reacting badly to med change

[Jimbo]

I understand your fear of Lithium, I don't think I'd want to take that option myself. However, I've rarely heard negative comments from people about it. But It is a bit of a pain with all the blood tests etc.

I personally don't think your shrink has fully diagnosed your particular form of BP. Your mood seems to shift very quickly and your 'hyper' or 'manic' episodes seem too frequent for a type I, II or even Rapid Cycling BP, so I think you should pressure him a little more about that.

I see a lot of similarities between my mood shifts and yours and I fear Cyclothymic BP for myself. Is that something you consider matches your mood shifts? I'm sure you've read up on the different types. Sorry but I've been Googling because of my own fears:

http://www.mixednuts.net/bipolar.html

I'm getting on well with the increased Seroquel, 200mgs a day. It's lost most of it's sedative side effects for me, so doesn't knock me out like it used to but I do notice a levelling of my mood from it.

It can't hurt to give it a try increasing it, there's a lot of room in the dose to play around with. We just don't want a zombified Happyone all day.

I really can't understand your psych's reasoning for trying Prozac especially in mind of BP. I thought Prozac was considered high risk in triggering a manic episode out of all the AD's. Might be worth having a chat about Venlafaxine instead, it's more commonly used as an AD for BP depression (from what I've read). Going on and off it is not particularly fun from my point of view tho, I have to admit. But for me, it's been the best at helping my depression and anxiety.

There are alternative mood stabilisers to Lithium you could talk about too.

I'm not a shrink tho (everything above is from my own experience) and I spose they didn't spend years in university getting the title 'Dr' for nothing, so I really think you should be challenging his diagnosis and getting him to investigate or even experiment with other options a bit more.

Jim

[Quirky]

Glad you're not so itchy now mate

Lisa x

[happyone]

I don't know what I have Jim

IF IF IF I have this then bipolarII fits. I have the deep depression but lesser form of mania.

People with bipolar II suffer primarily from episodes of severe depression with occasional episode of "mild" mania, called hypomania. Hypomania differs from mania in that no delusions are experienced.
Like mania, hypomania can cause severely impaired functioning. The hypomanic episode often feels so good that bipolar patients often discontinue their medication in quest of a hypomanic episode. (I have done this once and while I haven't done it again, I always want to when I feel good)This is especially problematic because symptoms that come back after stopping drug treatment are often much harder to get back under control a second time.
While Bipolar II has sometimes been described as a "milder" form of bipolar disorder than Bipolar I, the suicide rate among people suffering form Bipolar II is actually higher than that for those suffering from Bipolar I.

But then

[quote]
People with cyclothymic disorder alternate between hypomania and mild depression. It is not as severe as bipolar I and II,

but persists for longer periods with no break in symptoms.(I think I do get a break as I am on a plateau a lot of the time)[/QUOTE] Cyclothymic disorder can later become full-blown bipolar disorder in some people, or can continue as a low-grade chronic condition.

and lastly
[quote]Most people with bipolar disorder have an average of 8 to 10 manic or depressive episodes over a lifetime. Some, however, experience much more severe symptoms called rapid cycling. They can swing (cycle) between "highs" and "lows" many times in one day. (this could definately describe me before I was taking the meds)To be considered a rapid cycler, you must have at leat 4 mood swings in a year.(definately. My moodswings are generally on a monthly to six week basis. Sometimes longer, sometimes shorter. I have had really really bad lows but they are contained with my drugged state)[/QUOTE]

My brain is pickled now.


Happyone
xxx

[happyone]

and I spose they didn't spend years in university getting the title 'Dr' for nothing,

No.....my dr excelled at saying 'Mmmmmmmm, yeah.....mmmmmm'

then he excelled at eccentricity. It is ok to take the stairs two at a time, to pull your hair in angst and to not brush the dandruff off your jacket

he excelled at having messy hair (alll the clever ones do....think of Einstein!)

He has an excelled sense of naff painting (you shoul see the one in his office!)

Nope....he has worked hard at this!

Happyone
xx

[happyone]

I have been Googling

I definately can't take any med now. (well I will take my night time one)

Happyone
xx

[Jimbo]

I'm worried for you hun.

Just stopping the AD's is not going to do you any good. It will probably make you feel awful.

I think you should be seeking some advice on this.

Even if you do decide to stop the AD's then do it slowly, I'm sure you've read enough horror stories about 'cold turkey' syndrome.

Please get in touch with your psych or GP to at least talk it over, think you can do that?

Jim

[Quirky]

Hi Happyone,

Like Jim I'm also worried about you too I really think you should get some advice before just stopping the meds cold turkey, if you do want to stop them at least do it gradually maybe?

