View Full Version : The odds are against you in cyber help.
Scrubmuncher
02-04-11, 03:09
Been spending a lot of time with some of the top guys in the country specialising in panic/anxiety and fantasy thought. Over the time in hospital they put it go me that the majority of people involved in sites such as this/sobriety etc and the whole range of supposed self help cyber groups have led to worsening symptoms by only being cyber life, not real, no one is actually dealing with anything, only going through the concept that rarely gets played out. Infact all in all I was told if suffering seriously these sites are bad news long term, although on the contrary can be life savers on the short term.
Just a thought before building an imaginary group of friends, these are words of people who have investigated this entire online support for such a wide spectrum of possibilities.
eeyorelover
02-04-11, 03:42
I have been a member here for about 5 years and for me personally I don't think this holds true.
I truly believe that I'd still be completely housebound if I hadn't found this site!
The support and information I've received here made me want more for myself, made me push myself, and I knew that when I had a setback or a success that there were people who really did care and would support me.
I also believe that some members here feel that they can share their fears and issues more freely than they even could with a therapist because of the anonymity that the internet provides.
I have, however, heard some members say that they felt they needed to leave because they felt it would be better for them.
I also think that too much of any online activity could feed into someone's anxiety or more specifically how we tend to isolate ourselves a little bit at a time.
Creating one's own 'cyber world' and spending loads of time in it instead of facing one's fears and living in the real world would definitely be detrimental to one's mental health.
xxx
Sandy
If I hadn't have stumbled across this website I'd still be persuing my imaginary heart defect and I'd still be convinced I had something wrong with my heart and that I was about to drop dead at any minute.
Like eeyore said, it's a lifesaver in many cases, however, too much time and too much reliance on a website can feed your anxiety. Sometimes people need to leave this website for personal reasons, for instance, I class myself as having Health Anxiety, so sometimes it makes me a bit worse to read other peoples posts because I start to think "what if?" myself, but I know that's the time when I need to take a break, so I take one, as do the other people who have took a break or left the site.
I think it's a great support group, I've been here nearly a year now and I seriously don't know what I would have done without this site or the amazing people on it, I don't even want to imagine where I'd be right now! You have to treat it like anything else in life, take it in moderation, know yourself and know when you need to take a break. No More Panic will still be here when/if you feel ready to get back. xx
jessicalittler79
02-04-11, 05:06
i also been a member for 3 years and if it wasnt for the site i dont no were id be ....this place has careing ppl and i love it here
Personally, I find this site to be of immense help.
Agreed, there are times when I read posts which contain too much information for MY benefit, but this is no fault of the poster.
I believe that great comfort can be very beneficial to people like myself who live alone and are prone to panic at unexpected times of the day and night whenever anxiety symptoms attack us.
However, I agree that by reading posts on any anxiety related site, we are subconsciously 'saturating' our illness by feeding our minds more and more information about our/others problems. But, bare in mind that also by not reading about others illnesses and symptoms will not make our anxiety go away!
I conclude that although such websites can make some sufferers possibly worse by reading certain posts (especially hypochondriacs), I still support such places and if a site is run with a manner such as this one in particular, I for one will remain eternally grateful and proud to think that people have been kind enough to offer help and compassion to fellow sufferers, including myself. Which as far as I'm concerned is what this world should all be about, but sadly........ is not!
Horse.
:)no i tend to agree - sorry all but i have not made one friend from this site,but thats just me - i dont make friends easily, and i have kept a grip on reality the whole time i have used it - for some they will make friends they keep in touch with off the site, but for others how can anxiety and depression be the only thing you have in common? it helps to be able to talk about it though, but then i think most ppl arent so stupid to know deep down that actually they do have a seperate life off line that they have to deal with - alot of these so-called experts dont suffer and can be extremely patronising - we ourselves decide how much its helping - and sometimes you come to the realisation that yes i need to switch the computer off anf go and do something else - but also at times of great loneliness and distress this place can be the only place to find somebody to talk to who understands - for me that is what it does:hugs::yesyes:
if these these sites are so bad why you here or you just haveing a dig at people
and these so called top guys in the country did thay ever suffer
its like a lot of thing such as this works that dont what do people know who have never suffered NOTHING the mugs
Been spending a lot of time with some of the top guys in the country specialising in panic/anxiety and fantasy thought. Over the time in hospital they put it go me that the majority of people involved in sites such as this/sobriety etc and the whole range of supposed self help cyber groups have led to worsening symptoms by only being cyber life, not real, no one is actually dealing with anything, only going through the concept that rarely gets played out. Infact all in all I was told if suffering seriously these sites are bad news long term, although on the contrary can be life savers on the short term.
Just a thought before building an imaginary group of friends, these are words of people who have investigated this entire online support for such a wide spectrum of possibilities.
wheres the data from these top guys
Anxious_gal
02-04-11, 18:22
well I think there’s a lot of other factors involved, nothing is that black and white.
things such as what anxiety disorder a person has, personality types, if they are getting any medical or professional help in their real life etc.
One thing that is true to a degree is that yes I am guilty of talking more about getting better than actually getting better.
Factors for me where ZERO support in my real life at the time, plus my agoraphobia was quite bad.
