the EU & the UK

[Noivous]

Hey Gotagetthroughthis,

Yes...it seems your media is a lot like ours here. Obama has lied over and over and over right to the face of every single American. I didn't vote for Trump in the primary but I will absolutely support him in the general election. He is a means to an end to the oligarchy and government/media incestuous alliance.

N.

[MyNameIsTerry]

A vote to leave gives more power back to our government, not us really. We can then try to kick them up the backside but that's very hard as they are very self serving. The same with the justice system.

There is a downside to that, what madcap ideas of their own replace the ones we complain about from the EU. So, we can expect a fight for years to come. Plus the EU courts do sometimes allow us to overturn the silly decisions our courts make too.

A lot of the people arguing over all this cite their lack of trust for the persons involved. Cameron takes a fair bashing because of affairs with no connection to the EU. This had introduced a lot of bias, in my opinion. On the other side Gove is less than popular and having IDS join your side is about as useful as James Corden coming on as a sub for Rooney! IDS must be one of the most hated politicians we have among those most likely wanting out.

[Noivous]

Now I know I don't have a dog in this fight...and pardon me for misspeaking if I do...but someone made a point earlier that if you don't leave you will never get another chance. I tend to agree with that - if you don't leave you won't ever know if it would work out for the betterment of the nation...and if you do leave and it doesn't work out (I believe) it wouldn't be all that difficult to get back in the EU.

Again, it's not my country and I know I'm not privy to all the ins and outs of the matter.

N

[Gotagetthroughthis]

A vote to leave gives more power back to our government, not us really. We can then try to kick them up the backside but that's very hard as they are very self serving. The same with the justice system.

There is a downside to that, what madcap ideas of their own replace the ones we complain about from the EU. So, we can expect a fight for years to come. Plus the EU courts do sometimes allow us to overturn the silly decisions our courts make too.

A lot of the people arguing over all this cite their lack of trust for the persons involved. Cameron takes a fair bashing because of affairs with no connection to the EU. This had introduced a lot of bias, in my opinion. On the other side Gove is less than popular and having IDS join your side is about as useful as James Corden coming on as a sub for Rooney! IDS must be one of the most hated politicians we have among those most likely wanting out.

But the thing is we can elect a new party every few years in the UK if we aren't happy with the current government. Not so in the EU. Also things like the cuts to disability benefit that were planned by the British government a few months ago, the outcry by the country stopped that, so we have some power here. We won't have any people power when all laws and decisions are made by the EU.

[MyNameIsTerry]

But the thing is we can elect a new party every few years in the UK if we aren't happy with the current government. Not so in the EU. Also things like the cuts to disability benefit that were planned by the British government a few months ago, the outcry by the country stopped that, so we have some power here. We won't have any people power when all laws and decisions are made by the EU.

But to me, we don't. Labour are just as bad in their different ways and with their current leadership I can't vote for them anyway.

I agree that we have less control because the EU has created a nice club for the elite. There are ways that at least some of our problems could be improved but a total lack of willingness to do it. No corporate would have a problem resolving immigration caps where there existed a disparity between their sites. It's just proof that the EU doesn't work,.

[MyNameIsTerry]

Hey Gotagetthroughthis,

Yes...it seems your media is a lot like ours here. Obama has lied over and over and over right to the face of every single American. I didn't vote for Trump in the primary but I will absolutely support him in the general election. He is a means to an end to the oligarchy and government/media incestuous alliance.

N.

Our media are usually aligned to a specific political party and you can work out which pretty easily after reading a few editions. News channels are less so although the BBC tend to support the current government, which is an echo of their past.

We may get a further ref in the future, they didn't want to give us this one and Tony Blair (Labour) spent several of his terms of PM refusing to address the issue despite Labour being "for the people". But then as MrsCav said earlier, "tricky" Tony was very slippery and a lot has come out about him since...and some is being withheld hoping the public will give up so they can bury it.

Maybe your Obama will be just the same? Obviously, once they finish with Billy Boy Clinton and his associations with sex offenders or if Mrs Billy Boy gets in and shuts it all down, whichever comes first.

I'm not sure what "the great man" Obama has supposed to have done. I think the rest of the world are scratching their heads too. We had him over here lecturing students on "how to change the world" yet I've seen no evidence of his contribution to that so far.

Anyway, back to the ref the same can be said for Scottish independence. They lost and have been told they won't get another. They are still working towards another though. It really means "in your generation" more than anything.

