The vaccine

[spectrum123]

Whilst I agree that Blair and Brown did have their faults, many of the issues during their tenure were mostly of their time, and probably would have arose regardless of who was in power, but it does seem that virtually all Labour leaders since Blair have been labelled as 'bogeymen' in some form or another.

Let's face it, if Bozzer was to involve us in a third Iraq war next year and/or a second Global Financial Crisis was to occur under his watch, I bet you a tenner that there wouldn't be anywhere near the same extent of public outrage under him as there was under Blair and Brown.


Like I've already said before, had this pandemic occurred under Labour they would have been finished. Finito!!

Blair lied to the electorate and took us to a war that cost British lives just so he could leave a legacy, he got that just not in the way he hoped. Brown was a disaster as a PM. Since then Labour have lurched from one catastrophe to another. In my opinion they went for the wrong Milliband brother, the one they got was weak, then swung in the opposite direction with JC, who was about 40 years out of date. Got himself embroiled in the anti-Semitic issue, which he was warned about, but he sat and did nothing whilst Rome burned.

Whatever scandals and mismanagement the conservatives managed to bring upon themselves, Labour somehow managed to create a bigger one to overshadow it. At times when the conservatives were at their weakest and primed for the opposition to score points, Labour managed to completely drop the ball. This was evident in the last election when hard line Labour areas started voting Tory, not for any desire for a Tory government but the sheer frustration of how badly the Labour front bench were handling things.

We aren't like the US who polarise and get behind vocally their respective parties, the British have a mistrust of MP's in general, we tend to vote for the ones we least dislike.

[Lencoboy]

Blair lied to the electorate and took us to a war that cost British lives just so he could leave a legacy, he got that just not in the way he hoped. Brown was a disaster as a PM. Since then Labour have lurched from one catastrophe to another. In my opinion they went for the wrong Milliband brother, the one they got was weak, then swung in the opposite direction with JC, who was about 40 years out of date. Got himself embroiled in the anti-Semitic issue, which he was warned about, but he sat and did nothing whilst Rome burned.

Whatever scandals and mismanagement the conservatives managed to bring upon themselves, Labour somehow managed to create a bigger one to overshadow it. At times when the conservatives were at their weakest and primed for the opposition to score points, Labour managed to completely drop the ball. This was evident in the last election when hard line Labour areas started voting Tory, not for any desire for a Tory government but the sheer frustration of how badly the Labour front bench were handling things.

We aren't like the US who polarise and get behind vocally their respective parties, the British have a mistrust of MP's in general, we tend to vote for the ones we least dislike.

Exactly my point.

[spectrum123]

Exactly this Terry. Edward Jenner and his curiosity over why milk maids never seemed to contract smallpox. He found that when they contracted cowpox from the cows, a milder disease than smallpox, this provided cross immunity. Jenner died in 1823, so unless CTs go back as far as this, I don't see why people are so fearful of a Covid jab. Covid the disease or Covid the vaccine, I know which one I'd choose.

The basic principle of which is used today to create the covid vaccines (except the mrna ones), invoke an antibody reaction by tricking the body into thinking it's under attack. The mrna vaccines the biggest issues have been down to the fact that if the message encoded in them isn't perfect the body breaks them down and ignores them as they are a natural substance.

[Lencoboy]

Politics now aside, my mom received a letter through the post from our local GP surgery this afternoon saying she has been allocated a slot for the Covid jab at midday on Wednesday, just one week and one day after my dad's first jab.

He has had a few cold-like symptoms since Thursday morning which are likely initial side effects of the jab, but nothing mega serious so far and certainly nothing compared to what all three of us had midway through last February, which was possible 'phantom' Covid.

[MyNameIsTerry]

Blair lied to the electorate and took us to a war that cost British lives just so he could leave a legacy, he got that just not in the way he hoped. Brown was a disaster as a PM. Since then Labour have lurched from one catastrophe to another. In my opinion they went for the wrong Milliband brother, the one they got was weak, then swung in the opposite direction with JC, who was about 40 years out of date. Got himself embroiled in the anti-Semitic issue, which he was warned about, but he sat and did nothing whilst Rome burned.

Whatever scandals and mismanagement the conservatives managed to bring upon themselves, Labour somehow managed to create a bigger one to overshadow it. At times when the conservatives were at their weakest and primed for the opposition to score points, Labour managed to completely drop the ball. This was evident in the last election when hard line Labour areas started voting Tory, not for any desire for a Tory government but the sheer frustration of how badly the Labour front bench were handling things.

