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Ven diaries
Beginning a switch from cit to ven xr after cit seems to have stopped working so thought I'd write about the switch for anyone else looking to change over.
So step one of the plan is to cross taper from 20mg cit drop this to 10mg and add 37.5mg ven for two weeks.
Day 1: started this yesterday, feel a bit jittery today and a bit teary but I've been teary with depression for months. Slight sore head.
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Re: Ven diaries
Hope it all goes well Debs and you start to feel better soon xx
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Re: Ven diaries
My appointment is in 2.5 hours. Feeling nervous now, but only because I don't know what he is going to do. My mum is hoping that he doesn't change anything until we get back from holidays, but in a way I'm kind of keen to get it over and done with. Will let you know when I get back. In any case, he will make the decision about what is best and I will just do what he suggests.
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Re: Ven diaries
Good luck lovely! Keep me posted x
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Re: Ven diaries
Hi Debs! Well it looks like we are going to be Ven friends . I had my appointment, he had always talked about Duloxetine for the swap, then while I was in there he said pristique (not sure of spelling). Then he scribbled it out and said no, I will start you on Ven. So my plan now is to stay at 50mg Sert for another week, start 37.5mg of Ven for a week (keep the Mirtazapine at 15mg). I feel like a pharmacy some times with all the drugs I'm on. Anyhow, really looking forward to just moving forward and getting off the Sert and then once I'm stable the Valium. He said he could have decreased the Sert again but wanted to see what kind of effects I got from the Ven. Plus he said 50mg of Sert is the lowest theuraputic dose, so if he drops that again I will essentially have two drugs in my system which are both doing nothing. I felt really flat today which is new. But I guess everyone has those. So I will let you know how I get on tomorrow. So he said to take the Ven and the Sert at the same time. I usually take them around 9am. Will let you know how I get on tomorrow night. Xx
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Good luck to you both. I am hoping Sert works for me but its not at the moment, so I'm following this with interest as this is likely my next step. Cant stand this anymore :(
Good luck!
Rich
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Re: Ven diaries
Hi Tracy,
Oh well looks like we will be going through the same thing. Ven friends! Hope it goes well, I've heard a cross taper can be very gentle as really the serotonin is being replaced rather than withdrawn but we're all different. We can compare notes.
Rich, hope Sert comes through for you but will note everything here incase you need to make the change.
Day 2: poor sleep, mild headache a few hours after taking, slight jitters still, no difference in mood (not that I expected any).
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Re: Ven diaries
Day 3: tiredness, very mild headache on and off, slightly increased thirst. Again mood was low and some anxiety but no more than usual.
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Re: Ven diaries
Hi Debs! Are you taking 20mg cit or 10mg cit plus the 37.5mg Ven. I think I'm going to ask to stay at 37.5 for another week as well because of our holiday. Feeling really unmotivated. I hope that improves. Think I will try get out of the house today even just for a drive to the shop. Fingers crossed this all goes well xx
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Re: Ven diaries
I hope it goes well for you
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Re: Ven diaries
Hi Tracy,
I'm on 10mg cit with 37.5mg ven for two weeks. How are you finding the taper? I'm past the three day mark so should be getting a steady dose. My psych wanted me to start dropping the cit every other day after the two weeks but I usually feel that worse so she said I could swap to the 75mg Ven if I didn't want to do that. I'll see how the next couple of weeks go. I'd probably do the same as you if I was going on holiday, better the devil you know!
Thanks Dale, I hope it goes as smoothe as possible.
X
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Hi Debs. To be honest, I feel like sh+t. I take the dose at about 9 because that is when I took the Sert. I actually didn't take them until about 10 this morning because I was thinking of not taking it, but then had a change of heart. I feel really flat, which is just not like me. Since this started in July, I have had crying spells and the like but have never lost my mojo. The last two days, I have stayed in bed until about lunch time, where I force myself to get out of bed because it makes me feel worse. I am worried that it is the Ven that is causing me to feel the flatness. Other than that I haven't felt too bad, have a tiny bit of a head ache and lower stomach cramp (but I don't know if that is my periods about to start). Just want to shake this feeling off. I don't like it at all. Also felt really weird thoughts wise this morning. Will see how I get on, but don't think I will be making any changes until back from holidays. Let me know how you get on tomorrow.xx
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Re: Ven diaries
Hi Debs and Mermaid
I hope you are doing okay and well done for writing about it. It will help lots of people.
It might not be an easy ride but it's well worth doing in my opinion. I went from pragabalin to ven about a year ago and I'm doing good!
I look forward to hearing how you get on
T
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Re: Ven diaries
Hi all,
I've been on ven for over 4 years and it has saved my life. I know we're all different but it's worth giving it your best shot because it can works wonders.
Just wanted to give you a little positivity during tricky times :)
Pip
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Thank Tom and Pip, encouragement is always needed when you are facing the unknown. How did the switch go for you Tom? Did it take you a while to feel the difference like the standard 4-6 weeks?
Tracy, it could be the switch and us getting used to it as I've found I've been more tired and a bit flat myself especially the first few days. I suppose it's a matter of time before it all settles down. Are you still taking the Sert with the ven?
Day 4: increased sleeping, Slightly more thirsty, feel like I'm second guessing my mood.
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Re: Ven diaries
Hi Debs! Well, this morning I got my period (sorry TMI). So that at least explains the tears all weekend. The Ven has definately increase my anxiety back up. Before I started on it, I was relaxed on waking and during the day, I am back again to feeling like a wound up rubber band in the morning. It does decrease once I get up and get moving. I know my anxiety is high, because when it is I start to get a bit of pill phobia, but will continue with it now until I at least see the psych again on Wednesday. It is early days I know and I think 3/4 days is when you are getting a steady dose. So I am just about to take day 3. When you say you feel like your second guessing your mood, do you feel like you are improving but not really sure? My anxiety has increased, not gone the other way, but it may just be anxiety about starting a new med. In any case I am telling myself the anxiety is just nervous energy and it won't hurt you, and to keep going at least till I have done a week. Hope you continue to do well. xx
Thanks Pip and Tom...fingers crossed we have the same success. Do you mind if I ask what dosage you are on and if it is to treat anxiety, depression or both?
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Re: Ven diaries
Well that explains a lot Tracy, especially when pmt is worse since the dip in estrogen plummets the little serotonin we have! I've seen ven is used for pmdd too.
I find I get a bit jittery but I'm not sure if that's just the transition from cit to ven, are you still on Sert too? Sometimes I think it's anxiety over just making the change and I'm always expecting the worse just with the way I'm feeling.
In terms of second guessing my mood, it's like I feel okay for a while then my mind kicks in thinking oh do I feel ok? Where is the anxiety? Like I'm looking for how I feel since I'm so used to doing it, it's very annoying x
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Hi Debs. Thanks for replying. It made me feel a whole lot better. I am still on 50mg of Sert, and have been on that since the 30th of August (that's when I did my last drop). I was feeling fine up until I started the Ven, so I know it is that, that is causing the added anxiety. Plus I was fine in the mornings until I started on the Ven. I really feel like chucking it in (the Ven) to be honest. My mum has convinced me to stay on it at least until the see the doc again on Wednesday. I just am having major mood swings (don't know if that is part of the Ven...then again probably PMT...I keep forgetting about that). Hopefully in a few weeks, we will be high fiving each other and saying thank f"|k that is over. Have a nice rest of the day and let me know how you get on tomorrow. xx :hugs:
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Stick with it Tracy, part of our problem is that we've been on our meds so long we haven't had to deal with this start up anxiety from new meds. The first few days will be worse as everything is so changeable. Hopefully it'll get easier as we go along. Pm me if you need a chat x
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Re: Ven diaries
Hi both
Debs is right, stick with it !
To answer your above question, unfortunately it took me a while to 'level out' after finding the right dosage. but thank god I stuck with it.
You will have heightened anxiety but please be reassured that this is the chemicals causing this and it's all normal!
T
Xx
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Re: Ven diaries
So plodding along is all I can say for now as its early days. Feels like I'm starting to feel the effects of the taper more now.
Day 5: tired, feel like I'm sleeping most of the day, jittery/anxious, headaches, chills, low mood.
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Re: Ven diaries
Day 6: increased sleeping, jittery/anxiety, chills, lightheaded when going from sitting to standing.
Nearly at the one week mark, have another week of the same then I drop the final 10mg cit and increase ven to 75mg. Fingers crossed once that happens I can start to make progress. Have diazepam for when the anxiety is bad but trying not to use it unless I really need to and even at that I tend to take half.
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Hi Debs! We are at polar opposites with regard to sleep. I am so tired, but my mind won't shut down (I had this also when I started on Sertraline). Which is actually doing my head in, because I wake at 4.30am wound up as tight as an elastic band with anxiety (which tends to ease once I get moving, not go, but ease). When I get home from work I'm exhausted, but can't sleep...aaarrrhhhgg). Thankfully with the Mirt it knocks me out for a few hours at night. Can't wait till this is over!!!
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Hi Tracy, I'm not sure if the sleep thing is partly because I have chronic fatigue as well and I was told the citalopram gave me a lift so it could be the transition is interfering with that. I have anxiety and jitters too so I never know if it's coming of the citalopram or starting the ven. We're only really going into side effect territory just now, once we're off the old drugs then hopefully we'll start to make progress.
I read somewhere 20mg citalopram and 50-75mg sertraline is equivalent to 75mg ven so we're not even at a therapeutic dose yet.
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Hi Debs. I dropped from 75mg to 50mg on 30th of August and had no change in sleep at all (or any real side effects from tapering down 25mg), until I started taking the Ven. I was snoozing in on the weekends until about 10ish. By day three it had definately changed my sleep as I was awake at 4.30am and have been every day since with severe anxiety upon waking. It does ease though once I get up. I know you have only just started as well, but do you think when you updose with the Ven, the anxiety will get worse, or once it's in there, it doesn't make much difference. If anyone who is reading this has had experience, could you please advise. I get really overwhelmed with everything, my anxiety I guess is rampant at the moment. I did feel quite rational yesterday afternoon though and was thinking positive. Good luck Debs...you seem to be coping with it much better than I am. xx
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I'm just thinking being on 10mg citalopram and 37.5mg Effexor I pretty much have two ineffective doses doing nothing right now. Roll on another week to get this switch done with!
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Hi debs you should have the same levels of seretonin with half and half but I expect each med works a bit differently so still needs adjusting. Hang in there!
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Does anyone know that if you start a medication that's equivalent to the other in terms of dosage whether it can still be effective? Eg could 75mg ven work effectively even though the equivalent 20mg cit stopped working?
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I think they work a bit differently which is why you sometimes need to change. From my experience they must act a bit different because when I started on sertraline I was incredibly ill and then with citalopram but didn't have any gastro upsets with venlafaxine.
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Re: Ven diaries
Hi Debs :ohmy: We won't be Ven friends anymore...I had a psych appointment today. He is taking me off the Ven. He said that because it is so activating for me, I felt wired all day (but exhausted) if that makes sense, not sleeping (only with Mirt), then waking early. I also was feeling irritated and agitated. He said I must be too sensitive to the chemicals that Ven affect in the brain (can't remember his exact medical terms). Anyhow, I'm supposed to just stop it tomorrow and see how everything goes for the next week without it. Who know what will happen after that. Will be following your journey closely. Will let you know how I go with everything xx
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Hi Tracy, if it's not working for you then it's best to find that out now before you continue any further. I am having the opposite effect of sleeping too much which I hope will go away as I've literally been sleeping 10-12hrs a day which is ridiculous. I'll maybe speak to my dr as if it doesn't improve I'll need to consider something else. Has anyone else experienced tiredness?
Day 7; sleeping 10-12hrs, jittery, low mood, much more emotional today
Not sure if the mood and emotionalness is just part of the depression I already have.
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Hi Debs. Hope you start to feel better soon. I have read that it can make you sleepy, but also it can make you wired (which is what I was feeling like). I just don't think it was for me (I did have second thoughts when I got home last night), but after waking at 4.00am again this morning and laying there coiled up like an elastic band until I had to get up for work, I thought, nope this isn't for me. I was starting to feel okay before I took it, was starting to read and do some work on the panic and anxiety myself (like trying to drive etc), but that stopped when I started taking this because it took me right back to where I was before, unable to concentrate, mind wizzing 100 miles an hour, anxiety through the roof. So I think I have made the right decision. I think with me as well because I am on so many drugs, my brain just couldn't handle it. Let me know how you get on with the doctor. Maybe once you up the dose to the therapeutic level your energy levels will return? I'm really not sure. I wish you all the best with it though. A lot of people seem to have had good outcomes with it. Chat soon xx
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Hi Tracy, I hope you find something that suits you better soon so you can start your recovery. The past couple of days I've been feeling a bit more emotional and shaky but I assume it is a bit of start up and withdrawals all mixed in together. Will keep going and see how it goes. Let me know how you get on.
Day 8: increased sleep, jittery/anxious, emotional.
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Not much changing in terms of side effects however I sometimes think part of the jitters I have are from coming off the citalopram, after 12years I'm sure it'll have an effect. Taking half a diazepam to take the edge off if I need it. I know it's not much but I'm too scared to use it too often incase I become tolerant plus I wait to see how I feel before taking anything.
Day 9: still sleeping a lot 10-12hrs, jittery/anxious, thirsty.
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So not much different to report, mainly sleeping a lot and not even at a therapeutic dose yet to make a difference. I do have chronic fatigue so the med change could be affecting that as the citalopram used to give me a boost for that.
Day 10: increased sleep, anxious.
Don't know if anyone can view this but an actress here in Britain who is open about her mental health issues speaks about her recent episode, gives me hope!
http://youtu.be/cmU8ms7suhQ
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Re: Ven diaries
More of the same, trying to fight the sleep but not doing to well as I'm constantly tired. Still having anxious/depressed thoughts but didn't expect these to go when I'm not even tapered over properly yet. Trying to my best to challenge them.
Day 11: increased sleep, anxious/depressive thoughts.
3 days til I do last bit of taper.
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Re: Ven diaries
Keep going Debs! You are doing great and almost there. I don't always comment, but read every day. Our holiday is going well. Anxiety has been good and have had not early morning waking and anxiety since the Ven got out of my system (I really wished it had of worked for me). Maybe if I gave it another try when I'm in a better head space. I did have a panic attack at the shop which was a bit of a scare. Had to get my daughter to come to the toilet with me and then my partner stay with me in shop. Thought there was something wrong with me (other than panic attack), but as soon as I said to myself 'oh well if you faint, you faint, who cares'. Then I was fine. Kids had a kebab, the takeaway shop man put Jalepenos on instead of olives (can you believe it). Poor little buggers mouths were on fire. We showed him the jelepenos and he said 'yes' yes, they are olives...Grrr what a friggin idiot. Thinking of you. Feeling tired is a very common start up effect of the Ven (from what I've read), I think it will pass once you up the dose. Take care of you xx