I did take a break from here to focus more on my real life but that was because I had a tiny bit of support which motivated me into getting out more.
I have noticed that the more I get out, the more stuff I do in the real world, naturally I spend less time on the internet.
I think problems may arise when all your friends are online, where you get all your help and support from online groups.
But why would someone does this? Because they haven't gotten any help or support from anyone in the real world.
There are lots of lonely people out there who have virtually no one and for them the internet is a source of comfort and human interaction.
I will say this though that yes if you can find support in the real world like doctors, therapists, health professionals, support groups, friends then that will help you greatly but keep in mind that not everyone has that advantage.
But online help/support sites are there to offer people support, advice, friendship.
Personally I think the benefits outweigh the negatives.
the negatives again really depend on the persons personality and their situation. It’s not that the help sites directly make them worse it's how they are using the site and not seeking out or maybe they don't have the option of getting support from the real world.
There needs to be balance, too much of anything is not good for you.
I do find that people who have no direct experience of online support sites do tend to think they make people worse. I would love to actually do a study to see how the members of support sites actually feel about the support they get.
I dont believe that people would go on sites that didnt help them. I for one wouldnt be here if I didnt find it helped me. One of the best things about online sites is how it connects you with so many people who understand how you feel! So you dont feel so isolated anymore!
I for one have made a good friendship with a member of this site and we really help each other because we understand each other!
It's all in moderation as with everything else......
It's part of a support structure that everyone needs to build to their own requirements.
And as for imaginary friends - think that's somewhat different to ppl you meet on an internet site, unless I'm imagining the whole thing here?!
Lastly, I'll second London, where do they publish this 'study'?
Personally, I'll keep doing whatever helps me - and this site does ;)
No I actually think the original poster has a point. Once I'm cured of anxiety I rather not use any anxiety site.
To be out, socialising, seeking help from a therapist is the way. Stop talking about your condition is a must so very true. It's a habit with anxiety to seek help and reassurance sometimes in real life or on here. Long term it's not the solution. I admit I can relay too much on this site but I have started reading self help books and feel I'm progressing and now getting out more than I was.
Scrubmuncher
02-04-11, 21:00
Kind of got the responses I expected from some of the slightly less experienced or naive posters. Sticking up for a group or site that you really don't know, becoming defensive whe there is no need to go down that road. I have merely spoken an opinion, which by the way, was quite strongly fixed in my mind well before speaking to specialists. I've been around this kind of environment and so called specialists for over 20 years, in every kind of situation and attempted mothod of quashing the beasts, but they all have something in common, and that is not one thing works for everyone.
I have come across people on here that truely feel they have a group of friends on this website. Although you meet up in cyber space and have a good bit chinwag, it isn't a friendship. If it was a friendship you wouldn't be calling each other by false names, hiding yourself just on the offchance someone is a looney. You don't even call each other on the phone, I guess because you would have very little to say to one another, as you have nothing in common other than panic/anxiety, stress, don't pretend to yourself this is enough to build a relationship/friendship. It isn't, it is not even a support group. One thing you will notice more and nore as you read these forums is most posts start with 'I', or 'me'. Occasionally there is a 'Oh I am sorry for the way you feel', but you can be sure somewhere the poster will have to get across how bad their own experience is in comparrisson, or how bad it used to be.
I think falling for these sites as anything other than information, occasionally desperate to get something off your chest, or in dyer need to a few comforting words is rediculous. I use it to get things off my chest, even reading about someone else having a worse time can make me feel better that I'm not that bad. Whatever it is. But hanging around from morning till night like some of you will do, is not helping yourself, surrounding yourself with a community that is not a community is deluding and unreal. The circle of friends does not exist any more than it would do if you opened up a bokk written 10 years ago and read that.
Just remember that.
If I am wrong, then tell me last time you met up with someone from here, or you had a bad time and someone from here went to visit you, get your shopping etc. the usual things we can rely on from real existing support.
I'm not dissing anyone or trying to make anyone feel down, just grab a slice of reality, it may help your progression rather than the cycle of looking for it in the safety of a computer screen.
I have to disagree, I've chatted to many people on the phone from NMP, all of which I still ring, or they ring me to this day. I've also met a couple of people too and got on like a house on fire.
I'm not being defensive, just pointing out a fact from my perspective :)
I also have chatted on the phone to NMP people and mailed regularly, so friends can be made.
A therapist I saw also thought that sites such as these are the wrong direction. However, 3 sessions with her talking about past situations and she all but had me convinced that I had something or someone to blame for the anxiety/depression. I realised though that the big problem is not how situations or people affected me but how I reacted to those things. A case of you cant change people or the past but you can change how you feel about those things.
I have found useful information here on this site and comfort to know that people are not alone with their symptoms,fears and anxieties,but as some others have said..there are times to step back a while.
For me being around anxious people would make me more comfortable to suffer and put up with it. Not telling people about my anxiety and being around more laid back people means I tend to forget about anxiety.
My last therapist said if I wanted to visit a support group and I said no I was happy for one to one help and wanted to keep it private.
Anxiety is more open these days which is good. I know have the view I'm not "putting up with" and my aim is to be totally anxiety free.
