-
Everything contaminated
As I said in other posts toilet germs worry me. Basically I will post a few examples:
*The toilet got blocked and I used a coat hanger to unblock it and my mum said she put it in a bin. I seen a hanger in my cupboard the same colour so basically I wanted to chuck everyone out or sell it in fear its contaminated even though it probably wasn't the same hanger. I have a Hoover for when I move out now I fear the whole house would be contaminated.
*I had to buy a new mop bucket as after a shower I worried I brushed it and maybe my backside wasn't clean enough?
*I won't use a rucksack in fear its contaminated no idea why..maybe toilet germs some how?
Basically I get these thoughts all the time and loads of items in my room have bend off limits. I wouldn't plug headphone in my phone as one time after the toilet my backside wasn't 100% clean so fear my phone is too contaminated.
At the moment my OCD makes me worry every thought in my head is real
And my over active imagination is coming up with loads of scenarios where I can't use certain things. I buy new polish clothes, house brushes if I fear the old one is contaminated. Re buying is easing my anxiety but not a great long term solution...anybody else had issues like this before? :blush:
-
Re: Everything contaminated
Right I have given up I've got the Hoover for sale on gum tree even though it's new. My head says it will be dirty and when I move house that will be dirty. I kept it by for months but this time I couldn't resist and was even going to search the bin for the coat hanger which was causing me anxiety. The thought of it cleaning carpets and being dirty could "contaminate"
My new house.
I may buy a new Hoover and store it somewhere else so I don't get anymore anxious :huh:
-
Re: Everything contaminated
I have this too except mine is more with poisoning though I used to have it just as bad with germs.
I also get it if I am outside and I touch a toilet door handle or anything public, I feel like I need to scrub myself all over afterwards and most of the time its not possible to do it so I keep reminding myself that I have to as soon as I get the chance and the longer I wait, the more anxiety builds up.
I've had to stick my hand down my toilet before to unblock it because the plunger didn't do the job and even though I had gloves on and had anti bacterial soap to scrub with afterwards, I still used went for 2 baths and a shower that day after it and I threw out the clothes I was wearing even though they had been washed in the washing machine three times since that incident. I just couldn't bring myself to wear them again and even used gloves to take them out the bin for fear they were still contaminated.
-
Re: Everything contaminated
Thanks glad I'm not the only one suffering.
I will probably buy a new Hoover even though I don't need it but just worried about the germs even if the chances of the coat hanger not being in the room my thoughts have been so over powering this time I fear if I use this Hoover I will be worrying forever the place has germs but this is how my OCD behaves?
How will I cope without having to buy and replace things?
---------- Post added at 23:56 ---------- Previous post was at 22:10 ----------
And I'm now worried that I need to throw everything in my cupboard out even my new microwave.
One thoughts say nothing happened it was just a coat hanger not a dirty one but I'm worried someone put it in and everyone is dirty :ohmy:
-
Re: Everything contaminated
Phil,
I really think you need some support from a therapist with this. It's clear that this is advancing and now you are moving into a stage of discarding things because of the "what if" of contamination.
The human body is advanced, we build up our immunity as toddlers. Just look how toddlers are crawling all over the floor. The floor will be covering in germs & bacteria throughout the day as we are surrounded by so there is no escape. This is precisely why our bodies build up our immune systems when we are very young.
You need to be challenging these thoughts and not giving into them by panicking or throwing things away or cleaning things. I know this is really really hard. I've not had contamination issues but I have had loads of OCD forms and it had me on my knees for ages but it doesn't now so I know you can get much better, because I was pretty poor at pushing myself on to do things and I'm a million times better now. So, if can do it, I believe everyone can.
I believe you need support through a structured ERP programme to get you facing this but with the skills to get through it. Some of those skills will be things like Thought Records, relaxation, Mindfulness, etc as well as all the acceptance stuff but having a hierarchy structure of exposes from easiest to hardest (and potentially a further step beyond that of the normal practices in life to prove it has been beaten) will be a good way for you. There are guides on how to do this and I can happily post you something like this off the NHS websites but given how you are throwing thinsg away, selling stuff and how your thoughts are escalating to even more, I think you need some professional support for this. At a minimum an assessment of your needs should be done so you get an understand of how you can move forward.
How about speaking to your GP to get the ball moving? You don't have to go the meds route and we all know that doesn't work anyway as only the hard work from yourself in recovery ever works. A referal for CBT would be a good thing.
Honestly Phil, my OCD was out of control for the first year and I thought I was going crazy. I got into therapy, which helped a bit, got some understanding and started Mindfulness and kept challenging things and it got me to a much better place.
