What to do now? My story. Appologize for the length.

[drummermike]

Posting in general anxiety in hopes that someone, somewhere will relate and contribute. My world is getting to small. Thanks in advance.

Hello all.

This is the second forum I belong to. The other being business related and not health related. So fortunately I am familiar with this vBulletin type forum.

My name is Mike, and I am in my early 40's.

My story (when all this came on) is so long it would be way to long to write and most would not read it all anyway. My goal is to share experiences and hopefully find like symptoms and problems from others so I can hopefully find the real answer to what happened to me. The majority of my life 20 years ... I spent as an emergency services worker as a Paramedic in the USA, upstate NY. A high volume city, running 5-8 calls per shift. From shootings to diabetics to minor scrapes and cuts to ... yes, psychological issues. I dealt with many panic stricken and anxiety stricken patients. Now ... I think I am one and have had minimal luck helping myself. Ironic huh?

I have had minor issues here and there throughout my life. Feeling spacey/dazed a couple times as a kid 16-19 years old. Feeling a little anxious - weird, but for only moments at a time maybe a full day here and there. Never thought much of it. No drugs, minimal alcohol, I was high on life, drumming and girls. :wink:

Fast forward to my late 30's. After divorce, and a significant reduction in being able to handle stress, especially emergency service stress, I went into a more mundane corporate type job. And only dabbled in EMS part-time. I knew something was up. Heart palps, rapid heart rate, (while relaxed) ... dread going on the next call etc ....... burn out I attributed it too. Which was fine, I wanted out at 40 anyway. Most Paramedics burn out in 5 years.

I met a great girl in a different state, PA. We fell in love, this was my best friend, not just any love connection. It was different. I saw myself with her and content for the rest of my life. Can't say that about even my marriage of 4 years. After being here PA, for 6 months, the transition was tough. New place, new culture, new everything. I missed home and all it had to offer. You don't see this until you move away. But it was only 3 hours away.

Many stresses unforeseen where brought into the relationship. Her ex husband caused many problems directly and indirectly. Court and custody issues etc ..... it was very stressful and sometimes scary. I had a hard time finding adequate employment in the area, and did not want to go back into EMS. The chronic problems and stress continued for a good year. We started a business together, I had an artistic background and we formed a decent sign and graphics business. I have always been sharp, articulate, and an excellent multi-tasker. I have always been able to do what I want ... when I want ... when it came to going to the store, taking a little trip or sitting with the neighbor next door, talking about nothing and everything all night long, without ANY discomfort.

Aside from chronic issues going on, (too many to talk about) I was watching a NASCAR race on TV the 500 in February 2006. I noticed I was not feeling right. My brain felt off "woozy". Woozy is MY word till this day. Shortly after this there were some arguments and I noticed when I was upset or raised my voice (which I don't like to do), I became even more woozy and weird feeling.

Then one day out of the blue we where talking (not arguing) about some stress issues. I was just standing talking and suddenly my head (brain) began spinning, NOT the room spinning. I felt out of control (of my senses). I told my GF something is wrong with me. I had to lay face down with my head in my hands (face down). I could not move my neck to lift my head. I could not describe what was wrong. My heart rate was normal. Breathing rate normal, (although shallow) from fear, and I just felt out of it and very woozy, it felt like my brain was on TILT ..... like a computer that freezes up or a pinball machine that goes on tilt and freezes. I was in this face down position for about 10 minutes. She calmed me and slowly it released it's grip.

This same thing happened 2 times more after this, but not as sever, on later dates.

Then while in Virginia beach, for a get away weekend, I was ordering a pizza in a Pizza shop, and I told my GF I didn't feel right, woozy, weak, spacey, dazed, and all the people and sounds ... sounded like being in an echo chamber. Did I mention I don't do drugs? And never have? This was like doing drugs. She said my eyes looked glazed, glassy. After going back to the hotel room I ate, calmed down and felt better except for the following bathroom issues, I'll spare you that.

Returning from the weekend trip, I felt ok. My GF then had a female Cancer scare that turned out to be nothing serious. But I panicked and thought the absolute worse, despite my medical background and feared if something happened to her, I loved her so much, i couldn't imagine life without her. What would I do alone in PA by myself if something did happen to her. I felt woozy during these thoughts, just odd. Brain kind of racey. Detached.

Then the court issues came up with her and her ex, I dreaded going to court for their custody issues, I just wanted a peaceful life. During this time I was still wozzy, and became depressed because I was not getting any better. Then I started with feeling detached and not quite with my environment. I was/am totally cognizant of what I was doing, where I was and all that, but just not feeling that warm, every thing is fine feeling, where life is in focus and content. This move to PA all of a sudden hit me that I may have made the wrong move. I wasn't eating right, and was basically not functioning at all. It was a struggle to do anything and feeling dazed and spacey scared me to the core. Life seemed flat.

After all the court issues were done, I went to every doctor and specialist imaginable. All findings normal, except some small glitches on my MRI on the frontal lobe that was deemed, "insignificant". All blood labs normal. However the ENT thought the true basic cause for my anxiety and fear was more likely from and eye/inner ear connection. But could not prove this. They even suggested painless migraines. (my suspicion) was seizure like activity. But again, nothing found.

Fast forward to today.

Since all this happened, I have serious trouble, walking in stores, talking to people for any length of time, I cannot turn too fast because I get motion sick, my eyes jerk slightly when focusing and reading, I am still spacey, a bit dazed especially without sound sleep, don't feel like I am real sometimes or even here (alive) but I am and I know it. Flat. My body is always in a minor chronic state of fear. My world has become very small. I don't play my drums out in bands anymore, I am uncomfortable around anyone anywhere, I feel drugged when I am walking through stores, and not totally connected. It has become very hard for me to get groceries. I cannot drive to far, sometimes I feel like my vision shifts and it scares me. I used to drive 70-80 miles per hour looking left and right quickly for house numbers as a Paramedic, without a trace of problems.

