Mental strength

[ladybird64]

Weird title, let me explain (now that I've decided where to post this at last! :wacko:)

Quick history. A mixture of Panic Attacks, Agoraphobia and Anxiety for more than 25 years, probably longer.

I went on meds (Citalopram) for 6 months last year after having taken nothing before, felt wonderfully better and decided to stop them cold turkey in October, felt awful for a while then side effects stopped.

I have noticed a gradual remergence of old anxieties, very gradual. I am aware of what helped me while I was taking meds and have continued to believe that this is the way forward for me while I'm not on meds.

I have had a couple of PA's recently, not pleasant but I'm still standing.

What I have noticed though is just how good my brain is at storing every bad thing that has happened connected with my past panicky experiences! The places where it happened (every one of them :lac:), the feelings that one gets when the panic starts to rise, the sensations of helplessness, the very same thought processes that I had before.

All these sensations and feelings, every last one are EXACTLY the same as before, right down to the last detail.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with my mind, it is as sharp as a damn pin. It is feeding off information that it has, that I have provided it with.
It has taken that information and provided me with worst case scenarios, avoidence strategies the lot.

And this is only in the past week because I had a flash of the old panic!

I'm going to try and come at this from another angle, the "it doesn't matter" angle. The other day when I had the Panic I spent an hour before I left the house debating (just like I used to :doh:) on whether I should get the bus to where I needed to go (not a problem for me) or make the effort to walk and possibly face a panic. This internal debate lasted until I reached the bus stop when I decided that no, I shouldn't avoid, I should walk.
And yep, the inevitable happened. Which is not surprising because I had kind of worked myself up into a mild frenzy of what I SHOULD do.
Pressure on me built up over an hour and a half and an inevitable conclusion, a feeling of failure and a very strong sense of deja-vue.

I'm not going to do that again. If I want to get the bus I will, if I don't feel like doing something I won't do it. It's not avoidance because there is a part of my brain that knows I CAN do it and did it sucessfully for months last year, I went to places that had terrified me for years, went on trains, conquered so many of my nightmares because I finally stopped trying to fight with my own mind.

I haven't lost it, it's not a "blip" (grrr), it's still there in my mind. Nothing has changed except I have let my memory of anxiety and panic take charge again..briefly.

I think it's time I used that amazing mental strength that I think we all have somewhere (although it may not feel like it) and put it to good use.

Dealing with panic and anxiety in my way on my terms. :yesyes:

I feel better for getting all that down, sorry if it's bored you:flowers:

[cookie10]

It didn't bore me in the slightest, it's an amazing post, and I think that you have summed up anxiety perfectly ! Good luck to you ladybird, I''m sure with your poisitive attitude, you will be kicking anxiety's bum straight out of the door before long :)

[snowgoose]

thank you for this post.

I have had similar experience this week...........after a fairly good couple of years ............the old demons came back with a vengeance and I did the same and went for the hard option. I knew I had gone too far for comfort and ended up ....well I dont need to say to all reading:blush: panic and tears .
the hard wiring in my head is entrenched with so much upset. so for the meantime I will be gentle with myself ...........do stuff that might help new neural pathways to send packing this learned behaviour ...........and yes perhaps avoid challenging myself too much while I try to heal yet again .
send my empathy to all reading
it is horrible ........but we will all get there .we will.
cos we have found this forum AND ARE DOING SOMETHING POSITIVE . XXX

[KK77]

You know I share a lot of your views on panic/anxiety and I've always admired your sheer bloody-mindedness to get through everything life throws at you. Sometimes, I really do think it's as simple as this. Stoicism has got me through both mental and physical pain.


I'm not going to do that again. If I want to get the bus I will, if I don't feel like doing something I won't do it. It's not avoidance because there is a part of my brain that knows I CAN do it and did it sucessfully for months last year, I went to places that had terrified me for years, went on trains, conquered so many of my nightmares because I finally stopped trying to fight with my own mind.


This is self-preservation Angie. We don't step in a puddle because we know it's silly to do it. We know we could and it wouldn't kill us but we don't because it's not constantly on our minds. If someone dared us to do it then things change, and it's rather like this situation you describe - almost daring yourself to face your fears. Look at it like this and it becomes somewhat clearer: your mind and body are fighting each other over this dare because it perceives danger - whether it's real or not is not the issue. It's not failure LB and you're only be heaping pressure on yourself if you try to force body and mind when it's not ready. As you've said, you've done it in the past and will do it again - when you're over this nasty *ahem*.

