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Karen
12-09-05, 15:10
Why does everyone give up on me eventually? I guess it is my own fault really and I drive everyone away. But just when I have been really trying to make an effort my therapist has told me she cannot continue seeing me because I have not been given any local support from the CMHT or psychiatrist.

Is this my fault? She said it is because I have been too fixed in what treatment I would accept, but the only treatments they offered me were medication (initially) and then admission to an eating disorder clinic. I don't want to be in hospital.

So now I am just wonder what is the point in even continuing to try. How much longer before everyone else gets fed up and leaves me too? She said she knows I will feel abandoned and she's right. This makes me really scared that K might now leave me too.

Whenever I try to do something to help myself get better I just get knocked back down again. Why should I even keep trying?

I'm sorry. I just feel incredibly let down at the moment.


Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

kairen
12-09-05, 15:41
Hi Karen,

Sorry you feel so bad,
Not everyone is going to leave you, and especially K, who has stood by you all this time, I really dont know what advice to offer you as i know little about how the NHS treats anorexia, not very well from what i have read about you,

Never think its not worth the fight, you have a lot of people here who have supported you for a long time,

I would still go back to your GP,
Maybe the eating disorder clinic is something you should think about again, if it is going to get you other support along the way, could you talk to your gp about this,
sorry im not much help but i am here to support you pet,

take care

kairen x

Sax
12-09-05, 15:49
Oh Dear Karen,

I'm very to hear you are so low and you feel let down by your therapist. You wrote why does everyone give up on you eventually?

I think you know deep down that none of us ever will, we are still here, listening, willing you on and no one is going to leave you! I am sure you also know K won't either, from what has been said on previous threads when you are feeling a little more positve you say she is a true friend who you know will never leave you through good and bad.

Karen I find it hard to give you any advice cos you are the person who is good at that ;) so all I can ask is for you to read your thread as though it was someone else and think about how you would reply to them! If you come up with any positive thoughts then hold them tight and don't let them go becasue as you would say the low period won't last and things will get brighter if steps are taken on a day to day basis rather than thinking too far ahead.

(((((((((((hugs))))))))))))))

Take care Karen

Sax xx[8D]

tracyp584
12-09-05, 16:20
Hey Karen,

Sorry to hear you are feeling so low, I don't really know what to say, other than agree with what others have said.

You are a valuable member to this site, who is always there for other people, just as we are all here for you too.

Take care,


tracy x x

Karen
12-09-05, 16:26
Thank you for your replies and I truly do appreciate your support.

Why does it still feel like this is all my fault? I feel like she has given up on me because it is my fault I am still ill and it is my fault that I haven't been offered any local help apart from admission to hospital.

Kairen - I appreciate what you are saying but I cannot go into the eating disorder unit. I would be completely cut off from K then and they would only pump me full of drugs and force me to gain weight so quickly that I would just come out and want to lose it all again. That is not going to help me.

My therapist has been certain that I need to go into hospital for some time and a couple of sessions back threatened to stop my therapy with her if I didn't agree to some local help. However, there is NO HELP available here. They turned me down for everything.

It just feels so hopeless.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
12-09-05, 17:36
Now I've written a really emotional message to K which she probably won't answer because it contravenes her list of what's banned.

I really really need her now. I'm so scared she will be next.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

clickaway
12-09-05, 18:14
K will not be next. She will be here for you.

She is a friend and not a paid professional.

Just like we won't desert you either.

I think you are going great guns in eating a little more, and wouldn't it just be fab if you could continue this trend and then go and show the doctors what you have achieved through your own self-will.

Keep fighting those anorexic voices and keep up with the food intake.

There's nothing I'd like more than to see you win.

And I'm stickin' around to see it...

Ray

And when you get the choice to sit it out or dance, I hope you dance.
~Mark Sanders and Tia Sillers

LisaS
12-09-05, 18:35
Hi Karen,

you have been doing so so well recently and making really positive steps on the recovery road, so dont let this put you off on your fantastic progress you have been making..

there is no way K or us will leave you - you know this, its that negative chatterbox again that you can listen to and know that thats all it is..

I know Kairen suggested the eating disorder clinic and you said you couldn't be in hosptial, but isn't this a daily clinic as an outpatient? There was one in london and one in maidstone wasnt' there?? and i very much doubt they are going to 'pump you full of drugs'!

I think you have really made good progress in the last couple of weeks so try and keep it going!!

love lisa
xxx

"do not fear to hope...Each time we smell the autumn's dying scent, we know that primrose time will come again"

tammyg
12-09-05, 20:34
Hi Karen,

sorry to hear you're feeling so bad. It is not hopeless, you have been doing so well. I look forward to reading your posts and checking on how you are doing. Sorry to hear about your therapist, surely they can offer you something else??

Whatever happens, remember, your (many!) friends on here will never leave you.

Take care

Tam x

Karen
12-09-05, 20:39
Thank you Ray and Lisa. It is good to know you have such faith in me but I don't have too much belief in myself right know.

I'm afraid I have slipped tonight and can't face eating and I am finding it impossible to ignore the anorexia. Looks like I've blown it again:(.


<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">I know Kairen suggested the eating disorder clinic and you said you couldn't be in hosptial, but isn't this a daily clinic as an outpatient? There was one in london and one in maidstone wasnt' there??<div align="right">Originally posted by LisaS - 12 September 2005 : 18:35:12</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
The psychiatrist was only offering me inpatient treatment, at Maidstone I think. I was turned down for the day hospital because they said I wasn't an urgent enough case and that I'm not 'in crisis'.

When I try to think rationally about the situation I know K won't leave me but then again people say that and then they DO leave or give up. I know I drive people to this so really I only get what I deserve. I'm just feeling extremely low and very scared again tonight.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
12-09-05, 20:57
I'm so pathetic getting so upset about such a stupid thing. I just feel like crying (again) but I can't and so I feel the need to harm myself instead.

This just brings back to me all those thoughts that I'll never get better and it is my own fault if I don't. Other people recover but each time someone else gives up on me it just reinforces my view that I'm worthless and that I have made myself so ill and will never recover.

Now I've ruined everything again.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

andrew
12-09-05, 21:20
karen, you do sound like your getting really down about this - obviously shes run out of ideas of what to do, it happens - but nobody else has, think about the ppl who are still here not those who have gone.
stop being so hard on yourself karen, your upset its not stupid or pathetic, its just how you feel. you can get through this - wishing you some support .. tc andrew

pips
12-09-05, 22:39
Karen,

None of this is your fault hun. please don't think that.

It does seem like when we are at our lowest we get knocked back again. You will get there though. There might be another alternative keep perservering.

You must keep trying and try to stay strong.

We are always here.

Take care

Sending you hugs and lots of POSITIVE thoughts.

Love PIP'S X X

Karen
13-09-05, 07:12
Thanks Tam, Andrew and Pips.

Wish I could say I am feeling better this morning but I'm not. I never expected any help to come from the psychiatrist of CMHT. I am used to the way things turned out with them - being passed round from person to person and no one actually doing anything to help.

However, I didn't expect my private therapist to give up on me, although to be fair I cannot afford to pay her so I guess this is another luxury I can't afford.

I just feel like I have seen so many different therapists over the years and ALL of them have given up eventually so it must be me. I must be beyond help. So what am I still doing here? I feel like I might as well just give up on myself too.

Don't think I can keep doing this and right now I really really need K.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
13-09-05, 09:21
It seems maybe I have been overreacting about my therapist giving up on me and maybe it is more about the money side of things and her business. However, she did say a while ago that she wouldn't keep treating me unless I had some local help in place too and I don't think that had anything to do with money.

She also said that she has already gone against her better judgement to keep seeing me this long when the idea of her treatment is that clients can be helped in around 6 sessions, whereas I have been seeing her for 9 months.

She did offer to keep in contact by email - though she is rather erratic about answering and said if there is work to do in the office I could do that in exchange for a session. But this isn't likely to be very often. So really I am left with no local therapy support now.

I've been thinking some pretty delusional anorexic thoughts yesterday and last night, as I got into such a state about all of this, including considering actions that really amount to another form of self-harm.

Thanks to having some sense talked into me in an email from Meg, I know I can't let what has happened sabotage my recent efforts. I did go off the rails yesterday by not eating from the time I received my therapist's email.

Now I need to try really hard to get back to where I was again. I'm just going to attempt some breakfast, but I'm feeling really anxious and panicky about it and would be happier trying if I had heard from K this morning.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
13-09-05, 11:42
Managed some breakfast. I had half a pot of yoghurt.

Now though I am getting increasingly anxious waiting to hear from K today. Even though I tried to edit my last message to her, I am still worried she will reject it for being too negative. I need to hear from her today.

I'm trying to get past all the anorexic thoughts I am having this morning and get back to what I was doing a couple of days ago.

This is so so hard.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

kairen
13-09-05, 12:13
Hi Karen,

Well done for all the effort your putting in, glad you managed breakfast,
keep it up, your doing well, just try and keep your mind occupied (easier said than done i know) Im sure you will hear from K, keep busy and distracted as long as you can

take care

kairen x

Karen
13-09-05, 13:14
Thank you Kairen. I am finding it very difficult to stay motivated with this at the moment. It would be so much easier to just give in to the anorexia and not eat.

I am also obsessively checking my other forum and another site for signs of K. This is why I usually prefer to sleep during the day because I can't help my compulsion to keep checking and I am getting more anxious and distressed the longer I don't hear from her.


Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
13-09-05, 16:38
I pushed myself to have half a sandwich with turkey for lunch.

Now I'm getting increasingly anxious and feeling panicky though because I've still heard nothing from K today and I've been on and off the computer all day looking out for signs of her.

