Massage causing massive, massive anxiety.

[ankietyjoe]

Do you believe this can happen?

It's not the first time either.

A couple of days ago my partner gave me a back massage as I had loads of knots.

4-5 hours later, in the middle of the night I had enormous adrenaline rushes/panic lasting about 4-5 hours with the remainder of the next day spent exhausted and in bed (with small adrenaline rushes all day long).

This also happens if I do exercise, which I don't do any more.

There seems to be a 50/50 split on the internet whether toxin release (from massage) is actually a real thing or not, but I can tell you the adrenaline gushing through my body at 3am was real enough.

Has anybody else experience similar symptoms?

[MyNameIsTerry]

Yes, I remember you posting about this when it happened in the past. Is there any science out there that shows it's possible? Or any science disproving it?

If it does release toxins they are going to head for your liver and anything that does that causes us to feel pretty rough & low if the liver is temporarily overwhelmed with toxins to process. It's one reason people take milk thistle when they have a hangover.

Massage is going to increase blood flow. So, it makes sense that if toxins are released, they are being transported more efficiently.

Adrenaline will increase with exercise. Does massage provide enough stimulation for this? A deep massage can be painful so does that imply it is doing the same as exercise, specifically anaerobic, by produces "micro tears" in the muscles? If so, could it mean the adrenaline would normally be getting uses up by the exercise element that is expected alongside that?

Just a few thoughts that spring to mind, sadly no answers though but maybe some lines of enquiry?

[ankietyjoe]

This is where it gets frustrating. I've yet to read anything conclusive.

For example, I've read that the US Marines 'recognise' a phenomenon where sedentary individuals exhibit severe flu like symptoms during the first weeks training.

I've also read that toxin release isn't a recognised medical occurrence.

Basically everything you read is conflicting in some way or the other.

I have mentioned this to different Doctors several times over the last few years and it's always met with a shrug or an 'hmmmm', but nothing conclusive.

Bloody annoying though, especially when it happens after exercise (which it always does, 3-4 hours on the dot).

[fallingstar]

I've had panic disorder from age 19 diagnosed... I've had so many professional back massages within that time - well most being when I was about 26 years old - 27 years old. There were about 2 times out of those 2 years where I got anxiety after a massage (these massages were 50 minutes in length - back - legs - arms - neck - head etc). I found the one that set me off was the pressure points in the neck and head - sometimes a nerve would get pinched or whatnot and I'd feel off and it freaked me out. Other than that, I was okay - I received massages on a monthly basis and I must've had many toxins to release but was okay. This is my input. 9/10 times the massages relaxed my tensed muscles from tensing up due to the work I did at the time lifting heavy boxes but also the tensed muscles from tensing up during anxiety and panic attacks. I can get panic attacks started from nearly anything - so the massages were always going to be a hit or miss - but 9/10 times like I said they were a hit. And exercise tends to help me rather than bother me. Rowing, swimming and doing elliptical has made me feel wonderful this week - sore since I've been pretty sedentary as of late - but wonderful. I hope this helped you if even just a little bit!

[MyNameIsTerry]

I've had panic disorder from age 19 diagnosed... I've had so many professional back massages within that time - well most being when I was about 26 years old - 27 years old. There were about 2 times out of those 2 years where I got anxiety after a massage (these massages were 50 minutes in length - back - legs - arms - neck - head etc). I found the one that set me off was the pressure points in the neck and head - sometimes a nerve would get pinched or whatnot and I'd feel off and it freaked me out. Other than that, I was okay - I received massages on a monthly basis and I must've had many toxins to release but was okay. This is my input. 9/10 times the massages relaxed my tensed muscles from tensing up due to the work I did at the time lifting heavy boxes but also the tensed muscles from tensing up during anxiety and panic attacks. I can get panic attacks started from nearly anything - so the massages were always going to be a hit or miss - but 9/10 times like I said they were a hit. And exercise tends to help me rather than bother me. Rowing, swimming and doing elliptical has made me feel wonderful this week - sore since I've been pretty sedentary as of late - but wonderful. I hope this helped you if even just a little bit!

If it's about toxin build up then maybe the length of time between massages matters here too? I'm wondering whether it was a harsher release for Joe whereas you were doing it enough not to exceed a certain level where it feels so harsh? Maybe there are other factors too like diet, exercise and general liver health factors?

---------- Post added at 05:28 ---------- Previous post was at 05:22 ----------

This is where it gets frustrating. I've yet to read anything conclusive.

For example, I've read that the US Marines 'recognise' a phenomenon where sedentary individuals exhibit severe flu like symptoms during the first weeks training.

I've also read that toxin release isn't a recognised medical occurrence.

Basically everything you read is conflicting in some way or the other.

I have mentioned this to different Doctors several times over the last few years and it's always met with a shrug or an 'hmmmm', but nothing conclusive.

Bloody annoying though, especially when it happens after exercise (which it always does, 3-4 hours on the dot).

Well GP's tend to be lacking in knowledge when you move into the world of sports, nutrition, etc so it wouldn't surprise me. They don't even educate us on better eating habits when they throw SSRI's at us which is a pretty dumb thing given how basic that element of nutrition & mental health works.

Just a thought, is there any possible link into stretching muscles? Don't they say that stretching a muscle increases blood flow and release toxins? I'm wondering if there is anything in that which could highlight a potential crossover into massage?

[ankietyjoe]

Apologies for not coming back to this sooner.

I guess the answer is we're still none the wiser about the effects of massage/exercise on potential toxin release.

I might even be barking up the wrong tree, but when I see a clear correlation between my activities and the resulting effects on my system 3-4 hours later I need to keep searching for an answer.

It might be worth pointing out that I am built like a gorilla and have high muscle mass even though I do practically no exercise whatsoever any more. I've always wondered if that makes a difference. So 'IF' toxins are stored in the muscles, do I store more? That might be the same kind of logic that led people to believe the world was flat, but I'm out of ideas right now

Edit - I've also wondered if my sympathetic nervous system could be 'over-detecting' massage or exercise as physical damage (which it is really) and having a paddy about it.

[MyNameIsTerry]

Well I've got to admit that's a new one on me, an "inner chimp" with an outer one!

[ankietyjoe]

Haha

Well, it's all I can think of