Peer pressure

[Lencoboy]

Me and my dad went to the pub with my brother last night for a pre-Christmas drink and we were discussing stuff about music and how the industry has changed over the past 20-odd years or so. Not necessarily bemoaning the current state of it per se, but my brother was talking about how my 15-year-old nephew (his eldest son) listens to a good variety of music from pretty much all eras, unlike my brother at the same age (circa 1995-96) who admitted that he felt an obligation to listen to a lot of the popular chart music of the time in order to 'fit in' with his pals from school at the time, even though he now admits some of it was actually rather twee and cheesy.

I also brought up the fact that when I was about 15 a lot of the other kids at school thought I was weird for liking Phil Collins, especially as he was considered 'old hat' and uncool by the 90s, and mocked me for it while they liked rave and hip-hop, both of which genres I despised back then and still despise today, and they always hogged the classroom cassette players with the likes of The Shamen, Prodigy, NWA, Public Enemy, complete with all the language, sex and drug references, while the staff hardly seemed to bat an eyelid and just left them to it, even in 1992; though some with more libertarian attitudes could probably argue that the staff were 'forward thinking' and 'ahead of the time' in that particular context. Many of the staff at that school seemed to stop caring about pupils smoking underage by then as well.

It got me wondering if peer pressure among youngsters in particular is still quite as prevalent in such ways now like it was in the 90s, or have things shifted, especially with the advent of the Internet and social media.

Plus there no longer seems to be quite the same generational gaps and intense moral panics that there used to be in most previous decades either.

However it now seemingly being more acceptable for youngsters to listen to and enjoy older music and trends at will without being blatantly mocked and ridiculed can't be a bad thing, even if it seems that nostalgia has stolen the future in many ways, inadvertently leading to the lack of originality and uniqueness historically peculiar to specific eras/decades.

[Catkins]

I think young people have access to a lot more choice because of it being digital. You don't have to go and buy a tape of your favourite band you can select a random playlist and just listen to it and I guess if you hear something you like you can listen to more by the same person/band.

To be honest I've not really got into the whole digital music side of things, I still like a CD.

[Lencoboy]

Swings and roundabouts methinks.

But the point I'm generally making is that there doesn't appear to be the same generational gaps and divides (at least in terms of popular music and popular culture in general), like there was in most past decades, nor the same 'moral panics' that often accompanied them, which I guess could be a good thing in many respects.

[Lencoboy]

Also that evening my brother was saying that during much of the 90s (and also well into the 2000s) that much of the music and popular culture in general seemed to be largely about rebellion and shock value; much of which (for better or worse) doesn't seem quite as prevalent among the current younger generation.

But then again, I guess it's because there's not really that much left to shock with anymore that hasn't already been done to death before, and also the current generation of parents and even grandparents have obviously 'seen it all before' and had indeed been at the forefront of a lot of the raucous rebellious debauchery of most previous decades.

My brother added that he couldn't really imagine another 1996 TFI Friday moment on live pre-watershed TV these days with celebs like Shaun Ryder dropping F-bombs and many of the participants openly smoking. Not that my brother openly condones such practices, but I guess for him and many of his best pals back then at the age of 16 it would have no doubt seemed rather amusing and exciting, and indeed very much 'of its time', despite my brother actually being a lifelong non-smoker and AFAIK has also never habitually used bad language.

[Miu medical billing]

Peer pressure may have shifted online (social media validation), but access to diverse music through the internet reduces the need to conform. Generational gaps blur as everyone enjoys old and new, while moral panics adapt to new concerns. Nostalgia is enriching, but originality needs nurturing to avoid homogenization.

[Lencoboy]

Peer pressure may have shifted online (social media validation), but access to diverse music through the internet reduces the need to conform. Generational gaps blur as everyone enjoys old and new, while moral panics adapt to new concerns. Nostalgia is enriching, but originality needs nurturing to avoid homogenization.

Your last sentence is exactly my point, MMB; a kind of balance is needed between consumption of nostalgia and nurturing originality, especially as (apart from the likes of the Covid pandemic, etc) the 2020s so far haven't really been that much different to the 2010s culturally overall, and the 2010s as a whole in turn weren't that much different to at least the latter half of the 2000s, both culturally and politically.

