I often feel a bit uneasy as a passenger even now, despite practice. I had been to the hairdressers the day before and was amazed not to have had a single flash of panic in there. (I had a major attack in the hairdressers after being diagnosed, so again that can be a problem for me)....anyway back at the car and I did something I have not done for a long time...I did not stay in the my seat floating and accepting as Claire recommends but got out of the car and started pacing....yes 'building my own crisis', I was sipping my bottled water and eventually took a Diazipam, and shed a few tears.
My friend understands this illness as she had it herself with post natal depression. I did get back into the car and of course experienced a few flashes but I was more annoyed with myself for taking the meds and not following Claire's method, which has worked well for me in the past.:mad: I did have a good day in the end and even managed a pub lunch...after which I almost nodded off thanks to the Diazipam.
I have Claire with me at all times on my ipod so think it is a great idea to take her to work with you. I am glad that you are feeling a bit better this week Liam and the mash and eggs sounds lovely...:bighug1:
Veronicax
Monday 25th. Well as I wondered (not in the forum) if the anx band would start to drop away at the latter part of Sunday.. as it would be about 20 hours since I put Zopicone into my system after a ten day run, it did. Just dropped away. And it wasn't because soulmate was coming around or kids were here or anything. It's simple now. It's bio-chems just like Claire Weekes says.. but in this case it's a reaction to the withdrawal for me of these sleeping tablets. So... that's proven twice and that's enough evidence for me. I also took only 1 Diaz on Sat and then nothing yesterday. Just thought I'd try and ride through the weekend and that meant I could have ONE SMALL GLASS OF PORT with dinner last night at about 7pm. And then I had a Diaz at midnight bedtime to see what would happen. I slept ok until I woke in the small hours and then a single business matter just kept banging away in my head and I couldn't get off the train. I dozed here and there but each time I became awake again it was there. Just the one thought.
Back to that bit later. Because the blackout strategy for the room is very helpful. Bit daft really because I've got prototype stuff blocking all the light over the top of the curtains where it bleeds through; at present, 3 black T shirts. Does look daft but it works. I can now cut an old sheet and job done!
HOWEVER it makes getting up in the morning not easy. Soulmate agrees! Even with radio 4. It's the fact that it's so dark. And we're going to have to work this out a bit because in warmer weather we're going to need the bedroom door open and the hall has a skylight which the sun blasts through. Great. Cross that bridge later.
Meanwhile I came up with another thought. SORT THE TV OUT SO THE BBC MORNING SHOW POPS ON WITH THE TIMER AND THEN WE HAVE STIMULUS and LIGHT. HAHHAHAHH!
So a bit of manual hunting and then having told the TV it was 2009 and not 2007 and the correct time, we have a good chance of waking with the telly in the morn and we'll set John Humphries on Radio 4 as a contingency 15 mins later just in case I've nupty'd the setup process. This might well do the trick as we usually have the Beeb burbling in the background of tea and makeup. (Hers- not mine). Practical solutions winning through I hope.
A bank holiday Monday gives us the chance as we've taken for years to have a catch up day. Fortunately I was able to contact the person with the issue I'd been struggling with in the early hours and we resolved it in a positive way. I popped a Diaz early in the day to calm myself and found it affective. I believe that when the anx band kicks in from the sleeping tablet withdrawal the Diazepam can't touch the problem. My head is easier but not the physiological so I've learnt you can't chase that bio chem problem/withdrawal away with Diaz.
Therefore I firmly conclude that I must not take more than 1 or 2 consecutive nights of sleeping tablets on the trot because they mess me up. Simple as that. I might relish the disapearance into the world of nod for the respite from the pressure but the consequences just aren't worth it. A bit of research online has shown me there is a concern that Zopiclone has just as diverse an affect on certain people as Zolpidem if taken for more than a few nights. Perhaps it's exagerated because of my current condition. Who knows.
Meanwhile I lined up more business decisions today, sorted the desk and papers and got yet another pair of unpleasant emails written and sent. I honestly can't say whether I can save this ship and the jobs of those that work for me but I THINK I've "bought us" June if we can just keep rowing onwards. It's quite brutal out there for business. I don't see much written on the site from other struggling anxious business people. But I guess they're here too. If not, I wish they could NMP because the hand holding and support is just great!
So with the chemical situation back under control, the booze under control, practical measures to assist the sleeping process, business effort being made, me feeling better than I did 48 hours ago in my body at least meaning I can do my best to be effective in June..
I now have to try and find a strategy for getting off the single thought train when it kicks in. Cos that was not easy this morning. I have this very fond location in Cornwall where I grew up. And I was trying to trace the beachside road from the carpark at the beginning of this sleepy cul de sac of a harbour village, along the front and down the steep slope to the old stone jetty and beach beyond. But I couldn't get beyond the end of the road before my mind shot back to the business issue. I'll have to try that again. OR TURN THE LIGHT ON AND REACH FOR A BOOK INSTEAD OF JUST LYING THERE. Soulmate assures me it doesn't disturb her so I'll try that tonight.
I've also stopped "breathing in blue sky and blowing out clouds". CBT has to be about reinforcement and I'm failing to reinforce and implement some strategies. Remembering that I have no CBT session this week I must remind myself to focus on my "own homework" and continue the Cognative process.
So that'll do for this bank holiday weekend pen work. Lessons have been learnt and actions will be applied. I may have one small glass of port again. Just the one. And I will have a single 2mg of Diaz at bedtime. And I will take one tomorrow morning as a matter of course to try and go to work calmer.
As Scarlet O'Hara said.. "Tomorrow is another day".. and off we go again. I hope everyone had a good bank holiday, charged up batteries and are ready to take one step at a time on the road to recovery. I'm off to email NMP Claire Weekes free downloads address to my work. FIRST JOB OF THE DAY. INSTALL CLAIRE. AND LISTEN WHEN I NEED TO. Anyone got a set of the CDs I can borrow? :-)
Tuesday 26th. BIG UGGG. Last night tried no Diazepam and the 3rd night without Zopiclone. THAT was a big failure. I went to sleep ok but woke about 2 hours later, drifted in and out.. fell asleep and woke IN a virtual panic attack. HOW CAN THAT HAPPEN WHILE YOU'RE ASLEEP? I nearly had to wake soulmate up because it was quite a dreadful experience. I did take 2 Nytol to try a natural remedy but come on! It can't have been them. Then the rest of the night was a complete disaster.
So I guess this is still what happens if you cold turkey the sleepers. I'm bored with writing about them. I stayed at home, operated as much business as I could online and left the business to fend for itself. Soulmate is still there. I took a Diaz to try and calm the system this morning and posted a request on another forum here at NMP to try and track down anyone with experience of going cold turkey off these sleepers. But no response yet sadly. I did wonder about ringing Ms CBT but felt that we're still in bio chem land with the sweats, the bizarre sensations etc. So I left it.
Not sure how to play this tonight. Take a single 7.5mg tablet.. or try and cut one in half and see how that does. I need to sleep, I need to function but I clearly need to wean this out of my body.
Try a Diaz instead again.. or half a sleeper and a diaz. Jeez I don't know. It's 7pm and I'm yawning my head off now. But I better stagger on until midnight. If I nod off earlier I'll make a bigger mess of the body clock.
I do know this.. no amount of CBT strategy was going to help with that feeling at 3am this morning. And I just don't understand where a panic attack comes from when you're asleep. I would say it's the worse one I've had actually. Anyone else WOKEN with one going on? Forgive my ignorance if there's loads of you.. but I'm on unchartered territory here.
So I'm not going to bang on in this forum tonight.. because I do attempt to write with some spirit and gusto for others as well as myself. But at the moment I've got to work this one out from a chemical point of view. If anyone has got any advice.. I'm "listening" and reading! Liam xx
Veronica H
26-05-09, 20:18
:bighug1: So Liam you have experienced the dreaded night time attack. I will be surprised if there is one person out there with panic/anxiety who has not. The night time panic seems more severe because we do not have time to put our coping strategies into practice. We are still half asleep and are just in the middle of it before we know it. Even the great Dr Weekes still had the occasional night time attack. Maybe you were having an anxious dream.
Just to reassure you, I have only had one in two years.
A quote from the great Dr, anxiety buddy...'behind all this nature is waiting to put you to sleep. Sleep is lurking in the background even behind such tension....if sleep does not come tonight it will come tomorrow or the night after it will eventually come. It has been coming nightly to man for thousands of years. This habit is stronger than your power to prevent it'.
I was so upset when I had an attack in the night as I felt that was my safe part of the day, but try not to let it mean too much. You may be on to something with the meds, so I would carry on trying to figure out what is best for you. Thanks for another great post.
Veronicaxx
Two good posts Liam.Was hopeful you would have slept better last night. I really dont think its a good idea to try and sleep without any thing at the moment.Seeing you have not had a sleeper for a few days
I would try half a tab and a diazepam..Diaz is used to withdraw from sleepers so ,you will be on the right track if you intend to stop using them. I had months of waking with panic attacks! can honestly say it wasnt a very pleasant experience.I used to dread bed time and this made it worse.Iwould have an attack about3oclock 5 then 7 ish ,if I went back to sleep id have another. I havnt had one since November:yahoo: If I have an appointment or event,which is out of the ordinary,I still wake up during the night before with anticipatory anxiety,but in all honesty I think you can say that is a normal response,I immediately start deep breathing ,and dont react to the thumping beats, its just anxiety dont give it the fear it craves to survive,it"ll leave like a beast in the night .Imagine its an intruder, pushing its foot through your door.! push it away in your mind dont let it get through, and Slam the door ,close it tight. Your not welcome mate no food tonight. Sounds mad I know but its worked for me ,Could even draw you a photo fit. :wacko: Youll find your way to beat this ,we all have our own way of fighting it off. Its only fear of fear after all. Hope you manage soon to find out the best way to sort your meds, feeling tired definately makes the anx worse, Try sticking to a bedtime routine for a while,until your sleep patterns settle down a bit.Youll probably still have the odd bad night ,but dont we all. Feel free to vent all you like,thats what this site is all about .Hugs Sue:hugs: x
And along comes the A team of Veronica and Suzy-Sue. With Nic's permission WHEN I've sorted myself out I'd be delighted to offer my services of support for others. Thanks guys. I had a Diaz earlier this eve..chilled down and I've taken a whole Zop now so that I go for the night hopefully. Have to get effective at work 2moro. And 2moro I will have a half Zop and a single Diaz in the evening after HOPEFULLY getting through the day with no Diaz. Today we bought a pill cutter.. and I was trying to work out how to use it without my specs on..and nearly sliced myself. There's a blade in there! Derrrr.... So we're set for a chopping session 2moro but no soulmate sadly. I agree with Suzy Sue. We'll work a reduction of the sleepers and utilise the Diaz instead of trying to dump everything at once.
It seems ridiculous that my body can do this with a comparatively short time on chemicals. I don't know if I've already written this at all in this thread but here's a thing. Despite all the years of cannabis, LSD in my late teens, Cocaine in showbiz (THAT could have taken me out it got a hold so fast but I recognised the problem very quickly and get out as fast as I got in) I always shied away from chemicals in the 70s in my teens. Others were taking speed, Barbs.. not for me. never touched Heroin. All seemed too "chemical". At college when the others were crawling around in the grass looking for magic mushrooms I never joined in. There must have been an early sub-conscious awareness that chemicals and I (chemicals and me?) Don't mix.
Sounds daft of course after diving into booze and all the years of cannabis.. but they seemed more natural and less manufactured.. if that makes any sense.
So.. I can go to bed with confidence now as I have a pill and a decision made about a process of reduction in place. I WANT a good day at work tomorrow. Much to do to in order to reduce the underlying anx that played it's part in the initial kick off.
And I must now think of the words written above from V and S. Not be in fear of the fear if it re-appear and chase it out the door. Goodnight all. Liam xx
Sadly at present this CBTthread is drifting towards overcoming the difficulties of meds but I started it.. so I'll finish it. Slept ok last night. No panic attacks and woke at a reasonable hour. I've STILL not got the TV wakeup system going properly for one reason or another. Usually cos I've switched the Sky unit off so theTV comes on but there's nowt there.. not even "Poltegeist". (You have to be a certain age to get that weak joke).
As planned I'll take a half Zop tonight and a single Diaz. See how that does. Work was "ok" today. Coped and got on with it. As I've said enough times in this forum to bore even myself there's no quick fix- CBTor no CBT, to the business problems but the application of strategies still apply.
So tonight we'll settle for a simple meds report and see how that works and whether I'm ok tomorrow. How many of us here feel we work pretty hard at overcoming stuff only to slip back a step here and there.. and when the going gets tougher, find it hard to think we're making progress. Perhaps I should read my own writings from the beginning again and remind myself where I was just a few weeks back. I'm still standing! Good night all. Liam xx
Hi Will
Some great posts, really interesting.
Unfortunately as Claire weeks sates we will have sets backs but don,t think you are back to square one because youre not. We all get these but they show you how far you have come, if that makes sense. It makes you feel as if you have got to go through it all again but you hav'nt, just keep looking forward. I know its hard in your situation but you have made a lot of progress.
Take care
Sharona :yesyes:
Thanks for that Sharona. Always appreciated. I read the above AFTER I'd written the below. Please keep posting guys.. I'm sure it helps others when you contribute your own comments, thoughts, experiences and support. IT CERTAINLY HELPS ME.
*************************************************
So here we are on Thursday evening and last night’s half Zop and Diaz combo did the job. This is good as it’s reducing the amount of sleeper in my system but today hasn’t been a good day in terms of the amount of anx sitting in my system though.
I’m now having a struggle with trying to just “accept” the anxiety feelings and get on with it. It’s hardly surprising because the pressure at work SEEMS relentless and my faith that I’ve always come up with answers is starting to take a fair battering.
We are surrounded by businesses in trouble and I wonder how I can be one of the ones that manage to stay standing when all is said and done. I have colleagues in similar situations and they seem stronger; or they just don’t talk about it as I do. I’m not one for faking it and putting on the “bravado” act or the false front. Perhaps this is a business strategy error.
Soulmate is so good at keeping the spirits up at work. Her significant bout of PND after her first child taught her coping strategies 25 years ago that she still applies to this day and she’s very impressive with her public face. It certainly plays a major part in keeping up staff morale. My staff know I’m not well and that the struggle is getting to me. But it is not easy to float through the place with a big smile on my face when there seems such a storm on the horizon.
HOWEVER this weekend I have entirely to myself. An NMP buddy has sent me CBT for Dummies to read and I have my Claire Weekes to listen to. I’ve also been contacted by a MALE NMP MEMBER of my own age group and I hope we get a chance to chat as he has a regular online chinwag with another anx buddy from NMP. He clearly has a compassionate nature as well as the experience (sadly) of being down this road longer than I and I hope that over the weekend I can get some control.
I’ve got 48 hours where I don’t have to think about or attend to anything or anyone else but me. I have no idea whether for once this will be a good thing or not! I’ve got plenty of domestic and garden stuff I can get on with but then again it won’t matter if I don’t so it doesn’t need to be an issue if neglected for a couple of days. I shall allow myself CHOICE.
I must admit to being a bit “in awe” now of this condition. Especially as I thought I was taking good steps forwards. It is encouraging to see replies posted in the thread reference progress and steps back sometimes before moving forwards again.. however there’s the little head voice that says “Yes.. but….”.
Probably won’t yet read back through the writings as planned. My “decisions” stuff is working in principle, the work strategies, the sleep strategies, all pretty much gamefully stuck with.
But I guess until I come up with some results for work and can FEEL BETTER ABOUT IT I’m going to have to learn to live with this feeling. It is "only" a feeling I sort of know and I’m no worse than last week. I’m not ill or tired (except in my head) so maybe that counts for something.
I hope to goodness I don’t bore you guys out there with the downturn stuff. Writing here at NMP is selfishly important to me now. And it’s value to me has clearly grown as opposed to the original concept of the thread. I was very pleased to have a male response as I was wondering if there were any here. But as a gender we’re not so good at talking openly about our vulnerabilities. It’s not an issue for me though. Probably because I’m far more comfortable with women than men anyway.
So, with some Pirates time ahead now this evening with two sons later, I’ll put away the quill and ink and see what tomorrow brings. Or perhaps more importantly what I take TO and FROM tomorrow. Night all. Liam xx
Veronica H
29-05-09, 12:52
Hi Liam
You are never boring and always give an honest account. We are all here to help each other and share in the highs and lows. Enjoy the weekend.:hugs:
Veronicax
Hi liam
Your anxieties are a normal response to your present situation and as you stated until things improve then more than likely these thoughts will pervade your concious mind when you try and distract yourself. Everything goes round in circles and there will be better times ahead.I understand this may not help you or console you at this moment, but I am sure you have been there before and more than likely everything turned out reasonably ok. You may have to make some soul searching decisions but bear one thing in mind you are not alone in having buisness problems or in the anxiety field.
As far as panic attacks at night, yes I have had them and knowing why you get them in itself is not important, what is important is how you react when you wake. The main thing is not to fear them, they are just a reaction to anxious thinking. You sometimes can recognise that thought that starts the first fear but sometimes it is so fleeting that it is impossible. The main thing is not to add the second fear so adding adrenaline and starting the flight and fight response. The other reason you may be getting them is because of reactive hypoglycaemia. This is not connected with diabetes in any way, it is just your bodies response to a heightened anxiety state. Your body drops its blood sugar to fast and adrenaline is released to stabilise it and that is when the panic attack starts. If one strikes in the future have a walk around the house with purpose as that will calm things. Your mind can only concentrate on one thing at a time so exercise will help. Go down and raid the fridge, nothing to sweet though as that can have a rebound effect a couple of hours later.
The other thing this weekend is to be honest with yourself, there is no way on this earth that you can possibly forget or distract yourself totally from life issues, so dont, let them come and go. This in itself may help the anxiety as fighting thoughts can be destructive. thoughts are feelings. Challenge that negativity with positive thoughts and try and live in the present, try not to second guess future events as you never know what is round the corner. Distraction does help but like medication it is a short term help only. I have learnt that the way to beat anxiety is to live with it, treat it as a friend who is trying to protect you, albeit at times out of place but sometimes a neccesary and essential emotion. Follow Dr Claire Weekes advice and you wont go far wrong, she got it right 30 years ago and her work is still relevent today. I hope this helps but I am sure you probably have worked it all out for yourself.
All the best
Ron
Good evening everyone. It's Friday night and I "survived" another week in the new age trading world. I'd like to start by thanking Ron who is the first male to contribute to this thread. I did wonder and ask if there were any "blokes" reading my words.
And now we have another contributor with words of his own, based I suspect on experiences of a longer time span than mine. How many “anxers” pass through this website, how many heal themselves and move on. How many stay to work support and be there for others I wonder.
Light is beginning to dawn in my head that I may have to work out how I accept this feeling of anxiety as a state or condition. Bit like having a toothache that nags and won’t go away.
Unlike toothache however meds need to be discouraged from my head and I’ve now done two nights of the 50% tab thing combined with a Diaz. I’ve slept for definite for about 5 hours and that seems to be my lot. But I’m still not doing much physically and that of course must mean I’m not as tired as I could be. That said I find the anxiety knocks a fair bit of stuffing out of me but doesn’t seem to make me sleep longer.
I guess one underlying grizzle would be that less sleep means more awake hours and more awake hours means more time to think and more time to be anxious.
Ron has a good point about the anticipating what may be coming along the train track before I either get there or need to. I’ve got a meeting on Monday and I keep having conversations with the person I’m meeting! Ok I used to rehearse in my head of course, collate thoughts and ideas in advance of meetings. Who doesn’t but to be anticipating what may be said is a new thing and obviously an aspect of this condition. So with Ron’s prompt I’m going to try my best to knock that on the head for the weekend.
As he also says you don’t know what is around the corner and the last email of the day was an interesting response to a seed I planted only yesterday so maybe there’s fresh fruit over the horizon after all.
HOWEVER when you’re a pragmatist by nature it’s not easy to switch off the anticipatory thinking process but couple it with a dose of anxiety then it’s not an easy combination! LOL
I wonder how many of us write at the PC with dodgy keyboards and useless mice. The keyboard on this machine has had a useless space bar for about 2 months since I gave it a coffee bath. I completely dismantled it (possibly early in this forum) and cleaned every key and rebuilt it. But it has gradually got worse and this evening I have FINALLY got round to changing it. BLISS. Bit like the dripping tap and the toilet seat. Little jobs that just get left. If I’d changed the keyboard ages ago I could be boring you for twice the length of time because I can “rattle it out” without constantly having to edit space errors! J
So what confessions this week? I’ve not used the cycling machine much. I get bored. And I’ve not listened to Claire Weekes at work. So logic says I should try to listen to our Claire at least WHILE I ride the ex bike. But for the moment I’m allowing myself a half pint of Woodpeckers (keeping that sugar up a bit Ron) and banging away seeing how much I can type with my 3 finger system without actually glancing at the keyboard.
There’s a good CD on in the background that my youngest made for me. It’s one he put together which he called “Karting Cool Down” and it’s a combination of tracks he’s chosen that we play when we come away from the track at the end of race days. It’s a great combination and helps of course with dragging this old Pink Floyd dinosaur into the present century and some new toons.
So back to the “confessions”. I’m not doing very well with the breathing stuff. And yet I know it helps my system. “STOP IT” is going ok as a strategy but “CHEER UP” is proving a bit of a struggle.
There’s a lot to be said for Ron’s comments about my anxiety trying to protect me because yes, I have justifiable reasons to be anxious. Work is poo! There’s a lot at stake, peoples jobs, not just my own. And I KNOW they are all anxious themselves with their own perspectives. It’s fair to say that despite the difficulties I’m facing and my lack of capacity to drive on at full tilt still, I’m still paying my mortgage by the skin of my teeth and as yet despite all the business financial “pain” nothing has crept into my private finance. I’m max’d out credit wise of course but with the support of my working team we’ve been able to plough on and I’ve drawn as little as I could manage with but I have been able to draw it.
Today I met an ex neighbour who’s been made redundant again and you can just see what a dreadful state he’s in. I said the best things I could but I found myself limiting the conversation time wise as best as I could politely because I just wasn’t able to offer any energy to support. Which is selfish and saddening but I’m aware since last weekend of trying not to burden others with my “anx and sadness”. However there’s a comfort here at NMP because fellow members “get it” and understand before we even start to talk about it. If that makes sense.
I don’t regret or feel guilty about not “hanging around” to support the ex neighbour. When I’m able to offer others strength I will.
It’s CBT day on Tuesday. So with avoiding the ex under control, the meds coming under control, sleep at least happening in a form that lasts a while albeit not as long as I’d like to be “away” for, I shall focus on the work stuff and coping with “living with anxiety”.
Half a pint of cider later, and a session of waxing lyrically here on NMP and I’m feeling a little calmer. I’ve just seen Tetley’s in the chat room so I’ll close now and leave you all in peace. I’ve yet to find out whether SHORT POSTS OR LONG POSTS are better. If anyone wants to candidly comment I’d be glad for the feedback! LOL Have a good weekend everyone. Long live NMP. Liam
It’s Saturday 30th May. Nearly two months since I started this thread. I’ve just read a couple of the first posts. I don’t usually like to read “old” writings but it’s interesting to take advantage of a record of events from just two months ago when I developed the condition I shall call “anx”.
So let’s go for some brutal honesty and appraisal.
Health is no longer an issue. 2 stone lighter has helped. YAY ME! At present I’m glugging a beer and I have to make the effort to go eat. But if I were hungry I would and if I was tired I’d sleep.
The ex is the ex. It’s been a GOOD couple of weeks since any particular contact. The family inevitably have to move out of the huge great house I’ve rented for the last 15 years, which she won’t find easy, but it’s time to “move on” and lessen the pressure of those costs. Get through the GCSEs for the youngest and then face the closure of the family home. They know. I know. She knows. The kids know. And the kids are ok with it. Certain reluctance from the eldest but at nearly 22 with a live in girlfriend who’d LIKE her own place – get your finger out lad. It’s just a process we have to go through and for the first time ever probably I don’t feel guilty about it.
I have no intention of letting the ex’s passive aggression guilt control thing get to me ever again. (Well, not too much anyway). She won’t like it. But it’s time to move on and I’ve covered all the bills forever. I don’t envy her the learning curve but I must create the break.
Sleep. NO sleepers last night. Just 4mg of Diaz before kip. (See. the addictive head didn’t even think about trying 2mg). Nodded off ok but it was late. Kipped from 2am to 6am. And then sort of dozed for 45 mins. Ok. I’m going to have to work at accepting that. If I don’t do a lot physically at present then I’m going to sleep less. GET UP LIAM. DO STUFF. Rang soul mate. She’d been up since 6am as well. It’s not easy because sleep and bed is refuge from the poo of thinking but if there’s less hours of it then I shall have to take that on board and it’s better to go to bed later and get up at a sensible time than try to nod off at 11am and wake at 4am. No doubt. Clocks still face the wall. But because soul mate suffers hot flushes as we approach the age of MP I’m going to have to “obsess” less about light levels and leave the bedroom door open a bit and let light intrude because I’m going to boil her as summer comes on. I’ve stopped trying to block all chinks of light as well. Because the blackout blind does the job well enough frankly. Anyway, reduced meds is GREAT and no doubt they played a part in the bio chemical thing I’ve been banging on about. A bit of Diazepam? I’ll live with that for a while. There’s been no tears for a fortnight.
Work I wrote about last night. And today I took time out, read a book, and just thought. It was hot in the conservatory. Popped a fan on. I could hear neighbours children shrieking in a paddling pool. I’ve a meeting on Monday as previously mentioned and it’s “important” because if I can get a result it can sort stuff. I’m rehearsing but today I also started to try and work out what to do and where I could make approaches if it doesn’t pan out. Work and the quantity of it is not an issue. We have lots to do. It’s cash flow that’s still killing me. And threatens the very essence of the business. I’ve always borrowed when needed and indeed speculated for years with bank monies. But I can’t get any. Simple as that. There’s no point in ranting on about banks here. But they have a big part to play in this current credit crisis. My own one included.
So with my 48 hours of no kids and no responsibilities for others what have I done with the time available to me today apart from the conservatory time and thinking? I’ve played my Pirates game a few hours. Which is plain daft sometimes because combat is a stress thing of course. But I like it, I can escape and it DOESN’T MATTER AT THE WEEKEND ON MY TIME.
Got in the fishpond and cleared the filter and some overdose waterweeds. Yuuuch. I had to stop talking to an “anx buddy” on MSN earlier because my hands still niffed so much of uccchy pond gunk. Fish seem to be rushing everythere this evening as a result. Probably because they can see! (Or they’re spawning and my timing was naff in fish world).
I also did another of those “silly little jobs that don’t get done”. The skylight window in the hall seemed broken during the winter. And that meant going to work, getting a ladder, climbing UP said ladder and investigating. A job I’ve put off for about six months. So today I decided to sort it. (Like the tap thing). It only took 15 mins to go get the ladder, install, climb and realise that the skylight window had just stuck. TRA LAHHHH! Result. So now I’ve opened the chimney to the house again at last which is probably wise cos it’s been hot. But I ask you. Another of those little tasks that seems so big when you’ve “lost control”.
While in the conservatory I could hear the throb of Harleys going by sometimes. And I wondered why I wasn’t out riding. But sitting in the sun, and chilling with a book was ok. I had one Diaz early in the day and slowly but surely I’ve chilled through. Each time I wandered off in the thinking and considered the imaginary conversations of failed business talks on Monday I managed to stop myself and get back onto constructive thinking.
I also spent time working on pushing away the “anx band” as soon as I can detect it starting with a sort of imaginary pushing it down and out with my hands (not actually moving) thing.
And here’s a thing. Memory is a wonderful thing when it plays a useful part in reminding you of stuff from the past. I used to have this technique.. don’t know if it’s a Yoga thing or what.. I don’t do Yoga, never have but I kind of categorised it that way long ago. When my skin is cold (started with motorcycling) I used to be able to “push the cold away” from myself. Moving “heat” from my inner self to my outer self. Pah. That doesn’t make sense as a description does it. But I could actually FEEL it happening when I applied the technique. It made for a “blanket” about me and really worked. Ok, naked in the snow it might not but as a principle for feeling too cool at any time it used to be very effective. So I’m going to try and work the same approach with the “anx band” which I have to learn to live with at present.
So what about my CBT? Have I worked daily and fastidiously at processes and tasks for the elimination of anxiety? No. Have I worked daily at breathing and reinforcing a process of trying to calm myself? No.
Do I wish I had for the last two months? Yes.
Somewhere along this thread I said that CBT was not appropriate for anyone hoping to “go and get a cure” by chatting to someone. The work has to come from the inner self. It’s as simple as that. Would I be better if I had applied the processes fastidiously? Yes. (I like that word. Had to go spull check it).
THAT SAID I’m making progress with sleep. I just have to accept that my body seems to need less of it at present or even probably ongoing. But that wouldn’t be an issue if I was “happy” to be awake. Sleep is escape. A sanctuary. A place of refuge. I recognise that for a lot of people here at NMP.
So part of my personal CBT must be to learn to live with the anx and make being awake a happy place to be again. And that means finding extra courage to fight the fight with the worries at work and if I lose it, go down fighting.
But with health sorted, sleep coming under control and acceptance of the new goalposts with the application of CBT techniques, the situation with my ex manageable because of Ms CBT without a doubt then work remains the key problem.
AND TODAY HAS BEEN A DAY FOR ME, a couple of pints of cider and a definite period of increased calm. Tomorrow I must go shop, buy fish food for anxious fish, perhaps even get my backside onto the motorcycle and work at CHEERING UP and finding the strength to get on with the challenges of work.
Because failure, although an option is much worse than the battles gone through in the past and ahead. (In terms of BOTH ANXIETY AND WORK DIFFICULTIES). And therefore strength needs to be found and solutions sort. Both in and out my head. How easy it is to write those words at NMP when the mind is calm and the body under control. It's a different matter at 4am when your mind goes POW! I wonder whether to start a new thread of "live anx" so that I jump online and write here when it actually kicks in?!??! Or indeed whether to include it in this one.
That’ll do for a Saturday night. I STILL can’t get rid of the smell on my hands. A sort of drain thing. Great. Now I can obsess about stinky hands!
Veronica H
30-05-09, 22:39
:flowers: Rub a lemon on your hands anxiety buddy.....cut it in half first.:D
:bighug1:This hug is for coping so well given the challenges you are facing on so many fronts. I hope you get out on the Harley tomorrow.
Veronicax
Hi Liam! Good to hear you have had a good day.Hope the technique works with the anx band. Combined with deep breathing techniques would say has a good chance of at least reducing it. Your anxiety over your buisness problems is understandable ,it not something you can completely switch off from,all you can do is carry on with your strategys and turn the negative thinking into something more optomistic,.Staying positive ,certainly isnt easy ,but it certainly helps.This coming from a person who for years was a pessimist ,isnt written lightly. Like with the breathing techniques it takes lots of practice,in the end it comes naturally. You seem to have dealt somewhat with the sleep probs even tho you arent sleeping for so long at the moment,but its better as you say to go to bed a bit later to avoid waking even earlier,I wont go to bed unless im really tired as it means hours of tossing and turning .and I dont feel anxious in the evening.Got rid of the nightly visits from the garbage truck ages ago. Anyway my friend ,keep on with the way you are going,you certainly are making progress.Tommorows another day ,and the sun is going to shine.Good night ! and sleep well! Sue x Ps long posts or short posts it really dosent mattter ,say what you need to say, Your posts are pleasure to read.:hugs:
Thanks Liam for doing this. I just found this post (while looking for info on GI Diets and Anxiety) and although I have to admit I did not read every page, the pages I did read have been inspiring. I would NEVER get up to do the ironing, read a book. I would just get up and eat something and plonk in front of the tv if i couldn't sleep again, or drink some chamomile tea and relax. So thanks for the ideas (i really need to do the ironing, something I NEVER do).
Have you tried drinking chamomile (camomile as its spelt as well) tea say about 30mins before heading to bed? I find it great to get me to doze off and get me through most of the night. I find am not waking up so often - although still snap waking at 4 in the morning before sleep for 1 or 2 more hours.
I am going to try going to be slightly later, as 22:00 am usually real tired from working all day, and see if that won't push my waking time to a nice 07:00 instead of 5 or 6.
Thanks again
Yay me. Another night without sleepers and only 1 Diaz Sat and 1 Sunday morning. Just to take the edge off the start of the day. Thanks for the lemon tip Veronica. Didn’t have a fresh one but a squirt of Jif saved the day! (And the nose).
I actually went to sleep at about 11.30pm after watching half an hour of Poldark. Big gamble going up at 11pm. Nodded off with the telly on. Realised it, switched off and conked out. I woke at 3.30am. I know because I decided to SEE what the time was. Tutted myself, immediately started a backward count from 400 and did a few deep breaths, focused on shutting thoughts out and concentrated on going back to sleep. It worked! I wasn’t awake long at all. And although I woke a couple of times I got through to about 6.30am. Surprising and also encouraging. I woke pleased with the result. That helped start the day. STILL couldn’t get the TV /Sky thing sorted. The TV started but I’d forgotten to switch it over to the telly channel. What a nupty. I’ll have another try tomorrow.
Wasn’t it a beautiful weekend. I DID get out on the Harley today. Just rode to a few places and round the Forest of Dean. Bought the fish food and prepared my head and speeches for tomorrow’s meeting that could be or may not be a “result”. Working at what Ron said I’m trying not to anticipate stuff. Because that IS an easy trap. He’s so right. How can I know the outcome until afterwards.
Tonight though I shall not hesitate to take a single knock out sleeper tablet as I do not want to wake at 3am worrying about it. Simple decision. One tablet – one night. I’ve changed all my bedding and put out all the pillows for a day’s airing. I slept with the door open and when I woke and the daylight was coming through the gap, I rolled over, faced the blind window and went back to sleep. Telling my head NOT to make it an issue. It worked. It needed to even if it didn’t. Mustn’t boil my soul mate when I’m lucky enough for her to be here.
This weekend with no kid responsibilities has been good for me. Don’t get me wrong; I love them death and would lay down my life like all us parents etc but actually it’s been good to be able to think only about me for a change. And focus on a bit of calming and a few small achievements. I’ve made more effort to eat properly and I truly do take notice of the contributions made here. Thank you Ron.
Saddened to read the thread about the death of Yvonne's Hollie. For most people their pets are special – I suspect even more so for those of us with a condition and Veronica’s loss will be a daily struggle for a little while that I truly hope she can get on top of shortly.
Welcome Wisey to my missives. I’ve had to work at accepting that at my age I’m needing less sleep and that although the refuge of kip is a welcome respite to my stressy days and general anxiety condition at present, because I am being less physically active I’m going to be awake more. So going to bed later is helping and I’ve broken the “Oooh it’s 11pm - I must go to bed” bit. I’ve not tried the Camomile Tea bit. I shall give it a whirl. However I'm a bit of an oldie traditional "English Breakfast" stauch drinker and tea variation beyond Earl Grey has never been enthused about in my head! There’s a lot to be said for staying up until you HAVE to go to bed. And there are those that say TV is not the best occupation prior to sleep. I must admit to using old BBC dramas though as there’s little anxiety or “dramatic” moments in terms of adrenaline. My soul mate uses familiar comedies where she practically knows every line of the script and therefore is never troubled with nodding off during.
The discipline of ironing physically occupies you, your brain is taken up by it but it doesn’t require “thinking”. Other things can’t come in. Does that make sense? There’s also a sense of achievement when the basket is empty. Although I can get fed up with elasticated corner bed sheets!
Reading for me was how I ALWAYS went to sleep for about 20 years. I don’t know when I stopped doing it. Probably as a reaction to the sighing and tut tutting of my ex who didn’t like the light or the sound of turning pages! LOL
So a successful weekend really and another step forward. No miracles but a bit more confidence. Certainly in the meds department as well. It’s June tomorrow and it’ll bring what it’ll bring business challenge wise. I have to find the strength to push it forward as the sanctuary of the house and weekend ends tonight and it’s back to the rowing in the morn.
Good night all and I hope everyone finds ways to cope with the week ahead. I have CBT on Tuesday. Depending on how tomorrow goes and how I FEEL at work will help me decide want I want to work on. The other issues are now just reportage. As Suzy Sue says it’s justified to feel anxious about the situation. It’s that kind of situation! Perhaps if the pile attack hadn’t been so traumatic for me two months ago I wouldn’t be in this position now, but who knows. Whatever.. I am. Acceptance and CHEERING UP is still the plan for the week. Liam xx
It seems that you have had a reasonable weekend and that is due mainly to your resilient personality. I hope today goes well and that you come away from your meeting knowing that anticipatory thoughts just do not help in any way. Anticipatory anxiety gets you to the highest part of the anxiety wave, the actual experience is always better than the anticipation. Its something we all have to learn and living in the now is essential in calming that nervous tension. We must also always give ourselves time to just relax and ground ourselves to reality, something I think you did this weekend Liam and it probably did you the world of good.
Just a little thought about the exercise, certain parties believe that while our bodies are under stress with anxiety that we should not go mad in getting that heart rate up to its maximum for your age which I believe for you is around 150-160 beats per min. This places enormous stress on an already stressed system so they believe that walking is the safest and most effective exercise as it has numerous positive effects such as giving you a safe aerobic workout as well as being relaxing and putting you at one with your surroundings. Take an i pod and listen to some relaxing music or even DR Claire Weekes.
Sleep wise though I would not concern yourself to much as that is very normal to wake up a few times in the night as we get older. Sometimes for us men it may be linked with our prostate so making us get up for a wee but my sleep pattern is very similar to what you have described. I always put a comedy CD on when settiling down and I am asleep in minutes, so I think your soul mate is spot on with that advice.
I wish you well and I hope you have a good week.
Ron
Monday 1st June. Well.. a single tablet of Zolpidem knocked me out for sure. I didn’t wake at all except when soul mate went for a wee and then I conked out again. There was no thinking about today’s meeting. I was in Never Never land. And AGAIN the TV thing failed to come on. But I’ve worked out why. Sky was set for “If inactive switch off”. So I’ve re-set that little sucker and tomorrow should be a successful waking to the BBC!
Today’s meeting went ok. It was a day of reasonable anxiety because it was important in terms of getting us out the poo if it the other party went for the deal. Or at least for a while. It’s hard to guess which way the decision will go but as Ron wisely said “Don’t try and anticipate the outcome or the future”. Helpfully the other side said they’d let me know tomorrow so without hesitation I’m having another Zolpidem at midnight because I don’t want to wake up thinking about it. I’ll get the answer tomorrow as promised and if it’s a yeah then tomorrow’s posting will be great. If it’s a no then we’ll fight on. But I’ll also stay off the pills tomorrow night. Interestingly only one Diaz today.
I shall go to CBT anyway tomorrow and report accordingly. With lovely weather I hope to ride over. And there’s an oxygen blast. The web was down at work today and that’s almost a case of anx in it’s own right for all the team. No research, no verification of facts for writers. No email except filtering through my blackberry thing. Ugg. But I have a friend at work on the security desk and he rang just now to say it’s been sorted this evening. So one less thing to worry about.
Short post today as my mind has been pretty much wrapped around the meeting. I had an MSN chat with Ronski about an hour before the meeting and his wordage helped. I KNEW that whatever the employees and partner were thinking that I HAD ANX BUDDIES WILLING ME ON and for a sole fish in a big sea that did me a lot of good. I kept the meeting to a minimum chat, laid out the data, did a pretty good job of presenting a no frills situ and what will be will be.
Thanks Ronski. I’ve had a couple of brandy and cokes tonight. Chilled down and chatted contingency with soulmate. It wouldn’t be the end of the world with the back up plan. Not brilliant but there is one formulating. And that helps a great deal.
Dinner now and at 9pm just one more small brandy and coke. And then no alcohol after 9.30. Sleepy tablet at midnight. BIT of a gamble but I should be ok.
If I goofed up, I’ll let you know 2moro. All the best.. Liam xx
Hi Liam
I hope the CBT goes well today and that your motorcycle trip refreshes you with that extra blast of oxygen. I hope you get the response that you want from your meeting as that would help enormously with your anxieties. Whatever the result though we are all here supporting you.
Ron
Hey ho Tuesday 2nd people. So the knock out Zolpidem (subjected to a bit of alcohol) had me awake by 4am.. but I dozed and napped and thought and drifted and it wasn't too bad. Had hoped to hear a result from the meeting of yesterday but to cut a longish day short I didn't. I did go to CBT and I rode there. It was good to get out but I'm aware that too much absence is making my staff a little nervous. However there's no deluding them that it's very tough and I'm fighting the biggest challenges of our time together. The month of May ended and again everyone was paid. That has to be considered a result. We are still standing. So I have to just leave them to get on with their own anxious thoughts until either the ship capsizes or I come up with an answer and save the day. Everyone is working very hard and although I'm grateful I'm also aware frankly that they are doing their best to protect their OWN worlds as best they can. With the effort I'm making and the stress it causes me I cannot afford to add too much guilt to my feelings.
There are smatterings of light on the horizon. I can feel it. Can't explain it, there's no new sales or deals being done at the moment and there's still the most dreadful of cashflow problems but one way or another I've got this week's bills sorted and possibly next even if nothing comes in. Tomorrow my programme distributor wants to talk to me and he says he has good news. That will either mean some money has arrived or he's done another deal or something. And MAYBE tomorrow, yesterday's meeting will bear it's fruit. I shall do my best to look forward to tomorrow.
Thanks Ronski for the posting above. For me to know that I have anx buddies here is truly a support. I pop onto NMP a few times a day, my soul is pleased to see that we now have a high number of viewings for this thread and increased contribution from others.
So what about today's session of CBT? Have I missed not going for a fortnight? Not really. I also haven't booked another session. The key elements laid in the early meetings have been applied in the areas that needed them. Sleep, Family and work. I KNOW EXACTLY WHAT TO DO AT NIGHT TIME BECAUSE OF THE APPLICATION OF MY CBT STRATEGIES. "All" I have to do is keep reinforcing them.
I have decided it's ok to be anxious about the work situation. Errrr.. who wouldn't be. The problem comes when it gets out of control and that is what has happened to me. However, slowly but surely over the last couple of days after a weekend where I managed to calm myself a little I have been more effective at work and even though I'm not smashing away at 16 hour days fighting the good fight, I've only got to get a single result from the seeds planted and we could be plain sailing again. Well, at least a little bit. There's discomfort on the horizon if the company folds, there's messy processes to go through but it's just processes and applications. Here's a little cut n paste from an email sent by someone who's worked with me in business for about 15 years and he's retired now. Lucky man in ways. Got out with enough before the proverbial hit the fan. "But one way or another, I have a hunch you'll pull something out of the hat. You're a surviver."
As mentioned several times over the last couple of months, I do not allow myself the arrogance of assuming I will just come up with the answers out of thin air. But it's good to read an email from someone with many years of working with me writing such a thing. He was never a kidder and he's not written it to just make me feel good.
As I write this, I'm enjoying a pint of cider. Soulmate is hammering herself in the power shower and we'll eat soon and watch a movie. No more talk tonight about "what ifs" and contingencies.
I owe yet another thank you to Ronski actually for helping me nudge back to food. His reference to adrenaline and lack of eating was reinforced by soulmate and therefore I've making more effort. It's a while frankly since I went and shopped properly for anything more than some essentials so I will try tomorrow to do a better job and at least get the freezer topped up again with stuff of substance.
It's so easy to let yourself go isn't it? It takes effort and willpower when in fact just going to bed, shutting the curtains, the front door and turning off the lights seem such a safe place to go to.
But it won't all go away will it. And if you do nothing about everything inevitably it must come on down around you.
I'll settle for reminding myself of that and make this a short posting. The weather has been beautiful. The squirell is now driving me nuts and he's winning the war by trashing every food hanger out there. We will have to have words. And while watching him foraging below a bird table last night suddenly a territorial rat shot out and took a bite at him. Great. Now I have a rat. And that noddy stuff they sell in garden centres really doesn't have much effect when a new family moves in. Charlie Dymock and co have a lot to answer for with encouragement of decking! ;-) Liam xx
Veronica H
02-06-09, 23:06
Hi Liam:flowers:
I think you are proving everyday that you are a survivor. It must be doubly hard when your staff are looking to you for reassurance, to keep a lid on your anxiety. I am glad that you are taking the time to relax with the soulmate. If anyone deserves a positive outcome tomorrow it has to be you as you have not shut the door and climbed into bed. You have 'worked the problem' and have been an inspiration to many of us. Having taken Ron's advice about your diet...please tell me that you are still allowed to slowly melt a square of dairy milk on the roof of your mouth as you do your ironing, I thought that was such a lovely image.
nite anxiety buddy and good luck tomorrow:bighug1: Veronicax
Hope today brings you the good news you are waiting for Liam.It would make time for you to have a weekend to relax and recharge your batteries . Its difficult for someone who lives most of their time alone to think of food when faced with anxieties that supress the appetite. Hopefully you acknowledge the importance of a good diet now thanks to Ron .Eating slow release carbs such as :wholegrain crackers,bread,whole grain pasta.wild rice, Oats ,and fresh fruit,keep the blood sugar levels more stable and you dont feel sluggish like you do when eating fast release carbs such as white bread cakes ,sweets and biscuits etc.A small snack before bed of the above slow release carbs will help with the sleep probs/anx. You have done and continue to do everything you can to keep things at work ticking over.Im sure your coleagues appreciate that and know you are doing your very best. The good thing about Rain is ,it eventually stops.! Leaving I hope !sunnier days ahead. Stay optimistic my friend Iv'e a good feeling :winks: . luv Sue x:hugs:
Wednesday 3rd. I so wish it was Friday 5th. Because then I could have the sanctuary of the house for some switch off time. That was a tough day. The hoped for business deal didn’t come off. But there are no angels of mercy or sudden cures to the difficulties we face in trading at this time. There was one bit of a business result that produces money in October which is good but I’d trade half of it for money now. The same party wants to suggest greater co-operation and a closer relationship later in the year. There’s a lot of businesses trying to team up with each other in order to stay alive. It’s hard to think of the future though when the present is so difficult.
