Reassurance seeking threads

[fightingmyself]

I'm new here, but not new to health anxiety.

On looking at the first page alone at the thread topics, the vast majority are from people seeking comfort and reassurance that they are ok and that there is nothing to worry about.

I fully understand the terrifying feeling that causes this behaviour, but as anyone who has done some CBT, reassurance seeking just feeds the fire of health anxiety.

Not only that, but looking at the thread titles can be enough to send some people into a panic.

I wonder what people think to the idea of having either a specific sub-board for specific 'illnesses' or a sub-board for general health anxiety?

I was hoping to find some help, but after seeing a page full of people worried about cancer, leukemia, lymphoma, I don't know if I dare stay.

I was scared to look at page 2 of the threads incase there was something that scared me! I also realise that you shouldn't avoid certain things, but with such a concentration of symptoms, it gives dr google a run for its money.

I'm not suggesting any kind of restriction on threads, just a division. Any views?

[westofengland]

Please stay. I'll tell you why
1) Not everyone has had CBT and might not realise about the reassurance-seeking thing
2) Reading other people's threads helps to put HA into perspective and realise we are not alone
3) I find it therapeutic to talk about what's going on with my HA, and *if* I do end up helping somebody with my experience and insights, that's fantastic
4) if you are scared of finding a 'trigger' on these threads about other things to worry about, don't worry. Believe me, you'll find plenty of triggers elsewhere. I got into a panic about lung cancer after listening to a silly throwaway comment on Radio 3 for god sake! We can't avoid health scares and health warnings in our society any more

[PokerFace]

While I admit since I've been here I've started to worry about diseases I didn't even know existed til I came here, this site has helped me quite a lot! I've made my fair share of reassurance seeking threads and I feel a lot better when I've done it. I've never had CBT but I've got a book that's based on it but it never told me seeking reassurance was bad for me!

The health anxiety boards are a bit of a double edged sword if you're a health anxiety sufferer. You just need to be careful about which threads you click on because admittedly some will set you off quite badly in my experience. It would be nice to see some more pro active threads about health anxiety on these boards to help us all out so please stick around! Maybe you could be the one to make that happen. x

[nomorepanic]

The nature of Health Anxiety means that most people worry about such things as cancers, tumours, severe illnesses and death!

I am not sure how you can separate the "nice" threads from the others to be honest.

On another note have you seen the website page on the left about HA, the free A4 info leaflet in the online shop and also the book I sell about overcoming HA in the online shop too?

[paula lynne]

Hi, your views and opinions are important. We are all on different stages of our own personal journey...as nic says, the leaflet may be really helpul, and lots of books out there too. A belated welcome to you x:welcome:

[CrazyCatLady]

There is another board for "Symptoms", and I do always wonder why the threads aren't posted in there but I don't really understand the difference between the two if I'm honest.

The threads themselves are a really good stepping stone between Google and stopping the reassurance seeking altogether. Reading through these forums is much better than doing a Google search, and eventually the reassurance can actually kick in - after reading a million posts on one symptom, you start to believe your doctor was right after all!

The forum also eases pressure on friends and family, who are probably getting a bit sick of us asking them :blush:

Not everyone can go cold turkey.

[itoldyouiwasill]

While I admit since I've been here I've started to worry about diseases I didn't even know existed til I came here, this site has helped me quite a lot! I've made my fair share of reassurance seeking threads and I feel a lot better when I've done it. I've never had CBT but I've got a book that's based on it but it never told me seeking reassurance was bad for me!

The health anxiety boards are a bit of a double edged sword if you're a health anxiety sufferer. You just need to be careful about which threads you click on because admittedly some will set you off quite badly in my experience. It would be nice to see some more pro active threads about health anxiety on these boards to help us all out so please stick
around! Maybe you could be the one to make that happen. x


Indeed they are!

The problem with forums is that they actually become addictive and semi reassuring in their own right and are not really a healthy enviroment for recovery.

Whilst I agree that they can be very helpful they are also full of people who are actually getting nothing from them and who use them very poorly and who suffer adversly.