[CeeCeeCee]

I'm not being misled at all. I made my decision based on a lot of things. Also, I tend to take notice and listen to people who I believe are knowledgeable about a subject and are intelligent balanced people.
This is the only time I have ever heard or read about anyone actually supporting Trump, usually people can't even mention him without a roll of the eyes or a look of distain, I personally think its a little scary to be honest, but people have the right to their own opinion...

I also can't understand people who say 'they're all the same' and therefore maybe don't bother to vote, then wonder why nothing is done about the things they care bout.
Politics affects everything in our lives.
Sometimes, you have to just take the 'least bad' in any situation. Corbyn isn't perfect but I'll take him over the likes of Farage and Johnson any time.

Take a listen to Russell Kane on Trump. Its called 'Kaneing' on Youtube...

[MyNameIsTerry]

But I can't see typical Labour voters picking Corbyn. At the last election they could have chosen Milliband, yet didn't. But the left are responsible for a lot of the things that your typical working class people are sick of such as how cushy our jails are, even more immigration (which Corbyn wanted) and the PC madness that we put up with.

I personally can't vote for him anyway as I don't believe in taking a soft approach to terrorism. That and the fact he can't understand why a nuclear deterrent is needed when we hopefully will never need it which is like selling off all those tanks, planes & rifles we don't use either that are ready should we actually experience a real war.

I say 'they're all the same' but that doesn't mean I don't vote. I take the approach that I choose who I believe will wreck the country the least. Why would anything be done? The days of Labour being anything like their original incarnation are well & truly over. All the other parties are pretty pointless unless something major happens. Many of them are just as posh and have no clue about their traditional voters.

I agree with others I've seen questioning whether the current Labour leadership will push people to UKIP. Corbyn is doing nothing about anti-semitism that seems is becoming a more regular occurrence under his leadership and it's hardly much of a brain boggler to understand why.

People are also raising the EU & Corbyn which really won't help his plight. To me, no leader can go against those that pay their bills so he does what he is told but some are calling him a turncoat on this one. I'm not sure what they expect, cash is king. There is a very good reason why the bog companies are avoiding tax and not caring, we need them and they know it.

Lots of people support Trump, that's evident from the fact he is even there now. He won't be popular over here but it's obvious he is in the US. So, I suspect there will be a big difference I discussions over here compared to websites over there.

I still haven't decided on the EU, I've even had my voting card through today.

[Noivous]

I will be voting to stay in, 100%.

Not gong to copy and paste any facts here as they are there for all to see but this poster says a lot I'd say.


Attachment 2668

You are right...you didn't paste any facts. One unflattering picture of a person doesn't say a thing. you said this is the first time you have ever heard of anyone supporting Trump. that proves to me what an insulated world you live in. as I have always said diversity to a liberal is everyone look different but think exactly the same. If you lived in this country you would know that millions and millions of Americans are supporting Trump and for good reason. He has garnered more primary votes than any politician in American history. But you only know of one.

N.

---------- Post added at 12:17 ---------- Previous post was at 10:43 ----------

A very interesting article on the In or Out situation.

http://www.nysun.com/foreign/whither...uestion/89594/

[Gotagetthroughthis]

I'm not being misled at all. I made my decision based on a lot of things. Also, I tend to take notice and listen to people who I believe are knowledgeable about a subject and are intelligent balanced people.
This is the only time I have ever heard or read about anyone actually supporting Trump, usually people can't even mention him without a roll of the eyes or a look of distain, I personally think its a little scary to be honest, but people have the right to their own opinion...

I also can't understand people who say 'they're all the same' and therefore maybe don't bother to vote, then wonder why nothing is done about the things they care bout.
Politics affects everything in our lives.
Sometimes, you have to just take the 'least bad' in any situation. Corbyn isn't perfect but I'll take him over the likes of Farage and Johnson any time.

Take a listen to Russell Kane on Trump. Its called 'Kaneing' on Youtube...

Intelligent balance people like? Obama, who is a corrupt puppet causing illegal wars and has his masters interests at heart, not ours. Corbyn? Well you should want to leave the EU then as Corbyn has been anti EU his entire political career, do some research on it, it's well a known fact. Russell Kane? Who isn't exactly the most knowledgeable on this subject.

I'd guess you believe mainstream media lies and that's the problem. Most of the people telling us to remain in the EU have self serving interests; Big bankers, the elites, the IMF (funded by the EU) but in fact there is actually more danger in staying than leaving in the long term.

The Trump subject was not something I mentioned so I assume that part of your post was aimed at someone else. But just to add i'd be more scared of Hillary Clinton than Donald Trump!