Till this day 3 years later ... this is what my life is like 24/7. I do get minor relief first thing in the morning after a good nights rest. Then as the day goes on especially under fluorescent lights, I get more spacey and fatigued (brain fatigue). Too many customers or phone calls I get overwhelmed mentally. Wow if you only knew me in emergency situations, total 360 degree change.

Yes I have seen a psychologist 10 times, he has 26 years experience. He say's it's GAD, situational stress and minor depression. Plus he believes there is an underlying organic issue. This has not been found.

Saw a psychiatrist, 30 years experience, feels it's major depression, I asked him if I was going crazy, he assured me it was not a serious mental illness such as Bipolar, Schizophrenia, etc ..... he tried several AD's ... I hated them ALL. They either speed me up much or make me feel severely flat and drugged. Not for me. The only thing that gave me some relief is .25 of Xanax. Which I do not take anymore. It's not much different then a couple glasses of wine, it calms the body but never the woozy issue I have.

The only thing that does seem to help is psuedophedrine in very small doses. This levels my focus, and I think more clear. It brings me more out of the spacey, dazed feeling, but NOTHING ever brings me back to where I was 5 years ago. Also Excedrine helps (I think the caffeine) and a cup of coffee also helps. It seems stimulants actually have a focus and calming effect for me. Yes they do make me a little jitterey, but nothing severe.

When I wear my contacts it makes motion issues worse, when I wear my glasses it seem to reduce the problem about 30%, which is weird, it should be the other way around. My vision is 20/20. NOTHING found wrong with my vision. At least from my eyes them self.

Anyway ....... as I write this long winded story, I have lost my GF that I loved more then anything, because she could not handle the stress of the failing economy, which has ruined our business almost all the way causing severe financial stress, and the fact that I could not get a second job due to my health issues. I couldn't go out with her to restaurants and fun stuff like I used to. I apologized for this many times. Any way she left the business, relationship and me. My parents offer verbal support and really have an "I am not interested in the stress" from what I am going through. But always give "best wishes" lol.

So my main issue now is I cannot get work anywhere because I am not functioning right, and no meds seem to work, I am in a state by myself with a failing business (due to no customers) our work is/was excellent, and no where to turn, still trying to find answers for this feeling in my head that won't quit. So I joined this forum to see if maybe someone else has/is going through this. I have never been NOT able to just pull myself up and re-start in life by finding a job ... digging a ditch if I had to, just to get by and start fresh. This has disabled me beyond belief. I asked my GF to please stay because I know she loves me and told me that when leaving. I told her I have a handicap apparently, many couples stay together through worse. But she wanted a different life. So that's that.

So here I am in the middle of the Ocean, in a life raft ....... and cannot see any land.

If you knew me 5 years ago you would be amazed at how self sufficient I was as a person. Alive, determined, optimistic, etc .... I miss drumming, people, shopping, going for drives and so much more. My biggest fear is now who will want someone in my position? How do I get a relationship with someone who wants to go out for dinner? How do I provide for my partner or family? Or myself for that matter.

What sucks the most is that I am a pretty good looking guy still in very good physical shape, all my hair and look pretty young for my age. I still have a lot to offer. Love, caring, affection, dedication ... but my brain won't give me a break. I swear I had a stroke, or blood vessel issue, but all test say otherwise. Maybe I'll find some answers on this forum. If you read all this, I think you are an amazing individual lol.

Ultimately I feel like my brain is off kilter. For a better description it's like this ... when coming out of a pool of water, sometimes water remains in your ear canal. You feel OFF ... then when you tip your head and tap your ear the water comes out. Then you feel normal ...... well for me the water never came out and I still feel off. Add in, a flat feeling in life, plus that feeling just before a Doctor comes in with your test results that could be life threatening, but then he gives you good news and you relax and feel relieved. I still feel like I am waiting for the news ........... plus ... not fully attached to my environment, but not out of body, all though I do feel like I am not real sometimes, but I laugh at that now ....... also I feel sometimes the opposite of claustrophobia ....... like I fear life ... or am not connected with it.

Does any of this sound familiar to anyone? Thanks, Mike

[alias_kev]

Wow Mike, someone who writes as much or more than me. That really is remarkable. Some of the others may be along and can hopefully shed more light on the stress/panic symptoms. A lot of what you describe physically is very different from most of my experience although I scored 20/21 on a UK GAD assessment test. The mental/emotional overload is fairly familiar though. I'm kind of the reverse to you in that most of my anxiety+stress originates from the Family Setting, and I'm still pretty good in a realtime crisis. I recall saying in school and uni that "I could deal with any emergency it was real life gave me problems". The odd thing is I recall having few if any problems in that era - I'm 47 now. The stress symptoms became apparent from about late 90s/early00s. Depression was assumed a bit then and again last year (when there was some). After I had some CBT and did a lot of research on the web I concluded that I'd had GAD building up atleast since that 99/01 time frame. The stress was more of a panic/fear response, and the depression was secondary or followed from reasonable life causes. ie. we are allowed to be sad/down sometimes!

My history was IT with long hours, fairly high stress and long distance commuting. However I always coped with work, professional responsibility is one the whole even OK now (although I'm not working much) but personal responsibility is pretty fraught still. At best my GAD rated 17/21 (down from 20/21).

