View Full Version : Binge eating
Thanks Nigel. See you later.
Karen
Happiness is not a state to arrive at but a manner of travelling.
You only live once, but if you do it right, once is enough ~ Christine Cagney, Cagney & Lacey
Hi Karen,
I hope today has gone well and that by the time you read this you're back home and feeling ok.
I am thinking of you.
Love and huge (((((hugs)))))
Lisa x
Hi Karen,
Just wanted to say Good Luck, and I'm also thinking of you,
Take Care,
Heather
Hi ya hun,
Did text you back at lunchtime but don't know whether you got it before you had to turn your mob off at the hosp.
You have been a right brave little soldier and we all look forward to welcoming you home mate.
Big furry non chucking you round the globe sort of a hug.
Love Piglet xxx
Still thinking of you sis, huge ((((((((((hugs)))))))))) waiting here for you.
Love Lisa x
Hi Karen,
I don't know if you're home, still in hospital or what but I am thinking of you, have been all day on and off. I really hope all went well and that you'll feel alot better for having the op done.
Big (((((hugs))))),
Hope wherever you are you get a good nights sleep.
Lisa x
Just checking in to see how today went and wondering now if you had to stay overnight???
Big hugs
Love Piglet xxx
Thank you all for your supportive messages. What a day! I am now home (by the skin of my teeth!) as I didn't think I was going to escape from there tonight.
All started ok with the nurse assessment, although she noted by BP was a little low it wasn't too bad and she didn't think there would be any problems, in spite of a couple of other possible problems.
Actually Lisa, I am not sure it is a good idea for you to read all of this although I am not going to go into lots of detail now, as it is very late and it's been a very long day.
The nurse told me I was third on the list and so wouldn't be going in for my surgery until about 3.30-400 and it was only 11.30 am at this point [:O]. Waiting around was the worst point.
In the end I was lucky in that the order of the list was changed and I was moved to second and went in for my surgery at about 2.45. I think maybe it was because I often experience nausea and sickness following anaeasthetics. However, this time I was given something to prevent this prior to the anaesthetic and it appears to have worked as I was fine.
The problems occurred because the nursing staff were concerned about my fluctuating BP following surgery and the fact that they thought it was very low at times. I was told that I wouldn't be allowed home until it returned to a normal level and that even the reading taken when I arrived was low, although I think it is normal for me. I tried explaining that I do experience low BP due to my eating disorder but that idea seemed to be discounted.
I was put on a saline drip and was having my BP checked at 10 minute intervals for several hours. I was confined to bed due to fears I would faint or collapse if I tried to get up, and it was difficult to move when constantly attached to a drip (which was hung on a make-shift hook and not a proper stand) and a BP cuff.
I was also drinking loads because not being able to drink until after my op had been very difficult when I usually drink loads of water. When it got to 6pm I asked to go to the toilet - having had the saline drip attached for a couple of hours and also drinking a whole jug of water. However, the nurse said it was supper time and to eat something and then she would help me get to the toilet! How was I supposed to eat when I was bursting to go to the loo [Duh!].
Plus I had discussed eating with the original nurse I saw who had agreed I could just have a slice of toast, without butter, and even dry if I couldn't face jam etc on it. However, she was now off duty and I was told to try a sandwich. I wanted to come home and so said I'd try a turkey sandwich as long as it didn't have anything like mayonnaise on it - I knew I wouldn't be able to get away without the butter. But, when the catering lady came in she offered me egg mayonnaise, corned beef and pickle, or some kind of meat (beef we both thought) and something like horseraddish sauce. There was no way I could eat any of those. So I again asked if I could just have a slice of toast and I did get this in the end. Luckily it came with a basket of different spreads and I just had a bit of low sugar jam on it.
After eating the toast, I asked the nurse again about going to the toilet but she told me to wait for 5 minutes after eating and then she would see about taking me. If I had bad bladder control I could've wet the bed by this time [:I].
Eventually she did come back to help me but it was embarrassing and difficult to cover up properly with the drip in my hand so I couldn't wear my dressing gown properly. She also wouldn't let me lock the toilet door, I suppose in case I collapsed, and having finally got there I couldn't go [Sigh...]. I didn't admit that though as I didn't want to give them another reason to keep me in overnight.
She did let me sit in a chair when I got back to my bay and I held on for as long as I could as it caused such a fuss getting to the toilet in the first place [8)]. Luckily that nurse went off duty and I asked someone else, saying I needed to go again and this time did lock the doo
Hi Karen,
Welcome back sis! I am so pleased all went well. I just came to turn my pc off and go to bed but I couldn't stop thinking about you, so was really pleased to see you'd posted when I checked.
Thanks for the warning about reading your post, I did read and I'm ok. I don't normally suffer from low bp, mine fluctuates but I guess most peoples does. Mine can go low late at night but not badly low. Now slow pulses however.......... No seriously thanks for thinking of me but I really am ok after reading.
Well done for coping with all that, you did so so well, I am so proud of you sis [^]. Well done for eating too and for eating now you're home.
I hope you make a quick recovery and are not too sore. Please loook after yourself more the next few days and try and keep up the eating, your body needs fuel to heal and recover.
So glad you're back and ok, really missed you.
Love and (((((((((hugs))))))))
Lisa x x
Hi Lisa
Thanks so much for your kind reply. I was conscious of posting too much medical information as I don't want to be the cause of anxiety to you or anyone - especially when I wasn't concerned about it myself.
I am trying to be kinder to myself. I feel I really need laxatives - not loads but enough to be able to go to the toilet but have avoided taking any and am trying to eat a reasonable amount.
I'm obviously sore and in a bit of pain tonight but am OK. Just wish I could've let you all know earlier that I was fine. Just relieved it is over and I am back at home.
Night sis.
Karen xx
Hi Karen
sorry not to post earlier - I read yours but am feeling so odd and awful tonight that I couldn't concentrate on writing... but have been thinking about you loads..
Glad you sound ok and it all seems to have been successful..
loads and loads of love xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
No worries Fee. It is too hard sometimes when you are having problems of your own and that's the good thing about this forum in that there are usually others around to support and encourage when necessary.
I am doing ok apart from soreness, pain and other side effects I expected. I can't sleep thought (or type it appears :D) which is why I am on here.
Just hope it solves the problem but it will be some time yet before I know for sure.
Karen xx
Thanks Nigel. Except I can't as I have to go out to the doctor's this afternoon.
I would also like to go to a few shops in town but don't know if I will be up to that or not.
Must get some sleep now. I'm suddenly soo tired [|)][|)][|)].
Are you up early or not been to bed yet either???
Karen
Happiness is not a state to arrive at but a manner of travelling.
You only live once, but if you do it right, once is enough ~ Christine Cagney, Cagney & Lacey
So glad that's all over then mate - other than the docs today try and rest up and maybe for the next few days too.
Biggest hugs.:D
Love Piglet xxx
"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.
Hi Karen,
Sounds like all went well. It's good you were able to come home and sleep in your own bed. Also agree it'd be good to relax when you've been to the doctors.
Hope you have a good day,
Take Care,
Heather
Hi Karen,
I hope you're feeling ok today, not too sore. I hope you got some sleep too.
I hope the docs goes ok later, I expect you get your blood test results?
Take it easy and look after yourself.
Love and hugs,
Lisa x
nomorepanic
21-04-06, 11:57
Karen
Glad it all went well and you coped amazingly well with all of it so well done you.
I am pleased that they have hopefully sorted the problem out for you.
Get some rest and take it easy now.
Catch up when I get back on Sunday
xxx
Nicola
Hi All
I think I had a total of 3 hours sleep at most as I was awake again at 10.30, so still feel very tired.
The thing is there are things I could actually want to go out and do today but know it's not a good idea and I need to rest. Although I wasn't actually given any post-op instructions come to think about it. Am not even sure if I can have a bath this morning - yes I still am in bed [:I]. Maybe I should ring the unit and ask but that involves my fear of making phone calls [Duh!].
Lisa: Yes I am going to see my doctor to get my blood test results. I actually hope they show my thyroid levels are low again because it would explain a lot of the tiredness I've been experiencing.
She was also testing for electrolyte imbalance due to my fall the other week but I doubt there will be anything on there as if there was anything urgent the surgery would've been in touch by now I am sure.
OK I get the message about resting lol!! Does that mean I don't have to do my housework then? :D
Pain is not too bad this morning but might take some Paracetamol before going out as moving about might start it off. Just one main painful problem really which is a bit embarrassing to talk about here [:I].
Thank you Lisa, Heather, Piglet and Nigel for your messages of support today. Fee thank you too as I know you are not well and my thoughts are with you too.
Karen xx
Thank you Nic.
I had to speak to so many different people yesterday and to try to be assertive in putting my views across when I was sure what the cause of my low blood pressure was when the staff there don't know my history.
Just realised I can ask my doctor the bath question [Duh!] although it means I'll have to make do with a wash before going there today.
Hope you have a very relaxing time Nic and enjoy yourself :). Look forward to hearing about it on Sunday.
Karen xx
Hi Karen,
Hope the docs goes ok, do take it easy and try and get some more rest aswell.
Thinking of you.
Love Lisa x
Hi Karen
How did the Doc's go? You have coped so incredibly well - I hope you are not in too much pain and are able to relax and take care of yourself this evening...
What a relief it's over - I hope it can be the start of you feeling a bit better generally, we often do not realise how anxious we have been about things until afterwards...
Thinking of you hun xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Still thinking of you sis, hope the docs went ok and that you've been resting.
Love Lisa x
Me too Karen!
(((((HUG)))))
Aunty Fee xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Hi Karen,
Just wanted to say night night. Hope you are ok and have been resting.
Sleep well,
Lisa x
Thank you Lisa and Fee.
I had a short walk around town after seeing my doctor to get a few bits and pieces.
My doctor worried me a bit because she said the way I am heading now with laxatives and pills, an inpatient spell is looking increasingly likely, and that this might be somewhere loike the Maudsley in London. I have heard some real horror stories of what it is like there.
I explained about my meeting with Julia on Tuesday and my doctor was pleased that I am still taking steps to try to find a way that is going to help me because what is happening at the moment has made me worse, which my doctor also recognises has happened since I started at the clinic.
I am very scared now that if things don't change soon I am going to lose funding for the clinic and also be forced into inpatient treatment at somewhere I don't want to go.
Regarding my operation from yesterday I am ok. Feeling very tired and still sore but that's only to be expected. At least my doctor said it will be okay for me to have a bath, as I had a quick shower today and really don't like showers [Sigh...].
I suppose the positives from today are that I had breakfast and then some chicken and baked beans for dinner. I also had a small ice cream lolly (only 40 cals) this evening as my throat is sore, probably from the anaesthetic yesterday.
Missing K today though as I haven't heard from her and she didn't answer my message from Wednesday either :(.
Need to sleep but then I will be awake too early in the morning.
Karen xx
Morning Karen
Sounds like you are doing really really well[8D]
Hope you had some good sleep too.
love n hugs xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Hi Karen,
I hope you had a good sleep and feel ok today.
Well done for eating so well yesterday :D.
Lisa x
PS Did you get your blood test results from the doc?
Hi Lisa & Fee
Thanks for your replies.
I am not doing well today. I am (or was) recovering from my surgery but had a bad night, woke up feeling very depressed and distressed and have been bingeing again.
Have also taken a high dose of laxatives and one of those diet pills that made me so ill a couple of weeks ago. I feel a deserve the punishment :(.
I know if I carry on like this I could end up in hospital and there is no way I am going there. Just feel like taking a load of sleeping pills and blocking the day out. In fact I would rather just sleep and not wake up at present because I feel so depressed.
I am so fat and can't stop eating, and I don't want to live like this.
Karen xx
(((((hugs)))))) Karen,
Sorry you feel low and distressed and are bingeing again. Wish I knew how to help. Please don't take any more of those diet pills though (in fact I thought you had got rid of them and used the ones you found afterwards?). Maybe you can use staying out of hospital as an incentive to stop these pills. I really worry about you taking these but more so as your body is trying to heal after your op. Please take care of yourself sis, you mean so much to me (and us all I'm sure), I don't want to see you get ill.
I know you can't help how you feel and that what you do is part of a nasty disorder. You are not fat at all, but I know you won't believe me.
I was thinking actually, I know you've been turned down for CBT on NHS but could you see someone privately for it? I say that because my CBT lady deals with eating disorders so thought many others may do too. Just a thought anyway.
If you look here under find a therapist and then sussex, there are plenty in your area and some do eating disorders.
http://www.babcp.org.uk/
Thinking of you,
Lisa x
Hi Lisa
Sorry to be causing concern again. I'm my own worst enemy with these things I am doing to myself. I don't even know why I binge half the time anymore, except maybe because I know I will punish myself afterwards and it's what I believe I deserve.
I just can't handle the fact that I've completel lost control of eating and I desperately want to be back in the position I was in last year. I can't handle the fact that I keep eating when I want to have the self-control to starve myself and to lose weight again. I am never going to be happy until I lose this weight.
Yes, I had disposed of most of those pills but I have a few left from the ones I missed when I flushed the others down the loo. I know it is dangerous to take them and my doctor explained why yesterday but somehow it makes it more appealing because I selfishly want to damage myself [:I]. I believe I deserve it.
I don't even want to eat. I feel stuffed and have taken the Xenical and a number of laxatives to make myself ill. So if I am rolling around in agony later it will be my own fault. I am not going to hospital though.
Maybe you are right and I should look into some private CBT. I was waiting to hear the outcome of the care plan meeting they are supposed to be holding at the clinic but my funding for there could be cut at any time and I don't want to get used to seeing someone and then be left high and dry again.
Just feel like I have no quality of life anymore but that this is my own fault.
Thank you for caring and I am really sorry. Feel like I should dump the rest of the food now and starve until I am back to a weight I am happy with but I am not even good enough to do that.
Sorry :(:(:(.
Karen xx
Hi Karen,
No need to apologise for anything, I am only concerned as I care :).
I wish I could help I really do, I hate knowing you are feeling like you do and not being able to help.
I wish so much that you'd at least stop the xenical, please if there is any way you can do, your gp even told you why it's dangerous.
I don't know if I should say this but will you really be happy if you lose weight, you weren't really happy when you were that weight before were you, and it will never be thin enough for the anorexia.
In the hairdressers yesterday I picked up a magazine and read a story about an anorexic lady (now 27). The picture was of here in hospital at 4 stone (I could barely look it was so disturbing), hours away from dying I expect, she only wanted to lose a little too, but that little was never enough and she lost more and more. She ended up having inpatient treatment (forget where) and she is now just about a normal weight and is able to see just how thin she was. But it scared me just how bad it can get and I don't want that for you and I know you don't want that really either. Being thin is not what will make you happy and you know that too, I know you do. I so wish you could get the help you need to deal with all of this.
Starving really won't help either, it doesn't even help with weight loss as your body will just think it's being starved and store fat. I lost 6lbs with my initial poisoning but even though I haven't eaten much for the last 2 weeks, I've lost no more weight, the reason is that I'm not eating enough to lose weight, my metabolism has slowed and my body will store my food as fat. I know that you know all this too.
I really hope I haven't offended you in any way, just desperate to help, but I am way out of my depth and probably not really strong enough myself to be of much help right now, sorry.
Do think about the CBT, at least whatever happens with funding you wouldn't lose this person and the clinic don't seem to be helping much, although I still hope that changes.
Right must go now, shoulder is aching form typing so much.
Love Lisa x
Hi Lisa and thanks again. I don't mean to cause concern to you or anyone here but don't have anywhere else to go to for help.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">I wish so much that you'd at least stop the xenical, please if there is any way you can do, your gp even told you why it's dangerous.</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I know it is dangerous, although not as dangerous as the Reductil which is the one my doctor was really concerned about. The Xenical could just leave me with severe stomach pain again but that will be my own fault.
I so understand what you are saying about the article you read but I have never been anywhere near that low weight and I managed to maintain at a weight I could cope with for most of last year (even though the temptation was always there to lose more).
What I can't handle is this out of control eating and the weight gain and I now feel much more ill now than I ever did when I restricted. I just want to get back to that again and I know I won't feel as depressed and suicidal as I do right now.
Starving does actually help eventually. I know this to be true from when I have been on fasts before. It is a quick way to lose weight as long as food reintroduction is managed in the right way so the weight doesn't pile on again. It is just getting past the first few days which is the difficult bit.
I have looked at the site you mentioned but there was only one female therapist listed and of course she was the only one with no website or email address listed, just a mobile number. I don't want to see a male therapist and I am a bit suspicious of someone who only lists a mobile number - and she is in Brighton too.
There is just no specialist help in this area, not even in the private sector it seems.
Karen xx
Hi Karen,
It's fine, I want you to come here for support, but I can't pretend your actions don't worry me, what sort of friend would I be if I encouraged you to take more pills, a very bad one! But if your doctor can't convince you not to take them, I have no chance sadly - doesn't mean I won't keep trying though.
I know you have never been anywhere near the weight of the lady I had read about, but nor had she for many years until she got worse, I just don't want that happening to you, you're too special and have too much going for you.
Shame there was no one on that list for you. I though everyone on that list had to also be registered with that association so would be ok, I found my lady on that list but my lady was also recommended to me by a NHS psychiatrist, so even though there is only a mobile number she may be ok. It may just be the best way to contact her if she's busy. I would have thought there would have been an email address though and I know you find phone calls hard.
Could you really not see a man? I only say that as I want you to get some help and does it really matter who it is if they help? Surely it's better than feeling how you do now? Could you not just see him as a person rather than a man. Sorry if that upsets you, I don't intend that, I do know you're not comfortable with men, just want you to find some help for you. You are ok with the man at Jills place though aren't you so you are ok with some men I believe. I should shut up as I really don't mean to upset you and I don't really understand I guess, although I do try to understand and help.
Anyway thinking of you, hugs,
Lisa x
Hi Lisa
I worry about posting here when I an feeling this bad because I don't want my problems to cause anyone else to feel worse but it is the only place I can get support aprt from my one a day message to K.
The lady on that list might be alright as she is registered there but I'd prefer more information and really a recommendation at this stage. I also agree with K and Jill that the kind of private support I could afford is not really enough help for me at present because seeing someone once a month is not going to be that beneficial when I am having these daily crises.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Could you really not see a man? I only say that as I want you to get some help and does it really matter who it is if they help? Surely it's better than feeling how you do now? Could you not just see him as a person rather than a man. Sorry if that upsets you, I don't intend that, I do know you're not comfortable with men, just want you to find some help for you. You are ok with the man at Jills place though aren't you so you are ok with some men I believe.</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
No, I really couldn't see a man and I do have my reasons for this. I am ok with the Mark, who works with Jill but I have known him for some time now so he is not a stranger and there are some important issues I still would not feel comfortable talking to him about.
So really I need a female therapist and someone who comes recommended and has the relevant experience. I am just so disappointed that I am not getting the help I was hoping for from the clinic, because I do think I need that kind of intensive (day patient) help at present.
BTW - don't tell yourself to shut up :D[^];). I know you are trying to help.
Karen xx
Hi Karen,
Can your gp recommend a private therapist at all? I do agree having a recommendation is a good idea if possible.
Hope you feel better later sis,
Thinking of you.
Lisa x
I appreciate what you say Lisa. My GP doesn't know anyone in this area who specialises in treating eating disorders.
My day is getting worse because now I have internet connection problems. It must be my ISP, but I couldn't even connect with my mobile data card either a minute ago.
Just feel like it's all my fault and another example of how bad I am. I want and need to punish myself more because I am so bad I deserve it.
I can't handle being cut off from K or being isolated without the internet.
Karen xx
Hey Sis, less of that bad and punishing talk as neither are true ok.
I can understand that losing your connection is stressful and makes you feel cut off, however it's not your fault, that can't be possible. If it's the ISP it will be affecting many people and can not be anything to do with you therefore no punishment is required and you are NOT bad in any way. I wish you could believe this. I for one wouldn't choose someone bad to be my sis :).
Love and hugs, thinking of you,
Lisa x
Hi sis
It must be me because the data card I have as back-up is not even working properly either. I feel I am being punished because I am so bad and haven't punished myself enough.
I can't cope. For the first time in ages I am desperate for K's help and scared of being cut off from her completely. If I lose my internet connection I can't contact her at all.
I feel so very low tonight that it's scary :(.
Karen xx
((((((((((((((((((((Karen)))))))))))))))))
Aww sis, sorry you feel so low tonight. The internet problem could be your data card but whatever the problem it is not and can not be your fault. You are not bad and don't need punishing. I think things like that sometimes, like for example I got food poisoning because I was off work for so long when maybe I could have gone in BUT there is no way that is true, it can't be really, it was a coincidence nothing I did or didn't do would have changed it. It's the same with you, nothing you do or don't do will affect anything. I mean even really bad people (murderers etc) don't get punished for things they do in that way. You're a great and good person - yes you are, don't argue ;).
I can understand you worrying more about hearing from K as you are low, that's natural. You may not even lose your connection, you are still connected now I see, it will be ok sis.
I know you feel that you can't cope but you can, I know you can.
Hang in there, you can do this.
Love Lisa x
Thought I'd reply to your surgery idea that you mentioned on my post here:
Surgery [:O] Well I really don't think this is a good idea at all sis in fact it's a terrible idea (but you knew I'd say that). No reputable surgeon would agree to this, really they wouldn't and if they do I will personally track them down and make sure the GMC strike them off! . You feel fat but I bet to anyone else you still look very thin and certainly not fat or overweight, no surgeon would agree to operate especially if they know your background and they would be downright irresponsible if they did too. Ok yes in theory we all have fat in our bodies, even the thinnest person has some body fat but we need that to survive too. I think you need to forget this idea. Also most plastic surgeons are men and you would have to undress in front of him and explain why you want the surgery and if they're decent surgeons they even counsel you about it first - ok I am trying anything I can think off to put you off but it's also true.
Lisa x
Hi Lisa
I am now connected using my data card but this can work out expensive, but it's the only option because my ISP won't connect for some reason.
At least I've managed to send my message to K but have been waiting for an email today, although it's not likely to arrive now.
I am determined to find someone who will do this surgery and I am sure there must be a way around it somehow. When I have proper internet access back I can do some more research. I definitely DO need it.
There is no reason for any surgeon to know my background and I am now so desperate that I feel this is my only option - either that or continue with all these pills, or even adding others that I had started to research.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Also most plastic surgeons are men and you would have to undress in front of him and explain why you want the surgery and if they're decent surgeons they even counsel you about it first - ok I am trying anything I can think off to put you off but it's also true.<div align="right">Originally posted by LJ - 22 April 2006 : 22:34:10</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
There must be female surgeons and I will just have to find one. I know you and probably everyone else here thinks I am mad but I need to do this.
My only other option is to spend more nights like I've had tonight being ill from taking the pills, and my doctor has warned me of the health dangers of doing that. Surely surgery is a preferable option?
Karen xx
Hmmmmm sis, what am I going to do with you. You actually have me lost for words for once [:O] Only for a second though while I thought of my reply.
Well while I don't want you to have any more nights or days feeling like you do right now, I can't say that surgery is a good idea, nor is pills of any sort. I can't really say one is worse than the other as both are not what you really need or good for you. You need to learn ways to deal with all these feeling you have and ways to deal with the bingeing. I do realise you are not getting this help from the clinic and that you are now feeling desperate. Seriously though surgery is not the way to go. I am overweight and probably full of cellulite that could be sucked out but I'd never do it as it's not the answer. Most surgeons do want to know your background too, some even want to consult with a gp these days. They will take one look at you and see you don't need it, once you start trying to convince them you do they will know you must have a problem to be seeing yourself in such a distorted way. Sorry to be harsh but I have to get through to you somehow, although I doubt I can even if I try.