Erm, did you read my post at all? If so, do I fit into your own imagined 'less experienced or naive' bracket? I haven't been here long and I have no special reason to defend the site, other than it works for me, I don't know many people here even.
The only person that seems to refer to hiding here is you. Some of the dictionary definitions you might find for 'friend' are:
1. a person attached to another by feelings of affection or personal regard.
2. a person who gives assistance; patron; supporter
3. a person who is on good terms with another; a person who is not hostile:
Doesn't seem to refer at all to how you try to define a friend, yet covers everything here that people are doing daily for each other. The fact that you believe the circle of friends that people have here does not exist any more than characters in an inanimate tome causes me concern for you, who do you think posts and chats here then?
I'm sorry, but you're last comment that you're not trying to make anyone feel down doesn't wash - why post it then? You knew the reaction you would receive posting such a one-sided view with no facts / evidence, on a forum that clearly has it's roots in mutual support and members kind enough to listen no matter what issue someone is facing. If you had perhaps worded your post seeking views or provided any evidence of how this might help people make more of an informed choice on how to use the site or what to post, I honestly believe you might have received some useful replies.
As I said, it's part of a structure. Not everything. Not a miracle cure. The fact that you find the idea of people posting here 'rediculous' (sic) is your issue really, and unless you have something constructive to add for them, you should keep that issue to yourself. Clearly you seem to have issues with the site and the way people use it - those alone are your issues, I would suggest that you take them up with admin if necessary in a private message and not post further where people already desperate for help may waste time on this thread.
Scrubmuncher
02-04-11, 21:48
Again, not getting my point. A handful hardly represents the majority, does it. I'm glad many of you do and have made friends, and I'm not calling out one stereotype over another. Only you know just how the site effects you, and if you would suffer should it exist.
Scrubmuncher.
Sir, I have met so called 'Guys and Girls at the Top' over the past 44 years as an Anxiety sufferer. I can only say that most of them did not have a clue as to the way Anxiety affects the individual as such. A large majority of us are NOT typical textbook cases because as individuals, we are all different with variable levels and severity of symptoms.
One thing I would add is that for the majority of the so called experts (that we wait months to see and in some cases, pay a considerable amount of money should we be able to afford their private fee), should you take away their prescription pad, they are stuffed!
Consequently, suffering as I have for this length of time has indeed made me an 'expert' or a 'guy at the top' as far as I am concerned and in several cases I have discovered that I know more about Anxiety in general than any of the so called 'professionals' that I have had the misfortune to visit!
Before I became as ill as I currently now am, I studied Psychology under Birkbeck College, London and one of the first things I was told was that no two Anxiety sufferers are normally the same. Also, it is considerably difficult to assess a patient because it is impossible to put into words what we are feeling or suffering or the way in which it affects us mentally or/and physically. Of all the people I have come to know on NMP, all of them have variable degrees of severity as regards Anxiety in general.
For most of us it is impossible to 'grab a slice of reality' because it is exactly that that we are afraid of considering that was 'reality' that lead us to Anxiety in the first place!
It doesn't matter how many friends we have who are fellow sufferers or if we have no friends at all. If you suffer Anxiety then you have it whether you're alone or in a room full of others who suffer it.
Please accept my apologies but I'm having difficulty in understanding your post and also finding it hard to warrant the reason for your comments as to others who have replied.
Horse.
Again, not getting my point. A handful hardly represents the majority, does it. I'm glad many of you do and have made friends, and I'm not calling out one stereotype over another. Only you know just how the site effects you, and if you would suffer should it exist.
Eh? :shrug:
scrubmuncher. You put this very badly and now you look like an arrogant pig.
People here HELP or at least try to, and you have expressed no thanks to the kind founders of this forum, who only wish to support people in their worst moments.
Now you look very silly indeed.
I would be dead if I hadn't recieved support from these people, have some respect.
Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and a healthy debate can be good if no-one gets too upset.
For me personally, I would not have realised and admitted my biggest problem was anxiety for months without this site and its information. I got better much quickly by realising I had anxiety and could still be stuck in an adrenaline spin now, I'd be only about 5 stones as I lost weight on the angst diet!!
I have been in contact with people on this site and hold them dear as a special relationship where we know each other's issues and respect, support and encourage each other without judgement or fear of of taboo. There is a huge taboo around mental illness in society at large, and we have unconditional understanding here that we may not get elsewhere e.g. at work. I am not on the site 24/7 but did use it a lot when I was off sick, it helped as a distraction, not to wallow in illness but to read stories of success and tips on getting well. I am not naive and realise that someone may be hiding behind their user name and not genuine, but the people I am in touch with know my name and trust me with theirs. All online contact has a security risk, you just have to be careful.
Overall, this site was a lifeline for me and I stay here to remind myself how to stay calm and hopefully help others.
Scrubmuncher
02-04-11, 23:06
scrubmuncher. You put this very badly and now you look like an arrogant pig.
People here HELP or at least try to, and you have expressed no thanks to the kind founders of this forum, who only wish to support people in their worst moments.
Now you look very silly indeed.
I would be dead if I hadn't recieved support from these people, have some respect.
I doubt that very much. The cicely of suicide and the thought of not being bothered if you live or not, and I predict you were parallel with the latter if feeling down.
People who are suicidal are very very rarely brought back and do infact die.