Reading your symptoms - which sound very intense - I'm glad to hear that you got a pretty full medical screening. Although anxiety/fear/stress can bring out some wierd symptoms its good to be fairly sure its not something else. As you said with your med related experience the other candidates would have been: mild seizure, painless migraine, arrhythmias, (borderline) syncope. A close relative had vasovagal syncope for 18 months and the Southend neurology department had no understanding of it! They continued to blame it on psych' even when the psychologists laughed in their faces. Even with the vasovagal diagnosis they still blamed underbreathing. So in that sense I'd say keep an open mind while you still get unusual symptoms. The relative had post event symptoms that I eventually compared 98% to a Basal Region TIA although naturally no Dr ever blamed anything except "stress over the fainting". Dealing with their condition is probably part of what gave me such high anxiety based stress!!!!

If your symptoms were more main stream and given your history then from my reading on the web/books I'd say yeah is very likely GAD/Panic/Stress and then obviously a dollup of secondary depression as its made your life fall apart. Your symptoms do sound kind of borderline "brain event" though. It could be stress/panic induced - kind of brain chemistry overload - or even the underbreathing my relative was accused of (as a stress symptom) - but keep an open mind.

I'm sorry if my post is a bit lacking in positivity - I mainly wanted to sympathise and air what thoughts I could. Especially to a guy of a similar age. I ofcourse hate you for having all your hair - it heads south in my family from the early/late 20s. (Joke!). Its a shame your parents aren't too good at being supportive although I guess at 40+ we can't expect too much of them. Mine are/were 80+ so there's not much scope there for me.

In terms of impact on life what you describe is pretty common on here and not too dissimilar from my own experience. We are not easy people for partners, etc to cope with and the whole work/coping thing is a minefield.

What next - well keep posting I'm sure people will offer what support they can. I'm better at info than hand holding so I'll list some ideas for you:
1. read all the problems & phobias (maybe palpatations) on the LEFT <--
2. check out the similar pages at www.anxietycare.org.uk as I like their info too. This may give you a feel for whether the GAD/Panic diagnoses really fit your experience.
3. maybe do the UK NHS GAD-7 test (http://www.patient.co.uk/showdoc/40026141/). Its not definitive but its a self assessment of how anxiety based you are.
4. For the syncope thought take a look at STARS (http://www.stars.org.uk/). The thing is you don't describe blacking out but some of those peak symptoms sound like the edge of a faint/migraine/seizure. Ofcourse for you it might really all turn out to be anxiety/stress symptoms. Your reporting a good pulse does perhaps contradict syncope but I wanted to mention it because of your symptoms.
While researching my relative's condition I was amazed at the number of odd overlaping conditions out there and their often confused diagnosis. Migraine vs Epilepsy, Epilepsy vs Syncope, Stress vs Syncope, etc, etc.

Anyway I hope this rambling and interference may have helped in some way. If you want to keep talking then keep posting. I thought you deserved to know someone had read what you wrote and cared in the same way you did at an EMS scene.

Take Care.

[drummermike]

Thank you alias_kev for your response. It was very detailed and thorough. I know it was a long read.

I swear in my heart of hearts, and my gut and soul that something happened to me medically speaking. Even though I know there is a mild history of anxiety in my family. But these head spins were just different. Plain and simple.

The biggest factor that is destroying me is the spaciness, the eye movement (jerking effect) while reading or driving or looking in any direction etc ... and the not feeling real in this life anymore. That freaks me out the most. Couple that with not being able to function in the real world anymore due to these symptoms is taking it's toll.

So I go to work (my business across the street) and back to my apartment at night. That's it. When my GF was in the picture I would go to the mall or store with her occasionally, and muddle through. At least I got out.

This is all unimaginable, I am sure a lot of people get it. Hell, I used to drive 4 hours to help out a friend at the drop of a hat and love every minute of it.

So you are in EMS? Thanks again for taking the time to read my post. I usually don't post long ........ but I am lost. I have lots to say ........ and these walls in this apartment don't talk back. Mike

EDIT: By the way I have these brain symptoms all the time. Like typing right now I have to re-read sentences and my vision jerks when tracking words (moving eyes) ....... my body is relaxed and my heart rate is 64 and my breathing is about 10 times a minute. No panic it seems.

[xBettyBoopx]

Hi Mike

Wow, that's a lot of information to take in:blush: :blush:

I'm sorry you're having such a bad time. We all mourn the life that we had, but that doesn't mean you can't get some of it back or all of it.:yesyes:

You're story doesn't sound familiar, I never had that much of a life...lol:blush:

I don't have the feelings that you have, but I have heard that people do. Although I was wondering if you'd had your ears looked at? You say that you have had tests but I can't remember that you mentioned having the ears looked into. A lot of dizziness or spaced out symptoms can stem from an inner ear problem (not that I'm a doctor) but was just wondering.

The only thing that does seem to help is psuedophedrine in very small doses. This levels my focus, and I think more clear. It brings me more out of the spacey, dazed feeling, but NOTHING ever brings me back to where I was 5 years ago. If this medication works for you, why don't you take it all the time? I haven't heard of it, what's it for exactly?

Els

[drummermike]

Hi Mike

You say that you have had tests but I can't remember that you mentioned having the ears looked into.

Thanks 4 saying hello and sweating through my post.

Yes I had extensive ENT tests. Although one of my vestibular nerves is functioning a little lower then the other, apparently it is not enough to cause my issues.

Psuedophedrine or PsuedoPhed is a antihistamine in the states. Basically for allergies and stuffed up nose. It has stimulant properties.

I also get worse "woozy" symptoms after eating a meal for about 1 hour. BUT my glucose level are always fine. Normally in the past I would feel refreshed and energized after a meal or exercise. But not now.

Anyway, thanks for saying hello. The internet is amazing, in that we can meet ppl all across the globe. ~Mike ;)

[xBettyBoopx]

Seems strange that you are actually helped by stimulants. Wonder if it's depression that you are suffering from, you know lack of seratonin (sp).

Coffee, sometimes tea, ciggies etc seem to make most anxiety sufferers worse.