What would K say to this idea? No one should go through surgery unless it's abslolutely necessary and this isn't sis, honest it isn't.
I feel so helpless, but I can only say please don't do it and hope you don't. Please stop with looking for more pills too, you are going not going to make yourself thinner but you will make yourself seriously ill at this rate and I don't want that and don't think you do. I don't mean to sound harsh but you know it's because I care don't you.
I really hope you sleep well tonight,
Night sis, hugs,
Lisa x
Karen,
I don't fully follow what your idea is but from what Lisa has said I could have a pretty good guess.
I only hope you are feeling better in the morning and realise what a completely daft idea this is. Everything Lisa says about them wanting to know your background is true so you wouldn't stand a chance.
I really hope you realise this is NOT a sensible idea, I think you know deep down. I really hope you find something to help you, it is a shame there isn't much happening at the clinic. You really need to let them know how bad you are feeling.
Hope you are thinking more clearly soon. Please take care of yourself. We all worry about you so much and just want the best for you.
Love Tammy xx
Hi Lisa
I know neither of these ideas are very rational but I feel so bad and am so desperate that I no longer care about the dangers of what I am doing or might do. I just need to be thin again and I feel such a FAILURE because I can't do it the way I did before.
I do know everything you are saying is because you care and I do feel bad about causing concern again. Everything is going wrong tonight, on top of the bad way I have been feeling since the beginning of the year really, and I just don't know how much more I can take.
K obviously doesn't think my ideas are rational either and not likely to solve the problem of why I feel so depressed and unhappy in the first place. But this is all I can focus on.
I can't sleep because my internet still isn't working - am still using the data card but this is very slow and costly. Plus I am worried about running out of credit.
I am also now panicking that I won't be able to get online tomorrow and therefore won't hear from K or be able to write to her. Everything is snowballing and I am feeling worse the longer this goes on.
Sorry, but I can't forget these ideas because I don't think I have any other options left.
Karen xx
Karen,
I do realise how low you feel but surgery isn't the answer, listen to K if not to me, you trust her don't you. At least don't make any rash decisions now, think it through and see how you feel in time, things really can improve and this is not the only option, in fact it should not be an option ever. K is right it will not be the answer to how you feel, really it won't.
You are NOT a FAILURE in any way, saying it over and over is just reinforceing it in your mind and it is not true in any way, shape or form.
Try and get some sleep soon, your internet may well be working fine tomorrow, I do understand you being stressed over it though.
I know you don't care about what happens to you (although I think you do care really and you sounded quite frightened the other night when you were so ill) but I/we all care about you. I know you feel bad about causing concern, it's ok but yes I am really concerned and I hate seeing you like this. I want to help and to know I can't is frustrating and makes me feel helpless. I am getting the urge again to visit your clinic and scream until someone listens (or locks me up Lol). Seriously though please look after yourself, you are strong, you can beat these feelings, I know you can. Just don't give up, things really can improve.
Really must go now getting exhausted and achy from being here too long.
Night sis,
Love and hugs,
Lisa x
Just popping in to say goodnight - I am up so late cos I have been chatting to my sister on the phone for 5 hours[:O][:I]!!!
Too dopey at this time of night to say anything that would make any sense so I will give you a hug instead.
<center>((((((((((((((K))))))))))))</center>
Love Piglet xx
"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.
Thank you for the messages. I lost my connection again and it has just taken me ages to top up my data card in case the ISP still isn't working tomorrow. I don't know if it's that or something wrong with my network set-up, but whatever it is it is making me feel much worse.
Tammy: Thanks for your message. I have already told them at the clinic how bad I am feeling and that things are getting worse, but nothing changes. I don't want to say much more because I am too scared of being sent for ECT like one of the other patients this week.
Piglet: Thanks for the hug.
Lisa: Thanks for trying to talk sense into me tonight. I realise it must be very frustrating and I am just not able to think rationally about anything, particularly when my only contact with the outside world is in doubt with these internet problems.
I do try to listen to K which is how I've managed to come off pills and laxatives in the past, but at the moment I feel I have sunk too far and I am scared of losing my contact with her too because I can only contact her on the internet.
I do feel a failure and I can't even blame the clinic for not doing enough to help becaude I am the one who has to get better. I just can't do it though and am getting worse.
Think I'll end up relying on sleeping pills and Diazepam to pass the day in a haze tomorrow. It's better than eating non stop. I now have even more fat and weight to lose.
Sorry, nothing is helping me feel better tonight. I feel so distressed.
Karen xx
One final (((hug))) for tonight sis.
I know nothing is helping tonight and that you're distressed but am still here for you and thinking of you.
Hope you get some sleep.
Night sis,
Love Lisa x
((((((KAREN))))))
1. I had trouble with my connection too (you will see I have said this before coming here - I'm not just saying it!). I bet it's not a coincidence (did you upgrade media player - I did and it's been since then). I couldn't work it out at all and this morning just fiddled and fiddled and eventually got it on line but don't know how I did it lol!
So did I deserve punishing too? NO WE DID NOT - it's the poxy internet world of gremlins lol!!!
2. (and I'm sorry hun I'm going to brutal here) Having surgery for a little bit of fat is obscene. To even think about it shows how terribly terribly distorted your thoughts are at the moment. It terrifies me to think there maybe a sick doctor out there who might conspire with you if you were convincing enough. It is the LAST THING ON EARTH YOUR POOR BODY NEEDS! (oh crikey I'm shouting[:I])
3. You are desperate for help. Use the money to get something that will help - like CBT - you are resisting this because that self abusive part of you does not want to get better it just wants to get thin. Tell that part of you to PO because you know better!
4. Why are you so opposed to a-ds? I haven't heard you say why (I may have missed a good reason) but could it be for the same reason as I am suggesting in point 3? Could it hun? Might they make you get better and therefore not get thinner???
Only you can get yourself better at the end of the day. You are a wonderful, intelligent, perceptive, sensitive and lovely lovely person and you just can't see it because you're feeling so so low. But if you start to feel better you will begin to see it again. So many people here care so much about you - we're not stupid you know[8D]
I hope your connection is working ok today and that you feel a little better... You HAVE to haul yourself back from where you are going.
And before you think it - no-one is fed up with you, it's a horrible horrible disorder you have that is incredibly difficult to deal with. The legacy of my skirmish with bulimia is that I loathe, absolutely loathe, skinny people, I find it utterly repulsive. That's my defence mechanism. I don't want to go all feminist on you, and I am aware these days many boys have this problem too, but the whole of the last 50 years seems to have tried to make women feel like they should look like 12 year old boys and it makes me seethe. You are a woman and have to somehow find a way of accepting that as we get older we mostly get rounder and softer and that's ok because who we are has nothing to do with how we look. Wanting to look skinny, emaciated, ill etc is a way of making the world see how much pain you are in. Restricting, bingeing,purging, taking laxatives and diet pills is your way of self-harming at the moment. All self-harming is a form of distraction from our painful emotions but it doesn't work for long...
Karen hun I had to say all this because I feel so strongly about it. So many women (and men too now) are doing themselves irreparable damage this way.
You have to fight it - I know you know all this. You have to want to get better. You have to force yourself to think positive thoughts about yourself. That's why CBT is the best route. Or a-ds. Or a combination. The alternatives are getting iller or other interventions you don't want.
I hope I haven't upset you and gone too far but it just had to come out of me.... I really do care so much about you and wish I could do more to help - and even more, I wish the services were available to help you.... There seem to be dozens and dozens of private clinics that offer help (I was googling for clinics the other day for myself in desperation and all I kept finding was ones for eating disorders - none for health anxiety lol!!!). So the problem must be huge if there's loads of money in it.
I hope you are ok today hun.... thinking of you and sending more
((((HUGS))))
Loads an
oh - don't know what happened here - got posted twice lol!!!
Morning All
Well Fee I feel well and truly told off now [:O] but I know everything you said comes from the best intentions.
I don't want to argue each point but do feel the need to reply to some of what you've said.
Yes, I did upgrade Realplayer but that was Friday night and the internet was working until the afternoon yesterday. Maybe there was a connection between the two and if so I won't be downloading any further updates for it, as I hardly use is anyway. Internet working this morning (touch wood!!!).
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">2. (and I'm sorry hun I'm going to brutal here) Having surgery for a little bit of fat is obscene. To even think about it shows how terribly terribly distorted your thoughts are at the moment. It terrifies me to think there maybe a sick doctor out there who might conspire with you if you were convincing enough. It is the LAST THING ON EARTH YOUR POOR BODY NEEDS! (oh crikey I'm shouting[:I])</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
But it isn't 'a little but of fat', it is a lot of fat and this is the latest way I am trying to deal with it. I'm sorry but I can't handle staying like this and the only alternative is to starve myself again until I lose the weight and the fat but I have failed at that and it will take too long. I need to do something NOW before I end up killling myself with these pills I keep taking.
3. I have researched private CBT/solution focused therapy for treatment of eating disorders and cannot find anyone - no female therapists anyway and I won't see a man (for reasons I am not prepared to say on here). It's not like I haven't been trying the therapy route but I'm getting worse and now I am so depressed I actually am so distressed that I wake up in the morning.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">4. Why are you so opposed to a-ds? I haven't heard you say why (I may have missed a good reason) but could it be for the same reason as I am suggesting in point 3? Could it hun? Might they make you get better and therefore not get thinner???</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I have lots of reasons for being opposed to antidepressants. I've been on countless different ones in the past, some of which made me worse and I actually tried to kill myself while taking them. I am also concerned with the weight GAIN associated with these meds. And I have never found these meds helpfiul so it is not worth it as far as I am concerned.
I admit I am feeling very depressed at present and that is probably affecting my judgement but medication won't help. What would help would be some effective help from the clinic and the support I really need and ought to be getting from there. So far I've felt invisible and left to my own devices to just get worse and worse. Now I am in the state I am in and it is only because I am noticeably depressed that someone I hope is taking notice.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">And before you think it - no-one is fed up with you, it's a horrible horrible disorder you have that is incredibly difficult to deal with.</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I admit I am beginning to think that I am causing people to lose patience with me. K hasn't even written today and the email I was waiting for didn't come in the end. I think I am a lost cause and I don't deserve the help of these ki
Karen hun your response hasn't upset me - I totally understand what you are saying and know you have been fighting really really hard... I understand also without going into detail what you are saying about your body..
I hope I didn't make you feel worse but I am so worried about you and had to say how I felt. It's disgusting the lack of support you are getting right now but I know you have all the skills within you to get better - the way you answered me shows how well you understand what is going on.
I wish so much there was more I could do.. yes the private clinics were all expensive (you know priory style) and out of our reach - I only mentioned the number of them because it shows that so many people are suffering - and if they have money there is help out there....
I hope you can manage to get through today ok hun... I'm so sorryif I upset you in anyway and I am thinking about you... I'm sure K will be in touch with you soon too.
All I can do is send another ((((((HUG))))))
Loads and loads of love xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Hi Karen,
I hope you're feeling a bit better today.
I wish I could say or do more to help too but am still thinking of you.
(((((Hugs)))))
Love Lisa x
<center>(((((((((((((((K))))))))))))))))))</center>Love Piglet xx
Thank you Fee, Lisa, Piglet and Nigel for the good wishes and hugs. I know I am being totally irrational right now and the only way I could deal with it was to self-medicate so I slept all day - and that's what I've done basically.
I'm still feeling rather doped to be honest - too many sleeping pills and Diazepam but I needed a day of fasting after bingeing yesterday and I couldn't cope with waiting all day to hear from K if she is not going to write, or for other news which is worrying me at present.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Karen hun your response hasn't upset me - I totally understand what you are saying and know you have been fighting really really hard... I understand also without going into detail what you are saying about your body..</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Glad I haven't upset you because I didn't intend to but just needed to explain how it feels from my point of view. The body image is not what people think about wanting to look slim or attractive, which is what I worry people think about me - like I am really vain or something. But there are many issues that go way further than this that I just can't talk about in public.
You didn't make me feel worse Fee and I know you care. I had all my hopes pinned on the treatment on the clinic but feel I am now worse than when I started and that leaves me wondering how or if I will ever recover.
Just need to get through the next few hours without eating and then I can sleep again until morning.
But I have stomach pains again tonight after taking laxatives when I woke briefly at lunchtime, but of course I haven't eaten anything. Still have diarrhoea and stomach pains and I hope I am not damaging my recovery from my surgery.
Hope this makes some sort of sense as I'm not really with it still [Oops!].
Karen xx
Hi Karen hun
Hope your tummy settles soon - mine's doing the same and is just as self-inflicted by drinking wine last night....[:I] I deserve it...
I know your eating disorder is not about self-image in that way - I should never have ranted on about it - it is that for some people that starts it off but I know it isnt for you... it just makes me so angry the pressure we are put under to conform - I know you're not like that! It was silly of me to let my anger out here and i didn't make it clear what i meant... I know yours has nothing to do with vanity... [:I]
Hope you evening is ok hun xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Hi Fee
No need to apologise aunty. I know you weren't getting at me with the image thing. I just didn't want anyone else reading to think my problems are due vanity or the media.
There are very specific causes of my problems.
I hope your tummy settles too!
Karen xx
Big hugs poppet and remember each day is a fresh start and full of endless possibilites - it's all in our own hands with a little help from our friends:D
Sing along now everybody 1,2,3
'Oooh I get by with a little help from my friends'
Piglet (gettin jiggy with it)!!!
:D[8D]:D[8D]:D
"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.
Hi Karen,
Just sending you more (((((hugs))))) :D
I hope you sleep well tonight (but not too many tablets please!) and have a good day at the clinic tomorrow.
Thinking of you still,
Night night,
Lisa x
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Piglet (gettin jiggy with it)!!!
<div align="right">Originally posted by Piglet - 23 April 2006 : 23:14:47</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Makes you a jiglet then! :D
Ok I'll join in with the singing, on 2nd thoughts, have you heard me sing [:I]
Hope you're ok Piglet and not been exposing yourself to too many people on a Sunday! [:O] ;)
Lisa x
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Sing along now everybody 1,2,3
'Oooh I get by with a little help from my friends'
Piglet (gettin jiggy with it)!!!
:D[8D]:D[8D]:D
<div align="right">Originally posted by Piglet - 23 April 2006 : 22:14:47</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
LOL Piglet!! You wouldn't want to hear me sing but thanks for the sentiment.
Karen xx
Thank you sis.
I'm unable to go to bed at present due to the laxatives I took at lunchtime [Sigh...].
I have taken a couple of sleeping pills now but nothing else. I need more sleep even though I've slept all day [:I]. It means I can't eat anyway.
Think K is concerned now too as she suggested it might be a good idea for her to have my address and phone number. I don't even want to imagine what she might have asked for my details for [:O].
Night sis. Hope you sleep well.
Karen xx
Hi Karen,
I hope the laxatives wear off soon.
Sounds like K might be concerned to ask for that, are you going to give her the details?
Hope you sleep soon too,
Night,
Lisa x
Hi Karen,
Hope you're ok today and managed to go to the clinic.
Thinking of you.
Lisa x
Nice to hear from you today mate and I hope the afternoon is more productive than you think.
I am trying to study so I can finally fininsh this A&P course but have a tummy ache of the sort that requires lounging about and plenty of attention for a couple of days[:I]
My exposure was really good on Sat and I cleaned the side windows chatted to a neighbour about his poorly wife and then settled down with a brew on the step and read a magazine for an hour. Only slight anxiety when I first went out but the rewards are good for sticking it out. It is really helping me feel like I have got out and seen other people and am part of the wider world. I also managed to wander up the street a couple of times not going too far though.
All little steps isnt it - will try and go a little further after dark on my own too. I think I may carry on with this as next weeks goal too, as I seem to need more than one week of any one goal. We are all pretty much in the same boat on the course and think we all look forward now to our weekly chats and I must say it's rather nice to hear real voices :D
Piglet xxx
"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.
((((((KAREN))))))
Hope this afternoon was better for you hun?
loads of love xxxxxxxxxxx
WELL DONE Piglet!!! It sounds like it's going really really well!!
big hugs to you xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Hi Karen
just to let you know im still reading your post and thinking about you,
hope you managed to get some sleep and feel a bit better take care hun xxxx
kairen x
Hi Guys
First of all Well Done Piglet. Sounds like you are doing really well with this No Panic course. Hope I didn't interrupt your studying too much today. It was soo boring sitting there alone.
Then it transpires they had forgotten all about me and a group had already started. It seems day patients (of which I am mainly now the only one) are forgotten about completely.
Felt so low anyway and it was another session where the inpatients were complaining about the food and a whole host of other issues. I just feel so much on the outside of it that I don't belong there at all.
The group finished and I went and sat down in the lounge on my own. I did eat half a sandwich but then prompted took a load of laxatives so I am paying for that tonight. Only had some rice cakes and grapes for tea but still felt compelled to take Xenical again. I just have these feelings of self destruction at present and believe I deserve to treat myself badly.
Lisa: Yes I did give K my details. I'm sure I gave them to her when I moved but I am a bit concerned about why the sudden interest.
Sorry, I'm not feeling too good either physically or emotionally again tonight. It's almost the end of April and I am nowhere near my weight target :(.
Thank you Fee and Kairen for your messages too.
Karen xx
Don't really like the thought of you taking those X tablets - don't know what they are or do but they don't sound very good for you :(
Try and look after that bod mate it's the only one you've got!!!
I don't ever mind a distraction when I am studying - doing the endocrine system tomorrow so feel free to text :D:D:D:D
Off for a bath then bed and will chat tomorrow.
Night trumpet:D
Piglet xx
"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.
Xenical [:O][}:)]! Hmmm sis, you must have found quite a few of these after you threw them all away. Laxatives are one thing (although still serious in what they do to the body) but the xenical are no good for you. Your doctor has told you that too, so I'll ease up on the lecture, only because I care honest. Can you please at least stop the xenical. Piglet is right you only have one body and it needs looking after. You are not bad and do not need punishing. Ok here endeth my sermon ;)
Sorry today was not that great at the clinic, must be hard with the set up as it is, seems you're not even getting much social contact if you're alone alot. When do you speak to Julia/Becky again?
I'm glad K has your details in some ways, kind of reassures me on some level.
Anyway hope your tummy is ok tonight,
Love and hugs,
Lisa x
Piglet: Hope not to have quite so much time sitting around with nothing to do tomorrow, apart from lunchtime when I've found the best solution is to try to have a nap. I'm not going in until 11.00, then we are hopefully having a structured session in the afternoon, plus Tuesdays are path lab outings for blood tests [Wow!].
Xenical is a prescription diet drug and I know it isn't good for me but I still feel compelled to take them.
Lisa: There are 25 in each blister pack so I have a fair few left yet. I can't resist taking them. Plus I didn't take enough laxatives today which is worse than taking a greater number. Still have stomach cramps at present and am so tired.
Hmm I trust K not to do anything except in an emergency but I won't go to hospital no matter what.
Don't know what is happening about seeing Julia or Becky this week. Things are very up in the air again at the moment. I feel too depressed to talk anyway. I've just retreated into myself.
Just want to sleep now.
Karen xx
Hi Karen,
25 xenical in a pack! I thought you literally only had a few left. Can you please throw these away, please sis, pretty please [?] They really don't do you any good or help in any way and could make you seriously ill then you will end up in hospital whether you want to or not. I did some googling a minute ago [:O] but for xenical not for me! It basically said it's only recommended for people with a BMI of 30+ who can't lose weight any other way or rarely for people with a BMI of over 27/28 with high cholesterol or other problems, certainly not for someone like you sis. Even in people that do need it, it's taken at mealtimes with a proper low calorie meal, not just the amount you are eating. It explained how it effects digestion and the bowels, I dread to think what's happening with laxatives aswell. I put in my weight and it even said I shouldn't take it and I am slightly overweight. Only nagging as I care so much, hope you know that but you really do need to stop this pill before any more damage is done. It said anorexics or bullemics should not take it and that is can cause depression with regular use as well as leaching nutrients you do need from your body. It also said this for example:
Anorexics eat very little or no fat, so this drug would have essentially no effect on them. Likewise, bulimics and laxative abusers purge the food from their bodies before it can be absorbed, so the drug would likewise have no effect. So basicaly this drug isn't even helping you, it's doing harm.
I really am sorry to be harsh (hope I don't upset you) but I just want to help you stop harming yourself so much. Whatever you think you're not bad and don't need punishing, you're a warm and lovely person.
I'm glad K has your details, even if only for emergencies.
I hope tomorrow is a better day at the clinic, at least you haven't got to go quite so early. I'm suprised you have to have blood tests weekly, I'd have thought monthly was enough but it gives you an outing! Lol.
I hope your tummy settles soon, and that you can get some sleep.
Thinking of you sis, night night,
Love & hugs,
Lisa x
Hi Lisa
I know you are saying this because you care and I can imagine it was difficult for you to read those health effects, even if the possibility relates to someone else. I did get rid of most of them (I had a real lot) but have about half a blister pack left.
I have tried to get rid of them and haven't been taking them all the time. I am aware that this really is not good news on top of the laxatives, which is why I think K is getting concerned again.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">It also said this for example:
Anorexics eat very little or no fat, so this drug would have essentially no effect on them. Likewise, bulimics and laxative abusers purge the food from their bodies before it can be absorbed, so the drug would likewise have no effect. So basicaly this drug isn't even helping you, it's doing harm. </td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
The thing is that when I binge I do eat high fat and high calorie foods and this is my attempt to prevent some of that fat being absorbed. I don't take it with every meal but do know you are right that I shouldn't be using it at all.
I am desperate for help to stop bingeing because then I'd not have the need for these pills and I know I could cut down on the laxatives again. But ultimately it is my responsibility to stop and I feel such a failure that I keep bingeing.
My tummy is still sore but the diarrhoea appears to have stopped so I'm off to bed in a minute hopefully.
I don't know why we need weekly blood tests either, particularly when there's never been anything abnormal on mine as far as I know.
Thanks for caring sis.
Karen xx
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Thanks for caring sis.
<div align="right">Originally posted by Karen - 25 April 2006 : 00:53:10</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
You're welcome sis :).
I do realise it's hard and that you have been crying out for help, the fact you can't stop bingeing doesn't make you a failure at all, you just need the right help and sadly you're not getting it.
I think I'm off to bed now too, who knows how I'll ever get up for work on Weds unless I can start going to bed/sleep a bit earlier.
Night sis,
Love and hugs,
Lisa x
Hi Karen,
Just saying hi and that I am still thinking of you today. I hope you're feeling ok and that things are better at the clinic today.
Love and hugs,
Lisa x
I know I haven't been here in awhile, but I've been reading.
Karen, xenical doesn't sound good at all. How did you get those?
((((((KAREN))))))
Thinking of you hun...
Loads of love and hugs xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Hope you've had a good day Karen.
Hugs,
Lisa x
Hi All
Thank you for all the messages. I have been in a panic for most of today because of what is happening at the clinic. There is a patient with anorexia and depression and she is currently being sent for ECT treatment. She has had three sessions now and when I saw her today she was in a right state.
This is and always has been one of my biggest fears and with Julia wanting me to see the psychiatrist because my depression is worse, I am terrified of the same thing happening to me. At the moment it is all I can think about.
