AstraZeneca vaccine halted

[Pamplemousse]

Whatever the reason, when you look at the data it’s a complete over reaction by many. It is a note of genuine puzzlement to me why they’d halt the AZ vaccine when the incidence of DVT’s is at exactly the same level as other vaccines being administered. If they’ve got some other data that shows the AZ vaccine is of more concern in this regard, let’s see it.

I couldn't agree more: causation and correlation applies here.

I suspect there's more than an element of "not invented here" going on, which I find sad: I expected better of some of the countries on that list. Either way, as Europe slides towards a third wave that hopefully we won't (and if ever there was a reason to close our borders, here it is) I can see a few disgruntled friends in my circle being narked that they'll have been vaccinated but other countries, through the actions of both their governments and citizens will remain off limits to them.

[Pamplemousse]

I've said this morning similar in my household, like literally ANYTHING could be attributed to it randomly - 50 people have heart attacks, 100 people have utis, 150 people get hayfever, 100 alopecia blah blah.

Panickattacka, its getting tiresome.

Well said on all counts, Carys.

As I've already said: correlation and causation.

I still feel nervous around others despite my having reached three weeks after being Pfizered, but I am so glad I've had it. I can work again, and the work offers are already at a point where I'm turning some down because there are so many. I wonder how long it'll take me to adjust to not wearing a mask in proximity to others when the time comes? For another thread, maybe.

Apologies if this link has already been posted: https://amp.theguardian.com/commenti...a-causal-links

[Lencoboy]

Well said on all counts, Carys.

As I've already said: correlation and causation.

I still feel nervous around others despite my having reached three weeks after being Pfizered, but I am so glad I've had it. I can work again, and the work offers are already at a point where I'm turning some down because there are so many. I wonder how long it'll take me to adjust to not wearing a mask in proximity to others when the time comes? For another thread, maybe.

Apologies if this link has already been posted: https://amp.theguardian.com/commenti...a-causal-links

Some very interesting commentary in that article.

Alas, it probably won't change the minds of those who continue to revel in misinformation/fake news, particularly those who get kicks out of all the excitement and tribalistic nature of it all!!

[MyNameIsTerry]

I am worried because someone died 10 days after having the vaccine, I think that was in Austria. Blood clots can take a while do develop and I assume a while longer until you notice any effects of it depending on where in the body it is.

I am grateful that I have had it done but worried also.

Nearly 17m people haven't had that reaction though. So it's quite rare just like so many health worries in anxiety.

[MyNameIsTerry]

If you're still wondering why all these European countries are halting the use of Astra Zeneca:

UK Government Report.
Pfizer vaccine adverse reactions

Execution date: March 4, 2021

* Blood disorders: 2,033
* Cardiac disorders: 1,032
* Congenital disorders: 3
* Hearing disorders: 713
* Endocrine disorders: 10
* Eye disorders: 1,242 (12 cases of blindness)
* Gastrointestinal disorders: 9,360
* General disorders: 26,391
* Liver disorders: 17
* Immune system disorders: 466
* Infections: 1,863
* Injuries: 393
* Continued Investigations: 965
* Metabolic disorders: 525
* Muscle-tissue disorders: 11,565
* Neoplasms: 20
* Nervous System Disorders: 16,107
* Associated with pregnancy: 29
* Psychiatric disorders: 1,235
* Renal / urinary disorder: 187
* Syst. Reproductive: 338
* Respiratory disorders: 3,575
* Skin disorder: 6,042
* Vascular disorders: 992
* Dead: 212
* Medical and Surgical Procedures: 45
* https://www.gov.uk/government/public...erse-reactions

What's disturbing is this is a weekly report

That's the Yellow Card Scheme. They ask us to report absolutely everything just in case..

If you look at the list of these side effects in other drugs you will see similar. They are then split into categories of 1 in 100, 1 in 1000, unknown, etc. There will be categories to report to doctors and ones saying it's no big deal. No big deal might include some itchy skin.

The MHRA have already told people to stop looking at this and worrying.

And no, they aren't halting it because of that. For one, that's Pfizer which they are happily still using. Two, they are bothered by a tiny reporting issue of clotting and not all the other, much more numerous stuff on the list you've posted.

How many of us even bother reporting? I haven't reported my mum's side effects. Have you all been reporting your cold-like side effects from flu jabs for years? Can't say I have.

[MyNameIsTerry]

Whatever the reason, when you look at the data it’s a complete over reaction by many. It is a note of genuine puzzlement to me why they’d halt the AZ vaccine when the incidence of DVT’s is at exactly the same level as other vaccines being administered. If they’ve got some other data that shows the AZ vaccine is of more concern in this regard, let’s see it.

Yes, let's see it. Ireland pointed out they heard something about the deaths in Norway after which caused them to take action. What information? The rest of the world don't appear privy to it

[MyNameIsTerry]

Well said on all counts, Carys.

As I've already said: correlation and causation.

I still feel nervous around others despite my having reached three weeks after being Pfizered, but I am so glad I've had it. I can work again, and the work offers are already at a point where I'm turning some down because there are so many. I wonder how long it'll take me to adjust to not wearing a mask in proximity to others when the time comes? For another thread, maybe.

Apologies if this link has already been posted: https://amp.theguardian.com/commenti...a-causal-links

Glad to here your work is back on track. A massive relief for you and so many in the same boat after such a tough year.

[Pamplemousse]

Glad to here your work is back on track. A massive relief for you and so many in the sake boat after such a tough year.

Thanks Terry, it's much appreciated.

With the anniversary of my wife's death approaching it's good to have a little distraction but I drew the line at working on the anniversary of her death, so turned that offer down. It all helps toward paying off the Business Bounceback loan early too.

Apropos reporting of vaccine side effects - my brother did after he was awoken a night or two afterwards with a rapid heartbeart of about 120, which he can get up to in his workouts anyway.

Turns out that... yep, it's a known side-effect of the AZ vaccine. Is he bothered? No. He just wants to be able to play with his grand-children again.

[AntsyVee]

Now you've all done it The teacher is here to give her lecture

Correlation is NOT causation. That means just because a variable and an outcome are linked together, it does NOT mean that one variable caused the outcome. It is very hard to prove a causation because there is no way to isolate all other variables, even in lab experiments. That's why all of our mental illnesses on here do not have one recognized, definitive cause. That's why it took so long to show that smoking causes lung cancer. Even when we know the causes of some conditions, chances are it's not a 100% correlation; it's just close and approaching that number.

Those 24 people who got clots could have easily developed them anyway without getting the vaccine.

Plus, the list panicattacka posted was for the Pfizer vaccine. And again, those conditions could have happened without the vaccine. We don't know. They're only weak correlations at this point.

[Pamplemousse]

I'd have hoped that correlation =/ causation was obvious from what I'd previously posted, Vee: after all, there are two types of people that can extrapolate from incomplete data:

1: Those who can