-
Re: Everything contaminated
I have battled OCD for years but in different phases sometimes it's worse than others. Sometimes I have to wash my hands more than others. Some of my worries don't bother me at all. I use to have Heath OCD, intrusive thoughts..
Usually it's cheaper stuff I throw away underwear, a mop bucket, socks. For some reason I'm less anxious about other stuff on the cupboard as I feel it's the Hoover which can spread germs as its one that goes between rooms. I can wash a microwave but not a Hoover. But I can't get my head round it not being opened anyway but I still fear germs got in. I know if I use the Hoover once I move into this house I shall worry and think "omg my living room is contaminated" even if it makes no logical sense. Usually I get anxious over an actual reason e.g a blocked toilet or something as I said in my other posts but when my OCD is bad my mind springs thoughts out which are so powerful I avoid touching things, I clean things more or I avoid or sell. Perhaps the stress of moving intensifying it. All of my worries are based around toilet germs for some reason or things like under cooked or over cooked food or swallowing glass ect.
I have been thinking about selling the Hoover for 48 hours now. I have also had thoughts people will come round to my house and mess my new bathroom up too. I worry I won't be able to keep it clean enough aswell.
I've had theropy a long time back and it helped with some of my anxiety but there's waiting lists now. Couple of years ago it got quite bad so I paid for a therapist that helped a bit but in the end she even said I wasted money as she did free group sessions. Self help worked for me to get over panic attacks however with my OCD I have never really been able to get over it as I feel I need to worry that's the bottom line. I know it's not normal to behave with all these ocds but I can't imagine not cleaning my hands 20 times? In public toilets I can only clean once or twice because of embarrassment of looking mad but I feel unclean at home I can clean like 5 or 6 times..:shrug:
-
Re: Everything contaminated
You just mentioned something that I found myself but haven't seen much on threads - how the fear of embarrassment is stronger than the OCD. I had that. I would be walking along a main road checking every road sign over & over and it got worse so that I was "head bobbing" as it I was trying to make it sink in somehow. Yet if someone was walking behind me I would not do it more than once and avoid the head bobbing so it was a discrete ritual.
It's strange isn't it how we can fear things enough to not be able to stop doing it yet if someone stands there we can. Did you find the compulsion wasn't as intesnse or subsided more quickly when in that scenario?
OCD is almost like we just don't trust ourselves. Funnily enough it did used to be known as "the doubters disease".
How do you feel about trying something like online CBT? You can get it free or some charge very little. Do you think that you could follow that with support on here? There are techniques you can try and it's easy enough to come up with ERP hierarchies, it's more doing them again & again thats the issue.
You clearly have a lot of strength in you to beat your panic disorder.
Bit annoying about your therapist, she should have advised you about that to save you money otherwise she's not very ethical.
-
Re: Everything contaminated
Yes she took about £30 per hour but most of it was about positive thoughts and ignoring anxiety. And yes at train stations when I use the toilet and wash my hands once I am too busy with the train journey to worry about the hands. At home I have less tolerance and have thoughts like they are not clean enough or I touched something. I think when others do a quick hand wash it makes me feel more at ease I guess. If there's nobody in the public toilet I wash hands more so I'm in a way glad if there's others around.
My mum said she never out the coat hanger in and it seems a crazy thing to do but I was out when she put it in the bin so I couldn't be sure it was in the bin hence why I checked but could only find one hanger I binned another one a day earlier. A few months ago I had a dream the dog poo'd my room and for about a month I avoided this corner of the room think I posted about it but it seemed real but today it seems more trivial.
Being in my own house I can be more in charge of my own cleaning so that will help. I remember getting some good help here a while ago that helped but the forums less busy these days and online anxiety help is a bit of a jungle of information. The relaxation I use is not OCD specific more anxiety. I defo need more direction and now I'm moving I'm Hoping to spend time looking at helping my OCD as I don't have to spend all the time trying to find a house. :blush:
-
Re: Everything contaminated
I think the extra stress you have had will easily play a part. I know my GAD causes my OCD to itensify with it. So, cutting down on stresses will help you get some more control back.
I know what you mean about wishing someone was on there so it overrided your OCD, I've had that too.
The problem with obsessional disorders like this is unless we get 100%, we think we can't accept it. This is that "All-or-nothing thinking" that you probably covered in your CBT. We need to learn to accept that having a possibility that something isn't what we think, is ok too. Some things are yes & no, others shades of grey and this is where we struggle. It makes perfect sense when you consider the fight or flight reaction which is looking to evaluate any risks and take an action that saves us. But if you think about fight or flight, how would running save you without any risk of being caught and how would fighting ensure you came out the victor? They don't so even at that raw level there is always doubt and acceptance has to be practiced. It's just more intuitive I guess.