Those who are sick of living however are usually brought back.
Scrubmuncher
02-04-11, 23:10
Hazel,
Yes you made the best point yet. You can feel unjudged, and to a point able to open right up, although I still feel 99.9% of people duffering to any extent do open right up in any situation as even to fellow sufferers some things push the bar
nomorepanic
02-04-11, 23:10
scrubmuncher. You put this very badly and now you look like an arrogant pig.
Can we please drop the name calling - that is not allowed. Thanks
Scrubmuncher.
Well that's just brought comfort to those of us who are suicidal!!!!!!
Anyway, is it me or have I just lost the plot of this thread entirely?
bottleblond
02-04-11, 23:18
Hey Scrub
May i just say that THIS site changed my life. I found NMP by accident when i was so low in my life that i thought no-one and nothing could ever help me again, i read some posts, bit the bullet and joined. To cut a very long story short, I have made the most amazing friends on here whom i talk to on a daily basis and no i don't mean by typing. I am talking about real friendship and people i would trust with my life.
I understand that not all of us are so lucky but if you are prepared to accept support as it is meant then i am sure you will gain as much as so many of us have.
Don't feel obliged to stay here but i thought i would just add my input.
Regards
Lisa
x
nomorepanic
02-04-11, 23:24
I was just wondering if you had looked at the gallery pictures on here of the meetups?
They are real people meeting other members in real life and not just on the internet?
Scrubmuncher.
Well that's just brought comfort to those of us who are suicidal!!!!!!
Anyway, is it me or have I just lost the plot of this thread entirely?
Is it a full moon by any chance ?? doesnt make sense to me either .Started off ok ,But I lost it too Horse ...:doh: sue x
Scrubmuncher.
A slight deviation from the point here but I notice that in your past posts since 2007 you are not quite as forthcoming in your gratitude with regards to others who have offered advice and support on NMP.
Would this have any connection or correlation to the reason for your comments?
I get the feeling that you are somewhat angry or confused?
Horse.
No I actually think the original poster has a point. Once I'm cured of anxiety I rather not use any anxiety site.
Excuse me Phil, but that's because you're a taker.
I have made many "real" friends through this site - people that I speak to on the phone regularly.
If people don't find the site helpful, and furthermore counter-productive, don't waste your time...
Off you go - goodbye :emot-wave:
Anxious_gal
02-04-11, 23:37
he over generalizes far too much and I find his post to be rather insensitive.
Fighting or debating via the internet can be exhausting and pointless, I feel this is one of those times.Sometimes people makes posts like this on purpose, because they feel powerful when they can get people to react.if you notice how a lot of peoples replies were rather respectful in tone compared to the original poster.
Excuse me Phil, but that's because you're a taker.
I have made many "real" friends through this site - people that I speak to on the phone regularly.
If people don't find the site helpful, and furthermore counter-productive, don't waste your time...
Off you go - goodbye :emot-wave:
I agree with what he says coming on chatting about anxiety is not the best way I feel. I don't think coming on offending others is the correct way the OP should have gone about it. I once said this site was not helpful and got a trail of responses and abuse too. Some come here to make friends some just come to ask a quick question.
I think ideally to be totally anxiety free and not talk about it is the way to go if possible.
nomorepanic
02-04-11, 23:56
Phil - I am confused about your post here as you are always on here posting and asking for help.
[QUOTE=phil06;816897]I agree with what he says coming on chatting about anxiety is not the best way I feel.
But you do this all the time Phil - are you serious?
I once said this site was not helpful and got a trail of responses and abuse too. Some come here to make friends some just come to ask a quick question.
I personally find cracking out of the shell of anxiety/depression and supporting others on this site incredibly helpful; instead of constantly focusing on my own crap.
I think ideally to be totally anxiety free and not talk about it is the way to go if possible.
Yet you still come on here and talk about it - regularly.
I don't want to upset you but I really don't understand what you're talking about. Sorry.
Irony upon irony from Phil, I'm afraid :rolleyes:. As for the original post I don't know why we repeatedly get people coming on and trying to discourage us from using NMP. If people think it's not a helpful place for them, fine, but why don't they just stay away? what do they get out of trying to persuade others to do so?
(Braces self for clique accusations)
The mind boggles JC :wacko:
Did someone say 'crony'?
Ive noticed a lot about certain types on here during my time .The members who are on here talking about themselves and their issues constantly, are the ones who dont seem to get better .On the otherhand the people who hardly ever talk about themselves and spend time helping others .Seem to recover much quicker .Focusing on your own symptoms to the point of self obssesion, isnt going to make you better . All talk and no action isnt the way forward . If youve been given good advice try it ,Talking alone wont make you well . If you use this site sensibly there is everything you need to get better and on your way to a normal life .Hopefully you will stay to pass on information and give support to others .Sadly some dont . But if we all did that ,there would be hardly any one left to help new members who feel frightened and alone .Food for thought I think ? Sue
But you do this all the time Phil - are you serious?
Ideally I'd not have to though.
nomorepanic
03-04-11, 00:35
Good post Sue.
I don't post about ME much as I know what to do - I just have to do it lol.
I created the site as when I was acute with panic attacks I wanted someone to talk to and I have found that a million times over on here.
For those that don't know, me and Sue meet up every Wednesday for an exercise class (a specialised one for me because of the heart attack) but Sue comes along with me.
So yes I do meet real people from here and talk to many more on the phone too.
If NMP doesn't work for you then there is nothing wrong with that at all. You just need to find what does help you. If it does help then stick around!
Scrubmuncher
03-04-11, 00:58
Scrubmuncher.
A slight deviation from the point here but I notice that in your past posts since 2007 you are not quite as forthcoming in your gratitude with regards to others who have offered advice and support on NMP.
Would this have any connection or correlation to the reason for your comments?
I get the feeling that you are somewhat angry or confused?
Horse.
Both angry and confused, the struggle has been a 25 + year battle that seems relentless. I hope that doesn't convey attitude on here, if it does I apologise, I am only trying to be truthful.
Scrubmuncher
03-04-11, 01:04
he over generalizes far too much and I find his post to be rather insensitive.
Fighting or debating via the internet can be exhausting and pointless, I feel this is one of those times.Sometimes people makes posts like this on purpose, because they feel powerful when they can get people to react.if you notice how a lot of peoples replies were rather respectful in tone compared to the original poster.
Rather a silly thing to say. Online we have to generalise as it is not possible to go through the majority except for.......and.........and..........and.........oh and ........, silly statement to make, generalising is a part of online commentary and discussion.
Scrubmuncher
03-04-11, 01:09
(Braces self for clique accusations)
Entirely in your own mind, name where I have tried to discourage anyone from using the site? I merely point my opinion on overuse!
Try and read it again my love, slowly this time, you obviously missed parts out.
nomorepanic
03-04-11, 01:17
You still chose to ignore the positive posts though
Scrubmuncher
03-04-11, 01:19
I think the sentiment of getting well and hanging around to help others is a sentiment beyond most real heavy sufferers such as myself. I'm not a selfish, nasty, inconsiderate person at all but I would without doubt pass my hindrance of this beast onto someone else and leave them with it for a life free of it. I'm just at that point where it is literally driving me crazy and I will end up in a loony bin for life if I can not get things under control. It is a time I would sacrifice anyone or thing for a bash at normal living, normal headspace, just normality without even having to consider how I'm reacting to situations, just like any other normal folk do.
Scrubmuncher
03-04-11, 01:20
You still chose to ignore the positive posts though
I haven't ignored anything.
eeyorelover
03-04-11, 04:08
I think part of the reason that everyone is having issues understanding some of the points expressed is because there are opinions from people who are at different levels of the anxiety struggle. Some are hip deep in it, some are at the point where they feel they take two steps forward and one step back, and some are farther along and their anxiety isn't quite as bad as it used to be.
(If any of that makes sense to anyone but me!)
Personally I see nothing wrong with people leaving the site when they have gotten a handle on their issues. It isn't like they are abandoning the site! Think about it! We spend SO much time wishing we could do this or that when we are in the thick of anxiety and then to actually be able to get out and enjoy life, who wouldn't want to turn off the computer completely and JUST LIVE?!!
I do take exception with the statement that friendships made on the site aren't real friendships. When people here I care for have successes, I feel joy for them! When they struggle, I want to try to cheer them up! A few members have passed away and I grieved the loss of them!
It's true that I've never met anyone from the site, partly because most of the people I'm close with live thousands of miles away but it doesn't make me care about them less.
Anxiety isn't the only thing I have in common with my friends here. We talk about our families, our hopes and dreams, and through conversations I've learned that some are SOOOO funny...some are SOOO sweet...some are SOOOO mischievous!
Lastly (I know this is long...sorry!!), generally the members who do a lot of posts starting with "I" are those who are so fully engulfed in the throws of anxiety that it's hard to look outside themselves! The internal struggle that goes on when the mind reeks havoc can make one feel as if they need to spend all their energy trying to control all the symptoms to continue to function! This can appear to be selfishness but in actuality it's more a struggle to not lose control and to try to figure out how to 'fix' what's going on!
xxx
Sandy
I can count on one hand how many times I've posted about my troubles over the years - and believe me, there have been many lol
I tend not to post because for one, I don't like the attention, however well meaning and appreciated it is. Two, I think it makes me dwell on the situation too much if I can see it there in black and white.
I do agree that helping others in the same situation as ourselves is pretty much the best therapy you can get. How many times have we given someone great advice but not acted on it ourselves? If you think to yourself, "now how would I help someone in this situation?" and use that advice yourself it would be far more productive than continually posting about the same problems, getting pretty much the same answers and making no progress.
I'm sure many of us would move forward far more quickly if we thought about others a bit more rather than merely focusing on ourselves and our problems and going round in circles worrying but never getting anywhere.
Sue :hugs:
I've been wondering whether or not to contribute to this thread, but may as well add my two pennyworth.
I think I come into the same category as Suebee and particularly Dahlia, and will probably make the same sort of observations.
I'm sure I would have found a site like this very useful had the internet been around 20-25 years ago, as I was in the throes of terrible anxiety and didn't know anyone else who suffered at the time (or if they did, they kept very quiet about it). As a result of this, I was dreadfully isolated and I don't think that helped me at all. I have no idea whether this has helped turn my anxiety into a recurrent theme of my life, or whether this would have heppened anyway.