I want help but not torture which is basically what I think this kind of treatment is. Part of me wants to not turn up on Thursday although I think I am just seeing Julia on Thursday as they are having a care plan meeting about me on Friday.
I don't want to see the psychiatrist and I am very scared :(:(.
Just feel so tired all the time at the moment too. I was struggling to concentrate during group CBT this morning and felt out of place with everyone discussing anorexia and not being able to eat when I am struggling with bingeing.
Then I had a nap at lunchtime and for part of the afternoon, as there was a staff meeting and we didn't have a session until about 3.15. Then we got sent to the hospital for blood tests at 4.30 just when I wanted to leave to come home.
SickofIt: It is easy to get hold of Xenical or any other medication if you know where to look. I think it would be irresponsible to say exactly where I got it from.
Lisa: Hope you get some sleep and are able to get to work tomorrow sis.
Fee: Thanks for your text. I only got it when I got home and then I promptly fell asleep [|)]. I am just tired all the time.
Hoping tomorrow will be better as I am off to Brighton to help Jill in the office for the day.
Karen xx
Hi Karen,
Well done for going and coping today.
I just read Fee's thread, it's great you have set some goals for the bingeing and that they seem to be helping you a bit more at the clinic.
I know it's hard but try not to worry about the phschiatrist, it may even help, it doesn't mean he will suggest meds or ECT at all. I don't think they will be sending you for ECT, there's no need and they can't do it without your consent surely especially as you're there as a voluntary outpatient. I agree it is torture but I really can't see why you would need it. The other person may have very different problems to you and there may be a good reason for this for her.
I hope you sleep well tonight and have a good day at Jills tomorrow.
Thinking of you,
Night,
Lisa x
Thanks Sis.
I just can't stop thinking about the ECT. It has been a major fear of mine for so many years, ever since my parents told me this would happen to me if I spoke to anyone about my depression or feelings. They went into graphic details too and I had nightmares about it for years.
Even now I know those were just scare tactics to keep me quiet I am still scared that this kind of 'treatment' still goes on today.
Karen xx
Hi Karen,
I can totally understand where your ECT fears came from and why you're so worried. I really don't think it's ever likely to happen to you but I can understand how you feel. It was awful of your parents to say things like that, I used to get threatened with boarding school occasionally but that is just cruel. I know how these things stay with us when we hear them at a young age but I really don't think it will happen.
I have to say it disturbs me to think this treatment still goes on too. I googled it to see why it is used and found this (part of NICE guidelines):
The new guidelines recommend:
:: ECT is used only to achieve rapid and short-term improvement of severe mental symptoms after other treatment has failed or when the mental condition is considered to be potentially life-threatening.
:: The therapy is used for patients with catatonia - a type of schizophrenia - or a prolonged or severe manic episode.
:: The decision to use ECT should be made jointly by the individual and the clinicians responsible for treatment.
:: Consent should be obtained where the patient is able to give such permission.
Karen none of the above applies to you, it really doesn't, it's mostly for severe mental disorders. Your problems may be severe at times but not in a way that makes ECT appropriate at all. None of your problems come into the category for this treatment and they would need your consent to do it anyway. I hope this helps and doesn't make things worse.
I hope you sleep well, love and hugs,
Lisa x
Lisa has done some really good posts there with a lot of wise words.
So there isn't much for me to add other than to agree with her - so have a hug instead (((K)))
Night night mate :)
Love Piglet xx
"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.
Hi Lisa
Thanks for sourcing that information for me. The thing that still concerns me is that the patient having this treatment did not get a choice even though she is not under section. She is just severely depressed, as well as having anorexia and feeling distressed about bingeing. So apart from the fact that she is underweight and I'm not, there is not much difference in our situations.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">
:: ECT is used only to achieve rapid and short-term improvement of severe mental symptoms after other treatment has failed or when the mental condition is considered to be potentially life-threatening.</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I think they can get round this if they say you are at risk of suicide and how do you refute that having already admittted feeling that depressed?
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">
:: Consent should be obtained where the patient is able to give such permission.</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I guess the thing that stands out here is where the patient is able to give such permission. They only have to say that the balance of the person's mind is disturbed, or thinking is irrational to get around this clause.
I think it is a barbaric treatment and I am still scared. This is such a deep rooted fear that it is difficult to let go of panicking about it.
Thanks for trying. You haven't made things worse. I just am very aware that K has been telling me how irrational my thinking is and then with what has been said at the clinic I am genuinely petrified.
Piglet: Thanks for the hug.
Karen xx
Hi Karen,
I still understand what you're saying, K may be right, it is irrational but most fears are (I should know ;)) but I know that once we get something into our minds it's stuck and it scares us.
Remember that this treatment is not used for most cases of depression (however severe) and most suicidal people are not treated this way.
They really do have to legally get your permission too, you may be irrational at times but you are able to give permission and being irrational doesn't mean they will say you're unstable etc, they could not get round this sis. Many of us have disturbed minds at times but that doesn't mean we are not able to understand and give informed consent. It may be worth telling Julia that you fear this treatment and maybe she can put your mind at rest? What does K say about the ECT?
I agree it is barbaric, I read exactly how it's done and what happens to the person, totally barbaric and uneccessary for most people so I do understand your fears. Sis it WON'T happen to you, really it won't. I know I can't reassure you so have another humungous ((((((((((hug)))))))))).
Night sis, I must try and get some rest or sleep now.
Lisa x
P.S That's two days now I've googled to find things to help you and not for me Lol.
Hope you are having a nice day today mate.
Love Piglet xx
"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.
Hi Karen,
I hope you're having a good day with Jill, must be nice to have some good company at least and I know you enjoy being there.
Still thinking of you,
Love and hugs,
Lisa x
Hi All
Thanks for the replies.
Lisa: Thanks for the reassurances about ECT. I am still really scared about it and had a nightmare last night.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">It may be worth telling Julia that you fear this treatment and maybe she can put your mind at rest? What does K say about the ECT?</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Yes, I am going to mention it to Julia tomorrow and I want to see if I can avoid seeing the psychiatrist. K hasn't yet replied to my message about the ECT but she will probably try to reassure me and tell me not to worry.
I was hoping to have a chat with Jill today about the way things are going but she was tied up with clients all day. I had already sent her an email but she had not had time to read it yet. She is hopefully going to ring me first thing in the morning before I go to the clinic for a catch up.
Piglet: Thanks for your good wishes. It was good to have some company with Karen (it gets very confusing with two of us!). I am now shattered though and not feeling too well - probably my own fault. I have stomach ache and I did take laxatives but that was only a couple of hours ago because I was feeling bloated (having not taken any yesterday). So I don't know whether it is the laxatives or not. They usually take at least 6-8 hours to have any effect.
I also need to find a good dentist pretty urgently. Having lost a filling a few weeks ago I have been putting off doing anything about it because it doesn't actually hurt and I am not registered with a dentist. But today I lost part of another tooth on the other side [Sigh...]. To be honest both these problems are with back teeth and I'd rather just have them pulled out because it's over more quickly and although not phobic of dentists, I do get anxious and have been known to be physically ill in the middle of treatment in the past [:I].
This latest tooth problem I think is the result of my last dentist who was actually struck off for gross mispractice, so I am rather wary now. I'd rather see someone who is recommended, even if I have to pay privately, as NHS dentists are like gold dust anyway.
I also suspect my poor diet is not helping as I don't get enough calcium, well hardly any really. I might have to consider taking a supplement because I just find it too difficult to incorporate sources of calcium into my diet without associations of bingeing.
I need to go shopping really as I have hardly anything in but didn't want to risk it on the way home tonight, and won't now have time to stop off in the morning before the clinic which is how I usually try to avoid buying binge foods.
I should eat something too but it is a bit difficult with tummy ache and the hunger has now passed having not eaten today.
Just feel like I want to sleep really. Sorry if I don't get around to posting elsewhere for a while, as I think I need a nap.
Hope you are both ok.
Karen xx
Hi Karen,
I hope you're feeling ok and that your tummy isn't too bad tonight.
It's good you had a day with some company in Karen, shame Jill was so busy but hopefully you will speak with her tomorrow.
Good luck with finding a dentist, sounds like you need one now. You may well need a calcium supplement, I think you take a multivitamin but there may not be enough in that. Might even be worth getting the dietician to recommend something if you're seeing her again. Can you manage to eat yoghurts at all, they can be good?
I hope you sleep well tonight and have a good day at the clinic tomorrow and manage to chat to Julia about things.
Thinking of you sis,
Night night,
Lisa x
Thanks Lisa.
Today has started badly already. I still have stomach cramps and diarrhoea from the laxatives I took yesterday - but this is my own fault. So I am not feeling very well.
But the worst thing is that Jill did not ring as promised and I have been waiting for her call - got up early especially so I could get everything done and be ready to go straight after her phone call. Now it is too late and I have to leave for the clinic. So I am feeling upset again.
Also if I had known she wasn't going to ring I could've left earlier and had time to get my shopping on the way to the clinic - which helps me stay in control and avoid buying binge foods. Now I still have that difficulty to face.
Not a good start to the day :(
Karen xx
Will check in a bit later - these things are sent to try us arn't they!!!
Love Piglet xx
"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.
Hi Karen,
I hope your tummy settles down and that you're having a better day at the clinic today.
Sorry to hear that Jill didn't phone, it's so frustrating when people don't phone when they say they will. I'm sure she had a good reason or something came up to do but even so it does mess your day up.
Thinking of you.
Lisa x
Hi Karen
How annoying - I hope everything is ok with Jill... and that you manage to cope ok today with getting your shopping...
Take care hun xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Hi All
I'm afraid my day went downhill from this morning. I sent Jill a text and she replied apologising and saying she had forgotten [Sigh...]. She did say she would ring later today (but didn't) or tomorrow but I don't hold out much hope.
My stomach did settle eventually but the drive to the clinic took ages as I had to turn around and go a different way as there was a huge backlog of traffic which wasn't moving on the route I usually take. So I was suffering from pain and desperate for the loo again [:I]. I was also very anxious about being late for my meeting with Julia.
In the end I just about made it on time but then she was running 15 minutes late anyway. She had said we'd have a session for an hour before the group started but in the end I only had 10 minutes with her as she hadn't taken me to a private room but to the day hospital and some other patients came up.
Now I feel worse than ever though and am in a real panic. Apparently yesterday the clinic received a letter from my doctor expressing concern about the number of laxatives I am taking and also the two prescription diet pills. She also wrote that she was concerned about my mental state due to me expressing feeling suicidal at times.
This caused a huge flap among certain staff members yesterday, including Annie, the result of which is that I have been told I have to see a psychiatrist tomorrow afternoon. What I don't understand is why the sudden concern when I have already openly admitted to using these pills and to feeling very depressed, and Julia agreed that all the information was already in my file and she did explain that I had voluntarily disclosed this information to her already. It seems that no one else bothers to read files or keep up to date on what is happening.
I don't want to see a psychiatrist and I am very worried that this has been arranged so quickly and what might happen next. The patient who had ECT went for a meeting like this originally and was told she was being admitted right then. I do not want to be an inpatient and I am scared what other decisions might be taken out of my hands.
Although I understand my doctor's concerns, I also am now wondering who I can trust because she didn't tell me that she was planning to write to the clinic and so now I feel it was done behind my back. It pays to keep quiet about these things and not be open and honest. No one would ever have known if I hadn't said anything.
I also feel let down because I didn't get to discuss any of this or have the time I was meant to have with Julia, which was the only reason I went in early today.
When I saw Becky she said she has been tackling my counselling by looking at the past because I am emotionally stuck at the age when all my problems first surfaced. I know that already but I don't see how talking about it will help me become 'unstuck'. She said I need to move on and 'grow up and be an adult now'. That made me feel really good :(.
Then she said that she doesn't think I am ready or able to cope with CBT just because I have had an awful day and found it difficult to talk and answer her questions. It is more the case that I am scared of saying anything to make things worse.
So now I am panicking about tomorrow and don't want to go in case they don't let me out again. I can't get in contact with K because I know she is out tonight and I am terrified.
I am beginning to wish I had never got involved with any of these mental health services, my doctor or the clinic. It is all just making things worse.
And to top things off, Becky insisted on weighing me before I left today so it would be on my records for tomorrow. I know I have lost slightly but only 3lbs. However, she made a big fuss about my BMI being 18.1 and that this is underweight - only according to their guidelines and it is nothing compared to how low it has been in the past. The last thing I am going to admit though is that I am actively trying to lose weight.
I've lost faith in the whole system now.
Karen xx
((((((((((((((Karen))))))))))))))),
Aww sis, I don't know what to say tonight, what a day you've had.
I know this won't help but the meeting tomorrow may well be fine and be about trying to help you more, seeing the psychiatrist does not mean ECT honest it doesn't and I don't think they can even just keep you there and admit you against your will. More likely they want to talk to you and get to the bottom of the current situation and help you. I do completely understand your fears though. If they do mention ECT (and I really doubt they will) you do NOT have to have it. Legally they have to get your consent, they can't just drag you there kicking and screaming. You would be entitled to get legal advice and take them to court if they did this against your will. This is a fact and part of the NICE guidelines but I don't think it will come to that honest I don't. I know they have to take suicide seriously but saying you feel it doesn't mean you would do it, and if you were seriously planning it I doubt you'd have told them anyway. I can understand you now wondering if you can trust your doctor, but I can also understand why she acted this way, she wants them to help you and it is her professional duty to intervene if she thinks it's necessary. She knows what you are currently doing is dangerous and she wants to get you more help. We all worry about you and want you to get the right sort of help.
Becky's comments were totally uncalled for, especially the grow up and be an adult bit [}:)] You had a very hard childhood, that would affect anyone, even as an adult. I also think CBT would help you alot, with the right person who has the right experience.
I wish I could say more to help, I am here for you and thinking of you.
I hope tomorrow goes well tomorrow sis, what time are you going in?
Night night, hope you manage to get some sleep.
Love and hugs,
Lisa x
oh karen,
yet again cant think to say or help u!! [Sigh...]
wish i could help u!! all i can say is im here and thinkin of u and tryin to think of things i can say to get u back into possitive thinkin!!!
((((((((karen)))))))))
Ammegxxx
Sorry im rubbish at this!!
Thank you Lisa and Ammeg
Lisa: Yes it has been a very bad day and I really needed it to be positive day before the bank holiday which is going to be hard enough as it is.
I know my worries about ECT are probably irrational but I am finding it so hard to let go of worrying about this.
The meeting tomorrow could result in admission though. I know they can't section me without going through the legal procedure, but when I saw my doctor she mentioned that I was heading for inpatient treatment and several people at the clinic are there because they were given little choice. They can say that it is a choice of either voluntary admission or they will pursue a section.
Maybe I am catastrophising rather but on paper I know it doesn't look good that I've been abusing laxatives and two types of prescription diet pills. I just wish I hadn't told anyone about that now. The laxatives they were not overly concerned with in isolation and I know people can feel suicidal without any intention of going through with it and I've always made it clear that these are just feelings and not something I have considered planning.
It is the fact that one reason for detention can be if they consider I am a danger to myself, which I guess taking these medications could be construed as. I can't deny taking them now and I don't know the best way for damage limitation.
The fact my doctor was concerned and wrote to the clinic is not what I have an issue with. It is the fact that she did this without telling me or mentioning it all. If she had said something I could have discussed it with her and explained that I've already spoken to both Julia and Becky about what I've been doing and so they are already aware of the situation.
I am just having doubts about who I can trust now when I have tried so hard to be up front and open about all of this. Part of the eating disorder illness is to hide and lie about using methods to lose weight and it is not easy to admit what I've been doing, but I am serious about wanting help and doing my best to work with the treatment on offer. But it seems that it is better not to be like this because I wouldn't now be in this situation.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Becky's comments were totally uncalled for, especially the grow up and be an adult bit [}:)] You had a very hard childhood, that would affect anyone, even as an adult.</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Yes that bit really hurt. It was like she was saying I have been deliberately staying like this. I know I have problems and I know where they stem from. What I don't know is how to move on and put it behind me, which is why I have had various emotional problems all my life.
I hope I get some CBT because at least then I would get a scheduled appointment regularly. Julia's approach helps but I often don't get the time with her that I need.
My appointment is at 2.00 and although I don't want to go, I suppose I don't have any choice.
I am very tired tonight but am going to take my sleeping pill to make sure I sleep and hopefully don't wake too early tomorrow. I don't want to be awake worrying about this all morning.
Ammeg: Thanks for your reply and you are not rubbish at this. I appreciate your message of support and it is very kind of you to take the time to reply.
Karen xx
Hi Karen,
Aww more hugs sis. I really do feel for you right now and understand your fears.
In all honesty I don't understand enough about all this to know if any of your fears may really happen and what may make them happen, especially with regards to inpatient treatment but I am fairly sure you won't have to have ECT, they can't make you do that. If you can talk to them honestly and explain things how you see them it may help them fully understand the current situation and what you really need help with. You must do and say what you think is best though, I really don't know what to advise here and would hate to say the wrong thing and make it worse.
In all honesty I have been really worried about you at times, and there have been times that I have been desperate for you to get help, even if it did mean inpatient treatment. The main thing is that you get better before any serious damage is done (well that's how I see it anyway). Don't hate me for saying that, it's only out of concern. Ideally I'd like to see you getting proper daycare and proper help with your issues without being admitted and I still hope this can happen. You may just find that tomorrow will really help and be a step forward in getting that help.
Would having a chat with your gp help, maybe you could phone her in the morning,? I also understand why you may not want to now though.
Wish I could help more sis, really I do, but I will be thinking of you and I hope all goes well.
Hope you get to sleep soon.
Night,
Love Lisa x
Hi Lisa
Of course I don't hate you for saying that you have been concerned and want me to get help by whatever means. I know it is because you care and I really appreciate your support.
There has been the very rare occasion when I've felt that an inpatient stay might be what I need but having been at the clinic this long I know that this wouldn't be the case. All that would happen is that they would stop me taking the pills and I'd be fed food I don't want or need. Force feeding me when I am not really underweight will make me feel worse and I'd be more likely to continue with the pills when I got out.
I just need the right help and support from the clinic and a way to live a more normal life away from there at the end of treatment. It is the lack of proper help and support which has led to the worsening of my problems since I have been going there.
My doctor is not in surgery until the afternoon tomorrow and so even if I felt able to talk to her (which I don't at present) it would be too late for my appointment.
Now I have a migraine too. Have just taken my sleeping pill so I hope to be able to sleep soon.
Thanks for your support sis. It does mean such a lot to me.
Karen xx
Have woken up really early and can't sleep again. Feeling really sick and this migraine is bad [xx(].
Just taken a painkiller but also realised I am running low and can't get anymore because of the bank holiday weekend. If I put a repeat prescription in now it will take a week to come through as my surgery is really slow with prescriptions.
Don't want to be awake all morning worrying about this afternoon and don't want to be awake so I can't eat either :(:(.
Karen
Happiness is not a state to arrive at but a manner of travelling.
You only live once, but if you do it right, once is enough ~ Christine Cagney, Cagney & Lacey
((((((KAREN))))))
I totally understand your fears today but I do believe that you have been feeling so awful on and off lately that you couldn't feel much worse what ever happens... You have the skills to recover from this and any professional will be able to see this - especially if you are able to talk to them like you do us and it is only fear that stops you (only fear - ha! hark at me!!!).;)
I so desperately want you to get some CBT and I am keeping everything crossed for you today and will be thinking about you. I wish there was more we could do to help but I really mean this - I have absolutely no doubt whatsoever that you will come through this one way or another and feel so much better when you do. You are constantly learning and understanding what is going on and are much more able to articulate things. I wish I had more energy at the moment to support you...
We will all be there with you today reminding you what a wonderful, sensitive, perceptive, intelligent, thoughtful and determined person you are - and we know it!!!
Take care hun and watch sarah and mark on bbc1 today on city hospital to distract yourself eh?
loads and loads of love and hugs
Aunty Fee xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Hi Karen,
Hope your headache settled and you got some more sleep.
Big big (((((hugs))))) for today, will be thinking of you. I hope it all goes well.
Love Lisa x
Wishing you all the best for today hun - try not to worry, Lis has covered everything I would have said (if the site hadn't chucked me off last night)!!
Text me later or I will check in to see how you got on.
Love Piglet xx
"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.
Hi Karen,
Just to say I'm thinking of you this afternoon and hope all went well.
Hugs,
Lisa x
Just checkin in but prob a bit early for you to be back!
Just incase I cant get on again later will you text me and let me know how you got on today.
Love Piglet xx
"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.
Hannahlou84
28-04-06, 18:08
Hi Karen,
I hope Jill gets in touch with you soon. Perhaps you could call her over the weekend?
I hope everything went well for you today, hun, and that something is being done to help now rather than make you more scared.
Your doctor probably thought it was best to write without saying because she didn't want to alarm you- but I am sure she did it with the best of intentions to make them to take notice.
I really hope everything is okay for you.
Hannah x
"I just wanna live my life sedated, cos I love driving myself away"
Hi Karen,
I do hope things went ok for you today,
thinking about you xxx
kairen x
Hi All and thank you for so many messages of support. I am overwhelmed by how you all keep standing by me through this.
Sorry not to have posted earlier to let you all know how it went but I am feeling so tired and not very well at all today. The migraine doesn't help but also have self-inflicted tummy pains and diarrhoea again [:I]. But even before this I have been feeling decidedly wobbly and unwell [xx(].
I was so scared going into that meeting, even with Julia there because she didn’t say a lot and I was worried about saying too much because of the consequences. He was asking me questions about how many laxatives I take, how often, what is the reason I take them, how and where I buy them etc. He asked if I felt embarrassed buying so many but I only buy a couple of packets at a time and in supermarkets I don't think people notice. Then he asked the same questions about the diet pills and I played down the truth a little because I was scared of the consequences. I admitted how many laxatives I take and that I take them most days. It was mainly the diet pills that I played down by saying I don't take them regularly. Although he didn’t ask how many I take so I didn’t need to hide anything there.
Despite the horrible side effects and the stomach pains I had, I am finding it hard to avoid using Xenical, although I’ve only used it a couple of days this week. I am also fighting binge temptations today which makes it very hard to avoid using this drug because I do believe it prevents some absorption of fat, which must help with weight loss.
The psychiatrist asked me about my depression and I blamed it on recent extra stress in my life, like a difficult period over Easter and also other reasons - excuses really I suppose. It is all related to my size and weight but I wanted to avoid any medical intervention and he had already started mentioning antidepressants. I thought if he believed my current low mood is due to current additional stress then I would avoid any intervention and it seems like it worked. He said there is a slight chance my mood will improve once things return to normal and he asked Julia to keep an eye on the situation, but stressed that 'medical intervention' might well be necessary [:O]. I hope he was just referring to antidepressants because I would just agree but not actually take them.
I was very scared at one point because he said the medical concerns raised by my doctor and the fact that other staff members had noticed a deterioration in my mood, could lead to the necessity for an inpatient stay if things don’t improve or if the situation deteriorates any further :(. I will just have to make sure I am able to hide the depression better and not be so open about diet pills and laxative abuse, or if I am feeling ill. I can’t risk anyone thinking I need to be admitted.
I think I’ve managed to get away with it for now and if I am careful about how much information I divulge from now on will I hope avoid this happening again. The psychiatrist said an appointment can be arranged for me to see him at any time but I wouldn’t voluntarily ask to see him.