The thing with health anxiety in particular is that it is the best damn hobby in the world. I suffered from it for 4 years and I know 100% that it was made worse by forums and discussing the same issues over and over and almost starting to 'learn' typical health anxiety behaviours. In many cases forums and the like help to foster a sense of belonging and understanding and we think that this is valid....well, with health anxiety it is very far from it I'm afraid. Health anxiety is very self centered and all encompassing and if we feel we are excused to feel and act that way then we almost normalise it, once we mix with and surround ourselves in such an enviroment our 'hobby' almost becomes justified.

Having said all that I believe that there is a place for forums as long as they are used correctly BUT the problem is this is incredibly hard to do with something like health anxiety. I know from my own experience recovery came when I gave up on visiting anxiety forums every day and no longer allowed myself the pleasure of finding reassurance for my behaviour. As you can see I visit here occasionaly (this as not my main forum) but this for other purposes rather than hoping to enhance my recovery.

[fightingmyself]

I understand that for some people, they can be a stepping stone from google to zero, but again the first page welcomes you with brain tumour, cancer.......

I don't need telling what health anxiety is, I've thought i've had most deadly ailments.

I know people come here for different reasons and what I was suggesting wouldn't change that.

What I meant was there is a sub form for SWINE FLU - the disease that never was. Why cant help for health anxiety threads be in one place so that those who don't want to be panicked and be bombarded with cancer further aren't.

[nomorepanic]

What I meant was there is a sub form for SWINE FLU - the disease that never was. Why cant help for health anxiety threads be in one place so that those who don't want to be panicked and be bombarded with cancer further aren't.

You just reminded me to remove that forum. It was added at the time as we were bombarded all day every day with swine flu posts. I can remove it now I think.

I don't think there are any threads about help for HA to be honest. They are all about illnesses. People don't tend to post about what helped them.

[fightingmyself]

I don't think there are any threads about help for HA to be honest. They are all about illnesses. People don't tend to post about what helped them.

That's a shame. I don't need any help at all at getting anxious.



Perhaps a specific section would grow and help others over time if it existed?

Obviously you know more about the content of the site than me, but just coming to the forum with a headache and seeing 2 threads for brain tumours isn't overly helpful. I suppose it's the risk I have to take

[nomorepanic]

Perhaps you need to look in symptoms forum instead.

Searching always yields good results as well.

Do you have a headache that is worrying you?

As for brain tumours - not one person that has had a headache has been diagnosed with much more than tension headaches to be honest.

[fightingmyself]

Perhaps you need to look in symptoms forum instead.

Searching always yields good results as well.

Do you have a headache that is worrying you?

As for brain tumours - not one person that has had a headache has been diagnosed with much more than tension headaches to be honest.

No, looking in a no symptoms forum was more what I had in mind.

As for the headache thanks for the info. But it was really more of an illustration.

[Jaco45er]

I googled once, never again, I thought I was pregnant

[nomorepanic]

I am afraid that the nature of the forum is one of people posting with symptoms and not many posts with positive things to say about symptoms (if that makes sense).

Have you read the symptoms website page on the left?

Maybe if you could let me know what sort of thing you are looking for I can point you in the right direction.

[nomorepanic]

I googled once, never again, I thought I was pregnant

I always knew you were odd Steve :roflmao:

[itoldyouiwasill]

I may be wrong but what I think the OP is getting at is that threads often descend into the usual symptom listing and reassurance seeking and as a result so many threads seem to just be going over the same ground and this often serves little helpful purpose.

I don't know but maybe if there was a division in folders of those people who wanted questions about specific symptoms or disease/illness concerns answering and threads more attuned towards discusing health anxiety and the thinking patterns/learned responses that cause it.

It does seem to me that when health anxiety first starts you do crave constant reassurance and symptom information but over time this gives way more to wanting to know the true underlying reason for the disorder in the first place...it is often when we reach this later stage that forums tend to become redundant and all too often this discussion never seems to take place...maybe as people get better and start to recover they decide to get the hell out!

