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Thread: the EU & the UK

  1. #1231
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    Re: the EU & the UK

    Ages ago on this thread I remember saying if they don't sort it they will allow Farage to rise from the flames. And here we have the same situation Cameron thought he could end, whilst he opened a far bigger can of worms in the process:https://www.express.co.uk/news/polit...ction-poll/amp
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  2. #1232
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    Re: the EU & the UK

    Quote Originally Posted by MyNameIsTerry View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MyNameIsTerry View Post
    Ages ago on this thread I remember saying if they don't sort it they will allow Farage to rise from the flames. And here we have the same situation Cameron thought he could end, whilst he opened a far bigger can of worms in the process:https://www.express.co.uk/news/polit...ction-poll/amp
    Polls. Hmm. Now a very famous event in 2016 had a lot of polls running up to it that were completely wrong in the end so maybe all isn't lost for those wanting a Remain win?

    It is interesting though that the Tory vote is collapsing into TBP's lap and also that the Labour vote is stagnant. I expect some are shifting from Tory & Labour into the centre ground, as they see it, of the LibDems...but why aren't the LibDems doing well in the polls? They did well in the local elections but that result doesn't feel reflected in polling for the EP elections.

    Labour might find their votes leeching to Farage next as Corbyn is very unpopular in many areas but what is probably saving him is his fence sitting. Labour voters might be hanging on hoping he will commit to Leave. If he commits to Remain and a People's Vote I question whether they will lose a load of votes to TBP in the process.

    As for Chukka & Soubry...looks like you lot backed the wrong horse I've seen people being very critical about their propping up of Tory votes in certain areas...hardly change then, eh?
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  3. #1233
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    Re: the EU & the UK

    16th July 2018 from me:

    Quote Originally Posted by MyNameIsTerry View Post
    To be fair to Davis, did he even have a job? May seemed to take it over soon after.

    Before the result we never had "hard" or "soft" if any other term. It was our of the EU and despite some later slipperyness we were told it meant out of the SM & CU. But it's too simplistic in a joined up world where we work together on so many issues so there was always going to be some affiliations.

    But I can remember the EFTA being talked about by prominent Leave campaigners so "soft" was always out there. Leaving had a spectrum of possibilities where Leavers themselves differed.

    I have to laugh though. I see many of the "you voted to get sovereignty back and now moan the judges say government have to decide" are often the same bunch saying they want a 2nd red on the deal. Hypocrisy exists in both sides.

    But it has to happen. You don't turn your back on the biggest vote with 17.4 votes on one side. It wouldn't address the issues which would just come bubbling back up but this time with a lot more people behind them. How many Remain voters would approve of opening the door to ignoring democratic votes?

    Who would anyone even vote for? Those UKIP voters who returned to the Tories & Labour would leave again. More might join them. Labour might come off better but many may not trust them either given their poor performance, lack of clear position, etc. UKIP may rise from the flames and now they are the anti Muslim party it makes voting for them even more distasteful. But there would be no one else to vote for as the 3 mainstream parties would be Remainers at that point.

    The political backlash would dwarf previous concerns and we could be stuck with hung Parliaments and minority governments.
    It didn't take any political smarts to work that one out, particularly if Farage came back.
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  4. #1234
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    Re: the EU & the UK

    Quote Originally Posted by MyNameIsTerry View Post
    Ages ago on this thread I remember saying if they don't sort it they will allow Farage to rise from the flames. And here we have the same situation Cameron thought he could end, whilst he opened a far bigger can of worms in the process:https://www.express.co.uk/news/polit...ction-poll/amp
    I get quite sad that Brexiteers have Nigel Farage to represent them. Hes as much a political chancer as Boris Johnson. Hes rarely held to account in interviews and when he is his line is that the interviewee is completely off the mark.

    Manifesto is a poisoned word according to Nigel which allows him to be as vague as he wants on Brexit Party policy.

    He is able to hold a line regards No Deal which is completely different to what he said prior to the referendum where he thought that a Norway deal or some sort of deal is wat Brexiteers were voting for, not a No Deal.

    However its easy enough to believe that the Brexit Party will romp home on Thursday 23rd May in the EU elections partly due to the despair that the general populace have with Brexit, so many folks I know who are pro and anti Brexit are not going to vote, they don't see the point, its odd as for me its always important to vote.
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  5. #1235
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    Re: the EU & the UK

    More scaremongering stuff from Blair:

    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknew...cid=spartanntp

    Pretty clear he wants people to vote LibDem.