I battered on and on through the day, trying different companies for different ideas. There’s another important meeting scheduled for Friday and I’ve got to appear calm and in control and show no anxiety when this visitor comes.
Youngest has just come over to stay for the night after visiting his girlfriend. He knows that business is in trouble of course and he’s suggested that we pull out of karting, sell the rig and van and use the money to help keep the business alive.
He’s right of course. It’s a bit of a tragedy for us both because we loved it, have missed it but he wisely gave it up for the exam period and he knows there’s no quick fix and that it’s wrong to be thinking about people losing jobs in a month and we’re off racing around a track. So it’s a good gesture from my youngest who is showing wisdom and maturity beyond his years. I’m glad for that and his suggestion. I got a big hug and I don’t feel guilty. (Much).
Managed to make myself eat. Not easy. Read the wise words written above and saw it through. Difficult call in the meds department tonight because I want to sleep and not wake. I had a half a tablet last night and woke at 3am. Which is what probably would have happened if I hadn’t have had one at all. Yawning my head off now; I suspect that’s a stress thing but I’m going to bed in a minute and I’ll have a go without a pill and hope that I’m tired enough to see it through. Gotta watch that proven bio chem problem and try not to take too many of them on the trot. Perhaps a single Diaz. Only had 2 today.
So a short posting, without much joy. Tomorrow I fight the fight for another day. I so very much hope I don’t have to fight the night. Liam xx
Feeling upset at the moment :weep: ,so a short post.Just a few words to wish you luck with your meeting tommorow.Your son sounds like a very mature young man,and a credit to you.Hope it doesnt come down to that thou! Thinking of you luv Sue x
Veronica H
04-06-09, 23:31
Hi Liam
I hope you managed to get some sleep last night in preparation for today. I have been sending positive vibes, so I hope they are getting through. That was a lovely gesture from your youngest and you got a hug as well! :bighug1:
Veronicax
Veronica H
04-06-09, 23:33
:bighug1: A hug for Suzy-Sue, I hope you are feeling better now.
Veronicax
Hi Liam and the weekend is nearly here, so a time for relaxation not brow beating yourself in what might have been. Remember live in the now, we anxiety sufferes tend to use castrophic thought process. we must take note of this and put it behind us as it is not helpful in any way. Try and chill and just enjoy the moment. Your son obviously understands the pressure that you are under and you must be very proud of him. With that support you will do well.
All the best
Ron
Isn’t a shame how easy it is to drop all the strategies when you slide back onto the skids?
With “stressy important” meetings early in the week which perhaps offered opportunities to get the business out of the mess, I took 4 nights of sleepers instead of the planned two as reported above so I wouldn’t spend half the nights tossing, turning and thinking about the same stuff over and over. Which then meant come Thursday I had to take none resulting in all the bio chem. reaction thing to go through again for 48 hours. . And because I’d taken my ration of 3 x 2mg of Diaz during each day there wasn’t allowance to pop one of them at night time. However I started Thursday night in the HOPE that it will have calmed by this evening and I have a better chance this Saturday. So the last couple of days and nights have been ‘orrible.
But none of the meetings produced results and it now looks as if I’m going to lose the business and next week tell all the staff it’s “all over”. So that doesn’t make for a pleasant weekend as soulmate and I will lose everything we’ve built and I have to make other people stressed and I will of course feel bad and guilty.
I was tired last night and went too bed to early, nodding off about 11.30 which meant I woke at 3 and that was it. So I put on the last DVDs of Poldark, read book, tried to go back to sleep, forgot the CBT bit about if you haven’t in ten minutes get up.
No. I’d pulled down the blinds, closed the curtains, dealt with the chinks of light, blocked everything that could intrude and just stayed in bed watching Poldark until the end in a totally dark room until 11.30am this morning. 12 hours in bed. Couldn’t see any point in getting up. Piddling it down with rain. And I just didn’t want to leave the quiet dark place at all while I did the cold sweats and the anxiety thing for hours.
I know I should have got up, baked bread, cleaned house, (run out of ironing). Anything. But today I just couldn’t. I didn’t and haven’t called soulmate cos I don’t want to add to her current distress when I’ve got nothing positive to say. So I texted I was ok and that I’d not ring.
Eventually forced some food down my throat, got dressed, went to feed the fish and the birds. I haven’t even been using the hot tub. And that used to be an auto pilot process that was so good for me. So at least today in between showers of rain, I emptied it and changed the water. I hope to get in it again tonight.
There’s bread baking in the kitchen.
It’s now 4.20pm and I’m writing this with the curtains closed in the lounge, (more darkness please) yawning away, music on and I’ve had 2 Diaz today. The anx band is beginning to fade and I’m going to see if there’s chips in the freezer for later. Sadly no chocolate here but I don’t want to go out shopping.
And ridiculous as it sounds I want a sleeping tablet tonight so I can have the “switch off”. I can’t but it doesn’t stop me wanting the escape. There’s a half bottle of red wine. Perhaps I can sup that after 6pm.
I’ve now lost over 2.25 stone, as appetite has taken a kicking but at least I did remember Ron’s advice at about 5am this morning, went to the fridge and stuffed some fruit juice down my throat.
I keep looking at the clock every ten minutes or so and thinking I should do things but then again WHY? The debate in my head swings two ways. The WHY BOTHER debate which is negative thinking and the WHY DO ANYTHING when it’s Saturday and I don’t have to answer to anyone for anything and if I want to just doss for the day I can. Which is less negative but not so positive really. Does that make sense?
I’m trying to encourage myself to go to work tomorrow and start to write down what we have to do to try and salvage anything out of the mess, work out how we earn a living and pay the bills to live. At least on a Sunday no tax office or VAT office or creditor is going to telephone me so I can put on music and work through stuff. Gotta get there tho. It’s only a mile from the house but a mile is a million sometimes.
And of course while lying in the dark SOMETIMES I think of something useful to do but the simple truth is that I’ve run out of significant ideas. It’s now moved on you see from being just a cashflow problem. As others have THEIR cashflow crisis (big AND little businesses) so the work is starting to dry up. We’ve ALWAYS had loads to do but it’s actually running out. And the jobs that are left are gradually getting to be less and less income and certainly less and less profit. Then I have something ‘orrible called personal guarantees which means that if equipment is re-possessed because of failure to pay the instalments, they sell it “garage sale” figures and come to me personally for the difference. So you have to try and negotiate terms and deals which means you increase the amount you need to earn and so on and so on. Like many, my house is in a negative equity situation, and in order to stagger on with the business every credit card is max’d out, overdraft at its limit and no corners to turn and find something.
So it’s hardly surprising I like the dark this weekend and I’m not exactly writing “inspiring” or “gee us all up” wordage. I ask you who are reading this to forgive me this bout of negativity and allow me just to pour the above out. I went and had a look at the chatroom just now but decided not to step in. Sometimes it’s nice to go in and try and make people laugh and contribute to good feelings conversation. But if I’m in a downer I don’t want to drag that feeling in there. You get SUCH a warm welcome there though even when I say “I just want to sit in the corner, be quiet and read other peoples stuff” and that’s ok.
However I’ve just seen that Tetley is on the site, and she’s playing a game. So I think I’ll go check the game bit out as I haven’t looked at that yet. Unlike Pirates I bet there’s no combative adrenaline, anx creating stuff there knowing the wisdom of Nic’s NMP site. Unless Scrabble can become a pressure!
Just to end the day on a lighter note (I had a good MSN chat with an NMP buddy).. after biting my nails my entire life.. I'm amazed that having reached the age of 51 and an anxiety issue how much more you can find to chew on! My fingers look 'orrible! Good night all.... have a good saturday night and I wish everyone the pleasure and release of undisturbed sleep. Liam xx
Was saddened to read your last posts Liam. Im so sorry you didnt get the results you were so hoping for.I cant offer much support in the buisness sense ,but Im sure as you always do ,youll do your utmost to survive, in one way or another.Dragging a heavy weight of guilt at this time would be of no benefit to your state of mind or change things for the good in others.Your doing your best and thats all you can do.No need for the guilt trip.Tommorows another day ,and who knows what next week will bring.When youve sorted out your stuff at work tommorow,Stop off at the shops and buy yourself some choclate, stick it in the fridge .Sometimes its ok to have a day to do what you want ,& not do what you dont want to .Its called a day off ,people do it all the time ,but sitting in the dark brings thoughts of depression to my mind ,and you dont want to go there my friend. :scared15: You will need to stick to your srategys that have got you through these past weeks ,you have support ,but you need to look after yourself as well. I hope you sleep better tonight with , a well deserved sleeper! we are here when you need us .Luv Sue:bighug1: xx
Morning Liam
You must never worry about pouring out your negative stuff on here, that's what this site is for - to air our problems, and release the stresses in our lives by way of words.
Right, well you have every reason to feel low so don't beat yourself up for having curtains closed etc. One day is fine, but you mustn't let that become a habit. You have given in to the desire of wanting to shut out the world but it's important then to re-enter.
Do you have financial advisors? Of course you do, a business like yours would have. Now, forgive me if I have missed anything in your previous posts because I haven't been on the forum much recently.
You have an enormous burden on your shoulders to carry, so, at this time, there is no need to feel any guilt about taking diazepam. Also, I would say that if you need the knock out drop sleepers from the gp then take the darn things.
Sleep is very important as we all know - the brain won't function well without it. My shrink gave me quetiepine when I couldn't sleep - now you can't get a much stronger med than that for shutting down the brain lol!
Liam, what you're going through with the business is very distressing, the sort of stuff that makes the strongest of men crumble. You are coping that's the main thing, not as you would wish to cope of course, but you are coping - give yourself a pat on the back for that.
Now, you are going to need therapist big time and I personally would increase the visits to twice a week, if you can afford of course. Legal advice, your accountant etc..... teaching my granny to suck eggs here is silly because I know you would have legal advisors etc to hand.
Will you end up in a high rise council block Liam? Yes, rather scathing of me I know to take this attitude, but what I'm asking really is; "what's the worst scenario?". I know you are not a materialistic man deep down, so I'm not having a go at you mate.
It's heart breaking because you are a self made man who has excelled in your business and all the wonderful things you have around you are well deserved because you have worked so hard at being successful. Liam, you will rise again my friend I just know you will.
Keep writing on here, you will get support and positive ideas from people, you've given us pleasure from your brilliant posts and people will help you.
You take the greatest care - and today get out even if it's for half an hour. The rain is drizzling I know but not unpleasant. So glad you fed the birds etc. I do that too, must look after our winged friends.
xxxxxx
Veronica H
07-06-09, 12:02
Hi Liam
I agree with all of the above from Suzy and Yvonne. Guilt has to be put away, and bring out the sleepers and the chocolate if and when required. I am saddened that this global financial meltdown can undo all of your hard work so rapidly, and I know you are going to have some major firefighting on your hands over the next months. Take care of yourself and I know that you and the soulmate will find a way through.:bighug1:
love and best wishes
Veronicax
Hey ho there supportive friends of above. Not doing too bad in the guilt department but plenty of anxiety on how to go forward. Soulmate arrives in 3 hours so that will be good. We must do our best to not get anxious with each other and tommorow I have cancelled filming and have a meeting with all staff at 1000am. FORTUNATELY I pay weekly.. never got into the habit of owing them for a month. Better policy with a smaller business so if they choose they can all leave tomorrow and then on Friday they will be paid for last week's work. It's beyond that I have no answers yet and the tax man and the vat man and creditors cometh. There has to come a moment when you recognise the plughole.. and I've reached that time. It's been a hell of a lot of pressure for the last eight months.. and although I can rally my head sometimes it gets harder and harder.
I took no sleeper last night.. I tried 6mg of Diaz instead. And in fairness seemed to kip longer and returned to sleep easier after wakeups at 3am, 5am and 5.45am. So having not taken a sleeper for 3 nights at least I can have ONE tonight so that I am rested as best possible for 2moro.
This thread was supposed to focus on CBT and it's applications as I realised that access to the therapy was not easy or quick on the NHS and plenty of people would struggle to pay for it. Me included. Thanks to an ever stretched collection of credit cards I got on with it tho.
But at present no amount of CBT will come up with the answers to deal with the business problems and I'm wary that this thread is becoming a bit of a "blog" about where "I'm at".. and I'm not sure if Nic and NMP are ok with me "letting off the steam" in this way. I shall attempt to keep focused on the application of CBT strategies as part of the writing but I will cut n paste this one to Nic to make sure it's alright with her for me to continue.
Last night I quizzed in the chatroom for the first time and the hour of shutdown was excellent for me. So I shall go for five days of work pressure and look forward to the weekend, the time off, some chocolate, a BIT of wine, the chat room, the quiz and try not to just write "blahhhh" about business when I post this week. All the best to everyone. Liam xx
Hi Liam
Good Luck for tommorow
Sharona
:bighug1: :bighug1: :bighug1: :bighug1: :bighug1: :bighug1:
Hi Liam
It was a much more positive post - the brain is working well.
Good luck with the meeting. As you said, you will explain to the employees exactly where it's all at with the business and it's up to them what they do. I think that's the only way to deal with it.
You are so right with the cbt stuff, no amount of thinking strategies can help in these sort of circumstances, and that was always my argument against wonderful (not) cbt. Cbt cannot change reality.
I'm glad you slept better on the 6mg Diazepam, that was rather a lot! 4 would have helped. The waking in the night is part and parcel of all this stress and anxiety lark. As long as you go back to sleep after you have woken then to me that's okay. I am naughty because when I wake in the early hours I come down for a wee and a ciggie! However, always to back to sleep.
Once again good luck for today and I think you are admirable to be coping as well as you are.
nomorepanic
08-06-09, 11:57
But at present no amount of CBT will come up with the answers to deal with the business problems and I'm wary that this thread is becoming a bit of a "blog" about where "I'm at".. and I'm not sure if Nic and NMP are ok with me "letting off the steam" in this way. I shall attempt to keep focused on the application of CBT strategies as part of the writing but I will cut n paste this one to Nic to make sure it's alright with her for me to continue.
Last night I quizzed in the chatroom for the first time and the hour of shutdown was excellent for me. So I shall go for five days of work pressure and look forward to the weekend, the time off, some chocolate, a BIT of wine, the chat room, the quiz and try not to just write "blahhhh" about business when I post this week. All the best to everyone. Liam xx
Liam
We do not mind what you post on here so please don't worry about that so feel free to go "off topic" if you want to or need to.
It was lovely to see you in the quiz as well :hugs:
Tuesday 9th June. Uggg... It was 'orrible telling everyone they were out of a job yesterday. As said before, their worlds are their worlds and it's all relative. I asked them to come back as freelancers on poo money if they could and after chatting with each of them one at a time, sent them all home. I think they went and had lunch together and worked at feeling better. Only one didn't come back today but it's hard to create a good atmosphere and try and inject any vitality for them. Soulmate desperately upset and when we got home last night (The day finally ended) I drank a half bottle of port and made myself all brave again. It's a short release tho and as previous was not a good idea.
Conked out at 11.45 and woke with a vengeance at 2.18am and that was it. Took a Sleeper at 4am and finally went out. Worried that I'd be loused up for the day as I still got up at 7am but despite a little groggy to start with not so bad. Had to fight a couple of fires on the telephone but surprisingly took no Diaz today. Must however remember to re-new my prescription tomorrow. Really wouldn't want to run out.
Two very experienced business colleagues came over today seperately. And both gave me valuable pointers. They've both been in this position.. all the staff, massive overhead etc.. lost it all in the past. There's a lot to be said for throwing in a towel and "starting again". Just waves of discomfort to ride as the "establishment" seeks it's pound of flesh but what aint there aint there.
I need to see that and see if I can find strength in it. It's very interesting (not) but I promised to revert to CBT when I could.. to hear myself trying to kick in a strategy about closing out thoughts when they can serve no purpose if they are negative in the early hours of the morning. I wonder if you guys out there find the SAME THING GOES ROUND AND ROUND and almost in the same manner. Once you've peeled the potato there's nothing to be gained by peeling it again.. but it doesn't stop the merry go.
So.. It's now Tuesday and the staff are part time this week. One very loyal person is still coming in tomorrow so it's just her, me and soulmate at work for the next two days. That could be kinda good. Just get my head together and focus on some practical stuff as well as learn a bit about company liquidation etc.
No chocolate in the house but will probably take a sleeper at a sensible time and try and have a tub before bed. If I wake I must try to read. And then read. And then read some more.
Not much to post really.. as I don't want to turn this into a business forum. Blessings for all good comments from those above and see you all soon. Or later if I have anything useful to say. Liam xx
Liam I am so sorry it all ended like this, but take some consolation that you arnt the first and you definately wont be the last facing liquidation. It is not your fault, it is the economy that is driving firms like yours out of buisness.But I know this probably dosent help at a time like this especially now that the establishment will get involved. This may seem like a dark tunnel but in the future there will be better times for you and your soulmate. You will look back yes with regret, but it will make you stronger people and when the economic recovery really kicks off you may reopen a buisness again.
Yes I can recognise those thought going round and round, and whatever you do it wont stop. All I can say is just go with them and time will sort it out. This may help with the nervous tension as fighting them when all of us would be doing the same because what is happening in your mindset is absolutely normal under the circumstances. The only thing that may help is a good walk in the countryside and really get tired so that sleep comes naturally.
Instead of relying on the diazepam have a chat with your doctor as Betablockers may be more effective with less side effects on calming the adrenaline surge from the stress that you are under, or there may be better drugs to have long term untill you get out of the stress that you are under.
Remember we are here anytime you want to chat or just let off steam.
All the best and I wish i could do more to help you Liam
Ron
Veronica H
10-06-09, 14:10
:bighug1: Hi Liam. I agree with Ronski that it might be a good idea to ask about Betablockers. They were a great help to me in the early days. :bighug1: Hug for the soulmate too. Take care and you know we are still reading and ready to give support where we can.
Veronicax
Sending you and soul mate lots of supportive hugs:hugs: .Mondays task must have been the worst stinky job of the week. You will feel anxious and you probably wont sleep well,its like all your nightmares rolled into one ,as you rid yourself of one thought ,another will jump in its place... We have all been there for some reason or another. When all is done that can be done ,I truly think you will feel some sort of relief! Sad !:weep: but relieved that its all over and you can do no more.Every day you hear of more buisnesses failing because of the situation we have at the moment.When things change,you will Im sure be back. Soul mate by your side and stronger by the journey.As Ron says ,I wish I could do something more to help you .Try to find small parts of the day to rest your tired mind .You Know what helps ,.Your facing your fears each day and you live to tell the tale.Well done and all the best luv Sue:bighug1: X
Oh Liam
So so sorry. All these weeks of anxiety at the prospect that this was inevitable and now it's happened. You have dealt with it, I think you're marvellous to have handled the meeting with employees and then to speak to them one to one. You're a very strong man you know.
Do you feel any comfort at all that it is now over, can you breathe a sigh of relief that you have dealt with it and now you will work towards tidying up the loose ends and getting debts sorted? Iknow nothing about procedures regarding businesses going under. Thank god you have some friends who you can turn to for professional advice and also support I'm sure.
The thoughts, oh those thoughts. Little demons, won't leave you alone until they have you feeling dreadful - to distract away from them at the moment I feel would be impossible. So, you must let them come and let them do their worst as Claire Weekes would say. These thoughts will bring out every emotion in you and you must let those emotions come.
Will you declare yourself bankrupt Liam? Is that the way to go? I know a lot of businesses do it to get themselves out of these situations. But, as I said, I know nothing.
I disagree about the beta blockers - they are really to slow down the heart, yes they do slow down the flow of adreneline but not for you I don't think. You don't take heavy dosages of diazepam and you can go without it so I would stick with it mate. You use your sleepers to help get your rest and if you have to have a couple of glasses of the queer stuff I say go for it. It's no time to start worrying about abusing your body with a few glasses of port and one or two valium a day, you need to repair yourself now. Lots of people won't agree with me on this. I don't believe in suffering to limits we can't tolerate.
You will rise again Liam, that I do know. You are far too intelligent and gifted to not try again.
Good luck mate and keep writing. xx
Thursday 11th June. Time I posted in order to bring those kind enough to be following and contributing to this thread up to date. It’s been a long, sad, anxious and frightening week. The days are not good and the nights are possibly worse in ways. Last night I just lay there until 2.30am alternatively watching “The Onedin Line” and reading, but every time I tried to put my head on the pillow it would all kick off again. Round and round. Trying every method known to my limited brain wouldn’t eliminate the thoughts. Finally gave into a Zop tablet and dozed off about 3am and woke with a vengeance at 4.30am and that was it for the night.
It’s not a case of me trying not to take the tablets despite the fact that they have given me problems. I would REALLY LIKE TO BE ASLEEP. But if a tablet only works for about 2 hours….
Today I went to the doctor, and I’ve been prescribed some Temazepam to see if that helps me sleep. WE shall see. Must not make cocktails though.
Work we battle away at as we learn fast about liquidation, bankruptcy (Yes probably inevitable) and the destruction of everything built. When you’ve had 10 staff a place is a big empty space when all are gone. And there’s so much to sort that it all seems mountainous still. Soulmate is reaching end of her tether with the pressure and although she’s ok with me I can see she’s feeling the strain. I’m not blamed – it’s just exreme pressure. All those years together and building this machine to be threatened with the loss of working together is a horrendously worse thought than the loss of the business if that makes sense. The rest is just “stuff”.
Beta blockers don’t seem appropriate for me. I hope that these new sleepers will give me a break and that I can keep things under control with Diazepam. I’m getting a new anx sign tho and it’s where my tongue seems to stick to the roof of my mouth and I slur slightly. Not a good sign. Especially when I have to sound fluid and under control.
So another “not very good” report. But I thought better to post than disappear. Thanks to all those above and the support, wishes and advice you offer me. There are of course many people facing these problems but in one’s own selfish world they are still big problems.
It’s hard to think Claire Weekes when the fight is real and feels so threatening beyond the coping with adrenaline and anx.