I have to say that THE lightbulb moment for me was the startling realisation that health anxiety was absolutly nothing to do with a true underlying worry about my health but was rather a sly, insidious and clever displacement that gave me a superb reason to excuse myself from my life and my real deep seated worries and neurosis.

It is well known that the prognosis for a total recovery from health anxiety, hypochondria and somatisation is very poor but there really is hope. The first step is seeing through the smoke and mirrors that health anxiety throws at us and seeing the real big picture. Health anxiety is like holding the piece of a jigsaw and being convinced that you can see the completed puzzle from that one piece...what we fail to realise is that we have actually taken it from the wrong box.

[nomorepanic]

In my experience on here very few people want to discuss HA thinking patterns but be reassured that what they have is not life threatening.

The forum is also primarily a panic/anxiety forum and not an HA forum - I only added the sub-forum as HA seems to be very common nowadays.

I am still struggling to work out what it would be called and what sort of posts would go in it to be honest - but that may just be me!

[itoldyouiwasill]

In my experience on here very few people want to discuss HA thinking patterns but be reassured that what they have is not life threatening.

The forum is also primarily a panic/anxiety forum and not an HA forum - I only added the sub-forum as HA seems to be very common nowadays.

I am still struggling to work out what it would be called and what sort of posts would go in it to be honest - but that may just be me!


Agreed, and that really is the irony of it as it is just this process that keeps people stuck in the loop with health anxiety...once we accept that the headache is from tension rather than a tumour we then want to accept that the twitching is from a tired and fatigued CNS rather than motor neurone disease etc...it just goes on and on.

It really is crucial that we move past the constant reassurance seeking etc as this is just a very short term fix and provides zero true foundation for recovery and actually has the adverse effect of digging us deeper into the hole.

Hey, I don't know how it is on this forum but I do know that on the other large anxiety forum I used to visit that the health anxiety folder was by far the busiest. I used to moderate on another forum but decided to give up the role for the very reason that my anxiety was very health based (or so I thought lol) and this then could hinder dealing with people with more 'traditional' manifestations of anxiety. I suppose what I'm saying is that I think that health anxiety is a very specific subsection of the anxiety disorders spectrum and we can be guilty of expecting all anxiety sufferers to 'get' the nature of the disorder and thois is often just not the case and is fair on nobody. I totally understand that a forum like this has to respect and cater for a wide variety of people with different issues and concerns and to that end it does a valid job.

[bottleblond]

There are a million and one variations of HA. Each and everyone is individual yet people are united by similar symptoms. It's one of these subjects that when we are 'well' we can see others situations as being meerly HA, however when we are suffering ourselves, we can see each and everyones point and get on board by comparing symptoms and worries.

The 'ONLY' thing we can do is to carryon helping and supporting eachother because that is what we do best.


P.s Jaco, congratulations mate, can i be godmonster please?

xxx

[fightingmyself]

ItoldyouIwasill is right.
Considering reassurance seeking is a definate no-no in cbt terms, this forum is 90% perpetuating the problem. If technology improves perhaps we should be able to go the whole hog and physically check each others lumps and bumps.
I know everyone means well by giving reassurance, and I know what it's like to want reassuring, but it doesn't work. The proof is exactly as nomorepanic admits that the vast majority of posts are reassurance seeking.

[nomorepanic]

How do you change that though ?

Also perhaps it is just what some people want - just reassurance knowing what they have is normal.

There is no easy solution to this without telling members they cannot post about the very things that they need help with.

[fightingmyself]

I don't think that you can change it, and if people with anxiety are after reassurance then this is possibly the best place to be. But it still doesn't help in the long run. I wouldn't want any restrictions on what people can post, but I think it would be helpful for people who want advice on beating health anxiety to have a dedicated sub category where symptoms are not encouraged to be discussed.

I came to the forum wanting advice for beating health anxiety, and judging from the posts seeking reassurance thats what most other people actually need (even if they are more concerned about a specific ailment).
I'm not knocking anyone because I appreciate that there are those desperate to have fears put to rest, and there are those who help them by providing reassurance. What you end up with though is a censored version of google, where reassurance only is provided. I don't particularly look at the symptom specific threads, but I would be very surprised if anyone providing advice said something like "yes I think you have cancer" or "i'd get to a&e double quick if I were you".