As you know I am scared of these drugs so do understand how you feel, however you also seem to say above how much the meds have helped you, and you're certainly said how much better you've been since being on them. If you are going to withdraw that's your decision but do it sensibly mate. I say this as I care about you and don't want to see you with withdrawal symptoms or you moods badly affected by this.

You also seem to be trying to convince yourself that you don't have bipolar and therefore don't need any meds, I can understand that but you have done this before when you have been on a low or high (sorry can't remember which) and as much as I understand that obviously you don't want to have bp, I think the fact remains that you do and it can't be ignored mate. I don't know whether bp needs meds or not, I know some people manage without them if they are prepared to accept the highs and lows (and if it's safe for them to do so) but you do have to at least accept that you have bp of some sort anbd stop trying to convince yourself that you don't. You seem to think you have talked yourself into this illness but mate you haven't.

I'm sorry if this sounds harsh but I know you would want me to reply honestly and say what i think so I am - because I care about you

Do you think googling so much helps? What do you tell me when I have done it

I hope you have a better day,

Lisa x

[happyone]

Jim,

I can't promise that. I'm sorry. I have lost faith in docs after that silly cow on Fri. If I had taken more prozac I could have had a worse reaction, it might have killed me. I don't have my own doc at the practice as she is on maternity leave. I have another one but I have not seen her for anything to do with my mental health yet. I don't trust the shrink, I think he is trying to manipulate me into taking lithium.
All in all, not very good eh?

BUT...I will say that if I start feel really bad, I will phone doc and discuss it.
I do realise that I might have no choice in the end but if I am going to have to come off citalopram anyway, I might as well start now. At least this way, it makes my system clearer for trying something new.
NHS24 will send a report to my doc anyway.

I know googling is not good but the things I have found out are scaring me big style and I need to be sure that I have no choice. I can't write what I think as it would be very irresponsible.

Happyone
xx

Jim, I will be sensible (kind of ) the only effect I have just now is anger and hubby is taking kids out soon so they will be ok.

[happyone]

Lisa sorry hun,

I know you speak sense and I don't mind you being harsh. But I am really scared of putting another SSRI in my mouth. I forgot last night and took them instead of my night time med and as soon as I realised I was sick and 'got rid' of them

I am ok, honest. Like I said to Jim, if things get too bad I will seek help.

Thanks for caring and I am sorry. I am stil taking my night time meds and they are designed to stop me doing my wacky stuff hun.

I know googling is not good but once it is done is done isn't it?

happyone
xx

[Quirky]

Aww mate no need for apologies

I perfectly understand the need to google sometimes too and to be fair it can be a good way to get information in you look in the right places. Nearly every doc/ dentist I have seen says I am so knowledgeable/have such insight into health stuff, yes some of that is through my work in the past but some knowledge has been gained by google to be fair so it can't all be inaccurate if they tell me my knowledge is so good lol - either way though it's very good for scaring us anxious types eh so in that respect not a good idea

I'm sorry you had to make yourself sick mate, even I would be too scared to do that after taking a med. You know that your citaloproam doesn't give you a reaction though so that should be ok if you took that. Do you need to come off that med or would it be best to stay on it, talk it through with somone and then decide what is a better alternative to prozac? Or again at least withdraw slowly if you don't want/need to be on meds anymore.

I completely understand you not wanting another SSRI ever, I would be just the same (no probably worse!) But I do not think cold turkey withdrawal is a good way to do it mate, I really worry what it will do to your mental health and moods and whether you will have withdrawal symptoms. At the very least it should be done on medical advice.

I am being hard on you but I'm worried by this and your state of mind right now

As for docs, don't let one 'silly cow' make you lose faith in them all. Locum doctors or duty doctors don't know us and in my experience are not always much use in that respect. What she told you was wrong but not all docs are wrong, most are not. I saw a locum german doc once after my food poisoning episode and he prescribed me am anti sickness tablet that would have made me really ill with my ME, my doc said "what on earth did he give you that for". Thankfully I knew enough about the med to know not to take it but the point is most docs have different opinions on things anyway which makes it hard for us the patients to know what to do for the best! However your own gp should be a safe bet.

How about trying your gp mate, I know you haven't yet talked to her about mental health stuff but she has all your notes, she may well be fine, you said she is nice so nothing to lose eh? Sorry to nag but I care about you and you can't just brush all this under the carpet and ignore it.

As for your shrink, I think many people just don't trust them but I'm sure he is not trying to manipulate you into taking lithium mate, they don't do things like that. They can strongly recommend things but they can't make you take them, that's your decision.

Anyway I hope you manage to have a relaxing day Don't be cross with me eh

Lisa x