I am no further forward on getting extra therapy either. The psychiatrist was only interested in assessing whether I needed medication or admission and said the therapy side of things is left up to the psychiatric nurses and Julia. I did talk to Julia afterwards and said I find the solution focused approach more beneficial than the sessions with Becky, which just leave me feeling worse. Becky was going to suggest CBT when there was my care plan review meeting this morning but Julia was there and said nothing had been mentioned. She said extra funding is needed for CBT and the plan had been to continue with things the way they are - with Julia doing some solution focused work with me (although this rarely happens due to lack of time), and my session with Becky continuing as they have been [Sigh...].
At the moment I am just relieved to have come away without any further emphasis being placed on my health and not to have
Hi Karen,
Big (((((hugs))))) for getting through today sis, you did well to go and cope. It took alot to face not only a psychiatrist but a male one, proud of you for that.
I'm sorry that no more therapy or CBT has been suggested yet, that's a real shame as that could really help.
I do feel sad that you now feel you can't ask anyone for help, even your gp, for fear of what may happen, although I understand your fears. It's a shame you were not able to tell them the real reasons for the current problems but I do understand why you would be scared to admit certain things. I just really want to see you get the help you need and find it frustrating that it's not happening.
Can you at least please try and keep off the xenical now? That's one way you could start to really help yourself. I know you've not taken many this week and that's a great start, well done for that.
I really hope you feel better soon, and sleep well tonight.
Night night,
Love Lisa x
Hi Karen,
Sorry to hear you are having a hard time again.
I think you did the right thing in being as honest as you could. They can only help if they have the big picture. You were brave telling them what you did.
Jill may just not realise the situation. I don't think you would be low on her list at all Karen, you have ben a help to her as she has to you and I'm sure she would want to continue to help but may have a lot on.
Please keep resisting the xenical.
Tammy x
((((KAREN))))
What a stressful day you have had hun... it's so frustrating that you feel so cornered. If you can't be honest you can't get the help you need, but I totally understand your fears completely. My dad was a manic depressive and in and out of hospital all through my childhood and I have lived all my life with a terror of being sectioned... although in recent years I seem to have finally left that behind me after breaking down so badly when my ex left me. I was, to put it colloquially, pretty much barking for best part of a year, with horribly confused thoughts (I used to describe it as having a video running in my head). I also had a terror of medication and would not take anything. But in the end I had to do the things I knew would make me better because otherwise I would have invoked 'intervention'.... eating was a problem for me too then still... but in the end I had 10 weeks cbt which I paid for, paid for shiatsu (I got myself into terrible debt), went to an anxiety management course through the NHS and built up routines mainly by walking my dog[Sigh...] working part time and forcing myself to socialise (I must be the only person in Brighton for whom going to the pub was my therapy lol - I had to go once a week on my own as part of my cbt!!!!).
I know you can get yourself sorted out but you are going to have to be very determined and you have to stop the Xenical. You have to be doing all the positive stuff you were doing earlier in the year. If no-one is going to help you properly you will have to dig even deeper and do it yourself - with our help.... and whatever you can pay for.
I recognise in you the ability to do this even though you feel so utterly dreadful at the moment. You are too intelligent and aware not to sort this out. Professionals know less than you do most of the time, that's the top and bottom of it.
You have had a really tough time lately, got swamped and saturated by the emotions that have come up. It will probably happen again. And again. But each time you will get better at coping and it will hurt less. All the skills that you have learnt over the years - the positive ones - if you practice them will eventually pay off. You will still go back to old behaviours, but less and less...
Karen, hun, trust me you can do this. Some days you won't want to. Some days you won't be able to. But some days you will see the light at the end of the tunnel and your spirits will lift.......
You are amazing and strong and, when you are ready, you will beat this.
I hope your tummy settles tonight and hopefully the relief having today over with will allow you to relax a little tonight....
I hope you get some sleep and your migraine eases off too.
Loads and loads of love n hugs,
Aunty Fee xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Hi Karen,
I hope you had a good nights sleep and feel better today.
Thinking of you.
Lisa x
Hi All
Sorry for not replying again last night. First I was ill because of the laxatives I too - so my own fault and no sympathy deserved for that. But my migraine was so bad, the worst I've had in ages and I was so tired that I fell asleep for a couple of hours. By the time I woke again it was gone midnight and I read all your kind messages but had no energy to reply.
This is another bad thing that since I've gained weight my migraines have worsened in intensity. I've always had several a month and know they are mostly hormone relates, but they were not as intense when I was at a low weight.
Plus I can't really understand the theory of feeling better mentally and physically when near or at normal BMI, because I've been more depressed, self-harming because I can't cope and I feel tired all the time.
It is like this morning. I had to go out to Tesco to get my prescription for my migraine pills - I did manage to get an emergency prescription from my doctor yesterday. I didn't want to go to Tesco but they are the only pharmacy that stock the pills I have. So I got up, had a bath and went to Tesco. There was a half an hour wait for prescriptions and I am trying to do controlled eating this weekend by allowing myself a little more than I normally feel happy eating, in the hope I won't binge. Anyway, I have only been out for an hour and now I am tired and could fall asleep again [|)]. There's surely something not right with this. I had more energy when I hardly ate anything at all.
Tammy: Thanks for your support. Jill sent me a text in the end and said she will ring tonight but I am not holding my breath! She does have good intentions but she is not that reliable.
Lisa: I am sure my doctor had good intentions in writing to the clinic but now I know the consequences if I admit what I do. She wants me to get help but being an inpatient will just make me worse. What would help is some CBT and other appropriate therapy and support.
So I do now feel that I can't admit to anyone officially involved in my care if I am feeling depressed, or using more laxatives or the diet pills more regularly, or even if I feel ill. I didn't take any Xenical in the end last night although I really wanted to.
Fee: Cornered is exactly how I feel. I have been completely honest with both my doctor and the clinic up until now but now I am too scared to in case they push for admission.
I am sorry to hear of the bad time you went through and I so admire you for coming through that yourself. I am back to thinking I am going to have to pay for private CBT but I need to find the right therapist, for my emotional and physical wellbeing. I can't handle another failure.
I don't feel very strong at the moment and I think the number of years I've been stuck with depression shows that I can't get myself out of it, let alone the eating disorder.
Right now I am sitting here panicking because I have food in the flat and I can't handle it. It is making me obsess about eating when I don't want to eat :(.
It is at times like these when I really wish I didn't live alone and had some family to help me. I feel like I need someone to take charge for a while, but in a way in which I am still in control if that makes sense? I know what I can handle eating and what I can't, so I need someone to give me the food I need at regular times but make sure I can't get hold of extra food to binge on in between. See - that shows how weak I am because I am not able to control this for myself [Sigh...].
This weekend is going to be so hard, as I often now am slipping up at weekends and this is a long one, with not going to the clinic until Tuesday now.
I am petrified that I am going to binge and undo all the good work I've done this week :(.
Off to check everyone else's places now and hope you are all well.
Karen xx
Thanks for texting me last night I couldn't get back on the computer so it was good to hear from you.:)
Something that worries me though is the way that you look at possible help and the way you see the professional people trying to help you as the enemy. :(
Mate none of these people have anything but the desire to help you through this wretched illness but how can they do that if you feel you need to hide important details. I can't see a way forward until you accept there is a big problem here (the tablet taking) and you need help dealing with it. If I had a broken leg I wouldn't start trying to reset it etc on my own, unless of course I was shipwrecked on a desert island. We are not on a desert island though and there is help available.
I know the clinic in some ways hasn't quite delivered what you hoped and the sessions with Becky are both painful and don't feel constructive yet but it's a start and was never going to happen overnight.
Your body can only take so much abuse hun so you really have got to look at seriously reducing the tablet taking. I dare say you could actually refuse the sessions with Becky if really necessary and you feel these are at the route of this lastest blip. Suggesting that they are replaced with the more solution focused ones that Julia was talking about.
I too like Fee had a terrible fear of being sectioned when I first started with anxiety and was acute - I pictured my kids waving me off to some victorian mental institution never to be seen again. The more I thought these thoughts the worse I felt ([Duh!]), until finally I wept it out to my doctor who said most assuredly that this was not going to happen. The relief was enormous[:I]:D
Have you said to any of the people trying to help you that this is one of your greatest fears and if so have you thought that the very actions that would prevent this are entirely in your own hands.
I so so so want you to get better and think you need pulling back to planet earth abit to realise that it is not at all right to be abusing your body this way.
Us lot have become good computer buddies over the last 6 months or so and tell each other stuff we maybe don't tell to lots of other people but that doesn't mean we can pretend we are living in a little universe that isnt real.
I for one do not want to be scared of going no further on my own than the first lampost for the rest of my life - I accept and recognize that this a problem and I am really happy to have all your support with this - like the good mates you are you are not going to pretend this is not a problem but will support me on my way. This is what I want to do for you too mate - we are gonna have to take a few risks along the way in order to get better. The world will not fall apart if I risk going to the next lampost and the world will not fall apart if you gain a pound.
Guys lets take a few risks :D:D
Piglet xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.
Hi Piglet
Thanks for your post and I do entirely understand what you are saying and why you are concerned.
The problem is that I cannot help seeing these people as the enemy when talk gets around to admission and having my rights and freedom taken away from me.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Mate none of these people have anything but the desire to help you through this wretched illness but how can they do that if you feel you need to hide important details. I can't see a way forward until you accept there is a big problem here (the tablet taking) and you need help dealing with it.</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
That's the thing. I do accept that it is a problem and I do know I need help with it. Until the events of this week I have been saying and asking for help. I have been open from the start. They've know from the beginning that I use laxatives. I have spoken to both Julia and Becky about taking the diet pills. I've also explained why I use them and that I need help to stop bingeing, which is what caused me to order the diet pills in the first place. It is also a big factor in the laxative abuse.
When I don't binge I have days where I don't use any pills or laxatives. I had virtually weaned myself off the laxatives before the bingeing became such a huge problem and that's what has caused the increase in my use of them, and why I resorted to two types of diet pills.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">I know the clinic in some ways hasn't quite delivered what you hoped and the sessions with Becky are both painful and don't feel constructive yet but it's a start and was never going to happen overnight.</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I am not the only one who believes the sessions with Becky are counterproductive and in fact in danger of worsening my depression. I fully accept that I have a lot of issues in my past and that these are why I am like I am now. I am not saying I want to avoid all talk of the past, but talking to someone for an hour just dredges up the hurt and pain and then I am left to come home and it is so hard not to dwell on it.
If there was some point to looking at certain memories in order to form strategies to cope with what I am going through presently, which is what solution focused therapy does, and to help change my thought patterns with CBT, then I would be fine about it. But this is not what is happening.
The one session on goal setting that I had with Julia on Tuesday has been the most helpful therapy I've had since being there and this is what I am asking for more of. Things to challenge me and help me move on. But I don't get the time with Julia regularly for this to be enough to help, and each time I mention CBT it seems I am fobbed off with excuses why it can't be arranged.
I was due to have some sessions with a psychotherapist after Easter but that hasn't happened either. Ok so I wasn't enthralled with seeing a male therapist because of personal reasons, but I was willing to give it a go, but promises are made and nothing happens.
Sorry, I hope this isn't sounding like a harsh reply but I am just frustrated that I have been open and honest - when many people with eating disorders hide and deny these behaviours because it is part of the illness. I've fought hard to be open because I do want the help but each time nothing happens and then all of a sudden I am faced with a psychiatrist and talk of admission.
The inpatient programme is set up for re-feeding mainly and I don't need that and it would make me worse. I'd lose the contr
((((((((((((((((((karen))))))))))))))))))))
thats all i can do!!i am very scared for you!! i nearly lost my sister to this and seeing you going down the same path is awful and not being able to help is worse!!! im sorry!!
Ammegxxxxxxxxxx
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">[quote] I still want to be the weight I was last year and I know my self image is so distorted but I do see myself as being very obese. That's what I actually see when I look at myself. Can you imagine how frightening that is? And therefore gaining one pound or even staying the same weight is a big problem?
Karen xx
<div align="right">Originally posted by Karen - 29 April 2006 : 15:52:48</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
If even staying the same weight is frightening then where do you see this ending???????
Love Piglet xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
(((((((KAREN)))))))
I know your fear of being sectioned is very real - and it is a possisbility but even that would not be as bad as you fear it would be... I have two friends who have been sectioned in the past (and it happening to them made me physically vomit at the time) and both ended up getting the help they needed in the end... it was a long time ago, they are both in their 50s like me and it happened in their 30s - one attempted suicide the other was seriously self-harming. The sectioning itself didn't help but it led to other things which did.... Their experiences have taken the terror out of it for me to some extent (not much I'll admit!). But maybe neither of them would be here now if it hadn't happened (I hadn't even realised this till I started writing....).
You have been incredibly brave being so honest about your disorder and I still seethe at the lack of support you have been offered every time I think about it - but which ever way you turn it round I suspect you have to feel worse to feel better, I don't know how many years you have suffered from depression but this manifestation is spectacularly dangerous and insiduous...
We are real friends on here, but there is only so much we can do - even if we lived near each other there wouldn't be much more - I tried with both the friends I'm talking about, in fact one of them lived with me for a while in London (and set fire to my living room actually!).... I have also lost three friends to suicide, 2 men and one woman. At the end of the day we are all responsible for our own mental health and have to find ways of getting better or getting professional help....
I hate to say it again, but I feel like I KNOW you can do it even though you are struggling so hard at the moment, but like Piglet said you will have to take risks - not the dreadful risks you are taking at the moment which are guaranteed to harm or at least not help, but the ones which have a chance of helping, even if you are not convinced....
You cannot continue to deceive yourself that weight is the issue. You KNOW it is not. It's just a self-harming behaviour you need to let go of. And you WILL.
Have you been looking at your book of inspirations? Could you travel to Brighton for CBT where there is a huge choice of therapists? What one thing could you do today that might be positive for you?
You have all our love and support and obviously we are all very concerned about you. We will not give up on you - do not give up on yourself either!!
Well done for keeping in mind how positive the goal setting has been - this is your way forward and you can do some of this yourself....[8D][8D]
What is your goal for this weekend?
Bigs hugs and loads and loads of love,
Aunty Fee xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
I will be thinking of you hun
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Hi Karen,
Seems like Piglet and Aunty Fee have said all the wise words already today, so I can't think of much to add so I will give you a huge (((((((((((((((Hug))))))))))))))) instead.
I know this weekend will be hard for you, I am thinking of you sis.
Love Lisa x
Thanks for the replies.
Ammeg: I am sorry that reading my posts is bringing back memories of what it was like for your sister. I am conscious that maybe I shouldn't be writing so much detail on here, but apart from here and K I have no other support.
Lisa: Thank you for the hug sis. I dread long weekends and the break in my routine I guess. As much as there is often not much going on at the clinic either, it does at least get me away from looking at the same four walls all day every day.
Piglet:
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">If even staying the same weight is frightening then where do you see this ending???????</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Back where I was last year I guess - at least that's where I want to be because I felt in control. I felt now realise how much better I felt about myself when I was that thin because of how dreadful I feel now. I felt successful at something for the first time in my life and now all I hear in my head is 'failure'.
Fee: I appreciate what you are saying about being sectioned but nothing will ever remove the fear of this from me. I don't actually think it is on the immediate horizon because despite the diet pill and laxative abuse, this has not affected my health significantly enough for anyone to say I am a serious danger to myself. Plus when talking to other people and reading other stories, the number of laxatives I take really is insignificant in comparison.
It is very hard to continue being so honest when threatened with what I feel is punishment for being so open about it all, rather than being given the help I have been asking for. There is always some excuse: funding problems, not enough staff time, or I'm told I am not ready to do this kind of work [Sigh...]. How can they say that when I do better with therapy that focuses on strategies?
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">I don't know how many years you have suffered from depression but this manifestation is spectacularly dangerous and insiduous...</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I have had depression since I was about 12, or at least that's when it hit crisis point so I had been unable for many years before that.
I do realise friends can only do so much and I truly appreciate all the support I get here. I'm sorry to hear of the experiences you had trying to help people in the past. I guess this is when I really wish more than anything that I had a family to rely on and support me - particularly a mum. It was a conversation similar to this that led Becky to tell me that I have to grow up and be an adult and that I'll never have those things. But surely even adults need support from their family at times?
Everything is focused on weight and that might be a delusion but it is one I am stuck in at present. I am able to see that the eating disorder is a symptom of all the other problems I've had throughout my life but it doesn't help me stop believing that I need to lose weight. It is all I can focus on.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Have you been looking at your book of inspirations? Could you travel to Brighton for CBT where there is a huge choice of therapists? What one thing could you do today that might be positive for you?</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
To be honest I haven't
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">
As to one positive thing for today. I think I've managed a couple already. I had lunch - a proper lunch of a chicken sandwich and some fruit, and I've not taken any diet pills or laxatives today - so far at least.
<div align="right">Originally posted by Karen - 29 April 2006 : 19:09:13</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Well done Karen, that's brilliant :D
Lisa x
Hi Karen...
Its BRILLIANT that you ate today so well[8D][8D][8D]
That's an excellent goal for the weekend and you CAN do it!!
I took a chance talking about sectioning and my friends in the past but it's so good that you were able to tell ME why it's so unlikely for that to happen... it really really is! You are doing far too well really.
The family thing is a tough one - I never felt I had any family support either (I bet you think I have but trust me I haven't even though I support my mum now). When I was 9 -13 I lived in a pub in one room with two drunk parents who locked me in at night when they were working and out in the afternoon when they slept... I have always got my support where I can, mainly from friends (or paid!!!!). Other than that I relied on my ex-husband for 18 years, he was my family, and when he walked out I thought I would just die. But here I am.......
It's not about 'growing up' it's about looking within and finding ways of comforting and caring for yourself. Some people never learn and rely on family or partners for many many years.... But everyone is alone at the end of the day in a way.
Here's a link to the clinic I go to http://www.rockclinic.org.uk/
Otherwise I think just looking up Cognitive Behavioural Therapists will work out very expensive, but is the only other route. I don't know if the Rock Clinic need a referral or if it is too local but worth a try?
You are NOT a failure and please take that blooming red lettering out of that post it's hideous lol!!!!!
I'm having a chuckle because there is a post on here complaining about the relentless positivity of people here - but that's why I love it and keep coming back because we are all so ABSOLUTELY DETERMINED to get better and to see each other get better. And you know what? WE WILL!!!!!! And we will have each other around to thank and support, cos it will not be easy or quick and it will certainly not be straightforward....
You are one very strong and positive lady Karen.... try and learn to like yourself, you can you know - I'm definitely better at that than I used to be......
Loads and loads of love n hugs
Aunty Fee xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">
As to one positive thing for today. I think I've managed a couple already. I had lunch - a proper lunch of a chicken sandwich and some fruit, and I've not taken any diet pills or laxatives today - so far at least.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote"> your goal for this weekend?</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
My goal for the weekend is to get through it without bingeing - as the goal I set myself with Julia on Tuesday was to go a week without bingeing.
Karen xx
<div align="right">Originally posted by Karen - 29 April 2006 : 19:09:13</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Karen - :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D
Fee - a wise and wonderful post as usual :D
*But everybody is alone at the end of the day in a way*
This is so true mate we are lucky to have people come in and out of our lives to give us company and support - whether they be family or friends as they make all the difference to how we deal with things and the enjoyment we get out of lives but at the end of the day if we really truly want things to change then this is what we have to do for ourselves. I have certainly found this to be true over the years in number of circumstances.
Love Piglet xx
Hi Karen,
Hope you're doing ok this evening. Just want ed to say night night and sleep well.
Big (((((hugs))))) sis,
Love Lisa x
Hi Karen,
Hope you're ok.
I don't always reply to your thread but I'm thinking of you.
Take Care,
Heather
Morning all.
Thank you for the words of encouragement from last night. I added an achievement of having a chicken breast and baked beans for dinner last night.
So I suppose yesterday was a positive and in control day, were I ate reasonably well and didn't use any laxatives or take any diet pills.
Unfortunately, there is always a but... :( [Sigh...]
Today is not going so well. I haven't slept well, had some horrible dreams and despite trying to find some positivity and motivation to do things, I am feeling low and already feel I've eaten too much and the wrong foods. So just gave in and took a Xenical (sorry [:I]).
Heather: Thanks for thinking of me and for your support.
Lisa: I really appreciate the hug sis particularly as you were having such a bad time last night.
Fee: I am really sad to hear of your experiences as a child. I feel almost embarrassed to rant on about my bad childhood when I know it wasn't really that bad compared to the experiences some people had. You have come through all that to be such a kind, caring and giving person and it really means so much to me the support you have been giving me.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">It's not about 'growing up' it's about looking within and finding ways of comforting and caring for yourself. Some people never learn and rely on family or partners for many many years.... But everyone is alone at the end of the day in a way.</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Yes I know this is true and I've spent my life trying to recreate the relationship and love I never had from my parents (my mum in particular) with other people. I do now realise that this isn't posssible and although I don't have a family, I do have some wonderful friends.
I know I am slowly moving forward with some things, as I have accepted and stopped yearning for K to be the mum to me that I've always dreamed of. She is still a very special person in my life and at the moment I know I do still rely on her an awful lot.
There are uncertainties around certain relationships at present and although I am coping so much better than I would've done a few months ago it is still insettling. I also suddenly started thinking again about K's possible move in the summer when I'd put that out of my mind.
Thanks for the link to the clinic. I will have a look at the site.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">I'm having a chuckle because there is a post on here complaining about the relentless positivity of people here
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Hmm I had a bit of a laugh about that post too as I don't think many people will think the majority of my posts are positive most of the time!
Piglet: Thanks for all the smilies!!! Wish I deserved them today [8)].
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">We are lucky to have people come in and out of our lives to give us company and support - whether they be family or friends as they make all the difference to how we deal with things and the enjoyment we get out of lives but at the end of the day if we really truly want things to change then this is what we have to do for ourselves.</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Yes, I agree we have to change for ourselves and I am so lucky to have made such lovely friends in my time here.
Last night though I was contemplating what 'enjo
:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D
Not got much time this morning as M&S on their way but had to congratulate you for yesterday - FANTASTIC - shows you can do it eh?
Today's only just begun... I wish you didn't have those rotten pills... but your thoughts, while sad, are on the whole going in the right direction which is the most important thing!
I think you deserve a WELL DONE for today's post anyway!
We are lucky to have this site aren't we[8D][8D][8D]
Hope today goes up for you...
((((HUGS))))
Loads of love
Aunty Fee xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Thanks for stopping by to post Fee.
Unfortunately, I foresee a day of not being able to do much because I've made myself ill but it's self-inflicted so my own fault.
Many thanks for your support Aunty!
Karen xx
More positive than negative though eh?
I am sitting here grooving a bit to Gnarls Berkley 'Crazy' my fav song at the mo and singing very badly - fancy joining in on the drums???
Piglet xxx
"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.
Gnarls who????????????????? never heard of that/him???? Guess I must be out of touch!
Hi Karen,
I agree, a huge well done for yesterday, you did so well :D. Today may be harder, remember things don't change overnight, but if you can keep making small steps of progress, things can improve again. I know you have it in you to do this sis.
Thinking of you,
(((((Hugs))))),
Lisa x
It's number one Lis and such a catchy song I don't know anyone who doesn't like it and feel like a bit of a jig along :D:D:D
Piglet xx
[:I] Shows I don't keep up with pop music these days then! Lol.
Lisa x
Hi Piglet and Lisa
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">More positive than negative though eh?
<div align="right">Originally posted by Piglet - 30 April 2006 : 14:07:10</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Umm... no, not today. Definitely negative :(. Have binged, taken Xenical twice (official dose 3 x day so one more allowed) and also just taken laxatives too [B)].
I am also in a quandry about what to do about something but think whatever I do will be wrong.
Had loads of plans to do boring jobs like sorting paperwork and tidying up today but just can't find the motivation and have spent all day on the internet in one way or another.
Karen xx
PS I don't know that song either so shows how out of touch I am too!
I want you to go on msn or yahoo and type in Gnarls Berkley and see if there is a clip you can listen to. There is on Yahoo cos I have just done it.
This track is famous for getting to number one with out selling any records first, purely by people listening to it on the computer - it was on the news.
Listen and then tell me it doesn't make you want to dance round your handbag and run off with the nearest man:D:D:D
Piglet xx
"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Listen and then tell me it doesn't make you want to dance round your handbag and run off with the nearest man:D:D:D
<div align="right">Originally posted by Piglet - 30 April 2006 : 17:53:11</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Umm... nothing would make me want to do that [8)][:I]
Karen xx
Hi Nigel
I do need to take the maximum dose at least because I am bound to have gained weight again after today :(:(:(.
Feel sick, fat and disgusted with myself.
Karen
Hannahlou84
30-04-06, 19:35
You really don't, Karen. Odd days don't make any difference to how much weight you gain. In fact, you are more likely to gain weight if you eat belowe 1500 calories a day than if you binge...
Have you got any films you that make you feel safe and happy you can watch? I find children's ones do that, even though my childhood didn't feel particularly happy or save- that or keep posting- so that you don't feel so alone.
There are loads of people here who care about you. And as for the Xenical, they provide no benefit for people who aren't obese- so why!? What's the point if all they do is make you ill and cost a heap?
"I just wanna live my life sedated, cos I love driving myself away"
Hi Hannah
Thanks for your reply.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">In fact, you are more likely to gain weight if you eat belowe 1500 calories a day than if you binge...</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I don't agree with that considering I was eating much less than that number of calories for most of last year and lost weight. I've only gained weight since I've been bingeing.
Can't really concentrate long enough to watch a film. I've been trying to watch the same film for weeks now but just feel too tired to concentrate.
I think the Xenical do work as I did lose some weight when I was taking these pills. I know there are health risks but tonight all I can think about is that I have gained the weight I lost last week when I am desperate to lose more weight.
I am so stupid for messing up again.
Karen
Happiness is not a state to arrive at but a manner of travelling.
You only live once, but if you do it right, once is enough ~ Christine Cagney, Cagney & Lacey
((((((KAREN))))))
Hun - don't know what to say. Please try to stay off those Xenical, they are making you worse and worse and losing weight won't help even if they would make you lose weight. They are poison and taking them has nothing to do with helping you to lose weight, it's just abuse. There's only so much weight you can lose in one day and how ever many you take it won't achieve what you want - which is to feel better.
Writing such horrible things about yourself is so upsetting. We know what you are like and that you are just having a bad day.... you did so well yesterday, maybe you will again tomorrow. One day is just one day...
It makes me so sad to think of you feeling so rotten, I wish there was more I could do to help but all I can do is keep sending you
(((((HUGS))))))
Try and take more care of yourself this evening hun?
Loads and loads of love
Aunty Fee xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
ps Piglet - I know it and love it too!!! I'm just so young and trendy [8D][8D][8D][8D] Hope your day is going well xxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Hannahlou84
30-04-06, 20:43
Hi Karen,
Okay, so maybe I worded that badly- you can lose weight by not eating- but you would only be killing yourself slowly- you wouldn't be healthy, and as soon as you did eat a little your body would store it as fat. Basically, it isn't good for you.
You gained weight when you started eating because that was what your body needed- if you allow yourself to binge occasionally, you find you do not want to so much and are then able to eat sensibly- that's what I normally find anyway- and then your weight will reduce again.
Could you not try doing some exercise after bingeing instead? It would be better for you long term?
Also, have you tried cleaning your teeth when you really want to binge? That usually puts me off for a while (though it doesn't when I've not been too good with food ie. not eating enough for the preceding days).
Just a thought.
Hannah x
"I just wanna live my life sedated, cos I love driving myself away"
Hi Fee
I'm sorry to be doing this to you all again. It's been an awful day and I need the pills to at least try damage limitation where weight gain is concerned. Wish I could just sleep all day and then I wouldn't eat or need the pills. Just hate myself so much for bingeing.
I just feel like I've thrown away a week's hard work of losing the weight to blow it all in one day. I hate myself for eating and want to starve myself completely. Then I could feel good about what I am doing.
Thanks for the hugs aunty. I think we both need them tonight.
Karen xx
Hi Hannah
It wasn't that you worded it badly, it is that I can twist anything to fit with the beliefs that stem from my eating disorder - as I am sure you yourself can relate to.
We both know that restricting food is not a healthy way to lose weight but it doesn't change what we do. It is all part of the illness.
I feel doubly bad though because I have failed the goal I set myself of avoiding bingeing for one week - and I couldn't even manage that. So now I need to go to the clinic on Tuesday and admit that I failed... again.
Wish I could exercise but I have no energy. I desperately need to exercise, as well as restricting my food intake so I can lose weight - although I did it without exercise last time.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Also, have you tried cleaning your teeth when you really want to binge?<div align="right">Originally posted by Hannahlou84 - 30 April 2006 : 20:43:54</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I've picked up quite a few tips like that which I use when restricting but I don't think it is particularly helpful to start exchanging tips. I wouldn't want to give you new ideas that you've not thought of already either.
Karen xx
Hannahlou84
30-04-06, 21:39
Didn't mean to abuse it whilst restricting!! I did mean when you had eaten enough, and anything in that respect would be better than the diet pills. Cleaning your teeth is hardly going to damage your health.
I'll shut up.
"I just wanna live my life sedated, cos I love driving myself away"
Hi Karen... don't apologise hun, I know you don't want to be in this position..
How about making your first goal not to take xenical? You can build up to not bingeing? If you stopped the xenical for a whole week that would be a wonderful goal to achieve!!!! In fact it is the most important...
To set yourself a goal of not bingeing is like setting yourself the goal of getting better - it's something you have to build up to.... Does that make sense? When it is your goal, it's like you have set yourself up to fail. You need to first give up xenical, second eat regularly and healthily (even if you do binge occasionally), third cut down the laxatives and then when that's all in place aim to stop bingeing?
I know that's not what you want to hear but it's right isn't it?
Hope you are ok hun..
((((((HUGS))))))
loads and loads of love xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Hannahlou84
30-04-06, 21:46
Also meant to say. Cleaning your teeth doesn't stop you wanting to eat anything- just makes it easier to resist binge food/sweet food like chocolate and cake. I'm really not so stupid as to say "xxxx is a way to stop yourself from needing to eat"
"I just wanna live my life sedated, cos I love driving myself away"
(((((((((((((((Karen))))))))))))))
Sorry to hear you're having a hard day. I agree with Fee and not sure I can add alot to that, so wise our Aunty ;).
Wish I could say more to help as I don't like to see you struggling this much. Please try and stop the xenical.
Still thinking of you sis, hope you sleep well and that tomorrow will be better.
Love Lisa x x
Thanks for the replies.
Hannah: Sorry if I upset you. I did understand what you meant, it is just that I have also used all those kinds of tips to help starve myself and one time or another too. Please don't feel I don't value your opinion; I am just in a very negative and low mood tonight.
Fee: My goal was set in conjunction with Julia and we went through triggers and ways to cope, but a bad night of horrible dreams, feeling low, lack of sleep and other worries just overwhelmed me today and none of the coping strategies on my list helped.
The problem is that although I see the sense in your suggestion of the order of goal setting, to me it is back to front. All the harmful actions stem from bingeing and so I need to tackle that as the main priority. When I am able to avoid bingeing I do not feel compelled to take the Xenical, so I am sure it wouldn't work the other way round.
At the moment my entire focus is on stopping bingeing because that will stop my weight gain. I agree that regular and healthy eating needs to come in at some point, but at the moment regular eating is a trigger to bingeing, which triggers using Xenical and eventually if I binge too much I start the Reductil too.
The laxative abuse is probably something I know I can tackle and reduce once these other things are under control. I am less hopeful about coming off them completely, but I had significantly cut down to a normal dose every other day until the bingeing got worse.
At the moment I am tempted to take more laxatives as I haven't been ill and I need to feel punished and empty after all the food I've consumed today [B)].
Karen xx
Thank you Lisa. We were posting at the same time then I think.
Not sleeping is making this worse because it has been such a long day today, and another long day ahead tomorrow. I really don't like changes to my routine.
I am tempted now to take extra sleeping pills and Diazepam to make sure I knock myself out enough to not be awake long enough to eat anything tomorrow.
The worse my eating gets and the more out of control I feel the worse my self-abuse gets. I just can't help myself.
I am sorry if I am upsetting anyone.
Karen xx
You're welcome sis, here have another ((((((((hug)))))))))) :).
Please try not to take more pills than you should. I do understand how not sleeping doesn't help though and how hard you find these long weekends. Just one more day to get through sis and then back to normality - whatever that is! Lol.
Hope you sleep well,
Night night,
Love Lisa x
hmmmm yes i can understand what you are saying about the bingeing being the cause of the problems.. but am I not right in that it is the thing you find hardest to control? I'm no expert obviously, but I thought with all these sorts of things that setting goals you can achieve should always come first? So things like eating a minimum amount, cutting out the xenical etc can then be seen as achievements you can build on? We watched you manage your laxatives really well, tackle some of your other fears (including asking for help which was a huge thing) and that seemed to help you not to binge earlier this year... that's how it seemed, but I didn't know you so well then...
Surely, like the rest of us, you need to do things that make you feel you have SOME control first? Surely bingeing is the thing you have the biggest problem with because that causes the panic spiral of the other behaviours?
I know you despertely want to stop the bingeing first because that's what you believe causes you to put on weight which is what you fear so much... but just because it's what you want to tackle first, doesn't make it the best place to start?
The spiral has culminated in the Xenical. To unravel it surely that's the place to start? When you get back to a better place then you can try again with controlling the bingeing?
Why not see if you can set that as a new goal... no more Xenical for 24 hours..... then eating 3 meals, then maybe going for a walk... then cutting down the laxatives... all the other things you were doing, but with stopping bingeing being the ultimate goal of all of this?
If you continue with the xenical, you won't eat properly, you won't feel well, when you do eat it will feel awful so you will take laxatives and feel so empty and miserable that you will binge again..... Work it backwards?
As I say I'm no expert but I am applying the principles I have picked up from CBT and other techniques. Throw in some positive CDs, writing some positive affirmations along the way and you have a plan.... But the hardest bit will always be avoiding bingeing (you will have to learn to cope with still doing it occasionally for some considerable time) and coping with sometimes putting on weight for a while until your body settles and you can manage your weight sensibly and positively (and that will take even longer to handle - but you CAN do it!).
I might be wrong... but you need to construct a plan of some sort because just setting not bingeing as a goal is very very hard for you...
Tell me to lay off if I am getting in too deep her hun..... I really really am not an expert but it's what is in my mind (and I never learnt to keep my mouth shut!!!!).
You are doing really well hun, yesterday was so good and whatever happens today, it is still brilliant that you got that far yesterday and you can do it again!![8D]
Hope you are ok hun
loads of love xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Lisa: Thanks sis for another hug. I really need it at the moment. This probably sounds mad to anyone other than me but I am at the moment suffering for not taking enough laxatives earlier in the day. If I don't take enough it takes them too long to work and the stomach pain goes on for longer. I should've taken more and then the diarrhoea would've happened earlier and I'd hopefully now be asleep, instead of being still awake with stomach pain and going to the loo every 5 minutes.
I do understand your concerns about taking extra sleeping pills and the Diazepam but I can't have another day like today. I am already panicking so much about how much weight I've gained because I've basically not stopped eating all day.
Fee: I also see the logic in where you are coming from but from my point of view I don't believe I can succeed in cutting out the Xenical, or reducing the laxatives, or any of the other pills I am taking until I have the bingeing under control. It was controlled eating which enabled me to start cutting down on the laxative use last time, just like it is the out of control bingeing which has led me to resort to weight loss pills like Xenical and Reductil now.
Yes, goals do need to be achievable but I wouldn't be able to stop myself taking laxatives, or even the Xenical while still bingeing, so it's a difficult one really.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Why not see if you can set that as a new goal... no more Xenical for 24 hours..... then eating 3 meals, then maybe going for a walk... then cutting down the laxatives... all the other things you were doing, but with stopping bingeing being the ultimate goal of all of this?</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I achieved some of these things in the past week, but not in the order you've listed. What enabled me to manage most of the other things was the fact that I didn't binge - which meant I didn't take any Xenical, I used laxatives probably every other day and I did eat small meals, but not at what most people would consider regular times.
I am not sure how much you know about Xenical. I only take it when I eat food which contains fat, or when I binge because it blocks a certain amount of fat absorption. The Reductil is the diet pill I was taking daily because that is an appetite suppressant. So I wouldn't take Xenical before eating, I take it as a result of eating.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">But the hardest bit will always be avoiding bingeing (you will have to learn to cope with still doing it occasionally for some considerable time) and coping with sometimes putting on weight for a while until your body settles and you can manage your weight sensibly and positively (and that will take even longer to handle - but you CAN do it!).</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
No, this is the bit I can't do. I can't handle being the weight I'm at now, let alone gaining more. That's why this is so hard. I need to stop bingeing so I can lose some weight to a level where I feel able to cope.
I really appreciate your attempts to help Fee and maybe my thinking is delusional again but this is the way I see it and it is the way it spirals out of control for me.
I'll be alright tomorrow if I ever get some sleep [|)].
Karen xx
hey karen!!
How are you today??? hope your doin ok!!! just wondering where you get your diet pills from?? sorry bout me message the other day- just wish i could help!!!!
Ammegxxx
Hi Karen,
I hope you got to sleep in the end and are feeling at least a bit better today.
Thinking of you sis,
Love and hugs,
Lisa x
Fee wrote such a good post on the setting achievable goals and seems to have a good handle on the processes.
I don't really understand the tablets especially the X one:(:(
I know this is the way they are teaching us to do things on my course - so that we feel totally comfortable with each stage first.
I am going to give you a bank holiday hug (these won't need to come out too often, just a few times a year when your routine gets mucked up).
A bank holiday hug is along the lines of country dancing (country dancing always seems to be going on round here on bank holidays) and involves lots of ribbons and piecrust bonnets which may get flung off in the tangle of ribbons as you get flung round the park. On this occasion I may just tie all the tablets to the ribbons too - designed to fly off into outer space never to return and when you try to order more off the internet you have to order a complete country dancing set to go with them. Will that deter you do you think!!!!!!!
Ray says he thinks I should write for children - but I think they would just tell me to grow up [}:)][}:)]:D:D OR WORSE!!!!!!!!
BANK HOLIDAY HUG COMING UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Love Piglet xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Evening guys
I finally stopped running to the loo about 6am and am afraid I took extra sleeping pills and some Diazepam which more or less knocked me out all day. I did wake at various times from dreams but went back to sleep again. I think I could still be asleep now if I hadn't forced myself to wake up. Didn't have much choice really as I've got stomach pains again following laxatives I took earlier on one of the brief occasions I woke - had to make sure I got rid of everything from yesterday.
Trouble is I haven't done anything I set out to do this weekend and I apologise in advance for any messages that don't make sense, as I still feel half doped up. I really need to wash, dry and straighten my hair tonight as it's a mess but don't have the energy.
Ammeg: I get the pills from the internet but know it is not a sensible thing to do and definitely would not encourage anyone to follow my example.
Lisa: I don't know what the day is like today really. Woke up feeling the same as when I went to bed - with stomach pains again, and also now a very fuzzy head and headache from taking too many sleeping pills or it might be the high dose of Diazepam I took.
I need to find another way of coping because, although I don't use the Diazepam often, I don't want to add tranquillizer addiction to my list of problems.
Piglet: Thanks for the special bank holiday hug. The pills are safely tucked away though because it costs too much to keep replacing them.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">I don't really understand the tablets especially the X one:(:(
<div align="right">Originally posted by Piglet - 01 May 2006 : 15:02:52</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
What don't you understand about the tablets? Is it what they are or what they do? Xenical is a prescription only weight loss drug only usually prescribed to morbidly obese people (but it's possible to get almost anything from the internet if you spend enough time searching [8)]). The theory is that it works to block absorption of fat from the food you eat - approximately 30% - and so aids weight loss. When I am restricting I don't need it because I don't eat any or hardly any fat, but when bingeing it is all junk food and that's when I use the Xenical to try to damage limitation with how much weight I gain.
The other prescription diet pill I have been using is Reductil which is meant to suppress appetite. However, I haven't taken this for about a week because I guess it only works on suppressing normal appetite and not enough to allow me to avoid eating completely, which is what I want to do.
They are the main two, although I have carb blockers and fat blockers but they are just from a 'health' site which also sells vitamins etc and I don't believe they are as effective, but feel compelled to take then anyway.
Does any of that make sense?
How has your day been?
Karenxx
(((((((KAREN))))))
You must feel awful, all those pills, upset tummy... I wish I had Piglet's way with words (by the way Piglet - Ray's right you SHOULD do some writing for kids lol!!! although don't stop doing it here ever will you[8D]).
I hope you manage to eat a little today as a goal if nothing else just to keep your strength up hun....
Hope you're feeling a little less groggy now.
Loads and loads of love
Aunty Fee xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Hi Fee
Yes, you could say I feel rather ill at the moment. Went to bed with stomach pain last night once the diarrhoea had stopped. But then stupidly took 3 times my normal dose of sleeping pills and a high dose of Diazepam on top, so it's no wonder I have a fuzzy head and a headache really. Also feeling rather nauseous but it is all self-inflicted.
Plus when I woke briefly following just one of the very weird dreams I've had today, I then took more laxatives to make sure my body definitely is empty of food following yesterday's binge. Also got dreadful indigestion.
I thought maybe I should try to eat something after all those pills but only have safe food here now of rice cakes and fruit. I don't think fruit is a good idea seeing as I have already had some diarrhoea again and think there is a lot more to come yet, so have only had one rice cake. It's a difficult situation because my system probably is empty following all the diarrhoea I had during the night and so the laxatives I've taken today are likely to simply cause a lot of stomach cramps with nothing to actually pass unless I eat something.
I'm trying to find some energy to get out of bed and wash my hair, which desperately needs doing since it is over a week since I last washed it [:I] - how disgusting is that? But that means spending an hour drying it and then straightening it and I really haven't got the energy. Biut come tomorrow morning I'll feel really embarrassed turning up to the clinic with greasy, messy hair, which won't do much to prove that I am coping at home will it? I won't have time to do it in the morning unless I get up very early.
My actions are so stupid and self-destructive and again all I can think about is wishing I wasn't so alone here because I am lost all will power to control the bingeing and dangerous actions I take to either make up for it or try to prevent it.
Karen xx
Lol Fee - Ray thinks I am off my rocker don't you hun and when he gets back connected he can tell you himself.
Karen thank you for explaining the tablets I do feel a little clearer about them all now - but sooooooooo many different types mate wouldn't just the laxatives suffice????
I hope you have a better day at the clinic tomorrow.
Bank holiday hug :D:D
Piglet xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.
Hi Piglet
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Karen thank you for explaining the tablets I do feel a little clearer about them all now - but sooooooooo many different types mate wouldn't just the laxatives suffice????</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Unfortunately this is how the illness deteriorates because I was only using laxatives (which are bad enough) but these are more about punishment and a need to feel empty.
Diet pills are an attempt to lose weight and control weight that I am petrified of gaining due to the bingeing.
Thanks for another bank holiday hug!
Karen xx
Hi Karen,
Well that is another bank holiday over for you and back to normality tomorrow!
I hope you're feeling a bit better this evening and hope you managed to do your hair.
I don't like the sound of all the pills you're taking and the amounts. I thought it was just laxatives and the odd xenical, didn't realise there was still reductil and the other carb blocking things etc. This is not good at all, Piglet is right if you must take something just take laxatives and cut them down gradually as you are able. The extra dose of sleeping pills and diazepam can't be good either. I really hope you have eaten a bit more too, all the diorrhoea you have must be really depleting your poor body, and most of the nutrients you do get from food are blocked or purged by certain pills and laxatives. Sorry this isn't meant to be a lecture honest, it just concerns me. I do realise it's been a hard weekend so hope you'll feel better tomorrow. Please please think about these pills and what harm they are doing you. I know you think they help you cope but they are not the answer and are only making things worse long term. Hope I haven't upset you saying this, you know it's because I care so much I hope.
Still thinking of you, I hope you sleep well tonight and have a good day at the clinic tomorrow.
Love and hugs sis,
Lisa x
Hi Lisa
Don't worry, you haven't upset me and I know you are concerned because you care.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">I hope you're feeling a bit better this evening and hope you managed to do your hair.</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
No to both I am afraid. I want to go back to sleep now but can't until the diarrhoea stops and I can't see me being up in time in the morning to wash my hair. Perhaps I should just stop off somewhere on the way to the clinic tomorrow and buy a hat to wear all day.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">I don't like the sound of all the pills you're taking and the amounts. I thought it was just laxatives and the odd xenical, didn't realise there was still reductil and the other carb blocking things etc.</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Yes, well, I was trying to avoid mentioning the full extent of it. The trouble is, as I wrote to Piglet, laxatives don't have any effect on weight loss which is why I started taking diet and weight loss pills in the first place.
I know overdosing on sleeping pills and taking Diazepam at that dose isn't good. I was desperate to avoid another day of bingeing.
I haven't been able to eat anything apart from a couple of rice cakes and they soon sent me running back to the loo again. Even water has been sending me back there with more diarrhoea. I think I am probably rather dehydrated at the moment and have pains everywhere and I am lying here with a hot water bottle on my back and one on my stomach [Sigh...].
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Please please think about these pills and what harm they are doing you. I know you think they help you cope but they are not the answer and are only making things worse long term.</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I know sis and I want to get off them but after events of last week I am too scared to speak to anyone about it or ask for help, even from my doctor. The last thing I want is to be forced into inpatient treatment.
I just don't know what to do.
Karen xx
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Hi Lisa
Yes, well, I was trying to avoid mentioning the full extent of it. The trouble is, as I wrote to Piglet, laxatives don't have any effect on weight loss which is why I started taking diet and weight loss pills in the first place.
Karen xx
<div align="right">Originally posted by Karen - 02 May 2006 : 02:49:02</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Well now I am a bit confused again - why are you taking laxatives if they don't aid weight loss as I thought that is the basis of what you want to do.
Anyway mate I am off to read the the 'goal' post now as I don't want to keep focusing on the negative stuff.
Big hugs
Piglet xx
"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.
Hi Karen,
I hope you feel better this morning and are having a good day at the clinic.
Thinking of you,
Love Lisa x
hey karen!!!
hope your feelin better!!!! so does the clinic know about the diet pills and the laxatives??? do you go days without eatin or eat tiny bits?? just tryin to get more of an understandin!!!
Ammegxxxx
P.s- where abouts are you from???
Hi Karen
Hope it went ok today - thinking of you,
Loads of love n hugs xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Hi all
Piglet: Don't worry, even the professionals don't really understand a lot of the behaviours associated with eating disorders.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Well now I am a bit confused again - why are you taking laxatives if they don't aid weight loss as I thought that is the basis of what you want to do.
