Have I got rectal cancer?

[Carys]

I'm really struggling with this one too. I can't get my head around 'accepting a host of parasites living in your intestines for months' and not mentioning it to a doctor when you see them at an appointment. Then not treating it, despite having easy access to treatment without needing to see the doctor (Pharmacist). Even non-HAers would be right in there sorting it out and feeling really grossed out.



I think there is more to this than Toby is mentioning; he has a reason for avoidance of mentioning it, avoidance of treating apart from with Herbal 'something' on Amazon. I dont know what the back story is, but I think there might be one, some other background fear or issue that is impacting on this rather bizarre seeming behaviour. I would be guessing about any number of things, but I wonder if Toby might like to tell us why he is making this choice to not treat and live with bowel parasites.

[MyNameIsTerry]

Well, I don't know much about cat and dog worms presentation in people....other than they are something we really don't want our pets having due to their zoonotic nature. Some people apparently can ingest the eggs, have an infection, have very few symptoms and it runs it course. However, in some people some more concerning outcomes are possible, and those are not something I will write here. You are right, It is VERY rare to get these toxicaris infections, really really rare...and very unlikely. I want to remind though, that there are articles that claim a long-term chronic infestation of pin/thread worms can mimic bowel disorders like Chron's. There are also many documented cases of hookworm infestations in human beings, and they definitely DO cause blood in stools, changing bowel habits that are like IBS. Also, very rare here it seems (just read) but WHY WOULD YOU BE TAKING the risk not to treat them?



Everyone else is probably bored senseless with this lonnnnggggg discussion of intestinal parasites....if they've even bothered to read it.

You are totally being called "the worm woman" from here on in

---------- Post added at 02:43 ---------- Previous post was at 02:36 ----------

I'm really struggling with this one too. I can't get my head around 'accepting a host of parasites living in your intestines for months' and not mentioning it to a doctor when you see them at an appointment. Then not treating it, despite having easy access to treatment without needing to see the doctor (Pharmacist). Even non-HAers would be right in there sorting it out and feeling really grossed out.



I think there is more to this than Toby is mentioning; he has a reason for avoidance of mentioning it, avoidance of treating apart from with Herbal 'something' on Amazon. I dont know what the back story is, but I think there might be one, some other background fear or issue that is impacting on this rather bizarre seeming behaviour. I would be guessing about any number of things, but I wonder if Toby might like to tell us why he is making this choice to not treat and live with bowel parasites.

Some are more afraid of seeing doctors than others. There is the stereotypical HAer who lives in the surgery but then a few that are terrified of tests, that they will get a confirmation, etc.

That's what I think here, it's avoidance. Confronting that there is an issue. I get that more than I would the reassurance seeker as my GAD has always included lots of avoidance. You do end up living with things you don't need to because it's easier to remain in the bubble than challenge the anxiety is provokes trying something new that feels like you aren't in control.

I'm sure we all get that when you apply it to a situation of your own. Someone can be terrified of an ESA appointment but really it's just talking to another human being in an office.

I'm not "creeped out" by something like threadworms (I might think a bit differently about a giant tape worm I've named Trevor who pops out every night to waive hello at me...when will we see HAers with mirrors and night wildlife cams capturing them? ) but do agree it's not something I would leave naturally.

[Toby2000]

Wow this is a long thread of parasite replies!

I’m super grateful for the help

I’m a little confused Carys, so pin worms are definitely a form of roundworm? I’m reading this late and I’m a bit tired so excuse me if I sound stupid!

It’s just I’ve read that pinworms never cause blood or mucus but if there is another sort of worm I guess that’s a possibility.. would a feces test detect that?

And my other issue that is if it is worms causing the bleeding, how could they cause all that bleeding a few nights after I first saw the worms, since there would have been no infestation at that point since it was so early on. And why haven’t I bled that much again? I’ve only noticed small traces after that initial bleeding

Unless it was a fissure and parasite problem which seems less likely to me and it would be a huge coincidence!

And I’m not scared about it because everyone gets parasites and they don’t 96% of the time kill you but not everyone gets cancer.. I have a cancer health anxiety because that’s the big bad of all diseases and is one of the biggest killers.

