CBT very upsetting and REALLY confused over what I'm supposed to do

[harasgenster]

Hi
Sorry for so many posts in a day, I'm going through a bad patch. I decided to have another look into CBT today to see if I can get through this rough time. I went on livinglifetothefull.co.uk (which has been redesigned and is much better than it was) and did a thing about unhelpful thinking. I'd done this before, where you put down an event - the thoughts you had - how it made you feel - what physical feelings you had - what behaviours it caused.

I understand how the exercise is supposed to help, but when I wrote down all my thoughts they made me feel very upset and then the module didn't explain very well how to challenge them and now I'm just very upset and very confused.

The thoughts I wrote down were ones that happened when my bf mentioned getting very drunk at a bar his ex managed when he was going out with her. He was boasting about it to his friends and remembering it as a really good time.

My key upsetting thoughts were:

1) He is disappointed that he is with me and not with someone like his ex
2) I wouldn't like him getting drunk like that and wouldn't be going out with him if he did that often, so he now cannot behave the same way as he did with his ex when he is with me – he cannot be himself with me because I would not like it – I have trapped him and he is unhappy
3) I am not a proper woman and it is impossible that he will ever love me like he has other women.
4) He misses his ex and is sad that he's not with her anymore and he won't see her again. He was happier then than he is now.

There were loads more but I think these are the main ones. I recognise that these thoughts are examples of jumping to conclusions or mind reading but I don't understand how that's supposed to make me feel better.

How do I challenge the thoughts? I genuinely think they're true and there's no way of knowing if they're not. I wouldn't ask him because he'd be upset and he'd lie to stop me from being upset. And then, what if I convince myself out of these thoughts but they are actually true - won't I just be deluded and stupid/naive?

This is the major problem I've struck with CBT each time I do it. It makes me more upset because it reminds me of these thoughts and I really can't see how I'm supposed to believe that they're not true. Some of them obviously aren't but some of them really could be.

I got much worse last time I did a CBT course and then got better once I'd been away from it for a while. Now I'm looking at it again I feel worse. It's not that I don't think CBT will help, I think it will, but I feel like I don't have the expertise. It feels like I'm opening wounds and then not understanding what I'm supposed to do to help them heal, so I just end up getting worse.

[robinhall]

Hi

My name is Robin Hall - I am a Cognitive Therapist - very sorry to hear that you first experiences with CBT have been problematic. It is actually very hard to give advice in one reply but I hope some of the points below may be of some help - Please PM me if you need to go over anything

It is very understandable that you got upset writing all this down - It brings up all the emotion and you are absolutely right, if it’s not clear how to restructure these thoughts you seem to be left with an open wound which can be very distressing indeed.

If I only tell you that your boyfriend is probably not thinking all those things that might help reassure you for about 2 minutes but then the fear may come back - if not now then some other time.

So lets look at both sides

It actually IS possible that he isn’t thinking ANY of these things that you fear. You really can’t absolutely know 100% that he is disappointed that he is with you. The fact is he IS with you so that is strong evidence that he does want to be with you.

He MAY feel deep down that even though in the past he enjoyed such nights - he prefers to be as he is NOW - with YOU - and possible enjoying that much more. I think most of us can look back and smile at such times but feel VERY glad that we don’t do it now and sometimes its nice when we are with someone who helps us be a bit more stable and grounded.

There is no such thing as not being a ‘proper woman’- how could we define such a thing. If a close friend said this to you about herself what would you tell her. Imagine talking to a friend and actually saying the words you would say. Whatever you would tell your close friend TELL YOURSELF :-)

Not only could it be possible that he could love you like other women - but he could even love you MORE - that is JUST as possible.

You may be completely ‘mind reading’ when you think he is missing his ex. None of us can ever know exactly what another person is thinking. He could miss her as we might miss anyone who was a friend but that doesn’t mean he would want to be with her. Again - the fact is he is with you.

But what if he IS unhappy in some way?
If he does have present concerns they may be to do with how he feels about HIMSELF inside - it may not be directly related to you. If he had never met you and was still with his ex he may still feel as he does because it is a certain time in his life, growing older, fear of the future, responsibilities and so on. We all can feel confused, anxious, down. He may simply be just the way he is because it’s just his time to be that way.

We can add a story on top of what we IMAGINE a person MIGHT be thinking. And if we are prone to anxiety that story is usually very exaggerated.

and finally - it is VERY useful to explore any deeper fears - because you sometimes find out that you CAN cope with those deeper fears and when you know that you feel a greater sense of underlying strength.

So -for example
MOST peoples fears in relationships are that they might LOSE the relationship because of one thing or another.

lets say a deeper fear was that if your boyfriend is unhappy then you might break up

the deeper fear might be “I don’t think I could cope with a break up / being single / rejection / and so on. Have a think about what your deeper fear might be

CBT uses a technique called the Downward Arrow technique

You start with the surface fear
“He is disappointed with me”

then you ask - why is that making you feel such a high level of distress
Possible answer “he will leave me”

and why is that so distressing
Possible answer “ because I will be depressed / terrified / on my own

Just consider the possibility that it is the DEEPER fear that is causing you such distress and NOT ONLY the surface level fears about your boyfriend. These deeper fears might surface in ANY relationship so it’s very helpful to uncover them and work on them.

HOW to deal with them - again QUESTION the evidence and come up with ALTERNATIVE answers to your fearful responses

Fear - “I absolutely cannot be happy without him in my life”
Can I absolutely know that that is true? No
I have been ok before him - I could be ok without him
For all I know I could be even happier - I simply can’t know for sure either way

Do I want to RELY on someone else for my happiness - No
Ok - then it is a good idea that I explore building my own sense of self
I can start appreciating ME myself for who I am without reference to someone else.

Write down 5 things everyday that you feel are GOOD about you and READ IT EVERY DAY
ie - I am a good friend
I like animals
I help people out
I care about others
and so on

try this now - list as many GOOD things about yourself as you can - it doesn’t have to be BIG things like helping starving people - ANYTHING at all - even small things. Read this every day

Read some books on strengthening your inner self.

Can I suggest that you practice MINDFULNESS - Mindfulness helps you ‘step back’ - it gives you tremendous strength when you are feeling overwhelmed. It allows you to let thoughts just BE thoughts without them pulling you in and causing you distress.


USEFUL QUESTIONS FOR RESTRUCTURING THOUGHTS

What would you tell a friend who was thinking the same thoughts

Could I be Mind Reading?

If I wasn’t ‘thinking’ these thoughts would I feel distressed? - So is it the THOUGHTS or an actual situation that is causing me the distress?

Even thinking about my worst fears - can I absolutely know for sure that I wouldn’t be able to cope?

Can I absolutely know that my life might wouldn’t turn out even BETTER?

Will I be thinking about this EXACT problem a month from now - a year - 5 years
It will pass - it always does

You can be ABSOLUTELY ok no matter what someone else is thinking in their own head. You don’t have to rely on someone elses opinion of you to be happy. belive in this for yourself - if you explore this you will feel less and less fear.

I hope this helps:)
Robin

[harasgenster]

With a little help from Robin, I did some more work and have begun to understand CBT a lot better. Just in case anybody who hasn't done CBT and thinks my initial post makes it sound scary, I thought I'd show the other side of it. This post (in the success section of the forum :) ) explains once I understood how to use the techniques I found at least one part of it very helpful - http://nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?p=807054#post807054

[Hazel B]

Robin has given excellent professional advice and I can't add to it or even begin to have his training and experience.

Please push to make sure you get CBT face to face as it could help you challenge your thoughts and get the guidance you need. You're torturing yourself right now and need to develop your own self-esteem and confidence before this gets too much.