If someone is anxious to start with, then seeing threads with others discussing similar symptoms can work one of two ways. They either are comforted. Or they see a discussion where they read more disease specific information which could make them twice as anxious as they think they also have x,y,z or person a says to person b "well aslong as you haven't been having x you should be fine" where person c has x themselves.

No-one will stop obsessing over a symptom by obsessing over a symptom - guaranteed.

[bottleblond]

And your 'happy' forum will reasure them more?

[bottleblond]

People need realistic advice not some happy slappy mumbo jumbo. sorry but we are not a comedy club here.

[nomorepanic]

I totally agree that it would be nice to come here and have a way forward with recovering from HA.

I am currently reading a book about the CBT approach for help with HA and my intention was to add more to the website page on the left.

We still have the problem that I can post loads of positive stuff on the website but this forum could still be very negative about it all and we may not get any positive threads offering advice on how to overcome it.

I am not sure of the way forward with this one at the moment.

I do not know if there are any forums dedicated to HA - have you looked into this ? I would be interested to see how they handle it all.

[bottleblond]

Pfffft :roflmao:

[itoldyouiwasill]

I totally agree that it would be nice to come here and have a way forward with recovering from HA.

I am currently reading a book about the CBT approach for help with HA and my intention was to add more to the website page on the left.

We still have the problem that I can post loads of positive stuff on the website but this forum could still be very negative about it all and we may not get any positive threads offering advice on how to overcome it.

I am not sure of the way forward with this one at the moment.

I do not know if there are any forums dedicated to HA - have you looked into this ? I would be interested to see how they handle it all.


Yes, there are a one or two forums dedicated to health anxiety and/or hypochondria and I also know of one forum dedicated to somatization disorder. I also know of a number of anxiety forums (including this one) that have a health anxiety or hypochondria folder within them.

I suffered from health anxiety and somatization disorder for 4 years and now consider myself fully cured. In order to cure myself I had to take a massive leap of faith and cast aside 30 years of learned behaviours and responses which basically was what I thought was health anxiety but which was in fact anxiety about myself, my being and my role and place in the world.

To say that this is all happy clappy mumbo jumbo does a total disservice to all the people who have found a way through the nightmare of health anxiety and who are prepared to open themselves up and offer others the same escape...I would not have been able to escape the loop if it wasn't for others who even though recovered took the time and effort to help me.

I am currently writing a book on health anxiety and there is a very good chance that this is going to be published. I have also written a leaflet about health anxiety which I passed to my local GP, he actually gave this leaflet out to patients who had health anxiety and somatization disorder and this leaflet is now actually in the process of being approved by the NHS in South Wales for official distribution. I am not mentioning this as some sort of ego trip but purely to show that it is recognised by both the medical proffesion and mental health services that the idea that health anxiety can be cured by reassurance giving on individual symptoms and illness/disease worries is totally misinformed and only leads to an escalation of the disorder.

I don't visit this forum very often so am not totally sure as to the extent of the problem that health anxiety is for the average poster in the health anxiety folder. I suppose for many people health anxiety and/or hypochondria is seen as a Woody Allen type ailment that is somewhat problematic but is quite a quirky, almost comical personality trait. I know for me the health anxiety aspect of my somatization disorder was actually far closer to a combination of Pure OCD and Body Dysmorphic Syndrome and was a chronic and insidous issue that effected all areas of my life and that very nearly cost me my marriage and my career.

The one thing I would stress to anybody with this disorder is to be open and receptive to any advise you are given as that whilst we may feel compelled to reject things we are told on the basis that they do not fit are usual accepted framework, it is actually very often the reliance on that framework that has got us into difficulties in the first place.

[Dizz]

Oooh....

Like you all know I am new to this forum and the information sheets I have read on the site are excellent and sort of confirmed to me that my doc was right and my so called illnesses were down to stress/anxiety.