They were all out of appointment slots at the gp today so I’ll have to go next week, and terry you’re right, sometimes I put it off so I can live in my bubble of not knowing rather than finally getting a test and it turns out to be bad news

Thanks guys for helping so much

[Carys]

TERRY -

I know and understand frequent HA visitors and avoiders Terry, absolutely I do. However I am not referring to the cancer issue - what I can't get my head around is not treating the worms, not mentioning the worms to the doctor despite being in the surgery about the actual bowel she was inspecting (its not like he went in there about his nose and the worms were just left out of the picture and forgotten as not relevant) and being fine with having them for three months. THAT is strange when you don't even need to see a doctor to treat them! This long thread, where we have had details of the contents and consistency of Toby's bowel contents, and in not one until very recently did he mention the worms being passed. Thats what I can't understand. That is an odd acceptance of parasites in the bowel which is something I can't understand, as he doesn't even know which worms he has ?!

I think looking back, Toby has not been an 'avoider', as he has been told he's a 'time waster' and has been to the doctor many many times by his own admission. He has been begging for scans and tests, and even rang 111 to try and force around the GP for those scans and tests. So, I don't see avoidance there at all. Sorry to disagree with you again buddy.

TOBY -

Yes, roundworm is the Family name for lots of different types of worms, of which pinworm is one of them. Toby you are presuming these are pinworms....you don't seem to have the classic symptoms of pinworms AT ALL ? Anyway, it doesn't really matter about diagnosing the type of worm, they are all killed in the same way - the same medication from the pharmascist. I think, and I'm going to say it, this is all very foolish just leaving them unchecked and that all family members NEED treating to eradicate them. I want to add, and thing its helpful to think about - having them is the result of poor hygiene, a lack of handwashing and eating in an environment where the eggs are around. So, maybe that could be another issue to take into account when thinking of your bowel functions, are you giving yourself a 'gippy' stomach with poor hygiene practices?

[Fishmanpa]

I want to point out a few things about the OPs points and fears.

And I’m not scared about it because everyone gets parasites

I'd like the link to that one because according to WHO, only around 10% of people in developed countries get intestinal parasites/worms. Symptoms can be abdominal pain, diarrhea, nausea, or vomiting, gas/bloating, fatigue, unexplained weight loss and abdominal pain or tenderness. (thanks Dr. Google )


The OP doesn't believe this is anxiety yet openly admits it here yet denies that he needs help

I have a cancer health anxiety because that’s the big bad of all diseases and is one of the biggest killers.

Logically, if someone is that ill or that concerned and convinced about having cancer and is having symptoms, they would see their doctor yet after the urging of members to do so for several months mind you, he cancelled appointments he said he made and the last response was....

They were all out of appointment slots at the gp today so I’ll have to go next week....sometimes I put it off so I can live in my bubble of not knowing rather than finally getting a test and it turns out to be bad news

Actually, I believe the OP is putting it off because it will affirm what everyone here is saying and take any wind that's left out of the dragon's sails. When all is cleared, there will be no reason at all to carry on with a thread that has gone on since July and has over 40 pages!

Finally, going back to the worms issue. I still cannot wrap my mind about this one and agree with Carys. This apparently started before the original post in July. Why, after all this time was this brought up? And why, if indeed there is an infection, would someone NOT treat this? It just doesn't make sense


Elen said it best...

The fact that you put off going to the doctor indicates strongly that you know deep down that this is your HA out of control.

This is a never ending cycle, similar to your previous worries over your mother,

You need to deal with the anxiety because otherwise you will get over this fear then latch onto another one

Toby, I don't expect a reply or acknowledgement. You ignored several of my recent posts as well as Elen's. These are just words on a screen and you can hit the little "x" at the top of the screen or put someone on ignore and it all goes away OR... you can finally take the advice to heart and do something to help yourself. All the advice in the world is useless unless you act on it. It's YOUR choice to live the way you're living. All I know, if you were my child, I'd drag you kicking and screaming to the doctor and mental health professional!

