Benzodiazipenes, neurotransmitters and their actions

[SarahH]

Listen you both have exceptional knowledge but you lose me in the overly long explanations. I M SURE others understand it but I don't always. I will try to keep up.

Just a little personal note..and I don't want to interfere with the big argument that is going on..but I find Ricardo is ALSO great on here. PLEASE could you all try to get along. Its really sad to loose anyone from NMP

Sarah

[MyNameIsTerry]

Listen you both have exceptional knowledge but you lose me in the overly long explanations. I M SURE others understand it but I don't always. I will try to keep up.

Just a little personal note..and I don't want to interfere with the big argument that is going on..but I find Ricardo is ALSO great on here. PLEASE could you all try to get along. Its really sad to loose anyone from NMP

Sarah

Just ask if you need any help, Sarah, and I'll try.

I'm afraid I can't help on the last issue, I don't know why Ricardo chose to say certain things to me and since there was no answer before he left, its a dead issue now.

[MyNameIsTerry]

Updating previous Day vs. %:

The plasma levels issue is in relation to "steady-state" which is 4-5 half lives of any drug. It looks like this:

HL.......%
1........50
2........75
3........87.5
4........93.75
5........96.875
6........98.4735
7........99.25

Clear elimination has the following:

HL.......%
0.........100
1.........50
2.........25
3.........12.50
4.........6.25
5.........3.13

When its under 5% its no longer clinically significant. It's more complicated than this when you consider how people taper as it will mean some overlap and then with some meds (e.g. Benzo's) you also have the storage outside of blood plasma which also needs elimination.

Factors involved in speed of distribution (drug starting to work) & elimination (clearance out of blood plasma) can be things like age (children differ, there are specific calculations for age that can be used for older people), speed of metabolism, weight (which will impact on metabolism), renal insufficiency conditions, etc. There are some very complicated guides on the internet for those interested such as some books on pharmacokinetics on Google Books but they are very difficult to understand without a medical background.

[MyNameIsTerry]

Posting in a very useful thread about future types of meds by NoPoet as it shows the range of neurotransmitters that pharmaceutical companies are looking to exploit in meds that could be useful in the future:

http://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/showthread.php?t=54701

It will be interesting to see how dopamine, glutamate and GABA all fit together in future meds on top of the current types e.g. SNRI's and the later variants that added a 3rd & 4th neurotransmitter system to them.

[chickenhawk]

I have depended on Ativan for the past 4 years as a safety net for occasional panic, and to get an occasional good nights sleep. I have used it at the rate of 1/2mg per week, (ie once a week, sometimes twice a week, sometimes none). Because I keep a meds diary, I know I have taken between 20 and 30 mgs a year. This year so far I am up to 25mg. Now I am too scared to take it anymore because I have read articles that say that benzos, along with tri-cyclics and sedating antihistamines, ie anticholinergics, are linked to brain damage and 'frontal temporal dementia'. As if I dont have enough to panic about already! I have long-standing GAD and agaraphobia, and am facing a home move in the next couple of weeks and not coping well. Doc prescribed some valium to help me over the worst of it, but again, too scared to take this stuff anymore, as I am in the older age group and feel like a sitting duck for dementia as it is! Now I feel I have nothing to fall back on and don;t know what to do. I am not on any other meds, but at this rate will end up on something, if I have a complete breakdown over this move (which is huge for me). Anyone else worried about this? I'm really sorry to bring up a stressful subject.

[MyNameIsTerry]

I have depended on Ativan for the past 4 years as a safety net for occasional panic, and to get an occasional good nights sleep. I have used it at the rate of 1/2mg per week, (ie once a week, sometimes twice a week, sometimes none). Because I keep a meds diary, I know I have taken between 20 and 30 mgs a year. This year so far I am up to 25mg. Now I am too scared to take it anymore because I have read articles that say that benzos, along with tri-cyclics and sedating antihistamines, ie anticholinergics, are linked to brain damage and 'frontal temporal dementia'. As if I dont have enough to panic about already! I have long-standing GAD and agaraphobia, and am facing a home move in the next couple of weeks and not coping well. Doc prescribed some valium to help me over the worst of it, but again, too scared to take this stuff anymore, as I am in the older age group and feel like a sitting duck for dementia as it is! Now I feel I have nothing to fall back on and don;t know what to do. I am not on any other meds, but at this rate will end up on something, if I have a complete breakdown over this move (which is huge for me). Anyone else worried about this? I'm really sorry to bring up a stressful subject.

Have you got an article we can look at?

The last one I saw was in the British Medical Journal (BMJ) and it made NO connection between Benzo's and Dementia. It only established that there were older people on Benzo's that had dementia but it was completely unknown whether their symptoms of anxiety leading to treatment with Benzo's was actually Dementia's early symptoms.

[dally]

I have depended on Ativan for the past 4 years as a safety net for occasional panic, and to get an occasional good nights sleep. I have used it at the rate of 1/2mg per week, (ie once a week, sometimes twice a week, sometimes none). Because I keep a meds diary, I know I have taken between 20 and 30 mgs a year. This year so far I am up to 25mg. Now I am too scared to take it anymore because I have read articles that say that benzos, along with tri-cyclics and sedating antihistamines, ie anticholinergics, are linked to brain damage and 'frontal temporal dementia'. As if I dont have enough to panic about already! I have long-standing GAD and agaraphobia, and am facing a home move in the next couple of weeks and not coping well. Doc prescribed some valium to help me over the worst of it, but again, too scared to take this stuff anymore, as I am in the older age group and feel like a sitting duck for dementia as it is! Now I feel I have nothing to fall back on and don;t know what to do. I am not on any other meds, but at this rate will end up on something, if I have a complete breakdown over this move (which is huge for me). Anyone else worried about this? I'm really sorry to bring up a stressful subject.

Chicken hawk
I had been taking Valium 4 mg once/twice weekly to help me through exposure therapy for agoraphobia.
Eventually, I realised I was building a tolerance/additiction to the drug when my panic was increasing/becoming more severe, and frequent. yet vanishing on taking the drug!! Duh.
Ironically it did help me to attempt my exposure therapy tasks, which did improve overall!

Moving home will be so stressfull, and I do believe taking a SHORT course will be beneficial to you. But I would def try to find other ways of dealing with long-term anxiety after that.

There is the danger of turning everything into a major stressful event that ONLY a benzo can fix.

I haven't taken any vakium since Feb 2015. I had just over a month of withdrawal symptoms, which SHOCKED me because, I thought I was taking so little and so infrequently!!!

I do worry now because I don't have anything (meds) to turn to 'if' I am in a desperate state