The thing is, germs are not always going to harm us. If I don't wash my hands before I eat, I won't end up ill because of that. Our immune system can cope with it. This is the type of thing you need to use in rationalising & challenging thoughts and then as you use exposure you can use that to help you through it.
I know I've mentioned this before, and I don't want to appear as pursuading you to leave here because I don't think you need to, but would using the free forum on somewhere like OCD UK help? I'm just thinking there will be more people with contamination issues on there. I understand a fair bit about OCD in generation and loads about intrusive thoughts but not much about some types like this and I worry about you getting the right support because you don't get many replies on your threads.
-
Re: Everything contaminated
Just a though Phil... Obviously, I'm going to reiterate getting professional help. It's very wasteful (and expensive) discarding items due to your fears. If you are going to do that, why not donate them to the Salvation Army or a charity. There are many families that would be thankful to get perfectly good items.
Certainly the best possible scenario would be to get a handle on this but don't just discard things if someone can benefit.
Positive thoughts
-
Re: Everything contaminated
So should I be trying to use this Hoover and not worry and if I use it and get anxious that won't be good?
-
Re: Everything contaminated
Think about it... you come into contact with more "things" just going to the grocery store or shopping for new items to replace the one's you discarded.
Ultimately, getting a grip on your OCD would be the best investment.
Positive thoughts
-
Re: Everything contaminated
I managed to hold off selling the Hoover tonight. I'm now worried about a fan I got as my girlfriend stood near a bag in the toilet which is had to be unblocked from the toilet.
I worry my house will never be the same if I use the Hoover but at the same time it would cost be more for a new Hoover and it is sealed so maybe it is clean? The thought of toilet germs makes me want to throw away ..can I resist?
-
Re: Everything contaminated
Perhaps this is something to try. If you dropped a $50 note in the toilet, would you throw it away? Maybe think of the items like the Hoover and the bucket and such like actual real money. If that doesn't work, I'll give you my address and you can send it to me :D
Positive thoughts
PS... your house will be different every time you use the Hoover... cleaner!
Positive thoughts
-
Re: Everything contaminated
I think FMP has a good point there with the donation. Just take it to the shops though, don't let the vulture companies pick them up (on commission) or the thieves that steal stuff out of the donation bins. (can't stand them!) Ideally you don't want to give into the obsession as it will only makes things worse but until you can control it, someone might as welll benefit.
Well done for holding onto the hoover, that shows you can confront the fear. Yes, you can resist it, you've just proved it. You need to have faith in yourself and keep going.
I've read a paper on the pitfalls of ERP that was useful and seen a TV programme (briefly) where contamination is raised in them. The paper explained how you take the patient through the hierarchy (or ladder) from the least to worst fear. Then you take them one step on the ladder further beyond their fear to do something a normal non anxious person wouldn't do. For contamination it mentioned how this might mean putting your hands on the inside of the toilet. I've seen that on a programme too. It must sound horrible but it's only when someone has worked through a list of progressively difficult exposures to ensure they can achieve it so you are much more in control & stronger at this point. A bit like that floating %50 note really.
Do you think you could use that hoover on a small patch of carpet somewhere in your house? Even if it is somewhere you rarely go or use? How does it make you feel? Can you expand on that patch a little bit at a time until you have done the room? How do you feel now? How do you feel being in there through out this?
That might be a way to try to work through it but it's just a quick thought, you need proper guidance.
-
Re: Everything contaminated
I have been thinking about it most of the day that now but today I opened the Hoover box and inspected it in all its plastic packets but it made no difference to how I felt. In fact I started worrying about the fan now and i also realised if I sold the Hoover I would have to replace everything in the wardrope as I would be giving in to believing a dirty plastic coat hanger was there. I know it was a thinner hanger and my mum said that and she said it was binned however I googled OCD help and faults thoughts can be common.
As I said in my other posts I worry my house is unclean so moving to a new one I want to be extra clean. However even if it was a dirty hanger the box was sealed yet for some reason I fear the Hoover being dirty I don't get why the OCD can be so powerful? When I wake up I think "Hoover"..last week I wanted to dispose of my iPhone and iPod as I feared my backside wasn't clean enough when I was using it so I worried touching my clothes spread germs and contaminated my iPhone. Luckily I have kept it but I was going to dispose or sell of my iPod. Cheaper items are easier to dispose of however I think now buying a new mop bucket was not required but I got it as when I came out the shower I worried dirt got in it and it would spread into my new house.