Would you try taking anti-depressants if your doctor suggested it? Sometimes people suffer with depression but don't even know it:scared15:

What do you think?

Els

[drummermike]

Great questions. Actually Psuedophderine acts on Dopamine levels, the feel good stuff ........ this also helps with concentration.

Yes I have tried AD's ........ Wellbutrin, minimal side effects with a feeling as if I had a POT of coffee all day long. Wayyyyyyy to stimulating.

Zoloft and the seritonin meds cause worse depression, wooziness, and a major flat feeling, I didn't care about nothing. These AD's don't sit well with me. The only med that helped a bit with anxiousness was xanax in ver small amounts. But that too bums me out.

Yes I have considered depression and so has my docs. It seems to have happen in succestion: Brain spins, Wooziness, Balance issues, Fear, Anxiety, depression ..........

So I agree with you, I don't fit in any one box. My shrink throws his hands up in the air, the medical Docs do the same. LOL ....... no answers. But there has to be some anxiety component. My fear level is wayy too much ... especially socially. ;)

[serenity]

Hi Mike,

I do relate to most of your symptoms though I am not sure that I would say I have had them 24/7. I have gone through phases where they are with me all the time but then inevitably they go away for times.

Ok, I am going to go against the grain here and say that I do believe that if you have been fully checked out medically then I think your symptoms are anxiety/depression related. Also, and I think this is fairly important, I think the fact that you are medically trained enabling you to really 'know' the worst is making things more difficult for you. I hope you know what I mean.... You have seen so much within your paramedic work and you have the knowledge base and sometimes with anxiety I believe that knowledge isn't power.... I am a nurse and I know that I have made myself so much worse at times because I know the possibilities and sometimes the failures of the system etc....sometimes I think it is easier if you have a kind of blind faith with doctors etc because then we wouldn't question things so much...

My advice would be the same advice I try to take myself and that is to try and get on with my life...don't check for symptoms, pulse rate, glucose levels etc...You know how and you have the means etc but you have done it and it is ok so you may as well try to accept it is all anxiety related and to stop focusing on the medical possibilities that have not been proven.

I have been the same as you....and still am to a certain degree...I go out to the supermarket and the fluoros make me feel all dizzy and woozy, I feel revolting but I self talk and make myself do the things and some days are better than others. I think you should try to do the things you used to do such as going out to dinner etc...kind of make yourself do the things and try not to let the feelings frighten you...just kind of go with them until they don't have the power to bother you so much. My feelings are always there in the background and if I let the fear in then they can overule me but I try my best to just focus on other things around me and I do get on. Try to not let this thing ruin your life because i believe that we can beat it.

Also, you are mourning the person you used to be quite alot in your post. I do that to but again I know it is not positive in any way and very unproductive. Yes we used to be like that and we are not now but...well I think life is a series of changes and some changes we learn from and can even become stronger from. To be honest it takes lots of strength and courage to handle anxiety so we need to give ourselves credit for that. You are still the strong capable person you always were...you have had anxiety creep into your life and that can be so debilitating and distressing but you are still there fighting and going on so you are still the strong person. Before you didnt have the anxiety to cope with so you cannot really compare then to now.

I have had exactly the same symptoms as you many, many times. A couple of years ago I had a breakdown from it all and became almost agorophobic. I couldn't take care of my children, couldn't even bring myself to pick them up from school. It was absolutely terrifying and yet before that I was always the 'strong' person that everyone relied on and I took care of everyone and lived with huge amounts of stress. Now I take a small amount of benzodiazepine daily and a sleeping tablet...I am able to live normally again and work part time as well as raise my family... I am always very, very aware of my anxiety and I always feel nervous about social events etc (was never like that before) but I do recognize how far I have come and I am proud of that. Anxiety and depression are nothing to sneeze at as we all know. I wouldn't wish them on my worst enemy!

Point of my very long reply (sorry for that) is....I believe your symptoms could very well be anxiety (I am constantly amazed by the symptoms anxiety can produce) and I think you should give yourself a break. You are coping and you are strong and capable....we are all to be congratulated for handling this awful disorder. And try not to let it rule you...try to keep on getting out etc and doing things even though you feel awful and slowly, slowly you may feel better about yourself and your life again...

All my best to you :bighug1:

Amanda

[mdLc]

Hi..sorry your feeling so down.
I know how awful it is to deal with such severe symptoms...Just curious to know if you have you ever been checked for vertigo?

[Jay Chal]

Hi Mike,

I'm sorry to hear you're having such a rough time of it.

I'm new here myself and others have answered you pretty comprehensively so I'll keep mine short. I just wanted to let you know that I have had a similar experience to you with the 'woozy' head. The only way I was ever able to explain it to doctors was to tell them it felt as though the inside of my head was out of synch with the outside. If I moved my head at all, even slightly, the 'wooziness' would happen, it was as though everything slowed down and my stomach would lurch as though I was falling and I wasn't able to focus; it felt as though both my eyes were 'wobbling' (like a cartoon character's but not nearly so funny :scared15: ). Similarly to you, I also used to feel as though I was in an 'echo chamber' with sounds magnified plus my own actions, such as putting one foot in front of the other down on the ground, seemed really exaggerated as though I was doing everything in slow motion...

I also went through a whole series of tests / scans that found no obvious physical cause.

Thankfully, things have calmed down somewhat now and I no longer get these symptoms. Having said that, I am still agoraphobic and unable to go out alone - but I think that's more to do with remembered experiences and worrying about them than it is to do with anything physically stopping me going out now. I'm working on it:) .

I hope things improve for you too soon and that you've been helped in some way by visiting the site. There are certainly alot of really helpful people here.

take care

Jay :)

[alias_kev]

Hey Mike, No my trade was "IT" eg, Computers nor EMS like you. The weird thing is historically I would probably have been a well suited as you since I was and remain pretty good in a crisis. Its the everyday kills me.

