To get the vaccine or not

[Panicandpeace]

That's correct. So, consciously you have world through the problem and framed a conclusion. The subconscious though takes more time to make changes and therefore it's important to keep on being rational/logical and not falling into it's traps of making you panic and spiral into obsessive-compulsive cycles.

Another trick it might try on you is "what if I repressed the memory?". But you have to consider how this wouldn't being a massively traumatic event that the mind tries to escape from in the same way people who go through that have experienced. It's just another "what if" doubt anxiety poses knowing you can't get an absolute answer.

Tolerating the "shades of grey" is important as these disorders thrive in needing 100% solid answers, known as All-or-nothing thinking in Cognitive Distortions.

The inner chimp wants to know everything is perfect so we are safe. It can't always get that so it just keeps throwing a wobbly even more.

In many ways it's like seeing a toddler throwing a tantrum in a shop. If only the mother's old favourite saying of "stop crying or you'll get something to cry about in a minute!" worked on this stuff.

This----> Another trick it might try on you is "what if I repressed the memory?" is exactly what my fear is. Nail on the head. Because that image is so vivid, I keep going in circles of, "Of course there wasn't a bat. Wait, yes there was a bat. Was there or was there not a bat?! Why can I see a bat in my brain, when before that day, I had never seen a bat in real life (again, other than at the zoo)?! I must have seen a bat!"

I talked to my primary care physician today. I had a follow-up appointment, and it just happened to be good timing as these fears have heightened. He's always so kind and patient, even though I know what I'm saying out loud is irrational. I did ask about the pre-exposure vaccine, just for peace of mind being outside. He said they don't stock it in his office and that I'd have to go to a travel clinic or back to the ID doctor, but if it would "scratch that itch" I could look into it. I was honest in saying, it might help but it might not, and that even if it did I would probably just go down another wormhole, which is why I'd asked him for the psych referral. I told him the soonest appointment I could get was in 2 weeks, and he offered me this really cool option in the meantime, of a newish program that links patients with therapists basically through Facetime/Skype and it's all covered by insurance and is totally CBT focused. I'm pretty excited about it. He said they would most likely get in touch by the end of the week.

[MyNameIsTerry]

That's good news. Well worth pursuing this therapy route.

You're absolutely right about the vaccine. All it will possibly do is allow you to move past this current cycle of anxiety but it shouldn't be there in the first place so will just find itself another target to start it off again. And then we have those who start to doubt tests & vaccines (look at the HIV threads) where it can range into the remotest possibilities like staff tampering/errors or a sociopath in the manufacturing process tainting things. I've seen exactly those "what ifs" on more than one HIV thread in my time here.

This is why it's useful to try to remove the emotion by observing thoughts just as thoughts that have the right to exist. In Mindfulness it teaches you to act as the curious observer that let's thoughts just be and doesn't necessarily get involved in them.

Try to see these subconscious "what ifs" as merely a load of brainstorming. In a brainstorming session it's common to write down stuff you know is rare or unlikely as a way to close of those avenues of investigation. Try to see the subconscious this way, it's blurting out stuff that may be useful or nonsense asking the conscious mind to decide which is which.

As for the imagery with your false memory issue, I can understand it. I'm not the only person on here (I bet there have been loads of us but I've spoken to some members who've said what I'm about to) who's seen graphic images in their intrusive thoughts. In mine, which a large proportion were about harming loved ones or strangers, I would see myself performing the act itself.

To back up my own experience I know of another person who was very disturbed by these graphic images. They got into therapy where they were told it's just their OCD and they greatly improved to the point of beating those problems.

I beat mine a few years ago.

So, if there are people who can see themselves physically harming a person in an intrusive thought doesn't that prove that your mind could do the same with a bat? And let's not forget we dream & daydream where imagery is conjured up by the subconscious.

Therefore the subconscious can conjure up that imagery of your bat.

[Panicandpeace]

That's good news. Well worth pursuing this therapy route.

You're absolutely right about the vaccine. All it will possibly do is allow you to move past this current cycle of anxiety but it shouldn't be there in the first place so will just find itself another target to start it off again. And then we have those who start to doubt tests & vaccines (look at the HIV threads) where it can range into the remotest possibilities like staff tampering/errors or a sociopath in the manufacturing process tainting things. I've seen exactly those "what ifs" on more than one HIV thread in my time here.