Anything stored at my girlfriends house is "safe" other than she has cats so I worry they may urinate on it.
You are right I need a solution because I'm sure even if my new house is clean there may be a situation comes up where something wasn't clean enough and I would dispose of things. A solution is maybe for everything to be exposed or contaminated in my mind as end up feeling exhausted and the thoughts ease. When it's a dear item I'm like well I can't afford to replace. I'm glad I'm not a millionaire as genuinely I would buy and replace and prob throw right into a bin.
When I google OCD help it all fits in with how I feel. Is my mind telling lies about the coat hanger or things not being clean?
As I say my house will feel clean for so long I keep thinking Hoover but I don't know why mind cares so much about that item anyway it was only £30 pounds. :doh:
---------- Post added at 16:07 ---------- Previous post was at 14:25 ----------
Update:
I ordered an upright Hoover the cylinder one is the one I worry is dirty but I was maybe going to get both types anyway what I will do is try and use the cylinder one in small areas in hope I can see it's ok :ohmy: I know it's not ideal but maybe it's better than giving in and throwing away?
-
Re: Everything contaminated
The Hoover I've bought is worse than the one I'm worried about so I have been considering buying a 3rd Hoover (same as the one i' I'm worried about) and selling the other but my bank will be almost zero. I don't know why I'm so worried about this Hoover I'm obsessed about it
-
Re: Everything contaminated
This is the thing, Phil; no house anywhere is ever clean. We clean to reduce things and remove bacteria but we don't get everything in our house as it's impossible. You would to live in a sealed box and keep cleaning it because your own body would contaminate it.
You could tell yourself that hanger touched you and you touched X & Y and they were touching this or that or maybe the germs moved off them onto Z. It's never ending.
Some people become even more severe and start the bleach routines. If you ever get to a stage like that, you really need to tell your GP.
This is the crux of the issues, you can't solve it because it's irrational. You can only try to mitigate all those risks that you think about or in some cases don't because you don't even understand why you are needing to do something. I didn't know why I was using a compulsion to mitigate a risk in some of mine and sometimes I didn't even understand what the outcome would be either if I didn't.
This is where exposure comes into play. You need to be in a situation and stay in it without avoidance or using a safety behaviour. Usually they say wait until your anxiety reduces by 50% to make the exercise a success. You repeat this again & again and you do something everyday, if possible. Then you step it up a notch to the next item on the hierarchy and repeat. You keep going until you clear the hierarchy. If you get stuck because a step is too hard, you go back a step an insert a "stepping stone" to get to closer to that next level.
So, if you were an agoraphobic you may start out by standing by the back door, moe onto standing in the back door, then setting foor out, then a bit more & more, then the front door, then further from home, etc.
You hit the nail on the head with the millionaire comment. You would do that. It will never be enough because your subconscious will just plague you with a new problem. Each time you buy a new hoover, it reassures you. All reassurance is brief in these disorders and reinforces them.
What is really good to see though is that you are opening up about this and talking about tackling it. I've read your threads for a while and I think FMP has too and I hope he agrees with me when I say this is the first one where you have gone this far with trying to understand it and wanting to move forwards. In the past I have felt you have been too consumed with the problem itself and not with moving forwards and whilst you have this issue still, and with a specific object in the hoover right now, you are researching help and showing you want to get out of this. Thats a step forward for me.
OCD does create false memories. Some people believe they have run people over and worry they will be arrested.
OCD is powerful, just like any anxiety disorder. I used to have to check every lamp post on my walks, every front door number was read, every licence plate, etc. I would go back hundreds of meters to check one if I thought I had missed it and then have to do all the others again too. But I don't do any of that anymore. I won't lie to you, I do still get the thought but my mind then lets it pass through. I did that by spending time looking at the lamp post numbers because I wanted to and I told myself "I am standing here looking at this becauase I have decided to, not because my anxiety wants to make do it". I would use the Mindfulness and look at more than the numbers and examine the sounds, temperature, the wind, how I felt about this, etc. If I get that split second urge now, I recognise it as an observer and I let it go.
Imagine how much better your life would be if you could do the same with the thoughts about germs or this hoover? I'm not recovered, I'm on my recovery journey but I'm a million miles away from where I was a few years ago.
-
Re: Everything contaminated
Been reading your thread.
I came across this and I was wondering if it would help you.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/articl...-of-everything
-
Re: Everything contaminated
Quote:
Originally Posted by
shakey1961
Thanks yes maybe.