Much of the popular music right now for me still sounds virtually indistinguishable from that of 2013 or even 2008 at a push, unlike back in 2008 I could already tell differences between the styles of then vs those of 1998, though even those differences were a bit more subtle than those between 1988 and 1998, and of course the differences between 1978 and 1988 were even more vast, ad infinitum.

I think you're also correct about peer pressure and the like shifting more online and especially towards social media, most notably since about 2008 or so, plus during the same time period I have also noticed that many of the more 'old-school' moral panics that typically characterised most past decades have seemingly declined in prevalence, though of course we still get the odd bouts of intense panics from time to time about things like health-related issues, terror threats, violent crime, the state of the economy, extreme weather conditions/climate change, etc, though they can all be regarded as fully legitimate concerns, despite the fact that the media do have a tendency to over-dramatise some of said issues on occasions.

But for me, the 90s will probably always be the most prolific period of more traditional moral panics in general, especially youth-oriented ones, many of which also seemed to continue into at least the first half of the 2000s.

[WiredIncorrectly]

Me and my dad went to the pub with my brother last night for a pre-Christmas drink and we were discussing stuff about music and how the industry has changed over the past 20-odd years or so. Not necessarily bemoaning the current state of it per se, but my brother was talking about how my 15-year-old nephew (his eldest son) listens to a good variety of music from pretty much all eras, unlike my brother at the same age (circa 1995-96) who admitted that he felt an obligation to listen to a lot of the popular chart music of the time in order to 'fit in' with his pals from school at the time, even though he now admits some of it was actually rather twee and cheesy.

I also brought up the fact that when I was about 15 a lot of the other kids at school thought I was weird for liking Phil Collins, especially as he was considered 'old hat' and uncool by the 90s, and mocked me for it while they liked rave and hip-hop, both of which genres I despised back then and still despise today, and they always hogged the classroom cassette players with the likes of The Shamen, Prodigy, NWA, Public Enemy, complete with all the language, sex and drug references, while the staff hardly seemed to bat an eyelid and just left them to it, even in 1992; though some with more libertarian attitudes could probably argue that the staff were 'forward thinking' and 'ahead of the time' in that particular context. Many of the staff at that school seemed to stop caring about pupils smoking underage by then as well.

It got me wondering if peer pressure among youngsters in particular is still quite as prevalent in such ways now like it was in the 90s, or have things shifted, especially with the advent of the Internet and social media.

Plus there no longer seems to be quite the same generational gaps and intense moral panics that there used to be in most previous decades either.

However it now seemingly being more acceptable for youngsters to listen to and enjoy older music and trends at will without being blatantly mocked and ridiculed can't be a bad thing, even if it seems that nostalgia has stolen the future in many ways, inadvertently leading to the lack of originality and uniqueness historically peculiar to specific eras/decades.

Phil Collins is great. His music is like piece's of art. One of my favorite musicians. But, I also like The Shamen, Prodigy, NWA, Public Enemy

Regarding peer pressure I am not too sure. I think so yes. With my own son we made sure he understood what peer pressure was and how to detect it. And thankfully he's never been a victim of it. Except when he was in year 3, 4 and 5. That was hard work because he was a bully and moving schools switched it all around.

On the other hand my old neighbors (the horrible lady that inflicted all of her **** on us) had a son who was 13 and walking around the streets with a machete. He'd steal motorbikes. You may think I'm joking but there is a lot of reason to suspect he burned down the Crooked House with his friends. He and his "gang" of friends have set fire to other disused pubs in the area. He is either driven by peer pressure, or is pressuring others.

Slang even has a term and it goes like this "Do you want to get pressured?". Means something like "Do you want to get bullied". They'll make other kids get naked and steal their clothes etc. Forcing them to do things they wouldn't otherwise do.

Sounds like the Bronx doesn't it? This happens.

And it's very much to do with UK Drill music and that stupid rapper with the colorful hair. Sixnine or something. The young kids are looking to them as idols.

It's fair to say music has always been an issue. But I see it getting worse.

[Lencoboy]

Phil Collins is great. His music is like piece's of art. One of my favorite musicians. But, I also like The Shamen, Prodigy, NWA, Public Enemy

Regarding peer pressure I am not too sure. I think so yes. With my own son we made sure he understood what peer pressure was and how to detect it. And thankfully he's never been a victim of it. Except when he was in year 3, 4 and 5. That was hard work because he was a bully and moving schools switched it all around.