I've also got someone from the estate agents coming at 5pm to talk about the marketing of my house and a possible price reduction.

I'm starting to panic now.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
13-09-05, 17:55
Glad that meeting is over. Have agreed to drop the price of my house by £5000 in the hope that it might generate some interest.

Just had to go out and get petrol too because I heard people are panic buying because of planned protests.

Now I've come back and still nothing from K. My determination to eat is now wavering as I am worried I am not going to hear from her today. Don't know whether this is because of what my therapist said or not as they know each other. I am getting really extremely desperate for contact now.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Piglet
13-09-05, 18:07
I think you're doing really well despite getting down over these bumps in the road. This week we were aiming for maintainance and you are doing that and some.

You're doing it with the main support being yourself, k and all your mates on here, so c'mon give yourself some credit.

I also think its a damn shame you can't attend a day hospital for treatment as I think you'd be ok with that, I can't pretend to understand the logic of why you would have to be more of a crisis to get that yet they suggest you be admitted into hosp surely thats the wrong way around - wouldn't the first port of call be the part-time day attendance and if that didn't help then think about going into hospital fulltime. Or am I missing something???

Anyway you keep eating these managable amounts and its all pointing in the right direction.

Love Piglet xxxx

Karen
13-09-05, 19:08
Hi Piglet

Thanks for your reply. You are right that I can't see that I am making good progress, I suppose because I still feel so terrible and it is such a big struggle. I do know I wouldn't be able to do it at all without K and everyone here and on my other forum who are supporting me.


<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">I also think its a damn shame you can't attend a day hospital for treatment as I think you'd be ok with that, I can't pretend to understand the logic of why you would have to be more of a crisis to get that yet they suggest you be admitted into hosp surely thats the wrong way around - wouldn't the first port of call be the part-time day attendance and if that didn't help then think about going into hospital fulltime. Or am I missing something???
<div align="right">Originally posted by Piglet - 13 September 2005 : 18:07:55</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
No you are not missing anything and I too cannot understand why they wanted me to agree to be admitted to hospital and yet said I am not a bad enough crisis case for the day hospital. They said the same thing about crisis team support too.

In fact the CMHT didn't even think it necessary to follow me up at all and yet in the same breath they are talking about sectioning me if I get worse.

The psychologist also turned me down for CBT.

I don't understand any of it personally and it hasn't improved my view of mental health services at all.

I am not doing very well this evening though because I've not heard from K today and I'm feeling very upset and distressed.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

sal
14-09-05, 00:22
Hi Karen

Sorry to hear this evening isnt going to well. Text me hun if you need to talk.

Love Sal xx


Dont mess up the best things in your life, just because at present you are unsure who you are.


"Life is a distance and to travel that distance you were given the strength and guidance to do so".

Karen
14-09-05, 06:53
Thank you Sal.

I did hear from K late yesterday evening, however now I am panicking because she told me she has written to the psychiatrist to ask why I was turned down for the day hospital.

I thought I had escaped from the psychiatrist and CMHT which I was pleased about because I still don't trust them and feel safer without their involvement. Now I am scared the psychiatrist might think I am worse because K has written and will force admission to hospital on me.

She is being really kind and doing what she thinks will help, which she believes is attending the day hospital. But I don't want to go there or have anything to do with NHS mental health services. They just make me worse and cause me more anxiety and panic.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

kairen
14-09-05, 08:20
Karen,

K has been with you all the way and supported you, I would do your hardest to go along with anything she suggests, I Know the thought of hospitals in the most scariest thing in the world to you but im sure with Ks help she will find a way of getting you help,

Please trust her she has your best interest at heart, and only wants you to get better,



kairen x

andrew
14-09-05, 08:30
hi karen,

the system just doesnt work does it - here you are, most probably doing/at your best so far this year and they still are stressing you, rather than supporting you.

you just keep on fighting and try not to let this situation hamper your progress .. tc andrew

Piglet
14-09-05, 08:47
Morning hun,

Just checking in to see how you are.

Love Pig xx

Karen
14-09-05, 17:21
Thanks for your replies Kairen, Andrew and Piglet.


<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">the system just doesnt work does it - here you are, most probably doing/at your best so far this year and they still are stressing you, rather than supporting you.
<div align="right">Originally posted by andrew - 14 September 2005 : 08:30:49</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
You are so right there Andrew. They are just stressing me rather than offering me any help.

In fact I saw my therapist this morning and she is pretty disgusted with the way things have been handled by the psychiatrist and CMHT. She also said they have 'played right into my hands' and just confirmed my beliefs that getting involved with NHS mental health services only serves to make me worse.

Had quite a good session with my therapist today and I now accept that she isn't giving up on me or abandoning me by calling a halt to regular session. It is just that she doesn't think what she is doing is having a significant impact on my problems and she has also been seeing me virtually for free for a while now and I realise that cannot continue indefinitely.

She had a few suggestions about how to keep pushing forward and she said she will see me maybe every 6 weeks or when there is work I can do in the office to offset the cost of my treatment. She also said I can keep in touch by email and if I am able to move forward a bit and feel her input would really be beneficial with anything specific then she would see me again. At the moment she said she doesn't see how she will be able to make a significant difference all the time I don't have any local support or treatment.

I am still worrying about K writing to the psychiatrist, even though I know she has done this with the best of intentions and is trying to help me. I just want to stay away from her and the CMHT from now on. I think they make me worse and I cope better without them.


Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
14-09-05, 20:16
The slightly more positive way I was feeling earlier is now draining from me because I am worrying about K again. I know I probably drive everyone mad with this but I can't stop worrying when I haven't heard from her and it gets worse the later in the day it gets, because I get more convinced that she won't be in contact.

I am worrying more tonight than usual because I think I said the wrong thing about her writing to the psychiatrist. The last thing I want to do is upset her. She is so good to me and helps me so much.

Also I had a funny turn in Tescos earlier which was entirely my own fault. As I had been out a large part of the day, leaving quite early this morning, I hadn't eaten anything and then realised I had to go and collect my prescription from the pharmacy. Really I should've eaten something when I got back from seeing my therapist, but instead I spent time on the forums and then went straight out again to pick up my medication.

I was standing in the queue and had a bad dizzy spell and felt like I was going to pass out. It was so embarrassing because I had to go and sit down. I don't know why this happened today because I have been used to going whole days without eating before, but maybe it is because I have been eating more regularly for the last week.

Anyway it was all fine in the end and nothing to worry about. I came home and did have some food. Now I am more concerned about not hearing from K.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

kairen
14-09-05, 22:08
Hi karen,

sounds like you had a really positive morning with therapist, i know as the day has gone on you have got more anxious, and i understand why, but go back to your first post and read it again and try to remember how positive you felt,
I know how hard it is for you when you dont hear from K, but you know she will always reply to you maybe not as often as you would like but she will reply

hope your ok tonight



kairen x

Karen
14-09-05, 22:12
Hi Kairen

Thanks for your reply. I am just getting more anxious as the night passes because she has read my message but not responded so I don't know what to make of that. I am so worried I have upset her.

Apart from that I am OK thanks. I am trying to hold on to the positive morning I had with my therapist. I just need to know K is alright. I hate to think I have hurt her.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

kairen
14-09-05, 22:20
Karen

You honestly wont have upset her, its just your mind going into overdrive, you know she is very busy a lot of the time, and she has prob quickly read your post and will reply when she has more time,

dont worry you know deep down she will reply,

kairen x

Karen
14-09-05, 23:46
Thank you for the reassurance Kairen.

I have now heard from her but I now know she isn't very happy with me and it is all my own fault.:(

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Sue K with 5
15-09-05, 01:36
Hi Karen

I have been on NMP for 4 months now, and in that time, I have found you to be the most supportive person to other on here. There is no way we would ever give up being there and supporting you. I have been doing therapy for many years on and off, and there are times when you feel like you have acheived nothing or feel like nothing is working.

You have a great inner strength which keeps you going and is backed up by the help and the support you get from K and your therapist and from the kind words from all the guys in here. Hold on to those and you will get through.

The anorexia has been your biggest hold on your life, but it can be beaten and you can get better.

Keep it going Karen we will always be here for you


Love sue with 5

scknight

Piglet
15-09-05, 09:46
Morning Karen,

How's it gong today?

Love Piglet x

paladin806
15-09-05, 11:29
Hi Karen, hope things are looking up for you again. I dont know too much about your illness, so i dont say too much, wise ehh.lol. But, i have to say that the way you get through is an inspiration to me, and from what i have read, many others as well. So, you keep on battling, keep on winning and we can all share in your victories. Just remember, a tiny win is still a win! Take care and keep it up girl, we all proud of you . John.

seh1980
15-09-05, 14:39
Hope all is well Karen :D

"Life is too important to take seriously" Corky Siegal

Karen
15-09-05, 14:54
Thank you for your replies guys.

Sue: Thank you so much for your comments. I really don't do much to help others here. I just feel like I am really selfish and always asking for help for myself without giving anything back. I don't believe I have anything valuabe to offer most of the time.

The anorexia is certainly one of the most difficult struggles I have had in my life, only from the point where this is the most serious in terms of my health. I know people do recover and I feel I should be making more progress too.

I am feeling physically better than yesterday. I slept quite well last night with the help of the sleeping tablets and I have been managing to eat regularly today, so have not had any recurrence of the dizziness that I experienced yesterday evening. I know it was a combination of not eating and lack of sleep which caused this yesterday.

However, I am feeling very low today and panicking about K (again). I still feel upset by her message from last night. I know it is all my own fault and I can't stop thinking that she must think I am such a despicable person. I don't know how she could possibly like me at all.