We aren't like the US who polarise and get behind vocally their respective parties, the British have a mistrust of MP's in general, we tend to vote for the ones we least dislike.

^ definitely all this. I always vote based on the least worst. Always have.

I think the last election was a little different because it was about Brexit and meant a lot of holding of noses. It muddied the waters meaning some of us voted because we wanted something when normally we are more likely voting because we don't want something. Corbyn muddied that too as his style is out of date.

With Blair we can also add PFI which still affects NHS hospitals.

I agree with Pamplemousse too. I grew up working class in a Labour safe seat. It flipped to Tory in the previous GE over Corbyn (For the first time in its history). Prior to that it had been a donkey in a red rosette seat. We had incompetent Labour MPs but they were laughing as they didn't have to do any work for it. Then came Jezza and our MP was unsuccessfully hiding his disappointment when knocking on doors to be told why he's not getting votes.

Hopefully we can move forward though now we are moving out of the main stages of Brexit. Labour have lots to do and Starmer has made some bad moves as well as good ones. But on trust he's got a hard journey.

Like Pamplemousse said we expect the Tories to shaft us. I grew up being told this. It's a Labour town, simple as that. Labour are for us. Yet under Blair that seemed to be slipping away into minorities. Labour started becoming the metropolitan party. Under Corbyn that bubble was there and the old voters were forgotten about as it became about members. Woo hoo we have 500k members, biggest party in Europe, blah blah blah. 500k is nowt at voting time.

I think many of us hold Labour to higher standards. They are supposed to be my people, the Tories were about the bosses. It's like how you are more disappointed when the police break the law. You expect the criminal will.

It's perhaps wrong but I know I'm more disappointed in the party that is supposed to be good to turn out to have rotten apples. I expect a fair amount of them on the opposite benches

[Lencoboy]

^ definitely all this. I always vote based on the least worst. Always have.

I think the last election was a little different because it was about Brexit and meant a lot of holding of noses. It muddied the waters meaning some of us voted because we wanted something when normally we are more likely voting because we don't want something. Corbyn muddied that too as his style is out of date.

With Blair we can also add PFI which still affects NHS hospitals.

I agree with Pamplemousse too. I grew up working class in a Labour safe seat. It flipped to Tory in the previous GE over Corbyn (For the first time in its history). Prior to that it had been a donkey in a red rosette seat. We had incompetent Labour MPs but they were laughing as they didn't have to do any work for it. Then came Jezza and our MP was unsuccessfully hiding his disappointment when knocking on doors to be told why he's not getting votes.

Hopefully we can move forward though now we are moving out of the main stages of Brexit. Labour have lots to do and Starmer has made some bad moves as well as good ones. But on trust he's got a hard journey.

Like Pamplemousse said we expect the Tories to shaft us. I grew up being told this. It's a Labour town, simple as that. Labour are for us. Yet under Blair that seemed to be slipping away into minorities. Labour started becoming the metropolitan party. Under Corbyn that bubble was there and the old voters were forgotten about as it became about members. Woo hoo we have 500k members, biggest party in Europe, blah blah blah. 500k is nowt at voting time.

I think many of us hold Labour to higher standards. They are supposed to be my people, the Tories were about the bosses. It's like how you are more disappointed when the police break the law. You expect the criminal will.

It's perhaps wrong but I know I'm more disappointed in the party that is supposed to be good to turn out to have rotten apples. I expect a fair amount of them on the opposite benches

I also believe what isn't helping right now is the endless conspiracy theories, which have certainly thrived over the past 12 months amid this pandemic.

Sadly, politicians of neither the left nor the right seem willing to address said issues, obviously due to fears of stifling free expression.

[spectrum123]

This could get interesting, not sure how this will play out legally, but it looks like we're about to find out.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...fety-laws.html

[Blonde123]

Haven’t read the full conversation but I’ve had the vaccine. I’m a frontline nurse working in A&E. I wear a normal face mask. I’ve not caught covid and I’m fully aware the covid vaccine is not 100% effective. This is a birus and viruses mutate every year. The flu jab is always based on the previous years strains of the flu because it mutates that quickly and we can’t produce vaccines quick enough so it’s always the scientists best guess. I’ve seen people die from covid so I’ll take a best guess vaccine over nothing any day.

[Scass]

I’m glad you’ve had your vaccine Blonde123. Keep safe & thank you for all you do.


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[pulisa]

A very big thank you from me too. Nothing like personal experience to emphasise the need for protection via vaccine.