Yeah, I talked about other possible causes since you seemed unconvinced about it all being "anxiety on its own". The visual ticks thing is probably more common as a side effect of medication than as a symptom. Its that and the spaced outness which made me wonder - like you - about physiological illness being part or all of it. Ofcourse it could have been some minor physical trauma (in brain, nervous system or circulation) that started the stuff off. We never found out why my relative went vasovagal virtually overnight OR why it stopped about 18 months later. OK it wasn't quite like throwing a switch they'd had the odd normal faint in the past and a couple of normal faints afterwards BUT basically they got it, had it for 18 months and then got better.

After all even if it is essentially physchological (like my GAD) no-one actually offers any reliable explaination of why meds can change things or why our brain chemicals may be worse controlled/generated/supplied than most peoples.

Interesting - in a bad way - that you get the visual ticks just typing. Does it depend on how much you are concentrating or how important the situation is? Eg. is reading a funny novel different from say a tax document or a health website? And thats not to clear up the physical/psycho question as its actually a combination of effort & mood that would be going on. But it might be revealing if its not just there as a constant. Those are pretty calm stats - although only some anxiety is about panic, its just most anxiety books that are! Certainly in our local libraries. In the heart/respiration area it would only leave arrhythmias or the old "bad breathing" ie. shallow ineffective breathes that they often accuse Syncope sufferers of having (the 1970s diagnosis). Some of your spaciness and detachment might be classed as "de-personalisation" where (I think) people often become over aware of their body - more like sitting inside a robot rather than it being part of you.

Have you considered - in your best EMS manner - putting your symptoms into a site like Wrong Diagnosis (http://www.wrongdiagnosis.com/index.html) or another with medical content such as Healthline (http://www.healthline.com/directory/symptoms). NB: THESE ARE NOT GOOD SITES FOR THOSE WILL HEALTH PHOBIA - Don't even think about it. Maybe consider that quick GAD-7 test as it would give you a feel for how much your other symptoms/feelings fit GAD.

[alias_kev]

Good post - Serenity/Amanda. I wanted to explore Mike's alternatives as clearly even his medics didn't want to make an easy psych call. Different from the UK where its now neurology's lazy diagnosis - no help of course - but a lazy diagnosis.

Its nice when between us we can help someone tackle things from different directions at once.

I agree anxiety can be weird and very slow and subtle in its build up. Looking back I think I can see a bit of a pattern in my own past which was the GAD/avoidance/phobia building up. For the last few (many?) years it only really showed as stress (and maybe lazyness or lack of confidence in certain things). Then boom I went down bigtime last year. So it could be the same for Mike - I don't like that visual tick of his though.

[alias_kev]

Jay - interesting about the woozy-ness. I agree that sometimes we can have what I'd call a woollyness. Like thinking through cotton wool. Not sure if I've often had the more woozy feeling you and Mike describe. I guess the nearest I'd describe is feeling like you brain is a bit of a poor fit inside your head so its like it gets left slightly behind when you turn. Almost like momentary realtime concussion. I wonder if thats the same feeling you and Mike are describing.

There is a pretty mad interaction between the whole anxiety-depression-stress spectrum and brain chemistry. I'm not even sure if they know if the chemistry makes the psychology or the reverse or both probably in a bad feedback loop in those of us who get really bad.

[drummermike]

Jay - interesting about the woozy-ness. I agree that sometimes we can have what I'd call a woollyness. Like thinking through cotton wool. Not sure if I've often had the more woozy feeling you and Mike describe. I guess the nearest I'd describe is feeling like you brain is a bit of a poor fit inside your head so its like it gets left slightly behind when you turn. Almost like momentary realtime concussion. I wonder if thats the same feeling you and Mike are describing.

There is a pretty mad interaction between the whole anxiety-depression-stress spectrum and brain chemistry. I'm not even sure if they know if the chemistry makes the psychology or the reverse or both probably in a bad feedback loop in those of us who get really bad.

Hello again. Not a bad description actually. Even slight head movements for me can bring this on, especially if I am tired and my neck hurts. The jerking movements with my eyes happens in any circumstance especially when reading or concentrating, especially working on the computer since I design most days in the Sign Shop. However, yet again this increases when I am tired, or stressed or pressured. But I was always pressured my whole life. It is like this: Put a book in front of you, and VERY slightly move the book up and down, side to side about a fraction of an inch, minimally while you fix your eyes on reading. Thats what it's like. In addition it seems difficult to focus in a relaxed manner, But I do not see double.

Yes I have looked up everything imaginable in the last 3 years. I don't panic over every disease out there. I know enough from my medical background that the human body is an amazing machine. I know that the heart is wayyyy stronger then most realize, especially people with anxiety. So maybe this is why I DO NOT get the typical heart and respiratory concerns. I do get IBS symptoms all the time and I don't worry about colon cancer or any other GI cancers. There are rare at my age.

My only concern is the crazy wooziness everday and YES I agree with your idea about de-realization or de-personalization. I think I have aspects of this .... AND I think I have it because I am STILL in a chronic state of FEAR of something. Like I said, the feeling that you are waiting for cancer results and you are fearful .......... and when the good news comes, the fear washes away and is replaced with calm, warmth and the world looks colorful again and you sigh, and leave the doctors office and go for that BIG cheeseburger ........ and celebrate life. ALL IS OK. I don't have that feeling and haven't for 3 years.

I did find some medical issues like Dis-embarkment syndrome, that can make you feel like you just got of an amusment ride except it's constant. I do fit into that to an extent, no cure.