Positive thoughts

[MyNameIsTerry]

TERRY -

I think looking back, Toby has not been an 'avoider', as he has been told he's a 'time waster' and has been to the doctor many many times by his own admission. He has been begging for scans and tests, and even rang 111 to try and force around the GP for those scans and tests. So, I don't see avoidance there at all. Sorry to disagree with you again buddy.

Not to my knowledge. In fact I was incredibly surprised when he went to see his GP given the time spent encouraging him to do so well before this thread.

As far as I know he saw one GP about the fissure and rang 111 later. That's it. He has been chasing for reassurance but on here not with multiple doctor visits as others do. His GP will only be aware of the tests/scans recommended by the 111 doctor because of a letter and Toby is yet to visit them to discuss anything further.

He's a reassurance chaser on here, and with family too it is likely, but otherwise we have been trying to get him to seek therapy for ages. This is why I see avoidance as in admitting there is a mental health problem (like many who chase reassurance or avoid) and seeking help for it. But also that unlike many on here who are at the doctors a lot more he is rarely seen there despite his various cancer worries over several years. And he appears resistant to treating the worms which are easily sorted with a quick trip to a pharmacy.

This is where I see the resistance.

[Carys]

Oh Terry, you and I are going to begin another back and forth debate.....(Sorry TOBY, we do know you are here and apologise for talking over you lol) Last time parastites, this time the terms 'avoider' and 'reassurance seeker'. Hey ho, here goes......

I apologise then, if in this particular 'fear of rectal cancer' Toby has only made two medical 'outreaches', once to the GP and the other to 111 since August. However, I did read lots of his past threads before joining this one and I'm sure that through all his illnesses he said he had made many doctors visits about many physical illnesses, often his family wouldn't take him despite him wanting to have an appointment. I believe he had been labelled by them (was it GP or parents?) as 'a time waster' ? If this isn't the case then I am sorry and must be thinking of someone else. Goodness knows I read enough threads on here!

I guess 'avoider' and 'reassurance seeker' are quite subjective, and Terry you see it differently to me. To my mind, if for each of his illnesses since 2015 Toby has made two visits, that is a pretty large amount of doctors visits ! I would say that he isn't as bad as some we see here in terms of being back and forth to doctors, but that is still for a healthy person a high proportion of hypochondriac medical appointments. Toby is desperately wanting more tests, of quite a variety, and that to me isn't someone who is trying to stick their head in the sand and avoid. He is still in my mind a medical reassurance seeker, and not a medical avoider.

I've just had a thought - Maybe you are using the term 'avoider' in a different way to me....do you mean avoiding getting himself seen to discuss HA??? 'Avoider' to me means something quite different, and is the other end of the scale to attention-seeker, someone who won't go and doesn't go for medical appointments as they don't want to hear bad news and are scared of the consequences of finding out things from tests. In my definition this doesn't make Toby an avoider at all, as he's quite up for tests and checks throughout his threads. He DOES avoid dealing with his HA though, which is a different issue. Its possible we have different definitions for what an avoider is ?

[Toby2000]

TOBY -

Yes, roundworm is the Family name for lots of different types of worms, of which pinworm is one of them. Toby you are presuming these are pinworms....you don't seem to have the classic symptoms of pinworms AT ALL ? Anyway, it doesn't really matter about diagnosing the type of worm, they are all killed in the same way - the same medication from the pharmascist. I think, and I'm going to say it, this is all very foolish just leaving them unchecked and that all family members NEED treating to eradicate them. I want to add, and thing its helpful to think about - having them is the result of poor hygiene, a lack of handwashing and eating in an environment where the eggs are around. So, maybe that could be another issue to take into account when thinking of your bowel functions, are you giving yourself a 'gippy' stomach with poor hygiene practices?

No I don't seem to have the classic symptoms but I know a pinworm when I see it

I mean.. I do wash my hands after going to the toilet etc and shower once every two daysI think they could be picked up in all sorts of ways but once they're there they stay until you sort them out. It probably doesn't have to be a prolonged habit or behaviour that contracts them.