She continues to point out that I am fantasising regarding my feelings for her and I know this is true. It hurts though when she writes in no uncertain terms that there is no hope of my dreams ever coming true.

The part that makes me hate myself so much though is her comments about my recent behaviour and now I can't stop thinking that I am manipulative and she must hate me for this and think I am the worst person ever. I deserve what she said but I cannot handle it when I give her cause to think so badly of me.

I am so very upset today.:(

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Piglet
15-09-05, 15:23
Hi Karen,

Sorry you're feeling low about things with K - I'm sure it will sort itself out like it has done many times before.

You are still doing really well and must feel proud of that.

Big hug

Piglet :)

Karen
15-09-05, 16:23
Thank you Piglet


<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Sorry you're feeling low about things with K - I'm sure it will sort itself out like it has done many times before.
<div align="right">Originally posted by Piglet - 15 September 2005 : 15:23:09</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I know she won't leave me because of this, but I cannot handle the fact that she must be thinking so badly of me at the moment. I know what the right thing to do is but whatever I do next I will be letting someone down and making someone hate me. I have made an impossible situation for myself.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
15-09-05, 21:02
I am finding it impossible to cope with the anxiety of not knowing whether K will be in touch tonight or not and the later it gets, the more unlikely it becomes.

Can't cope with the guilt or feelings of self-loathing either.

I don't know what to do.

:(:(:(:(:(

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Piglet
15-09-05, 21:14
Aww hun don't worry I'm sure she'll be in touch soon - sometimes when we stress about this stuff we then go and find it wasn't always to do with us at all. It could be her day has been a bit full on with other stuff etc etc.

Big hug and try and get some sleep and see what tomorrow brings.

Nite nite

Piglet x

Karen
15-09-05, 22:11
Hi Piglet

Thanks for your reply.

I know I am always stressing when I don't hear from her so I suppose today isn't all that unusual. But it is because of her last message that I am panicking so much and feeling so distressed about this.

I cannot stop checking the forum to see if she has replied and then I despair more each time I find that she hasn't.

Don't know what to do.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
15-09-05, 22:44
She's not going to reply now. I have really blown it this time and she must be really upset with me:(:(:(

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
16-09-05, 00:42
Now I am having a major crisis with the anorexia. The thoughts this generates have gone into overdrive and I don't want to eat anything at all tomorrow. I need to go further even than restricting and need to starve myself. I deserve to be punished now.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Meg
16-09-05, 08:07
You don't need to do anything different at all . You keep doing what you've been doing .


Thoughts not instructions, Karen

Meg
www.anxietymanagementltd.com

Your anxiety is the human representation of the pictures that you paint using your many vivid colours of revolving and reoccurring thoughts.
How big is your gallery ?

Karen
16-09-05, 08:13
Thanks Meg. I have got myself completely worked up into a real state about this and know I am not going to feel reassured about anything until I hear from her.

I know the anorexia twisted my thoughts about what is happening with K and eating and I am trying to rationalise these and not give in but it is very hard.

I'm trying to fight the thoughts.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Piglet
16-09-05, 09:17
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">
Thoughts not instructions, Karen

Meg
www.anxietymanagementltd.com
<div align="right">Originally posted by Meg - 16 September 2005 : 08:07:37</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">

That is so true!!!

Karen just keep plodding on - you can do it! This is just another little bump in the road and doesn't stop you travelling.

Love Pig xx

Karen
16-09-05, 12:05
Thanks Piglet.

Unfortunately, I am now struggling even more because K is away for the weekend.

I haven't yet recovered from being in such a state because of no contact yesterday and all the worry that I have upset her, and now she is going to be away for the next couple of days. I can't cope.

I'm still convinced she is upset with me, particularly as she didn't reply to anything I said in my message.

Feel like I am caught in a downward spiral again and don't know how I can do this. The more distressed I get and the more I despair, the more thoughts of self-destructive actions I have.

I am trying so hard to ignore these and to keep going but I feel like I am fighting a losing battle.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

tammyg
16-09-05, 19:56
You did it before, Karen, so you can do it again. You have been given some great advice. Just because you are having a tough time at the moment, doesn't mean you have to give up. You have done so well, please keep trying.

Tam x

Karen
16-09-05, 20:08
Thanks for your reply Tam.

Have not had a particularly successful day with eating today. I did start off trying to challenge myself and bought some different foods at the supermarket.

I missed breakfast due to the upset about K. Then I tried to have a small amount of porridge for lunch - my therapist suggested this the other day. I don't know what it was really but as soon as I made it I felt sick and couldn't even take one mouthful. Maybe it was too much trying to add not only porridge but also milk into my diet when I haven't been having either. I also have a block to hot food for some reason, which I know is stupid and my therapist actually said warm food would be easier on my tummy.

Eventually I did manage to eat and have been trying to eat little and often since then, but mainly sticking to foods I've been already having for the past week.

I don't think now is the time to be challenging myself maybe while K is away because I am already so upset and fighting the despair of her not being around, without trying to tackle my anorexia too.

I also wish she hadn't gone away with me still believing she is upset with me. The thoughts I have about her safety and the compulsions are particularly strong today. Maybe it is my fear of losing her through my actions that mean I am now obsessing about her being hurt or injured in an accident. I hate having these thoughts, as I then worry that just thinking it will make it happen.


Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

tammyg
16-09-05, 20:18
That's great news, about the eating. If you are more comfortable eating foods you know you are familiar with, this is the best thing to do for now. You can start re-introducing new foods again when you are feeling a bit stronger.

Try to remember, 'it's just a thought'. Thoughts may feel real but will never make anything happen.

One step at a time, keep it up!!

Tam x

Karen
16-09-05, 21:53
Thanks Tam and Nigel for your replies.

I am going to stick with foods I can just about get past the anorexia for the time being I think. I can't handle trying anything different while I am feeling so anxious and low with K being away.

Thanks for the suggestion about the porridge Nigel. It wasn't so much that preparing it gave the anorexic thoughts time to take hold, as it was just Ready Brek and didn't take any longer than other foods I eat, like making a sandwich for example. It was trying to eat something hot that got to me and I don't know how to get past that.

I was on the verge of panic earlier with the anorexic thoughts getting to me and worrying about K. I am not coping well with eating today and the anorexia was telling me to starve and to get rid of all the food in the house to make sure I couldn't eat. I have done this before in panic but have managed to ride it out this time. It is so hard to force myself to eat when I feel so much better when I starve myself.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
17-09-05, 07:44
Have decided I need to get out of the house today before I let my thoughts and worries about K drive my to despair even more, as I can't stop panicking that she will be hurt and I will never hear from her again.

I have also been finding it really hard to cope with the anorexic thoughts and to keep eating. I did manage to eat eventually yesterday, but it would be so much easier to give in and not have anything at all.

My therapist told me the other day that I could attend another hypnosis workshop that is being run this weekend. I've been considering whether to go or not, as it is a long day and it also means facing my fears of being with people I don't know and trying to talk to people. I am not sure the extra anxiety will do much good but I think I probably do need the distraction.

I think I might just do today, rather than tomorrow as well because it might be too much with the long day I'll have on Monday for the Alton Towers meet.

Although I am struggling so much already with K being away, I am trying not to let it push me back and to keep going with my eating. Just need some help to do it.

Thanks for everyone's support.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Piglet
17-09-05, 11:51
Morning Karen,

Just saying hello and think the workshop sound interesting.

Love Pig xx

"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.

trac67
17-09-05, 12:40
Hi Karen,
Just wanted to say i am still thinking of you, keep up the good work with the eating you are doing well hun.
Take care
Trac xx

its "just a thought"

Karen
17-09-05, 18:54
Thanks Piglet and Trac.

I've been feeling so cold all day. I went really wrapped up because I find the room they use cold anyway and it was freezing when I left here this morning. However, I was still cold and had to sit with my coat over me for most of the day. I just couldn't get warm.

I also felt tired even though I did get a reasonable amount of sleep last night with the aid of my sleeping pills. The group relaxation this afternoon was good but I could've gone to sleep afterwards, maybe because this was led my by therapist and she usually leaves me to have a sleep after doing hypnosis when I see her at the clinic.

Apart from that the day went well. I managed to talk to a couple of people a little. I stayed in the room on my own to eat lunch because it causes me a lot of anxiety to eat in front of people and then I went and sat in the garden with a few of the others. My therapist and the other therapist who teaches the course were both there so it felt safe to join them. The problem was I felt even colder afterwards.



Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

seh1980
17-09-05, 20:11
Karen - I think you did brilliantly today!! You went, you spoke to people and you managed to eat a little. Well done!! :D

"If life were simple, word would have got around"

Karen
17-09-05, 21:03
Feeling really depressed now and am missing K like crazy. I thought being out all day would help take my mind off the fact that she's not around, but I still thought about her constantly and now I am at home it is even worse.

I feel caught in the grips of despair again and don't know how to cope. It is like she has gone and is never coming back. I just have this awful feeling and dread, like something has happened to her. What if she is hurt? Or ill? Or has an accident?

I miss her so much. I don't know what to do.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

tammyg
17-09-05, 21:35
You did well today. Try to remember you have been here before and it worked out ok then. She is probably absolutely fine, try not to worry.

Tam x

Karen
17-09-05, 21:53
Thanks for trying to reassure me Tam.

I keep trying to tell myself that these worries are irrational, but there is always that doubt and I can't help panicking that I might never hear from her again. Losing her is my worst fear.

Right now it doesn't feel like I have done very well today because it has all gone completely downhill tonight.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

trac67
17-09-05, 23:09
Karen,
You have done really well today Honey, so dont think that you havent, and remember K is always there for you and nothing will happen to her, she is a really good friend to you and always will be.

sending you a big hug karen
Take care
Trac xx

its "just a thought"

Karen
18-09-05, 00:00
Thank you Trac. Your support and hug is much needed and appreciated.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Piglet
18-09-05, 11:45
Morning Karen,

How's things today??

Love Pig xx

Karen
18-09-05, 19:51
Hi Piglet and Nigel

Thanks for your messages


<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">See, that female Ďmulti-taskingí thing that you girls always brag about isnít all that itís cracked up to be ;). Now if that were me then Iíd be incapable of paying attention to the lecture and thinking about something else at the same time.
<div align="right">Originally posted by Nigel - 18 September 2005 : 14:41:05</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
LOL Nigel. In fact this point was mentioned in one of the talks about one possible reason more women experience depression than men - because women do not tend to compartmentalise problems and therefore one problem can affect everything in life.

It is also true that I can pay attention to what is being said in the talks AND think about K at the same time.

I didn't manage so well today and felt quite withdrawn so I didn't really talk to anyone apart from Jill - my therapist. I stayed in on my own at lunchtime, partly because I didn't feel up to being with people and also because it was too cold to go anywhere.

Then I spent this afternoon in pain with stomach problems. I left early because I didn't want to be back too late anyway so I can hopefully get to sleep early tonight and also because I wasn't feeling well.

And I haven't been able to stop obsessing about K.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Piglet
18-09-05, 21:09
Hi Karen,

Well done for going today thats you being proactive rather than reactive!!!!

Nitey nite

Piglet :)

pinkscrumpy
18-09-05, 21:41
Hi Karen

As you know I don't post here as I can't really help. But I keep up to date and just like to remind you every now and again that I am here and thinking of you

((((((((((((((big hug))))))))))))))

Love

MANDIE XX

Will I ever escape this?
Will I ever be free?
Wake me up from this nightmare.
Please just give me the key!

Karen
19-09-05, 01:14
Thanks Mandie and Piglet.

I went to bed at 9pm, which is really early for me and took a sleeping pill to make sure I got a good night's sleep before the drive to Alton Towers tomorrow.

However, I have been wide awake again since about 11pm and can't sleep even though I am tired. I got up and started cleaning the kitchen because my head is just bursting with all these thoughts and worries going round and round.

Don't think I am going to be able to sleep again now and would have too get up again in a couple of hours anyway.

In a bit of a panic right now.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Meg
19-09-05, 21:57
Yes, because I woke you....oops sorry.

You had such a brilliant day in several ways today.

Karen
19-09-05, 22:59
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Yes, because I woke you....oops sorry.
<div align="right">Originally posted by Meg - 19 September 2005 : 21:57:58</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Don't worry about it! You know I don't sleep well anyway and it is unusual for me to be asleep so early at night.

I had a lovely day today and although I did feel tired and am now really shattered, I want to thank Sax for driving most of the way, as I would have been even more exhausted had I driven all that way myself.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Piglet
20-09-05, 08:54
Aww did you all have a lovely time yesterday??

Love Piglet x

Karen
20-09-05, 15:56
Hi Piglet

Yes I did have a lovely day yesterday thanks. I was too tired to post too much last night.

The weather yesterday was so cold and particularly in the morning when it was freezing - well probably not freezing to anyone but me, but it was certainly cold. I had so many layers of clothing on, having gone prepared with jumpers, jackets, fleeces etc but was still cold. The sun did come out eventually and I felt a little warmer during the afternoon.

I struggled with the anorexia and eating as usual. I didn't eat before leaving home yesterday morning because I just couldn't face it, which meant I didn't eat until lunchtime. I did feel incredibly anxious about eating with other people again but I did it with the support I had. Everyone else bought a hot meal there and I know this probably would have helped me warm up a little but there was no way I could manage it. I struggled enough with my sandwich.

I went on a few of the rides but sat out of the really scary ones again. I think I could have attempted a couple of them and maybe I will be braver next time!

However, I refused to go on the log flume because I know from last time that the person sitting in the front ends up totally drenched! Despite having a waterproof mac with me I didn't want to sit at the front and get wet so I decided to give it a miss! I enjoyed the water rapids ride though which is much gentler and you don't get too wet.

I was totally shattered when I arrived home and still feel exhausted today but I am so glad I could make it.

Of course, now I am back in negative interpretation mode again and thinking about all the things I could have done better at. I did manage to eat something but still found it a struggle and didn't eat as regularly as I know really I should to prevent myself from getting dizzy and light-headed. I also think I could have been more talkative but, as usual, I couldn't think of what to say and felt anything I did say would be stupid anyway.

I am still feeling better emotionally than before I went, as the positive effects of spending time with people who are now friends and who I know are not negatively judging me, are still helping me feel a bit better.

I do feel a little lost now though with nothing else to look forward to. And I am obsessively checking and waiting to see if I hear from K today.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

trac67
20-09-05, 16:17
Hi Karen,
Im so glad you had a good day, i am definatley coming on the next one.
Dont be in negative mode hun, you went, you met new people, you spoke, you ate, you went on rides, what is negative about that, that is so many positives, you did so well.
A big hug
Love Trac xx

its "just a thought"

Piglet
20-09-05, 17:29
Hi Karen,

Oh, it sounded a lovely day - I'm so jealous!!!

I'm with you mate as regards the rides, dodgems (I don't bump into people though I drive nicely) and riding in a tea-cup are as brave as I get (this is because I was violently sick after going on a waltzer as a kid).

I'd really like it if I were going on a meet and you were there, cos you are sure to make the others feel at ease, you come over as so gentle and unassuming. Karen those are lovely qualites!

You did so well for going - I most certainly couldn't have got there on my own and it was nice for you this time to have Sax for company. I'd be ok once I got there it would just be the getting there.

Well done hun.

Love Piglet:)

Karen
20-09-05, 18:01
Hi Trac

Thanks for your reply.

It would be great if you could make the next one. It is really good meeting up with friends from here, even if I don't say a lot!

I guess there was some positives in my actions yesterday. It is my perfectionist streak I suppose which makes me think I could have done so much better.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
20-09-05, 18:07
Hi Piglet

Thanks for your kind comments. It would be lovely to meet you too because you are so kind and supportive to others here. I am sure you will make it to a meet at some point, as you are making such good progress.

I am fine about travelling alone as long as I know where I am going. Until a year ago I hadn't driven anywhere alone apart from my local area. I do still have wobbles when I get lost and have had to phone for help in a panic. However, for me it is meeting new people and even being with people at all that is the challenge really. I do wish I could be more confident and speak more though without worrying that I don't have anything interesting to say.

Unfortunately no dodgems or tea-cup rides at AT! The water-karts are similar to dodgems but on water though!


Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Sax
20-09-05, 19:00
Hi Karen,

I would just like to say some things about meeting you and travelling up with you.

Firstly i am very flattered you even considered changing your plans and coming up with me having planned it a certain way I certainly didn't expect you to change your plans so thank you so much for that. I appologise it was so last minute, I really couldn't decide if to come or not!:D

I really appreciated the company and you gave me the push to go cos once you are committed into picking someone else up - you have to lol!!!!

I too was nervous about meeting you and everyone else - i'm sure it showed - however - on the positve the journey was about 4hours each way from when we met - of course there were silent moments - gosh you and I would have been exhausted if there hadn't been!!!!! I am not one for talking a lot so I am glad we had those moments, I just hope you didn't keep thinking you 'should' be talking cos i certainly would have found it hard going talking for 4 hours non stop. i like time to think so I thought we had a happy medium of talking and silent periods.

Karen, I thought we did grand and I really hope to travel with you again to another meet in the future - however - of course no pressure ok!!!! If you want to go alone you must just tell me however as we said financially it suited us and also again I reiterate that I enjoyed your company on the journeys!

Take care karen and until we meet again ok - ta ta!

Sax xx[8D]

Karen
20-09-05, 21:07
Hi Sax

Thanks for this message and I am glad the arrangements worked out so well for both of us. I think you were brave deciding to come at the last minute, particularly as this was the first time you had met any of us. I remember how anxious I felt before the first meet up I went to and I still do get anxious about it now, because of meeting new people.

It seems we helped each other. I am pleased that making the arrangement to meet and travel up together helped give you that final push to go and the fact that you drove helped me because I get physically tired very quickly due to the anorexia and, as much as I don't like admitting it, I did really struggle with the drive home from the last meet at Tamworth.

Whilst it is true that I do get anxious about changes to plans, this is because I have to feel that I am in control and have been able to meticulously plan everything, down to the tiniest detail. I do this weeks and months in advance of things! I also do recognise that I do need to challenge these anxieties and this was another chance to prove to myself that although I might get anxious and fret about changes to plans, I can and do cope when the time comes.

It seems we were both as nervous as one another! You did really well yesterday and coped fine. Some people are more outgoing and chatty than others and I guess we both need to realise that not everyone can be talking at once anyway. You are right about the journey and thinking about it logically, I doubt anyone could or would want to be talking the whole time.

Of course we can travel again to another meet in the future. I have become used to believing that I have to do everything alone, but it is good to have company on the journey and it also does make financially for both of us.

I am glad you enjoyed the day and were pleased you had made the decision to come.


Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

nomorepanic
20-09-05, 21:15
Karen/Sax

I think you both did fab to be thrown together for 4 hours when you didn't even know each other beforehand.

It doesn't matter who does all the talking or not as long as you were comfortable together.

Well done Sax for that long drive as well - you did brill.

Karen - you ate with us that is all that matters mate - I was not particularly pleased with my kids sausages and chips but it was all I could find to eat!

Well done to you both!


Nicola

"Nearly all happiness comes into our lives through doors we don't even remember leaving open"

Meg
20-09-05, 21:30
I think it was a great suggestion from Sax and a superb response from you Karen.

I wouldn't have disturbed you if I didn't think you could have done it ...

We know you are much stronger and far more adaptable than you often give yourself credit for.

Meg x

Karen
20-09-05, 21:31
Thank you Nic.

I know I tend to panic and catastrophise prior to things like this but then when it comes to it I somehow manage to get passed that and do it anyway, as is frequently pointed out to me!

I put myself under a lot of pressure about eating because these meet ups are the only times I eat with other people at all nowadays. I also felt I had something to prove after the enormous struggle and failure I felt I had at Tamworth when I didn't eat, not only because I felt I'd let certain people down but also to prove to myself that I have not deteriorated that much and could do it again when pushed.

Part of me is so fed up with this anorexia and everything it stops me from doing, as well as the way it makes me behave. I want to be able to eat normally, without even giving it a second thought but it is impossible to know or believe that this will happen.



Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

clickaway
21-09-05, 12:33
Hi Karen,

Just a quick Hello as I haven't been around on your threads too much lately. I'm still here for you though.

I'm so glad AT went so well for you - look at your posts after this event and the ones before it - what a contrast in styles and feelings.

Its super that you teamed up with Sax and that must have done you the world of good.

These friends do love you Karen. Now learn to love yourself.



Ray

And when you get the choice to sit it out or dance, I hope you dance.
~Mark Sanders and Tia Sillers

Karen
21-09-05, 14:57
Hi Meg


<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">I think it was a great suggestion from Sax and a superb response from you Karen.

I wouldn't have disturbed you if I didn't think you could have done it ...

We know you are much stronger and far more adaptable than you often give yourself credit for.

Meg x

<div align="right">Originally posted by Meg - 20 September 2005 : 21:30:00</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I missed this last night. Thanks for your message.

I know I don't have enough faith in my own abilities and often need a bit of a push to do things.


Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
21-09-05, 15:00
Thanks for your message Ray


<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">These friends do love you Karen. Now learn to love yourself.
<div align="right">Originally posted by clickaway - 21 September 2005 : 12:33:08</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Learning to like myself, let alone love myself, is the impossible task. I don't think I will ever be able to do this.



Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
21-09-05, 15:12
I have had one couple to view my house this afternoon and have someone else due in a few minutes. I'm really hoping something comes from these viewings as I get so anxious and panicky beforehand because of having to talk to the people. This is so difficult and I don't exactly do a very good sales job.

I'm trying to take anything anyone says when viewing with a pinch of salt because I know most people make positive comments when viewing but often don't make an offer. The last couple haven't even got their house on the market yet so I'm not hopeful there.


Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

clickaway
21-09-05, 15:14
I do understand your thoughts on that one, Karen. But I feel there must be a way forward.

Have you tried to write down ten positive words to describe yourself. Then you can pin them up in large writing on your kitchen wall.

If you don't come up with those words, I'm sure others will.

:D



Ray

And when you get the choice to sit it out or dance, I hope you dance.
~Mark Sanders and Tia Sillers

Karen
21-09-05, 15:29
Just had the second viewer who seemed positive but you can never tell. This lady is in rented accommodation at present so would be ideal.

I have someone else booked to view tomorrow, so I am really hoping something happens now. It is all really scary though too because then I would have to start trying to find somewhere to move to.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
21-09-05, 15:30
Thanks Ray, but I couldn't come up with any words, let alone 10.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

trac67
21-09-05, 15:52
Hi Karen,
Ok i will start you off on your 10 positive words about yourself, and i can tell this without even meeting you

1/ Kind
2/ Caring
3/ Warm
4/ Considerate

There you go thats 4 just off of the top of my head that i think describe you to a tee Karen.
Take Care
Big hug
Trac xx

its "just a thought"

Meg
21-09-05, 15:59
5/ compassionate

I could have finished this list off easily but you add one too

Meg
www.anxietymanagementltd.com

Your anxiety is the human representation of the pictures that you paint using your many vivid colours of revolving and reoccurring thoughts.
How big is your gallery ?

Karen
21-09-05, 16:10
Thank you Trac and Meg


<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">I could have finished this list off easily but you add one too
<div align="right">Originally posted by Meg - 21 September 2005 : 15:59:53</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Umm... this is so very difficult because I really cannot think of one single thing.

I am too used to being told how bad and worthless I am and now believe this to be true. It doesn't feel right to believe anything good about myself, and definitely not to say anything good about myself.

What about all the truly dreadful things I do?

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

nomorepanic
21-09-05, 16:12
6/ determined!

Nicola

"Nearly all happiness comes into our lives through doors we don't even remember leaving open"

Karen
21-09-05, 16:15
LOL Nic! Is that a positive trait?!?

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Piglet
21-09-05, 16:39
7. Unassuming
8. Gentle

Love Piglet xx

Karen
21-09-05, 16:50
Thank you everyone who added to the list. You are all really kind.

It feels like you are all talking about someone else and I don't recognise these words as describing me at all[:O].

The person I believe I am is terrible, worthless and most definitely selfish. I try to accept that this view I have of myself is just due to low self-esteem and that other people see me differently to the way I see myself, but somehow I still can't really believe that I am someone anyone would really want to know, let alone to want as a friend.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Meg
21-09-05, 16:51
Right Karen

Your mission should you wish to accept it, could now be take each of these traits and give us an example of when you think we were referring to.

Meg
www.anxietymanagementltd.com

Your anxiety is the human representation of the pictures that you paint using your many vivid colours of revolving and reoccurring thoughts.
How big is your gallery ?

Karen
21-09-05, 16:57
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Right Karen

Your mission should you wish to accept it, could now be take each of these traits and give us an example of when you think we were referring to.

Meg
www.anxietymanagementltd.com
<div align="right">Originally posted by Meg - 21 September 2005 : 16:51:09</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Hmm that is a HUGE challenge and would take some time I think.

I have a question though - how can I come up with an example for each trait when I don't believe I have these traits in the first place? How do I imagine when you were referring to?


Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
21-09-05, 16:59
Actually I can do the 'determined' one I think - going to Alton Towers (first or second time), or any of the meet ups I guess, especially when I did this against practically everyone's advice the first time.

Not sure about the others though...

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Quirky
21-09-05, 17:55
Karen,

I'd like to add (13) understanding to the list of good qualities. You've been so understanding to how I feel, it comes across in your posts, and even if you haven't suffered the same thing as me, like health anxiety, you try and understand how I am feeling.
You have some great qualities, this many people can't be wrong!
Takce care,
Love Lisa x

nomorepanic
21-09-05, 17:56
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">LOL Nic! Is that a positive trait?!?

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

<div align="right">Originally posted by Karen - 21 September 2005 : 16:15:41</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">

Oh yes cos you never stop trying do you?

Nicola

"Nearly all happiness comes into our lives through doors we don't even remember leaving open"

Meg
21-09-05, 19:39
**Hmm that is a HUGE challenge and would take some time I think.**

I'm not going anywhere ..


That was no 6 - well done !!

Now for another one or two as the list grows longer..

Meg xx

Karen
21-09-05, 19:59
LJ: Thanks for your contribution. I can't believe how many people have added to this list.


Nic: I guess that's true, although I often feel like giving up. I haven't yet though.


Meg:


<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">**Hmm that is a HUGE challenge and would take some time I think.**

I'm not going anywhere ..


That was no 6 - well done !!

Now for another one or two as the list grows longer..

Meg xx

<div align="right">Originally posted by Meg - 21 September 2005 : 19:39:35</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Still 12 to go though!

Can I count LJ's as done because she's given me the reason for her contribution?!?;)

I need to give some thought to the rest, so I hope you have got a lot of time to wait for examples!


Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Meg
21-09-05, 20:04
No you can't ! You write it out in the 1st person from your perspective.

Of course you don't have to do any of them if you choose not to.

Karen
21-09-05, 20:15
Okay Meg. I didn't think you'd let me get away with that! Back to the drawing board then.

13. Understanding - I do my best to consider how others are feeling when I post a reply. If I can't relate to the particular issue that person has then I try to instead think how I feel about the things that cause me anxiety and reply with this in mind.

Is that ok?

I will try to do some of them at least but I am rather in a spin about the house situation tonight to be able to think too clearly about this. Most of these are traits I don't see in myself and so it is so difficult to imagine why others see them in me.



Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Piglet
21-09-05, 20:34
This may take you some time. Lol. We may keep adding to the list too!!!!

Nite nite.

Love Piglet

Meg
21-09-05, 21:44
No need to do it all at once...

Karen
21-09-05, 23:06
Hi Piglet

If you keep adding to the list I will never get around to finding examples for all of them! I can't think of any for the rest of the list as it is at the moment.


Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
21-09-05, 23:09
Thank you Meg. I'll come back to this tomorrow I think...

Right now I am feeling low again because I've not heard from K today. In fact I am panicking because I haven't seen her online anywhere and therefore can't stop worrying that something has happened. I've been checking all the sites regularly throughout the day but there has been no sign of her.

I'm also worried that she might be cross with me or disappointed in me because she asked me to do something which I haven't done. Now I feel like I have let her down.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
22-09-05, 02:27
Now I am feeling totally distraught and I know I have done something terribly wrong to make K not want to write to me today.

She has read my message but not replied and this doesn't happen. Once she reads it she always replies, even when it is to tell me she won't reply in full until I edit the message in some way.

I know I have really let her down this time and she must be so very cross and disappointed in me. I can't cope without her. I need her so much:(.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

in1peace
22-09-05, 04:13
[quote]
The person I believe I am is terrible, worthless and most definitely selfish. I try to accept that this view I have of myself is just due to low self-esteem and that other people see me differently to the way I see myself, but somehow I still can't really believe that I am someone anyone would really want to know, let alone to want as a friend.
Karen,
I immediately wanted to know you when I got to this site!! I could read your postings and tell that you were a very nurturing, sweet, thoughtful person. If you could just try on these NMP glasses... maybe you could see what others around this site see in you.... here!... put these on!... what a beautiful person!.... see her?? That's you.. we all think you are an amazing person!
Your contributions to this site are helping so many people!! Wish you knew what that meant to scared, new people like me!!
You are the bees knees Karen!!
Love,
Andrea

"Honey, if ya ain't feelin' the bumps in the road, ya ain't goin' nowhere!" (A wise Georgia Granny's take on living life to the fullest! LOL!)

Meg
22-09-05, 08:13
14) Honest - even at difficult times.

trac67
22-09-05, 08:50
Hi Karen,
Please dont think that about K, you know she is always there for you, maybe she was just busy last night, and didnt have time to reply to your post, I am sure she will respond to you today hun.
Big hug
Love
Trac xx

its "just a thought"

Piglet
22-09-05, 09:41
Morning Karen,

Sure you will hear from K today but if not you still have us!!!!!

Big squeeze

Love Piglet xx

Sax
22-09-05, 09:58
Hi Karen,

I wanted to add empathetic to the list - but i won't becasue you have already answered it under number 13. understanding - i think the two go together so although its definately a true asset of yours being empathetic in your responses to others here and elsewhere, you probably don't need to answer that one again!

Hope you are ok today!

Sax xx

Karen
22-09-05, 11:51
Thank you all again for such lovely, kind replies. You are all such great friends and I know how lucky I am to have the fantastic support of you all.

Andrea: I'm speechless after your message. You are so kind and thoughtful and have been very supportive towards me since you first joined the site and I truly thank you for that. I think I do need those glasses though, as I still don't recognise myself in all these descriptions of me.


Piglet: Thanks for your continuing support. I do appreciate my friends here and how you all keep supporting me, even though I keep going on about the same issues day after day.


Trac: I appreciate your kind support. I realise there might be another explanation why K didn't write last night. However, the circumstances were different to usual. She would not normally even read my PM if she wasn't going to reply. Also she posted on the forum and was on another site last night, so I am sure what I have done is so terrible she is not replying.


Sax: Thanks for your suggestion for the list. I think I probably did cover empathy under no 13. It is very kind of you to contribute. Hope you are ok today.


Meg: Honesty? I'm not sure if that one still applies after what I've just told you does it?


Still no word from K this morning, so I am still despairing about this. It upsets and distresses me so much not hearing from K because of the obsessive attachment I have to her and I cannot cope with one day without contact without getting totally distraught.

If she doesn't reply today either I don't know what I'll do. I am so sure I have let her down so badly and she is now very upset with me and extremely disappointed in my actions.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Meg
22-09-05, 12:09
Yes it does ..

14) creative

Karen
22-09-05, 12:29
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Yes it does ..

14) creative
<div align="right">Originally posted by Meg - 22 September 2005 : 12:09:14</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Thank you. I'm not sure I deserve that but it's kind of you to say it.


Creative - Think I can do this one. I do enjoy writing, whether it is working on an article, or writing some kind of fiction. I've also been told I have a very creative imagination because of some of the thing that go through my mind at times! Like most other things in my life, I don't actually have the self-belief to acknowledge whatever I've done, like writing something for instance, is good or not. Or at least, to me, it is never good enough. I'm always striving for perfection.


Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
22-09-05, 15:58
I am totally distraught and cannot cope with not knowing what is happening with K. I got so distressed earlier when I received a PM and thought it was her, only when I looked it wasn't and I was so terribly upset.

I am panicking that I will never hear from her again. What I've done must be so terrible that she no longer wants anything to do with me and can't even bring herself to write and tell me.

Now one of the sites I check for her on has crashed so I can't even look there to see if she has been around.

I can't live without her and I don't even want to. I can't do anything today and have been in bed for most of it. My life is a living nightmare and I just want to shut it all out.

I need her and can't go on without her.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
22-09-05, 19:50
I have now heard from K and therefore calmed down. And, yes, it seems I was catastrophising again. I don't know what happened last night but the reason she didn't reply wasn't because I had done anything wrong. Nor is she annoyed with me, although she is, I think, concerned at my further seld-destructive actions.

Finally I managed to get out of bed and have something to eat but now I am feeling very ill - really sick and bloated. I really hate feeling like this when I eat and it just makes me want to starve myself completely. I wish I didn't have to eat at all but I know where that will lead. Feeling like this after eating just makes me want to get rid of it though.


Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
22-09-05, 23:49
Feeling really sick still and very fat tonight now. I'm going to have to severely restrict or even starve tomorrow, particularly as I have to get weighed at the doctor's. I can't put any weight on.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Piglet
23-09-05, 09:01
Hi Karen,

Just saying hello and how do you feel this morning ?

Love Piglet x

trac67
23-09-05, 09:50
Karen,
You say you are going to have to starve today as you cant put any weight on, that is the anorexia talking not you. You know deep down in your heart that you are not fat and that you do need to eat. The real Karen has to talk louder than the anorexia hun, so that it stops taking over you.
A big hug as you need it
Take care
Trac xx

its "just a thought"

Karen
23-09-05, 10:02
Thank you Piglet and Trac.

Yes Trac - it is the anorexia talking and at the moment it is shouting at me in a very loud voice so I can't ignore it.

I know I need to eat and I have been doing better at eating regularly recently, however the anorexia gets to me other ways then.

I have been indulging is some very stupid and self-destructive behaviours where this is concerned, and then felt bad that I was hiding and covering this up, particularly from people who've been so supportive.

It makes me feel that I am being really manipulative and deceitful, which makes me hate myself more. The worse I feel about myself, the more the anorexia is able to take over but convincing me I am being 'good' by doing what it wants me to do and that I'm achieving something by losing weight.

Right now it feels like my head is such a mess and I don't know if I can keep fighting the anorexia.


Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
23-09-05, 10:08
I'm also feeling quite upset today because it is my Mum's birthday and it is now a year since I've seen or spoken to her.

It was a year ago today that I last saw her and it was a really painful experience for me. I finally came to realise that she does not and will not ever love me or want anything to do with me. While I was there, she ignored me completely and pushed me away, instead talking to my brothers. I'm trying not to think about it or let it bring me down, but today is a very difficult day and I am feeling upset.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

trac67
23-09-05, 10:14
Karen hun, you are such a strong person in your own right, and you have to shout back at the anorexia louder than it is shouting at you. Go back and read all the positive things we wrote about you, and keep on reading them, and start to believe in them, and in yourself. You are worth so much more than what the anorexia is doing to you karen, do not let it win.
Love and hugs
Trac xx

its "just a thought"

Karen
23-09-05, 13:15
Thanks for your reply Trac.

I am getting very anxious about the appointment with my doctor at 2pm. I have been too scared to check my weight today and am so confused I don't know what I hope for at the appointment really.

The anorexia wants me to have lost weight and in a way I do too because it does help me feel better about myself. I can't help but view it as an achievement and like I am succeeding at something.

On the other hand, I am scared what my doctor will say if I have lost weight because she wants me to be consistently gaining and isn't happy when I just maintain even.

If I see I have gained any weight, I know this will fuel the anorexia further and send me into strict restricting, or starving myself, or even more drastic action.

It is so difficult to keep fighting this.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
23-09-05, 13:18
Thanks for your message Nigel.

Yes today is hard. In one way I feel I have accepted that Mum will never love me and I won't ever have the mother-daughter relationship I dream of. It still does really hurt but the last year has taught me not to expect to get the love I need from Mum - though I still sent her a card.

However, the need for love is still there and instead of looking to Mum for it, I now look to K instead and this is probably another reason my attachment to her has become stronger in the last year. In a way I need her to take on this role, even though I know she doesn't want it and it is unreasonable of me to want her to fill it anyway.


Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
23-09-05, 14:56
Feeling worse after seeing my doctor really. On the one hand she said she thinks I am doing well and that I had maintained my weight since last time. That's not exactly the case but I won't go into that... She said this is good particularly as I am not receiving any psychological help or support from the CMHT or psychiatrist anymore - not that I ever did anyway.

However, she said she is going to have to push me harder because maintaining is not enough and I need to be gaining. She said the psychiatrist and CMHT were very strict in their letters to her about invoking a mental health assessment if my weight falls below a certain level and if that happens it means being sectioned.

I know she is trying to help and there isn't much she can do to treat the reasons behind the anorexia, but I still cannot cope with the thought of gaining any weight. I don't even like being told I've maintained and this has started me thinking about new ways to lose weight again.

When my doctor said I was looking a bit better and less gaunt, this to me was another way of saying I'm fat and I am gaining loads of weight. I don't want to be told I look well because it does mean I am far too fat.



Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

tammyg
23-09-05, 18:23
Karen,

*When my doctor said I was looking a bit better and less gaunt, this to me was another way of saying I'm fat and I am gaining loads of weight. I don't want to be told I look well because it does mean I am far too fat.*

of course this was not what the doctor was saying. You have to realise, this was a good thing. Looking well and looking fat are far apart, and in your case - a million miles apart. The fact she thinks you are looking well is great. It is good that you have maintained, please don't look for ways to lose weight.