You have the right ideas as usual.

[suzannacorfu]

Hi LB, long time no speak :((

You're a strong, strong woman. Don't stress it!! It took me years to realise that the things that caused me panic were the things I hated doing anyway BEFORE Panic ever arrived!!! The things I LOVE doing are no problem to me. Obviously motivation plays an important part. So yes I agree with you: on our terms!! There i one supermarket here that I just CAN'T get the hang of. I get the jitters EVERY time. But I am fine in all the others. So, instead of beating myself up about it and making myself face that supermarket I just shop in the other. There was a time when I couldnt go into any of them so just one "no-go" area is fine with me.
Hugs
Suz

[JaneC]

Ladybird :hugs:. I posted not so long ago saying that while I haven't had a PA in more than a year after going on Prozac, I still get the "what ifs" on probably a daily basis.

Indeed, the mind is very good at remembering things you want it to forget (as opposed to things like 'why did I come into this room again?' :doh:). I get a lot of the internal debate thing too but am perhaps getting better at just telling "it" to stop.

Slightly different thing but I'm having reasonable success with the "so what?" approach. I've always really hated feeling dizzy and it is something that has always made me panic. Now when I feel dizzy I just try to think, "so I feel a bit dizzy but so what, it's not going to do me any harm, so I'll just try to forget about it and hopefully it will pass".

Can tell I'm starting to ramble here but it's been a long day :emot-drool:.

It's tiresome having to deal with things again when you think you have got the better of them but it seems to the nature of the beast, and being aware of things creeping back makes them easier to nip in the bud, I think.

So, yes, you are a strong person and you will get a grip of these feelings, just as you have in the past, even if we could all do without having to do it over again. I KNOW you will get over this! xxx

[Magic]

Hi Angie.
I really do admire you. I wish I had your strength. I have a problem. I really am a person who cannot answers for people who patronise me,try to put me down.Sometimes I try to join in a conversation but am interupted or ignored. I was shouted at some relations house at Xmas for picking the wrong fork up,what the heck, does it really matter.And it goes on and on. It makes me feel down and turn to my meds.I consider myself a good person.But I just don't want to hurt anyones feeling if I speak up.
Bye for now

[ladybird64]

Thank you all for such lovely replies, it helps no end to know that what I said actually made sense to someone!

Well, you know how I ramble on and on.. :winks:


I just want to add a wee note for Helen.

You won't be interrupted or ignored here and you are a good, kind and thoughtful person as you have shown to me by the PM's that you sent when I was low.

And I'm sure we couldn't give a rats a**e about what fork you use. :D

[Magic]

Ahh Ange you are such an Angel,
I'm just in the process of typing out instructions for my husband how to work the central heating :lac:and sticking it in the boiler. No matter what I tell him he gets it wrong.There is nothing the matter with his memory,he just won't listen. I say to him what will you do if I drop dead.he says he would not bother!!! with the heating I mean:wacko: Take Care

[eternally optimistic]

What a fab post - thank you.

Good luck, and lots of it.

[shoegal]

Fab post. It was interesting that you improved whilst on anti-depressants as to date none of the meds I have tried have given me any respite from the attacks. It would be so lovely to be free of the attacks for a while! :)

[Chem]

You know the saying "you never forget how to ride a bike"........... For 25+ years your brain has been thinking about anxiety and panic as a response to stressors.

Stressors aren't stress, they are the points at which you make the decision how to react - whether or not to take the step up onto the bus or train. We all need them - they motivate all our behaviour, from why we get up in the morning to not stepping in puddles.

Your brain has been trained to overide consideration of the possible outcomes of how you react to the stressors. "Panic first, think later". You know the situations that make you feel anxious, so you can retrain your brain.

Fighting yourself won't help, because it will just reinforce your brain's reaction that you are in a bad situation. You need to try to "Think first, (maybe) panic later" and eventually you won't panic at all. Thinking means accepting your limitations, and not beating yourself up for what you can't do yet. You've come miles in a short time. It's going to take a while longer to overcome 25+ years of entrenched behaviour.

You have great insight, strength and determination. You'll do it!!!!!!! xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

[SueBee]

Tut Mrs :lac:

Why does it matter how you get from A to B? Surely the fact you got there by whatever means is a huge achievement! Also you managed to ignore the old panic symptoms and get to where you wanted to be - Well done LadyBirdyButt!!

JFDI - you did it!!

:hugs: