the EU & the UK

[MyNameIsTerry]

Well, if you are looking for morals you would be looking in the wrong direction in looking up to politicians. power attracts the mirky.

It's more important to me how they regard and act to others than what they get up to as consenting adults.

Trump apparently likes getting urinated on by a group of people. He gets the (piss) taken out of him for it He's regarded a deviant. Cameron once shoved his pork sword in into a pigs head at university. What a deviant! Theresa May once ran through a farmer's wheat field in her naughty days. Not enough of a deviant.

That's how it goes in the media. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. I mean, who hasn't done stuff when they were young???

Very few people on this earth are going to be saintly. And morality is subjective. Who decides what is mainstream? It's a big spectrum, a bell curve. But you will be standing in the voting queue, working, shopping, even at be around a family table at a get together, etc with all stripes of people and what they get up to behind closed doors.

[mezzaninedoor]

Well, if you are looking for morals you would be looking in the wrong direction in looking up to politicians. power attracts the mirky.

It's more important to me how they regard and act to others than what they get up to as consenting adults.

Yes, I rarely see politicians as role models. I think just 'loving your country' is overrated as qualification for leading your country. As Noivous says, he believes Obama didnt love the USA but actually he doesn't know regards that.

The 'my country, right or wrong' doesn't sit well with me.

Theresa May loves the UK but she has made a god awful cock up of the last 2 years.

What we need is some really great leadership that the MPs on all sides of the UK buy into, unlikely looking at the Tory candidates and in the words of the Chancellor of the UK we are likely to soon be driven over a cliff.

[MyNameIsTerry]

Terry... I never did that stuff when I was young, with the exception of running through wheat fields (and on one occasion getting a warning shot fired over my head by an extremely irate farmer). But I am looking forward to getting away with those other weird things when I get old(er) by blaming it on dementia (every cloud has its silver lining)

So, Mrs May lost her virginity to you then?!!!

As an old mate used to say "grow old disgracefully". You can get away with when you are old. Just look at Bush Sn pinching bums

[MyNameIsTerry]

The House of Lords did indeed explain their was no legal requirement for it. The trouble is you won't get a trade deal out of the EU if you won't give them what they want. And other countries may be wary of us. Or maybe they won't? Maybe they would say the same about the EU? And maybe business and making money will trump the morals of honouring xyz?

Pensions I can understand. What I disagree with is contributing to future projects just because we agree at the time. A50 states we leave ALL EU bodies...except those building xyz? Contributions should end at the leave date. The EU should drawn up a new budget for remaining members only from that point on.

Burslem bird can be pacified with a pint of ale

As for Boris, I just don't get his popularity. He's a buffoon, buy hey London voted him in. Didn't we all laugh at London for that? I would have thought anyone can see he promises whatever to get in and can't be trusted to honour anything.

[mezzaninedoor]

As for Boris, I just don't get his popularity. He's a buffoon, buy hey London voted him in. Didn't we all laugh at London for that? I would have thought anyone can see he promises whatever to get in and can't be trusted to honour anything.

I dont get it either.
I think Boris is a mythology really.
He wrote the articles on Remain and Brexit and chose Brexit, that seems to have made him someone who has weighed the odds and for Brexiteers he chose them.
He wasted so much money as Mayor of London, the Garden Bridge especially was something that if he has spent time on the detail he would have known it wasn't going to work. He is a complete buffoon and bluffer. Yes you are right he cannot be trusted.

[pulisa]

He was great on HIGNFY though..

I bet his ex wife has received a massive payout to keep schtum re BoJo's extramarital affairs. I hope the current one gets on with Melania.

[MyNameIsTerry]

We are back to people being bargaining chips. What I do find interesting is that there is the EU WAP and separate legislation for each state to agree too. I can't remember hearing this before and distinctly remember May trying to do this early on yet the EC told her they were united in refusing to discuss anything. These will be areas that remain sovereign but why can't that also mean granting the right to reside and work as they do for non EU immigrants? https://amp.theguardian.com/politics...no-deal-brexit

[mezzaninedoor]

Brexit Day + 81

Is Tom Watson (Labour Party deputy leader) voicing what all remainers want (many tacitly) that Brexit be completely abandoned – as if the Referendum had never happened?

If this is the fact of the matter, then surely it’s about time those remainers who profess to have a nodding acquaintance with the truth – that the outers won – should be honest and come clean. Obviously, this would mean their denying democracy, with all that that entails (I’ll pause here and wait for the remonstrations that there are degrees of democracy and it isn’t an absolute concept – because currently that’s how it’s being nudged into fudge).

im well known as a Remainer here
Absolutely acknowledge that Leave won the advisory referendum
i don’t want another referendum though I do wish we hadn’t voted Out. I don’t think that’s good for us
As a Remainer I absolutely do not want a No Deal though
I don’t see why we need to commit to a No Deal apart from the dire work of Politicians over the last 3 years !!!!!

There are not degrees of democracy, however further voting would be democratic though it might not seem fair

[mezzaninedoor]

I don’t know if I can bring myself to watch PM elect Boris tonight, I may spontaneously combust watching him !!!!

As comedian Katy Brand has just said on Twitter. —- A woman, a mother of small children, is imprisoned in Iran. She is ill, physically, and highly distressed mentally. She is still there because Boris Johnson couldn’t be bothered to read his briefing notes properly. If that doesn’t shit you up at night, I don’t know what will.

[MyNameIsTerry]

I don’t know if I can bring myself to watch PM elect Boris tonight, I may spontaneously combust watching him !!!!

As comedian Katy Brand has just said on Twitter. —- A woman, a mother of small children, is imprisoned in Iran. She is ill, physically, and highly distressed mentally. She is still there because Boris Johnson couldn’t be bothered to read his briefing notes properly. If that doesn’t shit you up at night, I don’t know what will.

To be fair, I'm not sure we truly know why she is there. Firstly lets blame the regime who have imprisoned her, coerced her into signing BS and treated her this way. Boris made it worse but Brand is demonstrating how she's more irked by Boris than the actual situation. Therefore she can hardly claim any moral high ground in using the plight of this poor woman.