One of the things that has been very helpful to me about this site is to give me a sense of proportion - although I have recurrent and quite severe anxiety, I am nowhere near as bad as a lot of the other users, and to be honest this has made me very thankful. I can function in a lot of circumstances and have always been able to hold down a job, therefore it has helped me to count my blessings.
Also, as I'm a long-term sufferer, I have acquired quite a lot of insight into it and am always happy to attempt to help out others and give advice. I'm also very happy to help out people with employment problems because of my trade union work - as far as I'm concerned, if I can help someone out here, it's at least my "good deed for the day". So even though I'm now a lot better than I was a few months ago (with the help of medication, CBT and my brilliant GP), I have stuck around as even if I can help one person out of this misery, then that will be useful.
Reaching out to help others can be an immensely useful part of recovery imho, because as soon as you think about other people, it starts to release a bit of the self-centred stanglehold that anxiety exerts. Those who have reached the stage of self-focus or (even) self-obsession really need some help, and it can be a very difficult cycle to break out of - which is why there are some people on here who seem to be stuck in a rut.
bottleblond
04-04-11, 11:20
I agree that everyone has and is entitles to their own opinion, however i am at at loss as to why this thread was created. It was bound to cause conflict and hurt. I say hurt because what a kick in the teeth this is to Nicola, the admin staff, the mod staff who help run this site day in, day out....The members old and new who has recieved and given support.
AND then to see members who continualy recieve support jumping on the bandwagon.
Why do we bother Nic?
Lisa
x
Lisa, you bother because for every one person who comes on here and says NMP isn't going to help you or whatever - there are hundreds, possibly thousands, of us, who know it does. Please don't get disheartened xxx
allergyphobia
04-04-11, 11:29
I hope it is because people don't realise the implications of their words...not that they are deliberately trying to cause conflict and hurt those who work so hard to keep this site going... but i am unsure if my thought is misguided on that one :shrug:
Lisa you and the other mods and admins do a fantastic job on this site! We all appreciate that, and yes there are moaners and complainers on here that will make you feel like poop, but I hope for every one of them there will be 10 of us who pick you all back up again.
Like Jane says, please don't get disheartened. Some people don't realise how good they've got it, and the hard work that goes on behind the scenes. NMP is a fantastic site and community. Those who don't find it useful shouldn't remain here and protest why it hasn't helped them just to antagonise and upset people.
:hugs:
paula lynne
04-04-11, 13:34
Regarding the origonal post........unless these "big boys/top dogs/so called experts" suffer themselves with the soul destroying agony that is panic/anxiety..then they have NO RIGHT dictating these ridiculous findings at sufferers! Their findings are neither tangible, reliable, useful or helpful.
NMP saved me from years of hell, alone, suffering, with no-one who cares or understands.
I have "REAL" friends here who care and respect me more than my own family. I find it offensive that these friends are not classed as "REAL"...of course they are! They are my reality...so its real to me.
Sure, I accept that some here have found it detrimental to be here as it hightens their anxiety and panic, in which case they should leave. However, the majority of people who ask for help, and give it, find this site a huge support. Me included.
Those "experts", unless they really KNOW the beast that is anxiety, are talking out of their fat rich buttocks imo.
Peace out, PAULA x (MY REAL NAME!)
Wots occuring..? NESSA (NOT MY REAL NAME............OR IS IT????:shades:
I think it would have been a good idea to post the thesis of these experts for people to read. Rather than saying someone told you and now you're passing it on. It's like chinese whispers, each telling will deviate from the original point. So are these people actual experts? Ie are they at the top of the field in physchological medicine? If so, where are their studies?
Life is full of givers and takers. The givers will get the most benefit from coming to a site like this because they get a feeling of pride from helping those who are crying out for help. Then you get the takers, and there are a few on this site, who just want to take take take. For those people they never really learn how to deal with their own problems and end up in a cycle needing constant reassurance. It's at this point when I would say that an online support group is actually hindering their recovery, because theyre so self interested that they can't see the bigger picture.
That does NOT mean that the givers and all the other people that are struggling will get no benefits from this site. I joined just over a year ago after suffering with anxiety for about 10 years. I'm not recovered, but I'm getting there and I owe a debt to those people that supported me along the way!
I agree that everyone has and is entitles to their own opinion, however i am at at loss as to why this thread was created. It was bound to cause conflict and hurt. I say hurt because what a kick in the teeth this is to Nicola, the admin staff, the mod staff who help run this site day in, day out....The members old and new who has recieved and given support.
AND then to see members who continualy recieve support jumping on the bandwagon.
Why do we bother Nic?
Lisa
x
We bother Lisa because, on the whole, people find the site helpful and are appreciative. You'll always get a few who cant see further than their own nose and probably don't realise that those who help run NMP are sufferers too, but put that suffering to one side to maintain the site.
I for one will always be grateful to the majority here for offering me support and some insight into panic and anxiety or else I suspect I'd still be feeling isolated and thinking I was the only one feeling like I have been when I've had my worst moments. If it wasn't for that very fact, I'd still be feeling like a complete nut job...... some would say I still am, but at least I know why now!