<div align="right">Originally posted by Piglet - 02 May 2006 : 11:31:52</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I do want to lose weight and initially I did think laxatives helped with this but have since learnt this isn't true. But I still need to use them because I need to feel empty and I also feel so ashamed about bingeing that I need to punish myself.
Ammeg: I'm from Sussex. Some days a severely restrict to my 'safe' foods which are basically only rice cakes and fruit. When I'm at the clinic I have to make an attempt to eat lunch but get away with as little as possible, usually half a sandwich but it has to be with Nimble wholemeal bread (no butter) and usually marmite, although I have been trying to have turkey sometimes.
I do have days when I eat more than this but then I feel I've failed because I've eaten too much. Eating anything is too much really as far as the anorexia is concerned. But I hate myself most when I binge and then I punish myself by purging.
Lisa and Fee: Thanks for your messages.
Had a mixed day at the clinic really. I was supposed to have a one to one with Julia first thing this morning but she forgot [Sigh...]. What with lack of help there and Jill not keeping promises to ring me I feel like I am at the bottom of everyone's list of priorities. But then I guess I deserve it for my terrible actions.
Then I saw the lady from the funding panel who told me my current funding is coming to an end. So she has to go to Panel on Thursday and see if she can secure more funding. This is another constant source of worry that funding can come to an end at any time and then where will I be?
No more news on getting any CBT either. Everyone seems to be passing the buck to someone else and I can't get a straight answer.
I am now worried about tomorrow because it is a non clinic day and although I don't exactly get the therapeutic help I need there, at least I'm not alone and am less likely to binge. Now I am tempted to pass the day being unconscious again with drugs like yesterday [:O].
Karen xx
Hannahlou84
02-05-06, 22:01
I'm sorry that the clinic is so badly organised- I know how difficult that must be- hopefully more funding will be secured and they'll get there with it eventually.
Keep pushing for the CBT- it's a shame they can't offer you something like hypnotherapy as well- damn NHS!!! Why does everything have to be about money?!
Have you heard from Jill yet? Perhaps you could call her?
Is there anyway you can keep yourself busy tomorrow? Perhaps you could spend some time with Jac and her daughter? or go on a walk (with very little money for a drink), if it's a nice day? What other things could you do to get you out of the house for a bit.
Good luck, hun for tomorrow- and all the best for the rest of the week without bingeing.
Han xx
"I just wanna live my life sedated, cos I love driving myself away"
Hi Karen,
Glad you had a reasonable day. Shame Julia forgot your appt though, it must be so annoying and frustrating. It's not because you're bad that Jill and Julia forget though, just probably as they are busy or have other things on their minds. I always do something if I say I will and if I can't I let the person know why and when I plan to do it instead. I do understand how it makes you feel though when you're waiting for someone and that support means alot.
It's a shame they can't get there act togther on the CBT front too. I hope the funding works out, must be hard not knowing each time.
Is there anything you can do tomorrow to keep yourself distracted, rather than being drugged up and asleep? Have a think, there must be something maybe.
Thinking of you sis, hope you sleep well.
Night night,
Love Lisa :) x
Thanks for your reply Hannah.
By the time the clinic sort themselves out my funding will probably have stopped and then I will be right back at square one.
Plus I've been told by someone today that I'm heading for serious ill health and need intensive help. That's what I am supposed to be getting at the clinic but it is not happening.
I think I might email Jill, not that she is likely to respond when it will be a negative email about the crisis I'm experiencing at present.
It's probably safer if I stay at home tomorrow. I don't have much food here and need to avoid the temptation of going out to buy anything. None of this would be happening if I hadn't started eating again in the first place. I am so desperate to lose this weight but keep failing every time.
Karen
Happiness is not a state to arrive at but a manner of travelling.
You only live once, but if you do it right, once is enough ~ Christine Cagney, Cagney & Lacey
(((((((KAREN)))))))
I don't know what to say hun - that clinic is such a disappointment but YOU DO NOT DESERVE TO BE AT THE BOTTOM OF EVERYONE'S LIST far far from it, you are working so hard to deal with all your problems and deserve all the support in the world....
Unfortunately people do NOT get what they deserve in this world, the rich get richer etc. etc....
Try to take care of yourself hun, please?
Loads and loads of love n hugs
Aunty Fee xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Thank you Lisa and Fee.
Lisa: I should be used to Jill not ringing or doing things when she says she will. She has good intentions but is not very reliable most of the time.
It is difficult not knowing about the funding each time and I know they will only continue funding this level of treatment for a limited period of time. That's when I start thinking that everything is hopeless again.
I don't know what I can do tomorrow. I don't trust myself and drugging myself so I sleep is the safest way to cope.
Fee: Sometimes I think I should make more of a fuss because it is the people who do this that get the most help but it's not in my nature. There have been several times recently when I've felt other people are more important than me and feel a bit hurt where certain people are concerned. But then I don't think I deserve the help anyway as I cause all these problems for myself.
Karen xx
Hi sis,
We all deserve help whatever the reason, and you don't cause all this yourself, it is part of a disorder, an illness. Not everything is hopeless either, you are making some good progress and I know you can achieve your goals.
Night sis, really going this time, Lol.
Sleep well [|)]
Lisa x
Morning all
It is going to be so hard to keep to my goals to avoid bingeing today. I felt upset last night, which never helps anyway, as I think it is sometimes emotional eating or eating to try to fill a void within me that can never be filled.
So I took extra sleeping pills and Diazepam last night and here I am awake at just gone 7am [:O]. The idea was to sleep most of the day [Duh!].
Can't do this alone I don't think, even though I have plenty of things to keep me busy around the flat.
Thinking of food already and so therefore the punishments I need to dish out to myself.
Karen xx
Hi Karen,
Just to say I'm thinking of you. Sorry this is quick but I'm running late for work.
catch you later sis,
Love and hugs,
Lisa x
PS I know you're alone in person but never in spirit :)
JUst popping in briefly to say hello and see how you are.
Hope the day is going better than you thought.
Big squeeze
Love Piglet xx
"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.
Thank you Piglet and Lisa.
It's a bad bad day with FAILURE of my weekly goal already.
After waking up too early, posting here and on my other forum and sending an email to Jill, I tried to go back to sleep for a while. But couldn't sleep.
I was so determined not to mess up again today and finished completing the rest of the form to claim housing and council tax benefit that I've been putting off for ages. Found most of the evidence I need to provide with the form, apart from my latest bank statement which I can't find anywhere - which is not surprising seeing as I have not been keeping up with paperwork and things are all over the place. Anyway I looked everywhere I thought I might have put it but no luck. Decided to take the previous two and print the latest one from the internet.
It's such a lovely day here today, very sunny and warm. I was going to go into the council office and drop the form off so they could take copies of my ID etc which it says not to send through the post. However, I had a massive panic attack and just couldn't do it :(. As soon as I was in the car driving to the council offices I felt anxious - the thought of having to talk to someone and I feel bad enough having to claim these benefits anyway. So now I'm beating myself up for putting it off again on the one day of the week I could actually get there during opening hours .
Next I needed to go to Tesco. [b]BIG mistake [Duh!]. I was anxious as soon as I got there. I had my list and went round just picking up the things I really needed, like some fruit, toilet rolls [:I] - so lucky they are on special offer at present, scented candles and air fresheners etc because I have this thing about the flat smelling [:I][:I].
But then I lost control. I've been obsessing about food all day and thought I could curb my craving with these Cadburys Highlight Nibblers (http://www.weightlossresources.co.uk/food/low_calorie/chocolate_snacks.htm) as they come in individual bags and although I don't want to eat anything, I could just about cope with the 75 cals in one bag. But they are out of stock. So ended up buying chocolate chip cakes that are 125 calories each :([No].
I then went into town, trying to calm down and putting off the inevitable of coming back here and eating, but there are not many shops here and I am not interested in looking at or buying clothes because I am so fat.
Now back at home. Have taken more laxatives than ever before in readiness to get rid of what I'll eat today, plus one Xenical so far, but need to take one with everything I eat for the rest of the day.
Now I just hate myself and feel so ashamed again. I have been reading a book by a local author who has overcome her eating disorder which she suffered from for 28 years (and at a far greater degree than me). Yesterday I read a quote where she said "I felt absolutely worthless and bulimia, more than anorexia, I think, compounded my low self esteem.” That's exactly how I feel about my situation.
I have lost the incentive to do any of the things I had planned today and am just waiting for the ill effects of the laxatives to take effect. In fact, I am tempted to take more because I deserve to be really really ill [B)][xx(].
The shame is unbearable and I want to take ever more increasing risks with my health because I am so desperate to stop eating and to lose weight. I just can't do this anymore :(:(:(.
Sorry for the long post.
Karen xx
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">.
Now back at home. Have taken more laxatives than ever before in readiness to get rid of what I'll eat today, plus one Xenical so far, but need to take one with everything I eat for the rest of the day.
In fact, I am tempted to take more because I deserve to be really really ill
The shame is unbearable and I want to take ever more increasing risks with my health
<div align="right">Originally posted by Karen - 03 May 2006 : 15:16:13</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Karen,
Noooooooooo :( No sis, this is not right at all, no way. In fact it's really worrying to hear you talk like this.
The amount of laxatives you must have already taken is not good but please do not take any more and no more xenical either. You do not need one with everything you eat [:O]. The maximum dose is three per day and then only for morbidly obese people when eating fatty meals.
You do not want to take ever more increasing risks with your health either, although I do fear the way you're going you're going to end up seriously ill, and you don't deserve any punishment. Sorry sis I had to say it as I care about you.
I'm sorry you're having a bad day, there are some achievements in there though like completing the forms and for going out and not staying in bed trying to sleep all day. It's not a failure to not go and sort the forms out, ok so you panicked and didn't go, so what it doesn't matter. You are putting too much pressure on yourself to be perfect, humans are fallible, we make mistakes, we have emotions that get in the way, we do all sorts of things because we are not perfect but none of it makes us failures. If I did a few things wrong you wouldn't think I was a failure would you, so don't be so hard on yourself.
So no more big red letters spelling out F words [:O].
Big (((((hugs))))) sis, thinking of you.
Love Lisa x
Hi Lisa
I am really sorry to be causing concern again. I know it is not really fair to post on here about what I am doing to myself as I don't want to be the cause of concern; it's just that I have nowhere else to turn. I can't write to K again as I am still waiting to see if she replies to my message from last night and I can't break my contact agreement with her.
Really I don't want to worry you but I have already taken 40 laxatives and 2 Xenical today and all because I couldn't stop at eating a sandwich for lunch but also had a cake bar and some low fat crisps.
Now I can already feel the stomach cramps starting and I am feeling sick, so no doubt it won't be long before I start getting the effects of purging. Maybe it will stop me eating anything else today if nothing else.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">You do not want to take ever more increasing risks with your health either, although I do fear the way you're going you're going to end up seriously ill, and you don't deserve any punishment. Sorry sis I had to say it as I care about you.<div align="right">Originally posted by LJ - 03 May 2006 : 15:30:30</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
The really stupid thing is that once I start feeling ill I then get quite scared, particularly being alone, but nothing is enough to stop me doing it. Every time I am alone I lose it and it is because I can't trust myself with food. I am such a fat blob now and I'll never lose this weight.
I really wish I wasn't alone. I know many people are and cope fine but I am so desperate for help from someone who cares about me - and I don't mean going into the clinic or hospital. I just need desperately so local help and support but don't have any and therefore it all feels hopeless.
Now I think it would've been better to take the sleeping pills and Diazepam instead.
Sorry to worry you sis :(.
Karen xx
oh karen
im soooo sorry your havin such a rubbish time of things!!! have you tryed hypnotherapy?? i now how rubbish the nhs is, why should we have to pay, if i u had a 'proper illness' id get everything for free!!! ****ers!! sorry!!! how long have you had your eatin disorder?? yet again just tryin to find out info!!! thinkin of u and ur poor empty tummy!!!
Ammegxxxxx
Hi sis,
No need to apologise, I only worry because I care, you know that. I would never want you to stop posting here, I know you need the support from here, it's ok.
40 laxatives does sound a lot though [:O] and I do get concerned what this is doing to you.
What you ate earlier wasn't bingeing, it was a normal lunch, ok the crisps and the chocolate are not the most healthy things but it won't hurt you in any way, all fodds are fine to eat, and the amount you ate was not excessive in any way, certainly not bingeing levels.
I wish you had some more support locally too, not sure what to suggest about that.
I hope you're not too ill, please don't take any more pills of any kind or laxatives.
Right I have to go now as need to pop out.
Thinking of you.
Lisa x
((((((KAREN))))))
I know there's no point in telling you that what you ate wouldn't have done you any harm at all even without all the purgeing - but can you see that it is the urge to purge that is the problem, not the urge to binge? How much did you actually eat? Not as much as most of us do every day - it seems you are skipping the bingeing (almost) in your hurry to punish yourself... That's why your first goal has to be to cut down on the laxatives and stop the Xenical even if you do eat a lot...
YOU ARE NOT A FAILURE
YOU ARE NOT A FAILURE
YOU ARE NOT A FAILURE
YOU ARE NOT A FAILURE
NER!!!
You are NOT WELL AND DEPRESSED
and struggling and working really really hard to get better without the support you need....
Go no further down this route today. First goal - NO MORE MEDICATION TODAY!
Second goal, get through tonight and tomorrow is another day!!!!
I'm so gutted for you that you feel so low but as always you have all my love and support.... I wish it was more....
((((((HUGS))))))
Aunty Fee xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Thank you Ammeg and Lisa for your replies.
Ammeg: Yes I have had hypnotherapy before and found it very helpful for my general anxiety and for social phobia. I didn't have as much success with my eating disorder but Jill (my hypnotherapist) always maintained this was because I need ongoing, daily sustained help and support, which she is not able to provide. She's been really kind and even saw me for a while without charging me - I did some voluntary work in the office instead.
I'd love to have more hypnotherapy but Jill does need to run a business and although I could find some money for treatment, she is very highly trained and the normal charges are high, particularly when surviving on benefits.
I suppose I've had the eating disorder for about 2 years now, although it only really became evident what was happening in the autumn of 2004.
Lisa: Yes I know you worry because you care but then I worry that I am causing you to worry and I don't want to be the cause of anyone feeling worse.
I feel trapped in the compulsive laxative use. 40 is the most I've ever taken and it helps me feel like I am serving my punishment and also emptying my body of any food the more quickly the diarrhoea starts. Every week or so though I find I need to increase the number I take in order to get the same results. Today 40 has been enough to start the diarrhoea within a couple of hours of eating and I feel better (as far as my eating disorder is concerned) about that than having to wait the 8-12 hours that it says on the packet. To me, waiting that long means I am not taking enough.
Provided I remain ill for the rest of the evening I won't feel the need to take any more laxatives today, but if I eat I can't promise about the Xenical.
Actually, in a way you are right about my bingeing today, in that so far I haven't consumed enough calories for this to be considered one of my proper binges. I have been working it out. My sandwich was made with Nimble bread (without any butter or spread), with ham and tomato, so that was about 115 calories. The crisps were from the Boots shapers range and were 75 calories, and the choc chip cake bar was 125 calories. So I've had 315 calories so far today - but I ate them all in one meal.
If I can avoid eating for the rest of the day then, although not a healthy diet, at least I am within my 500 calorie a day target. But there are so many hours to pass yet before bed time and there are the rest of those cake bars. In fact, I think I am going to dispose of them and soak them in bleach so I can't eat any more of them. I didn't even want the stupid cake in the first place so I don't know why I ate it. I think I was obsessing about these Highlight nibbler things and frustrated that I couldn't get those and so bought something I didn't even really want - or at least I certainly don't now I feel sick and have stomach cramps.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">I wish you had some more support locally too, not sure what to suggest about that.</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
This is my main problem at the moment because it is when I am alone that I do these things. I don't know what the answer is either.
Got to dash now [:I][Oops!]. Thanks for your concern sis.
Karen xx
Hi Karen,
It's ok, you are not making me feel worse so don't worry there, I am just concerned for you as a friend and for what you are doing to your health.
As for the calories, well I can eat more than 315 in a snack sometimes and it's certainly not a binge when I do it either. The average female needs 2000 calories a day, if you split that even into three meals a day you can eat nearly 700 calories at each meal. I'm not sure what you think of as bingeing actually is bingeing now, ok I know today you didn't binge today but what do you mean by bingeing. I think your idea of bingeing is very distored now, as you see any amount of food as alot. What you ate today was a normal amount, less than a normal amount really and did not require purgeing. 500 calories a day is way way too low too but if you could even start with eating 500 calories a day and not purge that would be a great start and a great goal to aim for initially.
Anyway no more laxatives today sis and definitely NO MORE XENICAL, sorry to shout! [Oops!].
I hope your poor tum settles down soon before you need shares in andrex! [:O] Sorry I have weird humour sometimes [:I].
Thinking of you sis,
Love and hugs,
Lisa x
Hi Fee
Thank you so much for your message and support. I just can't help feeling like a failure when I can't manage one day alone without get urges to binge like this.
I will admit that today's intake (so far) has not really amounted to proper bingeing, although it is unhealthy food with sugar and fat, hence the need to burge and take Xenical. A normal binge would consist of far more than that but I was trying to give myself permission to eat a bit of what I was craving but it didn't work because I felt the need to punish myself before eating any of it.
The rest of those cake bars are now in the bin and so even if I feel better later I can't eat more of those. Luckily I didn't buy much else except fruit, which will definitely have me rushing for the toilet again at present, and bread which is a worry. I feel the need to get rid of most of that too, just leaving enough for the sandwich I have to take to the clinic tomorrow. Oh I have eggs and baked beans too and they might also need to go. Leaving just the rice cakes again [Sigh...].
How I wish I could just eat without thinking about it and not be either obsessing about food I want to eat but know will binge on, or obsessing about how much fat and weight I've gained. I was already feeling so fat this morning and I've just realised I might get dragged off to be weighed at the clinic tomorrow. I can't handle it if I've gained any weight.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">but can you see that it is the urge to purge that is the problem, not the urge to binge? How much did you actually eat? Not as much as most of us do every day - it seems you are skipping the bingeing (almost) in your hurry to punish yourself... That's why your first goal has to be to cut down on the laxatives and stop the Xenical even if you do eat a lot...</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I see what you are saying but today was not a typical binge. It is not like it was on Sunday, for example, when I literally did not stop eating high calorie and high fat foods all day. So I do binge and the fact I dish out punishment to myself by purging in advance of eating is my latest attempt to restrict the binge - the theory being that I can't continue bingeing if I am feeling ill with stomach cramps and running to the loo every 5 minutes.
I am stuck in this vicious circle and don't know how to get myself out of it. The bingeing came first when this all started and it was when this got out of control that I started purging and then using Xenical, and sometimes Reductil - which I didn't take this morning and maybe should have, although it does not appear to be very effective.
I'll try not to take any further medication Fee, really I will. If I can avoid eating anything else then I won't need to take anything. I know I probably can't take more laxatives in case the effects last into tomorrow and I won't make it to the clinic. But resisting the Xenical will be difficult if I eat even as much as another slice of bread today.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">I'm so gutted for you that you feel so low but as always you have all my love and support.... I wish it was more....</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
It means more than you know Fee :). If only we lived that little bit closer we could help support each other so much more.
I still have the files and huge mound of paperwork sitting at the bottom of my bed that I was going to sort through today, and I haven't done any of the housework either. Plus it's been a gorgeous day and apart from a brief spell out, I've spent most o
Hi Lisa
We were posting at the same time then. I am glad what I am saying is not making you worse. I get concerned because of your health anxiety but I'm not really talking about what I could be doing to myself with abusing my body in the way I am.
I wouldn't call today a typical binge. I just felt bad at eating so many calories so early in the day, plus I was already feeling bloated after not using any laxatives yesterday.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">I'm not sure what you think of as bingeing actually is bingeing now, ok I know today you didn't binge today but what do you mean by bingeing.</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Believe me that when I normally talk about bingeing I really have binged. I am too terrified to add up the number of calories these binges contain but I would guess it would amount to at least 3000. So it is proper bingeing.
During a normal binge I would eat chocolate (either a number of individual bars, or a big bar), packets of cakes, packets of biscuits, bread, cheese and the other day it was chips - oven chips but still high fat and high calorie. If I wasn't truly bingeing then the days I restrict and the weight loss drugs and purging would mean I would be losing weight, whereas I had (before Sunday) only lost 3lbs in about a month.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">I hope your poor tum settles down soon before you need shares in andrex! [:O] Sorry I have weird humour sometimes [:I].</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
LOL!! I can't afford Andrex as I use too much of it [:I]. I am stocking up on Tescos own brand which is on special offer of £1 for 4 rolls at the moment. Perhaps I should just get them to come and deliver a truck load of it to me here :D.
Still feeling ill obviously and running to the loo intermittently. I don't really want my stomach to settle tonight because I don't want to eat anything else.
I'm so tired I think I need a nap though when I've hardly done anything.
Thanks again sis.
Karen xx
((((((KAREN))))))
So what you are saying is that actually today you did manage not to binge?!!!!
EH? LOL
Isn't that a success?!!!!:D:D
What you did was manage to eat but not binge which was your first goal... but you didn't manage not to purge afterwards... but isn't that half way there? And if you stop purgeing now isn't that at least a small achievement even in your eyes????
Stick with it hun, because not bingeing is brilliant but coping with feeling like you have eaten something is going to be very very hard.... and is the next step!
And although you don't feel ok all the distraction IS working - just hang in there and let your body deal with today....
Yes it would be nice to be nearer and go for a cup of tea....
Try and make the meet on Sunday eh?
Love n hugs xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Hi Karen,
I hope you're not feeling too ill tonight sis, you don't deserve that whatever you say.
Fee is right you did do well to not binge today, well done for that.
Anyway I hope you sleep well tonight and have a good day at the clinic tomorrow.
(((((((((Hugs))))))))))
Liisa x
Hi Fee and Lisa
I haven't been feeling too well this evening, with stomach pain still but the diarrhoea stopped ages ago. I don't think I've punished myself enough because it should've been worse than this. 40 is obviously not enough and I need more next time.
Fee: Umm... it still counts as eating the wrong food and therefore I had to purge. Cakes and crisps are on the definite unsafe food list and I shouldn't be eating stuff like that.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">What you did was manage to eat but not binge which was your first goal... but you didn't manage not to purge afterwards... but isn't that half way there? And if you stop purgeing now isn't that at least a small achievement even in your eyes????</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Not really because I didn't want to eat anywhere as much as I did eat and so I have to purge. I still think I failed. Plus I didn't do any of the other things I meant to do today.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Try and make the meet on Sunday eh?</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I want to and will try but it depends what kind of day I have on Saturday really as to whether I'll be up to it.
Lisa: Thanks sis. I feel like I should stay up now and sort through the paperwork I was supposed to do today, let alone the tidying up and housework.
Also felt worse when someone with an eating disorder - a new member - on my other site posted some photos of herself when she was very thin - and it was on my thread so I didn't think it right that I do anything about it. They made me feel even fatter than I believe I am already.
The photos have been removed now (probably by K as I mentioned how upset I was) and it is not a good idea to have things like that on the site anyway.
I am feeling very demotivated, depressed and am not looking forward to going to the clinic tomorrow.
Karen xx
Morning all.
I wish I could say I am feeling better this morning but I don't. I was up until 4am last night, and as I couldn't sleep - because I'd started rushing to the loo again - I did at least get some of my paperwork sorted and have a load of old stuff ready to shred.
