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Thread: The vaccine

  1. #1
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    The vaccine

    Iíve been thinking of starting a thread on this for some time now. Iím growing more concerned by the day, going through my own social media, to see the vast amounts of misinformation surrounding vaccination and, more alarmingly, folk swallowing it all.

    My own mother has decided that she will not be taking a vaccine if and when it arises, and she is a healthcare worker whoís best friend died from Covid-19 in April. I discussed this with her and was alarmed at the amount of stock she seemed to put on anti-vax propaganda thatís being circulated on social media. As I said, sheís a frontline healthcare worker who has witnessed first hand what this disease does, both in a personal and professional setting.

    So what is giving such concern? Why are folk all of a sudden turning against the idea of vaccination? Is the science actually flawed? Are people genuinely suffering horrific effects of vaccination worldwide?

    My intent here is to welcome all views and, I promise, not to turn this into anything other than a discussion aimed at clearing the waters when it comes to vaccination. I feel this forum sees large amounts of folk who have difficulty trusting medicine and doctors so I think itís a discussion worth having.

    If you have doubts, what are they? Letís see if we can have an open dialogue about this and get to the correct answer.

  2. #2
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    Re: The vaccine

    People are swallowing it because society has turned into the herd like fvcking stupidity that was described in the film 'Idiocracy'.

    Doesn't matter if you're related to them, they're fvcking idiots.


    Just tell them to go read up on smallpox. 30% fatality rate for around 3000 years, and then a vaccine was discovered. If a vaccine hadn't been discovered, probably half of us here wouldn't even exist.


    A vaccine is accelerated herd immunity. That's it. It stops people dying, but 'may' be a problem for a minute percentage of people. It's a numbers game, just like crossing the road.

  3. #3
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    Re: The vaccine

    I think the growing anti-vax movement is part of something much deeper and wider that goes back decades. Ever since JFK's assassination, the lies of the Vietnam War and Watergate, there's been growing distrust in Western countries about elites, leaders, institutions, etc. Look at the massive growth in conspiracy theories since the 1960s. 9/11 and the dubious Iraq War of 2003 only added fuel to the fire. Basically nobody trusts anyone anymore, and the rise of the internet and social media has only increased the paranoia.

  4. #4
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    Re: The vaccine

    Quote Originally Posted by Panicattacka View Post
    I think the growing anti-vax movement is part of something much deeper and wider that goes back decades. Ever since JFK's assassination, the lies of the Vietnam War and Watergate, there's been growing distrust in Western countries about elites, leaders, institutions, etc. Look at the massive growth in conspiracy theories since the 1960s. 9/11 and the dubious Iraq War of 2003 only added fuel to the fire. Basically nobody trusts anyone anymore, and the rise of the internet and social media has only increased the paranoia.
    I think you've hit the nail on the head there Panicattacka.

    I think there's far too many know-it-alls in today's society, exacerbated by the Internet and social media and those who will just believe any load of old pony, regardless of whether it's true or false. I mean, look at all the big global kerfuffle over toilet rolls back in March due to some imbecille down under posting misinformation online about (false) shortages with possible anti- China agendas added to the mix!

  5. #5
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    Re: The vaccine

    Quote Originally Posted by ankietyjoe View Post
    People are swallowing it because society has turned into the herd like fvcking stupidity that was described in the film 'Idiocracy'.

    Doesn't matter if you're related to them, they're fvcking idiots.


    Just tell them to go read up on smallpox. 30% fatality rate for around 3000 years, and then a vaccine was discovered. If a vaccine hadn't been discovered, probably half of us here wouldn't even exist.


    A vaccine is accelerated herd immunity. That's it. It stops people dying, but 'may' be a problem for a minute percentage of people. It's a numbers game, just like crossing the road.
    The interesting additional point I'd like to add is that such vaccines were discovered in far less scientific times. We are far more likely to create a safe controlled one now than back then.

    But I think part of the problem is the 'big pharma' paranoia (whether warranted or not) and some people's politics. Nancy Pelosi's stunningly ignorant remarks over a UK derived vaccine being one example. People are very suspicious.
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  6. #6
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    Re: The vaccine

    What is her reasoning, Gary? You don't need to answer this but it's a curious one since she is closer to medicine.

    Is she concerned about a rushed poorly tested vaccine?
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  7. #7
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    Re: The vaccine

    Quote Originally Posted by MyNameIsTerry View Post
    What is her reasoning, Gary? You don't need to answer this but it's a curious one since she is closer to medicine.

    Is she concerned about a rushed poorly tested vaccine?
    Pretty much that Terry, yes.

    I feel I need to point out, as I did to her, that while most vaccines take decades to approve, you have to take into account the prevalence of a particular virus that youíre testing against.

    If you vaccinate 10,000 people for an efficacy trial you need to wait until a certain percentage of that 10,000 are infected before you can decipher an efficacy result. Itís a lot easier to do that with a virus thatís seeing tens of thousands of new infections per day worldwide than it is a virus seeing small events in remote parts of the planet.

  8. #8
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    Re: The vaccine

    I understand that the UK is looking into deliberately infecting volunteers with the virus and then using the vaccine to see how well it works.

  9. #9
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    Re: The vaccine

    Quote Originally Posted by Pamplemousse View Post
    I understand that the UK is looking into deliberately infecting volunteers with the virus and then using the vaccine to see how well it works.
    Yes, challenger trials. You vaccinate then expose the person to the virus to see if they fight off the virus. This is due to start in January.

  10. #10
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    Re: The vaccine

    Quote Originally Posted by MyNameIsTerry View Post
    The interesting additional point I'd like to add is that such vaccines were discovered in far less scientific times. We are far more likely to create a safe controlled one now than back then.
    Exactly this Terry. Edward Jenner and his curiosity over why milk maids never seemed to contract smallpox. He found that when they contracted cowpox from the cows, a milder disease than smallpox, this provided cross immunity. Jenner died in 1823, so unless CTs go back as far as this, I don't see why people are so fearful of a Covid jab. Covid the disease or Covid the vaccine, I know which one I'd choose.
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