:wacko:
Huge hugs :bighug1:
Sue xxx
I dont want to be judgemental here ,but the OP has on another occassion posted I think for some sort of attention /response .I really woldnt get upset about it .He has like another member been here for years .Seems another case of Hypocrisy here I think ?:shrug: .More people find this site helpful than those who dont .You cant please everyone and theres always exceptions to the rule .After all you get what you put in. That means helping yourself ,and not expecting miracles or others to do it for you .Sue x
I love this site!
Suffered on and off for about 15 years.
I don't post here all the time, just when I think I can help someone or I need a bit of support. I read the posts quite regularly.
It helps me to understand that my symptoms are common!!!! I am not going mad etc!!!! So it really helps me! And with waiting lists being so long for any kind of therapy this site has made a real difference to me!
I have been suicidal about 8 years ago. I'm still here!!! But reading things on here help me put things into perspective and reminds me of things that I know my self but have forgotten.
And its an instant form of help. If I waited for counselling etc from my GP I would have to wait at least 6 weeks if not more!
Its like anything in life. Moderation. If I became obsessed with this this site, then I would need to think about it carefully. That said when I need the help I know I can post or chat whenever I want too. And I know there are people here who understand. To know that the strange and scary things you are feeling have been felt by other people is very powerful. I don't fear them anymore.
Thanks everyone on here. You are doing a great job!!! :hugs:
If it doesn't help you then don't come on here. Simple!
Mabel xxxx
I believe (and I could be wrong) that there is possibly a very small minority who post on NMP regarding whatever problems they are suffering and in turn receive the normal responses from other members, but, sadly they continue to totally disregard any advice, help or suggestion that is given and consequently continue to become engrossed in their malaise because the replies that they read are not what they want to read. Therefore, they continue to suffer and in turn begin to lose faith in the website concerned only because they have an 'axe' to grind!
It is my opinion that in these cases, any amount of help they receive falls on deaf ears and continues to do so until they hear something that they want to hear. In a perfect example, a person who firmly believes they have a tumour refuses to accept all negative tests results and is only 'happy' when a tumour is discovered! (I use the word happy as in the sufferer being content rather than happy they have a tumour)!
No amount of assurance will convince this sufferer that they are perfectly healthy from a physical point of view and that their symptoms are due to nothing more than anxiety. OK, I believe we all fall into that category to a certain extent but to this minority, it is a bigger problem.
Therefore, one of the results of this is that the original poster is in danger of upsetting other members who contribute to his/her post by ways of lack of response, abruptness, ungratefulness and occasionally using grammer than can appear as insulting!
This is the problem with correspondence using the 'written' word because no amount of emotion can be expressed unless it is written with emotion.
(I hope everyone is following this because I'm beginning to give myself a headache writing the bloody thing).
I know we are all different and that some of us will post/reply in certain ways as to what may appear offensive, naturally there is no need for this at any time, but perhaps this is just another result of anxiety getting to us, I don't know.
However, this (my) post is a classic example of how difficult it is to get our point across in written words and how it can easily be misinterpreted by the reader. But I do confess that sometimes I find it hard to understand some peoples reason for the original post in the first place if they do not heed to the resposes.
I'm off to lay down!
Horse.
Horse, I understand this perfectly, and I know exactly what you mean about seeking assurance - it's very true that we all do this to an extent - I suppose what we have to do is recognise this in ourselves. There is also what I would term a small number of "reassurance addicts" who unfortunately get locked into their behaviour.
I suspect that they get a lack of responses, or curt ones, because a lot of us will get angry or frustrated that nothing we say seems to help. In these circumstances I almost always step away as I get really disheartened with not being able to help. I'm one of the people on here who has a drive to feel "useful" so if I can give someone a bit of useful advice, that will make me happy.
Hi all
I've read this thread with great interest and wanted to post my thoughts regarding it. Everyone is entitled to their opinions and views and I think its great to see such debate here. My personal views regarding the posters comments are as follows.
1. Its clear what you think about this site and as such possibly you may wish to consider leaving?
2. In terms of self awareness I would suggest it may be a good idea to think more before posting. My view is that your post came across as quite patronising, Only my view.
3. It is not helpful to make sweeping generalised statements. You need to remember that we are all unique in terms of our issues and how they affect us. The same is the case for whats useful in terms of support and recovery for each individual.
4. I work in mental health and have done so for 12 years, believe me Health Proffesionals who have never suffered from Anxiety do not always give the best advice.
5. Finally I get a real impression from you that because youve suffered for many years that you may think your in the place of a teacher addressing your pupils. (Again my personal view) This links back to self awareness, I think it would be benificial to spend some time looking at that.
Brave
munkeyinblack
06-04-11, 13:50
*round of applause for bravedart*
very well put, couldnt have said it better myself !
Before I was hit by palps - I never had a panic attack. I was a professional working with anxiety much of the time. What a turn about ay! ....anyway...
I was reminded of a therapy group many moons ago which was part of my work.
There was much conflict within the group with some complaining the group was pointless and actually exacerbated anxiety - while others found it to be very healing and helpful. Oddly, the conflict helped both sets of people to think about their anxiety/depression etc and review where they were in their own healing and life process.
It was hard for the people who felt helped, to really listen to those who felt un-helped, because I guess they needed to defend the helper and the group that meant so much to them.