Veronica H
12-06-09, 13:30
Hi Liam
The dry mouth is a very common symptom with anxiety. keep some water with you. You are no doubt slurring because you are so tired. I hope the new Meds sort the sleep problems out for you. Love and hugs to you and the soulmate.:bighug1:
Veronicax
Hi Liam,:hugs: I do hope the new tabs helped you sleep better ?.I had them for a couple of weeks once and they did help me,but my problems were not the same as yours.I agree with Veronica about the slurring.chewing gum will help with the dry mouth too.Try to get out for a ride or better still a walk over the w/e.You need to switch off even for a short while .No sitting in a dark room ..Quiz night on Saturday ,so an hour of distraction there ,at least.Luv and hugs to you and your s/m.Sue:bighug1: xx
Friday 12th. Well, actually it's Sat 13th. 1am. Took the first Temazepam at 1.30 last night.. nodded about 2am.. woke at 4am with a vengeance, all the gut stuff and everything.. not a chance of going back to sleep. I can so see why we can get desperate to sleep. Strangely I haven't been that tired. It's an increasing desperation to "GO TO SLEEP" and switch off. So as I've had the whole gut/stomach/anx/bio chem thing all day that's it. Sleepers of any form don't work for me if I risk taking them more than a few nights on the trot. So I'm just going to stay up later tonight. See if I can do 24 hours and hope that I conk out. The WORSE is the waking at 4am and knowing there's hours to go before I have to start a bad day. And today was the day when we told the staff it was all over. Well, soulmate did, because I came home. I couldn't take the physicals and tell all the staff it was over. So I'm sure it was hugely difficult for my soulmate to do it.. but frankly it gave the staff a chance to have their say, voice their concerns etc.. "have a bitch" about me.. whatever they needed to do without having to not say it to the "boss".
So it's over. Now on Monday we have to start the whole process of telling people jobs won't be finished even though they've paid parts. The banks, finance houses etc... and somehow work out how to move forward. The probability of inevitable bankruptcy. Maybe for both of us. And then the immediate need to work out how to earn a living when there's no reserves.
I had to stop the staff because I don't know where next week's monies were going to come from for them with work drying up for the first time in my life. Whatever you waffle in business and trading, I just couldn't do it with my staff.
So they now have weekends of trying to work out their futures.. and my first task is to try to work out how to sleep without pills. I finished "The Onedin Line".. and now I've got videos of "War and Peace" lined up. I'm not doing a great job of looking after myself at the moment. Gotta go shop. Gotta try to eat properly. Gotta wash my hair. Gotta shave. And then on Monday walk with soulmate (At least she'll be there) into the big empty place with equipment that I don't understand. Perhaps I need to try and do THAT this weekend.
As Suzy-sue says.. quiz 2moro night.. and I shall look forward to that and a bit of chat hopefully with fellow anx buddies. It might be a little while till this thread has anything particularly rosey in it. But we'll go for a step at a time. SLEEP FIRST WOULD BE GOOD. Night all. xx
Hi Liam
Now that you have made the gut rendering decisions, that may help slightly with some of the nervous tension but what you explain with your symptoms and sensations is to much adrenaline circulating and the drug that is most helpful for that is a betablocker. When people think of these drugs they automatically think it works on the heart. What they dont understand is that there are different types of betablocker drugs and one differs from another with there effects on the body. Atenol is very Cardio selective so is given routinely for blood pressure and heart rate control so in your case probably not a good idea. But Propanolol is a drug given for systemic effects such as you describe, Some Violinists, Guitarists and pianists have all taken it at some time just to calm those performance nerves and shakes that we all get with heightened nervous tension. There downside is that they can block emotions and of course for asthma sufferers they are contraindicated. Have a chat with your doctor and see if he thinks they may be of benefit in the short term. A small dose may just help with that gut problem that you describe. Infact the gut nervous system has been described as the second brain because it behaves and responds just like your cognitive mind. Stress long term is not good and any help in calming things can only be good for you long term. With most of us on No More Panic our anxiety is real like yours but inappropiate at times but in your case yours is very appropiate and untill things are sorted you will suffer these stress symptoms and sensations.
I hope things improve for you soon and I am thinking of you.
Ron
best of luck and thank you!
I was referred to a clinical psychologist over 6 months ago and see her once a month which I feel isn't often enough because I am gaining nothing from it and I am most certainly not doing CBT with her although my Doctor is under the impression that I am!
Veronica H
13-06-09, 12:18
Cripes Liam/Soulmate
:bighug1: How awful. There I've said it. There will be no escape in the short term from the pain of these 'negative life events' as the professionals like to call them. You are good intelligent people and I know you will come through this. Ron is spot on about the betablockers. I was prescribed propranalol, and they really helped. Glad you are going to wash your hair and shave, and sort the food out. Do it on auto if you have to right now Liam, but don't stop doing it. Small steps and one day at a time is good enough given what has happened. This is a global crisis and there is no shame in what has happened. I know it will be difficult not to take it personally right now and there is a grieving process to go through, so ride it out. We are all here for you... enjoy the quiz.
Love
Veronica
Hi Liam
I'm glad you went to see the gp. The Temazepam is a benzo like valium but is given more often to help with sleep problems. The sleepers are non-benzo hypnotics, not that it matters. The sleeping problem with anxiety is completely common and it stinks. Yes, the meds do put you out for a couple of hours but you inevitably wake during the night and then can't get back to sleep because of the troubling thoughts. I have no sugestions Liam, you just have to go with it at the moment, it's just a process you go through and it makes you feel like screaming. Waking during the early hours when all the world sleeps is horrible and I used to get very very panicky.
It's good that you're doing the quiz on here, great mind distraction and you will also have good company. You do still have the motivation to want to actually try things mate and I think that's good. How you feel is not good and I once again I have to shout from the rooftops that Anxiety is a bloody demon!!!!
You have so much going on in the mind at the moment, the business and the fear of you not working with soul mate. It's all hurting you and stressing you out - I so sympathise. At least soul mate is not laying any blame on you and she sounds like a good one.
Someone else mentioned beta blockers again. The only one I know which is used for anxiety is Propranalol, it does help a lot of people I know. However, I do think this medication is more for tremors and racing heart. Propranalol reduces the amount blood which the heart pumps out at each stroke. It helps some people - I guess you could mention it to gp. However, I think he would have offered it by now if he thought it was a med which would help your anxiety. I say that because it's one of the first things a gp tries for anxiety states.
Keep on truckin' Liam, as I said before you will rise again - no doubt about that.
Enjoy the quiz tonight.
Sunday 14th. That was a long weekend alone, fighting meds and anxiety. Tongue doesn’t seem to be working very well but then again I’ve not spoken to people. Feeling a bit better though now. The anx band thing has dropped away a fair bit; harping on but probably as a result of no sleepers. OR do I specifically have a problem with the hypnotics. I understand that Temazepam is a benzodiazepine. Same group of drugs as Diazepam. Zopiclone and Zolpidem are hypnotics. More of this later.
Slept a little better last night. Woke with the cold sweats but not so bad. Had a GREAT quiz and ONE glass of port while playing. Fed myself reasonably well. Today I sorted all the horrid sweaty bedding, got myself power showered, shaved and hair washed, tidied the house a bit. Dossed on “Pirates”. Tried to be more positive and responsive to texts from the kids as I know they’re worried about me. Soulmate knows that I’m in a dark place too.
They are right. For whatever reason those demon “it’s pointless” thoughts creep into the head from somewhere and you really have to jump on them fast. And for a man who does voiceovers to have a glued tongue sometimes must make me sound rather strange. To myself as well.
I’m going to be setting the “Mad World” alarm earlier for working days. 6.30am. See if I can get myself up and away. Perhaps 5 mins on the exercise bike to start the day. We can all but try these things. Of course tomorrow is the start of an extremely difficult week as soulmate and I see what is recoverable if anything and try and find the heart to move it on. Very hard when you consider the utter mess there is to clear up at the same time.
However she’s here with me now. And we have 72 hours together of day and night and see what we can work out. We will start with a list. Jeez it’ll be long. But we’ll make the list. And we’ll work stuff one step at a time.
For those who came here to follow the CBT thread there’s no doubt that the application of the strategies has helped me. Honestly. I can’t say I’ve stuck to the letter of the law but I have specifically applied some techniques this weekend to try and get myself a little better.
We also wonder whether after a couple of days break from the sleepers whether we can try a single Temazepam tonight. It’s not an easy call. But if my reaction is to the hypnotics then it shouldn’t be so bad. I’ve only had one of them but it was after taking the others. The jury is still out on this one as I close this piece. I've only had 2 diazepam today and the band has gone. Maybe I should try without again.
This thread is in danger of becoming tediously plotted around meds and business problems. My original plan was a fair exchange. The therapy for me of writing and the “opportunity” for others to follow the application of CBT in the absence of their own availability to the treatment. That hasn’t happened. But with the goodness of NMP’s Nic and the support of those who contribute to this thread I’m allowed a free rein. So we’ll see what happens this week. Good night all. Liam xx
Veronica H
16-06-09, 14:41
Hi Liam
Getting up on time and sticking to a routine is good news as it is so easy for depression to take hold otherwise. I am glad that you and the soulmate are are working together on the list and helping each other to wade through it.
Sad times, but it has to be got through. Pirates with kids and quizes are just as important so glad you are still finding time for this. :bighug1:
Veronicax
Well it's now Wednesday night. Today was the 'orrible meeting with the company's biggest creditor. And they have the ability to just say no and close me down. However it's now done.. and they go away to think about it and frankly whether they want to try and run with me for longer or just shut me down. In a way it would be a "blessing" - take the decision away from ME.
I'm not doing great. It's dark inside my head. ALL staff are back on freelance for the week because I pulled a rabbit out of a hat on Monday for 1 week's money.. but the atmosphere is difficult because they too are anxious and of course wonder whether they should work with me or try and focus on starting business in their own right. So the vibe is not comfortable. And naturally I feel guilty and responsible and all that stuff.
I popped into the NMP chat room before the meeting and someone in there was in a lot worse state than I was.. it was no comfort in that sense but there was comfort in knowing at that moment there was eight of us there and we all knew how each other was feeling. Does that make sense?
Meds wise I seem to be a lot better for Temazepam. There's no anx band across my gut. And I've not exceeded my 3 x 2mg of Diaz a day.. ironically only two today despite the pressure. So that's the meds "under control" but I know I must let go of them as soon as possible.
Anyway.. a short post.. just to bring readers up to speed who follow the thread. Perhaps I'm boring people now.. less responses! LOL Isn't "positive" a hard state to find sometimes? Thanks Veronica H for hanging there with me. Liam xx
nomorepanic
17-06-09, 22:30
Liam
Over 3000 people have read the post so even though we may not respond all the time we are still with you ok?
Stick at it ok and keep us updated.
Hugs for you.
Hi Liam
No we are not getting bored with your posts, but speaking for myself I am trying not to invade your privacy as I know you are going through hell at the moment and I dont want to say the wrong thing if you know what I mean.
I do empathise with you even though I have never gone through what financial difficulties that you have at the moment. But I have lost my career to ME/CFS so in that I do understand the frustration and uncertainty about the future. If you want to chat on MSN then contact me as I dont want to bother you with my insignificant witterings. I can help with the anxiety if thats what you want or just be a sounding board.
Try and stay positive and keep that depression at bay if you can, we all know its hard but you must try.
All the best
Ron
freudian nightmare
18-06-09, 10:58
Hello liam,
I read your posts often but like ron am afraid of saying wrong thing and making it worse as i know you've a lot on your plate at the moment. Just wanted to say we are all here and hoping you the very best. Take care x
Feel bad now for not posting yesterday:doh: .To be honest my reasons were the same as Ronski,s.Its the feeling of not saying the right things,or repeating yourself, like a scratched record,that made me think twice.Your in such a bad place at the moment and I truly feel for you and wish I could do or say something to make you feel better. Like Ron ,I too havnt any experience of your current buisness problems.But I have lost a lot in the past ,and have possibly felt what you feel inside right now.Take each day at a time ,(where possible ) ,when you reach the bottom of the pit,the only way is up. Youll get there again. Life is full of changes and is a journey of experiences. Every thing we go through ,makes us who we are..Be proud of yourself you have accomplished so much. . All is not lost yet .You are stronger than you think ,and you will get through this. Till then my friend ,we are all here for you and wish you well. Keep posting! Hugs SUE:hugs: X
Isn't NMP an extraordinary place. Just look at those supportive responses. Last night having had the most important of the survival meetings.. where the "other party" of course had the control.. where due to an accident on the motorway he was two hours late.. and I had to survive that in a state of anxiety... not SHOW that anxiety but fight our corner with a fair chunk of "What's the point" going on in my head.. I was able to get home and indeed only had the 2 Diaz. But then like a fool I decided NOT to take the sleeper because I had a couple of glasses of port.. why oh why did I do that? I woke early and it's been a dreadful day. Enough so that I popped into "help" in the chat room. I had to leave work after forcing out a voice over... and the worse is that it's soulmate's birthday today.. This condition when you're in a bad way can make you very selfish. There was no way I could fake her out as to how anxious I feel today so now I have take on board her feelings that she's going to have to carry responsibility to pick up all the pieces and sort out the huge mess as I struggle to hang onto control. And the poor woman has to go out with her kids and do "birthday" this evening... and at the same time worry about me. And frankly I'm the cause of the distress because of the way I currently am.
At this moment guys I've "had enough".. and just want to go to bed, curtains closed and stay there. Cowardly, ineffective.. no use as a strategy. But I have lost my nerve at present and can't see forward. So there you go. That's where I'm at as I write.
Dark place "End it" thoughts have begun to creep in.. and what a rate they can bombard you at. I'm speaking candidly here and not wishing to spread alarm. I always said this thread would be real.. and I'm sure others have this experience. So... I've got a doc appointment this afternoon in a couple of hours and see what he has to say. I've used up my 3 x 2mg of Diaz for the day.. and mustn't take more.
The reality of the business bit is now it's the actual peak of all the poo I suspect. The acceptance it's all over; the enormous task of trying to clear the mess and to try and fathom a way forward with over committed finances and a steady spiral downwards. Another email just arrived from a bank and they all want meetings. How on earth do I do those in this condition?
Perhaps this was not the time to try and leave off a sleeper for a night!
So reading my post last night seemed as if I was "seeking attention". Maybe I was.. I had interpreted it as the previous writings being "up tempo" enough to help jee up others.. but now I'm on a fade... as you say who wants to write the "wrong things".
Sometimes in chat or on MSN.. because as I said previously there's a "selfish" element to this condition I'm not able to listen fluidly to other peoples difficulties. I also worry about saying the wrong thing.. just like you guys above. And when I see a thread I'd like to contribute to.. if I have no experience of that particular condition or distress I stay off it.. and write nothing.
So there we go for now.. I got strength from the above.. and if I'd popped back in last night I would have seen Nic's quick post yesterday evening. Thanks for the support of all. I will chat on MSN. But again there I'm aware of trying not to "intrude" on others.. in case like me it can be difficult at times when you're in your own holes. Liam xx
2 posts in a day.. but thought I'd "report in" after seeing the doctor. Today I told soulmate I was ill. And she said get to the doc. So I did. I told the doc I was ill. He asked me to do a short questionaire. The answers were obvious.. conclusion? I'm ill! Different doc from my normal And in fairness what a cool doctor. He clearly read up all the notes from his colleague and therefore I had no need to "pitch the sitch". So the "mistake" I've been making is trying NOT to take the meds. And maybe that's where it went wrong with the hypnotics. I dunno. But during this anxious and difficult time I'm to take the meds... simple as that. 3 x 4mg of Diaz a day... 10-20mg of Temazepam at bedtime. And he's prescribed Citalopram at 20mg a day. Hmmm.. Blood test on Monday just in case there's anything dodgy.. I doubt it. It's my head. Back to him on Thurs. Decision today? Go for using the increased Diaz and stick with 10 or 20mg of Tem a night for a week.. see how much poo work I can get out the way. Hold off on the Cital until then and see if this can be enough. SURELY apart from the consideration of no work.. "stuff" can be better 1 month from now. Let's see shall we?
I shall be trying to get my personal CBT on the go again properly. The car people come and collect the Porsche on Monday. I will owe soooo much money on it. But there's another job "closed" except for the ongoing "We want the rest of the loot" process. Bring it on. I aint got it.. and it's only part of the overall HUGE bill that is going to hit. So.. shall I have one last Porsche blast this weekend? Youngest and I LOVED belting around in it.. had them for a few years now.. or settle for what we had.. good memories.. They're all over Father's Day.. we'll see.
So.. there we go.. LIAM IS ILL. More medication. I shall be exploring NMP a lot for feedback on the Citalopram which appears to have a certain unpleasantness for some takers for a little while before there's benefit. My question would therefore be.. Am I am able to cope with yet more potential anxiety and discomfort on top of the bucket load I carry already.
I am aware that the sleepers I've discussed are not referenced here much at NMP. It APPEARS that sleepers don't play much of a part with the challenges that bring us all together here. Maybe I'm wrong.. and it's just not a widely discussed topic.
ONE thing that does appear important. Smiley was nudging me on it in the chatroom as well. Increased Tem and Diaz.. NO BOOZE. I'm still "in denial" as to whether that's because it "increases wooziness" or if it actually has a reaction to the drugs and disturbs the taker more. Jury out. But if I'm upping doses and also it has to be said THIS IS IT THEN.. THE FIGHT NEEDS TO BE ON. All the talking has to stop. I've got 2moro off it I choose and weekend ahead. I would say that Monday we have to start the big last battle. And I aint talking Pirates. I'm talking about the change of life if I'm going to get past this point.. a point that clearly I didn't anticipate reaching when I first started this slice of forum. Thanks to those who have supported me.
We have a phrase in television.. "Fading to black".. One of my mentors at the Beeb was Simon King's Dad.. (Big Cat Diary).. he died of cancer I think it was. He telephoned me a few days before he died to say goodbye.. and I asked him how he was doing.. and in true showbiz language he said.. "Fading to black now darling".
Today in a dark moment I thought of "fading to black" rather than rattling on here.. but Nic and the other support messages "do their thing" guys.. and I shall continue to write for the 8 people who have visited this thread about 400 times each.. ;-). As you say Nic.. over 3,000.. that's a lot of read.
So.. let us continue the story.. the drama of real life. the clock faces the wall, the blackout blind is in place.. the picture of my boys is 6" from the keyboard here to remind me why I must fight the fight. Soulmate will do anything to help as long as she can feel I'm still battling. She must be so close to wanting to join me in "the dark place" but she is such a trooper. Her experience with PND 20 years ago.. a virtual breakdown of her mum when she was young and had to pretty much run the family home has given her strength and resilience that I can really call on. And boy am I calling on it.
Time to really wake up and smell the coffee Liam. I don't want to sink further. Must now wade forward. Through the muck and mire. One step at a time. Pile of cliches. Must make every effort somehow to make sure I don't become one (Cliche). JUST bought myself a ribeye steak from the local butcher and some oven chips. Penance for messing the business has been "no real treats of meats" for Liam. There's trifle in the fridge but the chocolate supply is low.
There's the first challenge to overcome. C u all later. Liam xx
Veronica H
18-06-09, 21:31
:bighug1: Hi Liam
Meds are fine in the short term so you take them honey. Yes I think if we are honest the majority have contemplated the dark place at some point, when we are in the throws of panic and anxiety, and over time, if we fail to get a handle on things then depression creeps in. Given what has happened I think it is much more important for you to avoid sinking into depression than it is to worry about the meds. I have had a year to get my anxiety and panic under control where as yours has surfaced in the midst of a life changing crisis. I want you to keep posting through the highs and the lows.....steak ands chips....real food...sounds lovely...I have just eaten 'tesco healthy balanced salmon and veg', but on the plus side have managed to shrink my fat A**e and have dropped a jeans size....sorry for waffle but hope it is diverting, and at least you know I am still here for you even if I don't always know what to say.
Love
Veronicax
Glad you went to your Dr Liam .With regards to your meds ,I would say I agree with your descision to stick with the Benzos for now,try to get through with them if you can. Antidepressants can be very good ,I take Citalopram myself ,for 8 months now. But the first few weeks can increase the anx , and you may feel a lot worse before you get better.Some on the other hand dont feel bad at all but the effects dont kick in for a few weeks usually ,so its not going to be a quick fix. Your Soulmate has experience as you say, so at least youll get support from someone who can help you. Im sorry about the Porche ,but at least youve had that thrill,and its just things at the end of the day.Focus on keeping well,and those you love ,they will give you the strength to carry on ...Hope you enjoyed your steak,you deserve a treat. Sleep well Sue:hugs:
Hi Liam
I think your situation is so clearly different from most of us who visit this site. I have anxiety related to health concerns and the symptoms and sensations that I get from the ME/CFS so people could argue that at times my anxiety is inappropriate. Yours however is definately not and if a fix could be found to sort your buisness affairs out you would come out the otherside very quickly with no residue anxiety, just a bad memory that time would erase.
So yes I agree with your doctor that you need to get help with your anxiety and that taking the tablets that he has prescribed is appropriate for your circumstances at the moment, but as I said yesterday in chat please take care with the Diazepam as it can be a very addictive drug with very unpleasent side effects if then you try and limit there use when you are getting better. Citalopram is as you describe but is very good in controlling that anxiety until your life circumstances improve.
As far as the depression you must expect some as it is a reactive type, probably like a bereavement in that you are loosing very important aspects of your life. The only advice I can offer is to do as you have been and try and keep in sight the things that truly matter to you like your boys, and the very things in life that you cannot pay for like the sun and the sounds of nature. Yes you will lose a lot but always think its only material posessions and they hopefully will be replaced sometime in the future when the economy gets better and you get back on your feet. you have friends Liam on this site that will support you emotionally and will allow you to let off steam and allow those dark thoughts without judging you in any way. As I said PM me at any time if I am on line and I will just listen if that is what you want. Remember the creditors have been there before with others, so you are nothing new and again its not your fault. Life will go on, just allow these thoughts to come and go and with time and support from your soulmate you will come out of this a stronger person.
Try a walk this weekend with soulmate and go out into the forest and just listen to the sounds, it will make you feel better and give you the proper perspective with those thoughts.
Ron
So it's Father's Day and all three sons and their girlfriends are around in a couple of hours. I've cleaned myself up and sorted the house. I've ALWAYS reversed Father's Day. Presents and cashy for the boys and let them know how glad and lucky I am to BE their Father. I've never wanted them to be grateful or thankful on this particular day. But it's time to let go of that now. I know they want to "take charge" and I'm sure it'll be good for my spirits. Meds seem to be able to help a little but I didn't like 4mg of Diaz. Felt weird.. so well spaced 2mgs will be better I hope.
MISSED THE QUIZ. Helping someone with some online troubleshooting. Wanted to be there and had even lined up the Cadburys.
I woke at 4.30am and it all kicked off in my head but less of the physicals. I've just taken the Porsche for a last thrash and dumped it up at work so that youngest doesn't see it at the house when he arrives. It's gone. And time to work out how to move on.
Today though soulmate's doggie is poorly.. and either she'll bring her here tonight or need to stay there. I must not dwell on it today. For obvious reasons.
Ronksi is right. My situation appears different as in my anxiety has come from a real business affairs problem and yes I've been a little surprised to not have some "Oh I'm there too" responses from others. But it doesn't mean my anxiety is any less or more probably than others suffering what I clearly now feel is mental illness. There is no doubt that if I could come up with a fix I could improve things but I'm not going to be able to. And the mess to clear up is so very big why we work out how to move onwards.
I am one of those businesses built by bank money and now there is none. We can blame the banks sure.. but at the end of the day the decisions are ours to borrow even if they made it easy.
Today though is Father's Day and until this point at least I've done a fair job. Must find the strength and remember that however dark I feel that job is not over and I'm needed in that capacity however useless I may feel about my other values. Liam xx
Hi Liam
Happy fathers day Liam and have a good one.
You are right in that your anxiety is no less than ours and my comment was not in any way to be interpreted any differently and I recognise what you are going through with the symptoms and sensations. We all experience anxiety differently but the feelings of each anxiety symptom are the same. So in that aspect I can identify with you a lot. The other thing I meant to say was that in my comments I didnt mean to say you were materialistic in any way, what I was trying to say was concentrate on those things that nobody can ever take away from you, that are a part of life that sometimes we take so much for granted but in reality can when we are in times of great distress ground us and show us all is not lost and that there is a lot of reasons for just ploughing on and get out of life those things that really do matter.
All the best Liam and I will be thinking off you over the next week. Keep in touch mate and PM me when you want some support.
Ron
Veronica H
21-06-09, 16:00
:bighug1: Hi Liam,
The fact that you have always reversed fathers day tells us all what a creative, caring and sensitive soul you are. I would not have thought of that on mothers day:huh:. Let the boys take charge today as I think it will be their way of letting you know they are there for you.
Diazipam 2mg - space it out or your will be spaced out....my attempt at humour... but I know from personal experience that you would be better off doing this.
Yes this is a mental illness but the good news is that it is behavioural and not a psychosis, in that you are reacting to what is taking place, which lets face it is rapid negative change. Ron has a point about reconnecting as much as you can manage with the things in life that are constant, for this reason.
Love and best wishes to soulmate...I hope the dog is on the mend.
Veronicax
Just thought I'd take a breath in this difficult day, visit NMP and post. Boys did me proud with lots of banter, brought round food and cooked. I know they know that Dad's in a dark space but no questions were asked. Student son leaves for Florida on Friday for two weeks with girlfriend family. Eldest is getting ready to move out. Youngest has last GCSE 2moro. Then soulmate arrived in evening. Dog has a gastro problem but seems ok. However it's another worry at a difficult time.
Porsche went today. Emailed the bank that it was all in trouble. Started that ball rolling. Rang a TV channel and told them I'd be failing to deliver what they were expecting. Received half a dozen supportive phone calls quite quickly after that. Small world when there's bad news circulating but they all said good things. Went to doc and had my blood test. I know there's nowt wrong with the body; it's all the mind but he wanted a splodge of red stuff. Haven't started my Citalopram yet. Calming down a BIT with the Diaz and Temaz for night time.. although I wasn't asleep for long, CBT application beginning to function at night which is a help. I am starting to be able to shut the work thoughts out when they come in during the night hours. This is an achievement in its own right frankly given the weight of the burden.
It's 1.30pm.. and a few poo jobs have been done. I daren't make "The List" yet because it's huge and that won't help. SO I'm going for a few of the clearly obvious ones initially. And with a bit of luck that'll pace the 'orrible replies that will inevitably start. I can live without a flurry of finance companies and bankers all at once. I know I've messed it up but let's hope I can work it a single step at a time. Boy could I do with a drink! But that's a no no with the meds. I didn't do the "cold sweats" during the night either so another small improvement. We must clutch these cherries and appreciate them when they are ripe.
Hi Liam
I think a well done is due mainly in the way you are looking at things. You are clearly doing a bit better in that you have a coherent and well thought out structure for the days ahead. It is difficult and very exhausting being in a constant state of anxiety with no idea of what responses you are going to get from your creditors.
Hold on to your soulmate and be supportive for each other at this time. Frustrations and anger will appear but put it all into context and you will be fine. We are hear for you to sound off at any time.
Ron
Respite for a moment by diving into the site. I wish I DID have a coherent and well thought out structure Ron but I haven't. I'm not quite rabbit in headlights but it feels like that. And as you say the constant state of anxiety takes energy. Tonight will be one of the harder meetings as I have to see the ex and let her know she's on her own going forward and must leave the rented house and cut cloth she can afford because I can't guarantee it anymore. It would be so wrong if she went and rented something bigger in the belief that I can support it and then as my spiral increases I can't. The prospect of WHERE I am to find my income in about two weeks time is truly an unpleasant thought to write a big understatement! And therefore I have to help her see she has to be able to carry herself and most of the 16 year old as best and I can do what I can do.
It's hardly surprising the "dark thoughts" come in... I seem to be better for combination of the Diaz and Temaz and last night I had 3 temaz and "disappeared" for about six hours. However I am aware that sleep is a sought after refuge for escape rather than a requirement through tiredness BUT it was good to have a night where I didn't wake up in the middle and leap off on one. I THINK there was a small awake but it didn't last long enough for me to be too aware.
Soulmate can't be with me tonight. Doggie poorly and her daughter away at work so I not only have to meet the ex and try and take whatever gets thrown at me.. but then have no soulmate after to pick up my pieces.
Hence making sure I "conked out" last night. Once the ex is met though I know it's another hurdle climbed over and because it's family it's one of the worse in some senses.
Anyway, enough for now... thanks for posting Ron. Does me good to fly onto NMP and just have a burble. Cya all later. Roll on Quiz night! Liam
Veronica H
23-06-09, 13:28
:bighug1: Big hugs Liam. The meeting with the ex is going to be the hardest especially as the youngest is involved too. We are still here for you as you work the problem.
Veronicax
It's 3pm and I've come home from work. If I went back through this thread I would of course see that one of the key early strategies with my CBT etc was to stay away from the ex while I tried to get myself sorted a bit. The situation was a primary area of my anxieties. But now is the day I have to see her and let her know how bad everything is. And this is NOT going to be a good one. As Veronica confirmed after my posting last night it may be the hardest. I feel as if I've fallen at the last hurdle with the last child. BUT he's surprisingly resiliant and as I write probably concluding the last minutes of his last GCSE.
Sitting here at home isn't helping at work. But maybe a case of THIS is today's task.. and at least she's coming here. I bet she too is nervous though and of course has never truly carried responsibility beyond being a mum (I don't mean that at all as light as it may sound) for herself in terms of maintainance for 30 years.
I hope we can be kind and gentle with each other. She's 2 years down the road from breast cancer removal.. and I know has gone through a fair bit of "What's the point" too.. who knows eh... I'll post later if I have anything useful to say. Sigh. Meanwhile I'm off to the shed I haven't got. It would be a cool, air filled space.. and maybe I could find a shovel to help dig myself out of this dark hole I'm in. Liam xx
Good luck with your meeting Liam,its one that had to happen sooner or later,Better to get it done and dusted,it wasnt going to be easy no matter when it happened. Some thing else off your endless list. Women survive in worse situations ,its no ones fault. I feel for both of you in different ways.. Im glad you had a good day Sunday ,well the best it could be under the circumstances! Its good you didnt run and hide under the covers,feeling the way you are right now.Shutting people out can hurt them more than letting them see you in a vunerable state.So a big well done for that.You have lots of support here ,so later if you need to talk .Im sure one of us at least will be here for you. Chatroom always open too. So all the best for now. Hugs Sue:hugs: xx
Liam xx
I have just updated on your posts, haven't been on for a couple of weeks - I feel horrible that I'm not posting so much on the site actually, I feel as if I am not being loyal.
Anyway, this is not about me. Liam, the posts have left me with a huge lump in my throat and I could cry for you.
I don't know how many times I will repeat this to you but you are the most wonderful writer and the emotions I felt reading your posts was all encompassing.
So glad you went back to doc and even more pleased that you saw a different one, always good to have a second opinion. You have gone from someone (in my opinion) who was worried and stressed to someone now suffering bad anxiety. Is it any wonder having gone through what you have over the last weeks/months.
I did tell you not to worry about taking the Diazepam. When you are in this sort of state of stress then I personally feel that whatever helps then go for it. I say this because I, like many many others on here have suffered the punishment of anxiety to unbearable levels and anyone who decides to wear the hair shirt and just suffer without meds is truly being very very unkind to themselves.
So glad that the Temazepam is helping you more than the sleeper, sleep is good, sleep is so necessary - burn out requires medication to MAKE us relax. Right, so the 4mg diaz didn't agree with you, it can make you feel very woozey when using a higher dosage. All you do Liam is take more of the 2mg as needed. I am just thankful that it helps you.
Regarding the Citalopram,I think you are wise to be leaving it for now - you will know when you really need the medication - and I can assure you when that point hits you, you will take it. I know you are in a very very dark place, and I think you cope admirably. The script for the Citalopram is there if you decide to take it. Do not worry at all about the side effects at this stage of the game. When and if you go on the medication we will all be here to give you support and help you onto the med. The worst thing you can do before taking an anti depressant is to start torturing the mind with more stress about taking medication.
Oh what a lovely man you are, you use Father's Day to show your appreciation of your children. Sod this I'm getting teary eyed. You are a good man and good things will come to you in the future, this is not the end of your amazing career, this is the beginning of something new. First you must recover, then you will move on. It may be months and months ahead but it is there.
I so hope the meeting with ex went okay . It was bound to hit her like a ton of bricks even though she has been aware of your financial difficulties. I feel for you I so do. I also feel for your wife, she has been used to you paying the way and now you can't - she will be mega stressed herself at the prospect. I hope she can stay strong because your boys need their mother to be able to function normally.
I hope soul mate's dog is okay. I won't talk too much about dogs at the moment though. I hope soul mate can stay strong for you Liam and I am sure she will.
Liam, if I had money I would pay you to teach me to write as you do - truly wonderful reading and you my friend will never be poor.
I feel for you because the Porsche has gone. Some people may ask why should I though, because I, and many others have never had the good fortune to own such a car. BUT I do feel for you deeply because even though it was only a car, - it was one more loss, something that not only pleased you but your boys too.
You take great care my friend and I will keep up with the posts now. You are coping well Liam, ..... you are and please do believe me. You are functioning well amidst this nightmare of a situation.
Big hugs xxx
Tucked amidst the positive, the not so positive and the darker pieces of wordage I scramble across this forum by cableless keyboard, has formed a small but elite band of supporters and consistent contributors. These fellow NMP members are here because they too suffer the challenges and conditions that unite us on this site.
I’ve spoken in recent days about the drift from CBT to therapeutic forum as I take advantage of the ether space kindly sanctioned by Nic for these small stretches of the English language.
I am moved my Yvonne’s piece above. It follows my meeting with the “ex” which followed some chatroom support from Suzy-Sue because the dreaded meeting was due this evening and now it is done.
I had to tell the mother of my children, the woman who I’ve provided pretty much everything for since the first child was born 22 years ago and that I moved away from 3 years ago that she now had to move on in her own right and rent only a house that she could afford and manage with the very probable possibility of not getting a bean from me. At least for while. That was the bottom line. And it went ok. There was no drama. I was not laid into. She levelled no guilt. I was not judged or condemned. There was no anx or drama from her.
I believe she feels it isn’t my fault although as Yvonne writes I am sure she’s quite frightened about this process. And we parted ok. A lot has been lost but there’s still a family. And each of us has sacrificed a lot; just like every other parent.
When communication gets difficult between parted couples and there remains a need for such a system we agreed that text was the easiest. And as texts can be short, and easily misinterpreted we agreed a principle that every text would end with something pleasant or at the least a kiss (x). She now knows the worse. She knows and indeed recognises the position I am in and the dark place I currently reside.
So it’s done. The rest can now be business and I can focus on that. And hopefully start to build again. And because there’s no promises in place then whatever I can raise or do will be appreciated as opposed to assumed and taken for granted. That will I believe help me find some strength.
Ideas have already popped into my head tonight. I shall take my meds and not fight them. I’m back to the doctor on Thursday and I now know which levels and which drugs are working for me with less side effects so I shall discuss that process and leave the Citalopram in the drawer. They are ready and waiting if matters take a turn for the worse but for the meantime that is where they can stay. I’ve had a glass of port, the ex meeting is over, it’s the midnight hour. And tomorrow is another day. I’ve got some of the poo jobs done this week and I think I’m going to get on the motorcycle, find £100 and ride off for the weekend to Cornwall and just stuff air through the lungs at the seaside and think. I wonder if I’ll get that far.
There’s an easier day at work tomorrow with only a couple of staff in on freelance both of which whom give me no atmosphere of discomfort. I understand the ones that do are really just anxious about their own futures and as the boss I am I suppose the obvious focus for those feelings. But for someone with thin skin, raw nerves and coping with the devastation of this sort of collapse of all that has been built it isn’t easy. I’ve provided their incomes for a long time. And I’m the baddy.
I heard today though from a writer who’s friend is in a dreadful state because he has to tell the person he’s employed for 18 years that there’s no more work.
I am not alone with these business tragedies. I am not alone without a family. I am not even alone from my ex. We wonder if we can still be friends. Marriage and relationships can end but children are for life and therefore a way must be found to always move forward for their sakes.
As indeed it must be through the dark places we find ourselves. The consequences of letting such negative thought patterns get beyond control and into a place where we cannot find our way back are too great for them and as I’ve mentioned about the selfishness that comes out from the condition of anxiety it’s another aspect that I have to overcome.
Brave words after a glass of port and a few successful hurdles jumped over in the last two days. Soulmate made and left me an enormous pile of cooked pasta. I stuffed myself with it this evening. It’s probably the best I’ve eaten for a few weeks.
A combination of getting through the “dreaded meet” of inevitability, the support in the chat room prior, the surfacing of a couple of good business thoughts this evening, and the moving words of encouragement from my friend above. Yes, this is a good hour and now it’s time for some meds and hopefully some sleep. Blackout blind in place, clock to the wall, a book at bedtime and let’s see if I can raise some more spirit and rise above the melancholy a little better tomorrow. Good night all. Long live NMP. Liam xx
Veronica H
24-06-09, 09:05
:bighug1: Morning Liam. I hope you managed some sleep. Glad the meeting with the Ex went well. I was moved by your post and also by Yvonnes. I am stuck for the right words as usual but just wanted to add my support.
Veronica
I'm stuck for words as well actually ... not like me at all lol!
Well Liam, as you said, one more stressor removed from the list. I have to repeat loudly how well you do. Yes, I know you are taking meds to help but I do believe you are a trooper. Even with medication an anxiety state can be shere torture - so you really are a very strong man.
I am shocked that your wife took it so well, I am assuming now that she has a career of her own and therefore has an income. However, the fact that she has to find another place to live etc. is a huge blow. I'm so pleased that you agreed to put something positive at bottom of the texts and yes a few kisses will help heal wounds.
If you can get away for the weekend then you must. The escape from your own four walls will be so therapeutic.
Thank god for soulmate who not only supports and keeps you stronger than you otherwise could be - she even cooks you grub lol! Eating, sleeping, keeping oneself presentable, is of utmost importance and you have to keep to routine.
Take care Liam, all will be well in the near future.
By the way, CBT is good for certain things but people are sooooo much better. xx
Nearly always ,the thoughts of anticipation before an event are always blown up in our minds to be the worst scenarios. Its what we do ,when we suffer with this condition.I cant express how pleased I am that your meeting went well,even better than you could anticipate. Well done for facing it and not putting it off,many would have..Corn wall sounds a good idea,,getting away to that beautiful part of our country is just what you need right now.Clear your head ,breathe in the air ,and take in the sights and sounds...The words from all here ,show how we feel and empathise with your current situation,it might have been a different reason that brought you here than most ,,but we understand your turmoil and suffering right now,Thats what makes this site and the people here so special .As Yvonne says "CBT is good for certain things ,but people are sooooo much better" Keep well Liam ! and be kind to yourself..Luv Suex:bighug1:
A SHORT QUICK POST QUESTION THEN... I'm hoping for feedback from you guys. Went to the doctor today. Re-newed my prescriptions for 10 or 20mg Temazepam a night, and 2mg of Diaz as and when required through the day up to 12mg tops. AND he wants me to start the Citalopram. I thought I'd take it at bedtime. I KNOW it's my decision to start this medication or not. He would want to phase down the Diaz and Temaz when the Cital takes effect in a few weeks by gradual withdrawal. I've read a fair bit of peoples bad reactions to starting Citalopram and I try not to be too influenced by it. Feedback appreciated tho. I value the opinions of those with experience who support me in this forum. And if you prefer to PM me rather than leave a record online of what you feel I understand and appreciate your thoughts and confidentiality. Liam xx
I am sorry Liam in that I cannot help you with any personal experience of taking prescription drugs for anxiety. This is due to all the doctors that I have seen who have always advised me not to start taking any unless I get to the point of just not coping. Their arguments were that these drugs do not cure the anxiety, they just mask the symptoms so at some point in the future I would have to face the demons, plus coming off these type of drugs can be challenging in there own right as well.
But saying that Liam I can understand that you really do need these meds at this time. Certainly Citalopram would be better for you than Diazepam long term as Diazepam is so addictive in nature and a real pig to come off if you maximise the dose for a lengthy period. As you are probably aware of it takes about 6 weeks for your body to adjust and stabilise itself with citalopram so you may feel increased anxiety for a time for no reason but stick with it and it will pass. Some people try 10mg to start with and then increase to 20mg. What did your GP suggest. I am sure there are loads of people with personal experience of taking this drug that can advise you better than me, as my knowledge comes from textbooks.
The other thing is not to read all the side effects literature as pharmaceutical companies by law have to state every reported side effect however small. I have done with other drugs and it has always increased my anxiety greatly. I hope things go well for you soon and this dark period of your life will become a distant memory.
All the best and have a good weekend if you can
Ron
Ok.. here we go then. Citalopram. I must write with care and remind people that everyone's experiences are different. Firstly I read a lot about the side effects. And indeed I found out recently that my ex had been prescribed Cital in her own right but having read the side effects she'd chosen not to take it.
I took mine on Thursday night as planned at 11pm. 20mg and 20mg of Temazepam. I nodded to sleep about midnight. At 2am I awoke with a massive sweat, specifically my feet, shivers, shakes, dry mouth, and the WORSE OF THE WORSE "Anx band" as I've taught myself to call it.. the same band of adrenalin whatever right across my entire abdomen. The same physiological experience as I had when stopping the sleepers previously threaded. ONLY THIS WAS MUCH WORSE. I was unable to leave my bed yesterday (Friday). Couldn't stop curling and uncurling my toes.. could only ease the sensation by rolling up in a ball and constantly switching sides. Suicidal thoughts flitted in and then out. I then stayed awake for 24 hours. By Friday evening it had started to fade and it dropped away overnight some more and has gone now. 36 hours. NO WAY IS THAT DRUG GOING IN AGAIN. I clearly can't handle that kind of medication. I am not depressed. I am suffering a lot of anxiety and stress. Everything I've built is going down the toilet. That's all understandable. It'll go down even further and faster if I had to spend any more days like I did reacting like that yesterday. To reduce some chemicals I only had 2 x 2mg of Diaz yesterday and 10mg of Temaz. I note what Ronski says. Today I've only had a single 2mg of Diaz. I shall only have 10mg of Temaz.. and then another 10 later if needed.
Again noting what Ronski says above.. these were real bio chemical reactions to the drug. I didn't feel any more anxious. On the contrary I was doing better by Thursday with the Diaz/Temaz combo.. but Citalopram. Nope. I cannot even see the merit of trying quarters of halves.. or anything with it. My body doesn't like the stuff.
I'm not going to write much tonight. Thanks to those who PMd me. appreciated. Just came out the quiz room. Pleasant switch off for an hour. MUST try to get up and out 2moro... fresh air etc. Wimbledon is a good excuse to close the blackout blind and stay in the dark places. Goodnight all. Liam xx
nomorepanic
28-06-09, 00:15
It was lovely to see you in the quiz tonight Liam
I am always thinking of you even if I don't reply.
Veronica H
28-06-09, 00:38
Hi Liam
So sorry you had to find out this way that Citalopram is not the drug for you. :bighug1: Those were major side effects. I have to say that this drug has really helped me although I only take 10mg, and as you say we are all different.
Veronicax
Hi Liam
Hmmmmmmmmmmm --- yes I gently try to warn people about the meds on start up - but don't like to scare the crap out of people.
I have lived that experience you described so well many many many times. It can indeed be hell for some of us getting on these meds.
Thing is Liam, the medication is not just for depression - they are to help anxiety states as well. You suffered very badly that night, however that may not have happened with the second dosage. Nevertheless the experience has scared you to death and you aint gonna get on the anti depressant meds merry go round by the sounds of it.
Stop worrying about the other meds, the cutting down on the diaz etc etc. Fair enough if you don't feel you need it then don't take it. But.... take the stuff as and when - don't bloomin suffer!!!
Take great care Liam and hope the weekend is going well. xx
For a first time on taking this type of medication,its very unfortunate you had such a bad experience Liam:hugs: I had a very bad time when I went on it ,but the end result made it worthwhile...I couldnt of got through it if I had to deal with all the things you have at the moment tho.A lower dose would have been more suitable to start on ,for someone who is sensitive to medications ,like yourself. I m glad you have now got it out of your system and the current meds will keep you functioning.Hope you managed to get some fresh air today and have a manageable week ahead.Take care Sue:bighug1:
Thursday 2nd July. I guess some followers of my forum might be wondering why I’d stopped writing this week. Well it is because I made a bad decision last Sunday and as a consequence of the respect I have for this site I had to seek permission from the admins of NMP to be able to continue the story before I could post further. To the serious credit of Nic and the team I have been allowed to proceed as a process of my own ongoing therapy and to maybe help look more closely at where things go wrong when we find ourselves in the darkest of places at the end of the day.
After a weekend of wrestling through the possible biochem reactions to the Citalopram, too much time on my own, a failure to get out and get on with stuff and a general state of increased anxiety about the oncoming train of the business crisis.. after a raging debate with myself from 7am to 12 midday on Sunday after more sleepless nights I decided to have a hot tub and try and calm myself down a bit. I rarely tub in the day. Especially in hot weather.
It did calm me but negatively. I made the decision that I’d had enough. I got out the tub, cooled down, dried off and collected my tablets plus some high powered pain killers left over from Diverticulitis last year. I am not going to divulge here the quantities, or the drugs involved or the process of calculating what was required to “succeed” with my decision. I took the tablets, jumped onto online banking, transferred all the monies I could find into the accounts of my ex, my children and my soulmate, typed a word document to leave on the desktop of the computer with a simple explanation and a few thoughts and “words of strength” to those I was leaving behind as fast as I could because my lights were fading and texted my soulmate not to come round that evening as she would normally because I was ok but wanted some quiet thinking time and that I’d see her in the morning. And then with reality fading fast, before I could mess up or alert anyone I went up to bed and lay down to sleep. It was 12.30pm.
My next memory is of hearing soulmate calling my name and slapping my hand, a vague picture of a paramedic and then waking in the Acute Assessment Unit at the hospital. Apparently my soulmate had arrived at 6.30pm because I’d not responded to her telephone calls. I’m not going to describe the events that happened that I was unaware of, the process that I apparently went through or the details that have subsequently been relayed to me.
So there we go. A step too far. A greatly upset family and friends. Devastated ex and soulmate. The recognition that I was clearly more ill than I’d realised. And now I’ve told the readers of NMP.
Four days later where am I? I’m at a point where I recognise I had nowhere further to fall. I can perhaps describe it as being in the middle of a small black cylinder. There seemed no gaps, no light, no pathway out. I wonder if only those that have been there can actually relate to the feeling.
There are those that say suicide is a selfish act. I can see the validity of that point of view. The consequences for my family and friends, my children especially are dreadful to contemplate. And indeed student son is blissfully unaware as he’s in Florida on girlfriend holiday. After an initial reaction of anger from my other sons they’ve been hugely supportive and haven’t levelled a single criticism at my actions. It is only me who’s starting to think about how a sixteen year old may well have had to live his life without his father to be there for him. Whatever messes I’m in now he certainly will be making enough of his own that I will have had experience of and as a parent I’m supposed to be there as long as I can be to offer that experience, as well of course as to reap the benefits of watching the growth and development of my own children over what should be many years.
Why would this be any different for the other older children? Why should the mother of my children have to try and carry the responsibilities of passing on experience and support as well as try to help them cope with their grief and loss for themselves and their own future families?
These are just the immediate thoughts and affects of my action if it had been “successful”. It could be deemed as selfish that I didn’t factor and think of these aspects before I acted on my decision but I believe I was in such a dark cylinder that such thoughts just didn’t really enter my head. I’d had enough. It was a “simple as that”.
This could be a rather long posting and I have to think very carefully about the wordage before I post. So I think I’ll do this in stages and settle for the above consequences as being the first that I’ve considered as the most dire.
I do not plan to “beat myself up” though. Part of the issues I’m trying to cope with are of course about guilt; family, ex, work associates and staff. I’m just not going to add more guilt to consider because I have to start finding ways of taking steps back up the ladder as I have most definitely acknowledged that I’ve been on the ground below the bottom rung.
Tomorrow I am back at the doctor. Having met with the local triage support they are recommending that I am prescribed Escitalopram which apparently will become effective more quickly and hopefully less side effects. Needless to say I won’t be able to get any sleep medication and that is going to be a problem because I slept like a log on Monday night obviously still heavily sedated but Tuesday and last night only managed 1 hour per night. But I have some Diazepam and have only had 2 x 2mg per day for the last two days. I shall try and take 1 at bedtime tonight and see if that helps.
HOWEVER I AM NOT ALONE. I am back with my family with the agreement of my ex, and soulmate has taken over totally the issues of dealing with work matters and is working closely with ex and my kids to help me rest for a few days.
My sons have installed my computer in “student son’s” old room and now I can step onto the first rung of the ladder with this posting. I shall really rest for a few days, I shall visit the chat room in the middle of the night if I am awake to see who else is there at “unpleasant hours” – I’ve not done that before. I shall play Pirates. I shall read. And I shall stay OFF the emails etc until Monday.
I shall work at this forum and try to find valid words of contribution that may benefit others who find themselves in the cylinder. I shall with NMP’s blessing continue to tell it as it happens and see how we go from here a step at a time.
I’ll close now though by saying that I have realised that all I had to do to stop such a potentially devastating chain of events was say HELP.. via a text, a telephone call, NMP chatroom. Family, friends, colleagues. Even my pal the Samaritan. There are in my life a lot of people I could have said HELP to and they would all have rallied.
What a foolish man. A simple single word at a critical time. I shall always remember that now. And I hope others will when they find the cylinder has closed around them. The single word – HELP. I DIDN'T EVEN NEED TO COMPLICATE THE SENTENCE WITH THE WORD "PLEASE".
nomorepanic
02-07-09, 19:14
Aww Liam :hugs:
That brought a tear to my eye.
Not what you had done but the words that you wrote here - they were "said" with honesty and you have obviously had time to reflect on what you did and why and you now know that you can always reach and ask for Help whenever you need it again.
People do care - even strangers on here and if you ever need us just ask ok?
I am glad you decided to post this and let us know what happened and thank you for contacting me prior to this post and letting me know what happened and then humbly asking if you could stay on NMP. You are a true gent Liam.
Take love and comfort from those around you at the moment and be "looked after" for a while
xx
Wow Nic.. that was a fast reply! Have you been monitoring my forum to make sure the wordage was ok.. or is that a tiny bit of personal ego coming out of my dark place? If so there's a bit of my life showing a sign! ;-) Thank you for your support. I think I can continue to write a contribution of value for others as well as myself but I will take it slowly and edit with care before pressing that "Post quick reply" button! The course of action I took will I am sure have been considered by many of the members and guests here however fleetingly and it is not to be written about lightly. This site works well by helping people recognise that they are not alone and experience shared with fellow sufferers can lighten loads. Once again, thanks for allowing me the opportunity of continuing with your trust, faith and support. Liam xx
nomorepanic
02-07-09, 19:41
I was clicking on active topics and yours was on there so I thought I would reply now to let you know that I was thinking of you.
I am sure more will follow soon too.
Veronica H
02-07-09, 20:31
Dear Liam:bighug1: :bighug1: :bighug1: :bighug1:
I am so happy that you are still with us. The world would be a poorer place without you. Keep connecting with your family and friends and talking things through. I am so going to kick your A** when you feel better though for giving me such a fright. Love and Hugs.
Veronicax
Liam,
Although I have not contributed to this thread I have followed it from the beginning and almost feel I know you as your post are so honest and well written. I also shed a tear when I read your latest post. I am so sorry you felt so bad. I am glad you have had time to reflect and realize that there are so many people in your life that love you and will be there for you whenever you need them. All of us on NMP are here to lend an ear if you need it.
Please take care of yourself. Sending you lots of hugs.:hugs: :hugs: :hugs: xxxx
Veronica.. I didn't even think about MSN where you and I meet sometimes. And who knows.. you might well have been online and there's another option to have listed as a possible contact point. Although we all gather at NMP we of course develop relationships that use other aspects of the web and we move beyond the protection of the anonymity we are afforded here. If I'd just thought... you are so right to kick my a**. But as Eeyore would also say from his gloomy patch... xxx
Hello Mojo. Welcome to what started as a CBT thread that has over the course of 3 months changed shape quite considerably. One of the issues I have to deal with in MY life is the matter of approval and disaproval. Here at NMP no-one judges me - indeed I take comfort and gain strength from the posts I receive and if I move a spirit a little or gain a tear here and there I'm not going to complain. At that moment someone has taken the trouble to let me know I'm not "disaproved of" and that does ME good. Thanks for contributing. I hope to hear from you again. Liam xx
Hi Liam
What can I say mate? I am sorry you felt that way. You must remember we are here for you, you can talk to us all even on MSM. I could not imagine this site without you. You have been a rock to me with your post and advice.You are a great man and a lot of people care about you.
Please keep posting and remember we are all here for you.
Take care Sharona xxx
:bighug1: :bighug1: :bighug1: :bighug1: :bighug1: :bighug1:
You have written a lot of very moving posts Liam,but that one must certainly move all who read it.:weep: No one has the right to judge another for feeling in total despair.For those who have felt like you do for whatever the reason,will empathise .For those who have not will surely count their blessings. As others have said "Im truly thankful you are still here" You have seen the bottom of the pit and thats as bad as it gets. If you feel like your slipping all you have to do is ask for help before you fall . Im glad you are not on your own ,get plenty of rest and keep talking. luv Sue x:bighug1:
Tell you how important you are Liam --- I just had a text from a very good, kind and trusted friend of mine - doesn't even belong to the forum now just has a read of posts now and again. She just texted me and told me you had attempted taking your own life and she knew I would want to know.
Oh thank god you are at home with your family - I heaved the hugest sigh when I read that you were back there. God that post scared me - I so didn't think you would go that far Liam. Yes, this means you are worse than you thought you were, the gp thought you were and many others on here I reckon.
I know that place you were in which you described as being in a black cylinder. There seems nowhere to turn, no reason to anyway, no longer able to endure the feelings... and that's it. Then come the thoughts that you would be better off not being here.
Everything passes, these moods do pass - may take months, may take weeks but I promise they do. Always tell yourself that how you feel one moment, one hour, one day, can change in instant.
Escitalapram, yes better than Citalapram. Less side effects and is meant to be superior to its' partner Citalapram. Get on it, get through the side effects, think positive and use this site as needed for support. We love ya xxxxxxxxxx
All these posts must be published in a book !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You take immense care and allow others to now look after you!
Lots of love xxx
Hi Liam
I just dont know what to say other than thank goodness your soulmate responded so quickly to your apparent unresponsiveness to contact with the outside world. As you say I also at times I have felt that complete blackness and that life is so hard and unforgiving that is it worth going on, but as you said it was only fleeting in nature not like your experience. Mine was brought about because of illness and not life issues like you have.
As Yvonne says these moods do pass but it may take time and of course you recognising them for what they are, they are a reaction to what life is dishing out at this moment in time. try and think outside of the box with the things that you hold dear like your family and friends and even the support from total strangers.
What you must do to go forward is to stop blaming everything on yourself, this recession is the fault of a greedy banking system and ruthless bankers who are only interested in bonus payments and blow the future.and the look after yourself culture that has sprung up from the late seventies, early eighties.
Next time Liam if these moods strike may i suggest that you just get out of the house and just go for a good walk until they are gone. Glad you are still here Liam and I will watch when Veronica kicks your axx.
Ron
Friday 3rd. Thanks for the Pms and the postings guys. I thought I’d try and write daily for a little while and see if those who follow this thread want to tread these steps the few at a time that I’m going to try and see how long it takes to at least get back to sea level. After that, maybe we’ll even venture onto dry land!
So today’s first “challenge” was to get up, shower, shave, wash hair, eat and then go to the doctors. Went with eldest son. Lucky because Doc wants my meds handed to me one tablet at a time by a responsible party and then he only prescribed a week’s worth. Great. I’m ok with it. I’m past ego and humility at present for all the other reasons. But I’m a sensible head in some senses and even I know I can’t go anywhere on seven tablets. HOWEVER it is a useful and valid precaution. That meant this week’s tablets are £2 a DAY. Great. So I’ve applied online for Prescription Pre Payment Certificate and at £104 for a year I’ll take that thank you. I am realistic enough to know that I’m not going to be fixed in a fortnight of meds. I assume but shouldn’t that others know of this NHS facility…. If you don’t then I’ve contributed something in today’s missive already.
Cipralex. 5mg a day for a week. Zolpidem. 5mg a night for a week. Diazepam. 3 x 2mg as required daily. Last night (hardly surprising considering two nights total of about 3 hours) I did get about four hours worth of relatively untroubled sleepage. I shall have my tablet by my bed and if I haven’t switched off by 2am I shall pop the pill. I plan also to take my Cipralex at night and hope that any side effects work through while asleep. In truth I haven’t a clue. I do struggle as well with the concept of a drug that can possibly make you feel worse before it makes you begin to feel better. And all the paperwork not recommending it to those with suicidal thoughts or tendancies. Sigh.
So… I called round to my house. And got something to drive back to family home in. I felt alright on the road and I’ve de-toxed enough now five days later to not feel so druggy and therefore I’m not a liability to others. Fed the fish, grabbed some clean clothes, watered the plants. Son followed me back to home. Picked up meds. So far so good.
Then I went to check online banking. Soulmate had told bank that the business was in deep trouble and that there was little point in calling in personal guarantees for loans etc as there was no equity in the properties and that all I would do was go bankrupt and that they’d be wasting further monies. Real bull by the horn stuff. I had voluntarily damaged myself and was in no state to operate a business at the present time and they should liase with her while I got a bit better and then we’d work through the incoming tide of mess. The bank man said he’d freeze the one business account and come back to her with further discussions next week but in reality he didn’t think the bank would persue it far if the reality was as she’d stated. Interesting. If it’s not there to chase in this current financial climate and you’re not hiding stuff then the banks are going to have to take on the debt and “crystalise it” as they say.
TODAY THOUGH THEY FROZE MY PERSONAL BANK ACCOUNT. Ron, you are so right. As a result, there’s now a dominoe effect because it meant I couldn’t transfer some authorised overdraft facility to the house business account and as a result there’s now an unauthorised overdraft or two unpaid mortgages. Great. How helpful of the bank. And my reaction? Guilt? Panic? Anxiety? Fear? YES. All of them.
Until I went for a walk with the family and the dog. A couple of miles, great views, beautiful weather, fresh air. Woodlands, the smell of ferns, hay being mowed in the fields on the side. Came back through a cornfield and ran my hands through the wheat (Russell Crowe style in Gladiator). And thought..”Sod em.. I’m GLAD I gave all the monies that was there to the kids on Sunday”. They were my credits in those particular accounts. I have not taken the bank money. Ok.. I owe them elsewhere legitimately but I am VERY PLEASED I did THAT bit on Sunday… because as the primary business was going into trouble last week anyway.. they might have frozen my personal account as well without advising me and then the kids wouldn’t have had what little I did. Or the ex. Or soulmate. There’s a bit of irony here. I was going to put BACK 50% of the monies tonight. So the bank “loses”. And I “win” a little bit of a rise in the seawater as a result of thinking this through during the walk and some anxiety has faded this evening.
.
Tomorrow I may feel different as the loss of my bank account means I’ve lost another bit of control. So be it. Time to start looking at how you live life on cash and what you have as opposed to borrowing and banks. Brave speak on a Friday evening Liam. No contacts until Monday.
I have eaten better. Certainly helps being with family because it’s served up. I haven’t got to shop or prepare stuff. I’m going to stay here another week I think. I am surrounded by comfort and am left alone as much as I want to be. It also has value for them though. They do not need to fret and wonder if I am away in a dark room somewhere. Ex and I are able to talk a bit. And today she too woke with anxiety but she just rides it through with the lessons she learnt as she coped with cancer. And has begun the process of making lists and financial details to manage her own affairs in due course. We are talking a bit. But being gentle with each other. I feel ok being here with her. Soulmate has been round daily except today and she spent a half hour on phone with ex. All very helpful and the closest people of my entire life are able to support each other. Well.. soulmate is the true strength it should be said.
I think today we’ll not look at any aspects of suicide. We’ll settle for the above. I haven’t played Pirates for a week and I have a big slab of chocolate. Some for this evening and the rest for the quiz 2moro.
I have sleeping medication if I need it and a week to go through any side effects. I have the weekend to chill further and no need to even go into work if I don’t want to or can’t make it. I may take this step quietly though myself. Somewhere along the rise through the water I have to paddle a taddle myself again. And I have to do it on my own. I must also remember to breath OUT and not just IN. Night all. Liam xx
Hi Liam
Great post, had me in tears. Goodnight and god bless you.
Sharon
:bighug1: :bighug1: :bighug1: :bighug1: :bighug1: :bighug1: :bighug1:
Hi Liam
I am so pleased that you are having such valuable support from your family, ex partner and soulmate. It is times like these that show us how important families are and that we must never take them for granted. Also the walk did you good and it does ground you and show you how wonderful nature is in all of its glory.
Have you any hobbies that you could concentrate on as a means of distraction such as photography which would get you out and about and take some of the pressure off. Financially wise regarding personal debt have you thought of Citizens advice. If you ask them for help they may be able to approach the banks and other creditors to set up an IVA i think its called so avoiding bankrupcy. They are a powerful influence and as a third party they can approach these financial giants with getting sensible solutions laid out to allow you to get on with your life with the minimal anxiety possible.
Have a good weekend Liam and remember this only worry about those things that you can change and have under your control. It seems as though the banks are in control now, let them worry about how they are going to get there money.
All the best with the medication and with time you will be flying again with all of this behind you and a distant memory.
Ron
Was nice to read you are being well looked after and among people who care for you..Take plenty of walks and photos as Ron suggests,it will help distract you.Loved the part about Russel Crowe,brought a lump to my throat..Hope your new Med is not making you feel too bad? at least its a lower starting dose than last time. Really hope you feel up to going in the quiz room later and you have saved some of your chocolate.Thinking of you Liam,Enjoy the quiz.Luv Suex:hugs:
It's Saturday night and quiz time is an hour away. Took the med at 11pm last night and then watched "Braveheart". Took the sleeper at 2am, conked about 2.30 and seemed apart from one piratical dream to go through to 6am. Youngest has kindly "binbagged" the window in this room so that I have relative darkness. I woke, and stupidly lay there thinking and trying to doze for an hour and a half. It's just a waste isn't it. The same thoughts just come bouncing in again uninvited. Finally at 7.30am I switched on the bedside light and picked up a book. Then I catnapped, nodded and read for the best part of two hours. I must therefore try to just reach for a book AS SOON AS I AWAKE WHATEVER THE HOUR instead of just lying there in the dark and even darker places.
I would say there's no adverse reaction to that first tablet. And I was glad for the sleeper as it helped confidence. But we are going to maintain the usual candour through this thread and I'm certainly not over the "wishing it had worked" bit. I'd like to think it was part of the chemical process but at the end of the day it's only 6 days since I made the decision to turn the lights out and it's going to take time.
This is an even harder week now as eldest and girlfriend are leaving the family home next weekend. Deal done. House rented. I don't feel great about being a "sad bit" in a week when they should be enthusiastic and anticipating their future life. Needless to say Ex is troubled by their departure as well. The next stage of inevitability. It's hard to feign enthusiasm and not be selfish when simply put I need them around me at the moment. So, I have a week "to get myself together" somehow and hope that there's not too much side affect to deal with of the new meds. I must look to possibly going back to my own house next weekend.
What I have learnt though is they feel safer and less worried when I'm here and they're not keen on me going off on my own. Neither am I really but it is a step to be taken. And soon.
Little jollyness to pass on tonight. Sadly Ronski matters on the scale of my business collapse are not within reach of the help capabilities of the CAB. Worthy cause as they may be. But thanks for suggesting. Coincidently I was a professional casting photographer (theatre and actors) for several years but there's no time to be looking at such pleasurable activities when as a self employed person there's no benefits for me. I HAVE to work out what I can sell to live off.. and then inevitably go bankrupt probably. It's going to be a rather long and slow painful process.
So there we go. It's quiz in 50 mins. Bottle of Sprite, a rather depleted large bar of chocolate and "escape" for an hour. Rather than getting answers right.. I'll see if I can find some funny lines to make others smile. "lol will" always makes me feel a little better. I'll settle for that this evening and see how many lols I score. Night all. Have a truly good Sunday. Liam xx
Midnight. 5th July
Three months now
since I started this thread
Many dark hours
that I’ve spent in my bed
Forums and books
have all been read
Lucid insights
confidently said
Words of wisdom
enthusiastically spread
But the worst of thoughts
came into my head.
Many pills were taken
And I’m not dead
Reponsibility to take
For times ahead
A future still possible
Albeit with some dread
My children need me
TO CHOOSE LIFE INSTEAD
nomorepanic
05-07-09, 00:36
Liam
You are a strong person and a true gent and I love you for that :hugs:
You take care ok
You are a lovely person Liam and a wonderful Dad.Life will be different for a while ,but its still life.It will be a happy one for you again ,and the sun will shine.Your not alone ,it just feels like it .Sleep well . Thinking of you Sue xx Liked the poem x:weep:
Hi Liam
You sure know how to bring a tear to my eye. Your friends need you as well. You are a great man. Never let anyone tell you any different.
Sharona:bighug1: :bighug1: :bighug1:
48 hours of doing very very little. Just taking my meds, and read and read and read. Went swimming yesterday with eldest. Did me some good. But I haven’t ventured out much apart from that. Tomorrow I’m back at the doctors for my weekly dose of stuff and then in the afternoon it’s my follow up with the triage and we see how we go from there.
How do I feel? Better in some ways – (less anx abdomen) - worse in others as there’s still a great big train coming towards me and I’m still struggling to find the strength to get up and confront stuff. No particular side effects though and I can now sleep for about 5 hours uninterrupted. But at 6am or so when I wake it all hits like a giant wave of freezing water. I have taught myself however though to turn on the bedside and immediately reach for the book. Then I read and nap and read and nap for a couple of hours.
There’s an inevitability to having to stand up soon though and it probably starts tomorrow. When I think about it I am frightened and not sure what to try and deal with first. Soon the last of the monies will run out and I can feel that soulmate and I have “lost each other” in so many ways. It’s a sad Liam writing here at present. And 15 miles away there’s a sad but loyal soulmate. That’s my lot for today. Sorry there’s no jokes or clever stuff. Liam xx
freudian nightmare
07-07-09, 19:37
Hello liam,
I can identify with some of what you say, and feel for you at this anxious time. But soon all your problems will seem but a distant memory and you will be a stronger person for it, it just doesn't feel that way right now. Best wishes and take care xx
Veronica H
07-07-09, 23:26
A big hug Liam. See what tomorrow brings before you think about the big
train. Try not to block the negative thoughts as this will tire you out even more, but let them float in and out again without engaging with them. You still need rest, and what will be will be, and no one will starve and the people that really love you will always be there. Soulmate is probably exhausted too so don't mistake fatigue for emotional distance. Let it be lovely man and pace yourself.
Love and hugs
Veronicax
Hi Liam
The poem was great. So, you're taking the med and doing okay so far - that's brilliant.
Sounds like you're being looked after well, being with the family is exactly what you needed. You just cannot be alone when suffering such agony and you did the right thing to rejoin family.
I know how it feels when siblings leave home - so this is just an added emotional upset for your wife. I know how you would love to be enthusiastic for son and his g/f, you can only try to muster up some enthusiasm for their sake but if you can't then so be it. Remember, anxiety and depression are powerful illnesses which rob us of our old friend - ourself.
Keep writing Liam x
Another heart wrenching post ,which tells what these illnesses are capable of doing to us.That said ,Its good to hear you are sleeping and the escit hasnt made you feel like the last experience with ssris. When you see the train coming ,jump aboard and ride to the next place,not forgetting to get off now and again to breathe in the fresh air. Soulmate has her own personal stresses ,as well as feeling pretty cut up that you could think of leaving her to get on with it. Rational thoughts dont go hand in hand with Depression.and as Yvonne says it "robs you of you "and also of life as you know it.You wont be lost to each other for long Liam its a personal pain like you get with grief and it will bring you back together ,its a tough time for both of you.I hope your Dr andTriage appointments went well.Take one step at a time and be good to yourself.Hugs Sue:bighug1: x
A small reliability of sleep pattern coming in. 4-5 hours. Not brill especially when you want sleep for a place of refuge. JUST come back from swimming again so I hope a little physical stuff will help tire me a tad. Doctors = renewal of prescriptions for a week but upping the Zolpidem from 5mg to 10mg and see if that gives me a bit more time under the quilt. Different doctor. The one who still owns a porsche. We used to talk "top gear" on the rare occasion we met.. not any more. I then spent a couple hours just chatting with ex and soulmate together. Slightly odd but it's good to see they can row side by side during this crisis.
This afternoon I saw the Triage and I'm hopefully being referred to a pyschologist as an "accelerated case". I'm enrolled for stress management as a group therapy in September. Next week she wants to see if she can help me with some relaxation techniques. We'll report in due course. I candidly said I am not one for joss sticks and lavender candles personally but I was willing to give it a go.
Soulmate and I agreed another few days of no emails, no phones, no work. See if I can target next Monday as a day to go back into work. I do feel a little better for a couple of days of break but I just hope I'm not kidding myself and delaying an inevitable. It's fair to say though that I've needed a little less Diazepam today and my nerves don't feel quite so frayed. Either there's some benefit coming in after 5 days of Citalopram (which I don't think can kick in for a fortnight) or I'm just getting a little better from the respite in my own right. I'm still here though. And trying to find a flicker of candle light in myself.
Still not ready to discuss attempted suicide any further in this thread yet and therefore question the value of committing wordage to it. Today I heard from the kids some of the things I said to them when they came to the hospital and also what I'd said to soulmate when she was trying to bring me around. I have no memory of these statements.. and there's a bit of me wishes I didn't know now. But my family have to find their own ways of coping and I probably just have to take it on the chin when THEY want to talk for their own benefit. Not easy though. I also heard from soulmate that she'd wacked that bank pretty hard with what I'd done and we'll have to see in due course how hard they hit back for their monies.
So that's it for tonight. I am keen to write stuff that gives others something worth reading.. but I'm not there yet guys. Thanks for the supportive postings and PMs. I do truly appreciate them and the words of advice and encouragement. Liam xx
Rest is the bodys way of healing itself,be it body or mind. Another four days will help.You would be wise to not attempt too much too soon ,to avoid going backwards.Take time out ! when you need to.It wont pay to push too far at once.Small steps,are better than none at all. A familiar phrase ,spoken often here.It is possible your medication is beginning to kick in, some do say they feel slight improvement after a week. Its perfectly ok not to want to talk about certain things right now. Thats your choice ,and it should be respected. But you do understand ,that they need to sometimes & that must be very hard for you. Everyone is going through their own hell at the moment,but like many things time is a great healer.Keep focused and get plenty of rest the next few days . Goodnight Liam , Hugs Sue:bighug1: x
freudian nightmare
08-07-09, 22:23
Hello liam,
Glad to hear the anx has lessened a little for you, just keep up the rest a little longer and hopefully the much needed relaxation will follow and that old jokey liam will return with a vengeance and there'll be no stopping you lol! Best wishes xx
Hey you,
The writing is still great and your posts are worth reading. Now........ be told!!! Lol xx
No Liam there will not be any joss sticks, aromatherapy burners burning, hypnotic indian music in the background, I can assure you of that. The relaxation sessions will most likely be "progressive" relaxation whereby you tense and relax every muscle in the body. Other relaxation techniques will be taught as well - many and various I reckon. You may be lucky and have some light therapeutic music in the background. It will be good for you and it's good to get into a habit of the practice of relaxation every day.
The Cipralex could be having an effect, if people have never had an anti depressant it can kick in quicker I think. I think it's more placebo and I'm all for that. It's working Liam - it's working it's magic already!!!! Believe that.
I think it was Sue who said that doing a little is better than taking huge steps. Regarding work, you start off gently and do what you feel you can.
I'd like to hear all about the dark place you went to - but when you are ready is fine. I look forward to more wonderful words.
Great that ex and soul mate can be together and talk - that must make you feel easier inside.
Swimming! You're doing well! Keep it up - that's very very positive believe me.
One last thing, sleeping: Stop worrying about the sleeping, some people lie awake for hours at night. My shrink gave me a "talking to" when I kept going on about not sleeping. The key is to stop worrying about not sleeping at the moment. Take a nap during the day as you need it. Having told you the wise words of my ex shrink I do know how utterly punishing it is lying awake with thoughts chasing around the mind. The higher dosage of the Zopi stuff should help. xx
Hi Liam
I hope you are o.k?
Glad to hear you are being looked after.Hope the therapy helps mate.I am also glad to see you still posting. Its good to have your family around even if it is your ex and souldmate. I bet thats quite funny really.
Anyway, speak soon, Take care.
Love
Sharona
xxx:bighug1:
It's the middle of Friday afternoon, 10th of July. And at the moment I'm in a dark place. So I thought I'd try and write while I was in it. Yesterday wasn't a very good day. So I "wrote it off" and longed for the evening to come, the sun to set and the excuse to take the tablets and go to sleep. It was a long day.
I woke feeling better this morning, but as the hours have progressed so has the inevitability of all that I still have to face and at present I feel as if I'm no further on than I was the day before I took the decision. As I write student son is flying home to England ignorant of his dad's actions. Eldest son is trying to pack stuff ready to leave tomorrow and youngest has gone off to his girlfriend's. Ex is at her work, soulmate is on her own at our work valiantly trying to hold back a tide and I'm supposed to be "resting" and getting ready to face student son tomorrow, eldest's departure and then my return to work on Monday to face soulmate and mess.
I have no idea whether the Cipralex is starting to have an effect. There's no side effects as far as I can tell and the 10mg of Zolp does knock me out to the land of bliss and ignorance for five hours.
I'm trying to make the cylinder I described previously become at least a tunnel so that an end is in sight but it's not easy. I'm struggling in all senses here. How do you rally your own mind? Is it about getting up at 6am and taking some exercise? Eating breakfast? Attending to personal hygiene? Creating a disciplined timetable of events and days of structure? That all sounds fine on paper and when it flows from this keyboard and a good way to move forward.
But at each corner I'm going to bump into trains hurtling from the business and the personal debts and difficulties. It is so hard to consider moving on when the past is so active in front of you.
Here's some cut n paste from an earlier Skype (same as MSN) conversation with my soulmate.
ME "Just starting to feel really bad.. as all this train stuff is coming again isn't it? You're off inevitably to face your own music and I have to face mine. A failed suicide attempt "bought me" a fortnight's rest.. but will have lost me my soulmate."
HER "It needs to be looked at steadily and one small step at a time, that's the only way I've achieved anything this last week. It's harder because of the personal stuff, but where you are starting from in every respect is square one. Try not to see it as a failed suicide attempt, look at it as a full stop. Everything stopped and that's where you're beginning from."
ME "I don't want you to be a full stop".
HER "But don't you see, you put the full stop on the page, went, OK, that's enough, and when you're as ill as you are you need to get well before you can even consider any kind of relationship. I will help and support all I can, but for now you will only put your recovery back if you go down this road with your thoughts. There are no answers, that's why you took such desperate measures, but the first step has to be acceptance of a truly horrible situation, while you try to find some strength to carry on xxx
True words. But tragic ones for me in so many ways. It is hard to rest and recover when that ever repeated train sits there. Yvonne wants to hear about the dark place and I shall try to cover that in posts when a little stronger. Today I'll close with a simple thought though.
I survived my attempt. Now i have to attempt to survive.
Sorry you are still in a bad place Liam, Once you start to face the daily tasks of doing what has to be done ,will you feel that you are moving on. Facing your fears and staring them in the face is the only way .Avoidence will keep you standing still and realistically is no longer an option. A daily routine of necessary essentials to start the day and end it .Is a good way to start. Take each day as it comes, Many have been in your shoes and come out the other side. Many will be where you are right now. Soulmate is right you have to find the strength to carry on .As Ive said before ,board the train ,but get off every now and then and breathe the air. As for telling your son ,he will no doubt be upset ,but glad ,so very glad he still has his Dad..We all have an inner strength, just reach inside and feel it.We dont see the sun at night but we know its there ,its the same with your tunnel.You cant see it because its dark, but its there waiting to shine again. Sleep well and remember your not alone .Luv Sue:hugs: xx
nomorepanic
10-07-09, 23:12
You have to decide to live and fight or give in and I think you will choose life.
I have been so ill that I had to think hard about what life had to offer - I would never consider dying but I mean what is the quality of life?
You can come out the other side but it takes time and effort but you will do it Liam
xx
Liam
Rethinking my wanting to hear about the dark place I realise that it may not be a good idea for you to go back there or for others to read about. I don't want you to think about it all my friend. Full stop as soul mate said is right, so please do put a full stop under that day now.
You're doing well to get yourself out swimming Liam I promise you that. When you are that low and have bad anx getting yourself out anywhere is a complete triumph so give yourself a pat on the back for that.
Yes, structure your day if you can - and yes it is good in theory but extremely difficult to carry out the "structures" especially when the mornings can feel so bad when suffering depression.
Get over the horrible morning feelings, MAKE yourself get on. Washing and dressing is a must and makes you feel better - moving about is imperative in the mornings. Try to make a list of things to do during the day, try to follow the list. Do what you can, don't push it too much. Rest as you need to but the one thing you must try to avoid is lying on the sofa with fleece lol.
That's all for now - you take great care xx
48 hours has passed since my last rather depressing post. It's Sunday afternoon and everyone is out - I went for a short walk. A bit of effort to do it but I did. Yesterday was a tough day of trying to be a bit "cheery" while eldest and girlfriend packed their clutter into one of her dad's vans and began the mutliple trips of moving themselves and their two pet prairie dogs to new home about 2 miles away. Seems like a thousand.
And all the time of course we're waiting to hear from student son who seems to be flying forever as the only way we know is texts sent to him as showing "pending". We decided he and girlfriend needed to be able to come round and wax enthusiastically about their adventures and holiday in Florida while we ate and then after we'd done the "picture looking" we'd have to get serious and let him know what had happened while he was blissfully away. He had in fact spent four hours + just sitting on a runway waiting for a storm to pass. And then the umpteen hours of flight on top of that making them arrive early Sat morn.
Needless to say it was a dreadful feeling for me.. and a long long day. The speech was started so very well by the other wordcrafter of my family - eldest son who did a great job of telling the tale. There was a lot of tears and in fact I had the biggest cry I've had since my attempt and it has to be said that the family rallied so well. I know I am very much loved by them, I know I have caused great distress for which I am not blamed and that they demand I make every effort to stay alive.
Can others of you who have entered the "dark space" appreciate that contributes to the anxiety and depression? It adds "burden of responsibility" to an overloaded stress system. The easiest cop out is the cop out but because of them I have to put up with loads of oncoming trains as previously outlined in this thread. Doesn't that sound so selfish?
But it's a hard feeling to chase away. HOWEVER I woke feeling a bit better today. Probably a combination of climbing what was to me going to be a major hurdle. I wasn't expecing any difficulty with student son - just my pain at upsetting him so much. And the guilt of knowing the family had carried the burden of it all for a fortnight. ALSO MAYBE the Citalopram is starting to kick in.. I have no idea but it's day 10 and combined with the Zolp I do seem to be getting a reasonable sleep.
I woke about 6.30am but today for the first time in a few weeks I had constructive thoughts. Worked out a few hurldes; made decisions. Nothing that was going to stop my world spinning but a couple of steps in the right direction. And when I started to get too hectic I kicked it into touch and reached for the book. OR just CBT'd the thought elsewhere. Cat napped possibly as well. Eldest spent first night at new home and student son stayed here with girlfriend. He's coming back tonight, bringing his PC and we shall probably play Pirates a bit. I KNOW I can lean on him with no guilt and comfort just as I can with eldest. And indeed student son is around for a few weeks in reality if I need him. So I may try and enlist the help of him and youngest to make a few work steps and get some practical stuff done. We'll see.
I am very aware of trying to encourage them to get on with their own lives and plans in their own right... but I have also been made aware that their own lives and plans include most definitely me so getting me better appears to be their priority in reality. Nothing can take away the feeling of "spoiling" a bit the new house feelings for eldest and partner about coping with me and this lot when they are trying to have "happy first home" but then again it is the collapse of the business etc that nudged them along the track of independence and I am sure that they will be very happy in their new house. Indeed I would be... it's a lovely private little place they've found themselves at a very reasonable rent. Eldest can work there and the prairie dogs settled in very quickly.
They can manage it financially and eldest has been self employed for three years now. He doesn't rake it in but does seem to scrape by. Perhaps the need to stand on his own without dad loot will strengthen his resolve. The reality for me is I can tick that box as "covered" in terms of the gross responsibility I've carried lootwise. Sadly in ways he has no broadband at the new house for ten days or so.. and will need to come back here for work... SO.. I'll get to see him as long as I'm back at family home. We have ALWAYS had Skype and MSN to talk every day when not texting or on phones. But his final step will be when he's connected to the ether (which is what his work is all about as an online journalist) and then he'll be gone altogether. I just wandered into his huge and now empty room. First entered as a small boy in 1986. Sigh.
So.. am I glad my attempt was not sucessfull? Not yet.. no. But the rallying call is strong from all those around me and as said, today has been better. I must make sure I remember that tomorrow even if tomorrow isn't so good. But actually apart from the "Oh my god" bit about the pile of work poo I think it will be a little better. I have to go and re-new my prescription but without seeing the doctor. Wednesday I see the Triage and we'll be looking at relaxation techniques.
Of course soulmate and I are not spending time together and therefore for the first time in 17 years I'm not getting my "feet done" which for followers of this thread from it's first postings has BEEN my cutoff for so many years. A price I've had to pay for my actions.
Will we get back together properly in time? I can't say. And nor can she. She was/is the greatest friend and the biggest influence for good in my life. But to find me overdosed and unable to respond except apparently asking her to to "let me die" must have been a nightmare of an experience and one she may never be able to risk going through again.
To write that line was not easy - not easy to read back either. She has also told me she was very upset that I could go without saying "Goodbye". There's no answer to that because it just wasn't possible.
So the consequences of an attempted suicide are the need to accept responsibility for the very action itself. Only time will tell if my losses will be greater than if I hadn't tried. One thing is perfectly clear though. If the attempt had been "successful" then the losses for those that love me and still demand my presence would have been far greater than any losses I incur now.
My mental illness is certainly worse than anything physical I've had to go through in my reasonably physiologically undamaged life. I've never broken a bone of suffered a major accident to limb or organ. Time, medication and treatment cure those things unless terminal.
I have to work at avoiding termination in my head and begin to build the trust of the family so that they can travel their own roads and journeys without constantly worrying about their dad and where his head is at. Today's post is possibly the first recent real step in that direction. However, writing on NMP is so very much easier in the bravery department though. There's no Sat Nav out here is there?
Hi Liam
You sound so much more positive than you did on your last post and I am so glad that there may be a flicker of hope arising in you just to fight on and hopefully get well again in the not to distant future. But I think you must find that certain hope that life is worth living regardless of what life throws at you. I think it is very sad that you still find it hard to see that the love that your family, soulmate and friends have for you must be so fantastic that your buisness issues should be put into perspective. Yes they are dreadfull and awful but really are they worth dying over. No and if you havent got the money then the creditors cannot have it so please Liam put things into perspective and enjoy life at its most basic, the sunshine, walks in the countryside, laughter with your sons and blow the banks. Try not to continually mull over your problems as if things cannot be changed then whats the point, they will all be sorted eventually.
Look to the future and not to the past and I wish you well but please Liam get these thoughts of its all gloom and doom out of your mind. Get your relationship with soulmate back on track and just dont look back.
Ron
If it were that easy Ron. I don't hanker for what I'm losing... I would estimate there's about 400 hours of work to do SORTING the accumulated equipment and stuff from a 15 year business that had 10 people working it. And THAT is before I can go "That's that done now then.. let's see about moving on". And that does not take into account the paperwork, meetings, systems et al that have to be gone through. This is not a case of an unpaid mortgage and half a dozen credit cards and unemployment. The loss of 10 peoples jobs is a surprising amount of work for references, CVs, support, assistance. I'm sorry to "defend" openly Ronski but it's a massive can of worms involving 9 properties as well (2 of which contain ex staff... how I can possibly charge them rent - they're unemployed but somehow the mortgages are supposed to be paid). . And I now don't even have a bank account to process anything. And there is only ME to sort it.
Don't get me wrong. I hear exactly what you say about priorities and totally agree. Would be I could just go bust and pop into a small rented house and start again. THAT option is not open to me. Although this bit of of thread seems irrelevant to what I write here at NMP I would hope that it helps put a perspective on the negative aspect of the enormity of what I face to sort ALONGSIDE the issues of my head health. Liam xx
Veronica H
13-07-09, 09:16
:bighug1: Hi Liam. I hear what you are saying about the business and of course you have a point, but I think you sent a very powerful message to everyone recently that you were struggling and I am sure that your employees will already be thinking ahead for themselves as they are bright people. I know that soulmate is helping to wind things up but I think it is time to call in a few trusted friends to look at this too. You are in no fit state to be working right now. For the sake of your recovery reach out and let people help you. They can run major decisions past you. You are surrounded by bright people and you have invested in them in the past and you have been and continue to be a very caring boss and father. (I know you feel guilty about your attempt but this was a reaction to extreme pressure, this is not who you are). These are administrative tasks from here on in, and it will pass a great deal quicker if you let go and trust others to take it on.
Love and hugs Liamxx
freudian nightmare
13-07-09, 13:47
Hello liam,
It's good to hear some of the positive progress you've made since your last thread, you're doing well and you need to remember that. I'm glad you're getting much needed support and i hope other stuff will improve for you too, i'm sure it will with time but in the meantime look after yourself and keep taking those walks lol! Best wishes x
Just come back from "going to work" today for 4 hours. A small step in the right direction. Soulmate is having a dreadful time there on her own. There are no friends to Help Veronica H. Staff have all gone; kids have their own lives and jobs to lead. I've never been much of a friends person and the ones I have although supportive and keen to give advice are not able to get on and help with the practical element of 400 hours of clearing up work. It is quite tempting to just throw away the keys and leave the world to get on with it... but that's not a practical solution!
I have been able to establish a bank account of sorts which will enable me to push funds in and out regardless of bankruptcy or anything ( I think). Found it online and althouth not perfect it does offer a process of administrating money. I was able to answer most of soulmate's questions so she could proceed further but it is terrible to watch her slowly spiralling in her own right as she valiantly acts as an air traffic controller and holds the wolves at bay. It was however wonderful to kiss her, smell her and get a big cuddle.
Went round to the doctors to put my repeat prescription in and stupidly left my mobile on my desk. So the kids and ex couldn't get me when they phoned and therefore I created a small panic. Sorted it. Went back to my house. Soulmate last week had expected to find me "finished" in the hot tub. So I switched it off today. Another way of allaying her fears.
It was a strain going there to say the least. a 20 minute drive but I went through the woods and lanes deliberately. With the windows all open I could smell wet trees. Past the big oak covered in bunches of flowers saying Dad and surrounded by young people toys where someone had obviously died in a car crash and left youngsters behind. A poignant prompt to my mind.
Through then to the next village. I always smile when I see really big men walking very tiny dogs.
More hedges, fledglings, flock of Canada Geese en masse and en route in somewhat decisive fashion. And into work. A place now cold and dark, much silent machinery that once pulsed and painted new moving pictures with people who's careers I launched and others I developed. Uggg.
2nd Diazepam of the day and a cup of tea. And despite the little I could do, no wiser as to ways to move on. Listened to soulmate and her growing fears. Her sadness when she shops as after 17 years she no longer shops for us. As she rightly says we cannot pretend for a relationship now when there's so many hurdles in our way and there's no "opportunity" to run off and find a little cottage, two easy jobs and a start up.
But we didn't spend too much time on old ground thankfully. Little point. We were spiritually glad to be with each other for just a little while. But it has drained me. No need to go back 2moro specifically. I'll have a go Wed morn, Triage on Wed afternoon, pick up weekly prescription. The card for pre-paid prescription payment arrived so there's another task ticked off the long long list.
As I write, I have a mouthful of chocolate. Slap in the roof as usual and gently disolving. Brought a couple of tasks home and see if I can get those done tomorrow. Night time is still a good few hours away but at least I have a sleep process and MAYBE when I wake tomorrow I will remember that I DID GET TO WORK TODAY and that is a small triumph when I have recovered from it.
I disagree there Liam ,I see it as a Large triumph,considering what you are going through,Well done. I m pleased you have sorted out an account ,as Im sure that will help you with a lot of your problems. Your bound to feel drained and am glad that you didnt spend too long there today.Try to leave the tasks for tommorow locked in the drawer and think about them then. Tonight do what you can to switch off.Sleep and face tommorow when it comes. There will be solutions to you and your problems with Soulmate,but that is for another time ,things will work out if you both want the same. I bet she was happy to see you today,in more ways than one. :hugs: Untill tommorow rest and feel ,that today was an achievement & a big step in the right direction. Hugs Sue:bighug1:xx
Isn't it all a rollercoaster. I woke early, did the lying and thinking thing. Not too bad. Jumped off the bad thoughts when they crept in. SUPPOSED to be taking it easy because of the pressures of yesterday. Keep trying to run before I can walk. Walk? I can't even seem to crawl.
Halfway through the day, I suddenly started a "low moment".. not an "anx moment". Felt dreadful. No tummy churns, no particular anx just what I'll call a "What's the point; it's all hopeless" moment. I was trying to skype chat it with soulmate who was battling away at work dealing with yet another "I'm sorry you can't get him and he owes you money - He took an overdose 2.5 weeks ago and is off sick" conversation. When I know she's trying to deal with those, I of course feel worse. Two of my kids walked in just as I was having a huge howl about it all.. and of course that will have worried them.
Anyway, I TRIED to get out the room and go for a walk but I just went to bed, closed the curtains, stuck on a movie and conked out asleep. Which is the first time I've slept in the daytime since all the troubles began so something wanted to shut down obviously.
As I write now, I've got a bit of an anx across my middle, I'll have my 3rd Diaz of the day in a min. In fact I've just gulped it. I'm writing while waiting for tetley to talk to me. Went to the chatroom and isn't the help capability wonderful? There's usually someone there you can "lean on". But as I was just getting going another member arrived, and being the gent that I am and trying not to be selfish I left Tetley to stay there and sort the other member out.
SO HOW DO I FEEL RIGHT AT THIS MOMENT? I'm wishing it was later in the evening, when it was dark. I'm wishing I could be asleep for lots of hours instead of just a few. I'm wishing my body didn't feel 'orrible. I'm worried about trying to go to work 2moro, then the visit to the Triage in the afternoon because I rang to confirm my appointment but she's off sick so whether I'll get cancelled I don't know. Then I have to go and collect my repeat prescriptions after 4.30pm so I've got about 30 miles to drive altogether on my own. I feel as if I am having what my american friend calls a "pity party". I have moments of wishing I could stand up and fight this illness. I have tiny flashes of my old resiliant self. I breath in and I clench my fists and I stand.. and then I sit down again. And wonder what next.
And then I remember that this isn't the first time in my life I've tried to "take my own life". I had a major attempt when I was 19. NMP readers won't know this. Only people who have read my book. This of course is over 30 years ago and I must have got over it. Because since those dark days I've had many years and lots of experience. And this time round cannot be as bad surely. I was just a lad. But now, I'm a middle aged man with supposedly about 30 years ahead of me. And kids who want me there for their 50th birthdays.
Tetley has just chatted with me for five mins and that has helped. This is such a good site. I think I'll stop writing now. Let this Diazepam kick in and see if I want to return to the keyboard pen later this evening. The writer bit of me always wants to try and say something "witty" or up tempo or at least close with a bit of a happier note. But just at this moment I can't think of anything. So we'll keep it real, base it on what I feel, get off the sentence and eat a meal. That'll do! LOL
Hi Liam
I am glad you have made a few steps, even if they are little ones. I know what it feels like when you are having a down moment. I get them but I now tell myself its a little blip and try to ignore it. Its hard I know but I just try to keep myself busy and try not to reflect on it.
Things will get better love and I hope you can share more time with your soulmate. I know you have to do things at work which may not be nice but they have to be done. Keep talking to your family and your friends.They all need you.
Hope you have a good night and some more chocolate.
Sharona xxx
Hello will
You should write a book . what a great read I have really enjoyed this thread I am currently waiting for an appointment to start CBT. I can relate to your morning feeling .Maybe I too should cover my clock and set phone alarm.
Please keep us informed and good luck
Deb
Wednesday 15th July. Got my butt out of bed with effort, cleaned myself, ironed a shirt and went off to work. A LITTLE easier than Monday. Good to see soulmate. Tackled two jobs, one of which was my mortgage company. Got a two month break with no penalties. Apparently I was entitled to it. THIS SHOULD BE A TRIUMPHANT MOMENT BUT HARD TO MAKE IT ONE. So there's clinical depression for you. Got to Triage. Answered a pile of questions and I'd hoped to get on with some relaxation stuff but it got left too late. So maybe next time.
Picked up this week's meds and drove home. It seems like the days start reasonably ok.. and then by midday the spiral begins. I'm glad not to be having any side effects to the medication at least and apparently I can't suddenly expect to feel better but I hope it has some effect soon.
As daylight fades, so bravery increases. Thoughts creep in about doing more tomorrow and "getting my finger out". Courage raises as light levels drop. Hah!
On my own here now. Family all out. Went to eldest's and partner for tea. Worried them when I said I was coming home at 9pm but I was feeling weepy and I was not going to howl in their new happy home. Pursuaded eldest I'd be fine. He reluctantly let me go.
But as triage said today, 50-50 stuff. They can only help some of the way. The rest has to come from me and my mind. It's only 2 + weeks since I made a major negative decision and I can't expect my head to sort itself just like that after the pressures that made me get to that point.
Now though I begin to understand the real problems of mental health issues. I am severely clinically depressed with no clinic to go to. Surrounded by young family and an ex who need to get on with their own lives despite me. And yes support is needed by the family without a doubt, I accept it readily and they give generously but somehow I have to find a little light so their candles can burn brighter and that is still so very hard to do.
However, today I sorted two months space with my mortgage and also student son mortgage. Results. A huge increase in the number of people unemployed. A serious decrease in jobs available. I've spent my whole life working for myself and I must try and do it again now because there's no "popping to get a job" and having a respite period that way.
So... "time to get the finger out tomorrow" he says as the neighbour's horse winnies at the dying sunlight and I breath in the last drops of fresh air; windows must be shut from chilling breeze. The house is quiet. The retriever is snorting in his sleep at my feet and I'm going to see if my "anx buddy" is on MSN. Debb-22 suggests a book. Who knows eh? Let's see how the chapters roll because most books really do need a happy ending. xx
When I went to sleep last night there was a bit of me that so wanted to post something more positive today but from the moment I woke with "physicals" at 6.30am I knew the day was a goner. But 12 hours or so later it's been a reverse of yesterday's reactions. Wednesday started ok.. I got on with stuff and as the day went on so the spiral began. Today it's been the other way around. Is this the effect of change on Serotonin? I've now onto day 14 of Cipralex I think... and frankly I'm confused as much as I'm upset and depressed.
All the literature and online stuff seems to suggest that I'm "doing well" in terms of no side effects and that this drug becomes effective AFTER two weeks or so; some people earlier, some later. Exploring the info here on NMP seems to fortify those opinions.
It's poo. Simple as that. I've got a lot of support. People are helping me both in business and in the home and I struggle to take one tiny molecular step in the direction that everyone wants me to go in. I got a letter threatening proceedings for a grand today and it was like the end of the world! I've known about the situation for 8 months; it came as no surprise. But calamity in an envelope as far as I was concerned. Perspective seems to be in trouble as well.
We're back to a cylinder damn it. Where's my tunnel?
You have been taking steps in the right direction Liam.Youve been into work ,youve been to the Drs and Triage & you also went to your Son and his partners for tea. None of which I suspect you wanted to do. So it was small steps but steps in the right direction.Its a slow process at first with the medication,one good day and maybe two not as good, a rollercoaster ride. Youll end up with more good days than not.Dont let it dishearten you..You will no doubt know its your illness that is making you lose perspective,the drugs at first contribute to that. I think perhaps it could not necessarily be the letter regarding the thousand pound s that is the issue ,but more of SH-T here comes the train. Trains dont go through cylinders they go through tunnels .You have more than 50th Birthdays with your sons to look forward too, Engagements and weddings ,family outings and Grandchildren ,Theres that cottage with the soulmate and days spent ,just feeling glad your alive . Think back to what you would have missed if you had suceeded when you were 19. ! ,Tommorows another day ,another step or two up that mountain :yesyes: Sleep well my friend x .Hugs Suexx:hugs:
So... it's friday night. 9pm. And here's my question... WHY DO I FEEL OK RIGHT NOW? Today has been "ok". Compared to the last two, I feel "normal" again. As in "wondering where to start" tomorrow. Is this the medication beginning to take effect? Or is this just a better day than all the others over recent time?
I woke up feeling "ok". The little bit of relaxation technique started when time ran out with Triage on Wed was based on taking myself to my special beach whenever the mess kicked off in my head and I've been doing it. I can get there quick enough.. I can see and visualise. I can't stay there more than 15 seconds or so.. but because I'm working at getting there quick it HAS HAD THE DESIRED EFFECT. How strange.
Instead though of trying to rush around and do things I deliberately stayed in a recovery day; read book, surfed a while, ate properly.. and stuffed a pile of chocolate. It's Friday.. there wasn't much I could do to change the world. (Not a great day for personal hygiene though. Teeth will take some seeing to tomorrow).
Banks and Mortgage companies trying to reach me on the mobile now. I just ignored them and switched it off. I'll have another go at stuff on Monday. As suzy-sue says.. I DID some stuff this week. And today was "ok".
So... I have to take that triumph and not anticipate that tomorrow will be good or bad. It will be what it will be. If it's bad I shall remember that today was "ok". If it's good and I can get my finger out and manage a couple of things, it'll be two days on the trot and that's progress.
I confidently take my Cital at 11pm and my Zolp at midnight.. gently crept that back in time from 2am now... Switched of Kevin Costner's "JFK" about 12.30 and reached for the Wilbur Smith. After fifteen mins my eyes shut so I switched off the light with my eyes still closed, dumped the book and pillowed my (really need a hair cut) head. BANG. In came the thoughts. So, after two minutes I switched on the light again, bunged on the readers, grabbed the book and read again.. managed a page and my eyes closed.. so I left them there with the light on and the book still in hand and stayed like that for a while this time. I guess fifteen mins passed or so.. and then I had another go. Eyes still shut, book dumped, light out, focused thought on my soulmate's lovely legs, rolled the dunlopillo to a cold side and conked out.
Woke at some stage, glanced at the blacked out window and knew it was night. Went back to sleep. Woke about 6.30am and started an "ok" day. I'd like to say I felt a LOT better.. but I'll settle for "ok".
Cos then if tomorrow works out better it's a rung up the ladder isn't it?
And THAT would mean possibly.. that I was back at groundlevel. And THAT seems a good place to start a Sunday. Especially as to close tomorrow it's quiz day and I had to miss that last week.
So.... AT LAST A POST OF SOME POSITIVITY. MY DAY WAS "OK". Liam xx
It does seem that your medication is starting to kick in Liam.Its a pity that there isnt a pill to take for patience too. You certainly know the meaning of the word when you suffer with this illness.. You have the right frame of mind regarding tommorow,,every good day is a step in the right direction. The rest you had today will have done you good.You deserved the treat of chocolate.. The visualization will definately help you,the quicker you do it the better .The more you do it the longer it will last. Picture yourself walking barefoot ,feel the sand in your feet and the chill from the sea. Hear the sounds and smell the air ,describe it to yourself like you are writing a book. It is a useful exercise ,but takes a lot of practice. All in all I would say its been a week full of ups and downs .But your efforts have made it a pretty ok one ,and you should feel proud of that.As for tommorow who knows ? lets hope its ok too ! cos ok is pretty damn good in my book too. Sleep well and enjoy the quiz.Hugs Sue:hugs: xx
Hi Liam
Just updated on your posts. More excellent descriptive writing that not only illustrates to the reader your deepest feelings but also depicts where you are and what's going on around you. I could see the geese lol.
Okay I'm going to have to give you a bit of a talking to. !!!!!!!! .. In the nicest possible way............
Liam, you're not doing too badly - please do believe me. To get yourself to your workplace for one hour would be seen as a triumph - please try to see it that way. You have immense worries and you still manage to get yourself out, read etc etc. These things are extremely positive and I can promise you that if you had to see a shrink he would tell you this.
Liam I don't think you are suffering severe clinical depression. You are very depressed without doubt, but it is not clinical and it isn't what I would call severe. I want you to take comfort from what I saying and understand that what I'm telling you is to help you.
You are suffering "reactive" depression. This depression is the result of months of worry and stress, what you are feeling is absolutely normal - under the circumstances. What you are feeling is the pain of "burn out" when we just can't take any more.
Remember with anti depressants one can feel worse before feeling better. You have only been on the Cipralex for two weeks (I think) and so although you may not think you were getting any side effects - you may have suffered worse depression as a side effect.
Some people do get relief more quickly than others with the medications. However, I personally would say that's placebo and not the actual chemical reaction of the medication. The medication has to build up in the system before it works. I think you should feel some positive relief by 4 weeks. If you don't then the med can be increased. You are on a low dosage at the moment which is absolutely right.
You are managing to get yourself out, you are reading, you must believe me that these are very positive and good things. In severe depression to be able to pick up a book and concentrate onthe words would be impossible. To go out if severely depressed would be something you really could not face.
You are going through dark dark times with nasty thoughts coming at you - but who wouldn't be getting such thoughts with the worries you have. The not sleeping, the feelings of needing to cry are all normal - under the circumstances you are in ---- blimey I'm sounding like Claire Weekes lol.
The suicide attempt (I think) was your cry for help, it was the dark place where many of us have been when the self pity (which is completely justified) takes over. Of course we feel sorry for ourselves, we feel so bad, we can't see a light at the end of the tunnel and so suddenly we feel that the only way to stop the suffering is to sleep..................... I've never attempted suicide Liam but I have had some thoughts when I was very bad which were along the lines of "what is the point in this suffering".
You are a strong, kind and I am going to use the word "great" man. The love you feel for y our boys comes out in your posts so vividly and I believe you are a wonderful father. I think you want to make people happy,I think you delight in giving others' the benefit of your wonderful writing and I KNOW you will come back up and do what you do best - entertain people.
You said you are suffering clinical depression but there is no clinic to go to. Well Liam, there is. If your doctor sees that you are in a severe state I can assure you that he will refer you to the Mental Health Team. Use this website as your clinic, let us help you. You mentioned Tetley helping you - yes - she is a wonderful therapist no doubt about that.
Liam - forget that crap about keeping your chin up - you drop your chin whenever you want and you cry mate for as long as you need to. The crying is the body's way of releasing the adreneline which is causing the tension. The crying will relax you.
KNOW that your medication is going to work for you, KNOW you are going to survive this, and remember just how strong you really are.
Very big hugs to a very very nice man xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Isn't it great when others post? Breaks the monotony of my dronings. Day three of being "ok"... except when I had to get up, get dressed, clean myself, shave and all that stuff and then try and do something. I got as far as "do something". And then I got flappy. And ground to a halt. Albeit I was at least clean. And I did manage a half hour walk on my own. But I didn't do very well with "jolly hockey sticks" during it.
So I came back and googled "Reactive Depression".. and decided I probably started there and then slalomed down the hill into a worse snow pile.
And then the ex who'd been trying to see if I was entitled to any monies from the government on Friday (I've never had a benefit since my mother ceased getting my family allowance about 37 years ago) said they wanted details of my mortgage and other properties. And part of my business has nine mortgages. And they want all the details. And I mean the details. Never mind that I'm going to lose them which obviously I will... but sorting out all the details at THIS stage of my crisis? AHHHHHH!
So tomorrow I have to go to work by myself and see if I can sort out those details. It's a Sunday. No one around of course.. but I'm frightened. Simple as that.
Steps at a time would be lovely. I so hear the words of those of you who contribute. But I don't have the time for steps anymore. I need progress. And that means that I'm just going to have to go and get on with it somehow. And that sucks. Because it's dark now. Just finished the quiz at NMP. Had my hour of respite. Stuffed chocolate. So I can write the above "Just going to have to".. but tomorrow morning is a different matter.
And then it's Monday.. and then.. etc... HOWEVER I have NOT thought today "I wish it had worked" three weeks ago. I haven't gone.. "Yippeee, I'm glad it didn't" but I'll take this as an "ok plus 1 bit" day. Despite the flappy bit about stuff. I'm clean. I'm shaven. I've read literally thousands of pages over the last 3 weeks so maybe Yvonne is right.. and my plight is not as bad as others. Relativity is relative.. but there's no succour in it of course.
Student son and girlfriend are over at eldest son and girlfriend house tonight. Youngest sees girlfriend tomorrow and he's excited. Ex is going running in the morn. I shall be here on my own or will rally and get to work. I could achieve sooooo much if I could get there. Soulmate now has a bug. So she's feeling downer than down now as well. I so miss her and love her very much. But because of my illness probably what could have been fought for as a business and remnants dragged out of the mud seems even less likely.
I so wish I could get there Monday and say to her "Right then.. what shall I do to help?" But it won't happen.
Walter Cronkite died today. Watched him last night in Oliver Stone's JFK. I remember well the moon landings. rest in peace Walter. Liam xx
It is 3 weeks ago today that I decided to take enough tablets to end my life. It has only been the last couple of days that I’ve not thought too much about wishing I’d “succeeded” but that I would see as progress. I’ve been on Citalopram for just over a fortnight and I now confidently sleep for five hours or so with no disturbance or dreams that I am aware of compliments of the Zolpidem. I don’t get too many anx bands but it takes little thinking before I become overwhelmed and frightened of all that still lies before me to do.
Sadly I didn’t get to work today as hoped for. Therefore the opportunity of the weekend where the phones, bailiffs or emails cannot “get me” has been lost again.
Which means that I have the dilemma tomorrow of either “failing” to get to work again or trying to go there after doctor’s appointment in the morning.
I’ve not seen soulmate for a few days. She still has a bug and on top of her own stresses and strains it’s laid her low and she’s tired and weakened further. But somehow she’s held off many wolves and if I could but just find a little strength of inner spark I could help the helpless tasks.
With the doctor I need to see if he’ll agree to me handling my own meds now because somehow I have to get back to my own house along with all the other hurdles, and daily dispensing of medication makes that difficult. Family seem able to leave me for a while now at a time without worrying so at least SOME of us are healing.
Would that I could just take some more time out and NOT do stuff. Because I am aware that the rest is helping my nerves and that each of the last few days has been a little easier.
Or am I deluding myself? Is this self deception? Am I convincing myself I’ll get better if I carry on just lying here, reading books and looking forward to the twilight hours?
I pop to MSN a fair bit to see who’s there. Absence of onliners shows that others I know are doing a better job than me of being out or at least active on this Sunday afternoon. NMP is relatively busy with 55 members and over 220 guests logged in though. None of my “anx buddies” or support group are there at present.
I’m hurtling through books with my face just inches from the open window so at least I’m getting fresh air. It’s pouring with rain, the door has slammed from the breeze coming through and the rain spats my face when I lie there to read. It’s a good feeling.
I can “get to the beach” and I can stay there longer than a couple of days ago. I wonder if I can apply that technique when I TRY to deal with the hurdles rather than just the thinking processes. I write this now and probably lie to myself that I’ll get in to work tomorrow.
As I tap wordage, I’ve JUST received a text from Barclaycard. Apparently because I’ve not paid my instalment this month my credit rating is threatened. Firstly “There’s a surprise”. Secondly there’s a new way for the credit system to “get to you”. Must be legal to text you on Sundays now and point out the errors of your ways. In a world that now counts so much on “credit ratings” I have worked so hard and for so long to make and keep an impeccable record, it’s hard to just let it go and tell them to stuff their card and what do they want to do with the debt. I feel like faxing them my hospital report citing “significant overdose suicide attempt” and let the system know just how bad it can get out here for some of us when we’ve tried too hard for too long to stop our ships sinking.
It’s also tempting to try and pay the instalment but I’m best not to. What little money I have needs to be spent on living, not debt management. I can tell you this though. The Triage warned me that the ONE YOU MUST PAY IS THE COUNCIL TAX. There’s no leniency with that apparently. Your mortgage, your secured loans and your council tax. And the first two you can negotiate. But the council tax? THAT has to be paid. Nice one government.
Ex came and talked to me today. Trying to rally me. Told me she knew there was still a spark there inside me somewhere and that I just had to find it and ignite it again. In fairness she’s the person on the planet (I come from a broken family) who’s pretty much known me the longest. 29 years now. And of course she’s seen me jump many hurdles, face many challenges and overcome seemingly impossible obstacles (plenty of my own making). Perhaps she’s right.
There’s this tiny tiny bit of me seeing a tiny tiny bit of light. I THINK. But there’s an even tinier bit that goes when it really comes to the last minute and my back is finally to the wall and there’s no further reverse step to take then MAYBE that’s the moment I’ll step forward again. Won’t have any choice really will I? Liam xx
Hi Liam
Another great descriptive post. I am glad you can see a tiny bit of light, its better than none at all. I am glad the medication is working for you.
If like me, you have no patience and want everything to work now, it doesn't but I am glad to see it is slowly working. Your anxiety is getting less by the sounds of things. I am so glad you feel that little bit better.
It does make you feel as though somethings working. Its good to read your posts and find out how you are.It will get even better soon. I know you have to sort out the banks, its good to know their text service works- I would of texted somehing sarcastic back-but thats me.
Also good to know the goverment do not let you get away with the council tax-I am sorry but that sucks.
Anyway enough of me, hope you have a good night and good to see your posts getting longer. Take care.
Sharona :bighug1:
So... 48 hours since I last posted and what have I learnt or continued to remind myself? I've learnt that if you're on Diazepam with the "2mg when needed" bit.. that if you're having an ok day and you think they're not "needed".. then stick with them anyway.. because when you have a not so good day... then you wonder if it's because you didn't just take your allocated amount anyway!
I've reminded myself that just cos you've had a couple of "ok" days that it doesn't mean it carries on like that the next day! Today hasn't been poop. It's just been "not very good/bordering so so I suppose".
But after taking a diaz it levelled out a bit. And then a few hours later levelled out more with the 2nd one.
I've reminded myself that you have to push through and be active.. and I aint been. Ex breast cancer sufferer ex, is a good example. Wakes up feeling poo apparently but then gets on.. and battles away and the day gets better for her. Tomorrow I'm supposed to get into work and see soulmate and have catch up and try and do something useful. Also though the private financial matters are starting to kick in with auto texts from credit card companies, mobile messages (I aint answering it unless I know who it's from) being left by mortgage companies... and therefore bulls that have to be taken by horns. ANY VOLUNTEERS?
I don't want to do them. I'll discuss with soulmate and say "Now you've done most of the horrible business ones, would you like to move onto my other business and private finance? Only 9 mortages to discuss". People reading this might go "Why you got 9 mortgages... more fool you". Well here's why.
We chose to privately educate the kids from 4-11. (MY tab totally. Not a wife thing. Not a whinge just a fact. My commitment). We felt they'd get a better start in life/more options. At 11 if they couldn't get to "Grandma" schools.. then save the money at that stage until they worked out whether they wanted to go to college later. As a result we lived as a family in rented property only. We never bought a house. No savings.. it all went on school fees for 3 kids. So when they ALL got themselves to gram schools that was very rewarding.. and the fees stopped. But when you work for fees that you don't have in a family.. it's a big bill as the years go by.
So... four years ago when it was all over it was time to think of the future and pensions we didn't have.... so in addition to the business I decided to build a property portfolio and that money when they were sold up would go to the ex and the business would be for me and soulmate as THAT is what we'd built. All seemed a good plan. Honourable dealing with all involved. No divorce, no lawyer bills.. I'd protected and provided well for all members of the family. Bought properties steadily and surely, rented them off steadily and surely... and all going ok. Until the business went poo. And then the property market went poo and there were staff in properties (been there a couple of years).. and that went poo.. and then the banks went poo.. and so on...
What started out as a good plan to protect family, future, ex, kids and provide pensions.. all went pearshaped. As of course have many others... I seek no sympathy.. just thought I'd point out WHY there was nine mortgages.
And therefore nine more phone calls to make. EXCEPT unlike a domestic mortgage where they're playing ball.. this is more "business stuff".. and the bank have made it very hard by closing ALL my accounts.. so now it's even harder to work the problem.
Is this relevant to NMP? Not really.. but it's part of "my story".. so we'll bung in a few of the practicals as well as the therapy, consequences, anxieties and stress strategies to this epic tale as we go along.
SOMEWHERE on this site are men in similar positions.. and indeed women. But the men don't seem to talk in this thread. Cept Ronski!
I did my best family. I suppose it's not over yet. BUT the little things can make you feel guilty. The ex was watching Sky the other night and it just switched off halfway through the prog. Because the direct debit had disappeared from my account. BUT she was fine.. she knew, and had decided that she wasn't paying for it. And that was ok. And I was not to feel guilty.
But they could have waited until the END of Top Gear.
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