Last night I tried to forget about it but I was so close to ordering another Hoover again. However as I said I'd give in and think everything else was contaminated so I wouldn't use it if I believed my OCD. The box was sealed what germs could have got in? I know the coat hanger probably wasn't even the same but my head tells me if I use this Hoover my house will stink, it will be dirty, I'd have to change the carpets ect all these horrible thoughts. I guess letting it sit in the box naturalises my fear at the moment as I can use the other hover.
It seems so real though I don't know why my mind keeps going over the Hoover. There was a shirt in the cupboard I'me maybe 2/10 anxious on yet it's this Hoover. Even a brush for outside was that there but that's not causing anxiety. I think the fact I keep thinking "omg it's dirty" makes me want to sell maybe rather than the actual situation that I dismissed as the box was sealed and it prob wasnt that hanger?
It's this powerful thought about it being dirty which makes me want to sell to ease the anxiety but in this case it won't as it will be wasting money and making me worry the rest is contaminated..if only I could believe the Hoover is clean? Will it ease?
-
Re: Everything contaminated
Update:
I gave in I bought a third cylinder Hoover the one I got the other day was upright. I thought having a different type would be enough to ease my anxiety. Good news is the new Hoover is only £15 more and someone is buying the one I'm worried about being contaminated.
I know i need help for this as I'm also worrying about other contents in my wardrope. I feel weak for giving in but it was so powerful I felt the urge to get rid..anybody else with OCD feel the urge to dispose of stuff? :blush:
-
Re: Everything contaminated
The thing is, Phil, a seal on a box isn't necessarily to keep out bacteria. So, is anything truelly ever free? Do the people on the production lines spray or wipe down everything before they put them in the box? So, this is where anxiety & OCD are selective and not looking at things rationally; it's tunnel vision on the obsession. Our bodies are covered in bacteria and it's in the air so just taking it out of the box means it's contaminated but why doesn't your OCD see that? It's because it's irrational in nature because if you wanted to rationally determine how bacteria could get on the hoover, you would be saying something like I have here.
Right now it's intense but yes it can ease and yes it can go to complete recovery as well. The thoughts can still come but it's the fact the reaction changes so they don't bother you anymore and those thoughts just come a lot less. I know this because I've been on that journey and for the majority of my OCD I am now out of the other side of it. What you are saying here is exactly what I was saying to myself when I was walking the streets checking every written sign or number in sight and many more compulsions.
I know how powerful it seems, it owned my life from waking to sleeping for over a year before I started finding ways to deal with it.
Don't feel bad for giving in. I performed hundreds of compulsions each day as mine were quick rituals opposed to what you are going through. In terms of me giving in, it was within the first 5 minutes of getting out of bed and probably 10+ times by then! Until you have recovered from OCD, you will give into it but each time to don't you are moving closer towards controlling it and letting it go.
Trying to forget an obsession or intrusive thoughts or worries just makes you think about them more. It's been proven in studies. It makes sense when you think about it because you are setting your mind a task and saying "mind, I don't want to think about this anymore" and what does your mind do? It starts to go to work trying to stop thinking but how can you stop thinking by starting thinking? You can't. This is why acceptance works better because you acknowledge thoughts as merely thoughts and let them go. It's hard to master and my personal preference is Mindfulness as it teaches it in stages as opposed to the many books that just tell you do it and leave you scratching your head about.
If you sell the hoover or even give it away to charity, it's giving in. This feeds the anxiety disorder. But thats ok, you can't be expected to resolve an anxiety disorder overnight so whilst you give in now, you will learn not to later and then you won't be selling or giving away your hoover.
As You know, it's the hoover now thats your main focus. If you threw all 3 hoovers in the bin within a matter of days you would be focussing on another object as another main problem. It may be one of the lesser worrying objects it turns to next or something completely new, but it will happen. Thats just OCD.
-
Re: Everything contaminated
You were right my worry is something else now but I have also been dwelling on the fact I now feel I wasted money buying another two hovers.
Tonight when I came out the shower a tiny piece of toilet paper maybe fell from my under wear it was next to a coffee table yes in sealed box as I am moving so worried that's contaminated now. Also I have had thoughts like the cushions on my cupard are contaminated with the coat hanger too.
I sit all night depressed in bed worrying about this when its to intense and all I will feel is how all these different things could be dirty when I move out I know these thoughts will come. I will have "safe items" or safe areas of the house. It's mostly toilet related stuff it's not the getting ill from germs it's more the fact most toilet stuff is horrible to think about and it's not going to feel new or totally clean I know toilet traces got near it. This has happened before small bits of toilet paper and I never got as anxious I just swept it now I'm worried a lot.