What was harder was to think about whether perhaps the complainer(s) were, paradoxically being helped and supported by articulating their doubts about the group, about therapy and about the potential to heal or learn to manage. In other words, I guess the OP may in some way be reaching out and expressing their disappointment not just about this or any cyber group, but about help and if there is any. Perhaps for this person personally, the pain and isolation have not gone away and to that person - any cyber group may seem empty because his/her needs are not being met
Anxiety etc is so very isolating as I have come to find out. But even before that and as a long term professional, I always encouraged groups. Personally I have been helped by not feeling so alone ... so isolated and at times desperate.
I am sorry for the OP, sorry for you that it has not been so helpful and sorry you cant seem to find a way to be heard. Sorry its been so disappointing and sorry you've suffered so long. I wish you peace of mind and hope you can find the words to express whatever pain you may be feeling
All this bickering is enough to give anyone P/A,I come on for distraction,but understand what the poster is saying.It is their opinion that is all.
Petra x:flowers:
I've been on here for 5 yrs or more now and found it a great help just to find there were others out there like myself and that I wasn't some sort of freak.
Admittedly there was a brief period when I thought I had everyone else's symptoms but that passed pretty quickly.
I am now cured of my anxiety and come on here to offer help where I can.
Without this site I doubt that my recovery would have been as rapid or as complete.
I have only praise for both the organisers and members of this site.
All I can say is - If it suits you go with it - if not don't read the posts.
Phill :shades:
harasgenster
10-04-11, 01:43
Hope it's ok to bump this back up, I realise it's a contentious subject. I thought that since I'm here on another sleepless night I'd just add my two cents.
I officially "left" less than a fortnight ago. For me, posting (and pretty much anything I do in any area of my life) becomes an addiction that's extremely hard to kick, so I have to be careful if I'm doing anything at all more frequently than usually. I know that probably sounds silly, but I'm actually serious!
I'm not sure everybody sees cyber-groups as cyber-friends. Without meaning to offend anyone here who has been extremely helpful to me in the past, I don't pursue friendships online, no matter what site, as I find this idea uncomfortable. This part of the idea against the use of online support groups isn't relevant to all users.
Answering other people's posts is does not affect me negatively and is not as "addictive". If I feel I have helped, then this is a boost to me. If I feel that I have contributed, well it's just kind of like a girly night at a friend's house where you give advice about their problems anyway (I guess my friends are pretty open, mind you...) Basically, I'm a girl. I enjoy it. I like thinking I'm helping and I like talking. I think many people would agree that the reward of helping others gives them a lift. Also, my symptoms don't get worse by reading about others, as some other people have pointed out.
However, I can't post about myself. This makes me far, far worse. And this is possibly where you could have a point for some people. I think a few repliers have already said that you can't generalise. What some find helpful, could actually hurt others, it depends how anxiety manifests itself. Counter-intuitively, perhaps, talking about my problems or writing them down, makes them worse. There are a bunch of reasons why this is true, but it's probably the opposite for most people.
Essentially, online support groups are not for everyone. Support groups, online or not, are not for everyone. Neither is CBT or psychoanalysis. A site like this can definitely make people worse, but only some people. One size does not fit all, so your comments may be true for a certain percentage of people here, and I would say people who are obsessive and have a history of strong psychological addictions (that's me!) should be careful what they do online or otherwise.
That links into your idea of living in a cyberworld, actually. This is very true and very important. I have done it with forums and social networks, my best mate has done it with online dating sites, and another depressed friend has done it with virtual gaming. There is actually quite a lot of unhappy people who withdraw into the online world to the detriment of their own lives in the real world in order to cocoon themselves and escape what is happening around them as well as in their own minds. (If you want a proper extreme case, there was someone a few years ago on the news who died of dehydration because they didn't get up from their virtual game to drink). I've done it once a few years ago, where I basically just gave up on the real world and lived in a virtual one, and I see my friends do it too. I have one friend who doesn't come and hang around with us very much anymore because she wants to sit alone and chat to boys on a dating site - obviously that's not good! I don't think you can really suggest that all depressed people are like this but, yes, from what I've seen there are a lot of depressed people that are. Are you sure the experts you cite were not referring to this phenomenon? I could probably go find about 20 studies saying exactly the same thing. It's pretty well known as an issue, but again, it's only a certain proportion it's true for.
(And I am actually going to try and find something else to do when I can't sleep now...at least I didn't post to ask for advice...)
However, I can't post about myself. This makes me far, far worse. And this is possibly where you could have a point for some people. I think a few repliers have already said that you can't generalise. What some find helpful, could actually hurt others, it depends how anxiety manifests itself. Counter-intuitively, perhaps, talking about my problems or writing them down, makes them worse. There are a bunch of reasons why this is true, but it's probably the opposite for most people.]
Maybe you do say a lot about yourself indirectly. Our opinions and the way we come at things; the way we explain our position, says so very much.
I am thinking you hurt very much, and sometimes that feels like anger. What is addiction but a need or hole being filled. I can understand your not wanting to fill it with not real things and it seems you cannot fill it with real things either. I offer a cyber hug even though you will maybe find it hard to accept or feel it to be genuine. Take care
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