CBT hasn't worked - what next???

[Richie]

Thank you Bluedaisy
yep getting the right therapist is like finding a needle in a haystack,
and you need to gel with them, i was real lucky those years back,
Thanks for the book recommendation called "Mind over mood" i will see if i can get that. I'm thinking of finding a therapist privately like you but would mean getting a loan and don't want to be in debt ! And there are loads of people practising CBT that don't know who to see!!
Anyway the best of luck to you, sorry things haven't worked out, like you my agoraphobia/sa is at a chronic stage but i do sometimes have good days.
Lots of love Richie xxxxx

[Bill]

I've been housebound with agoraphobia for 18 months, and for the past three or four months I've almost given up my battle to overcome my anxiety.

Reading back on your introduction thread, you say you've been housebound for 18 months. Does that mean that before then you were coping ok and if so, what was it that happened to make you housebound?

The other thing is did you try the CBT within the past 18 months?

You've probably heard this before but my "guess" is that something you were going through created so much stress that 18 months ago you were out and experienced a bad panic attack which made you retreat indoors because the intense feelings scared you so much so you have now become afraid of experiencing fear - fear of fear.

When you go out with someone you feel secure but alone you feel vulnerable again with no support. This means that if you think of going out alone, you're already worrying "what if" I experience a panic attack and there's no one with you to support you.

The fear of the original panic attack has remained with you so that each time you go out your mind is now recreating that first attack worry = fear = panic.

I can see why CBT didn't work because your confidence is so low in your abilities. It takes Far longer than 6 - 8 sessions And doing them alone to build up the confidence you lost. All too often we see therapists and feel fine because they are there with us.

I've always believed in adopting a new mindset. To attempt very short walks alone, even just a few yards but before attempting them to re-programme the mind with positive thoughts to counteract the negative thoughts that produce the worry and lack of self-belief.

Instead of thinking "what if I have a panic attack"...think "I Have to go out to do something and I Will be fine". Instead of focussing on the worry, focus on what you need to "do". Also to stay where we are when the panics occur so we experience them for what they are - just panicky feelings and that they won't harm us however bad they feel.

We fail before we set out through worrying thoughts that create our panics. It takes a Long time to but I Do know of people who were in your situation who are now getting out and about without worry and they didn't use CBT to enable the change. They simply adopted a new way of thinking with goals and the positive approach paid dividends.

Tackling the fear of panics IS very difficult but the only way we build our confidence IS to tackl them gradually "alone". If someone is with us we will always depend on them for the security they provide.

I used to experience panic myself because of a lot of stress in my life and I became afraid to go out but in time I learnt not to worry about them and they stopped. I do still get anxious but it doesn't stop me from doing what I need or want to do so I Know it IS possible for anyone to do the same with a new way of thinking.

It is only a guess how your panics started but the way to learn to cope with them I know is true.

[Big Bird]

Hi there,

Just a hunch but it may prove beneficial to try some 'Person' centred therapy, once known as Client centred!
It allows the individual to explore all the avenues and attain his/her own personal growth.
It is not so widely publicised nowadays as the mandate is more CBT directed but it is still a very very interesting and succesful form of therapy.

Wish you all the best,

(Roy)

[Angel64]

Hi, what you said about knowing more than the therapist really rang a bell with me.

I have read so many books, listened to so many tapes and looked on so many websites that I feel that I have done a university course in it !! The thing is though by doing this i am analising everything, and I was even thinking did my therapist really know what she was doing. We come to a point of knowing too much I think.

I had sessions through the NHS with a therapist and also an online CBT course, which was helpful but at the time I think I was so concerned with doing well and of course all my family/friends knew so I felt under pressure.

I finished that in September last year, as the therapist thought I was doing really well. But I still had days where i couldnt even leave the house and so to me it wasn't really any good.

But then I decided that on January 1st 2008 I would make a resolution to get better, and I think once I had made that decision, and didnt tell many people about it, it was easier. I have had a really tough few weeks but am getting there slowly.

I would say the key is to be really ready to want to change, to have a hunger for it, and I must admit finding this site late December has been wonderful.

I wish you luck on your journey.

Christine xx

[scared guy]

I almost hate to say it here cause I don't want to discourage anyone, but I haven't had much success with CBT either and I think it's important that people understand that not everybody can be cured by it.

I've had panic attacks and agoraphobia for years and have made a few attempts at CBT and either I just lack the needed courage to carry it out to it's end, or what I have simply doesn't respond to it. Maybe I've just lacked the proper mindset all this time. Whatever the reason, it hasn't worked.

One problem I have with CBT is it treats panic attacks like normal fears. I don't believe there's anything normal about a true panic attack. Just because you develope a normal fear of a situation where you panicked, doesn't mean that facing that situation and overcoming it is going to make you stop having panic attacks. I can overcome certain associations I've made as far as situational attacks, like at a store or driving my car(this list goes on forever lol), but at the end of the day, I still have panic attacks and always a new feared situation to overcome.

I believe something is predisposing me to them. I have no clue what it is, but you wouldn't expect a person to overcome type 1 diabetes by changing their thinking. Nobody knows what causes that either, but because theirs is more physical than mental, people accept that they can't just pull themselves up by their bootstraps and get over it. What I have isn't as cut and dried as diabetes(yet), but after all these years of dealing with it, I believe it falls more into that territory than a learned behavioural problem that can be dealt with by learning to think differently.

That's just me though and I hope I haven't discouraged anyone from trying CBT. Just don't get down on yourself if you have tried it but didn't get better.

[Allye]

I do not think that CBT is a quite fix in all cases. I had about 8 sessions – made sense but did not really make a difference at the time.

I then went on to Citalopram which really made a difference as it gave my body a break from the constant anxiety, panic circle. When I came off Citalopram I used what I had learnt from CBT to help.

I am not cured but cope a lot better.