So yes the way it's going I will feel everything is dirty I wish I could be more
Clean I freak even if any small traces or participles of toilet paper hit the floor when wiping if it sparks out or of the toilet bowl splashes but this doesn't worry me as much as I use to. But with the coffee table I'm now like "omg
I can't put my remote on it as its dirty" ..it's never ending this anxiety :lac:
---------- Post added at 02:18 ---------- Previous post was at 02:17 ----------
Like I am worried I will make my new home unclean of I blocked toilets or something
And had thoughts like it would be dirty for 100's of years
-
Re: Everything contaminated
Yeah, I had a feeling you would kick yourself over the money. This is common in OCD, we get annoyed with ourselves and admonish ourselves for being stupid to do it all
The thing with germs is, you can't see them. So, they could be flying off that toilet paper as you are dropping it on the floor.
You are having unreasonable thoughts based on perfectionism, a typical OCD issue. Changing your thoughts so that you accept that perfect is never what we achieve is something you can do. You need to learn that this is ok.
Your home not being perfectly clean is how everyone's home is. Unless someone seals themselves in a bubble and uses something that kills everything off, it will never be fully clean. This is another distorted thought here because you can't even seen if something is perfectly clean, you can only see what is clean to the naked eye. It's not like you are using a very powerful magnifying glass to look for microscopic dirt.
So, you need to be telling yourself that it is ok for something not to be perfectly clean. You say you want to be cleaner but I bet if we all came around your place on an NMP coachtrip we would all see an extremely clean environment and be remarking about how it's cleaner than ours.
There is an opportunity to use the ERP approach but also the cognitive side of CBT so that you consciously acknowledge that it is ok to put that remote on the table because the table & the remote will have microscopic dirt on them but thats ok and you wouldn't even be aware of it, just like everyone else and they don't care.
-
Re: Everything contaminated
So do you think the germs reached into the box or am I being over paranoid? I know there will be germs on anything as its assembled ect but I'm more worried about toilet germs my head says the table is spoiled or the Hoover is spoiled? And I get that urge to throw away?
-
Re: Everything contaminated
May I ask a question Phil? How do you think the germs get into the box? Is the box sealed or open when they get in?
Could I also add, would it not help ease your fears if before and after you used or stored something, you wiped it down with disinfectant? I'm just thinking from a cost point of view. I don't want to increase your OCD, but might it help if you had some spray solution that you could wipe over whatever you think is contaminated? It would not be contaminated after you'd wiped it down. Just a thought that it may calm your fears a bit.
-
Re: Everything contaminated
Phil,
After reading this and just about all your other threads, it's painfully obvious that intensive professional help is needed to help you overcome your OCD and fears. I don't know what anyone could say (that hasn't already been said) that would truly help. I know you've been on meds and have had therapy but I haven't seen a reference to that recently. It just seems you're really stuck and it's not getting better.
I truly wish you the best.
Positive thoughts
-
Re: Everything contaminated
Just be careful with using solutions to clean with, some people with OCD progress into self harm e.g. bleachig their hands. If you get urges to do that, make sure you contact your GP.
This is the thing, Phil, everything everywhere has germs on. We can't live in a world without them. Unless you live in a special facility that the scientists or medical professionals clean for you, you are living in a world with bacteria, germs, dirt, etc. This is the thing with Cognitive Distortions, you aren't seeing that you are using your eyes to look for dirt when that won't even show you everything anyway. You need to change your thinking so that you accept that these things exist all around you and that there is a normal range of cleaning and then there is an obsessive disorder distorting & skewing your thinking towards things being contaminated.
A question. How do you ensure that something microscopic doesn't fall off toilet paper than you use? Do you somehow wipe with your bottom inside the toilet and the paper & your bottom doesn't come out? Then even after you have wiped, how do you know your bottom is completely clean at a microscopic level? You don't and it won't be unless you use something to kill anything that could be there and toilet paper doesn't do that. So, how do you know that when you are standing wiping or that when you stand up, something doesn't fall off and touch the floor or your clothes? (something microscopic) You don't. So, do you immediately take off your clothes and wash them, wash the mats/carpets, clean the seat, etc? If you did, what about the things you touched before that around the room? Do you stand there naked and not leave the room until it has be cleaned as well as your body?
That might be triggering, and I apologise if it is, but thats the reality and not what you OCD is having you concentrate on. Your OCD has your attention on certain elements of the process, not the whole process. This is where things like Cognitive Distortions come into play in our thinking. We aren't looking at it like an analyst, scientist or trained person would. So, we are leaving gaps in reviewing the process and focussing on certain elements that are OCD is telling us may be a problem.
So, in challenging such thoughts to change your thinking you look at things end-to-end like above.
I bet you have got a whole load of "what ifs" going on in your heard with this. Challenge negative "what ifs" with positive "what ifs". Say "what if X isn't dirty", "what if nothing is wrong", etc. At least 3 or more for each negative.
I also think this forum lacks for OCD. I would encourage you to look at a charity such as OCD UK which has a free forum as you will find more people who have been through this who will be able to tell you what they had to do and what their therapists guided them with.
For me, the throwing away is an escalation and could lead onto more things and that needs addressing. I think you should be talking to your GP too and getting referred onto CBT for this but I also know that you can conquer this without that and with the support of others who understand. It really means taking the steps to deal with it though whichever route you take.
-
Re: Everything contaminated
Since this post I have had lots of worries.
I bought a new floor mop as the other new one may have been contaminated.
I fear the toilet germs will move over to the new house. If I block a toilet or what if somebody touched something before and they never cleaned there hands enough and my stuff is contaminated?
The bin issue worries me all those germs spread around. Even the idea of anybody not washing there hands makes me worry. Blocking toilets is quite unclean so as much as I try to be clean I am making it unclean too if it won't flush. How can I ease these worries? :blush:
-
Re: Everything contaminated
Quote:
Originally Posted by
phil06
How can I ease these worries? :blush:
What do you think the answer to that question is? (Hint: It's not another new Hoover).
Positive thoughts
-
Re: Everything contaminated
It gets no better I don't move out for a week now which is not long but I am sick of living with my parents.
Another toilet bag was used to unblock a toilet now it was left on the carpet and my girlfriend put something in the bin so she touched stuff in my room I duno if she cleaned her hands but I am worried my phone charger is dirty now now my new iPhone is dirty too.
My parents used a box from the bin the other day too and touched dishes after cleaning up cat poo. I am really struggling as I feel my parents are not that clean these days. The toilet bag issue is a big problem as my mum thinks just putting on a carpet is ok rather than disposing of it somewhere better?
I am now moving into a house in a week now I can control germs better but I am very anxious half of my items in my room are contaminated? I hate when this happens as I get thoughts like "phone is dirty" and I can have this thought for months maybe forever as I remember it was unclean. What can I do about this anxiety? Will it be better in my own house without my parents being so unclean? :blush:
-
Re: Everything contaminated
Hi Phil,
You will have more control over your environment so you will be able to manage some of it better but it will likely be an avoidance in some ways too and just feed the irrational fears of contamination. Thats the problem with anxiety, you avoid things and your bubble gets smaller.
You ideally need some time doing some exposure work so that you learn to cope with the possibility of something being unclean. The more you do that and work upwards through a hierarchy, the more you will regain your life over this.
Did you try ERP before?
-
Re: Everything contaminated
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MyNameIsTerry
Hi Phil,
You will have more control over your environment so you will be able to manage some of it better but it will likely be an avoidance in some ways too and just feed the irrational fears of contamination. Thats the problem with anxiety, you avoid things and your bubble gets smaller.
You ideally need some time doing some exposure work so that you learn to cope with the possibility of something being unclean. The more you do that and work upwards through a hierarchy, the more you will regain your life over this.
Did you try ERP before?
No not tried it. I mean I still get the urge to clean my hands at work but I have a little more control. At home the anxiety is like 10/10 but maybe 4 or 5 out of ten outside even that can affect my day.
I just fear all my items are dirty i tell myself well I will change phones or tv in a year or two anyway and eventually as the years ago on the anxiety from my parents house can ease but I am still obsessively buying. I got a new sky remote as I worried my old one had germs.
When I move out i would probably use a plunger for the toilet rather than bags so I wouldn't have this anxiety just my parents deal with it in an unclean way.
I void be doing with more help with hand wash it and showering ocd as sometimes I use a whole tub of shower gel in one shower and my hands can be rough with cracks in the skin with hand washing ..
---------- Post added at 13:53 ---------- Previous post was at 12:12 ----------
I am now worried my phone is contaminated as I put it in the phone charger my girlfriend touched before and she used the bin and I never seen her wash her hands so can't confirm if it's clean? My phone will be unclean anywhere I now
-
Re: Everything contaminated
I have this but in a strange albeit similar way. If I, or someone I know has been to a funeral I can't eat the food at the wake or touch anyone's clothes including mine after. They would have to be thrown away. I think I associate anything (food, clothes etc) that comes in to contact with a funeral as carrying negativity. I have never heard anyone else having this before so if anyone else this please let me know :)
-
Re: Everything contaminated
I fear my tv is contaminated and phone and the cost to replace both is around £800 or more so can't afford to unlike the cheaper Hoover. I may wall mount the tv my head says it will forever contaminate the flat? I know things would be unclean but I never seen my girlfriend was her hands she said she did but I can't be there to be sure as I was sleeping.
I will probably spend a long time worrying over this now. The toilet being unblocked and dirty toilet paper being put in a bag causes me a lot of anxiety it's very unhygienic and it's almost like dropping a phone down a toilet you wouldn't use it again you know? Or maybe people do I don't know.
Toilet water is probably my biggest worry or toilets being blocked and the germs it will spread. I don't worry about being ill from it I just fear it will contaminate everything and the anxiety has spread where I now worry and get thoughts these gems being passed around everyday life and buses shops surfaces won't be clean and who knows what else is dirty? I think of all the mess toilets can cause and it doesn't ease my worry.
Others probably don't worry but I want to throw away as I will forever get a thought of it being near dirty toilet bag or something? TV now has germs forever like it's been spoiled that's how my anxiety feels. By iPad is the same it no longer feels perfect as my girlfriend touched her feet and her feet have been on the floor in the bathroom so my screen is now contaminated like sewage if you get sewage on things you dispose of it this is how I feel does that make sense? It's awful because right now almost everything is contaminated in my life and it will cost thousands to replace :weep:
---------- Post added at 00:45 ---------- Previous post was at 00:42 ----------
Spent £200 plus on a new washing machine too as I refuse to wash my clothes in the one left in the house as it's been used.
-
Re: Everything contaminated
What help are you currently getting with all this Phil ? Has your Dr suggested anyTherapy?
Everything in life is contaminated. Germs can be killed off with the appropriate cleaning solutions.
-
Re: Everything contaminated
This is the thing about how irrational anxiety can be. You are worried about contamination but your worries are based on toilet gems, not all the other germs we come into contact with on a daily basis.
Another selectivity is going to around your girlfriend. The human body always has germs on it (and in it) yet you must have physical contact with her (and other people) and again you don't seem to have a concern unless toilet germs are involved.
The recommended treatment for OCD is CBT but specifically the ERP component. I'm surprised you didn't have this when you had therapy before because it's a classic treatment for contamination problems.
-
Re: Everything contaminated
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MyNameIsTerry
This is the thing about how irrational anxiety can be. You are worried about contamination but your worries are based on toilet gems, not all the other germs we come into contact with on a daily basis.
Another selectivity is going to around your girlfriend. The human body always has germs on it (and in it) yet you must have physical contact with her (and other people) and again you don't seem to have a concern unless toilet germs are involved.
The recommended treatment for OCD is CBT but specifically the ERP component. I'm surprised you didn't have this when you had therapy before because it's a classic treatment for contamination problems.
My anxiety tells me I need to worry as pre anxiety I was always a clean person. I hate dust and grime. I fear helping this will make me unclean maybe I am even surprised other people find toilet germs acceptable or bad habits? Like I hear of people who use the bathroom and don't wash there hands that's not good is it? If it as to rate my anxiety I would say toilet water or blocked toilets and poo of urine marks would be about 9-10 anxiety not washing hands only makes me feel about 5 using an old towel to wash hands maybe 3. I always remember all the bits of the bathroom which may be unclean and there's areas or handles I won't touch without washing my hands and I often get the urge to throw away or dispose or sell items. Selling is more common like the Hoover one I regret selling it however if I still had it I would probably still worry it had germs even though in a sealed box that made no sense.
-
Re: Everything contaminated
Another day worrying my new phone is boring already as I don't feel it's clean and been looking at new TVs as I fear mine is contaminated? What if she touched it with dirty hands but what if she did wash them and are clean? I'm worried these dirty unclean things will come to my new house now.
My head now says it will take years to fix this as I will have to replace everything I own before I feel things are "safe". I have a worry for almost everything I own now and think how it may have got dirty or if people touched it without washing hands.
:blush:
My only comfort can be keeping my new flat as clean as possible..
-
Re: Everything contaminated
I also fear putting the tv on the will contaminate the walls as my girlfriend touched it and I can't confirm if she cleaned her hands so my house could be forever dirty. What do I do keep my tv, let the anxiety win and just place it on a stand? How can I deal with this?