This is why it's useful to try to remove the emotion by observing thoughts just as thoughts that have the right to exist. In Mindfulness it teaches you to act as the curious observer that let's thoughts just be and doesn't necessarily get involved in them.

Try to see these subconscious "what ifs" as merely a load of brainstorming. In a brainstorming session it's common to write down stuff you know is rare or unlikely as a way to close of those avenues of investigation. Try to see the subconscious this way, it's blurting out stuff that may be useful or nonsense asking the conscious mind to decide which is which.

As for the imagery with your false memory issue, I can understand it. I'm not the only person on here (I bet there have been loads of us but I've spoken to some members who've said what I'm about to) who's seen graphic images in their intrusive thoughts. In mine, which a large proportion were about harming loved ones or strangers, I would see myself performing the act itself.

To back up my own experience I know of another person who was very disturbed by these graphic images. They got into therapy where they were told it's just their OCD and they greatly improved to the point of beating those problems.

I beat mine a few years ago.

So, if there are people who can see themselves physically harming a person in an intrusive thought doesn't that prove that your mind could do the same with a bat? And let's not forget we dream & daydream where imagery is conjured up by the subconscious.

Therefore the subconscious can conjure up that imagery of your bat.

*You're absolutely right about the vaccine. All it will possibly do is allow you to move past this current cycle of anxiety but it shouldn't be there in the first place so will just find itself another target to start it off again.*

So, I've had trouble even finding a place that offers the vaccine... maybe it's a sign? haha. Although my insurance covers it, I can't find anywhere that offers the vaccine other than travel clinics that don't accept insurance.

You're right, the anxiety probably shouldn't be there, and I've calmed down a bit since last week, but I sometimes can't help but think that I'm calming down because the memory is fading... and again, the what if's: what if that memory is real? You don't want it to fade away before you know for sure if it's real or fake. And my toe is tingling nonstop and driving me insane!

Try to see these subconscious "what ifs" as merely a load of brainstorming. In a brainstorming session it's common to write down stuff you know is rare or unlikely as a way to close of those avenues of investigation. Try to see the subconscious this way, it's blurting out stuff that may be useful or nonsense asking the conscious mind to decide which is which.

This is a great way to look at it!!

So, if there are people who can see themselves physically harming a person in an intrusive thought doesn't that prove that your mind could do the same with a bat? And let's not forget we dream & daydream where imagery is conjured up by the subconscious.

Absolutely!! I have a vivid imagination for sure. I guess, again, I'm just kind of in the process of determining if that memory is in fact false because I unfortunately, just can't remember... or better said, I'm remembering two different versions of the same day. One with a bat and one without.

I kind of felt better after I asked the neighbor if there were bats in the neighborhood, and she said she hadn't seen bats in years, which isn't the same as no bats, but did make me feel a bit better.. . However, then I thought, well my aunt had a bunch of bats in her attic, and I never once saw them around her house. So much for that fleeting moment of comfort haha.

Thanks for all of your input. I think you put things into perspective really well! Good for you for overcoming your intrusive thinking. I've had that for a long time, forget about the current bat situation. My earliest one included me driving off a bridge into a lake when I would make the 2 hour drive back and forth from college. Not because I was suicidal in any way, shape, or form, but just because I thought my body would somehow, involuntarily just veer off of the bridge into the water. I got over it eventually.

[Panicandpeace]

Feeling a bit anxious today. Just the usual, confusion/questioning of whether I saw a bat that day a couple weeks ago. I've been pretty good because I just decided not to think about it, but every once in while, I still do, and it freaks me out. Getting further and further away from the memory (the one which I can't decide is false and there was actually no bat OR real and there was a bat), while it has kind of calmed the anxiety, also makes me worry occasionally that I'm tucking away an important detail... my brain goes, "don't forget about this! You need to go get the shots. Sure, you're fine now, but what about in a month or two?! Or a year from now?! OR LONGER since you *think* you got bitten on the toe?!" It doesn't help that I was watching Instagram stories today, and one of my friends posted a video of a raccoon out and about in broad daylight. She was like, "Does the fact that this raccoon is out in the middle of the day mean it has rabies?" ...and I'm like UH YEAH, MAYBE... STOP GETTING SO CLOSE TO IT! Anyway. Just feeling the anxiety today. My foot was buzzing yesterday.

[textsfromthemoon]

Sometimes our anxieties surge on us but don't let that erase the progress you've made, remember to keep challenging your anxious/intrusive thoughts, keep yourself distracted and remind yourself that your symptoms are anxiety...NOT RABIES

[Panicandpeace]

Sometimes our anxieties surge on us but don't let that erase the progress you've made, remember to keep challenging your anxious/intrusive thoughts, keep yourself distracted and remind yourself that your symptoms are anxiety...NOT RABIES

Thank you for the encouragement. I sometimes can't shake the feeling that I did get bitten by a bat, and for whatever reason, didn't have a reaction, and just kept going about my day as if nothing happened. Like I repressed the memory. Also, today, I'm having another episode of feeling like a bat bit me while I was walking to my car. I have on jeans and sneakers and a bit of my ankle/lower calf is exposed and am worried that a bat bit me on that part of my body. Feeling quite panicky at the moment. I have very fair skin, so I tend to always have redness or marks, plus all the things I've read (not recently, I'm trying to stay away from Google) about bat bites not being visible... not in a good place today.

[textsfromthemoon]

Thank you for the encouragement. I sometimes can't shake the feeling that I did get bitten by a bat, and for whatever reason, didn't have a reaction, and just kept going about my day as if nothing happened. Like I repressed the memory. Also, today, I'm having another episode of feeling like a bat bit me while I was walking to my car. I have on jeans and sneakers and a bit of my ankle/lower calf is exposed and am worried that a bat bit me on that part of my body. Feeling quite panicky at the moment. I have very fair skin, so I tend to always have redness or marks, plus all the things I've read (not recently, I'm trying to stay away from Google) about bat bites not being visible... not in a good place today.

I've been there but keep reminding yourself that this is your anxiety causing you to think these things, most people go their entire lives without ever having any interactions with bats, the odds that you would have had all of these bat exposures within a matter of weeks are slim to none, its your anxiety creating this feeling of "exposure", I've gone through the same thing a few times myself, just keep focusing on tackling your anxieties and rationalizing your thoughts and definitely no visits to Dr. Google

[Panicandpeace]

I've been there but keep reminding yourself that this is your anxiety causing you to think these things, most people go their entire lives without ever having any interactions with bats, the odds that you would have had all of these bat exposures within a matter of weeks are slim to none, its your anxiety creating this feeling of "exposure", I've gone through the same thing a few times myself, just keep focusing on tackling your anxieties and rationalizing your thoughts and definitely no visits to Dr. Google

I definitely am trying to stay away from Dr. Google!! I have just been going through a phase of assuming every time I've been outside that I've been bitten by a bat and have worried myself that it's because I'm traumatized from getting bitten a few weeks ago...

I went and saw a psychiatrist this week. He told me that he does more of medication assessment/management and not therapy. While I know medication can be helpful, I really think CBT is what is truly going to help me. I also didn't really like the doctor. He was nice, but I just don't think we connected, if that makes sense. I've heard from a few different people that with therapists, it's almost like dating, in that you need to find the right personality match. I'm going to keep looking.

The other day, I walked outside by a garbage bag my employer left outside and immediately had thoughts/"false memories" (I think) of a raccoon being by the garbage bag and biting me on my leg, but just barely enough to go through my jeans (thus no noticeable puncture wounds). Later that day, I dropped my keys on the street and I picked them up quickly and got in the car. I was parked on a busy street, so I was hurrying and not paying attention to my surroundings ar all. It wasn't until I was driving that I noticed my hand bleeding. When I got home and washed the blood off, it looked a bit like a bite mark to me... one very clear puncture looking mark and another smaller one right next to it. Of course, now I'm worried that a bat bit me and because I was rushing to get into the car I didn't notice. I was in an area with lots of trees and lots of leaves on the ground. I mean, the wound definitely hurt, which is why I noticed it while I was driving, so that makes me uneasy because, you know, we all reassure each other, if you get bitten you would know it, but I got this wound without immediately realizing it...

Sometimes, I worry that because of all the times my mind has supposedly "cried wolf" that either I, or family/friends won't take me seriously if I ever do get bitten.

[NervUs]

I definitely am trying to stay away from Dr. Google!! I have just been going through a phase of assuming every time I've been outside that I've been bitten by a bat and have worried myself that it's because I'm traumatized from getting bitten a few weeks ago...

I went and saw a psychiatrist this week. He told me that he does more of medication assessment/management and not therapy. While I know medication can be helpful, I really think CBT is what is truly going to help me. I also didn't really like the doctor. He was nice, but I just don't think we connected, if that makes sense. I've heard from a few different people that with therapists, it's almost like dating, in that you need to find the right personality match. I'm going to keep looking.

The other day, I walked outside by a garbage bag my employer left outside and immediately had thoughts/"false memories" (I think) of a raccoon being by the garbage bag and biting me on my leg, but just barely enough to go through my jeans (thus no noticeable puncture wounds). Later that day, I dropped my keys on the street and I picked them up quickly and got in the car. I was parked on a busy street, so I was hurrying and not paying attention to my surroundings ar all. It wasn't until I was driving that I noticed my hand bleeding. When I got home and washed the blood off, it looked a bit like a bite mark to me... one very clear puncture looking mark and another smaller one right next to it. Of course, now I'm worried that a bat bit me and because I was rushing to get into the car I didn't notice. I was in an area with lots of trees and lots of leaves on the ground. I mean, the wound definitely hurt, which is why I noticed it while I was driving, so that makes me uneasy because, you know, we all reassure each other, if you get bitten you would know it, but I got this wound without immediately realizing it...

Sometimes, I worry that because of all the times my mind has supposedly "cried wolf" that either I, or family/friends won't take me seriously if I ever do get bitten.

I am no expert, but this sounds like OCD to me. If you are thinking you've been exposed to rabies literally just walking outside, those are intrusive thoughts. It sort of seems like a contamination issue to me (I have experienced that with parasite fear, so I am not judging, just observing).

People show up with puncture marks all the time without knowing what caused them. If people had to get rabies shots everytime something like that happened, well, WOW! The fact is, you need to live with uncertainty. You won't know what caused that wound. Could it have been a bat? Yes, there is like a 1 in a billion chance (and, yes, someone actually did the calculation on bat rabies from completely unknown exposure). But, there is no medical recommendation for a shot if you have an unexplained puncture wound which means.....

IT IS NOT A RISK.

If rabid bats were a leading cause of unexplained puncture wounds the recommendations would be totally different than they are. Rabies transmission is actually pretty well studied!

You are backing yourself so far into a corner with these intrusive thoughts until you are going to have no space left for yourself.

I would say, finding the right therapist is a must. You have no more time to play. I would also say, find someone with experience with OCD. For me, I dealt with my fear of parasite contamination with exposure, and it does help to see nothing bad has happened after walking in the area or letting my kids play in the area that I feared was contaminated). I'm not sure how you expose yourself to what you fear, but CBT plus desensitizing yourself to real bats might help you make progress.

Good luck!!!

[Scottyboy]

I am no expert, but this sounds like OCD to me. If you are thinking you've been exposed to rabies literally just walking outside, those are intrusive thoughts. It sort of seems like a contamination issue to me (I have experienced that with parasite fear, so I am not judging, just observing).

People show up with puncture marks all the time without knowing what caused them. If people had to get rabies shots everytime something like that happened, well, WOW! The fact is, you need to live with uncertainty. You won't know what caused that wound. Could it have been a bat? Yes, there is like a 1 in a billion chance (and, yes, someone actually did the calculation on bat rabies from completely unknown exposure). But, there is no medical recommendation for a shot if you have an unexplained puncture wound which means.....

IT IS NOT A RISK.

If rabid bats were a leading cause of unexplained puncture wounds the recommendations would be totally different than they are. Rabies transmission is actually pretty well studied!

You are backing yourself so far into a corner with these intrusive thoughts until you are going to have no space left for yourself.

I would say, finding the right therapist is a must. You have no more time to play. I would also say, find someone with experience with OCD. For me, I dealt with my fear of parasite contamination with exposure, and it does help to see nothing bad has happened after walking in the area or letting my kids play in the area that I feared was contaminated). I'm not sure how you expose yourself to what you fear, but CBT plus desensitizing yourself to real bats might help you make progress.

Good luck!!!

You have OCD and intrusive thoughts. I suffered from similar delusions and got diagnosed with OCD. You have to begin CBT and perhaps ACT and ERP.

I seriously can relate. I have the exact same contamination worries. Nearly identical.