    Would a "silent revolution" actually be a bad thing? He talks about it sweeping aside a two party system which holds us back...although he seems to think this is bad? Who knows how that would look but this two party system is a lot to blame foe why we are here where we are now.

    I have no idea he's waffling on about here though...

    He said: "People talk about how you have to avoid those who feel strongly pro-Brexit, you have to avoid them rioting on the streets and this outburst of populism.
    Yep, we are all rioters. Idiot. More scaremongering...popularism? The kind of thing that comes out of the mouths of the very people he is criticising.
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  6. #1236
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    Re: the EU & the UK

    Hmm. Guy Verhofstadt thinks be should he campaigning in the UK under the guise of supporting the shared group of parties that are LibDems. Apparently he thinks that's fine as it's Europe. Nope, I think you'll find Europe is a bigger area than EU states. How arrogant it must sound to them, that they aren't even considered part of Europe? But we must remember to start sending more politicians over when other countries have elections quoting him as to why we should be there: https://www.express.co.uk/news/polit...erhofstadt/amp
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  7. #1237
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    Re: the EU & the UK

    Quote Originally Posted by MyNameIsTerry View Post
    More scaremongering stuff from Blair:

    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknew...cid=spartanntp

    Pretty clear he wants people to vote LibDem.

    Would a "silent revolution" actually be a bad thing? He talks about it sweeping aside a two party system which holds us back...although he seems to think this is bad? Who knows how that would look but this two party system is a lot to blame foe why we are here where we are now.

    I have no idea he's waffling on about here though...



    Yep, we are all rioters. Idiot. More scaremongering...popularism? The kind of thing that comes out of the mouths of the very people he is criticising.

    I don't think the multiple party voting works unless you have proportional representation then you get smaller parties able to leverage the actual vote that they get in the HoC.
    We are not a 2 party political system, we are a first past the post system that advantages larger parties that may only gather 60-70 % of the vote amongst them and it diminishes the vote that the smaller parties get.
    Proportional representation also would have meant that UKIP would have been able to leverage on behalf of Brexiteers more in the HoC as Greens & Lib Dems would have been able to push the Green agenda more.

    I can't believe that the Lib Dems let the Tories push them into that Alternate Voting system rubbish during the coalition.
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  8. #1238
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    Re: the EU & the UK

    Quote Originally Posted by MyNameIsTerry View Post
    Hmm. Guy Verhofstadt thinks be should he campaigning in the UK under the guise of supporting the shared group of parties that are LibDems. Apparently he thinks that's fine as it's Europe. Nope, I think you'll find Europe is a bigger area than EU states. How arrogant it must sound to them, that they aren't even considered part of Europe? But we must remember to start sending more politicians over when other countries have elections quoting him as to why we should be there: https://www.express.co.uk/news/polit...erhofstadt/amp
    I think Guy has lost the plot.
    This would be interference in our electoral process surely.
    Having said that we did have the US Presidents rock up to support the Good Friday Agreement in Northern Ireland as it was politically presicient for them to do so.
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  9. #1239
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    Re: the EU & the UK

    Today I had an EU election leaflet from Labour and the Tories. An issue I have with the Tory one, other than it being light on details of deals, is the lie that a vote for them will stop these elections...unless they have a Tardis or mean future ones? The issue I have with the Labour one is... It's a GE vote leaflet and other than the first paragraph of working with the EU to secure jobs and the environment the rest of the leaflet is babbling on about inequality and ending austerity. Mostly of no relevance whatsoever to these elections and another Corbyn "just don't ask me about Brexit" attempt.
    Last edited by MyNameIsTerry; 13-05-19 at 17:34.
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  10. #1240
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    Re: the EU & the UK

    Quote Originally Posted by mezzaninedoor View Post
    I think Guy has lost the plot.This would be interference in our electoral process surely.Having said that we did have the US Presidents rock up to support the Good Friday Agreement in Northern Ireland as it was politically presicient for them to do so.
    Special consideration for the US, meddling is "advising", "steering" or "brokering" when they are fiddling around in other countries It looks bad with Guy V with him being so impartial in our future relationship whatever he says. Reminiscent of Obama but he was at least on the outside so I can't see Guy V adding much? Given his statement about stopping this happening again, and whether we will actually leave, it could be interpreted as aimed at Euro skepticism in general across other states or another cancel leaving message or both. I don't buy his reasons and his excuse that he should be involved is very weak.
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