---------- Post added at 19:46 ---------- Previous post was at 19:38 ----------

I'd like the link to that one because according to WHO, only around 10% of people in developed countries get intestinal parasites/worms. Symptoms can be abdominal pain, diarrhea, nausea, or vomiting, gas/bloating, fatigue, unexplained weight loss and abdominal pain or tenderness. (thanks Dr. Google )

Obviously I was being hyperbolic when I said everyone! But pinworms are just one of those things so I didn't think I had to worry too much

Logically, if someone is that ill or that concerned and convinced about having cancer and is having symptoms, they would see their doctor yet after the urging of members to do so for several months mind you, he cancelled appointments he said he made and the last response was....

No.. I've seen the doctor twice and rang 111 twice, it's just hard to go back now because I feel like she's gonna start to hate me. Or already does. For going behind her back and ringing 111 maybe?

Actually, I believe the OP is putting it off because it will affirm what everyone here is saying and take any wind that's left out of the dragon's sails. When all is cleared, there will be no reason at all to carry on with a thread that has gone on since July and has over 40 pages!

I mean if you don't want me here, I can stop posting

Finally, going back to the worms issue. I still cannot wrap my mind about this one and agree with Carys. This apparently started before the original post in July. Why, after all this time was this brought up? And why, if indeed there is an infection, would someone NOT treat this? It just doesn't make sense

So... you think I'm making the worms up?

Maybe if I read online that they can cause blood and mucus and whatever else, I would've mentioned them, but I've had them before and I know they're pretty much harmless so I didn't think they were relevant to this. That's all.

Toby, I don't expect a reply or acknowledgement. You ignored several of my recent posts as well as Elen's. These are just words on a screen and you can hit the little "x" at the top of the screen or put someone on ignore and it all goes away OR... you can finally take the advice to heart and do something to help yourself. All the advice in the world is useless unless you act on it. It's YOUR choice to live the way you're living. All I know, if you were my child, I'd drag you kicking and screaming to the doctor and mental health professional!

Positive thoughts

I don't just "ignore" your replies and I certainly wouldn't ignore Elen's. Sometimes I think you can be quite rude towards me for whatever reason and you seem to get frustrated with me but you have to remember that you're on an anxiety forum. Not everyone deals with problems the same way. I'm not saying I don't NEED help, I'm just saying that if I get help now, these symptoms may continue and I'll end up dead because I chose not to follow the warning signs up?

Bottom line: I keep seeing blood. Blood is not normal and is not caused by anxiety. You surely understand why I'm worried?

---------- Post added at 19:48 ---------- Previous post was at 19:46 ----------

Not to my knowledge. In fact I was incredibly surprised when he went to see his GP given the time spent encouraging him to do so well before this thread.

As far as I know he saw one GP about the fissure and rang 111 later. That's it. He has been chasing for reassurance but on here not with multiple doctor visits as others do. His GP will only be aware of the tests/scans recommended by the 111 doctor because of a letter and Toby is yet to visit them to discuss anything further.

He's a reassurance chaser on here, and with family too it is likely, but otherwise we have been trying to get him to seek therapy for ages. This is why I see avoidance as in admitting there is a mental health problem (like many who chase reassurance or avoid) and seeking help for it. But also that unlike many on here who are at the doctors a lot more he is rarely seen there despite his various cancer worries over several years. And he appears resistant to treating the worms which are easily sorted with a quick trip to a pharmacy.

This is where I see the resistance.

I've seen my GP twice and both times I had the same answer. I feel like there isn't much more I can do now. I'm scared to go again.

---------- Post added at 19:51 ---------- Previous post was at 19:48 ----------

he's quite up for tests and checks throughout his threads. He DOES avoid dealing with his HA though, which is a different issue. Its possible we have different definitions for what an avoider is ?

Yes I would love tests. I would probably try and get on top of my HA if I just knew what was going on for sure.

---------- Post added at 19:54 ---------- Previous post was at 19:51 ----------



This is a very long thread. This must be the record number of pages on a bowel problems thread.

I'm sorry for causing so much upset on here, if you like I could stop posting or delete my account or something. I just don't think everyone else sees my problems the same way I do, which says a lot about said problems I guess.

[pulisa]

Carys, you may be thinking of Blaze and his many trips to the doctor? Toby and Blaze have a similar style of posting.

[Toby2000]

Toby and Blaze have a similar style of posting.

Is that just an observation or do you think I'm "Blaze"?