On the other hand my old neighbors (the horrible lady that inflicted all of her **** on us) had a son who was 13 and walking around the streets with a machete. He'd steal motorbikes. You may think I'm joking but there is a lot of reason to suspect he burned down the Crooked House with his friends. He and his "gang" of friends have set fire to other disused pubs in the area. He is either driven by peer pressure, or is pressuring others.

Slang even has a term and it goes like this "Do you want to get pressured?". Means something like "Do you want to get bullied". They'll make other kids get naked and steal their clothes etc. Forcing them to do things they wouldn't otherwise do.

Sounds like the Bronx doesn't it? This happens.

And it's very much to do with UK Drill music and that stupid rapper with the colorful hair. Sixnine or something. The young kids are looking to them as idols.

It's fair to say music has always been an issue. But I see it getting worse.

Perhaps you're correct in some respects re popular music, and also your manor might happen to be more unlucky in terms of youth crime and social problems in general, but I don't seem to notice the same moral panics about such issues these days that were far more prevalent in the 90s and 2000s, nor the same talk of 'kids today...', that was also ubiquitous in both of those decades in particular. Strangely even the expression 'Broken Britain' hardly seems to figure in the media these days either, but was a kind of buzzword during the latter half of the 2000s and into the very early 2010s but its usage suddenly petered out after about 2011 or so, and of course the word 'ch@v'.

As for drill music, I do recall there briefly being a bit of a hoo-ha over it in the media back in 2018, but it never really escalated into a full-blown moral panic though, and in terms of general media attention it's seemingly been kept largely lower-key since then, which I suppose might actually be a good thing.

I've also noticed more recently that the media tend to keep knife crime-related stuff a bit lower-key compared to 2018 when they were often covering said issue in more graphic and lurid fashion, and sometimes overdid it a bit IMO, which I think can often provoke the so-called 'deviancy amplification spiral' and make certain 'hooligan' types want to indulge in their respective misdemeanours all the more, especially in pursuit of their 'fifteen minutes of fame'.

I think that was also the case when my manor went through some bad patches with youth crime and ASB during the 90s and 2000s, which I believe was also exacerbated by our local rag often over-dramatising such issues and events and inadvertantly provoking a lot of the local ne'er-do-wells to act out all the more, which then became a vicious circle of even more lurid 'drama porn' spewed out by our local rag, ad infinitum.

Thankfully a lot of that in my area had largely died down by the early 2010s and beyond, plus our local rag is now a completely different kettle of fish compared to then, when it often seemed to be a liability on occasions for 'hyping things up'.

[Lencoboy]

I was watching a very interesting video on YouTube last night from this guy by the name of Thomas Rispoli, who is a teacher/lecturer in sociology (dating from early 2021) that discusses moral panics and the media, and the video concluded with him saying that due to the media landscape and society at large now being more diverse than ever before, moral panics in general don't seem to carry the same weight now that they used to in most past decades.

He also added that since many moral panics have become so commonplace and formulaic over the past couple of decades or so, they have supposedly lost much of their impact that they once used to have, with many people now probably thinking 'oh just more of the same old same old; meh!'

What a lot of that guy said in that video seems to make quite a lot of sense to me, especially about increased media diversity and indeed over-saturation at times nowadays, but one other issue that he seemed to overlook was many people's decreased attention spans, which I think largely plays a part also, especially where it's one big panic one minute, then the next minute said panic is 'water under the bridge' and largely forgotten about, then onto the next big panic, ad infinitum.

I've also observed that the media have had a habit (at least since the early 2000s) of recycling/regurgitating many big panic-related issues; e.g, from violent crime and feral youngsters to the state of the economy, then onto the threat of terrorism and/or viruses/health-related issues, then rinse and repeat.

In another video on his YouTube channel, that same guy mentioned that statistically property crime (e.g, burglary, criminal damage, etc) still actually remains way more commonplace than violent crime, despite generally being on a downward trend overall since the 90s, but the latter is usually deemed far more exciting and indeed emotive by the media than the former, so is inevitably afforded far more disproportionate media coverage.