However, now I am extremely tired having woken again at 7am and have been ill again this morning. My stomach is still feeling very sore and I have tummy cramps.
All I really want to do is go back to bed but it is a clinic day and so I can't do that. I was going to leave a bit early to put my car through the car wash, as there are no facilities here like an outside tap and due to my RSI I can't carry buckets of water up and down from my flat. However, I don't know if I can risk being away from a toilet for that long at present - and no I didn't take any more laxatives last night.
I feel all achy and am even shivering although it is meant to be a warm day today. Also had to find and iron the biggest, baggiest t shirt I could find in case it does get warmer and I can't hide in my fleece today [8)].
Karen xx
Hi Karen,
I hope you feel better as the day goes on and have had a good day at the clinic.
Thinking of you.
Lisa x
Hi Karen
I hope you are feeling better tonight hun..
love n hugs xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Thanks Lisa and Fee.
I am feeling so low and depressed. Can't even put how I am feeling into words :(:(:(
Karen xx
oh karen
try and let us know how u feel!! huge squeeze from me!!!
(((((((((((KAREN))))))))))))))
Ammegxxxxxxx
((((((KAREN))))))
Did something happen today?
Or was it just more of the same?
Sorry you feel so rubbish hun - thinkin of you
loads and loads of love
Aunty Fee xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Thanks for replying Ammeg and Fee.
I'm not sure why I am feeling so low. I had a better day at the clinic and as it was just two of us in the group sessions I opened up and spoke quite a bit.
The problem is I had specifically asked to work on coping strategies for when I hit a crisis, defined by me as being at the point where I am bingeing. But we started looking at triggers and didn't actually get to how to deal with the crisis.
Becky asked what would happen if I had someone I know and trust staying with me for a month, as I had said that being alone makes things worse. Having thought about it, I think it would break the binge pattern as I wouldn't even slightly overeat, let alone binge. But this is all fantasy and not going to help in the real world. I am alone and have to cope alone.
So I am now facing another 3 days until I'll get the chance to talk to anyone again and I'm feeling out of control completely already. It was also the funding panel meeting today and so I don't even know if more sessions have been approved or not.
Too many negative things happening and I feel bad about myself for not getting better. I still want to stop eating and to lose weight but I've lost control.
Have been taking Xenical tonight. Want to use laxatives too but am supposed to be going to the hairdressers tomorrow, unless I cancel. I still can't decide what to have done and I don't think I can face going. I don't want anyone to see how much weight I've gained either :(.
Karen xx
Hi Karen
You have had a rotten time so it's not surprising you feel low. Try not to take the laxatives and look forward to getting your hair done - I thought the idea of a perm sounded cool[8D] I made an appt to have mine done next Weds :( I'm scared to death of the hairdressers but my home colour is just not good enough and I haven't had a decent cut since before xmas!
I hope you manage not to make yourself too ill tonight - I'm really hoping your coming to the meet on Sunday - something to look forward to eh???:D
You know that taking xenical and too many laxatives will make you more tired and miserable in reality even though you want to do it....
I hope you manage to sleep tonight hun.
loads of love n hugs
Aunty Fee xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Hi Fee
I actually find it really difficult going to the hairdressers, especially for something that means spending a great deal of time there. I haven't been since before Christmas either.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">I thought the idea of a perm sounded cool[8D]</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
It would be easier to manage but I also need my roots done and know I can't have both done at the same time.
I am using Xenical tonight as I've eaten food with too much fat in it but I should've taken the laxatives much earlier as I can't risk being ill at the hairdressers [:I].
Will have to wait until I get home tomorrow as I need to get rid of this food.
I was looking forward to Sunday but now just keep thinking how ashamed I am of my size and also meeting at a cafe and being around food. I am such a mess right now.
Karen xx
(((((((((Sis))))))))))
Sorry you're feeling so low tonight. I was pleased to read that you had a better day at the clinic though and that you managed to talk more, well done for that.
Please try and resist the xenical, or better still throw them away [:O].
I hope you make it to the hairdressers tomorrow, I love going and having mine done, but it can also give you a lift and it will make your hair easier to manage and save you time.
I really hope you make it to the meet on Sunday, it may do you good to get out, and you can meet your Aunty!
I hope you sleep well tonight,
Night night,
Love Lisa x
Hi Karen,
Just wanted to let you know I'm thinking of you and keeping up with what is going on with you.
I agree it would be good if you could make it Sunday, sounds like you could do with some time out.
Hope you get some good sleep. Take care.
Tammy x
Thank you Lisa and Tammy.
As if I needed any further reason to be feeling low right now, I've just heard that K is away next week.
Right now the only things that spring to mind are hopelessness and further proof of how terrible I am for reacting to the news this way.
I really don't care what I am doing to myself or if I am making myself ill or worse. It's what I deserve and nothing could be worse than how things are right now.
Karen xx
OMG I have eaten too much tonight trying to fix emotional emptiness with food which only makes me feel ten times worse.
I think even K is losing patience with me and pointed out that my messages are totally irrational, contravene our communication agreement of how I am allowed to say things, and include too many banned words and phrases.
Am so desperate to take laxatives but can't because it would be too embarrassing to need to loo every 5 minutes while at the hairdressers. So I have been taking Xenical. In fact, I've lost count of how many I've taken now [Oops!] - not that I really care at this moment in time.
I don't have any hope for the future and I am feeling abandoned by people I need. Now I despise myself even more by adding to my fat by bingeing tonight. I can't do this anymore :(.
Karen
<center>~~~Losing It~~~</center>
Now I know I really am losing it, or at least that my mind is so messed up right now that I don't know whether I am coming or going [:O].
I finally went to bed about 5.00 this morning because I couldn't sleep earlier. I remember dreaming about being in this job, somewhere where the building was kind of like the clinic - which is really several houses joined together and a bit of a maze until you find your way around. Anyway, I was working doing admin or something, except people from places I have worked before were there.
I've just woken with a start believing I have slept all day and it was 6.30 pm, had an anxiety attack for missing my hairdresser appointment - simply because I don't like letting people down. So I was feeling guilty at missing an appointment, wondering how I slept so long on a normal dose of my sleep medication and felt completely confused. I thought I must have turned my alarm off (which I've done only once before in my whole life) but it was still set to go off at 10.30am. I must admit then I got angry at the alarm clock blaming it for me not waking up.
Still feeling confused, I looked at my mobile phone, which said 6.30 am. But I couldn't believe that was right either and that I'd been asleep for only an hour and a half. So I had to turn the TV on and check that out too - of course it is the news so couldn't be sure from that and looked on Teletext.
Now I feel really stupid [Duh!] but also thought you guys would have a laugh at how really silly this is[:P].
Still feeling the same as last night and obviously still too tired to function properly with the trouble I am having typing this even. So back to bed for me and I hope I don't wake until the proper time now. Am just about to set my mobile alarm as back up though now the seed of doubt that I might not wake when the alarm goes off has been sown. It's more probable that I won't be able to sleep again now.
Night again [|)][Duh!].
Karen xx
Oh Karen hun..
I don't think anyone is abandoning you, that's just how you feel. I'm sure K is just very worried about you, as we all are....
((((KAREN))))
You really HAVE to make getting rid of that Xenical completely your first goal, it is absolutely no good to you and I'm sure is making you really unwell. Nothing will get better while you are using and abusing this stuff....
Thinking of you hun
Loads of love n hugs
Aunty Fee xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote"> I have been reading a book by a local author who has overcome her eating disorder which she suffered from for 28 years (and at a far greater degree than me).
Karen xx
<div align="right">Originally posted by Karen - 03 May 2006 : 16:16:13</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
How did this lady get better???
Nice to hear from you yesterday - might you get chance to go to the sea today - still really sunny here just at present.
I had another session on the course this week and while I had lots of positives to report on the being out in the front garden for hours chatting etc I have been finding the going out alone in the dark really hard - so I havent done it [:I][:I][:I][:I] (telling you this so you realise we all find our goals hard and stumble around abit too)!!
We all chatted and thought it would be best to try and do the evening walk but take one of the piglets with me. I did have such a good walk last week when I went to the bank so we thought that made a good starting point.
One of the others also didn't quite make his goals either so you see it does happen to us all. The fact we have the goals and try at them is the most important thing of all. Keep trying mate and you will get there.
Big squeeze.
Love Piglet xxx
"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.
Hi Guys
Fee: I know the Xenical is no good for me but I can't get rid of it all the time I am bingeing. I am so petrified of further weight gain when I do not even want to weigh as much as I do at present.
K is not abandoning me I know that really but it is going to be 10 x harder next week when she is not here. She WILL eventually be moving further away and I am again struggling with coming to terms with that.
I was also not only referring to her but a general feeling (not about my friends here of course) and other things are happening to cause me to feel worse about this.
Piglet: I think you are doing well with your goals and it's the perfectionist in me which means I class anything but total success as failure. I have definitely failed on this week's goal though and have done worse than last week, having already had two binge days and we are not even at the weekend yet.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">How did this lady get better???
<div align="right">Originally posted by Piglet - 05 May 2006 : 10:02:19</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Don't know. I haven't got to that bit yet. I am rather slow at reading at present.
Don't think it is the weather to do much today. It's cloudy and looks like it will rain.
Karen xx
Hi Karen,
Just sending you a big (((((hug))))).
I hope you manage to do something nice this afternoon.
Thinking of you still.
Love Lisa x
Hi Karen
Piglet is so right (wise woman!!) it is the aiming for goals that is most important, failure is not trying!!! And we are all trying (very lol!!).
I hope you feel better as the day goes on hun.
Loads of love n hugs
Aunty Fee xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">How did this lady get better???
<div align="right">Originally posted by Piglet - 05 May 2006 : 10:02:19</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Don't know. I haven't got to that bit yet. I am rather slow at reading at present.
Karen xx
<div align="right">Originally posted by Karen - 05 May 2006 : 12:11:22</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
How good are you - I would have raced to the end first and read backwards[}:)][:I]:D:D:D:D:D:D
Fee - wish I was wise hun but I don't know what the maths term 'nth' means so I am afraid I can't possibly be. Piglet shakes her head sadly at this terrible lapse but then catches sight of her crystals sparkling in the sunlight and all is well again!!! :D:D:D
Hugs
Love Piglet xxx
hey karen
did u have your hair done?? wot did u have done?? im sorry your havin such a crap time of things!! I am concerned about the diet pills you are takin!! concerned about you!!! hope your feelin better hun!!!
Ammegxxxx
Hi Karen,
I'm sorry things are so hard for you at the moment. I really hope you have a good day today.
I've come across a website for eating disorders. I hope you don't mind me suggesting this. It has links for help and information. I'll give you the link http://www.edauk.com/getting_help.htm
Take Care,
Heather
Hi All
Thank you for all the lovely messages.
Lisa: Thanks for the hug. Have only been to the hairdressers and then came home again. The sun is shining now but it hasn't helped lift my mood at all :(.
Fee: I agree I am setting myself goals but I am doing worse than last week and the aim is supposed to be to improve.
I just got home not having eaten so far today. I looked at the food I still have in the flat and thought I should eat something, but then the anxiety and panic started and I found I couldn't because this is supposed to be a fasting day and I cannot gain more weight. So my goal has now shifted from stopping bingeing for 7 days to fasting for 7 days. Now that would be an achievement.
Piglet: The reflexology sounds a lot more calming than the last course you were doing!
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">How good are you - I would have raced to the end first and read backwards[}:)][:I]:D:D:D:D:D:D</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Actually I do that a lot with self help books, turning to chapters of most interest and not actually getting round to reading the whole book [Oops!]. But as this is a life story I think I do need to read it through from the beginning and not skip to the end. I expect the bit about getting better starts somewhere in the middle anyway.
Ammeg: Sorry I know I am causing concern again. The laxatives are calling me now and I know I'll end up taking them at some point, as well as the diet pills if I give in and eat anything.
Yes, I did go to the hairdressers and I had the perm done. Not too sure about it at the moment [:O]. I hope it will be alright when I can wash it myself and the perm relaxes a bit. It's a bit too curly at the moment [Duh!]. Also have to wait 5 weeks before I can have my highlights done which is a bit of a pain.
I am not really doing too well today and just want to sleep so I can stop thinking and ruminating about everything. There is so much going round in my head at the moment.
Jill actually replied to an email I sent her this morning but when I read it she hadn't actually replied to what I'd written. She said she couldn't read it all and could I send her a summary instead :(. I do get carried away with the amount I write in emails at times but this one was only just over one page long. Even she has given up on me and can't be bothered to read my messages.
So I quickly edited out as much as I could to make it really short for her to read as I was about to leave for the hairdressers and hoped she would reply if I replied straight away. But now I don't think it really expresses and explains what I was trying to say and she hasn't even replied anyway :(.
Everything is getting worse and going wrong. I am obsessing about K and the fact the I've seen her online a fair bit today but she rarely writes on a Friday. And also the fact that she is away next week.
I am so ashamed at the way I am behaving and it's no wonder people don't want to reply.
Don't know what I'd do without my friends here and you all deserve medals for putting up with me. I am desperate to hear from K though and after promising to ring me last week, I had hoped Jill might at least answer my email. There is one from the other day she hasn't replied to either.
Karen xx
Hi Heather
Thanks for your message.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">I've come across a website for eating disorders. I hope you don't mind me suggesting this. It has links for help and information. I'll give you the link http://www.edauk.com/getting_help.htm
<div align="right">Originally posted by h3ths - 05 May 2006 : 15:54:02</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Yes, I already have read through this whole site and some of the information was helpful when I first became ill with this. But I haven't been able to find any help through the site and found reading the forum there made me worse.
I appreciate you taking the time to find the site for me and I do check in there now and again to see if there has been anything useful added.
Karen
Happiness is not a state to arrive at but a manner of travelling.
You only live once, but if you do it right, once is enough ~ Christine Cagney, Cagney & Lacey
(((((((((((Karen))))))))))))
Firstly your hair looks lovely - can I call you curly Karen now :D. Well done for going though. It will relax in time and not look so curly.
Fasting for 7 days is a terrible goal and would NOT be an achievement in any way [:O]:(, please rethink this one. Think about what sensible goals you could achieve, even if you break them down into several tiny steps.
Jill hasn't given up on you either, I know she cares, she is probably just too busy to read so much or is trying to encourage you to be more positive with what you say maybe. I do understand it must be hard when you wait for replies and help and get that response though.
Not everything is going wrong and not everything needs to get worse and to top it all off we are still here and replying :D.
Please try and keep off the nasty Xenical tabs sis, you CAN do it.
Wish I could say more to help, maybe the wise and clever Piglet or Fee will be along with there pearls of wisdom soon.
Thinking of you,
Love Lisa x
((((((KAREN))))))
I bet your hair looks lovely - well done for going[8D][8D][8D]
I'm so sad that you feel so rotten and it is hard to know what to say. You KNOW that wanting to fast for 7 days is totally distorted thoughts..
You will only get better when your goals are healthy ones like your list you made, and all that your body is coping with at the moment is just making you more and more depressed.
I know you can pull it round again hun - try and do it soon...
Thinking of you.
Loads and loads of love n hugs
Aunty Fee xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Sorry Lisa and Fee. I guess I am letting everyone down at present.
Well the fasting didn't last long as I had some toast and marmite but then took a Xenical with it [B)].
Lisa: My email to Jill was a bit negative but I was mainly explaining a certain situation and asking her opinion about my reaction because I don't even trust myself to know if what I am feeling is normal or not. She hasn't even replied to my shortened message though :(.
Sorry, I am having a very bad day and the next week is going to be hell. I just can't cope. I dread every waking minute. I need to order some more sleeping pills.
Karen xx
Hi Karen,
You are not letting anyone down at all.
I'm glad you've eaten but why did you need the xenical, a slice of toast is hardly anything. You really seem to have alot of these tables left still, I thought you only had a few. They really are doing you no good and I dread to think what harm and you do not need them, you really don't. Sorry got my anti xenical head on [}:)] but as usual only because I care sis.
Big (((((hugs))))), thinking of you.
Love Lisa x
Things can't get any worse
Now K's forum is down and so I cannot even check for messages or send a message to her. I can email her but she will only reply on the forum by PM and not by email.
I'm now distraught :(:(:(.
Lisa: I know you care. I got some more Xenical because I need them.
Karen xx
Karen,
You don't need them. I know it's hard for you to believe that and you obviously believe that you do but you must believe us when we say you don't.
You have been without K before and survived. I know you're feeling really down at the moment but you will be OK Karen. Keep in mind your lunch date with her, try and focus on that again because you were almost there before. You CAN do it.
Anyway, hope you begin to feel a little better soon.
Please take care.
Tammy x
Hi Tammy
I do need them though because I have gained so much weight and I have to lose it somehow.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">You have been without K before and survived. I know you're feeling really down at the moment but you will be OK Karen. Keep in mind your lunch date with her, try and focus on that again because you were almost there before. You CAN do it.
<div align="right">Originally posted by tammyg - 05 May 2006 : 19:21:21</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I expect the meeting with her is probably cancelled now. She doesn't mentioned it every time I ask and I have failed yet again so don't even deserve to meet her. I don't even know why she still bothers with me.
Karen xx
Just popping in to say goodnight and no you don't need the X's - try and breakdown your goals a little smaller so that they are easier to achieve.
I think we would all feel alot easier if that goal was binning the x tabs just for now.
Big hugs mate.
Love Piglet xxx
"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.
Hi Karen
I agree with Piglet only I just want to say pleeeeeeese bin them? It's so hard to know what else to say, there is no way you can improve at all while you are taking them and only able to think about losing weight which will not help anything...
Hang in there hun, we're all rooting for you with all our hearts.
(((((((KAREN)))))))
Hope you get some sleep tonight.
Loads and loads of love
Aunty Fee xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Hi Karen,
Please bin the xenical sis, pleeeeeeaaaaaaaaaassssseeeeee[?] [Oops!] that is a bit loud but you get the message ;).
I agree with the others you do not need these, they are harming you and not even helping you lose weight. They are not the answer and on top of all that they are sooo expensive.
Sorry about K, I know that must be hard. She may still get to reply but even if she can't you can cope, I knew us lot are not the same as K but we are still here and K will be back before you know it.
I hope you feel better soon and have a good nights sleep tonight.
Are you planning to go to the meet on sunday? it may do you good, wouldn't it be lovely to meet Fee?
Anyway night night sis, thinking of you.
Love and huge (((((hugs)))))
Lisa x
Hi All
I recognised the crisis point I was hitting tonight and admitted I needed to be with someone so have spent the evening with Jac. It helped for a few hours but I feel bad because I ended up talking a lot about my current problems so I'm not exactly a fun person to be with right now [:I]. Having some company for a couple of hours helped but I know this was only a temporary solution and I can't rely on one person to be there for me all the time. She has so many other things on and I have to learn to cope alone.
At least it stopped me giving into the binge thoughts I was having earlier and I have managed to keep within my normal 500 calorie target. However, I really wanted to avoid eating completely after yesterday and I have still taken Xenical today and need to take laxatives before heading off to bed tonight, or maybe first thing tomorrow because if I take enough of them it will mean I'll be too ill to leave my flat to go anywhere to buy food, and also hopefully be too ill to eat much too.
I know it wasn't unexpected but I didn't hear from K tonight :(.
Piglet: I don't think I can break down my goals any further unless I set daily rather than weekly goals, but then that kind of defeats the object as I need to build on what I've managed in the past and this would be taking a step backwards.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">I think we would all feel alot easier if that goal was binning the x tabs just for now.<div align="right">Originally posted by Piglet - 05 May 2006 : 21:25:05</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I know you would but I really can't do that. If they are even helping the slightest bit to stop me absorbing fat and therefore not gaining (and hopefully losing) weight then it is worth taking them.
Fee: Thanks for the hugs and I know you too want me to bin these pills. This is a goal I will definitely fail at and the next panic I have I'll only end up ordering more.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">It's so hard to know what else to say, there is no way you can improve at all while you are taking them and only able to think about losing weight which will not help anything...</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I realise you believe this but I believe the opposite. I don't think I can work on achieving anything else until I lose weight and start to feel back on a more even keel. I am in such a distressed state because I can't handle being this big.
Lisa: Sorry again and I do get the recurring theme that you all want me to ditch the Xenical. I think this is too big a step for me right now though. Yes, the pills are expensive but I am so desperate that I will only end up ordering more.
I am not sure about Sunday. I'd like to go but really need to see how I cope tomorrow and whether I am up to it on Sunday. It would be lovely to meet Fee.
Another concern is food. I really will not want to eat but am aware that we are meeting at a cafe and others will want to have lunch. I did not have such a problem with this at the meet ups last year because I was strong in my resolve not to eat and actually felt good that I had strong willpower to be around food and other people eating without wanting to eat. However, now I am petrified it will tip me over the edge and cause me to obsess about food and I'll binge later on. I doubt I'll eat during the meet up but it can start a sequence of events which leads to bingeing later on when I am home alone.
I hope I sleep tonight too. I feel very tired but at the same time don't want to wake up early tomorro
(((((((((((((((((((Karen))))))))))))))))))))
Just saying night night and still thinking of you. Too tired to say anything clever (not that I ever do lol).
I'm glad that you went to see Jac, no need to feel bad for talking to her, that's what friends are for.
Sleep well sis,
Night,
Lisa x
I really can't do this anymore. [B)]
I've been awake all night. Slept only for about 30 minutes before I woke up with a start. Now it is only 9.00 in the morning and I have binged already [B)]:([Sigh...].
K is off to Ireland and once she goes I'll never see her. Other people are backing off or not replying because of disapproval and I am causing so much concern.
All I want to do is shout "stop this life/existence so I can get off" [xx(]:(.
Ordered more sleeping pills last night and now I desperately need more Xenical and the Diazepam seems a good idea at present. I've been told I am putting my body under extreme pressure medically because of the qnantities and mixture of medication I am taking. I don't even care at the point in time. My whole life feels like a living hell and I've taken as much as I can handle.
So have taken more laxatives after bingeing this morning, although I am still waiting for the first ones to work, and another Xenical. I feel the need to take one whenever I eat and especially on really bad days like today.
I'd just like to be normal for once in my life because I don't even know what normal life is like. I'd like to have someone, a friend maybe, who cares about me enough to help me - not doing anything in particular, but just so I am not alone and don't get into states of distress like this. Jac cares and does her best but she has hardly any time as it is.
I believe I deserve to be hated and left because I am so bad for what I am doing and it is so shameful.
One of these days maybe that time someone predicted will come and I will have a medical emergency but I won't be calling for an ambulance. I won't be doing anything.
Karen
Just trying to work out how many pills and laxatives I've taken in the last 24 hours.
I know I've taken over 50 laxatives so something should happen soon [:I]. Think I have taken 6 or 7 Xenical pills too but not sure anymore. I don't even care. Just need to feel empty again and make myself suffer.
Now K's forum has gone down again :(:(:(:(:(
Karen hun stop stop stop.... you are doing all the things that you know mke you worse, your thinking is distorted today, you are exhausted and distraught... please please please try to take some care of yourself and turn this around...
You know how to do it, please reach deep within and pull yourself out if you possibly can.
You are such a special person and so many people really really care but just don't know how to help and it makes people feel so helpless and sad.....
((((((KAREN))))))
Still thinking of you - please take care
Loads and loads of love and hugs
Aunty Fee xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Hi Karen,
I agree with Fee, please stop and look after yourself. It really scares me to read how many pills/laxatives you've taken. Even obese people only need 3 xenical a day, any more is really harmful, in fact any at all are probably harmful for you as you don't need them. I really don't want a medical crisis happening to you but the way you're going I dread to think where all this will end if I'm honest. And don't apologise for saying all this or for causing concern, but yes we are concerned because we care about you, and we feel sad and we feel frustrated and helpless.
I really want to help but I don't know how, I am way out of my depth. Right now I feel rough, quite low and edgy and have so much of my own to deal with, yet if I could help you I would. If I lived closer I'd happily come and spend time with you but I don't and can't sadly.
Karen I know it's hard (especially weekends) but the effort has to come from within you somewhere, I know somewhere in you is still a strong determined young woman, use that determination to turn this around, you have done it before. You know what you're currently doing isn't helping you, it doesn't does it? look how distressed it makes you feel. You have got back on track before and you can again but you have to stop what you're currently doing, you really have to. Try and start by binning the xenical and then make a plan to cut back on the laxatives. Set yourself small goals, however small, achieving something spurs you on. It doesn't even matter if it is a step backwards initially as long as it's working towards an achieveable goal, small steps all count.
Sorry I can't help more, and I don't mean to be harsh but I want to help.
Thinking of you.
Big hugs,
Lisa x
Hi Fee and Lisa
I know I am not thinking rationally and I am totally exhausted after being up all last night, but this crisis is more than that.
Fee: I did try to avoid doing this again today. I can identify the triggers but they are overwhelming me emotionally right now and this is my attempt to cope with it, or rather to block out those distressing and painful feelings.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">so many people really really care but just don't know how to help and it makes people feel so helpless and sad.....</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I am so aware of that every time I post and I think I shouldn't be saying these kinds of things here, but selfishly I need the support of my friends. I've tried eating disorder (recovery focused) forums before but it leads to more obsessing and focusing on food, and not wanting to eat. So I am sorry that I drop all of this on you guys.
Lisa: I do know that no one here has any experience or expertise on eating disorders and although I am looking for answers, I don't expect them to come from you. The support is what helps me get through the day - maybe not always very safely, but I survive it.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">It really scares me to read how many pills/laxatives you've taken. Even obese people only need 3 xenical a day, any more is really harmful, in fact any at all are probably harmful for you as you don't need them. I really don't want a medical crisis happening to you but the way you're going I dread to think where all this will end if I'm honest.</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Well if I am honest is scares me too but probably for different reasons. I don't want to end up in hospital. I'll be completely cut off from everyone and having a medical crisis caused by self harming behaviours like these could end up with me being given no choice but to go for inpatient treatment. That's the last thing I want.
But it is so hard to describe the driving force behind an eating disorder. The more times in a week I binge the more severe the punishments are becoming. I can't believe I managed 6 days of not bingeing last week and now this is my third this week. So now I really do feel like I've failed and need to dish the punishment out to myself.
In fact, I am trying so hard to resist using any more laxatives or pills today. I don't feel I have been ill enough yet, although maybe I've not yet had the reaction of the second lot of laxatives I took.
It just seems like I've taken a lot of Xenical because yesterday has run into today and I started bingeing so early this morning.
Lisa, if this is too much coming onto my post and reading this then please don't do it. I completely understand that you are struggling too and have enough of your own worries to deal with. I do not want to add to them in any way. We can still chat on your post.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">If I lived closer I'd happily come and spend time with you but I don't and can't sadly.</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Ahh that's so sweet and kind of you Lisa. I think this is what I need at present and I know I am not the only person who has no contact with their family, but I am making myself worse every day and to have someone take over for a while, to care and to be with me so I am not always alone woul
(((((KAREN))))))
I'm glad that you do feel supported by us even though there is so little we can do.. I feel I have so little to offer anyone in the way of support - I feel I have been keeping myself together by the skin of my teeth, but i just HAVE to for M&S's sake.... Surprisingly at the moment I'm not doing too badly considering but I am aware of being very vulnerable myself.
I think I do understand the force that is driving you, although I have never been in your position. Somehow I feel that force is driving you into a worse crisis because that is the only way you will get the help you need.... I think you will understand what I mean? But at the end of the day it will always be down to you to drag yourself back to a manageable position and it will be bloody hard work. Whenever I can support you I will. It is a long haul to recovery, whatever route you take, but as I have said before, somehow I KNOW you can do it. What help you get will vary but it will be YOU that does it.
I have felt as alone as you - after I split up with my ex and he wouldn't speak to me, Mark was seeing a girl who didn't like me and there was one year when I only spoke to him about 4/5 times. I had no money for counselling, I really didn't get on with my mum (I think I have mentioned my childhood) and she was still married and living in Bexhill and really couldn't have cared less and I had no friends having moved to Brighton with my ex only 2/3 years before. I lost my home and had to start from scratch working when I wasn't well enough (ME and anxiety etc like now), a 'dodgy' mortgage - well I could go on and on about how bad it was. I was very nearly sectioned twice (a neighbour actually got me through those occasions - I hardly knew her). I really was quite 'deranged' with very confused thoughts and panic and anxiety that overwhelmed me. I lost over 2 stone (but didn't want to go back to the bulimia of my 20s so fought it).
All that was nearly 10 years ago and I have struggled to get to where I am now and it is very precarious with all that is happening again in my life. Perhaps the only difference is that I did not have social anxiety - I could appear to be very confident and even happy to a group of people even when my world was falling apart... most strange, but also it meant that I got no sympathy or support from anyone because no-one believed how bad I felt most of the time....
I'm saying all that because I can honestly and truthfully say though is that you sound so much like me - you have the ability to analyse behaviour and think things through in a similar way to me. You know and understand what is going on and what you need to do, but something in you is not allowing you to do it, not accepting that you truly deserve to feel better. You are turning the anger and pain on yourself (as I did) and are angry and frustrated with yourself instead of feeling sorry for yourself (there's nothing wrong with that sometimes if you have had a hard time) and being kind to yourself. You are floundering and struggling with the pain of your childhood and the loneliness that you are experiencing at the moment and the awful distorted view you have of yourself - and I'm not just talking about your weight which is obviously only symbolic of your dislike of yourself. But you WILL come through it - I really believe it. You have to go back to basics again - and again if necessary.
Nobody else will be able to do this for you - people can only help and support you to do it yourself. As I have begun to get better and treat myself better, people have begun to like me more and help me more. Sadly that's the way of things.
I still have no real family, I do my best to get on with my mum although the resentment is still lurking underneath, and I adore and am over-attached to Mark although I try desperately to control it and hope he never ends up like me. But I also have glimpses of myself as a strong and clever and loving person which I am AND SO ARE YOU!
I think I would be reading your book much faster or jump to the bit on how the lady started getting better.
I sometimes wonder if sheer blo*dy boredom is exacerbating this condition. We all need to have a reason to get up in the morning and we need to have some sort of routine to the day. In that respect attending the clinic is good but you need to find an interest something that absorbs you for hours at a time or even minutes at a time.
I think your goals should be narrowed right down to reducing the amount of different medications you are taking. I would work out what you have been taking the last week and half it! Only allow yourself this amount of tablets to help you with your condition and NO MORE!
I hate to say this mate but you are going have to show some self disipline somewhere along the line or the consequences don't bear thinking about.
I also think despite how crap you feel you could start your course - you are spending far too much time on the self at the moment and while that is good for us all from time to time too much makes us introspect and rather selfish.
I know when I am totally self absorbed with my panics I can forget that other people have real issues - this has been brought home to me very sharply recently.
Is there any mileage in trying to contact your family and see if you can't make up??
I know these issues are longstanding and have a bearing on how you are now but maybe resolving your family difficulties may give you some closure on it.
We are all a product of our past but sometimes it gets easier to keep lumping it all back to this rather than taking the problem on and dealing with it. I know your parents have hurt you very badly in the past but this is not the answer!!!
I do hope you manage the meet tomorrow :D
Love Piglet xx
"Supposing a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?" said Piglet.
"Supposing it didn't," said Pooh after careful thought.
Hi Karen,
Told you those two were wise didn't I, some good advice there.
I can't add to that so I will add a huge ((((((((((((((hug)))))))))))))))).
Love Lisa x
I am beginning to think that I am being a destructive influence here and I should stop this post now before I do any further damage. I'm all too aware Piglet of how selfish my problems can make me and I focus inwards too much at the expense of other people.
Writing here what I am doing to myself is not fair when we are all struggling with different issues, but if I become physically ill it is entirely my own fault and I don't want to be responsible for being the cause of so much concern.
Fee: I do know how much you are dealing with at present and it constantly amazes me how well you are managing and the inner strength you find to help you carry on. The situation with Mark and Sarah in itself would be a big challenge for anyone to deal with and that's without the other difficulties you are working on.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">I think I do understand the force that is driving you, although I have never been in your position. Somehow I feel that force is driving you into a worse crisis because that is the only way you will get the help you need.... I think you will understand what I mean?</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Umm not sure I do understand what you mean. I do recognise there are aspects of my problems which keep me stuck and I get so far and then fall right back again. I know one reason for this but am not sure whether we are talking about the same thing here.
At various times different people have said I have the inner strength to pull myself through this but right now I can honestly say I feel about as hopeless for any future than at my worst times in the past. Those times led to desperate actions, although I was rather naive then about what would work.
Those times after you split with your ex do sound about as bad as things get and I feel I have been teetering on that edge for some time now. Some of our experiences are similar, as in the isolation, losing your home and some of the family stuff.
Various people, like K for instance, is very quick to tell me when my thoughts stray too far into the delusional and irrational side of things, and I know she is currently concerned about my mental and physical health again because she specifically asked for my contact details.
I do have a lot of insight into my difficulties, which is mainly from what I have learned over the past couple of years. It is like I do know in my rational mind that all these pills and laxatives are just going to make things worse in the long run, and I am petrified of being dragged off to hospital by being sectioned (as it is the only way they would get me there). BUT even though I know all of this I am still not able to stop. The driving force which is currently focusing on it being essential that I lose weight is currently winning.
It is true that I don't believe I deserve to treat myself well and I absolutely believe I deserve the punishment I am dishing out to myself. I've been doing it in one way or another all my adult life. My parents no longer needed to punish me because I have learned very well how to do it to myself - and the more pain and damage I cause myself then the better - because I do deserve it.
[quote]<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">You are turning the anger and pain on yourself (as I did) and are angry and frustrated with yourself instead of feeling sorry for yourself (there's nothing wrong with that sometimes if you have had a hard time) and being kind to yourself. You are floundering and struggling with the pain of your childhood and the loneliness that you are experiencing at the moment and the awful distorted view you have of yourself - and I'm not just talking
Thought I'd better start a new post to reply to you Piglet but I am really not sure I know what to say, for once.
I am so tired today I can barely focus on this screen let alone anything else. I prefer to keep books to read for when I am at the clinic, as there is nothing else to do at lunchtimes.
Maybe everything you say is right. I don't have any hobbies, or a routine when not attending the clinic. But more than that, I don't have a reason to get up in the morning. My life feels like being in a vacuum and there is nothing and no one in my life.
The despair of how I feel generally is causing the deterioration of my eating disorder and therefore the use of the pills and laxatives. It is the only way I can cope.
There are also other things going on in my life at the moment which are compounding all of this and they are out of my control completely. There is nothing I can do to change any of those things and I shouldn't want to and so I have even more reason to punish myself.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Is there any mileage in trying to contact your family and see if you can't make up??</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
None whatsoever. I cannot handle trying with mum and being rejected and pushed away again. All my ilife I have tried to be 'good enough' for her to love me but nothing was ever good enough. I am not good enough.
As for Dad, the consensus of opinion is that it would be detrimental to go back now. If I did try to repair our relationship I would have to go back on bended knees and beg for forgiveness. I would have to be the obedient and loyal daughter he wants me to be, ie to do whatever he says without question.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">We are all a product of our past but sometimes it gets easier to keep lumping it all back to this rather than taking the problem on and dealing with it. I know your parents have hurt you very badly in the past but this is not the answer!!!</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
I hope it doesn't come across like this because if anything I internalise what's happened and I blame myself. If only I could be the person my parents want me to be then everything would be alright. If only I could be good enough... but when I am told they wish I had never been born then I also internalise that too and it reinforces my belief that I don't deserve to live.
Lisa: Thanks for the hug.
I thinik maybe I should give you all a break from having to read about my terrible behaviour and the bad things I do - which confirm my selfishness and badness.
I am sory if I have been the cause of anyone feeling worse.
Karen xx
I have deleted my post as I will worry about my reply.
Please try and take care of yourself
Tara xxx
It comes over to me like your parents have hurt you and this is your way of hurting them back - but that seems so sad because the only person you are hurting is you.
Karen try and leave them behind then and focus on giving the love you have outwards to other more deserving causes!!!
I think like many of us you need to be needed - there are just so many ways of dealing with this need. Do some volunteer work of some sort - giving something satisfies a basic human emotion in us that is more satisfying to some than to others (I also like to be needed)!!!
My mum is a loner by preference but she does do volunteer work for just a few hours a week - this in itself is enough to give her a sense of purpose and value.
We all have a purpose to being here and skills and qualities to share - rather than finding a million reasons why this is not possible have a look at what the benefits would be. You would be busy being useful and have a great opportunity to expand your friendship circle.
Please do keep posting mate - we want to help but we honestly can't really answer some of the posts you do by just saying "Oh well hope you feel better tomorrow all the time". Tomorrow has come so what now???????
If we think we can't then we won't - if we think we can then we will!!!!!
I will keep on at you until you get better :D:D:D:D
Love Piglet xxx
Karen hun it's ok to post here as far as I'm concerned - no-one HAS to read it and speaking for myself I will step back if I have to - because I have to take care of myself. So if I read and answer it's MY CHOICE and MY RESPONSIBILITY... OK?!!!:D
The most important thing is that you have to believe that just because your parents were rubbish (and many parents are despite popular consensus) it does NOT mean they were right. If they were inadequate and in capable of giving you a loving childhood and feelings of security, love, protection and self-worth it does NOT mean you cannot ever learn to give yourself those feelings.... I too felt like that for years, but truthfully do not any more. There is hope.
The bit you didn't understand in my post was my poor way of putting things. I just meant that the force you are feeling is self destructive and driving you to the thing you fear most - hospitalisation - which may in fact end up being the only way you get the help you need... which I know you do not want to hear. But if you seek to punish yourself then that would be the punishment you feared most? Sometimes when we hit our worst fear that is when we can begin to heal. It doesn't have to go that way but you have to stop punishing yourself hun.
Any positive thing you can do for yourself tonight can be a stepping stone....
I really hope that you are able to come tomorrow, but if not then of course we can meet up for a cuppa when you come to brighton some time... [8D]
((((((KAREN)))))))
Hang in there hun.
Loads of love n hugs
Aunty Fee xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Hi Karen,
I'm so glad Piglet and Fee know what to say and they make alot of sense to me. I have to be honest I am struggling to know what to say to help right now. That doesn't mean I don't care though, I do alot.
You're not bad, you are a good person. Just because your parents said bad things in the past, doesn't make those things true, the problem was with them not with you. I can understand why all that affected you so much, it would anyone though.
I was reading my CBT book earlier and it was talking about self esteem and core beliefs. I expect you have heard of core beliefs but basically they are things that we have believed to be true from early in our lives, however just because we believe them doesn't make them true at all.
It gives an example of a lady who believes she is bad and it gets her to change her thoughts from "I am bad" to "there are good things about me". She also feels a failure and changes that though to "I succeed at some things" and so on. This is not about positive thinking, it's about generating more realistic opinions about yourself. The lady in the example also had a bad childhood and she was asked to change her thoughts in the following way:
" My father said and did some bad things but HIS bad behaviour doesn't mean that I am bad" You can replace this with my mum or whatever and fit it to your situation.
This seems pretty basic CBT, but it says that if these thoughts are challenged enough in time new beliefs CAN be developed and be believed. Initially you will not believe the new core beliefs, it will take alot of practice of course.
Anyway I hope you have a better night and do make it to the meet tomorrow.
Night night, thinking of you.
Lisa x
Just reiterating tonights texts as I think you may need to hear it again :)
<center>WE CARE ABOUT YOU BECAUSE YOU ARE WORTH CARING ABOUT !!!!!</center>
Like I told you imagine your duvet is a Nomorepanic hug :D:D:D of top TOG value!!!!!
Night night mate.
Love Piglet xx
Thank you all for the messages but am just going to say goodnight at the moment because now is not the best time for me to reply calmly and rationally.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">It comes over to me like your parents have hurt you and this is your way of hurting them back - but that seems so sad because the only person you are hurting is you.
<div align="right">Originally posted by Piglet - 06 May 2006 : 21:45:23</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Just had to say that I don't believe I am trying to punish them. The only person I want to punish is myself.
Lisa: I've read some of that CBT stuff before and it is very true. K suggests I keep repeating "I'm OK" as much as I can during the day to start to break the belief I have that I am bad.
Sorry, to tired to write anything else tonight.
Karen xx
hey karen,
how r u feelin 2day?? just been catchin up!!! wish u lived nearer me!!! why do u want to punish yourself hun??? you have done nothin wrong!!! and dont u ever feel like you cant come on here and spill out everything your feelin- no matter how bad or upsettin it is!! you obviously havin so much goin on in your head- mayb it would help to get absolutly everythin out!!! we are all very concerned about u and these pills hun, i know it must feel like we are havin a go, we all care for u and dont want... well you know what could happen!!!!
you may have explained before but why dont u wanna go into hospital and get some help of them?? i wanna know wot this clinic is playin at??? so dont they realise how sad u r at the moment??
i hope things get better for u hun- i really do!! please dont stop talkin to us!!! well thats it from me for now!!!
((((((((karen)))))))))))
Ammegxxx
Hi Karen,
I hope you got some sleep and that you and your tummy feel better today.
I haven't looked anywhere else yet to see if you went to the meet today, I hope you were able to.
You may not want to read my latest post as I have ranted about my weight today, just a warning, sorry. I try to never mention it, really I do, but sometimes I just need to let it out! I get affected by reading other peoples posts sometimes so I try not to do that to others where possible.
I really hope you can feel a bit better about things today and start to cut down all those pills and laxatives.
I was reading a bit about eating disorders earlier, in my attempt to try and help and understand more, and came across a clinic in eastbourne (not sure if that's the one you go to or not, it's probably a different one) but it had an account on it's website of a patient that got better with in patient treatment. What was described wasn't bad sounding at all. She was not force fed, it even said they realise this doesn't work and makes things worse. Of course she was encouraged to eat but they worked on treating her eating disorders and the underlying problems. She had alot of CBT which really helped and other therapies. She was not locked in, could even have left if she had wanted to. As she improved she spent the odd weekend at home, she was allowed to keep in touch with people while in there too. When she left (after about 6 weeks I think) she had follow up outpatient appts with them to make sure she was coping at home and the main thing, she did recover! So to me that didn't sound so bad at all, not if the end result is recovery or at least a dramatic improvement. Even she admitted that she got more help by being in there as all the approaches were integrated, rather than just addressing the odd one thing here and there that happens with outpatients. I know you are scared of inpatient treatment sis, and I do understand really, but if it is like I've described would it really be that bad, if it helped you recover and get better? and if you could keep in touch with people etc. Surely six weeks is nothing compared to the misery you currently face every day? I do fear the way you're going that you will end up being admitted at some point, especially with what you do with the pills, surely it would be better to voluntarily go in to somewhere like I describe rather than being sectioned and forced into hospital, even if you are only forced due to a medical crisis from the pills? As I think Fee said once, nothing will be as bad as what you are feeling right now anyway. The only other option is to really turn this around for yourself, stop the pills, start eating a bit more, getting private CBT etc. You are not a failure if you can't do that either, most people would need some extra professional help in order to do this and you have lots of other issues to solve.
Sorry if I'm being harsh and speaking out of line, I don't mean to but I do really want you to get some help, you so clearly need it sis. K would agree too I think? Sorry if this upsets you Karen, I hope you know that is never my intention.
In the meantime I will send you a big ((((((((((hug))))))))))
Love Lisa x
Thank you Ammeg and Lisa for your posts. I am replying just so you know I am around but I still am too worried about the effect my posts are having and so am not really saying much at present.
Ammeg: You are very kind and I have explained several times about the fear I have of psychiatric hospitals. I'll try to search out one of my old explanations when I get a chance rather than repeating it all again.
Lisa: I do understand that everything that is said here is because you are my friends and are concerned about me. I do feel like these posts are going round in circles, which is my fault for not being able to see reason. I am not at all offended by what you've written.
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">I was reading a bit about eating disorders earlier, in my attempt to try and help and understand more, and came across a clinic in eastbourne (not sure if that's the one you go to or not, it's probably a different one) but it had an account on it's website of a patient that got better with in patient treatment. What was described wasn't bad sounding at all.<div align="right">Originally posted by LJ - 07 May 2006 : 14:17:31</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
Yes, this is the clinic I attend and it was that article which convinced me this would be the right kind of place to get the treatment I was looking for. As is now obvious though, what is on the website and what happens in reality are not necessarily the same things.
This is the link in case anyone else is interested:
http://www.eastbourneclinic.com/eating_disorder_study.html
I think (or hope) you can now see that things are not always as they seem and the clinic has not been like this at all in my experience.
Unfortunately I was not well enough to make the meet up Lisa. In fact, I am not sure if anyone actually made it.
Karen xx
Hi Karen
Sorry you couldn't make it today - it would have been so lovely to meet you - you know Sax apparently - she went to Alton Towers? I met her and Shiv who is lovely but that's all we could find....
We are def. up for doing it again and I will make sure it is well organised and you WILL be there hun!!!!
Might aim for the beginning of June....
Hope today is not too bad - I will look at that site (cos I'm nosey [:I]) and will just say again that you can post what you want - we are all grown ups and don't have to read if we don't want hun!!!!!!
Hope you aren't too bad today....
(((((KAREN)))))
Loads of love n hugs
Aunty Fee xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Thank you Fee.
Yes Sax and I travelled to the last Alton Towers trip together! Will have to see about the next one I was disappointed in myself that I didn't make it today as I'd have loved to have met you.
Best not say too much about today other than that.
Karen xx
Karen just been looking at that site... are you sure that's the same place? [:O][:O][:O]
I can't believe it... it's outrageous misrepresentation, I think you must have some recourse - your treatment has been NOTHING like they claim... It's made me livid reading it!!!
Grrrr better not start ranting, I'm sure it's not helpful for you xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
btw Sax is lovely eh?!!!
Fee xxxxxx
www.like2like.com
Why live life anticipating the bad things when you could be anticipating the good?
Good and bad things WILL happen!
Hi Fee
<b id="quote">quote:</b id="quote"><table border="0" id="quote"><tr id="quote"><td class="quote" id="quote">Karen just been looking at that site... are you sure that's the same place? [:O][:O][:O]
I can't believe it... it's outrageous misrepresentation, I think you must have some recourse - your treatment has been NOTHING like they claim... It's made me livid reading it!!!
<div align="right">Originally posted by feege - 07 May 2006 : 18:17:52</div id="right">
</td id="quote"></tr id="quote"></table id="quote">
It is shocking that they can advertise like that when the treatment offered is nothing like the claims they are making. I am glad Lisa found the site and mentioned it (thanks sis :D) as now maybe it will highlight why I have been so disappointed with the lack of help I've received there.
Keep hoping the situation will improve.
Karen xx
Just popping by to say goodnight :)
Love Piglet x
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