You have had some great advice about some of your posts being the anorexia talking and this may be the case here also.

Take care,

Tam x

Karen
23-09-05, 20:21
Thanks for your reply Tam. I do recognise that it is the anorexia talking and yet at the same time I can't help believing that I am fat. I don't see myself the way everyone else appears to see me it seems. I look in the mirror and do see someone grossly fat looking back at me, particularly after I have had something to eat.

I suppose the only way I can describe it is that it's like looking into one of those mirrors you sometimes see at funfairs etc, where the mirror distorts your reflection. This is kind of like what I see when I look at myself and it makes me want to lose weight.

The anorexia also makes me think and believe that any comments about looking better actually mean I am looking fatter. At the beginning of the week I had lost weight and I had to hide this from my doctor.

She was trying to get me to say that I feel better now I've gained and kept on a couple of pounds, when I know I had lost weight. There is no way I can ever feel good about gaining weight.

I'm feeling really down again tonight, I think with the combination of not hearing from K so far today, this appointment today, the situation regarding moving, and the memories of what happened last year on Mum's birthday. It is all getting to me and I'm feel the despair pushing me down again.

Today is one day I really do need to hear from K and I have a terrible feeling that I'm not going to.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
23-09-05, 22:33
Haven't heard from K again today and I can't cope. I am feeling totally distraught and don't know how I am going to get through tonight. Without her there is no point to anything:(

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Quirky
23-09-05, 22:43
Hi Karen,
You can cope, you have before and you will this time too. I know it's hard for you but K will contact you when she can, it may not be today but it will be soon, she never lets you down does she. Try and stay strong, lots of us care for you, I know we're not K though.
You're having a bad day with your Mum's birthday, and you have alot on your plate with looking for a house etc so don't be hard on yourself. Hope tomorrow feels better.
Take care, thinking of you.
Lisa x

Karen
23-09-05, 23:17
Thanks for your reply Lisa. I'm just feeling so out of control tonight and everything is getting on top of me. It has been a bad day anyway with bad memories of this time last year with Mum and now the despair of not hearing from K when she is the most important person in my life. The trouble is even when I think about wanting a mother's love now, I'm not really thinking of my own Mum anymore, I'm thinking about K instead. Really stupid and pathetic I know.

I know K never lets me down but I still can't help feeling distraught tonight. I am not coping and when I'm feeling this bad I just want to hurt myself to stop this despair.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
24-09-05, 08:13
Have been up all night again because I need to wait to see if K is around this morning and if she replies or not. As I didn't see her around anywhere yesterday I am worrying about her, as well as feel low because I didn't get a message.

I can't cope with a second day without her.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

mum2four
24-09-05, 08:26
I totally understand the feeling that everyone giving up on you. I can keep friends for long i'm alway putting my foot in it some how. I have a strong erg to argu when i feel cornered or out or of control ect.

I hope you feel better soon i dont have a eating disorder but I can relate to knowing you have a distorted veiw on something buit not being able to change the thought that you have.

Karen
24-09-05, 08:31
Thanks for your reply Mum2four. I think I lose friends because I get too intense and then they can't handle it and back off. I have problems with obsessive attachment and this makes me behave in ways that I really don't like about myself.

K has promised that she is not going to abandon me and I do believe her but I still panic when I don't hear from her. I also start to think that something bad might have happened to her and she will be taken away from me.



Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

mum2four
24-09-05, 08:57
I fully relate to that I have am either fart to full on with people or or cant remember to ring when i should ring ect. I talk heap's and I say evry thing on my mind and people take everything i say so serious instead for what it is (just a way to make sence of whats in my head).

I find it so hard to find a reasonable balance with people. I also have dont see the bondary very clearly so when i think I'm helping the other person see's it as interfering.

tracyp584
24-09-05, 10:20
Hey Karen,

Hope your day improves.

Take care,

tracy x x



Every time you avoid your fears they become stronger,every time you face your fears they become weaker.

Karen
24-09-05, 10:50
Thanks Tracy.

I've now had a message from K but for some reason I am now feeling sad, probably because her message sounded sad. She thinks I am indulging in very self-destructive behaviours again and am further damaging my health, but I feel I have to do these things because I'm getting fatter than I already am. Even my doctor said so yesterday.

I want to do what K says but the anorexia is taking over completely again. I've also got such a craving for something sugary this morning. It's making me want to binge but then I know I'll only end up taking even more drastic action to compensate.

Just feel I've had enough and don't know how much more I can cope with.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Piglet
24-09-05, 12:03
Hi Karen,

Still here and still urging you on - you are not getting fat you'd have to put stones and stones on to be that!! You are getting healthier though and that will keep you out of hospital.

Focus on that just at the moment.:)

Big hug

Love Piglet xx

Karen
24-09-05, 20:47
Thanks for replying Piglet.

I don't think I am getting healthier though that's the thing. I just feel fat and out of control and my doctor's comments have pushed me back further.

I sat up all last night because I felt I needed to wait for K, so went to bed mid morning and then took a sleeping pill. So I am now back to sleeping during the day and being up at night again.

I know this is a step backward. My therapist was pleased last time I saw her because I had managed to change my sleep routine so that I was staying up all day. But I just can't handle the extra anxiety of being awake during the day and waiting for K and keep checking on her.

Guess this is really very stupid and why I never get anywhere. I take a step forward but then two back again. Basically I just fail all the time.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

mum2four
24-09-05, 22:44
You never fail at anything I try to look at every I do and find some positive about even if is a small positive. I also am trying to change my thinking and sometime's I cant do this by inside my head so I write up positive thing's to put arpund my house in place's I know I will see it.

You cant change every thing at one you have take baby step's and I beleive you should start with something small alot people with start with something to overwelming and fosuing on a small do-able posivtive change will help you face the next small do-able positive change.

Be good to you self dont put your down you are a nice person and you can get back to the same point you were at before your took a fue steps backward's

Take care say something positive at least 10 time when you say some thing negative your self.

Karen
25-09-05, 09:40
I have been up all night again and think I am getting stuck in this pattern of sleeping during the day and being up at night. It is the only way I can cope with the anxiety of waiting for K to reply and stop checking for her all the time.

I just feel like I am constantly letting K down at the moment.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

mum2four
25-09-05, 10:13
Your not letting anyone donw not even your self needing to talk to some one or just needing to know someone is still there for you and letting them know your there for them is nothing to be asamed of.

I am alway's telling people that if the people in this world were more accepting of people in general and speacial try harder to understand people like us then we would find it easyier to get over our fear's.

Just tell your self I have the right talk to people when i need to and if the person you want to talk to get's upset with you then find a new person cause the the one that got unpset has the problem not you.

i once had a poster that said " A true freind is one who takes you in when the reat of the world has cast you out" and that has gotten me threw some tuff time's with my anxiety.

take care of you self and smile even if you dont feel like smiling cause it still releases the chemical that help's you stay happy.

Karen
25-09-05, 11:09
Thanks mum2four. K is there for me though and she has been incredibly patient, supportive and caring in the time I have known her. No matter what I do she is there for me.

She stands by me even though I must test her patience to the limit with some of the things I do. Even when I am obsessing about her and bombarding her with messages she is still there. I really don't know what I would do without her.

When I feel unable to do what she wants me to do (and she only asks me to do things that would help with my recovery) then I do feel like I have let her down.

My world would come to an end without her.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Piglet
25-09-05, 11:28
Morning Karen,

Just saying hello.

Love Piglet x

"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.

Karen
25-09-05, 12:02
Thanks Piglet.

How are you today?

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

trac67
25-09-05, 13:23
Hi Karen,
Just giving you todays HUG and telling you to keep being positive.
Take care
Love
Trac xx

its "just a thought"

Karen
25-09-05, 13:58
Thanks Trac.

Unfortunately I am feeling anything but positive today. In fact I am having the worst possible day and feeling so desperate I don't know what to do or how to cope.

I want to be with K. I need her to help me. I just don't know what to do.

The anorexia is making me do some really stupid things and I really hate myself right now. I feel so fat and I feel sick. I don't want to eat ever again. I just want to starve myself from now on. I can't handle the way food and eating makes me feel.

I need someone to help me.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

trac67
25-09-05, 14:06
Hi Karen,
Im sorry you are feeling like that today, I wish i could do something to help you feel more positive and to make you see what a great person you are inside, because you really are one of the best, the way you take time to help everyone else. I know you have a problem with speaking in the phone, but if you do ever feel the need for a chat, pm me and i will give you my number.
Take care hun
Love
Trac xx

its "just a thought"

Karen
25-09-05, 14:51
Thanks Trac. I really appreciate that.

I'm just having a crisis today and not coping at all well. I don't think I'll ever recover from this anorexia and that other people are giving up on me too, or giving up hope that I can get better.

I really want to be with K more than anything in the world right now. I had had enough of fighting this alone. I feel so alone.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Quirky
25-09-05, 15:26
Hi Karen,

I don't really know what to say to help you as I don't understand what you're going through but I am thinking of you.
You've been doing so well lately, try and see this as a blip that will pass.
It's hard when you are feeling down but try and focus on positives, like the fact that you have been doing your body so much good lately by eating a little more. This will make you healthy, keep you out of hospital and make K really happy for you. Try not to think you will never recover from anorexia but try and see it differently, e.g it may be a long struggle but step by step it can be overcome. Just keep trying and don't give up. You will have good and bad patches along the way but that's normal. Also try and remember that all these negative thoughts are the anorexia talking. You are stronger than you think and can achieve more then you know.
Try looking at those positive messages you had from K and use those to spur you on as you did before.
Anyway as I said before I don't understand anorexia at all, so if what I've just said makes no sense I'm sorry. Just wanted to show my support.

Lisa

bluesparkle
25-09-05, 15:46
and me too karen!!!
im still reading and listening... and definatley here for you... trying to send you posative vibes...
you are a great person and always there to help others no matter how you are feeling or what you are coping with...
i so feel for you at the moment ... you have so much going on in your life.
i know what you are saying about how low you are feeling and its awful when its like that but you know we are all here for you and spuring you on... you have done so well lately hang on in there mate.
take care
rach
x

Karen
25-09-05, 16:59
Thanks for your messages of support Trac and Rach. It doesn't matter that you don't understand about anorexia. Receiving messages of support does help.

I have posted separately about what has been happening because really I am not doing well or acting in a way that is healthy for me.

Just need to let everyone know because I feel like a fraud and I know I am letting K and everyone else down.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Piglet
25-09-05, 17:02
Hi Karen,

I echo what's already been said. I wish I knew more about anorexia then I could say more helpful things or offer more in the way of usable advice.

Is the other site you go on more in that line???

How old were you when this started being a problem and was there a direct trigger. Is it a control thing in the sense of its the one area of life that you can have some say in.

Sorry that's a lot of questions - just asking cos I care.

Love Piglet :)

Karen
25-09-05, 17:10
Hi Piglet

Don't worry about all the questions!

No, the other forum is a Psychology forum and it covers all kinds of psychological problems from depression, anxiety and panic, to relationship problems and also hypnosis.

The anorexia only started probably about 18 months ago, although I didn't really see it as being a problem at all until about a year ago and it took me longer than that to admit it.

I suppose my slide into depression again was the trigger, which was due to what happened with my tutor breaking off contact.

Part of it is control. Losing weight also gives me a sense of achievement when I feel I am failing in everything else. There are a number of complicated issues surrounding it really.

I appreciate that you care Piglet. Thank you.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Piglet
25-09-05, 21:56
Thanks Nigel.

Love Piglet :)

Karen
28-09-05, 21:09
Now I am really panicking. I haven't heard from K today and so am feeling really low because I might not hear from her today.

But to make it worse the forum she PMs me on is now having problems and intermittently crashing. So I am scared she either will try to write to me and won't be able to, or she will send me a message that I won't be able to read.

I really cannot cope without her and I am feeling so distraught now.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
28-09-05, 22:13
Things are getting worse. The other forum is definitely having technical problems tonight and I am so worried it is going to crash completely.

K has been able to read my message but I am not sure she can reply. It keeps crashing when I reply to posts on there so I am so scared she can't answer my message.

If it crashes and I don't hear from her I don't know how I am going to cope. I am panicking. Not having any contact with her is the end of the world to me.:(

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
28-09-05, 22:57
Can't cope. I haven't heard from K and know I won't tonight now, even though she read my message and has been online several times. I hate myself for feeling like this.

I need her:(:(:(

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
28-09-05, 23:10
Now the forum has crashed completely. Can it get any worse?:(

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Trev
28-09-05, 23:41
Hi Karen,

just wanted to let you know that I keep looking in and I'm thinking about you and willing you some positive vibes. I don't know much about anorexia either so I find it difficult to know how to help so I don't post much. Just hope you can find the way through it. I'm sure you can.
The technical things are out of anyone's control so try not to beat yourself up over it. Hope you can get some rest tonight.

Cheers,
Trev

Karen
29-09-05, 05:12
Thanks for your message Trev. I appreciate you taking the time to write. I doesn't matter that you don't know much about anorexia.

My other forum has been back online for a while tonight but I am still scared it will crash again at any minute. If it does I won't hear from K today either and I am still in a panic about that.

I don't know what to do if I have to get through a second day without contact.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
29-09-05, 13:55
Now I've upset K and I feel terrible about it. The last thing I would ever want to do it hurt her. She is everything to me.

I said something stupid in my message last night. I wasn't thinking clearly because I was so upset, but that is no excuse. She must think I am the most terrible, selfish and despicable person on the planet now and I deserve to be thought of in this way.

I don't deserve her friendship or for her to love me and it is no wonder she could never do this. I have messed it all up and I am so ashamed. It's all my own fault:(:(:(

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
29-09-05, 19:16
I can't stop worrying that I have really hurt K this time and that she is thinking badly of me because of my last message. I feel so bad about it and I know it was so wrong. I just need her so much and am getting ever more desperate by the day to be with her. I don't stop thinking about her every minute of every day.

My fantasies of being with her, of her looking after me and loving me the way my mum never has are all that keep me going. I would give up without her and yet I am petrified that I am just going to push her further away if I don't get this obsession under control. If I lose her then I've lost everything. I don't want to live without her.

I've already caved in and sent her a message today, when I am not supposed to write until tonight. Then I wanted to apologise but saying sorry is one of the items on her banned list, so I am not able to apologise in any of my messages. I sent her an e-card instead.

I want her to know that I know I am in the wrong but now I don't know if I am just being more obsessive for sending the card[:I].

I seem incapable of thinking clearly about anything anymore.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Trev
29-09-05, 21:31
Hi Karen,

Quote..."I seem incapable of thinking clearly about anything anymore."

This may be the case because of the constant state of high anxiety and the chemicals that this releases into your system. Is there any way you would be able to find a distraction that could occupy you? I only say this so that it could give you a break which will enable you to relax and rest a bit and start to stem the flow of these chemicals.

I'm sorry if this is advice that has been given before but just trying to offer some sort of help really.

Take care,
Trev

Karen
29-09-05, 22:10
Thanks Trev

It is true about anxiety and depression making it difficult to think clearly. I have tried to do some relaxation but I am finding it difficult to even concentrate on this and need to keep checking various sites for K instead.

There are some others more constructive things I could be doing, if only I didn't feel so totally exhausted and feeling quite ill tonight. I don't have the energy to move further than from the computer to my bed.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Trev
29-09-05, 22:53
How is it with eating and with sleeping lately?

Sue K with 5
29-09-05, 22:56
Hi Karen

I am sorry things are not improving for you! I know how hard it is when your fighting and you feel your not achieving your ultimate goal, I spend many days locked into my own world, wondering when things will get better or when the anxiety and panic will end. The anorexia has been hard on you, but I do think it is something you could work on achieving, I think once you get that under control then the other problems will gradually slow down! I am sure this has all been said to you before but you have to belive in yourself! K has been a part of your life for quite a while now and this might sound hard, but its a bit like a marriage, sometimes you need to sit back collect your thoughts and start a fresh, K does not want to lose you, she needs to re evaluate things so that she can be strong for you and help you. Sounds daft, but if you were in K's shoes how would you help you ?? I have to think like that sometimes, especially when I know how hard caring for me from a friends perspective can be. Dont be hard on yourself Karen, she loves you and she is always going to be there for you, trust your instincts, I need a mum too sometimes and like you I dont have one that I can have any kind of relationshsip with or one to relate to. But I have great friendships with people and do you know without them right this minute I would be lost.


Anorexia is a long hard battle I have seen it twice in my life and I have been through the emotional discharge and I know you can beat this ! your a strong person with amazing abilities who is intelligent, Keep fighting this Karen you can do it ! just have faith in yourself! Put everything else aside and start another day with a fresh outlook, use K as your support and NMP as your guide and you can do it! Dont ever think you will not achieve success! especially with yourself


Take care

Sorry for going on a bit but I know how tough things get for you and I just want you to know I have every faith in you



Sue with 5


scknight

sal
29-09-05, 23:08
Hi Karen

Would be easier to talk to you so if you feel up to it when you get this just text me.



Love Sal xx


Dont mess up the best things in your life, just because at present you are unsure who you are.


"Life is a distance and to travel that distance you were given the strength and guidance to do so".

Karen
30-09-05, 05:05
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">How is it with eating and with sleeping lately?
<div align="right">Originally posted by Trev - 29 September 2005 : 22:53:27</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Not too good with either Trev.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
30-09-05, 05:06
Hi Sal

Thanks for the offer to talk. I didn't read your message until really late unfortunately.

Catch up with you some other time.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
30-09-05, 05:17
Hi Sue

Thanks for your message. I too find it difficult to see any way out of this and feel I am the only one going backwards and actually getting worse and then I blame myself and think I am not doing enough or trying hard enough to get better.


<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Sounds daft, but if you were in K's shoes how would you help you ??
<div align="right">Originally posted by susan Knight - 29 September 2005 : 22:56:11</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Actually it doesn't sound daft and K has before said it is a pity I can't apply the advice I give others to myself, but then I think it is easier to think clearly about the problems of others because emotion is not part of the picture.

I am actually in a similar position to K in some ways with someone I am trying to support who has become rather dependent on me, and has some of the same issues I have but not anorexia. So I am seeing things from both sides but it doesn't help me to be able to help myself.

I know K won't abandon me. She promised me right at the start that she would be with me through this and I do trust her. It doesn't stop me feeling bad about the way I behave because of the obsession though.

Thanks for your support and faith in me. I am rather lacking in faith in myself right now.

Tonight I am struggling with anxiety and panic about not having any contact with K tomorrow, as I didn't last Friday.

It is also raining very heavily again here tonight and my internet connection plays up when it is really wet, so I am scared of being cut off from K and not being able to get on either forum.

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Karen
30-09-05, 10:06
Feeling extremely low today and worrying whether K will be in touch. I have a horrible feeling I won't hear from her and then I'll be panicking for another day that I upset her.

I can't sleep and keep checking to see whether she has been online.

Without her I feel absolutely and totally distraught.:(

Karen



It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere.

Piglet
30-09-05, 11:18
You know she will be in touch - she always does!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Love Pig x