Having read some of the HA posts though (which I agree are hard not to read) I started to think 'gosh thats me too' which was reasuring in a way to know that others were having similar symptoms to me but 'it is nothing'.

So now I find myself reading more and more posts now where people mention something else and I think... 'hang on a minute I get that too now I think about it'. Yes it is reasuring that I'm not the only one but I do find myself now looking to see what everyone else is asking about next rather than looking to see if there is any possitive advice on how people have overcome stress/anxiety etc.and to stop it happening in the first place.

I haven't actually been told I have HA I was just told it was stress and anxiety which plays havoc on your bodys fight or flight mechanisms... but now I'm thinking maybe I do have HA after all.

In a way though it is good to read a post from someone else whereby you can reasure them from your own experiences or tests etc. I did wonder at first if some questions were false for a while and without wanting to sound awful I thought they were so ridiculous that surely noone would ask such a thing... but having been on the site for a couple of weeks now I realsie that once you get to that stage then every little thing starts to freak you out no matter how daft it may sound to others.

So after all that... everyone is obviously benefitting from this site in one way or another but it may be a good idea to see an area solely targeted at recovery and possitive ways forward only.

Maybe it would be possible to have an 'opt in' or 'opt out' option for certain areas of the site so that when you log in you ONLY see the areas you want to see rather than the areas which may make you worse by being accessible.

From my experience with forum moderation and web site 'management' though I reaslise that this could very difficult to achieve and implement.

Still a great site though :)

[nomorepanic]

Thank You Dizz for your comments and kind words about NMP.

I have just been browsing around and what I see is this:

member comes on suffering with something - be it a worry, symptom, concern, question, uncertain about medication, side effects - whatever!

members reply

the original poster sees they are not alone and sometimes the worry they have is easily explained away and they feel better and thank us for our help

That member does not feel alone and realises that what they are suffering can be attributed to anxiety etc

member feels reassured and calms down

So all in all I think it works ok and regardless of whether people think NMP is negative or not a LOT of people on here get reassurance and support and advice and above all else I have seen some friendships develop on here that will be lifelong - now that can't be all bad can it?

[itoldyouiwasill]

Thank You Dizz for your comments and kind words about NMP.

I have just been browsing around and what I see is this:

member comes on suffering with something - be it a worry, symptom, concern, question, uncertain about medication, side effects - whatever!

members reply

the original poster sees they are not alone and sometimes the worry they have is easily explained away and they feel better and thank us for our help

That member does not feel alone and realises that what they are suffering can be attributed to anxiety etc

member feels reassured and calms down

So all in all I think it works ok and regardless of whether people think NMP is negative or not a LOT of people on here get reassurance and support and advice and above all else I have seen some friendships develop on here that will be lifelong - now that can't be all bad can it?


...but that isn't health anxiety:wacko:

When I refer to health anxiety I define that as being the chronic condition of when somebody believes themselves to be suffering from an organic ailment despite all medical evidence to to the contary, these ailments are generally catastrophised to the worse case scenario.

What you seem to be talking about is the confusion many people have often in the early stages of anxiety regarding the physical symptoms that anxiety can produce...yes, this can progress and develop into health anxiety in some cases but I think in the vast majority of the cases people may well accept what is going on at this point and then deal with their anxiety accordingly.

Maybe this is the confusion in this thread...I know when I refer to reassurance I am not talking about explaining the symptoms of anxiety and or side effects of meds to people but rather it is the constant reinforcement that the health anxiety sufferer demands to be told they are well even when all the evidence already confirms this.

Anyway, I think this is an interesting discussion none the less and gives us all something to think on I suppose...:)

[nomorepanic]

Yes I know what HA is but what I meant is that if someone comes here suffering with HA they can be reassured that the symptom is normal though can't they?

I think I am losing a fighting battle here and this comes to mind :wall:

No matter how much you reassure someone with HA it won't help but my point was that sometimes we are stopping people crossing the line from "just a symptom" to "full blown HA".

Too late to get into a debate now lol.