Basically my brain (partsof it) feel off. Like rediced blood flow. Probably the depression component. I am tossing all this out there because I feel maybe someday we all can put pieces of the puzzle together. If and when I get through this even 30% I will definately share why. I also think I have a lot of anger in me. I am angry, that I am not functioning right, because I have so much more to do in this life. Like everyone else here. Plus I have had many failures throughtout life and losses and normally I just muddle through and learn and create better opportunities, but this time around my mind is exhausted. Again probably the depression component. I have a myspace if anyone is interested, to share and sho you that I really am not all doom and gloom. At least I don't choose to be. :winks:

[drummermike]

All my best to you :bighug1:

Amanda

Thanks Amanda.

Glad a Nurse stepped in. I agree being in the medical field we can take things further then they might go. I rarely do this because I am aware of the body systems, there functions and basic statistic for most medical issues. Especially the hear. I am excellent in cardiology and know how much the heart can handle. Probably why I do not get cardio respiratory symptoms of anxiety too often.

I agree there is an anxiety component. But I have found few people including ones with serious issues like BP disorder and even Schizophrenia ... that have chronic, imbalance and eye problem when reading or tracking their visual field. However derealization and depersonalization seem to be popular.

I am happy that you responded. Mike ;)

[drummermike]

Hi..sorry your feeling so down.
I know how awful it is to deal with such severe symptoms...Just curious to know if you have you ever been checked for vertigo?

Hi ....... thanks. Yes I have had all the caloric, testing and just about everything from my ENT. I have NOT however gone to a Neuro Ophthalmologist, which I plan to do. Because I know deep down inside there is a visual, ear component, MAGINIFIED by anxiety or vice versa.

Here's a good question for anxiety sufferers ......... when you get into the shower in the morning .......... does anyone hang on to the wall while stepping in for fear of getting off balance? I do this every morning.

Wow you guys are great. Mike

[drummermike]

Hi Mike,

I'm sorry to hear you're having such a rough time of it.

I'm new here myself and others have answered you pretty comprehensively so I'll keep mine short. I just wanted to let you know that I have had a similar experience to you with the 'woozy' head. The only way I was ever able to explain it to doctors was to tell them it felt as though the inside of my head was out of synch with the outside. If I moved my head at all, even slightly, the 'wooziness' would happen, it was as though everything slowed down and my stomach would lurch as though I was falling and I wasn't able to focus; it felt as though both my eyes were 'wobbling' (like a cartoon character's but not nearly so funny :scared15: ). Similarly to you, I also used to feel as though I was in an 'echo chamber' with sounds magnified plus my own actions, such as putting one foot in front of the other down on the ground, seemed really exaggerated as though I was doing everything in slow motion...

I also went through a whole series of tests / scans that found no obvious physical cause.

Thankfully, things have calmed down somewhat now and I no longer get these symptoms. Having said that, I am still agoraphobic and unable to go out alone - but I think that's more to do with remembered experiences and worrying about them than it is to do with anything physically stopping me going out now. I'm working on it:) .

I hope things improve for you too soon and that you've been helped in some way by visiting the site. There are certainly alot of really helpful people here.

take care

Jay :)

Your description is VERY good!

My agoraphobia if I have this ....... my psychologist disagrees because I want to go out and love people, places etc ...... but he thinks my wooziness is scaring me and the spaciness.

The one thing that started me not going places, was at a restaurant having breakfast with my GF. Again we where discussing stress issues with her ex. I ate about a quarter of my food and sipped my coffee ....... and suddenly my hands, froze in position, my head was down, and the outside world became a daze ...... like you see in movies when someone is out of it and people are saying "are you ok" but it's in the distance ....... I could not move myself for about 5 seconds ........ then I slowly snapped out of it ... and was terrified ....... I exscused myself to the bathroom and splashed cool water on my face ...... I couldn't finish eating and told my GF we had to go. Was this a panic attack? An anxiety attack? Again it's like the comuter in my rain FROZE .......... total blue screen lol ........... for those that understand blue screen.

I keep posting these examples ......... because I KNOW, someone else has gone through this.

Thanks again,

Mike ;)

[Captain America]

this may be a long shot, but have you considered subclinical epilepsy? a couple of times computer screen flicker rates (at 60 i can actually see the screen flashing) caused me to get really confused, so much so that i couldn't remember my own parents' names or my own phone number. seriously it was that bad. i had ct scans and nothing...they said migraine but i didn't have a headache with it. i stumbled across subclinical epilepsy, where you essentially have 'seizures' without the full blown everything.

i've considered getting tested for it myself, since to this day i think that kicked off my illness. i just have no idea who would do that. a neuro-opthamologist, or just a neuro?

[Captain America]

sorry..too add, along with the confusion during those episodes i really can't describe what i was seeing...but it was unlike anything i've experienced under any other circumstances. people talked to me but i couldn't reply, or if i did i said things that i don't remember saying. all i could do was lie down.

it happened to me twice while looking at a computer screen, and once while watching a movie (in a theatre) off to the side where i could almost see the dfferent lenses flashing the images on the screen.

more than a migraine, in my opinion

[drummermike]

sorry..too add, along with the confusion during those episodes i really can't describe what i was seeing...but it was unlike anything i've experienced under any other circumstances. people talked to me but i couldn't reply, or if i did i said things that i don't remember saying. all i could do was lie down.

it happened to me twice while looking at a computer screen, and once while watching a movie (in a theatre) off to the side where i could almost see the dfferent lenses flashing the images on the screen.

more than a migraine, in my opinion

haha ........ now we are digging! Yes I have considered simple seizures and in fact I have found some of my symptoms very similar. I have said this all along to my docs "it felt like I was having a seizure, but just in the brain".

What you also seem to describe is Ophthalmic migraines, with shimmering lights, kaleidoscope effects ...... no headache. And usually in the peripheries of your vision. I don't get these, but my GF does/did under stress ........ she also had a panic attack in a movie theater. Movies theaters make my ears go crazy with the loud sounds (never before) and the large screen is too much for me. Gives me bad anxiety. DID I MENTION I WAS A DRUMMER and played loud all my life? LOL ........

Good hunches you have there ..........

[drummermike]

ohhhhhh and yes CONFUSION is huge with me when I get these real bad spells ........... does not remind me of panic or anxiety ....... more my brain freezes up or goes off tilt .......

[ro44]

Hi Mike,

I have had so many strange "head sensations" over the past 15 years. Had many MRIs and tests and nobody has been able to tell me what causes them. I know how hard it is. Have you ever had your neck and spine xrayed? I think a lot of my problem may be from my neck. I have gone to many chiropractors over the years and I have finally found one who is really trying to help me. I started with him last July with a -11 degree curve in my neck ( it should be +18) Anyway, after 16 weeks of treatment, I was a -3 and now after recent xrays I am at 0. I am hoping that when I get a curve back in my neck that my weird head sensations will go away.

Anyway, your neck and spine may be perfectly fine, I was just wondering. I know that if you neck is really off it can affect eyes and well a lot of things.

Just a thought,

Ro

[drummermike]

Hi Mike,

I have had so many strange "head sensations" over the past 15 years. Had many MRIs and tests and nobody has been able to tell me what causes them. I know how hard it is. Have you ever had your neck and spine xrayed? I think a lot of my problem may be from my neck. I have gone to many chiropractors over the years and I have finally found one who is really trying to help me. I started with him last July with a -11 degree curve in my neck ( it should be +18) Anyway, after 16 weeks of treatment, I was a -3 and now after recent xrays I am at 0. I am hoping that when I get a curve back in my neck that my weird head sensations will go away.

Anyway, your neck and spine may be perfectly fine, I was just wondering. I know that if you neck is really off it can affect eyes and well a lot of things.

Just a thought,

Ro

Hi ....... yes and oddly enough I have yet to convince my Docs to MRI my neck and just below. I also cannot get them to do a MRAI and see the arteries.

My neck always is stiff and sore. I attributed this to constant computer work and tension. Mainly the tension, because I believe my neck muscles are trying to compensate for the wooziness I have constantly in my head.

In other words my neck is trying to keep my head still and my vision. So I agree with you and I think I should go to a chiro ........ but I feel so off I get nervous waiting in the waiting room ....... this stupid feeling stops me from doing much ..... I feel "odd" or "weird" when I go for these appointments ...... and I get the anxiety and agoraphobic?

My GF used to go with me to appointments, and even if I felt crappy I knew she was there. Now she is gone and so I have to force myself. It's a crazy life ....... I went anywehere anytime in the past. But like some other poster said now is the present. ~M

[WANTTOBEBETTER]

Hey Mike,
I am sorry you are feeling soo rough. I live in Virginia right below you. If you ever need to talk just let me know. I experience alot of the same sysmptoms. Not real thing also. read my post to see how crazy I am.

Good luck,
Greg

[Captain America]

ah yes, noise. i'm a guitar player and i started wearing musician ear plugs at practice. they helped a little, but funnily enough it almost seems like the vibration is worse than the volume. i've taken to positioning myself so that no one's amp is pointed at me. but those drums! our drummer is loud. very very very very very very loud. he breaks sticks on our ballads.

[ro44]

Mike,

I know exactly what you mean. For the first 16 weeks, I had to go to the chiropractor 3 times a week. Now I go twice. Actually he lets me go twice in one day. He says if I wait one hour in between adjustments, it will still work, so I will be going today with my son (he's getting treated also) and then we go eat and come back for the second one. It is VERY HARD for me to sit in the waiting room. I usually wait in the car so I can recline the seat and my son calls me on his cell when it's time for our adjustments. Ocassionally I will take my .25 of xanax an hour before I go and it will help. I try not to do that very often though. I hardly drive anywhere anymore unless I have to. I start feeling weird in the head when I drive. Also, when I have to hold my head still and talk to someone for very long. Even going out to eat at restaurants is so hard for me. I often tell my husband in the middle of the meal, "I'm going to the car" , I feel so off in the head. I have so much stiffness in my neck and shoulders and I often feel like my head is "heavy" and if I have to sit without supporting it, I will get a bad head sensation. Anyway, I hope that I will get better when my neck gets better. I think for me the problem is my neck along with my anxiety. And I think sometimes the neck problem is causing the anxiety.

Ro

[drummermike]

Mike,

I know exactly what you mean. For the first 16 weeks, I had to go to the chiropractor 3 times a week. Now I go twice. Actually he lets me go twice in one day. He says if I wait one hour in between adjustments, it will still work, so I will be going today with my son (he's getting treated also) and then we go eat and come back for the second one. It is VERY HARD for me to sit in the waiting room. I usually wait in the car so I can recline the seat and my son calls me on his cell when it's time for our adjustments. Ocassionally I will take my .25 of xanax an hour before I go and it will help. I try not to do that very often though. I hardly drive anywhere anymore unless I have to. I start feeling weird in the head when I drive. Also, when I have to hold my head still and talk to someone for very long. Even going out to eat at restaurants is so hard for me. I often tell my husband in the middle of the meal, "I'm going to the car" , I feel so off in the head. I have so much stiffness in my neck and shoulders and I often feel like my head is "heavy" and if I have to sit without supporting it, I will get a bad head sensation. Anyway, I hope that I will get better when my neck gets better. I think for me the problem is my neck along with my anxiety. And I think sometimes the neck problem is causing the anxiety.

Ro

wow. Your description is wayy too close to how I feel. I used to feel bad when out with my GF ...... I would have to go back out to the car or wait to go in etc ..... wow this really blows for lack of a better word. Now she's gone, she couldn't take it anymore. She needs a partner that can live life. I hate her being in someone else arms but she has to have a life. Although i think I would have stayed with her if the roles where reversed. I loved her that much.

Anyway ..... yep the wooziness stops me from interacting in public and in general. I have had days when the wooziness almost STOPPED. And when I was out in the mall or shopping I loved being there and with people. So I do not think i have a true social anxiety or agoraphobia. I think the sensation is causing the latter. For example, I just dropped off a letter at the local town office. I walked there, it's beautiful out. I went up the stairs, dropped off the letter and spoke with the secretary. I felt woozy but was ok. I turned to go back down the stairs and while I was looking down at the steps, I fely like I was being pushed forward and had to stop and grab the rail. Then I continued. Of course I get a rush of adrenaline when i felt I was going to fall down the stairs. Not the other way around.

Just tossing out what happens to me. In store when I scan with my eyes through the shelves of product, I get qozzier and overwhelmed and confused ...... like my brain is not keeping up with the input. Fun Fun!

I sooooooo understand your sitting in the car and being paged via cell phone. I had to do that while my GF waited my turn at the DMV to have my license photo taken. I felt like a cripple. So demeaning. Mike

[drummermike]

ah yes, noise. i'm a guitar player and i started wearing musician ear plugs at practice. they helped a little, but funnily enough it almost seems like the vibration is worse than the volume. i've taken to positioning myself so that no one's amp is pointed at me. but those drums! our drummer is loud. very very very very very very loud. he breaks sticks on our ballads.

Vibration sends me into a confused state. The bass players rig kills me. Heck I'm a drummer, low amplitude is my thing. I have the SAME issue as you. Even when cars go by with their deep bass vibration it rakes my nerves and actually effect my brain, not just my ears.

I thought I was just getting older and becoming like my parents ... ya know? But no something is not right. I spent many years in clubs LOVING loud music. Also high treble ............. makes me cringe .......... it's like someone turn up the sensitivity meter in my brain to high.

Man so far the people on this thread truly relate.

[ro44]

Yep,

This past November, I was in the grocery store at Wal Mart. Had a lot of groceries. I was almost done and all of a sudden, I got this incredibly wierd feeling in my head. It scared me SO BAD. I just knew I was having a stroke or seizure or something. I called my husband and said "Somethings wrong with me, you have to come and get me" Luckily he was only 20 minutes away. I felt weak, shaky (from the adrenaline, I'm sure) Heart started racing because of the fear. Luckily, I was able to push my cart down one aisle where there was a bench and I sat down, trying to look "normal". Fiddling with my cell phone, so people would think I was okay. I just knew that there was NO WAY I could push that cart to the check out and stand there and wait while they checked my groceries. So I sat there and wished I had some water so I could take a xanax. I know now that you can put one under your tongue and let it dissolve. Tastes really bitter but I usually carry lifesavers candy in my purse. Anyway, I started feeling better but couldn't wait for him to come and get me. I managed to walk to the car, leaning on him, I couldn't walk fast at all. Then, he wouldn't let me drive home so I laid in the back seat crying because I was so upset He paid for the groceries and drove me home. I've never been so bad that I actually had to call someone to come get me. I got home and took a whole .5 xanax and then felt okay, just very upset at what had happened.

This has been 6 months ago and it still "haunts" me. Maybe it was just a panic attack. But it was brought on by the HORRID HEAD FEELING I had which I don't know what it was. Anyway, I won't go on and on but now I only go to the smaller grocery store and I rarely go alone anymore. I haven't even been back in that Wal Mart Supercenter since. I go to the store with my son or hubby so that I can go back to the car if I need to. I HATE BEING THIS WAY, but for now, that's just how it is. I know how you feel, I wish I could have my life back.. I am still hopeful. I know we will both get better.

Ro

[drummermike]

Hey Mike,
I am sorry you are feeling soo rough. I live in Virginia right below you. If you ever need to talk just let me know. I experience alot of the same sysmptoms. Not real thing also. read my post to see how crazy I am.

Good luck,
Greg

Man I feel for you and you are NOT crazy. Stop using that word for yourself, you will believe it.

Although I have not had the experiences as severe as you I understand you. Mine are more subtle especially the not connected firmly in the moment or present. I am here, life or people are not flat, but am I really here? I feel more trapped in ME ........ probably because I don't feel good. I am tired and feel tapped out. I too was anxious when I was young, now reflecting back more so then I realized. Here's a wild thought for ya .....

I too worried about the end of the world. Though I'd be dead by 20, because certain religions said this. Didn't happen. But whats even weirder is I was sitting with my first girlfriend on the couch one day I was about 19 and she 24 lol ........ yep 24 ...... she was hot too lol ....... and we where talking and looking eye to pretty close cause we were probably being romantic, anyway ........ I loved her too .......

When I was looking into her eyes I got this weirdest feeling, like "what are eyes", how can she see me? "eyes are weird" ....... but I could not put a finger on why I was even thinking this. It passed ....... in moments but I remember fear and being anxious ....... wow that was odd. And clowns? forget about them. They are evil and I hate them to this day. Actually I ahte most inanimate object that act alive. Freaky. I think many people without mental issues feel this way too.

Talk about dejevus? All my life I would have these but there's a twist. During these dejevus ... I would ACTUALLY remember that I dreamed this memory ....... and I could place it to about 1-5 years of when I dreamed it. But could never be exact. But I knew ........ or at least thought I knew when the dream occured. Situations I was in where the exact same as my dream years later. Freaks me right out. I laughed about these occurences too. Did I really dream into the future? Doubt it .......... that's how I knw I am not crazy. If I was I would truly believe this occured.

Us musicians seem to have issues. lol ........ I don't mind little issues and quirks ....... but I do mind being non functional. ~M