I know what you are saying - it is just so hard to put it into context and get members to act on this and I still find it hard to go back to the OP's request of a separate "nice" HA forum.

[itoldyouiwasill]

Yes I know what HA is but what I meant is that if someone comes here suffering with HA they can be reassured that the symptom is normal though can't they?

I think I am losing a fighting battle here and this comes to mind :wall:

No matter how much you reassure someone with HA it won't help but my point was that sometimes we are stopping people crossing the line from "just a symptom" to "full blown HA".

Too late to get into a debate now lol.

I know what you are saying - it is just so hard to put it into context and get members to act on this and I still find it hard to go back to the OP's request of a separate "nice" HA forum.

If you feel like :wall: I'm afraid that statement makes me feel much the same.

I also think the idea of a 'nice' or 'happy' forum is misguided. From my experience of all anxiety forums the 'happy' forums are those where people can get the reassurance they crave and have never ending discussions over their symptoms that allows them the opt out of taking steps towards recovery. The 'nasty' or 'miserable' forums are those where people are not allowed the chance to be drawn into dwelling on their health but rather are activly encouraged to do the work that will whittle out the true underlying cause of their issues and take the steps to recover...I have no doubt as to which group have the better chance of moving forward.

Anyway, as you rightly say it is too late to get into a debate and we would appear to have pretty opposed views on this matter so maybe we should just agree to disagree:grouphug:

[nomorepanic]

Umm I thought we were on the same side here and not having opposing opinions! I agreed with what YOU said but disagreed with the OP about a NICE sub-forum.

Maybe I was wrong lol.

[itoldyouiwasill]

Yeah...maybe I just wanted an excuse to use the group hug smiley. Crikey, 2AM on Friday night Saturday morning and posting an an anxiety forum...

...MUST.NOT.REGRESS, lol:winks:

[fightingmyself]

Nomorepanic said
"No matter how much you reassure someone with HA it won't help"

Which is exactly the point!

and

"Umm I thought we were on the same side here and not having opposing opinions! I agreed with what YOU said but disagreed with the OP about a NICE sub-forum.

Maybe I was wrong lol."

I'm not saying you are wrong, but just that it might be worth a try having an area for people who want to get over health anxiety rather than rely on other people to give them reassurance.

How many people with HA have asked ONCE and left it at that about an ailment? (if its once only, then it aint HA to start with!) The point is HA sufferers don't believe reassurance, hence they keep checking, prodding, examining, asking partners, posting on forums, searching google, to try and prove to themselves that they are not ill. That is understandable. It's also never ending because it only takes another symptom to come along to knock the legs from under them. If the core problem of accepting a higher level of uncertainty is dealt with, then HA sufferers could be like most other people who worry about their health, when there is a real reason to worry.

Again, i'm not knocking anyone. I know people what escape from the panic they are in, and there are those who want to help them by comforting them. I'm here because I have HA, and this has been one of my worst weeks in ages - I need help too.

It is impossible to get over and ignore a problem by focussing on it

[westofengland]

This is a fascinating debate. I don't think you will ever stop people seeking reassurance here, no matter how you organise the site. But at least if people come here and post reassurance-seeking threads,they may get some feedback that gives them the bigger picture - eg reminding them that their issue is probably more one of anxiety. They can also come here and see what other people are going through and that they are not alone. HA can make you feel so lonely. They will also get a different perspective here and if there is just one person that suggests maybe the reassurance-seeking is the problem, rather than the feared symptoms, it might help. Not everyone can afford or get access to CBT treatment. I am trying to get referred back to a counsellor on the NHS as my other therapist charges fifty quid an hour!

I find this site absolutely fantastic, there is nothing like it for helping me understand I am not alone and that maybe my terrors are related to other things (rather than my current obsession, asbestos exposure giving me and the kids mesothelioma!)
Geoff

[Dizz]

Therapy at it's best :yesyes: There's nothing quite like a good debate and the odd disagreement to get peoples minds occupied with something else.:D

Maybe the forum needs a section where people can debate topical issues (or anything else for that matter) as long as it's not about health or panic etc. :bighug1: